hello and welcome to the programme bringing together leading british commentators with foreign correspondents who write, blog, podcast and broadcast from the dateline: london. ?this week, british conservative mps completed their "colleague cull" in the hunt for their new leader and this country's next prime minister. have they also culled the economic consensus within which governments of left and right have operated for at least the last 20 years? and as the world waits for vladimir putin to allow safe passage of ukraine's grain, why putin was himself kept waiting. in the studio are ashis ray, indian writer and cricket

commentator since the 1970s, michael goldfarb, actor turned journalist, foreign correspondent for pbs radio in the united states, now host of the podcast the first rough draft of history, steve richards began his career as a westminster correspondent just as margaret thatcher was ending hers. coincidental! his blog is called rock and rolls politics, his most recent book about the talented politicians who failed to make it to number ten. steve, we can leave the question unanswered, whoever that is. what do you make of the choice that tory mps have presented between the sunak and loose trust? in a have presented between the sunak and loose trust? . , ., . have presented between the sunak and loose trust? ., , ., . ._ loose trust? in a very erratic way, ou can loose trust? in a very erratic way, you can see _ loose trust? in a very erratic way, you can see attempts, _ loose trust? in a very erratic way, you can see attempts, chaotic- loose trust? in a very erratic way, you can see attempts, chaotic in i you can see attempts, chaotic in johnson's case —— liz truss, attempts to move on from

thatcherism. borisjohnson occasionally put the case for high public spending. now you've got a battle with two people claiming the thatcherite in mantle, the focus is on tax cuts. when is the debate, but not should there be. there's no focus on the role of the state as demands of the state are growing. so, it's a return to that sort of 19805 so, it's a return to that sort of 1980s thatcherism that the tory party have been a radically trying to move away from. thatcherism, absolutely a product of its time. the late 70s and early 80s. not the situation we're in now. but she cast a spell over its membership, and these two candidates. it is a very narrow contest in that respect.

ashis, you were reporting in london when margaret thatcher was prime minister. as steve says, circumstances are different, but the debate is very much, it seems, over notjust debate is very much, it seems, over not just taxation and debate is very much, it seems, over notjust taxation and the debate is very much, it seems, over not just taxation and the fact we got the highest burden since the 19505 got the highest burden since the 1950s under rishi sunak�*s chancellorship. that's a ground for liz truss to attack him on, but she also seems to be attacking the consensus of economic policy for 20 years. that's quite radical. yes. years. that's quite radical. yes, because britain _ years. that's quite radical. yes, because britain had _ years. that's quite radical. yes, because britain had to - years. that's quite radical. yes, because britain had to move - years. that's quite radical. yes, because britain had to move somewhat towards _ because britain had to move somewhat towards the _ because britain had to move somewhat towards the centre in terms of economic_ towards the centre in terms of economic policy, and therefore that's— economic policy, and therefore that's something that she is trying to yank— that's something that she is trying to yank out, it would appear, or at least _ to yank out, it would appear, or at least that— to yank out, it would appear, or at least that might be her attempt. whether— least that might be her attempt. whether that's the sensible thing to do, whether that's the sensible thing to do. i don't _ whether that's the sensible thing to do, i don't know. for the simple reason _ do, idon't know. for the simple reason that— do, i don't know. for the simple reason that people seem to think that rishi — reason that people seem to think that rishi sunak's approach, which is of trying — that rishi sunak's approach, which is of trying to reduce the state

debt— is of trying to reduce the state debt before lowering taxes, seems... he said _ debt before lowering taxes, seems... he said any— debt before lowering taxes, seems... he said any rises probably would not be at least before the end of next year. be at least before the end of next ear. ., �* year. he said he won't give them straiaht year. he said he won't give them straight away _ year. he said he won't give them straight away because _ year. he said he won't give them straight away because he - year. he said he won't give them straight away because he needsl year. he said he won't give them. straight away because he needs to recover— straight away because he needs to recover the money that has been spent, _ recover the money that has been spent, and — recover the money that has been spent, and therefore the government debt has— spent, and therefore the government debt has grown exponentially. that said, _ debt has grown exponentially. that said. i_ debt has grown exponentially. that said, i think people, although they think— said, i think people, although they think that — said, i think people, although they think that maybe the more responsible, more sensible thing to do, responsible, more sensible thing to do. but _ responsible, more sensible thing to do, but clearly, the populist line is cut— do, but clearly, the populist line is cut taxes— do, but clearly, the populist line is cut taxes now. that seems to be playing _ is cut taxes now. that seems to be playing out — is cut taxes now. that seems to be playing out reasonably well. if you look at what brexit is, it is

