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tv   Talking Business  BBC News  June 16, 2022 2:30am-3:01am BST

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this is bbc news, the headlines: united states has announced a new practice of airy aid to ukraine worth $1 billion and urged allies to give more military aid to kyiv. you pledges a couple nato members meeting in brussels. police in brazil searching for the bodies of two men have found human remains. detectives in the city in the amazon onset as suspect has confessed to killing the two men. the us central bank has announced its biggest rise in interest rates since 1994.
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the 0.75% increase is an attempt by the federal reserve to combat surging inflation. rising prices are continuing to hit president biden�*s poll ratings. now on bbc news: talking business with aaron heslehurst. hello. let us take a look at what is on the show. the global economy is facing multiple crises, from supply chain chaos, war in europe, and potentialfamine. can this so—called poly crisis be taken on by the wto, the world trade organization, as global trade ministers meet face to face for the first time since the pandemic and the war in ukraine? i am going to be discussing all of this with these two. there they are. the boss of the world trade organization, as well as a former wto judge from china. and what does this mean for a business where trade is everything?
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i will be speaking with the boss of one of the biggest shipping and freight companies to find out how they are navigating through these choppy waters. whrnever you arejoining me from around the world, hello, welcome to the show. we are in a poly crisis. that is according to ngozi okonjo—iweala, because the wto is holding its most important meeting in more than four years. this week, trade ministers from more than 150 countries will gather in geneva in switzerland. the meeting has twice been postponed covid outbreaks.
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but now, as well as a world facing a pandemic and its aftermath, there is a war on european soil, globalfood shortages, and the global cost of living crisis. and of course, the continuing climate emergency. yes, poly crisis does seem about right. last time, the ministers met in december 2017, in buenos aires, they were greeted by anti—globalisation protesters. but dissent from the ministers is the bigger challenge that needs to be addressed. at the moment the wto is facing a crisis over its very existence. since 2019, and the presidency of donald trump, the united states has blocked the appointment of any newjudges to the wto applet body. that is a panel ofjudges from different member countries that decide on any challenges to the organisations rules. if this body cannot do its job because newjudges are not being appointed then none of the trade battles between countries, like us and china, can be resolved.
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while the biden administration says it wants to move beyond this, the block on newjudges remains. despite this, trade around the world has bounced back after the pandemic. global trade went to a record high in 2021. making it worth about $28.5 trillion. that's13% higher than the same number in 2019, before the pandemic to hold. but the supply chain crisis from the pandemic continues to linger, exacerbated by russia's ruthless attack on ukraine. oil prices have skyrocketed. a global shortage of that country's grain is causing major global concerns. that has led to some of the other big wheat producers such as india banning exports of their grains. but among measures that could be agreed by all parties at this wto meeting is exemption on export bans from the world food programme which is seeking to feed
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people in crisis. another change that could get approval is that of temporary waivers for intellectual property around vaccines. with much of the world still striving to jab its population, this could be a big win for the world trade 0rganization. agreements to stop over fishing and fishery subsidies could also be approved by the entire conference. smaller agreements between select countries could yield big results, which could include major economies agreeing to cut red tape for the service sector, new measures for america, europe, china, among others, to address the climate crisis. and key agreements to make digital trade more seamless across much of the world. so, as you can see, some major global challenges, and a very full plate for all those gathering at this all—important meeting. but where do they even start? to find out, i caught up with the big boss of the wto. dr ngozi 0konjo—iweala, my friend, always a pleasure having you on my show. let us start with this. as you've said, the global
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economy is facing multiple crises, which are having a profound effect on living standards around the world. where do we even start with these major issues? this is what i call this simultaneous crisis or poly crisis, it cannot be solved by any one country alone. that is why we need international cooperation. we need the multilateral system. some of them, are immediate emergencies, like the food crisis, that is facing as, the international health crisis, the pandemic, we see the pandemic going down in some countries, but it's not completely over. we now have vaccines that can help us do that, to solve it, although some parts of the world, like africa, still needs to get their vaccination rates up.
