it's monday the 3rd of october, this is politics live from the conservative party conference in birmingham where in around 15 minutes — after his u—turn on the 45p tax rate this morning — kwasi kwarteng will deliver his conference speech. joining me today, whitehall editor of the financial times. iceland chief executive,

richard walker. former cabinet minister andrea leadsom. and the bbc�*s deputy political editor, vicki young. the chancellors�* day began like this. this 45p rate was simply a distraction in our mission to achieve higher growth. a u—turn on the scrapping the 45p top rate of tax — a policy he'd announced in his mini budgetjust 10 days ago. now, in a little under 15 minnutes he'll be addressing the party faithful — to persuade them that he is the man to be trusted with the economy through turbulent times. welcome to politics live in birmingham. andrea led some, after the market turmoil following the mini budget on the 23rd of september by kwasi kwarteng, and then the dramatic u—turn overnight and this morning, on a central plank of that

budget, and the economic perspectives of the government, how damaged is kwasi kwarteng's authority? i damaged is kwasi kwarteng's authori ? ~ ., , authority? i think it was really important _ authority? i think it was really important that _ authority? i think it was really important that he _ authority? i think it was really important that he announced | authority? i think it was really l important that he announced he authority? i think it was really - important that he announced he was not going ahead with the 45p cut, down to 40p in the pound. very important to do that quickly, not to drag it out. it was quite clear that it wasn't acceptable, it was not the right time, it was not the right measure. in fairness to him, he has said, we have listened, we have understood this is not the right thing to be doing so we are getting rid of it because he wants to focus on what the mini budget was about, which will help them with their energy bills, helping businesses to stay afloat and supply side reforms to get the economy going. you know that first impressions _ to get the economy going. you know that first impressions matter - to get the economy going. you know that first impressions matter in - that first impressions matter in politics, and he stuck to the policy, he and liz truss, they were determined to stick to cutting that 45p top rate of tax, and then they abandoned it like that. what does that do to someone's credibility? i

don't see it like that. of course, when you come out with a policy idea that you want to follow through, you are going to try to sell it, you're going to try to push it and promote it. but then what they saw was that it. but then what they saw was that it landed so badly that they were going to reverse it. actually, that takes some guts to do. the? going to reverse it. actually, that takes some guts to do. they were left with no _ takes some guts to do. they were left with no alternative, _ takes some guts to do. they were left with no alternative, because l left with no alternative, because they were not going to pass it. once michael gove said it was against conservative values, grant shapps said this is not the right time, we are not going to vote for this. i don't actually see that was the trigger. i think it was a political reality that they faced up to early, and that is a good thing and politicians.— and that is a good thing and oliticians. ~ ., , ., , ., politicians. was it early enough, sebastian payne? _ politicians. was it early enough, sebastian payne? 0r— politicians. was it early enough, sebastian payne? or do - politicians. was it early enough, sebastian payne? or do you - politicians. was it early enough, l sebastian payne? or do you think kwasi kwarteng's authority has, to some extent, been restored by taking what andrea leadsom calls a quick and right decision?— and right decision? there is an old sa in: and right decision? there is an old saying about _ and right decision? there is an old saying about u-turns, _ and right decision? there is an old saying about u-turns, the - and right decision? there is an old saying about u-turns, the worst i and right decision? there is an old i saying about u-turns, the worst time saying about u—turns, the worst time is tomorrow— saying about u—turns, the worst time is tomorrow and the best times yesterday. it should have happened

before _ yesterday. it should have happened before that, there was a breakdown implications between the treasury and conservative mps. i think it was conservative mps, michael gove and grant _ conservative mps, michael gove and grant shapps said they would not vote for— grant shapps said they would not vote for this, and tallies of lists will be — vote for this, and tallies of lists will be brought together that showed well over_ will be brought together that showed well over a dozen, communicated to the chancellor and the prime minister. _ the chancellor and the prime minister, they could not get this thing _ minister, they could not get this thing through. and quite late last night, _ thing through. and quite late last night, about 10pm and the private suite _ night, about 10pm and the private suite at _ night, about 10pm and the private suite at the hyatt hotel across the road from — suite at the hyatt hotel across the road from here, they looked at each other— road from here, they looked at each other and _ road from here, they looked at each other and said the game is up, we are not— other and said the game is up, we are not going to get this through, so we _ are not going to get this through, so we had — are not going to get this through, so we had better backtrack as quickly— so we had better backtrack as quickly as possible. was so we had better backtrack as quickly as possible.— so we had better backtrack as quickly as possible. was at the ri . ht quickly as possible. was at the right decision, _ quickly as possible. was at the right decision, richard, - quickly as possible. was at the right decision, richard, to - quickly as possible. was at the . right decision, richard, to reverse the policy? i right decision, richard, to reverse the policy?— right decision, richard, to reverse the oli ? ~ ,.,,.,_ the policy? i think it probably was. it was the policy? i think it probably was. it was always _ the policy? i think it probably was. it was always an _ the policy? i think it probably was. it was always an odd _ the policy? i think it probably was. it was always an odd priority, - the policy? i think it probably was. it was always an odd priority, to i it was always an odd priority, to reduce — it was always an odd priority, to reduce the _ it was always an odd priority, to reduce the top _ it was always an odd priority, to reduce the top rate. _ it was always an odd priority, to reduce the top rate. i— it was always an odd priority, to reduce the top rate. i say- it was always an odd priority, to reduce the top rate. i say that. it was always an odd priority, tol reduce the top rate. i say that as a top rate _ reduce the top rate. i say that as a top rate taxnayer _ reduce the top rate. i say that as a top rate taxpayer myself. - reduce the top rate. i say that as a top rate taxpayer myself. i- reduce the top rate. i say that as a top rate taxpayer myself. i alwaysl top rate taxpayer myself. i always look at _ top rate taxpayer myself. i always look at this — top rate taxpayer myself. i always look at this through _ top rate taxpayer myself. i always look at this through the _ top rate taxpayer myself. i always look at this through the lens - top rate taxpayer myself. i always look at this through the lens of. top rate taxpayer myself. i alwaysl look at this through the lens of my customer — look at this through the lens of my customer they— look at this through the lens of my customer. they don't _ look at this through the lens of my customer. they don't really - look at this through the lens of my customer. they don't really care i customer. they don't really care about _ customer. they don't really care about political— customer. they don't really care about political machinations - customer. they don't really care about political machinations and what _ about political machinations and what is — about political machinations and what is going _ about political machinations and what is going on— about political machinations and what is going on in— about political machinations and | what is going on in westminster. they— what is going on in westminster. they care — what is going on in westminster. they care about _ what is going on in westminster. they care about putting - what is going on in westminster. they care about putting food - what is going on in westminster. they care about putting food onl what is going on in westminster. i they care about putting food on the table _ they care about putting food on the table so. _ they care about putting food on the table so. for— they care about putting food on the table. so, for me, _ they care about putting food on the table. so, for me, i— they care about putting food on the table. so, for me, ithink— they care about putting food on the table. so, for me, i think it is - table. so, for me, i think it is