a direct product _ if you look at what brexit is, it is a direct product of... _ if you look at what brexit is, it is a direct product of... i _ if you look at what brexit is, it is a direct product of... i was - if you look at what brexit is, it is a direct product of... i was a - a direct product of... i was a journalist _ a direct product of... i was a journalist here _ a direct product of... i was a journalist here in— a direct product of... i was a journalist here in the - a direct product of... i was a journalist here in the late i a direct product of... i was a. journalist here in the late 805 a direct product of... i was a - journalist here in the late 805 and early— journali5t here in the late 805 and early 90s— journali5t here in the late 805 and early 90s as — journali5t here in the late 805 and early 905 as well. _ journali5t here in the late 805 and early 905 as well. europe - journali5t here in the late 805 and early 905 as well. europe was - journali5t here in the late 805 and early 905 as well. europe was the j early 905 as well. europe was the issue _ early 905 as well. europe was the issue that — early 905 as well. europe was the issue that split _ early 905 as well. europe was the issue that split the _ early 905 as well. europe was the issue that split the conservative l i55ue that split the conservative party— issue that split the conservative party apart _ issue that split the conservative party apart and _ issue that split the conservative party apart and the _ issue that split the conservative - party apart and the anti—europeans, and she _ party apart and the anti—europeans, and she was— party apart and the anti—europeans, and she was there _ party apart and the anti—europeans, and she was there figurehead. - party apart and the anti—europeans, and she was there figurehead. they| and she was there figurehead. they never— and she was there figurehead. they never forgave — and she was there figurehead. they never forgave her. _ and she was there figurehead. they never forgave her. the _ and she was there figurehead. they never forgave her. the uk - and she was there figurehead. they never forgave her. the uk was - and she was there figurehead. they i never forgave her. the uk was formed bym _ never forgave her. the uk was formed by potiticiahs— never forgave her. the uk was formed by... politicians who _ never forgave her. the uk was formed by... politicians who thought - never forgave her. the uk was formed by... politicians who thought he - by... politicians who thought he wasn't _ by... politicians who thought he wasn't a — by... politicians who thought he wasn't a good _ by... politicians who thought he wasn't a good thatcherite. - by... politicians who thought he wasn't a good thatcherite. theyj by... politicians who thought he - wasn't a good thatcherite. they said wouidh't _ wasn't a good thatcherite. they said wouldn't it _ wasn't a good thatcherite. they said wouldn't it be — wa5n't a good thatcherite. they said wouldn't it be easier— wasn't a good thatcherite. they said wouldn't it be easier to have - wasn't a good thatcherite. they said wouldn't it be easier to have a - wouldn't it be easier to have a seahce? — wouldn't it be easier to have a seahce? you _ wouldn't it be easier to have a 5eance? you can— wouldn't it be easier to have a 5eance? you can have - wouldn't it be easier to have a 5eance? you can have a - wouldn't it be easier to have a 5eance? you can have a nice i 5eance? you can have a nice discussion. _ 5eance? you can have a nice discussion, but— 5eance? you can have a nice discussion, but can - 5eance? you can have a nice discussion, but can we - 5eance? you can have a nice discussion, but can we alsol 5eance? you can have a nice l discussion, but can we also be legislated _ di5cu55ion, but can we also be legislated for— discussion, but can we also be legislated for the _ discussion, but can we also be legislated for the 215t - discussion, but can we also be | legislated for the 215t century? discussion, but can we also be - legislated for the 215t century? i'm not sure _ legislated for the 215t century? i'm not sure they — legislated for the 215t century? i'm not sure they really _ legislated for the 215t century? i'm not sure they really are _ legislated for the 215t century? i'm not sure they really are there. - not sure they really are there. you're — not sure they really are there. you're right— not sure they really are there. you're right and _ not sure they really are there. you're right and she _ not sure they really are there. you're right and she cast- not sure they really are there. you're right and she cast a - not sure they really are there. i you're right and she cast a spell, but it change with her leadership. it became more ideological. so you're absolutely right, but you do

every now and again see kind of a very erratic attempt to move on and address the demands of now rather than... but she's there, absolutely. crosstalk things have changed. the conservative _ things have changed. the conservative pre55 - things have changed. the conservative press has i things have changed. the - conservative press has become things have changed. the _ conservative press has become much more _ conservative press has become much more hard-iihe — conservative press has become much more hard—line and _ conservative press has become much more hard—line and much _ conservative press has become much more hard—line and much less- more hard—line and much less interested _ more hard—line and much less interested in— more hard—line and much less interested injournali5m, - more hard—line and much less interested injournali5m, andl more hard—line and much less- interested injournali5m, and now it's all— interested injournali5m, and now it's all developing _ interested injournali5m, and now it's all developing all— interested injournali5m, and now it's all developing all the - interested injournali5m, and now it's all developing all the time. i. it'5 all developing all the time. i can remember— it'5 all developing all the time. i can remember many— it's all developing all the time. i can remember many a - it's all developing all the time. i can remember many a time - it's all developing all the time. i. can remember many a time where the daily telegraph — can remember many a time where the daily telegraph or— can remember many a time where the daily telegraph or the _ can remember many a time where the daily telegraph or the daily _ can remember many a time where the daily telegraph or the daily mail - daily telegraph or the daily mail would _ daily telegraph or the daily mail would be — daily telegraph or the daily mail would be talking _ would be talking about the chancellor _ would be talking about the chancellor —like _ would be talking about the chancellor —like ri5hi - would be talking about the . chancellor —like ri5hi sunak. puttihg — chancellor —like ri5hi sunak. puttihg up _ chancellor —like ri5hi sunak. putting up taxe5 _ chancellor —like ri5hi sunak. putting up taxe5 now- chancellor —like ri5hi sunak. putting up taxe5 now so - chancellor —like ri5hi sunak. putting up taxe5 now so he l chancellor —like ri5hi sunak. . putting up taxe5 now so he can chancellor —like ri5hi sunak. - putting up taxe5 now so he can have a trig-budget— putting up taxe5 now so he can have a trig-budget six— putting up taxe5 now so he can have a big—budget six months— putting up taxe5 now so he can have a big—budget six months before - putting up taxe5 now so he can have a big—budget six months before the| a big—budget six months before the next election. the _ a big—budget six months before the next election. the con5ervative5 . next election. the con5ervative5 would _ next election. the con5ervative5 would win — next election. the con5ervative5 would win and _ next election. the con5ervative5 would win and they _ next election. the con5ervative5 would win and they could - next election. the con5ervative5 would win and they could roll. next election. the con5ervative5 i would win and they could roll over their— would win and they could roll over their mandate. _ would win and they could roll over their mandate. that'5 _ would win and they could roll over their mandate. that'5 sort - would win and they could roll overj their mandate. that'5 sort of what rishi suhak— their mandate. that'5 sort of what rishi sunak is _ their mandate. that'5 sort of what ri5hi sunak is proposing, - their mandate. that'5 sort of what ri5hi sunak is proposing, i5n't - their mandate. that'5 sort of what ri5hi sunak is proposing, isn't it? | ri5hi sunak is proposing, isn't it? but that's— ri5hi sunak is proposing, isn't it? but that's good _ ri5hi sunak is proposing, isn't it? but that's good politic5. - ri5hi sunak is proposing, isn't it? but that's good politic5. it'5 - ri5hi sunak is proposing, isn't it? but that's good politic5. it's a - but that's good politics. it's a topsy—turvy contest. he is the