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we need to work on that, otherwise it might be variants more common among us. 0n food, we need to work together, we need to get the grain out of ukraine, because 20—25 million tons are waiting to be exported. we need those to be released on to international markets. above all, our members, we need them not to put on export restrictions and prohibitions for any length of time. on that note, because we are seeing some nations putting up trade barriers, which of course hinders the free flow of goods all around the world. perhaps, as you have mentioned, most worryingly on food essentials. but you, the wto, you exist to facilitate free trade. how do you bring down those barriers? with transparency. one of the tools we have
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is that it's ourjob to monitor these barriers. and once we know that members have put them up and it is transparent, it is easy, you know, to identify them, and work with them and get them to take those barriers away in the shortest possible time. we have 25 countries now have restrictions, this is a much lower number than at the height of the pandemic. this transparency, this will keep the number not going to high, with respect to those countries that have put in restrictions and prohibitions. and if they have, we are asking that they stick to the mutual guidelines, make them transparent, temporary and proportionate. indeed. it has been years since your top dispute resolution body was able to function. we know it was crippled
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by president trump blocking the appointment of newjudges. i want to ask you, when will you get it up and running again? and just briefly explain how important this group ofjudges are? the judges are part of what we call the appellate body, the central system of resolution. it has the panel where the members send a dispute. at the first level, for the panel to make a ruling. then they can put it to the appellate body. if we do not agree with a finding of the panel, then it is very important. the issues that we are getting conversation going on reform of this system, the us is reaching out at a technical level to talk with other members.
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that is promising because it means that one of the things we will be looking at, at least in the us despite concern, that is a good sign that we are beginning that process. there are some governments around the world and in particular the united states, that they are concerned about how china, the world's second biggest economy is treated by the wto. they say china should not get the concessions a developing economy is afforded. is there any merit in that argument, given that sheer size and influence of the chinese economy in the 20 years since its joined the wto? well, one of the things that is interesting or different or strange at the wto is that the wto, when it was founded, said countries should self designate what they want, whether they want to be called developed or developing.
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that is it. that does not change. china is designated as developing but in the past 25 years its economy has changed enormously, and changed fast. that has brought a lot of discussion about whether some of the ways of managing the economy in china are according to the rules, or that is something anti—competitive. what we are doing here, the wto, is trying to work with members on these issues, trying to make sure that benefits of special treatments, which is what those developing country members who are poorer get, they are able to implement agreements at perhaps a slower pace, and perhaps with more space and support than others,
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they are going to make sure that that benefit does go to members that need it. we are looking at the issue of subsidies, level playing field. we just completed the first stage of that kind of study with the imf, the 0ecd and the world bank, and the wto all working together to look into that problem. what is the level of industrial success? where is it coming from? agricultural subsidies. how do we reform the way we function in order to take account of these issues? we are looking at the level playing field issue. here is something i know is close to your heart because we know the covid pandemic still is not over and many countries are still struggling to access vaccines. you at the wto have spent more than 18 months trying to reach a deal on intellectual property rights. to make them more accessible, will having ministers meet in person at this gathering finally mean you get a deal? we are cautiously optimistic.
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right now, as we speak, negotiations are ongoing on this very issue. the good news is that after one and a half years of not really negotiating with each other, we have a text that everybody agrees on. the idea is to narrow the differences as much as possible so that when we discuss it next week they will have a text that they can look on and finalise and approve. we are cautiously optimistic. we are not out of the woods because there are strong areas of differences still. but we are very encouraged by the progress in negotiations. very briefly, the critics will say, the pharmaceutical companies have spent billions creating these vaccines, why give it away for free? is there a worry that if they had to it could jeopardise future vaccines? well, i do not think so.
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i think the kind of agreement that is being negotiated right now — to allow developing countries to be able to access patent so that they can be produced, should there be a problem, is not such a disincentive for the pharmaceutical companies. a deal on reducing fishing subsidies, we know that has proved elusive through 20 years of talks. given the threats to global fish stocks, and the focus on food security, given the war in ukraine, our mind is now focused on finally reaching a deal? you are touching on all the right issues. minds are really focused on this. i can tell you, for 21 years this agreement has been dragging on, right now in the past one year, very encouraged by the progress we are making. i do not want to overestimate
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the number of divergences that still exist among members on this important agreement, but again we are making progress. and we have to see how we land next week when the ministers come. but it is encouraging. dr ngozi 0konjo—iweala, i wish i had more time. but i don't. always a pleasure having you on the show. good luck with everything. i would love to talk to you soon. thank you. as we said at the top of the show, since 2019 the world trade organization has faced a crisis about its existence. the body ofjudges which rules on appeal to the wto has not been sitting. since 2019, the so—called appellate body was shut down after america said it would not approve the appointment of any new judges. as appeals can't be heard and ruled on, countries have been able to ignore some of the organisation's rules. earlier, i caught up with one of china's formerjudges
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on the wto appellate body. thank you for your time. i really appreciate it. it is great to have you. i want to make it clear that you are speaking to me from a personal point of view, not as a representative of the chinese government. so i really appreciate your time. let us start with this. for the past two and a half years the appellate body has not been functioning. it has not been able to function because china, the united states keep blocking judges. i want your opinion. do you think the appellate body will be able to recover? i feel very bad about the situation. the appellate body has done a wonderfuljob, deemed as the best function among four functions the wto. but with the blockage of the selection process, so all the appellate body cease to function, however since then, more than ten cases of appeal already submitted to the dsp, but nobody to handle these cases. so it is still pending. the rights to appeal of members are deprived.