absolutely— table. so, for me, i think it is absolutely the _ table. so, for me, i think it is absolutely the right _ table. so, for me, i think it is absolutely the right thing - table. so, for me, i think it is absolutely the right thing to i table. so, for me, i think it is . absolutely the right thing to do. business — absolutely the right thing to do. business broadly— absolutely the right thing to do. business broadly welcomed - absolutely the right thing to do. business broadly welcomed the| absolutely the right thing to do. - business broadly welcomed the mini budget at the time? flit business broadly welcomed the mini budget at the time?— budget at the time? of course, supply-side _ budget at the time? of course, supply-side reform, _ budget at the time? of course, supply-side reform, going - budget at the time? of course, supply-side reform, going for l budget at the time? of course, - supply-side reform, going for growth supply—side reform, going for growth and productivity, _ supply—side reform, going for growth and productivity, absolutely- supply—side reform, going for growth and productivity, absolutely the - and productivity, absolutely the right— and productivity, absolutely the right thing — and productivity, absolutely the right thing to _ and productivity, absolutely the right thing to do. _ and productivity, absolutely the right thing to do. let's - and productivity, absolutely the right thing to do. let's balance i right thing to do. let's balance that out— right thing to do. let's balance that out and _ right thing to do. let's balance that out and make _ right thing to do. let's balance that out and make sure - right thing to do. let's balance that out and make sure that i right thing to do. let's balance | that out and make sure that we right thing to do. let's balance - that out and make sure that we look after those — that out and make sure that we look after those that _ that out and make sure that we look after those that are _ that out and make sure that we look after those that are most _ after those that are most vulnerable. _ after those that are most vulnerable. people - after those that are most vulnerable. people like . after those that are most i vulnerable. people like my after those that are most _ vulnerable. people like my customers who need _ vulnerable. people like my customers who need it _ vulnerable. people like my customers who need it most. _ vulnerable. people like my customers who need it most. lets _ vulnerable. people like my customers who need it most.— who need it most. lets look at --eole who need it most. lets look at people queueing _ who need it most. lets look at people queueing up, _ who need it most. lets look at people queueing up, snaking l who need it most. lets look at - people queueing up, snaking around the conference hall, just outside the conference hall, just outside the conference hall, just outside the conference hall. people are eager, of course, to hear what kwasi kwarteng is going to say. do you trust him to steer the economy, richard? , ~ trust him to steer the economy, richard? , ,, ., richard? yes, i think what we need now is stability. _ richard? yes, i think what we need now is stability. it's _ richard? yes, i think what we need now is stability. it's been _ richard? yes, i think what we need now is stability. it's been a - richard? yes, i think what we need now is stability. it's been a rocky i now is stability. it's been a rocky start, _ now is stability. it's been a rocky start, that — now is stability. it's been a rocky start, that is _ now is stability. it's been a rocky start, that is for— now is stability. it's been a rocky start, that is for sure. _ now is stability. it's been a rocky start, that is for sure. the - now is stability. it's been a rocky start, that is for sure. the vibe l now is stability. it's been a rocky| start, that is for sure. the vibe is pretty— start, that is for sure. the vibe is pretty interesting _ start, that is for sure. the vibe is pretty interesting out _ start, that is for sure. the vibe is pretty interesting out here. - start, that is for sure. the vibe is pretty interesting out here. but. start, that is for sure. the vibe is i pretty interesting out here. but now we need _ pretty interesting out here. but now we need stability, _ pretty interesting out here. but now we need stability, we _ pretty interesting out here. but now we need stability, we need - pretty interesting out here. but now we need stability, we need to - pretty interesting out here. but now we need stability, we need to get i pretty interesting out here. but now| we need stability, we need to get on and focus _ we need stability, we need to get on and focus on — we need stability, we need to get on and focus on delivering _ we need stability, we need to get on and focus on delivering for _ and focus on delivering for everyone _ and focus on delivering for everyone-— and focus on delivering for eve one. ., '. , , everyone. how difficult is this auoin to everyone. how difficult is this going to be — everyone. how difficult is this going to be for _ everyone. how difficult is this going to be for kwasi - everyone. how difficult is this. going to be for kwasi kwarteng today? he only announced the mini budget ten days ago, now he has to stand up in front of the party faithful, with all of the jitters of

tory mps around here at the conference centre, and the relationship with liz truss, because there seem to be a bit of a blame game going on as to whose idea it was to scrap that high rate of income tax. in was to scrap that high rate of income tax— was to scrap that high rate of income tax. . , income tax. in that interview, she talked about _ income tax. in that interview, she talked about it _ income tax. in that interview, she talked about it being _ income tax. in that interview, she talked about it being the - talked about it being the chancellor's decision. i am told he'd not see that as him being thrown under the bus, which is what some people suggested was happening. i don't think we should overdo it about division between them. as chancellor and prime minister, they are on the same page, they share the same ideologies. people saying that she might sack him, i don't think there is any suggestion of that. that would leave her incredibly vulnerable, she needs the protection. we think about michael gove's criticism, he talked about is having the wrong values, it felt like that, up to a point. the other bit, when he talked about unfunded tax cuts, millions of those, being unconservative policies, most of them are still there. it's not the end of it. it does show tory mps

that, having given the impression they were not listening, now they have been forced to listen. but i think tory mps will want to keep that avenue open.— that avenue open. isn't that a roblem that avenue open. isn't that a problem for _ that avenue open. isn't that a problem for somebody - that avenue open. isn't that a problem for somebody like i that avenue open. isn't that a i problem for somebody like you, particularly, andrea leadsom? you have always come onto this programme and talked about fiscal responsibility, about being able to balance the books. and yet there are still going to be £15 billion of unfunded tax cuts. does that make you feel queasy?— you feel queasy? absolutely, it does. however, _ you feel queasy? absolutely, it does. however, in _ you feel queasy? absolutely, it does. however, in my- you feel queasy? absolutely, it does. however, in my view, . you feel queasy? absolutely, it| does. however, in my view, the energy— does. however, in my view, the energy package was essential. and it is by far— energy package was essential. and it is by far and — energy package was essential. and it is by far and above the greatest element, — is by far and above the greatest element, 90% of the tax pledges... but i'm _ element, 90% of the tax pledges... but i'm talking about the unfunded tax cuts on the other side. the intervention about energy bills and help for households was announced prior to the mini budget. it was. it priorto the mini budget. it was. it wasn't, actually. energy support for consumers — wasn't, actually. energy support for consumers and businesses... with tens of billions _ consumers and businesses. .. with tens of billions of— consumers and businesses... tn tens of billions of pounds. but consumers and businesses... try tens of billions of pounds. but the reality is that the uk announced a

huge package of support. germany has announced an — huge package of support. germany has announced an even _ huge package of support. germany has announced an even bigger, _ huge package of support. germany has announced an even bigger, we - huge package of support. germany has announced an even bigger, we are - huge package of support. germany has announced an even bigger, we are the | announced an even bigger, we are the second _ announced an even bigger, we are the second lowest debt to gdp in the g7. what we _ second lowest debt to gdp in the g7. what we need to be doing is to say to ourselves, we've got to get the economy— to ourselves, we've got to get the economy growing again, we've got to avoid _ economy growing again, we've got to avoid a _ economy growing again, we've got to avoid a deep recession. that is what killsiobs _ avoid a deep recession. that is what killsjobs. we got to get inflation under— killsjobs. we got to get inflation under control. the energy package will reduce — under control. the energy package will reduce the headline rate of inflation — will reduce the headline rate of inflation. that sets the economy back— inflation. that sets the economy back on— inflation. that sets the economy back on a — inflation. that sets the economy back on a much better direction, for those _ back on a much better direction, for those supply—side reforms and the support— those supply—side reforms and the support and encouragement to business, — support and encouragement to business, to start kicking off, to develop — business, to start kicking off, to develop much more exchequer revenues that will— develop much more exchequer revenues that will help the economy. one auestion that will help the economy. one question on _ that will help the economy. one question on the _ that will help the economy. iez question on the supply side that will help the economy. ©“ie: question on the supply side reforms, i think a lot of people will not know exactly what we are talking about. i think people will think, well, if these supply—side reforms are a silver polish, you're going to wave a magic wand, why have an successive conservative governments been able to succeed in delivering them? ,, . . , , been able to succeed in delivering them? ,, .. ,, ., , ., them? successive conservative governments — them? successive conservative governments have _ them? successive conservative governments have started - them? successive conservative governments have started to i them? successive conservative | governments have started to try them? successive conservative - governments have started to try to do that _ governments have started to try to do that. �* . �* governments have started to try to do that-— in i do that. and haven't delivered? in many ways. _ do that. and haven't delivered? in many ways. what _ do that. and haven't delivered? in many ways, what the _