thatcherite. she used to go around saying you have to balance the books. "my father never spent more than he own," and so on, which is basically what he's saying. but he is being attacked by those who regard themselves as the committed thatcherites, like jacob rees—mogg, as a socialist, even though he's the balance the book, don't cut taxes until he can pay. he might be wrong, but the thatcherite view. liz truss is more stuck in that reagan view that if you borrow to cut taxes and difficult —— deaf as it doesn't matter that much and we can pay back over many decades. that's not really how the party sees it, which is teary it. how the party sees it, which is tea it. , ,, .,~ how the party sees it, which is tea it. , ,, , teary it. rishi sunak has definitely declared himself _ teary it. rishi sunak has definitely declared himself to _ teary it. rishi sunak has definitely declared himself to be _ teary it. rishi sunak has definitely declared himself to be a _

teary it. rishi sunak has definitely i declared himself to be a thatcherite and ominous —— economics. whereas officially, _ and ominous —— economics. whereas officially, this— and ominous —— economics. whereas officially, thi5 tru5t ha5n't, but where — officially, thi5 tru5t ha5n't, but where i— officially, thi5 tru5t ha5n't, but where i think liz tru55 ha5 officially, thi5 tru5t ha5n't, but where i think liz tru55 has played the popular line is by saying to where i think liz truss has played the popular line is by saying to cut taxes _ the popular line is by saying to cut taxes now. the other thing is about her ideological inconsistency over a lon- her ideological inconsistency over a long period of time. she moved from the lib— long period of time. she moved from the lib dems to the liberal wing, if you like _ the lib dems to the liberal wing, if you like 0f— the lib dems to the liberal wing, if you like. of the conservative party. now you like. of the conservative party. now her— you like. of the conservative party. now her latest position seems to be to the _ now her latest position seems to be to the right, so she has moved quite a lot and _ to the right, so she has moved quite a lot and seems to be flaky. isn�*t a lot and seems to be flaky. isn't this a bit like — a lot and seems to be flaky. isn't this a bit like primaries _ a lot and seems to be flaky. isn't this a bit like primaries in - a lot and seems to be flaky. isn�*t this a bit like primaries in the us? you attacked the activists, then you slowly move towards a slightly larger position. but

slowly move towards a slightly larger position.— slowly move towards a slightly laraer osition. �* ., �* ., larger position. but you don't have to brin: in larger position. but you don't have to bring in voters _ larger position. but you don't have to bring in voters to _ larger position. but you don't have to bring in voters to this _ larger position. but you don't have to bring in voters to this context. | to bring in voters to this context. if to bring in voters to this context. if you _ to bring in voters to this context. if you can't — to bring in voters to this context. if you can't get _ to bring in voters to this context. if you can't get it— to bring in voters to this context. if you can't get it right _ to bring in voters to this context. if you can't get it right the - to bring in voters to this context. if you can't get it right the first . if you can't get it right the first time. — if you can't get it right the first time, cameron— if you can't get it right the first time, cameron and _ if you can't get it right the first time, cameron and johnson i if you can't get it right the first. time, cameron and johnson were if you can't get it right the first - time, cameron and johnson were big enough _ time, cameron and johnson were big enough personalities— time, cameron and johnson were big enough personalities for— time, cameron and johnson were big enough personalities for the - time, cameron and johnson were big enough personalities for the job. - enough personalities for the job. theresa — enough personalities for the job. theresa maym _ enough personalities for the 'ob. theresa may. . .i theresa may... crosstalk it 'ust theresa may... crosstalk it just feels _ theresa may... crosstalk it just feels like _ theresa may... crosstalk it just feels like in - theresa may. . . crosstalk | itjust feels like in effect,... this— itjust feels like in effect,... this is— itjust feels like in effect,... this is the _ itjust feels like in effect,... this is the third _ itjust feels like in effect,... this is the third prime - itjust feels like in effect,... i this is the third prime minister itjust feels like in effect,... - this is the third prime minister to be selected _ this is the third prime minister to be selected. bind— this is the third prime minister to be selected-— be selected. and the rest of the electorate _ be selected. and the rest of the electorate has _ be selected. and the rest of the electorate has excluded... - be selected. and the rest of the electorate has excluded... just | be selected. and the rest of the i electorate has excluded... just as it would with _ electorate has excluded... just as it would with tony _ electorate has excluded... just as it would with tony blair. - electorate has excluded... just as i it would with tony blair. crosstalk laughter wasn't the story that blair and brown — wasn't the story that blair and brown had _ wasn't the story that blair and brown had a _ wasn't the story that blair and brown had a packed? - wasn't the story that blair and brown had a packed? maybe l wasn't the story that blair and i brown had a packed? maybe blair

regretted — brown had a packed? maybe blair regretted having _ brown had a packed? maybe blair regretted having made _ brown had a packed? maybe blair regretted having made that - brown had a packed? maybe blair regretted having made that pact. | brown had a packed? maybe blair. regretted having made that pact. but he honoured — regretted having made that pact. but he honoured it~ — regretted having made that pact. but he honoured it. i— regretted having made that pact. but he honoured it. i have _ regretted having made that pact. but he honoured it. i have to— regretted having made that pact. but he honoured it. i have to say, - regretted having made that pact. but he honoured it. i have to say, it - he honoured it. i have to say, it feels _ he honoured it. i have to say, it feels wrong _ he honoured it. i have to say, it feels wrong that _ he honoured it. i have to say, it feels wrong that you _ he honoured it. i have to say, it feels wrong that you can, - he honoured it. i have to say, it feels wrong that you can, and l he honoured it. i have to say, it - feels wrong that you can, and seven years. _ feels wrong that you can, and seven years. lose — feels wrong that you can, and seven years, lose control— feels wrong that you can, and seven years, lose control of— feels wrong that you can, and seven years, lose control of your- feels wrong that you can, and seven years, lose control of your own - years, lose control of your own party. — years, lose control of your own party. much _ years, lose control of your own party. much less— years, lose control of your own party, much less a _ years, lose control of your own party, much less a country... i years, lose control of your own . party, much less a country... it's ve party, much less a country... very interesting that you party, much less a country...- very interesting that you mentioned gordon brown almost insisted there be no other candidates, it was just him. you can see now why he did it. it's really dangerous when the door is open on what happens behind the scenes, and we found moments of debates where rishi sunak and this trust are arguing over fundamental tax policies —— liz truss. in a way that breaks the spell about unity, it's very hard once the spell is broken, to put the genie back in the

