this is bbc news. we'll have the headlines and all the main news stories for you at the top of the hour as newsday continues straight after hardtalk. welcome to hardtalk from bratislava. i'm stephen sackur. the longer the ukraine war goes on, the higher the stakes become. slovakia is a front—line state, currently hosting tens of thousands of ukrainian refugees and funnelling weapons to kyiv. now vladimir putin has warned that outside interference could be met

by lightning retaliation. my guest is slovakia's prime minister, eduard heger. so, how much risk is slovakia prepared to take? prime minister eduard heger, welcome. thank you very much for the invitation. here we are in bratislava. slovakia is on the front lines of this ukraine war. you share a land border. you have taken tens of thousands of refugees. you are funnelling arms into ukraine for the kyiv government. do you feel that, as this war continues week by week, month by month, that the danger for your country increases? actually, i think it is

decreasing, because of the bravery of the ukrainian people. cos they have been really showing us such an example of bravery. they are fighting for our values, and we as neighbours, we know that, if they would fail, we would be next, we understand it very much. so we are very thankful for theirfight. we don't look at them just as our neighbours, but they are actually are friends, and they are co—fighters for the values of freedom and democracy. they have to shed their blood — we never had the need for it, but we support them because we understand, that is why we will be supporting them as much we can because we believe in freedom. when i talk about danger for you, i don'tjust mean military danger but economic danger. you, right now, face an extraordinary, pressing, economic challenge, and it is to do with energy, to do with your massive

dependence on russian gas. that's very true. are you ready to stop, right now, consuming russian oil and gas? now, we are not ready, because the previous governments unfortunately, and i think it is the problem of the whole of europe, and it is such a pity, i'm so disappointed that we were neglecting the threat of putin for many years, and now we have a strong wake—up call by him attacking ukraine in a brutal way, innocent people, there are soldiers raping young kids, young women. i was in bucha, in kyiv, and what i saw, it was horrible, it was really horrible. it is brutal what they are doing there. i understand, you recognise what is happening, and yet your government is,

today, as we speak, financing putin's war machine, 85% of your gas comes from russia. i am fully aware of it, and i am so sorry for it, and that is why the second part of the answer that i want to give you is that we are doing everything possible to disconnect as as soon as possible from the russian gas and russian oil. as i've said, we are now building, and it is in the final stage, an interconnector between poland and slovakia. we are in very strong negotiations with poland, they are one of our closest neighbours, of course, and friend and ally in this case, because we need an alternative and that is going to be the most likely way that we could bring it through their sea into slovakia but for this moment we are landlocked. that is why we are so strong advocates for unity and solidarity. are you as strong on principle? because we have seen poland and bulgaria categorically

state, we will not accede to russia's demands that we, in future, pay for our gas in roubles. and, as a result, as ofjust a day or two ago, russia has stopped all gas supplies to those two countries. will you, here and now, with me, say that we, slovakia, will not bow to russia's demand that we pay roubles? i will actually add to it, that the initiative that we will play in euros was made by slovakia. where it was that friday when we called all of the countries and said that we need to stay united, and we need to stay in the payments with euros, so it was us who initiated it, and i am so glad, and for us, as a landlocked country, so dependent, because you must understand the pipes from russia go through slovakia then go to western countries. we were for years, decades, we were responsible and reliable partner

in delivering the gas to the other countries. that's what we need now, if the flow turns, we have got to be at the end, and we say, you need to deliver to us enough gas from the other lines, the other streams, and that is why we say, for this to happen, we need to be united, and we need to show solidarity to each other. i need to pressure you more on this payment mechanism. it is not just about saying that we will not give russia roubles, there is a financial run—around, which it seems clear some big european energy companies and indeed nations like hungary are prepared to indulge in, to play russia's game, they will put money in euros into a russian bank account, but at the same time will set up an account in roubles and have the money converted and the roubles will then be sent to gazprom. it is a financial fix. are you going to do that financial fix, to ensure that you keep getting russian

gas for now? as i said, we are the advocates for unity and solidarity. i heard what you said. i will explain what i mean by that. what you're asking, that is the game of vladimir putin, because he's playing hybrid warfare with europe, economic and also hybrid. he's trying to kill the unity, because he knows, if he splits us apart, he is the winner. but i told you, we know that some energy companies in europe are prepared to play that game. viktor orban, the leader of hungary, an eu member state, is prepared to play that game. it is a very simple question — are you going to play that game too? no — i said we are going to pay in euros and we want to disconnect as soon as possible. if you are serious in what you have just told me, it is very likely that, within days, you, just like poland and bulgaria, will have your gas supplies cut off.