do that. and haven't delivered? in many ways, what the government | do that. and haven't delivered? in i many ways, what the government is doing _ many ways, what the government is doing is— many ways, what the government is doing is leaning on a doubling down on supply—side reforms that were attempted. the reality is, ever since _ attempted. the reality is, ever since brexit, that dividend in being able to— since brexit, that dividend in being able to get away from some of the stifling _ able to get away from some of the stifling red tape, not the necessary red tape, _ stifling red tape, not the necessary red tape, but the over burdensome red tape, but the over burdensome red tape, _ red tape, but the over burdensome red tape, it— red tape, but the over burdensome red tape, it was stifled by the covid — red tape, it was stifled by the covid pandemic, the lockdown. we now have a _ covid pandemic, the lockdown. we now have a breakage and supply chains that needs to be restored. there is opportunity— that needs to be restored. there is opportunity with many infrastructure projects _ opportunity with many infrastructure projects that themselves were knocked — projects that themselves were knocked sideways by the covid pandemic, to get under way and really— pandemic, to get under way and really start making a difference to productivity in this country. the issue is that _ productivity in this country. the issue is that you _ productivity in this country. t“ie: issue is that you have these measures, and if you look at the economic reform you would like, this wasn't that big, the 45p rate of tax wasn't that big, the 45p rate of tax was about £2 billion. the reforms were talking about, childcare, planning reform, house—building reform, they are all very contentious. if your colleagues are going to bowled at this small measure, how you get anything through parliament? it seems like

the parliamentary party are starting to get ungovernable at the moment. you have grant shapps and michael gove doing what some people are describing as the gove—erment. that describing as the gove-erment. that is over egging _ describing as the gove—erment. that is over egging their influence. they certainly— is over egging their influence. they certainly have influence, but you are absolutely right to say that conservative mps were saying to the government you can't do this, top rate of— government you can't do this, top rate of tax— government you can't do this, top rate of tax cut, because we have to focus _ rate of tax cut, because we have to focus on _ rate of tax cut, because we have to focus on the — rate of tax cut, because we have to focus on the people, and that is what _ focus on the people, and that is what has — focus on the people, and that is what has been designed to get the economy— what has been designed to get the economy going. there will be massive support— economy going. there will be massive support from conservative mps for the sorts _ support from conservative mps for the sorts of fundamental reforms that create the levelling up on infrastructure projects, the investment zones, the childcare reforms — investment zones, the childcare reforms. liz investment zones, the childcare reforms. , , ., reforms. liz truss will look at this, and _ reforms. liz truss will look at this. and in — reforms. liz truss will look at this, and in her— reforms. liz truss will look at this, and in her head - reforms. liz truss will look at this, and in her head to - reforms. liz truss will look at this, and in her head to the i reforms. liz truss will look at i this, and in her head to the next election is two years away? members ofthe election is two years away? members of the public — election is two years away? members of the public will _ election is two years away? members of the public will accept _ election is two years away? members of the public will accept a _ election is two years away? members

of the public will accept a new - of the public will accept a new direction _ of the public will accept a new direction that is really starting to show— direction that is really starting to show impact. we direction that is really starting to show impact-— direction that is really starting to show impact. direction that is really starting to show im act. ~ ., ., ~ ., ., show impact. we will look at that in a minute, because _ show impact. we will look at that in a minute, because we _ show impact. we will look at that in a minute, because we are _ show impact. we will look at that in a minute, because we are going - show impact. we will look at that in a minute, because we are going to l a minute, because we are going to hearfrom kwasi kwarteng in a few minutes' time. this global growth, the sort of reforms that we are discussing here, is that what is going to make businessmen like you invest in the economy? businessmen and women. — invest in the economy? businessmen and women. yes. _ invest in the economy? businessmen and women, yes, absolutely. - invest in the economy? businessmen l and women, yes, absolutely. anything we can— and women, yes, absolutely. anything we can do— and women, yes, absolutely. anything we can do to _ and women, yes, absolutely. anything we can do to lower— and women, yes, absolutely. anything we can do to lower red _ and women, yes, absolutely. anything we can do to lower red tape, _ and women, yes, absolutely. anything we can do to lower red tape, to - we can do to lower red tape, to lower— we can do to lower red tape, to lower taxation, _ we can do to lower red tape, to lower taxation, to— we can do to lower red tape, to lower taxation, to enable - we can do to lower red tape, to i lower taxation, to enable business to do— lower taxation, to enable business to do its— lower taxation, to enable business to do itsjob — lower taxation, to enable business to do itsjob ill— lower taxation, to enable business to do itsjob. i'll give _ lower taxation, to enable business to do itsjob. i'll give you - lower taxation, to enable business to do itsjob. i'll give you a - lower taxation, to enable business to do itsjob. i'll give you a very. to do itsjob. i'll give you a very pragmatic example. we - to do itsjob. i'll give you a very pragmatic example. we talk- to do itsjob. i'll give you a very. pragmatic example. we talk about levelling _ pragmatic example. we talk about levelling up. — pragmatic example. we talk about levelling up, what _ pragmatic example. we talk about levelling up, what does _ pragmatic example. we talk about levelling up, what does levelling i pragmatic example. we talk about i levelling up, what does levelling up actually _ levelling up, what does levelling up actually mean? _ levelling up, what does levelling up actually mean? it _ levelling up, what does levelling up actually mean? it means— levelling up, what does levelling up actually mean? it meansjobs- levelling up, what does levelling up actually mean? it means jobs and i actually mean? it meansjobs and opportunity— actually mean? it meansjobs and opportunity around _ actually mean? it meansjobs and opportunity around the _ actually mean? it meansjobs and opportunity around the uk. - actually mean? it meansjobs and opportunity around the uk. all. actually mean? it meansjobs and| opportunity around the uk. all we want _ opportunity around the uk. all we want to— opportunity around the uk. all we want to do— opportunity around the uk. all we want to do is— opportunity around the uk. all we want to do is open— opportunity around the uk. all we want to do is open shops - opportunity around the uk. all we want to do is open shops and - opportunity around the uk. all we i want to do is open shops and create jobs. _ want to do is open shops and create jobs. pay— want to do is open shops and create jobs. pay tax — want to do is open shops and create jobs. pay tax and. _ want to do is open shops and create jobs, pay tax. and, yes, _ want to do is open shops and create jobs, pay tax. and, yes, every- jobs, pay tax. and, yes, every single — jobs, pay tax. and, yes, every single one _ jobs, pay tax. and, yes, every single one of— jobs, pay tax. and, yes, every single one of our— jobs, pay tax. and, yes, every single one of our store - jobs, pay tax. and, yes, every. single one of our store openings jobs, pay tax. and, yes, every- single one of our store openings is delayed _ single one of our store openings is delayed because _ single one of our store openings is delayed because we _ single one of our store openings is delayed because we are _ single one of our store openings is. delayed because we are encumbered single one of our store openings is- delayed because we are encumbered by red tape _ delayed because we are encumbered by red tape and _ delayed because we are encumbered by red tape and planning. _ delayed because we are encumbered by red tape and planning. so, _ delayed because we are encumbered by red tape and planning. so, if— delayed because we are encumbered by red tape and planning. so, if we - delayed because we are encumbered by red tape and planning. so, if we can - red tape and planning. so, if we can reform _ red tape and planning. so, if we can reform planning, _ red tape and planning. so, if we can reform planning, if— red tape and planning. so, if we can reform planning, if we _ red tape and planning. so, if we can reform planning, if we can - red tape and planning. so, if we can reform planning, if we can get - red tape and planning. so, if we can reform planning, if we can get the i reform planning, if we can get the

