for a certain number of units per it for a certain number of units per household in a lower price bend that everybody gets access to, and then over and above that consumers will pay the full price. what that will mean is it would disproportionately benefit lower income households, but at the same time provide everybody with the incentive to find energy savings. it would cost less money to the taxpayer and it would give more benefit to lower income households. stephen fitzpatrick. former bbc breakfast host bill turnbull has died at the age of 66, according to his family. he presented breakfast for fifteen years between 2001 and 2016. he'd publicly revealed he'd been diagnosed with prostate cancer. his family said he died at home peacefully. and now the bbc news channel

is joining with radio 5 live to host a special edition of your questions answered, with the labour leader sir keir starmer. you're listening to and watching your questions answered: sir keir starmer, labour leader with nicky campbell on bbc 5 live and the news channel until 9:1i5 this morning. welcome. a word on the very sad news of bill turnbull, who has died. a great broadcaster, a great person as well. as well as a broadcaster he was effortlessly worn and he made it look so easy. it is was effortlessly worn and he made it look so easy-— look so easy. it is very sad news, i “ust saw look so easy. it is very sad news, i just saw it — look so easy. it is very sad news, i just saw it coming _ look so easy. it is very sad news, i just saw it coming through - look so easy. it is very sad news, i just saw it coming through now. i just saw it coming through now. that's a warm description you have just given is exactly what many people will be thinking. i think everybody listening or watching this will say our thoughts are with his family and friends. very sad news coming through. bill

family and friends. very sad news coming through.— coming through. bill turnbull will be hu:el coming through. bill turnbull will be hugely missed. _ coming through. bill turnbull will be hugely missed. sir— coming through. bill turnbull will be hugely missed. sir keir- coming through. bill turnbull will. be hugely missed. sir keir starmer, we have gotjames in huddersfield and ad in hove. we will go with you first. ., . , ., and ad in hove. we will go with you first. ., ., ., ., , first. how are you? i am really well. first. how are you? i am really well- thank— first. how are you? i am really well. thank you _ first. how are you? i am really well. thank you for _ first. how are you? i am really well. thank you for your - first. how are you? i am really well. thank you for your nice l first. how are you? i am really - well. thank you for your nice words about_ well. thank you for your nice words about bill— well. thank you for your nice words about bill turnbull. he was a nice broadcaster. what is up? i was wanting — broadcaster. what is up? i was wanting to _ broadcaster. what is up? i was wanting to ask you, i hope you are well, _ wanting to ask you, i hope you are well, what — wanting to ask you, i hope you are well, what is — wanting to ask you, i hope you are well, what is wrong with labour mps or shadow— well, what is wrong with labour mps or shadow cabinet ministers are showing — or shadow cabinet ministers are showing solidarity for workers on the picket— showing solidarity for workers on the picket line?— the picket line? look, let me be very clear _ the picket line? look, let me be very clear about _ the picket line? look, let me be very clear about this. _ the picket line? look, let me be very clear about this. when - the picket line? look, let me be very clear about this. when it i the picket line? look, let me be - very clear about this. when it comes to those disputes i completely understand why so many working people feel that they have got to have a wage increase. we have had ten years of very low wages, not very much increase in wages, and now we are in the middle of a cost of living crisis, so i completely understand what people are going through and i support the right to

strike. but i want to ensure that we get a labour government and i want to be labour prime minister, but i don't think the role of the prime minister to have a cabinet meeting and go on to the picket line. the role of the prime minister is to resolve these disputes because in the end with a strike everybody loses. but also people who are striking, for them it is a last resort and they would lose money. it is just a question of roles. the role of the labour party, of me as a leader of the labour party, is to get a labour government had to be prime minister. the role of the trade union has a different role. one quick thing and i will throw it over to you. but when you campaigned in 2020 you call yourself a pro—trade unionist. you are sounding now like a very timid trade unionist. l now like a very timid trade unionist-— now like a very timid trade unionist. . ., , ., ., unionist. i am a proud trade unionist- — unionist. i am a proud trade unionist- l— unionist. i am a proud trade unionist. ijoined _ unionist. i am a proud trade unionist. ijoined the - unionist. i am a proud trade unionist. ijoined the trade | unionist. i am a proud trade - unionist. ijoined the trade union when i started my working life, the gmb was the union ijoined when i was a lawyer. i have worked with the trade unions and what we want to see

is more secure rights at work. we spent most of last year around a table with trade unions and we have a draft piece of legislation that would give people a rise of work from day one, including things that matter during covid. during covid, many people learned to their horror that they did not have rights to sick pay. my sister, who is a care worker, had to use all of her holiday every time she had to isolate. we have been working with trade unions on that, but the role of the leader of the labour party is not tojump into... of the leader of the labour party is not to jump into. . ._ of the leader of the labour party is not to jump into. .. not to “ump into... what is the role ofthe not to jump into... what is the role of the leader _ not to jump into... what is the role of the leader of _ not to jump into... what is the role of the leader of the _ not to jump into... what is the role of the leader of the labour - not to jump into... what is the role of the leader of the labour party? | of the leader of the labour party? surely there are some things we cannot— surely there are some things we cannot be — surely there are some things we cannot be agnostic about, and supporting workers is one of them, especially— supporting workers is one of them, especially when they literally financially support us. i completely agree _ financially support us. i completely agree with that. thank you, i am glad _ agree with that. thank you, i am glad you — agree with that. thank you, i am glad you do. agree with that. thank you, i am glad you do— agree with that. thank you, i am glad you do. agree with that. thank you, i am lad ou do. , , ., ., , glad you do. the best thing to do is to have a labour— glad you do. the best thing to do is to have a labour government. - glad you do. the best thing to do is to have a labour government. i - to have a labour government. i completely support working people. then you would be on the picket line and your shadow ministers would be on the picket line. the

and your shadow ministers would be on the picket line.— on the picket line. the best thing i can do for working _ on the picket line. the best thing i can do for working people - on the picket line. the best thing i can do for working people is - on the picket line. the best thing i can do for working people is to - can do for working people is to ensure we have a labour government that has got answers to the pressing issues of the day, so when it comes to the cost of living, which is driving all of these disputes, i have said a labour government would freeze the energy price increases that are due this year, which are going to be colossal. people are worried sick about it. we would pay for that by a windfall tax on all the oil and gas companies in the north sea who made excess profits. we need a labour government, that is the single most effective thing i can do for working people and one i am utterly focused on.— am utterly focused on. thank you very much _ am utterly focused on. thank you very much indeed. _ am utterly focused on. thank you very much indeed. if— am utterly focused on. thank you very much indeed. if i _ am utterly focused on. thank you very much indeed. if i was - am utterly focused on. thank you very much indeed. if i was in - am utterly focused on. thank you | very much indeed. if i was in your shadow cabinet and i was the shadow secretary of state for paperclips and i went and stood on a picket line, as we saw anas sarwar, the head of the scottish labour party doing, and also andy burnham, if i went and stood on a picket line, would you fire me. nobody has been fired. if i did that, would you fire me? ., ,