bottle. there will be many consequences. in bottle. there will be many consequences.— bottle. there will be many consequences. bottle. there will be many conseuuences. , ., , , consequences. in terms of stability, it's revolving _ consequences. in terms of stability, it's revolving door— consequences. in terms of stability, it's revolving door prime _ consequences. in terms of stability, it's revolving door prime ministers. | it's revolving door prime ministers. this is— it's revolving door prime ministers. this is not— it's revolving door prime ministers. this is not really the history of the conservative party, and what he referred _ the conservative party, and what he referred to — the conservative party, and what he referred to is that gordon brown's turn came — referred to is that gordon brown's turn came after a decade, so it wasn't — turn came after a decade, so it wasn't really immediate.- turn came after a decade, so it wasn't really immediate. let's talk a bit about what _ wasn't really immediate. let's talk a bit about what these _ wasn't really immediate. let's talk a bit about what these two - wasn't really immediate. let's talk a bit about what these two may . wasn't really immediate. let's talk a bit about what these two may or| a bit about what these two may or may not mean for the rest of the world. just on this question of liz truss's position, there will be a lot of places where i suspect the united states would be wondering where her critique of the way the global economy operates will resonate, not least over the localisation. could she actually be quite a useful figure localisation. could she actually be quite a usefulfigure in localisation. could she actually be quite a useful figure in that regard? bet quite a useful figure in that retard? �* ., ., �* ~' regard? at the moment, i don't think

an one is regard? at the moment, i don't think anyone is paying _ regard? at the moment, i don't think anyone is paying attention _ regard? at the moment, i don't think anyone is paying attention to - regard? at the moment, i don't think anyone is paying attention to that. i anyone is paying attention to that. one of— anyone is paying attention to that. one of the — anyone is paying attention to that. one of the things _ anyone is paying attention to that. one of the things is _ anyone is paying attention to that. one of the things is the _ anyone is paying attention to that. one of the things is the pivot - one of the things is the pivot towards _ one of the things is the pivot towards china, _ one of the things is the pivot towards china, and _ one of the things is the pivoti towards china, and wondering one of the things is the pivot - towards china, and wondering how to play china _ towards china, and wondering how to play china and — towards china, and wondering how to play china and anticipating the - play china and anticipating the next 20-30 _ play china and anticipating the next 20-30 years — play china and anticipating the next 20—30 years really _ play china and anticipating the next 20—30 years really does _ play china and anticipating the next 20—30 years really does preoccupyl 20—30 years really does preoccupy everybody — 20—30 years really does preoccupy everybody in — 20—30 years really does preoccupy everybody in washington. - 20—30 years really does preoccupy everybody in washington. plus - 20—30 years really does preoccupy l everybody in washington. plus there is our— everybody in washington. plus there is our own— everybody in washington. plus there is our own internal— everybody in washington. plus there is our own internal problems. - everybody in washington. plus there is our own internal problems. this i is our own internal problems. this past week. — is our own internal problems. this past week, january _ is our own internal problems. this past week, january the _ is our own internal problems. this past week, january the 6th - is our own internal problems. this - past week, january the 6th committee wrapped _ past week, january the 6th committee wrapped up— past week, january the 6th committee wrapped up its— past week, january the 6th committee wrapped up its summer— past week, january the 6th committee wrapped up its summer hearings. - wrapped up its summer hearings. people _ wrapped up its summer hearings. people are — wrapped up its summer hearings. people are just _ wrapped up its summer hearings. people are just having _ wrapped up its summer hearings. people are just having to - wrapped up its summer hearings. people are just having to deal - wrapped up its summer hearings. | people are just having to deal with the fact that — people are just having to deal with the fact that the _ people are just having to deal with the fact that the us— people are just having to deal with the fact that the us is _ people are just having to deal with the fact that the us is both - people are just having to deal with| the fact that the us is both looking towards _ the fact that the us is both looking towards china, _ the fact that the us is both looking towards china, but _ the fact that the us is both looking towards china, but internally, - the fact that the us is both looking towards china, but internally, ourl towards china, but internally, our policies _ towards china, but internally, our policies are — towards china, but internally, our policies are such _ towards china, but internally, our policies are such a _ towards china, but internally, our policies are such a mess. - towards china, but internally, our policies are such a mess. i- towards china, but internally, our. policies are such a mess. i honestly don't _ policies are such a mess. i honestly don't think— policies are such a mess. i honestly don't think any— policies are such a mess. i honestly don't think any british _ policies are such a mess. i honestly don't think any british prime - don't think any british prime minister. _ don't think any british prime minister, even _ don't think any british prime minister, even a _ don't think any british prime minister, even a force - don't think any british prime l minister, even a force johnson don't think any british prime - minister, even a force johnson says hold america — minister, even a force johnson says hold america close _ minister, even a force johnson says hold america close stoplight - minister, even a force johnson says hold america close stoplight like i hold america close stoplight like his farewell— hold america close stoplight like his farewell message _ hold america close stoplight like his farewell message in - hold america close stoplight like his farewell message in the - hold america close stoplight like i his farewell message in the house hold america close stoplight like - his farewell message in the house of commons _ his farewell message in the house of commons it's— his farewell message in the house of commons. it's out _ his farewell message in the house of commons. it's out there _ his farewell message in the house of commons. it's out there and - his farewell message in the house of commons. it's out there and it's- his farewell message in the house of commons. it's out there and it's a i commons. it's out there and it's a reminder— commons. it's out there and it's a reminder that _ commons. it's out there and it's a reminderthat he _ commons. it's out there and it's a reminder that he saying _ commons. it's out there and it's a reminder that he saying no- commons. it's out there and it's a| reminder that he saying no matter what _ reminder that he saying no matter what happens _ reminder that he saying no matter what happens domestically, - reminder that he saying no matter what happens domestically, don'tl what happens domestically, don't lose sight— what happens domestically, don't lose sight of— what happens domestically, don't lose sight of it. _ what happens domestically, don't lose sight of it. i— what happens domestically, don't lose sight of it. i don't— what happens domestically, don't lose sight of it. i don't think- what happens domestically, don't lose sight of it. i don't think you i lose sight of it. i don't think you ever— lose sight of it. i don't think you