government— reform planning, if we can get the government out— reform planning, if we can get the government out of— reform planning, if we can get the government out of the _ reform planning, if we can get the government out of the way- reform planning, if we can get the government out of the way of- reform planning, if we can get the government out of the way of the| government out of the way of the private _ government out of the way of the private sector, _ government out of the way of the private sector, to _ government out of the way of the private sector, to do _ government out of the way of the private sector, to do its _ government out of the way of the private sector, to do itsjob- government out of the way of the private sector, to do itsjob and i private sector, to do itsjob and create — private sector, to do itsjob and create wealth, _ private sector, to do itsjob and create wealth, that _ private sector, to do itsjob and create wealth, that should - private sector, to do itsjob and i create wealth, that should have a benefit _ create wealth, that should have a benefit for — create wealth, that should have a benefit for everyone. _ create wealth, that should have a benefit for everyone. one - create wealth, that should have a benefit for everyone.— benefit for everyone. one of the exam - les benefit for everyone. one of the examples will _ benefit for everyone. one of the examples will be _ benefit for everyone. one of the examples will be the _ benefit for everyone. one of the examples will be the planning i examples will be the planning reforms that were being proposed under borisjohnson. they were dropped. they were dropped because the government found it too difficult to do. i the government found it too difficult to do.— the government found it too difficult to do. i think this is a vicki's point, _ difficult to do. i think this is a vicki's point, we _ difficult to do. i think this is a vicki's point, we have - difficult to do. i think this is a vicki's point, we have to - difficult to do. i think this is a - vicki's point, we have to mackerel years until we are going to be into the next general election. regardless of the mood of the parliamentary party, which is febrile at the moment, there is not enough time to do lots of this stuff. liz truss was coming in, the prime minister was talking about her balls of steel, and how they were going to be tested by the amount of reforms that she wanted to do. the fact that she has caved, quite early on, i don't think it bodes well for the hardest. on, i don't think it bodes well for the hardest-— the hardest. that's really unfair. it's not the hardest. that's really unfair. it's not caving. _ the hardest. that's really unfair. it's not caving, it _ the hardest. that's really unfair. it's not caving, it is _ the hardest. that's really unfair. it's not caving, it is facing - it's not caving, it is facing reality _ it's not caving, it is facing reality. to the point that we only have _ reality. to the point that we only have two — reality. to the point that we only have two years and these are fundamental reforms, that is the whole _ fundamental reforms, that is the whole point. liz set out her stall, there _ whole point. liz set out her stall,

there is _ whole point. liz set out her stall, there is too — whole point. liz set out her stall, there is too much blocking things from _ there is too much blocking things from happening. she came in on an absolute _ from happening. she came in on an absolute mandate to get rid of some of those _ absolute mandate to get rid of some of those problems that prevent planning — of those problems that prevent planning reform from taking effect. having _ planning reform from taking effect. having been a secretary of state myself, — having been a secretary of state myself, i — having been a secretary of state myself, i know how hard it is to get through— myself, i know how hard it is to get through the — myself, i know how hard it is to get through the system. so, what the prime _ through the system. so, what the prime minister wants to do is to cut through— prime minister wants to do is to cut through that and actually start to make _ through that and actually start to make reform happen faster. she has said said she — make reform happen faster. she has said said she should _ make reform happen faster. she has said said she should have _ make reform happen faster. she has said said she should have laid - make reform happen faster. she has said said she should have laid the i said said she should have laid the ground that the head of the announcements, and maybe that will be a salutary lesson. what are your customers need now? is be a salutary lesson. what are your customers need now?— be a salutary lesson. what are your customers need now? is much help as ossible. customers need now? is much help as possible- from — customers need now? is much help as possible. from my _ customers need now? is much help as possible. from my perspective, - customers need now? is much help as possible. from my perspective, i - customers need now? is much help as possible. from my perspective, i am i possible. from my perspective, lam no economist, — possible. from my perspective, lam no economist, but _ possible. from my perspective, lam no economist, but we _ possible. from my perspective, lam no economist, but we see _ possible. from my perspective, lam no economist, but we see and - possible. from my perspective, lam no economist, but we see and feel. no economist, but we see and feel and hear— no economist, but we see and feel and hear it— no economist, but we see and feel and hear it every— no economist, but we see and feel and hear it every day. _ no economist, but we see and feel and hear it every day. our- no economist, but we see and feel and hear it every day. our 5- no economist, but we see and feel| and hear it every day. our 5 million customers, — and hear it every day. our 5 million customers, who _ and hear it every day. our 5 million customers, who are _ and hear it every day. our 5 million customers, who are from _ and hear it every day. our 5 million customers, who are from the - and hear it every day. our 5 million customers, who are from the most| customers, who are from the most struggling — customers, who are from the most struggling communities _ customers, who are from the most struggling communities around - customers, who are from the mostj struggling communities around the uk, week— struggling communities around the uk, week in — struggling communities around the uk, week in, week— struggling communities around the uk, week in, week out, _ struggling communities around the uk, week in, week out, they- struggling communities around the uk, week in, week out, they needl struggling communities around the i uk, week in, week out, they need all the help— uk, week in, week out, they need all the help they— uk, week in, week out, they need all the help they can— uk, week in, week out, they need all the help they can get. _ uk, week in, week out, they need all the help they can get. all— uk, week in, week out, they need all the help they can get. all of- uk, week in, week out, they need all the help they can get. all of this - the help they can get. all of this bil the help they can get. all of this big supply-side _ the help they can get. all of this big supply—side reform, - the help they can get. all of this big supply—side reform, fine. . the help they can get. all of thisi big supply—side reform, fine. but let's reinstate _ big supply—side reform, fine. but let's reinstate the _ big supply—side reform, fine. but let's reinstate the universal- let's reinstate the universal credit, _ let's reinstate the universal credit, £25 _ let's reinstate the universal credit, £25 uplift. _ let's reinstate the universal credit, £25 uplift. that - let's reinstate the universal credit, £25 uplift. that is i let's reinstate the universal credit, £25 uplift. that is £1