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so it is a pity. does the wto have an answer, especially in this upcoming meeting? i think so. because i compare with other issues on the table. fisheries, vaccine waiver, or others. i think a resumption of the selection process of the appellate body is the easiest one, and is the urgent one, the most urgent issue.
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on that note, thank you so much for your time. i really appreciate it. good luck with everything. i will talk to you soon. 0k. thank you. even before russia invaded ukraine, globaltrade was reeling from the many shocks of the pandemic. changing consumer patterns, a bruised airline industry, and covid—related absences of shipping workers. add to that a war in europe and this has made the movement of global trade is uniquely challenging, and sending shipping rates through the roof. how do you navigate through all of that? i spoke to the boss of ocean network express, based in singapore, and one of the biggest shipping companies. jeremy nixon, a pleasure having you on the show. what is it that governments specifically have to do to free up global trade? they need to first of all look at their own individual countries. look at how is the existing
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supply chain working. look at the infrastructure that they have. their ports, the terminals, their railroads, the trucking operations, and do they have enough labour in those particular sectors. and i are those sectors working under very tight planning restrictions? is there enough new capacity being brought online to build to that. 0n the container shipping site, we have been traditionally building 4%—5% additional capacity over the last ten years on a regular basis. we have not seen that consistent supply—side extraction and build—up also on the landside operations. governments have got to look a lot more clearly at the infrastructure planning, and look at how the markets, how efficient are the markets working within their own individual domestic economies. secondly, they need to recognise the entire supply chain is linked up, so governments have to work together at a global level to make sure trading rules are clear, make sure that any adjustments that are being made to policies to do with transfer of people or crews or restrictions around certain commodities or whatever, are being thought through, and that this will not have some negative impact on supply chain and create additional bottlenecks and problems. make sure your markets are working, and working
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efficiently in terms of supply chain, also look at total global picture and realise supply chains are so interlinked that we need to work together, and total government policy at a global level to pull us through. but in part and just briefly, part of this, you are saying the needs to be more investment from government. indeed. also, to realise the pandemic is not completely finished. for example, in china we are still hoping that
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situation is improving, and that any stage we may get another flare—up somewhere else. while it may be covid situation and health situation is hopefully going to calm down, we still have weather—related issues, you sometimes have industrial relation issues that can also pop up, to do with trucking strikes, to do with labour strikes as well. we have various factors which could happen and bottleneck app, which would impact the overall supply chain. no room for any complacency. we need to work on this continuously to look at where these bottlenecks are, and free them up very quickly, because if they are allowed to continue they will have an overall knock—on impact right through the supply chain which may take many months to clear. we know that the pandemic is not over. winter is not far round the corner for the northern hemisphere. if it hits again, another variant hits again, will we have learned to right
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lessons to move forward? you have hit it on the nail. i am often asked, when is the supply chain going to calm down? when will things improve? i say, we are heading in the right direction, but we still of the pandemic existing, and while we still have locked out in certain areas, flair ups in certain areas, leading to labour shortages or complete closing down of factories in receiving areas, then that is going to mean problems will continue to exist. we need to get over that. secondly, we have had this major pandemic, hopefully the world learns from that. maybe we are better in the future in terms of predicting and spotting when the pandemic are happening, working quicker to close them down and stop them becoming a global phenomenon. but you need to do more in the healthcare sector, regarding our future risk aversion of these types of things happening. we are still dealing with post—pandemic chain chaos. but in late february of this year comes a war on european soil.