ever emerges _ lose sight of it. i don't think you ever emerges from _ lose sight of it. i don't think you ever emerges from this - lose sight of it. i don't think you ever emerges from this —— - lose sight of it. i don't think you - ever emerges from this —— whoever... liz trues— ever emerges from this —— whoever... liz truss hes— ever emerges from this —— whoever... liz truss has talked _ ever emerges from this —— whoever... liz truss has talked the _ ever emerges from this —— whoever... liz truss has talked the talk. - ever emerges from this —— whoever... liz truss has talked the talk. she - liz truss has talked the talk. she said they would be there if china invades taiwan. she said they would be there if china invades taiwan.— invades taiwan. she has a quite dangerous _ invades taiwan. she has a quite dangerous impulsive _ invades taiwan. she has a quite dangerous impulsive streak. - invades taiwan. she has a quite| dangerous impulsive streak. you remember the beginning of the russian invasion, she said ordinary people want to go out and fight, so that's fine as far as she's concerned. she had to be immediately disowned by the defence secretary within minutes. and likewise, rather alarming prospect that britain will be involved in some sort of military operation against china. she was interviewed the other day about russia and whether she would consider some sort of deeper military operation against russia, and she said no without hesitation. but she is impulsive. and that is

potentially quite dangerous in the current unstable situation. we know about rishi sunak's _ current unstable situation. we know about rishi sunak's family _ about rishi sunak's family connections to india. for the diaspora, he's an interesting figure, but what could he mean? what might he mean to the rest of the world? the og elite —— izzy likely to take a more collaborative approach —— is he? liz to take a more collaborative approach -- is he? liz truss's record has — approach -- is he? liz truss's record has been _ approach -- is he? liz truss's record has been quite - approach -- is he? liz truss's - record has been quite unremarkable as a minister. as far as india record has been quite unremarkable as a minister. as faras india is concerned. _ as a minister. as faras india is concerned, i think there's great excitement about this leadership contest — excitement about this leadership contest. it's all over media in india — contest. it's all over media in india it's _ contest. it's all over media in india. it's on television, it's on newspapers, it's playing out in a very— newspapers, it's playing out in a very big — newspapers, it's playing out in a very big way. of course, people are a little _ very big way. of course, people are a little too — very big way. of course, people are a little too exuberant and didn't quite _ a little too exuberant and didn't quite understand that two stage process — quite understand that two stage process. rishi sunak taking the lead

with the _ process. rishi sunak taking the lead with the reality with mps. the}t process. rishi sunak taking the lead with the reality with mps.— with the reality with mps. they said that was it! almost _ with the reality with mps. they said that was it! almost excitement. - that was it! almost excitement. suddenly. _ that was it! almost excitement. suddenly, reality _ that was it! almost excitement. suddenly, reality has _ that was it! almost excitement. suddenly, reality has gone, - that was it! almost excitement. suddenly, reality has gone, and that was it! almost excitement. i suddenly, reality has gone, and by the way, _ suddenly, reality has gone, and by the way, what i've been writing from here has— the way, what i've been writing from here has been a minority view because i've tried to explain this for the _ because i've tried to explain this for the last two weeks. this is a two stage — for the last two weeks. this is a two stage process, but nobody listens! �* , i two stage process, but nobody listens!_ i found - two stage process, but nobodyi listens!_ i found that two stage process, but nobody - listens!_ i found that one listens! laughter i found that one ofthe listens! laughter i found that one of the services said listens! laughter i found that one ofthe listens! laughter i found that one of the services said the prospect does _ of the services said the prospect does not — of the services said the prospect does not look very good when it cuntes— does not look very good when it comes to — does not look very good when it comes to the membership stage of the balloting _ comes to the membership stage of the balloting. so that, i think, comes to the membership stage of the balloting. so that, ithink, has created— balloting. so that, ithink, has created a— balloting. so that, ithink, has created a bit of a pause, but there is still— created a bit of a pause, but there is still a _ created a bit of a pause, but there is still a bit — created a bit of a pause, but there is still a bit of excitement, visible _ is still a bit of excitement, visible excitement, it has not gone away~ _ visible excitement, it has not gone awa . , ., . , away. one thing we should all be caettin away. one thing we should all be getting excited — away. one thing we should all be getting excited about, _ away. one thing we should all be getting excited about, arguably, | away. one thing we should all be i getting excited about, arguably, is this deal that was finally agreed on friday between, not directly between ukraine and russia, but between

ukraine and russia, but between ukraine and russia, but between ukraine and and turkey and russia and turkey to allow grain exports to happen again. this is hugely significant if it happens, what you think of it? , . , significant if it happens, what you think of it? , ., , significant if it happens, what you think of it? , , . , significant if it happens, what you thinkofit? , . , ., think of it? this has been any works uuite well think of it? this has been any works quite well and _ think of it? this has been any works quite well and we _ think of it? this has been any works quite well and we will _ think of it? this has been any works quite well and we will learn - think of it? this has been any works quite well and we will learn more i quite well and we will learn more about it. it shows how complicated and is, central age eyes, the caspian sea. you know, the caspian world is. i mean, russia and iran, russia and iran have been... you know, they have been helping to basically destroy syria in support of basher al—assad for more than a decade now. and turkey, which borders syria and iran, it is almost like our representative and it is incredibly complicated, so there's a