billion _ credit, £25 uplift. that is £1 billion why— credit, £25 uplift. that is £1 billion. why not? _ credit, £25 uplift. that is £1 billion. why not? it- credit, £25 uplift. that is £1| billion. why not? it wouldn't credit, £25 uplift. that is £1 - billion. why not? it wouldn't even touch— billion. why not? it wouldn't even touch the — billion. why not? it wouldn't even touch the sides. _ billion. why not? it wouldn't even touch the sides. that _ billion. why not? it wouldn't even touch the sides. that would - billion. why not? it wouldn't even i touch the sides. that would smooth some _ touch the sides. that would smooth some of— touch the sides. that would smooth some of the — touch the sides. that would smooth some of the income _ touch the sides. that would smooth some of the income for— touch the sides. that would smooth some of the income for my- touch the sides. that would smooth i some of the income for my customers and be _ some of the income for my customers and be a _ some of the income for my customers and be a godsend _ some of the income for my customers and be a godsend.— and be a godsend. would you support that, and be a godsend. would you support that. andrea? — and be a godsend. would you support that, andrea? there _ and be a godsend. would you support that, andrea? there would _ and be a godsend. would you support that, andrea? there would be - and be a godsend. would you support that, andrea? there would be things| that, andrea? there would be things i would that, andrea? there would be things i would support _ that, andrea? there would be things i would support sooner _ that, andrea? there would be things i would support sooner than - that, andrea? there would be things i would support sooner than that. . i would support sooner than that. things— i would support sooner than that. things like — i would support sooner than that. things like childcare... i would support sooner than that. things like childcare. . ._ things like childcare... operating benefits in line _ things like childcare... operating benefits in line with _ things like childcare... operating benefits in line with inflation, - things like childcare... operating benefits in line with inflation, do | benefits in line with inflation, do you support that?— benefits in line with inflation, do you support that? what i would like to see happen _ you support that? what i would like to see happen is — you support that? what i would like to see happen is childcare - you support that? what i would like to see happen is childcare reform. i to see happen is childcare reform. i'm to see happen is childcare reform. i'm going — to see happen is childcare reform. i'm going to— to see happen is childcare reform. i'm going to interrupt, just to say there is less trust, kissing her colleague nadhim zahawi, sitting next to therese coffey, the health secretary, and the deputy to liz truss. she is smiling, looking forward to hearing what kwasi kwarteng has to say. i am sure they had a discussion about it. what kwarteng has to say. i am sure they had a discussion about it.— had a discussion about it. what i would like _ reform that enables families to take the decision on when they use their budget— the decision on when they use their budget for— the decision on when they use their budget for childcare. at the moment, that is— budget for childcare. at the moment, that is a _ budget for childcare. at the moment, that is a real— budget for childcare. at the moment, that is a real stumbling block for families, — that is a real stumbling block for families, who find that they can't manage — families, who find that they can't manage raising a family with their working _ manage raising a family with their working responsibilities. that is their— working responsibilities. that is their real— working responsibilities. that is their real opportunity to earn more money, _ their real opportunity to earn more money, to— their real opportunity to earn more money, to meet the needs of their family. _ money, to meet the needs of their

family. and — money, to meet the needs of their family, and the system is against them _ family, and the system is against them at — family, and the system is against them at the moment. i would like to see investment in that sort of reform — they would be operated in line with inflation, running at about 10%. the government hasn't said it is committed to that yet. should they? i think probably the issue is that the energy package will reduce headline inflation typically by 5%, so then— headline inflation typically by 5%, so then you get the question of whether— so then you get the question of whether it would be right to up rate by a different number, and if so, why _ by a different number, and if so, why i_ by a different number, and if so, why i don't _ by a different number, and if so, why. i don't know, but that is where we are _ why. i don't know, but that is where we are right — why. i don't know, but that is where we are right now, seeing what the state _ we are right now, seeing what the state of _ we are right now, seeing what the state of the inflationary part of the economic cycle is. but state of the inflationary part of the economic cycle is.- state of the inflationary part of the economic cycle is. but in the meantime _ the economic cycle is. but in the meantime people _ the economic cycle is. but in the meantime people have - the economic cycle is. but in the meantime people have got - the economic cycle is. but in the meantime people have got to i the economic cycle is. but in the i meantime people have got to worry about the amount... simon cook they have a huge amount of support for their energy bills... kwasi kwarteng isjust making his their energy bills... kwasi kwarteng is just making his way to the

lectern. thank you, conference. what a day. it has been tough, but we need to focus on the job in it has been tough, but we need to focus on thejob in hand. we need to move forward. no more distractions. we have a plan, and we need to get on and deliver it. that's what the public expect. that's what the public expect. that's what the public expect. that's what the public expect from the government. but first, conference, welcome back to birmingham. this is a remarkable city. it has a history of great brilliance. joseph chamberlain in the 19th century was an extraordinary civic leader who led birmingham and the world through the industrial revolution, and today andy street is following in that great tradition. graft and grit turned this small town first into a thriving

industrial market then enter one of the centres of the industrial revolution, which powered and grew notjust revolution, which powered and grew not just the revolution, which powered and grew notjust the british economy but provided the new technologies that changed the world forever. the industrial revolution was one of the most monumental transformations in human history, and it began here, with determination and application. those britons built a thriving economy. they inspire me today. they remind us that in britain with the british people, absolutely anything is possible. our plan today focuses on the same bold sentiment, the same inspiration. to deal with the challenges of today by giving people the tools they need to thrive tomorrow. to get britain moving. applause we have great ideas. we have the

same inspirational people, and i know we have the same determination. our growth plans set out ten days ago will ensure we focus relentlessly on economic growth, because we must face up to the fact that for too long, our economy has not grown enough. the path ahead of us was one of slow, managed decline. but i refuse to accept that it is somehow britain's destiny to fall back into middle league status, or that the tax burden reaching a 70 year high is somehow inevitable. it isn't, and it shouldn't be. we needed a new approach focused on raising economic growth, because thatis raising economic growth, because that is the only real way to deliver opportunities, to deliver higher wages, to deliver morejobs, and crucially to deliver that revenue to

fund her precious public services. and it is the best and only way of achieving long—term fiscal sustainability. because it is only by raising economic growth that we will spread opportunity and prosperity to every corner of our country. with economic growth, everybody benefits, and i mean everybody. while we all believe in growth, we as conservatives also believe that it is an important principle that people should keep more of the money they earn. i don't need to tell you that. i don't need to tell you that. that isn't radical. that isn't irresponsible. it is a deeply held belief that wheelchair as conservatives. we were faced with a 70 year high tax burden. we were confronted with low growth. and the path we were on was clearly unsustainable. so that's why

we are cutting taxes for working people. that's why we will reverse the national insurance hike on the 6th of november, and that's why we will bring forward the 1p cut to the basic rate of income tax by one year. that's why we will take 200,000 people out of paying stamp duty altogether. taken together, this is what our support will do for all our people. thanks to our energy intervention, a typical person in a semi detached property will save £1150 on their energy bills this winter. on top of the £400 discount. and if they are earning an average salary, they will benefit from an additional tax cut of around £400. that is almost a £2000 saving this year alone. that is almost a £2000 saving this yearalone. but that is almost a £2000 saving this year alone. but i can be frank. i know the plan put forward only days ago has caused a little turbulence.

i get it. i get it. we are listening, and have listened, and now i want to focus on delivering the major parts of our growth package. because with energy bills skyrocketing, a painful covid aftermath, war on our continent, a 70 year high tax burden, slowing global growth rates, and glacially slow infrastructure delivery, we couldn't simply do nothing. we can't sit idly by. what britain needs more than ever is economic growth, and the government wholly committed to economic growth. that is why we will forge a new economic deal for britain, backed by an ironclad commitment to fiscal discipline. applause more businesses... morejobs, higher pay, more money for public services,

because we cannot have a strong nhs without a strong economy. we can't have good schools without a strong economy. we cannot fund our armed forces without a strong economy. so growing our economy should be our central and guiding mission. with this plan, we are aiming for 2.5% annual growth. we have done it before and we will do it again. even in the face... applause and even in the face of extreme volatility in global markets, with major countries wrestling an incredibly strong us dollar, and longer term trends from demographic change to climate change, we will show that our plan is sound, that it is credible and that it will increase growth. that is our pledge to the people of this country.