fired. if i did that, would you fire me? , , fired. if i did that, would you fire me? y , fired. if i did that, would you fire me? y |f fired. if i did that, would you fire me? ifi fired. if i did that, would you fire me? y , ifidid me? nobody has been fired. if i did it, would me? nobody has been fired. if i did it. would you _ me? nobody has been fired. if i did it, would you sack— me? nobody has been fired. if i did it, would you sack me? _ me? nobody has been fired. if i did it, would you sack me? sam - me? nobody has been fired. if i did it, would you sack me? sam tarry l me? nobody has been fired. if i did i it, would you sack me? sam tarry was fired because — it, would you sack me? sam tarry was fired because he _ it, would you sack me? sam tarry was fired because he did _ it, would you sack me? sam tarry was fired because he did media _ fired because he did media interviews which he was not authorised to do and he made a policy on the hoof. so authorised to do and he made a policy on the hoof.— authorised to do and he made a policy on the hoof. so it is ok to no and policy on the hoof. so it is ok to go and stand _ policy on the hoof. so it is ok to go and stand on _ policy on the hoof. so it is ok to go and stand on a _ policy on the hoof. so it is ok to go and stand on a picket - policy on the hoof. so it is ok to go and stand on a picket line - policy on the hoof. so it is ok to | go and stand on a picket line and support the workers, you would not fire me. ,, support the workers, you would not fire me. , ., , fire me. each case would be looked at as it came _ fire me. each case would be looked at as it came in. _ fire me. each case would be looked at as it came in. i _ fire me. each case would be looked at as it came in. i have _ fire me. each case would be looked at as it came in. i have given - fire me. each case would be looked at as it came in. i have given you i fire me. each case would be looked at as it came in. i have given you a| at as it came in. i have given you a very clear — at as it came in. i have given you a very clear scenario. _ at as it came in. i have given you a very clear scenario. my _ at as it came in. i have given you a very clear scenario. my point - at as it came in. i have given you a very clear scenario. my point is - very clear scenario. my point is very clear scenario. my point is very clear _ very clear scenario. my point is very clear is — very clear scenario. my point is very clear is that _ very clear scenario. my point is very clear is that what - very clear scenario. my point is very clear is that what i - very clear scenario. my point is very clear is that what i want i very clear scenario. my point is| very clear is that what i want to see is a labour government. can you imagine a situation where a prime minister who has thejob imagine a situation where a prime minister who has the job of resolving disputes around the cabinet table and then goes on to a picket line. it is different roles. trade unions represent their members and they are involved in the dispute going on to get the best deal. i completely support them, and the labour party and the trade union have a long history and have a long

history in the future, but the role of the leader of the opposition is to ensure we get a labour government.— to ensure we get a labour covernment. ., , ., ., government. people will wonder what our government. people will wonder what your namesake _ government. people will wonder what your namesake keir— government. people will wonder what your namesake keir hardie _ government. people will wonder what your namesake keir hardie would - your namesake keir hardie would think of that answer. many interpretations. james in huddersfield. hello. you are through, what would you like to ask a man who wants to be the prime minister in these troubled times? very quickly on bill turnbull. i hope — very quickly on bill turnbull. i hope his— very quickly on bill turnbull. i hope his family knows that in very troubled _ hope his family knows that in very troubled times people want clarity and comfort for many people. well said, and comfort for many people. well said. james- _ and comfort for many people. well said, james. so, _ and comfort for many people. well said, james. so, you _ and comfort for many people. well said, james. so, you have - and comfort for many people. well said, james. so, you have workedl said, james. so, you have worked hard to show _ said, james. so, you have worked hard to show and _ said, james. so, you have worked hard to show and been _ said, james. so, you have worked hard to show and been very - said, james. so, you have worked hard to show and been very clearl hard to show and been very clear that the — hard to show and been very clear that the labour party has moved on from _ that the labour party has moved on from the _ that the labour party has moved on from the leadership ofjeremy corbyn will stop— from the leadership ofjeremy corbyn will stop i_ from the leadership ofjeremy corbyn will stop i understand your reasons for doing _ will stop i understand your reasons for doing so, however regardless of how unpopular the party leader was, on the _ how unpopular the party leader was, on the 2017 — how unpopular the party leader was, on the 2017 labour manifesto, which you stood _ on the 2017 labour manifesto, which you stood on, had strong, aggressive and fulty— you stood on, had strong, aggressive and fully costed policies which were very popular with the public, even among _ very popular with the public, even

among traditional conservative voters — among traditional conservative voters. considering the strength of public— voters. considering the strength of public opinion at the moment and in a time _ public opinion at the moment and in a time of— public opinion at the moment and in a time of incredible turbulence to the country with the extreme pressure _ the country with the extreme pressure facing working families, why is— pressure facing working families, why is the — pressure facing working families, why is the labour party so timid with its— why is the labour party so timid with its policy offers four which is the particularly timid bit as far as you are _ the particularly timid bit as far as you are concerned, james? where would ou you are concerned, james? where would you like _ you are concerned, james? where would you like them _ you are concerned, james? where would you like them to _ you are concerned, james? where would you like them to go - you are concerned, james? where | would you like them to go further? while in terms of what i call timid, our current— while in terms of what i call timid, our current offering, i say hour, i am a— our current offering, i say hour, i am a labour— our current offering, i say hour, i am a labour member, our current offer— am a labour member, our current offeron— am a labour member, our current offer on the — am a labour member, our current offer on the crisis to freeze things for the _ offer on the crisis to freeze things for the winter, it is kicking the can down— for the winter, it is kicking the can down the road. it is not solving the problem, it is delaying it. among — the problem, it is delaying it. among conservative voters over 60% are in _ among conservative voters over 60% are in favour— among conservative voters over 60% are in favour of nationalising the energy— are in favour of nationalising the energy industry. it is a conversation that is happening broadly— conversation that is happening broadly across the media and i am not necessarily talking all the

assets — not necessarily talking all the assets and so on. nationalisation can be _ assets and so on. nationalisation can be a — assets and so on. nationalisation can be a nuanced thing. there is no reason _ can be a nuanced thing. there is no reason the — can be a nuanced thing. there is no reason the energy companies cannot make _ reason the energy companies cannot make a _ reason the energy companies cannot make a profit within public hands, but being — make a profit within public hands, but being in public hands would give them _ but being in public hands would give them the _ but being in public hands would give them the autonomy and extreme times such as _ them the autonomy and extreme times such as this— them the autonomy and extreme times such as this to say we will forego our profits — such as this to say we will forego our profits. we will forego paying a dividend _ our profits. we will forego paying a dividend to— our profits. we will forego paying a dividend to the government because our sole _ dividend to the government because our sole owner is the government. what _ our sole owner is the government. what is _ our sole owner is the government. what is your— our sole owner is the government. what is your straight question? my straight question is why are we being _ straight question is why are we being so— straight question is why are we being so timid? why aren't we talking — being so timid? why aren't we talking about the things that matter to people? talking about the things that matter to --eole? ., , talking about the things that matter to -eole-?y. , , to people? james, the first thing i would say is _ to people? james, the first thing i would say is you — to people? james, the first thing i would say is you said _ to people? james, the first thing i would say is you said a _ to people? james, the first thing i would say is you said a moment i to people? james, the first thing i i would say is you said a moment ago that our policy on energy is kicking the can down the road. we are saying that in the face of eye watering increases, because the average energy bill for a household will go up energy bill for a household will go up from about £1900 to £3500 in october and up again to about £4200