that is not the case. because you need to know some more details. our plan goes till 24th of may, when the next payment is, and that's why we have still time and there will be a meeting of ministers of energy in france in the coming weeks, and everybody is trying to, we are pushing, let's stay united, let's keep the solidarity, because only we stay together, we can succeed. your constant emphasis is on keeping european unity. so be clear, what is your message to viktor orban, who's made it plain he is not prepared to see hungary's economy killed and he will do whatever it takes including acceding to russia's demands, albeit by a financial fix, to make sure that it gets roubles? and germany, which says right now it simply cannot afford to stop using russian gas? are you saying that they will have to change? it is the same with us.

we are very dependent, just like hungary, czech republic, austria, germany, we are very dependent, but we can succeed only and only if we stay united, and we need to have the solidarity, because it is also a political aspect, but if we give up now, what do we say? we say "we give up on you" and we cannot do that. those guys are fighting for us, fighting because they are, with our support, when i to volodymyr zelensky, what i see in their eyes, their bravery, it is also because they know that they have the support of the european union, they have the vision of being part of the european union, the vision of a democratic and free country, and this is how serious this war is. so a simple question for you, which i am sure volodymyr zelensky would like a simple answer to. when it gets to next autumn, next winter, when you really, really need your gas supplies to be certain, will you still

be using and paying for russian gas, yes or no? that answer i don't have, because we are very dependent, but i spoke to volodymyr zelensky. and he is actually a very smart man. brave and smart. and we all understand we need to disconnect. it is not about a couple of months. it is about terminal solution, permanent solution. we all know that. it is about permanent. and that is what we understand. we need to cut off from russian oil and gas permanently. that's what we need to look for. because we know that once we do that, then we cut off the funding of russia's war, but we need to do this and accomplish this together. if putin divides us, then it is over, the european union, it is going to be... ..such a hit, such a collapse,

and we don't want this. europe must become stronger on this, and it is a crucial crossroads. i get that message loud and clear. let me turn to the question of arms supplies. is slovakia, right now, prepared to send heavy weapons, including howitzers that are made in slovakia, direct to zelensky? absolutely. as i said, our position is very clear. it goes back to the value. i'm sorry that i repeat it again, but i want everybody to understand. we are in a war, it is brutal, killing people, we haven't had that in europe for over 70 years, we forgot, and now we see the brutality. i don't want any of european citizens to be killed by some dictator who decides that he is going to kill innocent people in the streets. it is ridiculous — 21st century. that is why i said, whatever they request, we will happily help them,

gladly. zelensky has been asking for warplanes for many weeks. you have mig—29s that the ukrainians know how to fly, you have roughly a dozen, have you sent any? he haven't asked us. we are ready. we would have some operation will be needed, because we need to have first our space protected. we are working on this, and i think we are getting to a conclusion. at this moment, we are in very close communication, like you said, howitzers, with the mig—29s, they have not asked, but if they did, we would gladly speak. we are repairing their equipment. you are repairing, you're telling me that your people are repairing those captured russian tanks and sending them back to ukraine for the ukrainians to use? the agreement is almost at the final stages,

we do not hide about it. these requests we received when i was in kyiv, actually. so we will be repairing those. you are being open with me. and i am thinking of what your own people here in slovakia are going to be thinking about your message to me. they know this message. but they also know, as of the last 48 hours, that vladimir putin is threatening what he calls a lightning fast retaliation against anybody from outside of ukraine interfering in this war. he has been threatening ever since the beginning. remember the nuclear weapons? that was his first threat. he said, we are activating the nuclear weapons. immediately, it caused discussion here. and i said, guys, come on, what are we speaking about? are we going to allow vladimir putin to threaten us at any time he wants?

either we are bold or cowards. i don't want to be a coward. i want to defend our independence. we were under a communist regime. we understand the imperialism. we have strong memories. we do not want to go back to that time. but then there is behaving like a responsible leader. you know that sergei lavrov and putin have in recent days talked about the real possibility of nuclear war. i know. you are the neighbour of ukraine. you stand on the front line. you are ready, you are telling your own people, you are ready to face down that threat. you know what helps me? it helps me to look at volodymyr zelensky. because he is the first in line. he faced this question several months ago. and he didn't give up. he went to this fight, and we see results. they actually are gaining success.