however, conference, there is an immediate challenge facing notjust our country, notjust our people, but the whole of europe. the high cost of energy driven by putin's barbaric invasion of ukraine. cast your mind backjust four weeks ago. we had dire warnings of extreme energy crises to come. corner shops to heavy industry predicted unprecedented disruption. business groups feared mass unemployment. entire livelihoods were on the line. make no mistake, this was a very real prospect for our country. so, within 48 hours of taking office, we announced one of the most significant interventions ever conceived by the british state. annual energy bills of up to £6,500 from next year were staring us in the face, everybody was worried. now

we are holding down the price that an average of £2500. notjust this winter, like the labour party promised, but next winter too. two years of significant taxpayer support to protect our people, because this government... because this government will always be on the side of those who need help the most. for our business is too, conference, help is on its way. a local company could save their bills £3000 a month by cutting out going is 40%. and this is a support package that will protect families and businesses from devastating price hikes unleashed by vladimir putin. there is no doubt that this is a substantial

intervention. but we had no choice. doing nothing were simply not an option. we couldn't simply cross our fingers and hope for the best. the price of inaction would be far greater than the cost of the scheme. we will deal with the short—term shocks caused by putin, but we must also go for growth to ensure we are much more self—sufficient. we will tackle the mistakes of the past to ensure the uk can never again be blackmailed by people such as putin and his like. when covid hit our shores, we were right to intervene to protect lives and livelihoods. and i can say in all sincerity that we went into that crisis in a much better position because of the action we have taken over the last decade. because of

successive conservative governments, the uk now has the second lowest debt to gdp ratio in the g7. and throughout this urgent endeavour of hours to protect britain from high energy costs, and enlist response to the urgent need to grow our economy, we have taken the appropriate action. our entire approach will be underpinned by strong, institutional framework, which enhances growth in our country, including our independent bank of england and office for the responsibility. we will have a strong fiscal anchor, with debt falling as a percentage proportion of gdp over the medium term. that is the conservative way. but... applause but today, we face new challenges, and in addressing those challenges, we will act in a fiscally sustainable and responsible way. that is why shortly we will publish

our medium—term fiscal plan, setting out our approach more fully. we will set out how we plan to get debt falling as a percentage of gdp over the medium term, and i have asked the medium term, and i have asked the obr to publish a full economic and fiscal forecast alongside our medium—term fiscal plan. there is no path to higher sustainable growth without fiscal responsibility. conservatives have always known this, and we know it still. and it is because we are conservatives that we remain absolutely committed to being serious custodians of the public purse. this is what defines us and separates us from the labour party. but, conference, to grow the economy, we really do need to do things differently. we know that it is our towns and cities which drive much of our economic growth today. business investment, skills, science and technology, infrastructure, housing, energy supply, strong

financial services. these are the key ingredients for higher economic growth, and well funded public services. i had the great privilege of being business secretary for nearly two years. i visited every corner of this country. i saw the creativity, the drive, the entrepreneurial spirit. creativity, the drive, the entrepreneurialspirit. our creativity, the drive, the entrepreneurial spirit. our business people, ourjob creators, people who are taking risks. but i also saw where government got in the way of progress. myjob now is to free that potential. this starts with investment zones. we will empower local areas to do things differently, just as here in birmingham. we will liberalise planning rules. releasing land and accelerating development. we will cut taxes for businesses in those zones. we will accelerate tax reliefs for new structures and for new buildings. we will provide relief on investments on plants and machinery. we will lower taxes which stop businesses hiring and skilling

up stop businesses hiring and skilling up their workforce. that is an unprecedented set of incentives for business, to invest, to createjobs, to build right across our country. and it will start right now. conference, we will get britain moving. applause but too often, regulation holds business and britain back. stifling red tape puts up too many barriers to entrepreneurs looking to scale up. there are too many rules for small business owners who want to take on an apprentice. there are too many burdens on our finance sector stopping it from investing in key projects. and when britain's innovators, job creators, entrepreneurs and risk—takers are held back, so is britain. that is why we will review, replace or

repeal retained eu law holding our country back. applause we will also speed up the delivery of infrastructure and promote house—building to create a true homeowning shareholding democracy. unapologetically and emphatically, we will get out of the way, to get britain building and on its feet. applause over the coming days and weeks, we will forge ahead and break down the barriers that have held our country back for too long. on child care, agriculture, immigration, planning, energy, broadband, business, financial services. sensible economic reforms to produce more of the products and services we need to drive down costs. to create jobs. and to generate higher pay and

productivity. and when it comes to those who would hold us back, we will act. those who would hold us back, we willact. pernicious those who would hold us back, we will act. pernicious strike action disrupts the lives of british people and slows down our economy. it stops children going to school. it stops parents from going to work. and it stops people from getting the vital care that they need. action which slows down our economy cannot be the policy of any serious party, serious about growth. at a party which is not a serious about growth can never be considered fit for office. applause we will introduce reform to get britain moving.—

britain moving. conference, unashamedly _ britain moving. conference, unashamedly i _ britain moving. conference, unashamedly i am - britain moving. conference, unashamedly i am a - britain moving. conference, i unashamedly i am a pro-business unashamedly i am a pro—business conservative. i know that the interests of business and hard—working families are not in conflict. they are reliant. when businesses thrive, they create more jobs, reliant. when businesses thrive, they create morejobs, they reliant. when businesses thrive, they create more jobs, they raise wages and contribute more for our public services. rather than bashing business, we are backing it. that is why we need to make our tax... that is why we need to make our tax system simpler, and more competitive. we will reverse the planned increase in corporation tax. applause ensuring that we have the lowest rate in the g20. this will plough almost £19 billion per year back into the economy. that's £19 billion for businesses to reinvest, to create jobs and raise wages. we will

reverse the reforms to ir35 that have added unnecessary complexity and cost for so many businesses. we will retain the £1 million annual investment allowance, giving 100% tax relief on investments in plants and machinery. for overa tax relief on investments in plants and machinery. for over a decade, the conservative party has stood up for working people in this country. since 2010, we have delivered the lowest unemployment since the 19705, 1 million new businesses. more than doubling the tax—free personal allowance. we have taken to million of the lowest paid out of paying tax altogether. the national living wage, boosting the pay packets of the lowest paid. fuel duty frozen for 12 years. the £1000 uplift in universal credit, making sure work always pays. these are great achievements. conservative achievements. conservative achievements. let us not forget, when this party came into

government, we were met with the full force of labour's economic incompetence. no money left, taxes raised, record unemployment. we reversed that story of national decline. even after three election defeats, they still haven't learned their lesson. the labour party would have you believe that every penny you earn should go straight into the government's coffers. the labour party believe they know how to spend your money better than you do. the labour party believe that they can tax their way to growth. we don't believe that. we believe in low tax, high growth and fiscal discipline. we are conservatives. applause anti—vax, conference, is what our growth plan delivers. last week, we saw a labour party with the same old

ideas, renationalisation, empty slogans, no plan for growth. but we, as conservatives, believe in britain. we love this country. our patriotism isn't something that we turn on and off and negotiate like the labour party. it goes to the core of what it is to be a conservative. it is an unyielding quality. yes, we have challenges to face. but our plan will take this country forward. we will get britain moving, we will deliver lower taxes for you and your family, moving, we will deliver lower taxes for you and yourfamily, and we will grow our economy. i know we can achieve that goal. with greta, drive and determination, we can meet the challenges of this new era. thank you. applause -- with grit, drive and determination. - -- with grit, drive and| determination. nadhim -- with grit, drive and - determination. nadhim zahawi -- with grit, drive and _ determination. nadhim zahawi and liz truss look pleased, _ determination. nadhim zahawi and liz truss look pleased, so _ determination. nadhim zahawi and liz truss look pleased, so does _ determination. nadhim zahawi and liz truss look pleased, so does he, i tru55 look pleased, so does he, because it was a sticky wicket after he had to announce that screeching u—turn, reversing the cut in the higher top rate of tax. everybody