injanuary. that is huge. we are not talking about little increases now. i think for the millions of people who will not be able to pay those bills, hearing the labour party say we would freeze those bills, we will not let that happen, and we will use money from a windfall tax on oil and gas companies who have made much more profit than they were expecting, to pay for that, that is a huge relief. i don't accept that is kicking the can down the road. last year, just let me answer, last yeari last year, just let me answer, last year i was across the country and i remember acutely i was in dewsbury talking to pensioners. this was last yearin talking to pensioners. this was last year in the freezing winter and they said to me, many said, we don't get up said to me, many said, we don't get up until lunch time because we cannot afford to put the heating on. one said i am in a thermal dressing and all day long because i am scared of putting the heater on. james, i am sorry, for the labour party to have a big, bold, strong, fully costed plan which will not put them

through that misery this winter is not kicking the can down the road, it is meeting concerns of millions of people. even when they hear those sums of £3500 on energy bills, up to £4000, many people listening and watching will be saying, i can't afford that. when does it end? it takes us through to april. iitalith takes us through to april. with resect, takes us through to april. with respect. i _ takes us through to april. with respect, i find _ takes us through to april. with respect, i find it _ takes us through to april. with respect, i find it astonishing that you have — respect, i find it astonishing that you have just outlined a conversation you had last year and then you _ conversation you had last year and then you are telling me what you are doing _ then you are telling me what you are doing this _ then you are telling me what you are doing this year, but as far as i am aware _ doing this year, but as far as i am aware we — doing this year, but as far as i am aware we have got no plans for the future _ aware we have got no plans for the future what — aware we have got no plans for the future what will we do in 2024 and 2025? _ future what will we do in 2024 and 2025? even if we try to go back to what _ 2025? even if we try to go back to what they— 2025? even if we try to go back to what they were last year, old people will still _ what they were last year, old people will still not be getting up before lunch _ will still not be getting up before lunch. why i will not change in the country— lunch. why i will not change in the country when the public is behind us? it _ country when the public is behind us? it is — country when the public is behind us? it is more left—wing than the labour— us? it is more left—wing than the labour party at the moment. gn

us? it is more left-wing than the labour party at the moment. on the cuestion labour party at the moment. on the question of— labour party at the moment. on the question of what _ labour party at the moment. on the question of what we _ labour party at the moment. on the question of what we do _ labour party at the moment. on the question of what we do long - labour party at the moment. on the question of what we do long term, l labour party at the moment. on the question of what we do long term, i | question of what we do long term, i am completely up for that challenge, which is why i have been arguing for a year now that we need a very fast, progressive insulation policy for our houses. we have got about 19 households where they are paying a fortune on energy bills and losing a lot of that because the houses are not insulated.— lot of that because the houses are not insulated. that was in the 2017 manifesto- — not insulated. that was in the 2017 manifesto- it _ not insulated. that was in the 2017 manifesto. it should _ not insulated. that was in the 2017 manifesto. it should have - not insulated. that was in the 2017 manifesto. it should have been - not insulated. that was in the 2017 i manifesto. it should have been done manifesto. it should have been done many years — manifesto. it should have been done many years ago _ manifesto. it should have been done many years ago and _ manifesto. it should have been done many years ago and i _ manifesto. it should have been done many years ago and i go _ manifesto. it should have been done many years ago and i go for- manifesto. it should have been done many years ago and i go for it - manifesto. it should have been done many years ago and i go for it last i many years ago and i go for it last year. if they had done that we would now have 2 million houses that were well insulated. i have been to some houses that are well insulated. kirklees council have done some of them. they did it in the mid—winter, it was freezing cold, it was warm in the houses, the bills were next to nothing and the people in the houses were grinning from ear to ear. that is the sort of thing we need to be doing. it is big,, bowl, it should have been done many years ago. because they have got one houses and next to nothing on their energy

bills, it means they are not losing their energy. ma; bills, it means they are not losing their energy-— bills, it means they are not losing theirener. . ~y , ., , ., , their energy. my previous house was insulated under _ their energy. my previous house was insulated under that _ their energy. my previous house was insulated under that scheme. - their energy. my previous house was insulated under that scheme. the i insulated under that scheme. the fact you _ insulated under that scheme. the fact you are so enthusiastic about it hrings — fact you are so enthusiastic about it brings me great comfort because it brings me great comfort because it was— it brings me great comfort because it was in— it brings me great comfort because it was in the 2017 manifesto. i do not understand why you are so timid about— not understand why you are so timid about talking about a popular policy — about talking about a popular policy. change the colours, change the typeface and the font, fine. james. — the typeface and the font, fine. james, hang on. something we need to clarify. some excellent points, james, really good hearing that point from a labour supporter. we will come to sue in a second. but your plan ends in april 2023 and what happens then exactly? are you prepared to double the size of the package as it goes on exponentially as things get worse? then we are talking about something bigger than fellow. maybe that is what we need.

these are desperate times. i listen to people on a daily basis and people are terrified.— to people on a daily basis and people are terrified. look, our plan takes us through _ people are terrified. look, our plan takes us through to _ people are terrified. look, our plan takes us through to april— people are terrified. look, our plan takes us through to april and - takes us through to april and something has to happen in april, i accept that challenge. you something has to happen in april, i accept that challenge.— something has to happen in april, i accept that challenge. you will have to do it again. _ accept that challenge. you will have to do it again, cut _ accept that challenge. you will have to do it again, cut and _ accept that challenge. you will have to do it again, cut and paste - accept that challenge. you will have to do it again, cut and paste it. - accept that challenge. you will have to do it again, cut and paste it. wel to do it again, cut and paste it. we have to to do it again, cut and paste it. - have to wait and see what the forecasts are in april. we waited until mid august to see what the forecast was for autumn. {line forecast was for autumn. one prediction _ forecast was for autumn. one prediction is _ forecast was for autumn. one prediction is energy _ forecast was for autumn. one prediction is energy bills could double to £6,000 by spring 2023. there is a thought. {0m double to £6,000 by spring 2023. there is a thought.— there is a thought. corn will put out their forecast _ there is a thought. corn will put out their forecast two _ there is a thought. corn will put out their forecast two weeks - there is a thought. corn will put| out their forecast two weeks ago there is a thought. corn will put - out their forecast two weeks ago for this autumn and their precise forecast was only given days before our announcement was made because i wanted to see what the forecast was. i accept the challenge something has to be done. this i accept the challenge something has to be done. , , , ., to be done. this is bigger than furlough. _ to be done. this is bigger than furlough, isn't _ to be done. this is bigger than furlough, isn't it? _ to be done. this is bigger than furlough, isn't it? i— to be done. this is bigger than furlough, isn't it? i do- to be done. this is bigger than furlough, isn't it? i do not- to be done. this is bigger than l furlough, isn't it? i do not think we are approaching _ furlough, isn't it? i do not think we are approaching this - furlough, isn't it? i do not think we are approaching this in - furlough, isn't it? i do not think we are approaching this in the l furlough, isn't it? i do not think- we are approaching this in the right way because we are coming out with short—term answers and that is the problem with the government. we have