deal was confirmed when vladimir putin went to tehran last week. what else was discussed? well, can turkey have another incursion into northern syria to protect its interests in that part of the country which is in the hands of the kurds and maybe throw some bombs into iraqi kurdistan. eight or nine people were killed at a resort this week when the turks bombed it. what are leveraged as the united states have in any of this, none. because geography is destiny. these are neighbours and they work together and they can be utilised to come up with a deal like this brokered with the un and present article on. irate the un and present article on. we talked aboutjoe biden's the un and present article on. we talked about joe biden's visit to talked aboutjoe biden's visit to the middle east and whether it would yield anything —— with the un and

president of erodgan. whether he would hold his nose and do his best with muhammad bin salman, the crown prince there, notwithstanding what he had said before about him in saudi arabia. and that is the real politics. turkey, presumably... it is part of nato, it is part of the military operation in defence of ukraine against russia.- ukraine against russia. turkey doesn't- - - _ ukraine against russia. turkey doesn't... have _ ukraine against russia. turkey doesn't. .. have to _ ukraine against russia. turkey doesn't. .. have to be - ukraine against russia. turkey doesn't... have to be careful. ukraine against russia. turkey i doesn't. .. have to be careful how doesn't... have to be careful how you speak about erodgan, but he is kind of indispensable. and he is also infuriating to washington, to london, to the rest of the nato partnership. and this has been the case. if you go back to 2003 when the us wanted to invade iraq to rights, through the south and through turkey, you can't do it. and it has been like this now for almost

20 years. but he is kind of indispensable and the thing i come back to, just a second, ashis, the point i was making earlier about what americans are thinking about anyway. yes, washington is full of, he is going to fist pump mbs, and what about the murder of —— murder of kasia goldie —— murder of kashagoggi. you could think... it of kashagoggi. you could think... it is not the world we live in now. we saw it of any migrant deal to take pressure of europe, a number of migrants coming to take pressure of europe, a number of migrants coming through against that, but he expected a price. presumably it will extract the political rights from this deal. , . , , . . , extract the political rights from this deal. , , . ., , this deal. presumably. what is most interesting. — this deal. presumably. what is most

interesting, well _ this deal. presumably. what is most interesting, well we _ this deal. presumably. what is most interesting, well we are _ this deal. presumably. what is most interesting, well we are waiting - this deal. presumably. what is most interesting, well we are waiting to l interesting, well we are waiting to come _ interesting, well we are waiting to come on. — interesting, well we are waiting to come on. i— interesting, well we are waiting to come on, i do not know if you heard that _ come on, i do not know if you heard that... ., . , ., that... one of the agents of the deal was being _ that... one of the agents of the deal was being interviewed, - that... one of the agents of the - deal was being interviewed, someone from nat0~ _ deal was being interviewed, someone from nat0~ and — deal was being interviewed, someone from nato. and she _ deal was being interviewed, someone from nato. and she was— deal was being interviewed, someone from nato. and she was making - deal was being interviewed, someone from nato. and she was making the l from nato. and she was making the point _ from nato. and she was making the point that— from nato. and she was making the point that russia _ from nato. and she was making the point that russia benefits _ point that russia benefits considerably _ point that russia benefits considerably from - point that russia benefits considerably from this - point that russia benefits . considerably from this deal. point that russia benefits - considerably from this deal. the point that russia benefits considerably from this deal. the un secretary-general,. _ considerably from this deal. the un secretary-general,. that _ considerably from this deal. the un secretary-general,. that is - considerably from this deal. the un secretary-general,. that is who - considerably from this deal. the un secretary-general,. that is who it l secretary-general,. that is who it was. and secretary-general,. that is who it was and he _ secretary-general,. that is who it was. and he said, _ secretary-general,. that is who it was. and he said, we _ secretary-general,. that is who it was. and he said, we need - secretary-general,. that is who it was. and he said, we need the . secretary-general,. that is who it. was. and he said, we need the grain, basically~ _ was. and he said, we need the grain, basically~ the — was. and he said, we need the grain, basically. the world _ was. and he said, we need the grain, basically. the world means _ was. and he said, we need the grain, basically. the world means the - was. and he said, we need the grain, basically. the world means the grain| basically. the world means the grain or there _ basically. the world means the grain or there will — basically. the world means the grain or there will be _ basically. the world means the grain or there will be appalling... - basically. the world means the grain or there will be appalling... fifth- or there will be appalling... fifth laruest or there will be appalling... fifth largest exporter _ or there will be appalling... fifth largest exporter of _ or there will be appalling... largest exporter of grain. or there will be appalling...- largest exporter of grain. exactly. so you see how this leverage plays out in _ so you see how this leverage plays out in lots — so you see how this leverage plays out in lots of — so you see how this leverage plays out in lots of different _ so you see how this leverage plays out in lots of different ways - so you see how this leverage plays out in lots of different ways as - out in lots of different ways as this what _ out in lots of different ways as this what seems _ out in lots of different ways as this what seems to _ out in lots of different ways as this what seems to be - out in lots of different ways as this what seems to be anyway| out in lots of different ways as - this what seems to be anyway the war of attrition _ this what seems to be anyway the war of attrition in — this what seems to be anyway the war of attrition in ukraine _ this what seems to be anyway the war of attrition in ukraine and _ this what seems to be anyway the war of attrition in ukraine and i— of attrition in ukraine and i wondered _ of attrition in ukraine and i wondered if— of attrition in ukraine and i wondered if it _ of attrition in ukraine and i wondered if it will - of attrition in ukraine and i wondered if it will extend i of attrition in ukraine and ii wondered if it will extend at of attrition in ukraine and i- wondered if it will extend at some point _ wondered if it will extend at some point to— wondered if it will extend at some point to energy~ _ wondered if it will extend at some point to energy. how— wondered if it will extend at some point to energy. how long - wondered if it will extend at some point to energy. how long can - wondered if it will extend at some point to energy. how long can thej point to energy. how long can the german— point to energy. how long can the german economy— point to energy. how long can the german economy survive, - point to energy. how long can the german economy survive, even i point to energy. how long can the german economy survive, even in point to energy. how long can the - german economy survive, even in this current— german economy survive, even in this currentiunction— german economy survive, even in this current junction of— german economy survive, even in this current junction of not _ german economy survive, even in this current junction of not knowing - german economy survive, even in this current junction of not knowing when. current junction of not knowing when it's current junction of not knowing when its energy— current junction of not knowing when it's energy supply— current junction of not knowing when it's energy supply is _ current junction of not knowing when it's energy supply is going _ current junction of not knowing when it's energy supply is going to - current junction of not knowing when it's energy supply is going to come . it's energy supply is going to come from? _ it's energy supply is going to come from? and — it's energy supply is going to come from? and i— it's energy supply is going to come from? and i think— it's energy supply is going to come from? and i think that— it's energy supply is going to come from? and i think that is— from? and i think that is interesting. _ from? and i think that is interesting. that - from? and i think that is interesting. that from i from? and i think that is- interesting. that from those sort from? and i think that is— interesting. that from those sort of hard line. _