look5 pleased, or maybe theyjust looked relieved that he managed to deliver it, restating conservative principles, as he sees it. he wants more people to keep more of what they earn. he also wants that dash for growth, and set out pretty well what he said in the mini budget, how they're going to achieve with supply—side reform and tax cuts. he also talked about and lauded the institutions of the bank of england and the office for budget responsibility, and said that these are our great institutions that will underpin the fiscal discipline that i will oversee. he said he would have an ironclad grip on fiscal discipline. let's find out what our guests here thought of that. vicki, did he do enough to reassure those sitting there in the conference hall? it sitting there in the conference hall? ., ,., ._ .,

sitting there in the conference hall? ., ., hall? it will go some way to calming anxie . hall? it will go some way to calming anxiety- that _ hall? it will go some way to calming anxiety. that was _ hall? it will go some way to calming anxiety. that was the _ hall? it will go some way to calming anxiety. that was the point - hall? it will go some way to calming anxiety. that was the point about i anxiety. that was the point about the u—turn overnight, get it out of the u—turn overnight, get it out of the way so he can make the speech and move on. the add—ons from the mini budget are talking about fiscal discipline, as he sat there last time and announced billions of pounds of unfunded tax cuts, that is really party what the markets were responding to. that is all still there, and we don't have the full picture of what he's going to do, and how he's going to show that he is going to bring debt down in the medium term. we still obviously need that obr report. we need to see the supply—side reforms is talking about. ila supply-side reforms is talking about. ., , ., supply-side reforms is talking about. ., ., , about. no sign of that being brought forward. about. no sign of that being brought forward- ifut — about. no sign of that being brought forward- ifut a _ about. no sign of that being brought forward. but a lot _ about. no sign of that being brought forward. but a lot of _ about. no sign of that being brought forward. but a lot of mps _ about. no sign of that being brought forward. but a lot of mps feel- about. no sign of that being brought forward. but a lot of mps feel he i forward. but a lot of mps feel he can't wait until— forward. but a lot of mps feel he can't wait until the _ forward. but a lot of mps feel he can't wait until the 23rd - forward. but a lot of mps feel he can't wait until the 23rd of i can't wait until the 23rd of november and that would be too late. the other arrangements are going to come in the next few weeks. it begins to paint the picture more fully, but people would say it is donein fully, but people would say it is done in the wrong order, should have been done earlier. you try to

justify that by saying we had to act urgently because of the energy problem, but some are saying he could havejust problem, but some are saying he could have just done that bit and not the rest of it. i could have just done that bit and not the rest of it.— not the rest of it. i think kwasi kwarteng _ not the rest of it. i think kwasi kwarteng gave _ not the rest of it. i think kwasi kwarteng gave a _ not the rest of it. i think kwasi kwarteng gave a very - not the rest of it. i think kwasi kwarteng gave a very solid - kwarteng gave a very solid performance. if it was to channel one catchphrase, it would be corporal— one catchphrase, it would be corporaljones, don't panic. he was trying _ corporaljones, don't panic. he was trying to— corporaljones, don't panic. he was trying to calm everything down and say that _ trying to calm everything down and say that we are going to be fiscally responsible, we are going to do the sums, _ responsible, we are going to do the sums, and — responsible, we are going to do the sums, and what happened was a blip. at the _ sums, and what happened was a blip. at the beginning of his speech, the chancellor— at the beginning of his speech, the chancellor was quite clear, he admitted _ chancellor was quite clear, he admitted they got it wrong and took it on the _ admitted they got it wrong and took it on the chin. there wasn't really any new_ it on the chin. there wasn't really any new policy, which you could maybe — any new policy, which you could maybe understand, given what has happened — maybe understand, given what has happened over the last ten days. again, _ happened over the last ten days. again, i— happened over the last ten days. again, ithink happened over the last ten days. again, i think he is trying to be reassuring _ again, i think he is trying to be reassuring. what you didn't see is kwasi _ reassuring. what you didn't see is kwasi kwarteng is a very confident individual. — kwasi kwarteng is a very confident individual, and that came across quite _ individual, and that came across quite solidly. there was no the hrashraess— quite solidly. there was no the brashness or bravado that you saw in the mini _ brashness or bravado that you saw in the mini budget. there has been a bit of— the mini budget. there has been a bit of humility over the events of the past — bit of humility over the events of the past couple of weeks, but i think— the past couple of weeks, but i think people will look at that and say, ok. — think people will look at that and say, ok, that was solid. tory party members — say, ok, that was solid. tory party members seem to like it. they were

clapping _ members seem to like it. they were clapping when he talked about the tax cuts _ clapping when he talked about the tax cuts and the supply—side reform, no details _ tax cuts and the supply—side reform, no details on — tax cuts and the supply—side reform, no details on what they are going to look like. _ no details on what they are going to look like, when they are actually going _ look like, when they are actually going to — look like, when they are actually going to be done, but i imagine he would _ going to be done, but i imagine he would be _ going to be done, but i imagine he would be pretty happy with how that went _ would be pretty happy with how that went. ~ . would be pretty happy with how that went. . ., ., ,., would be pretty happy with how that went. ~ ., ., i. . ., would be pretty happy with how that went. . ., ., y., . ., ., went. what about you, richard? you said fairly early _ went. what about you, richard? you said fairly early on, _ went. what about you, richard? you said fairly early on, i _ went. what about you, richard? you said fairly early on, i know— went. what about you, richard? you said fairly early on, i know the - said fairly early on, i know the plan, in the mini budget, has caused a bit of turbulence. may be an understatement, some people would say. i get it, though, he says. as it reassured you?— say. i get it, though, he says. as it reassured you? yeah, look, there certainly has _ it reassured you? yeah, look, there certainly has been _ it reassured you? yeah, look, there certainly has been turbulence. - it reassured you? yeah, look, there| certainly has been turbulence. when you look— certainly has been turbulence. when you look at _ certainly has been turbulence. when you look at the — certainly has been turbulence. when you look at the energy _ certainly has been turbulence. when you look at the energy price - certainly has been turbulence. when you look at the energy price cap - certainly has been turbulence. when you look at the energy price cap and | you look at the energy price cap and we talk— you look at the energy price cap and we talk about — you look at the energy price cap and we talk about that, _ you look at the energy price cap and we talk about that, it _ you look at the energy price cap and we talk about that, it is _ we talk about that, it is complicated, _ we talk about that, it is complicated, big - we talk about that, it is complicated, big and l we talk about that, it is - complicated, big and scary. let's keep— complicated, big and scary. let's keep it _ complicated, big and scary. let's keep it simple _ complicated, big and scary. let's keep it simple. my— complicated, big and scary. let's keep it simple. my customers i complicated, big and scary. let'sl keep it simple. my customers and complicated, big and scary. let's- keep it simple. my customers and my constituents, — keep it simple. my customers and my constituents, they— keep it simple. my customers and my constituents, they are _ keep it simple. my customers and my constituents, they are really - constituents, they are really hurting _ constituents, they are really hurting at— constituents, they are really hurting at the _ constituents, they are really hurting at the moment. - constituents, they are really hurting at the moment. in . constituents, they are really - hurting at the moment. in terms of new policies — hurting at the moment. in terms of new policies and _ hurting at the moment. in terms of new policies and whatever - hurting at the moment. in terms of new policies and whatever new- hurting at the moment. in terms of. new policies and whatever new ideas might— new policies and whatever new ideas might be _ new policies and whatever new ideas might be announced, _ new policies and whatever new ideas might be announced, that— new policies and whatever new ideas might be announced, that is- new policies and whatever new ideas might be announced, that is why- new policies and whatever new ideas might be announced, that is why i i might be announced, that is why i keep— might be announced, that is why i keep going — might be announced, that is why i keep going ltack— might be announced, that is why i keep going back to _ might be announced, that is why i keep going back to this _ might be announced, that is why i keep going back to this universall keep going back to this universal credit— keep going back to this universal credit uplift~ _ keep going back to this universal credit uplift. let's _ keep going back to this universal credit uplift. let's try— keep going back to this universal credit uplift. let's try and - keep going back to this universal credit uplift. let's try and help i credit uplift. let's try and help them, — credit uplift. let's try and help them, the _ credit uplift. let's try and help them, the poorest— credit uplift. let's try and help them, the poorest in- credit uplift. let's try and help them, the poorest in the - credit uplift. let's try and help them, the poorest in the uk, i credit uplift. let's try and help . them, the poorest in the uk, the people _ them, the poorest in the uk, the people who — them, the poorest in the uk, the people who are _ them, the poorest in the uk, the people who are the _ them, the poorest in the uk, the people who are the most - them, the poorest in the uk, the - people who are the most vulnerable. let's get _ people who are the most vulnerable. let's get them — people who are the most vulnerable. let's get them through _ people who are the most vulnerable. let's get them through this. - people who are the most vulnerable. let's get them through this. he - let's get them through this. he didn't let's get them through this. didn't talk about spending