they are moving forward. they were able to escape, to rescue kyiv, and of course, now they face a very difficult fight, but we need to help them. if i may say so, zelensky had no choice because russia chose to invade. do we have a choice? that is the question. in this city today, you have people who are trying to figure out where the nearest bomb shelter is, and they are buying iodine tablets because they are frightened of nuclear attack. those are your people. not all of them. but this is realfear. that is hybrid warfare. that's what he's trying... putin is trying to make everybody fearful of him, and i said, enough is enough, are we either destroying this continent or not? will we be defensive, or are we going to say, no, we want to keep our democracy and freedom? let's talk now about strategic aims of the west in this war.

you are not directly in the fight yourselves, but you're doing more and more, to quote the british foreign secretary, "ramping up" arms supplies to ukraine. now, the americans and the british are using the sort of language, which suggests that the endgame of this war has to be every russian soldier leaving every inch of ukraine's territory, including that area of the donbas occupied in 2014 and crimea, which was annexed in 2014. is that your vision of the endgame, too? i will say yes, and i will tell you why, because this is the vision of the ukrainians, and i support it. it is their decision, whatever they say. it is their country. who am i to tell them what they should have in the country? that is their vision, and i support them because they are a democratic and free country. we are a community of peace. that is what i want to underline. what about putin and his future?

the defense secretary of the united states, lloyd austin, said, "russia must now be weakened to a point where it cannot do things like invade ukraine in future." it might have been a slip of the tongue, butjoe biden indicated that he believed that putin could have no future in russia. again, it is the decision of the russian people. that was biden saying... i understand, i know what he said, but if we are a democratic country, and if we honour the values of democratic countries, then the citizens of a country should decide of their leadership and that is what we do in democratic countries, and that is my decision, but of course, we have to stop putin to do this aggression, that is why we do economic sanctions, why we support the military of ukraine, because we want their victory, we want them to keep their freedom and democratic regime, because that is the best... my point, i suppose, is this, that some, like emmanuel macron, for example, has said

we have to talk to putin. europe, he says, cannot be safe and at peace if we do not talk to russia. on the other hand, and your government is involved in this, there are those using the rhetoric that there is no point talking to putin, your defence minister has said that putin is equal to hitler, so you don't negotiate presumably with a guy that you regard as equal to hitler. which is it for you, prime minister? we need to use all of the means. it cannot be only about talking. we know that. that is why we are helping with humanitarian help, that is why we say to the refugees, please feel at home while you need to stay here, so we need to use all of the means in order to bring back our peace, and also in ukraine, and that is the main principle. we have to stay with the core values. before we end, i do want to address how much pressure this is putting on your own country. you have at least 70,000

ukrainians who have stayed in your country, 350,000 have been through your country. there is reporting that your schools, some schools, are full beyond capacity, kindergartens cannot cope. 0n social media, we see some slovak people saying enough already, we cannot deal with these refugees, nobody is helping us. this could lead to instability in your country. are you ready for that? first of all, i want to thank our citizens. they proved great solidarity. they welcome all of these people with great warmth, they invited them into their homes and support them, feed them, and they have been all wonderful. the kindergartens, that is a challenge, we are doing a lot of measures, we're extending the capacity, creating temporary kindergartens et cetera, so we're increasing that so we can cope with the demand of the slovak children, and also the ukrainians, schools are ok, labour we are

ok, because we have a lot of vacant places, so i will say that they are a blessing to slovakia, because they help us to fill those empty places, so the biggest challenge is the kindergartens, that is where we are. my point is that slovakia, right now, appears united behind your government's stand on ukraine, but there is still an anti—us, sceptical element. that is because of russian propaganda. well, no, i looked at opinion polls before the invasion began, which suggested that there was a clear preponderance of people in this country who blame nato rather than putin, for his intentions. that was the influence of decades in slovakia that the governments tolerated russian propaganda. this war is such a wake—up call for slovakia, but for the whole region. my point is that you are vulnerable, still.