been so behind on solar energy, tidal energy, wind and nuclear energy and we need to fast forward on all those fronts and we need insulation. but you cannot escape the massive question, which is what are you going to do this winter to help people with bills that they can't afford? we have put a fully costed plan on the table. and the winter after? costed plan on the table. and the winterafter? i costed plan on the table. and the winter after? i accept that challenge, but what are you putting to me? that we don't do anything this winter? l to me? that we don't do anything this winter?— this winter? i put it to you that ou will this winter? i put it to you that you will have _ this winter? i put it to you that you will have to _ this winter? i put it to you that you will have to do _ this winter? i put it to you that you will have to do it _ this winter? i put it to you that you will have to do it again - this winter? i put it to you thatj you will have to do it again and even more and how much will that cost? it will cost whatever it takes. but where's the money going come from? late takes. but where's the money going come from?— takes. but where's the money going come from? we need a medium and lonu-term come from? we need a medium and long-term plan _ come from? we need a medium and long-term plan and _ come from? we need a medium and long-term plan and that _ come from? we need a medium and long-term plan and that is _ long—term plan and that is insulating. we could have done 2 million houses between the challenge i put down to government a year ago and now. get on with it because if thatis and now. get on with it because if that is done by the time we get to april that will be another 1 that is done by the time we get to april that will be anotheri million homes insulated. we need to fast

forward on wind power, solar power, tidal power and nuclear power, so get on with it, government. but also, stepping back from the challenge, if the challenge is this is a plan that takes us through until april, therefore what? you would not _ until april, therefore what? you would not do — until april, therefore what? you would not do it? _ until april, therefore what? you would not do it? no, you would do it and then you would have to do even more of it and then you would have to explain where the money comes from stop we have been very clear where the money comes from, it is the excess profits of the oil and gas companies. allow me. let's get another caller and another question. sue in hove. hello. i take your point, it is an ongoing debate. goad point, it is an ongoing debate. good mornin: to point, it is an ongoing debate. good morning to you- _ point, it is an ongoing debate. good morning to you. hello, _ point, it is an ongoing debate. good morning to you. hello, good morning to you _ morning to you. hello, good morning to you the _ morning to you. hello, good morning to you. the question i would like to put is, _ to you. the question i would like to put is, is _ to you. the question i would like to put is, is keir— to you. the question i would like to put is, is keir starmer concerned about— put is, is keir starmer concerned about the — put is, is keir starmer concerned about the number of people who seem to be leaving the labour party at the moment? there are quite a few people _ the moment? there are quite a few people who — the moment? there are quite a few

people who currently feel politically homeless and with the general— politically homeless and with the general election coming up next year what does _ general election coming up next year what does he intend to do to encourage those people to vote labour? — encourage those people to vote labour? i— encourage those people to vote labour? i can think of something to do with— labour? i can think of something to do with housing, perhaps tackle the ever spiralling cost of renting and 'ust ever spiralling cost of renting and just living — ever spiralling cost of renting and just living anywhere. fire ever spiralling cost of renting and just living anywhere.— just living anywhere. are you politically — just living anywhere. are you politically homeless? - just living anywhere. are you politically homeless? i- just living anywhere. are you politically homeless? i do i just living anywhere. are you | politically homeless? i do feel somewhat _ politically homeless? i do feel somewhat politically - politically homeless? i do feel| somewhat politically homeless politically homeless? i do feel i somewhat politically homeless at politically homeless? i do feel - somewhat politically homeless at the moment, _ somewhat politically homeless at the moment, yes. i need to be persuaded to vote _ moment, yes. i need to be persuaded to vote labour again next year. he is to vote labour again next year. is ready to do to vote labour again next year. he: is ready to do that. to vote labour again next year. he is ready to do that. i _ to vote labour again next year. he is ready to do that. i am _ to vote labour again next year. he is ready to do that. i am glad - to vote labour again next year. he is ready to do that. i am glad you. is ready to do that. i am glad you raised housing _ is ready to do that. i am glad you raised housing because _ is ready to do that. i am glad you raised housing because that - is ready to do that. i am glad you raised housing because that is i is ready to do that. i am glad you raised housing because that is a l raised housing because that is a hugely important issue and many people have not got secure accommodation or accommodation they can afford. we have to help first—time buyers and we have to do something about rent. we said quite a lot about that last year. but on

the central mission that i have got, it is to have a labour government. we had james on earlier talking about previous manifestos. we have lost four elections in a row and that means we have let working people down. i will not let that happen again. we have to win the next election. you happen again. we have to win the next election.— happen again. we have to win the next election. you could have won the last election. _ next election. you could have won the last election. a _ next election. you could have won the last election. a lot _ next election. you could have won the last election. a lot of- next election. you could have won the last election. a lot of us - next election. you could have won the last election. a lot of us feel l the last election. a lot of us feel let down— the last election. a lot of us feel let down about the last election. this is— let down about the last election. this is four— let down about the last election. this is four elections we have lost. we have to change that. for me that means saying the labour party has to change, which we have done. we need to absolutely take on the tories who are an absolute shambles at the moment. , ., are an absolute shambles at the moment-_ we - are an absolute shambles at the moment._ we have - are an absolute shambles at the moment._ we have to l are an absolute shambles at the - moment._ we have to show we moment. they are. we have to show we are fit for a government. _ moment. they are. we have to show we are fit for a government. when - moment. they are. we have to show we are fit for a government. when i - are fit for a government. when i took over as labour leader, we had just lost the 2019 election, the worst loss since 1935. probably unnecessarily _ worst loss since 1935. probably unnecessarily so. _ worst loss since 1935. probably unnecessarily so. what - worst loss since 1935. probably unnecessarily so. what you - worst loss since 1935. probably unnecessarily so. what you by| worst loss since 1935. probably - unnecessarily so. what you by that?

well, from what _ unnecessarily so. what you by that? well, from what i _ unnecessarily so. what you by that? well, from what i hear _ unnecessarily so. what you by that? well, from what i hear of _ unnecessarily so. what you by that? well, from what i hear of the - unnecessarily so. what you by that? well, from what i hear of the ford i well, from what i hear of the ford report, _ well, from what i hear of the ford report, there was probably a chance of winning _ report, there was probably a chance of winning the election. an report, there was probably a chance of winning the election.— of winning the election. an internal labour of winning the election. an internal labour report- _ of winning the election. an internal labour report- i— of winning the election. an internal labour report. i don't _ of winning the election. an internal labour report. i don't agree - of winning the election. an internal labour report. i don't agree with i labour report. i don't agree with that. millions _ labour report. i don't agree with that. millions of _ labour report. i don't agree with that. millions of people - labour report. i don't agree with that. millions of people did - labour report. i don't agree with that. millions of people did not i that. millions of people did not vote for us. we can respond to that by saying to those people who did not vote for us, some voted tory the first time, we can either say you are wrong, you did not listen to what we were saying, or we can be more reflective. if you lose that badly, you put a mirror up and look at the labour party and say it is not the electorate that has to change, it is the labour party that needs to change. when i took over we were coming off the back of the worst defeat since 1935, the fourth consecutive defeat for the labour party and most people said to me, good luck, when i became the leader of the labour party. then they said, you will never do it in a parliamentary term in five years, it is too difficult to get the labour party off its knees or even face down into a position where it can