interesting. that from those sort of hard line, everyone _ interesting. that from those sort of hard line, everyone was _ interesting. that from those sort of hard line, everyone was taking - interesting. that from those sort of hard line, everyone was taking at l hard line, everyone was taking at the treginning. _ hard line, everyone was taking at the beginning, including - hard line, everyone was taking at the beginning, including turkey, i hard line, everyone was taking at. the beginning, including turkey, it does— the beginning, including turkey, it does now. — the beginning, including turkey, it does now. hold _ the beginning, including turkey, it does now, hold on, _ the beginning, including turkey, it does now, hold on, we _ the beginning, including turkey, it does now, hold on, we need - the beginning, including turkey, it does now, hold on, we need the l does now, hold on, we need the grain _ does now, hold on, we need the grain and — does now, hold on, we need the grain and i_ does now, hold on, we need the grain. and i think— does now, hold on, we need the grain. and i think that— does now, hold on, we need the grain. and i think that kind - does now, hold on, we need the grain. and i think that kind of. grain. and i think that kind of signals— grain. and i think that kind of signals a _ grain. and i think that kind of signals a shift, _ grain. and i think that kind of signals a shift, really. - grain. and i think that kind of signals a shift, really. i- grain. and i think that kind of signals a shift, really.- grain. and i think that kind of signals a shift, really. i see this as a very _ signals a shift, really. i see this as a very good _ signals a shift, really. i see this as a very good news _ signals a shift, really. i see this as a very good news on - signals a shift, really. i see this as a very good news on paper. | signals a shift, really. i see this| as a very good news on paper. it remains _ as a very good news on paper. it remains to— as a very good news on paper. it remains to be seen whether it is good _ remains to be seen whether it is good news — remains to be seen whether it is good news in practice. that said, i think— good news in practice. that said, i think the _ good news in practice. that said, i think the role of the united nations also should not be underestimated in brokering _ also should not be underestimated in brokering this deal. 0bviously, turkey. — brokering this deal. 0bviously, turkey, which has a sort of blow hot, _ turkey, which has a sort of blow hot. blow — turkey, which has a sort of blow hot, blow cold relationship with russia — hot, blow cold relationship with russia has played an active role. at the end _ russia has played an active role. at the end of— russia has played an active role. at the end of it, need two guarantors, if you _ the end of it, need two guarantors, if you like. — the end of it, need two guarantors, if you like, are the united nations and turkey — if you like, are the united nations and turkey. because there is no direct— and turkey. because there is no direct deal. _ and turkey. because there is no direct deal, no direct agreement between — direct deal, no direct agreement between russia and ukraine, so you have turkey — between russia and ukraine, so you have turkey and at the united nations— have turkey and at the united nations in... it have turkey and at the united nations in. . ._ have turkey and at the united nations in... it is not in anyway preparation _ nations in... it is not in anyway preparation for _ nations in... it is not in anyway preparation for a _ nations in... it is not in anyway preparation for a peace - nations in... it is not in anyway preparation for a peace deal, i nations in... it is not in anyway preparation for a peace deal, isj preparation for a peace deal, is itthis is only a small beginning and one has to go a long way before anything concrete can happen. but at the end of the _

anything concrete can happen. but at the end of the day, _ anything concrete can happen. but at the end of the day, it _ anything concrete can happen. but at the end of the day, it means - anything concrete can happen. but at the end of the day, it means that - the end of the day, it means that the end of the day, it means that the russian blockade of ukrainian ports— the russian blockade of ukrainian ports will— the russian blockade of ukrainian ports will be suspended. as far as grain— ports will be suspended. as far as grain exports are concerned. but then— grain exports are concerned. but then the — grain exports are concerned. but then the boats will be monitored by turkey— then the boats will be monitored by turkey to _ then the boats will be monitored by turkey to ensure that just food and nothing _ turkey to ensure that just food and nothing else is coming out and no weapons — nothing else is coming out and no weapons are going on. and that seems to be the _ weapons are going on. and that seems to be the deal for the moment. as i said. _ to be the deal for the moment. as i said. the _ to be the deal for the moment. as i said, the proof of the pudding will be in _ said, the proof of the pudding will be in the — said, the proof of the pudding will be in the actual practice of the deal — be in the actual practice of the deal l— be in the actual practice of the deal . be in the actual practice of the deal. ., ~' be in the actual practice of the deal . ,, , be in the actual practice of the deal. ., ,, , ._ be in the actual practice of the deal. ., ,, , . deal. i do think this may have come in art deal. i do think this may have come in part because _ deal. i do think this may have come in part because some _ deal. i do think this may have come in part because some those - deal. i do think this may have come i in part because some those countries had not objected to russia's actions in ukraine, had maintained friendly relations with russia were starting to be hurt by the grain shortage? think russia may have come under some pressure? you think russia may have come under some pressure?— think russia may have come under some pressure? you talk about places like e: -t some pressure? you talk about places like egypt where _ some pressure? you talk about places like egypt where the _ some pressure? you talk about places like egypt where the price _ some pressure? you talk about places like egypt where the price of- some pressure? you talk about places like egypt where the price of bread - like egypt where the price of bread is exponentially higher by the day. i don't know. i think this is an interesting question. i think that