here is what cyber advisors, a defence minister in bratislava said, he said that, "in slovakia, there is a wide network of disinformation websites, so—called influencers, which the kremlin regime has quietly and strategically cultivated here in slovakia." it is a network, it is intricate, well organised and coordinated, and our population in slovakia is not prepared for the potential of russia's psychological military operations." is that true? slovakia are strong leaders. of course, we as a neighbour, one example i will show you, how we can see how important it is for a country like ours to be in an alliance. when we were in nato, we don't have f—16s, fighterjets, we have those obsolete migs, we have not procured other equipment, but as this war started, immediately, germany, netherlands, czech republic, slovenia and also other

countries said, "we will provide our soldiers, we will help you to protect your eastern border." they provided equipment, patriots came immediately, otherwise we would have to procure it, it would take years. where does this end? cos i have heard that you will host up to 1,000 us soldiers on your territory. a lot of slova ks do not want that. that was the situation injanuary, when there was this strong propaganda also run by our own opposition party. but the wake—up call came when putin attacked ukraine, because you know, what he was saying, our opposition leaders, three days before the war, said, "are you crazy?" "this government tells our own citizens that putin will invade ukraine, are you crazy?" in three days, he did it. end of game. so a lot of people woke up. yes, there are still people

under the influence of the propaganda. we have to cope with it, and work with it, but as i said, we have to evolve. the united states and great britain, politicians there are now saying that they believe that this war, which is currently in ukraine, but who knows where it is going to end, will last for years, possibly as long as a decade. is slovakia, a front—line state in all of this, is slovakia ready for that? mentally or economically, militarily, mentally? what are you asking? i am ready. economically, we are going through so many difficulties. we have just now proved five crucial reforms because of the recovery plan over the last year, and militarily, we received a lot of equipment from our allies, but we have to procure, we have to put much more money into defence. yes, we must be ready to do it, of course we are not

ready physically yet, but like i said, it starts with the decision, because we do not have another choice. if you want to keep democracy and freedom, sorry i repeat it so much, but i want to understand, everybody, we are in a war. it is the crossroads of our destiny. and i want to live in a better world. i want to live in a world where europe will be a strong, global player, and we won't need to see any dictator attacking any country and seeing war in this world and especially this region. prime minister eduard heger, we have to end it there. thank you for being on hardtalk. thank you very much.

hello there. cloud was the main weather feature for many places on bank holiday monday, and we take lots of that cloud with us into tuesday. the cloud showing up here on our earlier satellite picture. it is low cloud. it's turning things quite misty and murky in places, and there are some weak frontal systems just providing enough impetus to give a little bit of rain and drizzle here and there. but a mostly cloudy start to tuesday, some spots of rain and drizzle around. and where things brighten up, perhaps most especially in southern england and wales, where we see some sunshine, we will also see some scattered heavy showers and the odd thunderstorm breaking out into the afternoon. many spots will stay quite cloudy. rather cool for some north sea coasts. 10 degrees for aberdeen and newcastle, 16 for cardiff, 17 in london. and we see some showery rain into northern ireland through the afternoon. that will push across

a good part of scotland through the evening, and then getting down into parts of england and wales through the early hours of wednesday. but the rain quite fragmented, quite hit and miss. there'll still be some lengthy dry spells, a mild start to wednesday morning. those outbreaks of rain brought about by this very weak frontal system. it's running into relatively high pressure, so that means it's certainly not going to be a wash—out. the rain very hit and miss, very sporadic. some showery bursts of rain tending to clear eastwards. then we'll see some sunshine on wednesday, some brighter skies generally, but quite a few showers, some of which will be heavy and thundery. it will be a warmer day, highs for many between 15—19 degrees. and that theme continues as we head towards the end of the week. high pressure building to the south, frontal systems running to the north—west of the uk and this broadly south—westerly flow of air bringing some rather warm conditions in our direction. so, thursday will stay like this. much of england and wales will be dry with some sunny spells and just the odd shower.

northern ireland and scotland seeing more cloud and some splashes of rain at times, but not all the time. but the temperatures, 15 degrees there for glasgow, 16 for belfast, but 21 in london, maybe somewhere towards the south east getting 222 degrees. now, on friday, there'll some warmth once again towards the south east of the uk. but this band of rain looks like it will make some progress southwards, and behind that, something just a little bit cooler and fresher. so, temperatures of 12 degrees for stornoway, but 20 the high in london.

welcome to newsday, reporting live from singapore, i'm karishma vaswani. the headlines: hundreds of ukrainian civilians, including children, are still trapped in a steel plant in mariupol. those who've escaped tell their story. translation: for a month we were eating - over 40 l of us — six food tins. we boiled two buckets of soup out of them, and that was it for the whole day. we report from the town receiving those who've been evacuated. also coming up on newsday: restaurants are closed in beijing as the authorities struggle with a resurgence in covid cases. and, some chinese firms investing in europe are accused of exploiting workers and treating them like slaves. we have a special report from the balkans.