form a government. we have transformed that. two and a half years later the challenge i am now getting is why are you not further ahead in the polls? and getting is why are you not further ahead in the polls?— getting is why are you not further ahead in the polls? and why are you not further ahead _ ahead in the polls? and why are you not further ahead when _ ahead in the polls? and why are you not further ahead when it _ ahead in the polls? and why are you not further ahead when it comes - ahead in the polls? and why are you not further ahead when it comes to l not further ahead when it comes to radical policies? so, do you think the manifesto from the last election, when sir keir starmer was a part ofjeremy corbyn's team, do you think it was the right manifesto at the wrong time and that manifesto was for the time in which we are living now? it is so tailored to the needs of people now. do you think there is something in that? fries. there is something in that? yes, exactl . i there is something in that? yes, exactly. i think _ there is something in that? yes, exactly. i think the _ there is something in that? yes, exactly. i think the previous - exactly. i think the previous manifesto, we would not be in this mess— manifesto, we would not be in this mess for— manifesto, we would not be in this mess for now for sure. if there is one thing — mess for now for sure. if there is one thing they could tackle, it would — one thing they could tackle, it would be _ one thing they could tackle, it would be the housing situation for me. would be the housing situation for me i_ would be the housing situation for me i can— would be the housing situation for me. i canjust see it getting worse and worse — me. i canjust see it getting worse and worse and now we are seeing people _ and worse and now we are seeing people getting into dire situations and it—

people getting into dire situations and it has— people getting into dire situations and it has a knock—on effect. i and it has a knock—on effect. agree with and it has a knock—on effect. i agree with you on that and we need radical things in the next labour manifesto on that and we will have on housing. ifeel manifesto on that and we will have on housing. i feel strongly manifesto on that and we will have on housing. ifeel strongly about that. on housing. i feel strongly about that. ., ., on housing. i feel strongly about that. . ,, y ., on housing. i feel strongly about that. ., ~' y ., y on housing. i feel strongly about that. . ,, y . that. thank you very much indeed. for all the — that. thank you very much indeed. for all the criticisms _ that. thank you very much indeed. for all the criticisms of _ that. thank you very much indeed. for all the criticisms of labour - that. thank you very much indeed. for all the criticisms of labour at l for all the criticisms of labour at the moment these are politically volatile times. yougov this month found labour were 15 points ahead of the tories. things bob about, don't they? this is veronica in portsmouth.— they? this is veronica in portsmouth. ., ., ., portsmouth. how are you doing? hello. so portsmouth. how are you doing? hello- so i— portsmouth. how are you doing? hello. so i think, _ portsmouth. how are you doing? hello. so i think, we _ portsmouth. how are you doing? hello. so i think, we have - portsmouth. how are you doing? hello. so i think, we have seen l portsmouth. how are you doing? - hello. so i think, we have seen from the never—ending tory leadership that there — the never—ending tory leadership that there is significant division in the _ that there is significant division in the conservative party. however, i in the conservative party. however, i also _ in the conservative party. however, i also see _ in the conservative party. however, i also see division with your party with the — i also see division with your party with the criticism that you are having — with the criticism that you are having to _ with the criticism that you are having to move away from labour values _ having to move away from labour values in — having to move away from labour values in order to make yourself and the party— values in order to make yourself and the party more electable. i get that

we need _ the party more electable. i get that we need a — the party more electable. i get that we need a healthy difference and that is— we need a healthy difference and that is a — we need a healthy difference and that is a good thing, but how will you square — that is a good thing, but how will you square that circle? just explain that a little bit — you square that circle? just explain that a little bit more, _ you square that circle? just explain that a little bit more, veronica. - that a little bit more, veronica. squaring the circle in what way? hagar squaring the circle in what way? how will ou squaring the circle in what way? how will you bring — squaring the circle in what way? how will you bring your party together and, _ will you bring your party together and. more — will you bring your party together and, more importantlyl will you bring your party together and, more importantly i suspect, the voters _ and, more importantly i suspect, the voters who— and, more importantly i suspect, the voters who feel potentially alienated from the values you are currently— alienated from the values you are currently presenting. can alienated from the values you are currently presenting.— alienated from the values you are currently presenting. can i ask you a cuestion currently presenting. can i ask you a question before _ currently presenting. can i ask you a question before he _ currently presenting. can i ask you a question before he answers? - currently presenting. can i ask you a question before he answers? of| currently presenting. can i ask you i a question before he answers? of the possible, the probable prime minister will be liz truss if all the polls and if all the fingers in the polls and if all the fingers in the wind are correct on that one. what do you think about that prospect when it comes to a new dynamic for sir keir starmer in the house of commons? keir starmer and borisjohnson were very different and possibly liz truss is a different picture altogether. what do you think of that? i different picture altogether. what do you think of that?— do you think of that? i think keir starmer is _ do you think of that? i think keir starmer is more _ do you think of that? i think keir starmer is more than _ do you think of that? i think keir starmer is more than capable i do you think of that? i think keir starmer is more than capable of| starmer is more than capable of managing — starmer is more than capable of managing liz truss and i think she isiust_ managing liz truss and i think she isiust as _

managing liz truss and i think she isiust as far— managing liz truss and i think she is just as far right as mrjohnson is just as far right as mrjohnson is and _ is just as far right as mrjohnson is and was _ is just as far right as mrjohnson is and was i_ is just as far right as mrjohnson is and was. i don't see a problem there. _ is and was. i don't see a problem there. there _ is and was. i don't see a problem there, there will still be a significant difference between the labour— significant difference between the labour party's values that i see and the current— labour party's values that i see and the current government. i think it is more _ the current government. i think it is more than capable to manage that. we hear— is more than capable to manage that. we hear a _ is more than capable to manage that. we hear a lot of disparaging things about liz truss from people on the left. do you go along with that? do you disparage her in that way? ihla left. do you go along with that? do you disparage her in that way? ihlo i you disparage her in that way? no i don't disparage _ you disparage her in that way? in; i don't disparage her or rishi sunak. are they majorfigures? don't disparage her or rishi sunak. are they major figures? they are final two and one of them will become prime minister and that is a considerable achievement for both of them to have got that far and for one of them to go on to the highest office in the country and i would, office in the country and i would, of course, respect that. what veronica says about the tory party being divided is absolutely right. they are fighting like cats in a sack at the moment and their main argument seems to be that the state of the country is so awful after 12

years of a conservative government that only they should be prime minister. it is astonishing to see that that is their main argument. veronica, on your challenge to me, because i don't want to avoid that, on values, the arguments we are putting forward and the policies we are putting forward our absolutely fundamental label values. if you take the energy policy, freeze the price increases across the board for struggling millions of people, freeze it, do not do anything less radical than that, and ease the excess profits from oil and gas companies as a windfall tax to pay for that. that answers the question do you get it for how hard it is for so many people across the country? i completely get it. my dad worked in a factory and my mum was a nurse and i know what it is like to sit around the kitchen table are not able to pay the bills, because our phone was cut off, so i know what it is like.