there is a kind of return to playing both sides in the middle east and north africa and going down into sub—saharan africa. the kind of thing that we saw during the cold war alike... thing that we saw during the cold waralike... except there thing that we saw during the cold war alike... except there is no one who is one client to another. it is not quite as organised yet, so you cannot be on russia's team or on a medical�*s team. cannot be on russia's team or on a medical's team.— medical's team. and clearly the sawiest thing _ medical's team. and clearly the sawiest thing is _ medical's team. and clearly the sawiest thing is to _ medical's team. and clearly the sawiest thing is to play - medical's team. and clearly the sawiest thing is to play both i medical's team. and clearly the i sawiest thing is to play both sides savviest thing is to play both sides against each other. band sawiest thing is to play both sides against each other.— sawiest thing is to play both sides against each other. and clearly that is what people _ against each other. and clearly that is what people are _ against each other. and clearly that is what people are doing. _ against each other. and clearly that is what people are doing. and i against each other. and clearly thatj is what people are doing. and there is what people are doing. and there is a third player, china. —— america's team. china spending the last 20 years with its initiative influencing africa, providing infrastructure, loans, chinese companies going to build, and all of this fluidity is there. i think i am going to give mr guterres, the head of the un, some credit for being a

genuinely meditating and saying... because it is often quite a lousy job of being secretary—general. it job of being secretary—general. it is a thanklessjob, they job of being secretary—general. it is a thankless job, they have job of being secretary—general. it is a thanklessjob, they have been is a thankless job, they have been absent in terms of peacekeeping and crisis dealing in the war between russia and ukraine but this is a win because, if it holds, because it does allow all this good stuff, not just wheat, the soy, the sunflower oil. i mean, i have been in ukraine, it is sunflowers forever and at the sunflower oil, all of it is necessary for cooking in places the awkwardness of it having to be guided out past the mines that ukraine has laid to stop an invasion about southern ports and it has to be escorted every step of the way. there is the potential for flashpoints. fir there is the potential for flashpoints.— there is the potential for flashoints. , .~ , . flashpoints. or mistakes and accidents- — flashpoints. or mistakes and accidents. just _

flashpoints. or mistakes and accidents. just last _ flashpoints. or mistakes and accidents. just last point, i i flashpoints. or mistakes and i accidents. just last point, i should say. i asked the question, that we are in danger of not answering, why did he keep putin waiting for almost a minutelt quite humiliating in these choreographed events. i a minutelt quite humiliating in these choreographed events. i think it is a blow hot _ these choreographed events. i think it is a blow hot and _ these choreographed events. i think it is a blow hot and cold _ these choreographed events. i think it is a blow hot and cold event i these choreographed events. i think it is a blow hot and cold event and i it is a blow hot and cold event and ithink— it is a blow hot and cold event and i think he — it is a blow hot and cold event and i think he realised that putin needs this meeting, he needs to be seen in this meeting, he needs to be seen in this international arena with iranian— this international arena with iranian leader and so on. he has a very— iranian leader and so on. he has a very shrewd — iranian leader and so on. he has a very shrewd player, i'm not very sure _ very shrewd player, i'm not very sure whether he is great for the world. — sure whether he is great for the world. but— sure whether he is great for the world, but he is very much there. thank— world, but he is very much there. thank you — world, but he is very much there. thank you very much for your company, more from dateline next week, and a good weekend, goodbye.

hello there. well, we all know about those record—breaking temperatures that we recorded injuly, an unprecedented heatwave, but the other feature of the weather this month has been how dry it's been. across parts of southern and eastern wales, the midlands, east anglia, southern counties of england too, there've been places that have basically had no recordable rain at all. in nottingham, we had some showers on friday, 3.4 millimetres of rain, not much, but over the space of two hours, that delivered more rain than there had been in the previous three weeks. some of the heaviest showers around on friday formed along this convergence zone running across mid and east wales, down into parts of the gloucestershire area, somerset and dorset too. and there is the prospect for a bit more rain over the next couple of days. however, some of the very driest parts of southern and eastern england won't get much at all. now, taking a look at the weather picture overnight tonight,

many of the day's showers fading away pretty quickly, so there will be some dry weatherfor a time. however, towards the end of the night, a band of rain starts to move in from the west, bringing wet weather off the atlantic into northern ireland, so a wet end to the night here. temperatures about 11 to 15 degrees. now, this weekend, this area of low pressure will be bringing some rain with it, but the majority of the rain will be across north—western areas. we'll have some very warm south—westerly winds wafting in to parts of central and eastern england, boosting the temperatures through the weekend. saturday — well, we start off with that rain in northern ireland. the rain will eventually spread to western parts of england and wales and into western scotland, but the rule of thumb is the further east you are, the drier the weather gets, so east wales not seeing much rain, across the midlands, southern and eastern england, barely a drop at all. and, indeed, it will be quite warm across eastern areas, 25, 26 degrees with some hazy spells of sunshine. that same area of low pressure will continue to bring rain to scotland and northern ireland, where it will be heavy. this time, though, on sunday, we'll probably get some useful

rainfall across southern wales and that is one of the driest parts of the uk so far this month. of the uk so far this month, so that rain may well be welcomed. the temperatures coming up a little bit, feeling a bit more humid, low 20s, widely 20 to 23, but hot across parts of east anglia. temperatures could hit that 30—degree mark once again. and looking at the weather next week, high pressure keeps england and wales dry with sunshine. it becomes pretty hot, temperatures high 20s to low 30 by the end of the week. scotland and northern ireland will see rain at times.

this is bbc news, i'm shaun ley. the headlines at 8pm... ajury in washington, dc finds steve bannon — donald trump's former presidential adviser — guilty of contempt of congress. tailbacks stretching for miles outside the ferry terminal at dover mean a miserable start to the summer holidays for thousands of people. the calais mp blames brexit. this is an aftermath of brexit. we have to run more checks than before. and again, this is the first time we are experiencing trouble on holidays without any health conditions. ukraine and russia sign an agreement to allow the resumption of ukraine's grain exports from ports on the black sea. the united nations says it was vital to get a deal. gcse and a—level exam results could face delays because staff at the aqa exam board are striking for three days next week in a row over pay.