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what's that done? supply chain has been tough. we still have a lot of land aside bottlenecks. many of you will be aware we are still getting delays because of that back up from land side coming to 0ceanside. ships are running fine on the ocean side, we can carry things, we just cannot get them through the ports. changing gears and talking about that russia invasion, february, march this year, overall, russia, ukraine is 1—2% of global container business, not that significant in terms of overall supply chain. of course, very significant in terms of the citizens and businesses in russia and ukraine. we had to move very quickly for two reasons. 0ne, first of all, operationally we were having difficulty moving our ships into russian waters,
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because of the sanctions and conditions in and around the trading environment, particularly things like insurance cover, banking cover. secondly, the sanctions came on very fast, in terms of what goods and products can be moved into those markets. many of our customers stopped booking. we had to suspend pretty quickly back in february, march, also our russian business. just briefly, russian and ukrainian workers make up a lot of seafarers? that is a very good point. often when these things happen there as many unintended consequences that come out later. and while overall cargo volumes may be only one or 2% globally ukraine and russia, as you rightfullly point out, 15% of all global seafarers on the 60,000 ships around the globe trading are from ukraine or russia, and that provides a significant
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issue as well. we have to work diligently to find other crew members during this temporary situation, or maybe longer, as we can see, as things are developing at the moment. and make sure we have the cruise on board to keep the ships, the supply chain, are moving. when will rates normalise? we factor in design planning around the average container taking 50 days round trip. if it is taking 100 days we will run short of containers. and the ports, we are normally used to ships arriving on schedule on monday and immediately being served, 24 hours alongside, then departing. if we have to wait one or two weeks, that creates a huge problem, and the supply chain push back. we are seeing the port situation starting to improve. but we still have bottlenecks, like in north america and north europe. and some parts of asia as well. i would expect that as the supply chain starts to improve due to the health and covid issues, as the landside force comes back more effectively,
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as we get more resources from government and industry into more trucking and distribution centres, that by sometime the end of calendar 2022 we should see a return to normality, in terms of supply chain fluidity. if that happens, then assets could be deployed efficiently and effectively, therefore in 2023 we start to recover back to pre—covid levels in terms of business performance. on that note, i appreciate your time, thank you. good luck. talk to you soon. thank you. it has been a pleasure. that is it for this week show. i hope you enjoyed it. follow me on twitter. twist me, i will twitch you
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back. thank you for watching. i will see you soon. well, we're certainly turning up the heat over the next couple of days. for southern parts of the uk, this is going to be a short—lived heat wave. and this is the peak — by friday, london and the southeast up to around 33—34 celsius. look at the average — so we're significantly higher compared to what we would normally see this time of the year. not unprecedented — the record is actually a little above 35 celsius. so we're not beating any records, but it's not that far away, if you think about it. now, this is what's happening on the satellite picture. here's the heat coming in from the south. we've got cooler air in the north atlantic — that cooler air will eventually win, i think by the time we get to saturday into sunday, things will start cooling off and storms will come our way as well, but not in the short term. this is what it looks like thursday morning — clear skies across england and wales, a bit more cloud in the northwest here with these atlantic weather systems just brushing the northwest of the british isles, and bits and pieces of rain. some of the showers could turn a little heavy
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in the western isles, perhaps the north of northern ireland through the day. there's another weather front heading our way, but that's to come thursday night. but look at the temperatures — 28 in london, widely mid—20s into yorkshire, for example. we could actually hit 30 celsius on thursday. now, here's a reminder of the pollen levels — if you've been struggling with your nose and itchy eyes, the pollen levels are very high. and also, it's worth mentioning the uv levels — we are approaching the longest day of the year, the sun's high in the sky. you know, make sure you're very careful if you're out for any lengthy period of time in that sunshine. so, here's a look at the weather for friday. this will actually be the peak of the heat — so these south—southwesterly winds draw up that hot air from the south, 33—34 celsius, all the hot air coming in from france. the northwest of the country, much fresher here — this is that cooler atlantic air already starting to spread in. 17 celsius in glasgow. and this is what happens during the course of saturday — so that cooler atlantic air wrapping around this low pressure spreads across the country, here's the cold front. the heat is pushed to the south, back into france, and we get into this area of storminess. so come the weekend, whether you like it or not, after a hot and sunny friday,
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it's all going to go "bang".
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hello, welcome to bbc news, i'm rich preston. our top stories: the us announces a further $1 billion in military aid for kyiv and urges allies to provide more weapons to help ukraine battle russian forces. police searching the amazon for two missing men say they've found human remains and made an arrest. more than a million children in afghanistan are facing malnutrition, as the country struggles with an economic crisis. we hear from families desperately trying to survive. translation: i feel ashamed in front of my family that i am | so poor, i cannot afford to provide good food. my sons are really thin because
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they are not eating well. the us central bank announces the biggest rise in us interest

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