how long was the phone cut off for? for months at a time, we could not pay the bill. it for months at a time, we could not pay the bill-— pay the bill. it is interesting to note that you _ pay the bill. it is interesting to note that you did _ pay the bill. it is interesting to note that you did that. - pay the bill. it is interesting to | note that you did that. millions pay the bill. it is interesting to i note that you did that. millions of eo - le will note that you did that. millions of people will be _ note that you did that. millions of people will be having _ note that you did that. millions of people will be having an - note that you did that. millions of people will be having an anxious. people will be having an anxious conversation as we speak now. do i get that? yes, absolutely. will the labour party walked past that? absolutely not. are we prepared to say which side we are on? do we allow oil and gas companies continue to make billions of pounds was people suffer, or are we going to do something like it? i say we do something like it? i say we do something about it. like rishi sunak. that is labour values and basic values and it is part of me, i know what that feels like and i will not walk past that. we have got paul in cirencester. are you there, paul? i

we have got paul in cirencester. are you there. paul?— we have got paul in cirencester. are you there, paul?- just - we have got paul in cirencester. are you there, paul? i am. just let me tive a you there, paul? i am. just let me give a couple _ you there, paul? i am. just let me give a couple of — you there, paul? i am. just let me give a couple of text _ you there, paul? i am. just let me give a couple of text messages. i you there, paul? i am. just let me give a couple of text messages. when are you going to bring forward proper proposals to address social care, you have been avoiding it for ever. a nurse from oxford, what is your plan for pay for public sector workers? and more it wants to know how he will help small businesses that the cost of living crisis. moira, i think you will be on that one as well, paul. i had an e—mail this morning, you have got keir starmer coming on, ask him if you can what he would do, does he acknowledge that without government help or a cap on commercialfuel bills, many businesses such as mine, a pub, face financial ruin this winter. we discuss this, people in care homes, schools, small businesses thinking, what the hell are we going to do? simon, thank you

for that he runs the plough in great justified. there is a plug. let's get paul to add to that particular point. i think it is a question about small business?- point. i think it is a question about small business? yes, i am in the food and _ about small business? yes, i am in the food and drink— about small business? yes, i am in the food and drink sector _ about small business? yes, i am in the food and drink sector and - about small business? yes, i am in the food and drink sector and it - about small business? yes, i am in the food and drink sector and it has been _ the food and drink sector and it has been a _ the food and drink sector and it has been a tough few years the business, covid, _ been a tough few years the business, covid, supply chain crisis, high inflation — covid, supply chain crisis, high inflation and now the energy problem. the biggest in terms of me talking _ problem. the biggest in terms of me talking to _ problem. the biggest in terms of me talking to my fellow business leaders. _ talking to my fellow business leaders, the biggest hindrance to business — leaders, the biggest hindrance to business over the last couple of years _ business over the last couple of years has— business over the last couple of years has been brexit. but neither you. _ years has been brexit. but neither you. nor— years has been brexit. but neither you. nor any— years has been brexit. but neither you, nor any labour years has been brexit. but neither you, norany labour mps years has been brexit. but neither you, nor any labour mps ever talk about— you, nor any labour mps ever talk about the — you, nor any labour mps ever talk about the damage that has been done to the _ about the damage that has been done to the british economy through brexit. — to the british economy through brexit, why?— brexit, why? paul, firstly, i do know how _ brexit, why? paul, firstly, i do know how tough _ brexit, why? paul, firstly, i do know how tough it _ brexit, why? paul, firstly, i do know how tough it must - brexit, why? paul, firstly, i do know how tough it must have l brexit, why? paul, firstly, i do - know how tough it must have been with covid, and we do need to help small businesses as we go into this winter. what we have suggested, what

our proposal is that we alter the threshold for business rates, up from 15,000 to 25,000, so a small businesses don't have to pay so much out on business rates. we also, in the long run, get rid of business rates altogether, something small businesses have been asking for for a long time. i businesses have been asking for for a long time-— a long time. i am talking about exort a long time. i am talking about exoort and _ a long time. i am talking about export and import, _ a long time. i am talking about export and import, we - a long time. i am talking about export and import, we lost - a long time. i am talking about export and import, we lost £1. export and import, we lost £1 million — export and import, we lost £1 million revenue in ireland, after brexit — million revenue in ireland, after brexit. another company we work closely _ brexit. another company we work closely with lost £20 million revenue _ closely with lost £20 million revenue and i don't think those measures— revenue and i don't think those measures will help with getting exports — measures will help with getting exports and imports flowing again in europe _ exports and imports flowing again in europe let— exports and imports flowing again in euro e. ., ., ., europe. let me go to that, we need to make exit _ europe. let me go to that, we need to make exit work, _ europe. let me go to that, we need to make exit work, we _ europe. let me go to that, we need to make exit work, we need - europe. let me go to that, we need to make exit work, we need to - to make exit work, we need to improve the deal we have got, because it isn't working for many businesses, as it sounds it isn't for yours, businesses, as it sounds it isn't foryours, particularly businesses, as it sounds it isn't for yours, particularly with goods

in and out of ireland. we have to make brexit work, there are too many burdens and barriers to doing business and we would absolutely... my business and we would absolutely... my criticism of the government is, the slogan, get brexit done and it isn't done. ., , ., ., ., , the slogan, get brexit done and it isn't done-— isn't done. your slogan was get brexit stop _ isn't done. your slogan was get brexit stop and _ isn't done. your slogan was get brexit stop and you _ isn't done. your slogan was get brexit stop and you wanted - isn't done. your slogan was get - brexit stop and you wanted another referendum? paul, you would be interested to hear this, like liz truss you have converted from remainer to lever, but whether people think you believe in it is another question altogether, but what of the potential advantages of brexit for this country, give us the sunlit uplands of brexit? 2&th brexit for this country, give us the sunlit uplands of brexit?— sunlit uplands of brexit? vat of ener: sunlit uplands of brexit? vat of energy bills _ sunlit uplands of brexit? vat of energy bills is — sunlit uplands of brexit? vat of energy bills is something - sunlit uplands of brexit? vat of energy bills is something we i energy bills is something we proposed injanuary, which is something we can now do, which we couldn't do before. it is astonishing the government hasn't

gone down that route. there is support we can put in for businesses in a way we couldn't do before, and we should do that. everybody knows my position, i was a strong remainer, i voted to remain and i campaigned to remain. but we have left the eu and we are not going back so we have to make it work. we have to make the most of those opportunities. paul, he me out, a lot of people will be interested in this. we are not going back to the eu, but we have got to make it work. i have a relatively young kids. i feel very strongly to them, the next generation, the generation after, we have to put our shoulder to the wheel and make brexit work. that means working with you and other businesses. in northern ireland i was with the business roundtable and they were talking about the very problems you are encountering. they had 14 practical steps we can do to make trade easy with northern ireland and with ireland as well. i

want to get on and do it, stop arguing about the protocol, going back on our word and threatening to rip it up, get on with the practical measures, business is saying if you make adjustments as, we can trade much easier. make adjustments as, we can trade much easier-— much easier. from protocols to the practicalities _ much easier. from protocols to the practicalities of _ much easier. from protocols to the practicalities of your _ much easier. from protocols to the practicalities of your business, - practicalities of your business, paul. when you hear so keir starmer saying we have to put our shoulders to the wheel and make brexit work, it doesn't sound terribly bad market sound reluctant, doesn't it? i it doesn't sound terribly bad market sound reluctant, doesn't it?- sound reluctant, doesn't it? ithink the whole party — sound reluctant, doesn't it? ithink the whole party has _ sound reluctant, doesn't it? ithink the whole party has been - sound reluctant, doesn't it? ithink the whole party has been reluctant| the whole party has been reluctant to talk— the whole party has been reluctant to talk about it because of the danger— to talk about it because of the danger of splitting the voters in the red — danger of splitting the voters in the red wall. but those voters have seen _ the red wall. but those voters have seen how _ the red wall. but those voters have seen how difficult it is and would appreciate more honesty aboutjust how bad _ appreciate more honesty aboutjust how bad brexit has been. this appreciate more honesty about 'ust how bad brexit has been.�* how bad brexit has been. this is what people _ how bad brexit has been. this is what people want, _ how bad brexit has been. this is what people want, they - how bad brexit has been. this is what people want, they know. how bad brexit has been. this is| what people want, they know you how bad brexit has been. this is - what people want, they know you are a remainer and there are a lot of people in the country like paul, who

think this whole thing has been an absolute cossie. i am just wondering, is there merit in it long—term, can this make britain great, brexit? long-term, can this make britain great. brexit?— long-term, can this make britain treat, brexit? , ., ., ., ,, great, brexit? yes, we have to make a success of— great, brexit? yes, we have to make a success of it- _ great, brexit? yes, we have to make a success of it. global _ great, brexit? yes, we have to make a success of it. global britain, - great, brexit? yes, we have to make a success of it. global britain, how. a success of it. global britain, how does it work? _ a success of it. global britain, how does it work? we _ a success of it. global britain, how does it work? we have _ a success of it. global britain, how does it work? we have to - a success of it. global britain, how does it work? we have to make i a success of it. global britain, how. does it work? we have to make trade deals around — does it work? we have to make trade deals around the _ does it work? we have to make trade deals around the world. _ does it work? we have to make trade deals around the world. i _ does it work? we have to make trade deals around the world. i spoke - does it work? we have to make trade deals around the world. i spoke to i does it work? we have to make trade deals around the world. i spoke to a l deals around the world. i spoke to a us delegation and they said the current stumbling block, if the current stumbling block, if the current government rip up the protocol, we will not be doing a deal. i want to come back to this point, we have had a stagnant economy for 12 years, wages have not gone up and economic growth has been appalling. it is the achilles' heel of our economy and so many businesses are clear about that. it is notjust brexit, it is ten years of failure.

is notjust brexit, it is ten years of failure-— of failure. the food and drink sector, of failure. the food and drink sector. 68% _ of failure. the food and drink sector, 68% of _ of failure. the food and drink sector, 68% of europe - of failure. the food and drink sector, 6896 of europe are i of failure. the food and drink. sector, 6896 of europe are into sector, 68% of europe are into europe, — sector, 68% of europe are into europe, so— sector, 68% of europe are into europe, so we need to get free trade back~ _ europe, so we need to get free trade back if— europe, so we need to get free trade back. . ., ., , europe, so we need to get free trade back. _, ., y ., ., back. if the economy had grown, under this _ back. if the economy had grown, under this terrible _ back. if the economy had grown, under this terrible tory _ back. if the economy had grown, - under this terrible tory government, under this terrible tory government, under the same rate as it did under the last labour government, we would have billions of pounds to spend on public services without raising any taxes. the central argument i want to make is about growing our economy. about making sure the economy. about making sure the economy thrives because it is broken and stagnant and it has been that way now for ten or 12 years. part of thatis way now for ten or 12 years. part of that is making brexit work, but that is not all, we have a skills deficit, we haven't had investment in the right place, we haven't fast forwarded on energy. if he were self—sufficient on energy, if we had had a strategy, we wouldn't be in the pickle we are in with energy bills this winter. my frustration is we have had ten years of failure, ten years of stagnation and i am

absolutely determined we are going to turn it round, determined that will be the single focus of the next labour government. ok. will be the single focus of the next labour government.— will be the single focus of the next labour government. ok, thank you very much- — labour government. ok, thank you very much. pickle, _ labour government. ok, thank you very much. pickle, is _ labour government. ok, thank you very much. pickle, is one _ labour government. ok, thank you very much. pickle, is one way - very much. pickle, is one way putting it. interesting hearing that perspective. we ruth in belfast and we want to get tojennifer as well. we have six minutes, bear that in mind. welcome, ruth, how are you? good morning, it is good to speak to you. good morning, it is good to speak to ou. ., . good morning, it is good to speak to oh. ., ., ., " good morning, it is good to speak to ou. ., ., ., ~ ., good morning, it is good to speak to ou. ., . ., ~ ., ., you. you are talking to the man with one of the toughest _ you. you are talking to the man with one of the toughest jobs. _ you. you are talking to the man with one of the toughest jobs. hello, - you. you are talking to the man with one of the toughest jobs. hello, i i one of the toughest 'obs. hello, i used to womb one of the toughest 'obs. hello, i used to work in _ one of the toughest jobs. hello, i used to work in belfast. - one of the toughest jobs. hello, i used to work in belfast. it - one of the toughest jobs. hello, i used to work in belfast. it is - one of the toughest jobs. hello, i used to work in belfast. it is a i used to work in belfast. it is a beautiful sunny _ used to work in belfast. it is a beautiful sunny morning. - used to work in belfast. it is a beautiful sunny morning. i - used to work in belfast. it is a i beautiful sunny morning. i have a protocol — beautiful sunny morning. i have a protocol question. i voted beautiful sunny morning. i have a protocol question. ivoted remain and i_ protocol question. ivoted remain and i appreciate brexit has happened and i appreciate brexit has happened and we _ and i appreciate brexit has happened and we do _ and i appreciate brexit has happened and we do have to be positive and try to _

and we do have to be positive and try to make — and we do have to be positive and try to make it work. but for me, the question— try to make it work. but for me, the question about how you resolve the customs _ question about how you resolve the customs board without rejoining the customs _ customs board without rejoining the customs union or the single market, i customs union or the single market, i don't _ customs union or the single market, idon't think— customs union or the single market, i don't think anyone has answered that question yet, where will the border— that question yet, where will the border be — that question yet, where will the border be and you know there are unionists— border be and you know there are unionists who want the protocol to id unionists who want the protocol to go away— unionists who want the protocol to go away because they feel separate from the _ go away because they feel separate from the union. and the majority who voted _ from the union. and the majority who voted this— from the union. and the majority who voted this year want it resolved, but nobody can answer how or where this customs — but nobody can answer how or where this customs union will be and how it will— this customs union will be and how it will work— this customs union will be and how it will work and that is my question, sir keir, and thank you. for reasons — question, sir keir, and thank you. for reasons he will completely understand, we cannot have a hard border between ireland and northern ireland. i border between ireland and northern ireland. ., �* ~' border between ireland and northern ireland. ., �* ,, ., y ., border between ireland and northern ireland. ., �* ,, ., ., , ireland. i don't think anyone wants that. that ireland. i don't think anyone wants that- that is _ ireland. i don't think anyone wants that. that is something _ ireland. i don't think anyone wants that. that is something that - ireland. i don't think anyone wants that. that is something that goes. ireland. i don't think anyone wants. that. that is something that goes to the heart of — that. that is something that goes to the heart of everything _ that. that is something that goes to the heart of everything i _ that. that is something that goes to the heart of everything i was - the heart of everything i was working on. that creates a problem

that would be there for any government. we have got the protocol in place and we should build on it, not rip it up. if we rip it up, we go back to square one. just tweak it. don't go back to square one. just tweak it- don't rip _ go back to square one. just tweak it- don't rip it— go back to square one. just tweak it. don't rip it up, _ go back to square one. just tweak it. don't rip it up, tweak- go back to square one. just tweak it. don't rip it up, tweak it. - go back to square one. just tweak it. don't rip it up, tweak it. you i it. don't rip it up, tweak it. you can be vulnerable to conservative claims now you are backing the eu rather than the uk? the government has said it is — rather than the uk? the government has said it is going _ rather than the uk? the government has said it is going to _ rather than the uk? the government has said it is going to rip _ rather than the uk? the government has said it is going to rip it _ rather than the uk? the government has said it is going to rip it up, - has said it is going to rip it up, and that is what is destroying our international reputation. our government under borisjohnson and may be under liz truss are threatening to rip up the treaty they signed is ruining our reputation, ruining our ability to even do the changing of the protocol, because around the negotiating table... ido protocol, because around the negotiating table. . ._ protocol, because around the negotiating table... do you think it is ruinin: negotiating table... do you think it is ruining our _ negotiating table... do you think it is ruining our reputation, - negotiating table... do you think it is ruining our reputation, ruth? i is ruining our reputation, ruth? yes, i don't think what has happened over the _ yes, i don't think what has happened over the last — yes, i don't think what has happened over the last four years since they decided _ over the last four years since they decided to— over the last four years since they decided to go ahead, i don't think

anything — decided to go ahead, i don't think anything has helped the uk's reputation or northern ireland reputation. | reputation or northern ireland reputation-— reputation or northern ireland reutation. ., ., ., reputation. i don't want to dodge the question. _ reputation. i don't want to dodge the question, i— reputation. i don't want to dodge the question, i think _ reputation. i don't want to dodge the question, i think we - reputation. i don't want to dodge the question, i think we should l the question, i think we should build on the protocol, not rip it up. i build on the protocol, not rip it u i _ ., ., build on the protocol, not rip it u l , ., ., y ., build on the protocol, not rip it up. i am agreeing with you, but my cuestion up. i am agreeing with you, but my question is — up. i am agreeing with you, but my question is how? _ up. i am agreeing with you, but my question is how? if— up. i am agreeing with you, but my question is how? if you _ up. i am agreeing with you, but my question is how? if you had - up. i am agreeing with you, but my question is how? if you had a - question is how? if you had a veterinary — question is how? if you had a veterinary agreement, - question is how? if you had a veterinary agreement, it - question is how? if you had a - veterinary agreement, it wouldn't take away all of the checks but it would reduce them by 80% and make a massive difference. for many businesses are northern ireland, when i was over there a couple of months ago talking about this with them, that is one of the things they wanted to see. they said it would be a massive step in the right direction. around the negotiating, the eu has got to be flexible and it has got to give and take as well, i completely understand that. but what we need around the negotiating table is trust on all sides. my challenge to the government on the protocol is this, in 1998, tony blairand to the government on the protocol is this, in 1998, tony blair and the labour government and others came together and the good friday agreement was agreed. that was

massive. look at the issues they were dealing with after 30 years of troubles in northern ireland, a decommissioning of armoury, dealing with terrorist issues and that was resolved through the good friday agreement because there was mutual trust and respect. that is the ingredient that is missing now because you have had a government backed science a treaty and then says it's going to rip it up. that has destroyed the trust and respect. we have two minutes. it was great to have you on, thank you very much indeed. one more question and a very quick answer, it is from jennifer, can i ask you to be as quick as you can? i can i ask you to be as quick as you can? ., can i ask you to be as quick as you can? . ., , ., . ,, can i ask you to be as quick as you can? . ., , y can? i am from the black community and i feel that _ can? i am from the black community and i feel that keir _ can? i am from the black community and i feel that keir starmer - can? i am from the black community and i feel that keir starmer does - and i feel that keir starmer does not represent us any more. the labom— not represent us any more. the labour party, i think the labour party— labour party, i think the labour party has— labour party, i think the labour party has always relied on the black community— party has always relied on the black community to vote labour, but from my point— community to vote labour, but from

my point of— community to vote labour, but from my point of view at the moment, he does _ my point of view at the moment, he does not _ my point of view at the moment, he does not represent us and i would say to— does not represent us and i would say to a _ does not represent us and i would say to a lot — does not represent us and i would say to a lot of the black community to look— say to a lot of the black community to look elsewhere. dawn butler is not there — to look elsewhere. dawn butler is not there any more in the shadow cabinet. _ not there any more in the shadow cabinet, what has he got to offer me? _ cabinet, what has he got to offer me? i_ cabinet, what has he got to offer me? i noticed there was a report... can i_ me? i noticed there was a report... can iiust _ me? i noticed there was a report... can iiust stop— me? i noticed there was a report... can ijust stop it, it is a very important question and we haven't got a lot of time, butjennifer, you put it very well and here is a very quick answer. i put it very well and here is a very quick answer-— put it very well and here is a very quick answer. i want to represent ou, i quick answer. i want to represent you. i want _ quick answer. i want to represent you. i want to — quick answer. i want to represent you, i want to persuade - quick answer. i want to represent you, i want to persuade you - quick answer. i want to represent you, i want to persuade you that l quick answer. i want to represent i you, i want to persuade you that the black community matters hugely. we have high—level representation, david lammy is the shadow foreign secretary, doing a fantasticjob for us. but i want to reassure you, jennifer, we don't take any votes for granted and therefore, we will have that absolutely central to the arguments we make into the manifesto. arguments we make into the manifesto-— arguments we make into the manifesto. ., ., ., , ., manifesto. you take no votes for

ranted, manifesto. you take no votes for granted. thank — manifesto. you take no votes for granted, thank you _ manifesto. you take no votes for granted, thank you very - manifesto. you take no votes for granted, thank you very much. i manifesto. you take no votes for - granted, thank you very much. right now, we leave, rather bbc news viewers leave us. carry on your answer, radio only. thanks to nicky campbell putting your questions to the labour leader, sir keir starmer. i'm joined by our political correspondent helen catt. a range of questions and the last one we caught a bit of buzz from a black voter asking whether labour represented black people. we had questions on brexit, questions related to business on northern ireland. the issue of strikes as well. what where the key takeaways from that? , ., , ., well. what where the key takeaways from that? , ., . ., . from that? this was a chance, we have heard _ from that? this was a chance, we have heard a _ from that? this was a chance, we have heard a lot _ from that? this was a chance, we have heard a lot from _ from that? this was a chance, we have heard a lot from the - have heard a lot from the conservative contenders to be the

next prime minister, this