let's get them through this.- didn't talk about spending cuts, though. didn't talk about spending cuts, thouuh. , . .. didn't talk about spending cuts, thouuh. , ., ,, ., didn't talk about spending cuts, thouuh. , ., ~ ., , ., though. kept talking about strong ublic though. kept talking about strong public services _ though. kept talking about strong public services come _ though. kept talking about strong public services come to _ though. kept talking about strong public services come to grow - though. kept talking about strong public services come to grow the l public services come to grow the economy. public services come to grow the econom . ., ., ., ,, public services come to grow the econom . ., ., ., , , ., economy. you would assume that he will have to — economy. you would assume that he will have to do _ economy. you would assume that he will have to do that _ economy. you would assume that he will have to do that somehow, - will have to do that somehow, assuming he is not going to put up taxes. the idea of public spending and particularly the welfare bill, what they will do about that. ministers are absolutely considering not raising most of those benefits in line with inflation. that is still paying to come, potentially, for lots of people. we will bring you that when we hear any announcement. we mentioned turbulence. let's talk to dharshini david, the bbc economic respondent. we talked earlier about the turbulence in the markets. their response, ten days ago. the response, ten days ago. the response, following the u—turn this morning on the top rate of tax. it won't be cut after all. what about the response to this speech? yes. won't be out after all. what about the response to this speech? yes, we soke the response to this speech? yes, we spoke about — the response to this speech? yes, we spoke about the _ the response to this speech? yes, we spoke about the fact _ the response to this speech? yes, we spoke about the fact that _ the response to this speech? yes, we spoke about the fact that ten - the response to this speech? yes, we spoke about the fact that ten days - spoke about the fact that ten days ago, during that so—called mini budget, we saw the kind of movements in the currency markets, the bond

markets, that you never normally see during a fiscal event. what of today? let's not forget, the things the market are looking for. they are concerned because of the scale of the tax cuts, how they are going to be funded and ultimately, what this means for growth and inflation. we saw the pound actually slipping ever so slightly. why is that? when we talk about the u—turn on the 45p rate, it is a tiny proportion of the tax cuts. £2 billion out of £1i5 billion. what the market are looking for, is this the start of a u—turn? there is no indication that is the case. stirling are still hovering around. we shouldn't forget that the dollar is having a weaker day. all sorts of things going on. the bond markets, again, a bit more relaxed. but they too, lots of heightened uncertainty there.— but they too, lots of heightened uncertainty there. dharshini david, ou will be uncertainty there. dharshini david, you will be keeping _ uncertainty there. dharshini david, you will be keeping across - uncertainty there. dharshini david, you will be keeping across this - uncertainty there. dharshini david, you will be keeping across this for| you will be keeping across this for the rest of the day. thank you for joining us. i think we are going to be hearing from chris philpott,

hopefully we are going to see him and he willjoin us on set, the chief secretary to the treasury, to answer questions about what has changed. first of all, let's get a reaction from labour. we don't always speak to the shadow cabinet, or a member of the shadow cabinet, during tory party conference on the chancellor's speech day, but there has been a change in a fundamental piece of policy. we want to get their reaction. rachel reeves is the shadow chancellor us now. do you welcome the reversal of the 45p tax cut? , ., ., ., welcome the reversal of the 45p tax cut? ,., ., ., , ,., cut? good to be with you. the roblem cut? good to be with you. the problem is — cut? good to be with you. the problem is that _ cut? good to be with you. the problem is that so _ cut? good to be with you. the problem is that so much - cut? good to be with you. the i problem is that so much damage cut? good to be with you. the - problem is that so much damage has already been done. when the chancellor delivered his financial statement, we saw huge volatility in financial markets and a big spike in borrowing costs, notjust for the government, although that is significant, but also for ordinary families. if you have a mortgage of £200,000 a year, and you are looking to refinance, if interest rates go up to refinance, if interest rates go up from around 2%, which is where

many, many people are paying at the moment, up to 6%, that is hundreds of pounds, almost £700 extra per month, because of what the chancellor did in his statement. and the increase in borrowing costs haven't gone away, even with that u—turn today. so, the damage is being felt by ordinary working people. it's a crisis made in downing street, but it is ordinary, working people that are paying the price for this. working people that are paying the price for thia— price for this. rachel reeves, labour supports _ price for this. rachel reeves, labour supports much, - price for this. rachel reeves, labour supports much, in - price for this. rachel reeves, j labour supports much, in fact price for this. rachel reeves, - labour supports much, in fact the bulk of, you could argue, of the tax—cutting measures. now, it is true, you didn't want to see the cut in the 45p tax rate. it is now going to go back. you wanted to use the money from that to fund nurses and school business elite breakfast clubs. that money is accounted for in the fiscal plan. how are you going to fund the extra nurses you have committed to end meals for schools in england? n have committed to end meals for schools in england?— have committed to end meals for schools in england? i have always been clear— schools in england? i have always been clear there _ schools in england? i have always been clear there is _ schools in england? i have always been clear there is nothing - schools in england? i have always been clear there is nothing in - been clear there is nothing in labour's manifesto that is not fully funded and costed. let me explain

how we will pay for the doctors, nurses and breakfast clubs i spoke about at conference last week. i welcome the fact that the government are no longer going ahead with the 45p tax changes. 0ne are no longer going ahead with the 45p tax changes. one thing the government haven't done is abolish the non—dom tax status. i said earlier this year that if you make britain your home, you should pay your taxes here. new evidence from warwick university economists shows that abolishing the non—dom tax status would bring in £3.2 billion per year to the treasury. the changes i announced last week at conference are doctors, nurses and breakfast clubs would cost £2 billion per year. we would use that money by getting rid of that tax loophole, which means some of the wealthiest people who live in britain are not paying their taxes here. they will have to pay their fair share. that money will be used to fund that expansion of medical school places, more nurses and midwives, health visitors and district nurses, and breakfast clubs for children at primary school.

rachel reeves, shadow chancellor, thank you forjoining us today. in response to kwasi kwarteng's speech, that 45p cut in the top rate of tax was meant to deliver growth. that was meant to deliver growth. that was what we were told. what are you going to do to make up for the growth that you have lost by abandoning that policy? the 45p measure was — abandoning that policy? the 45p measure was less _ abandoning that policy? the 45p measure was less than - abandoning that policy? the 45p measure was less than 596 - abandoning that policy? the 45p measure was less than 596 of - abandoning that policy? the 45p| measure was less than 596 of the measure was less than 5% of the fiscal— measure was less than 5% of the fiscal measures in that growth plan, so it wasn't— fiscal measures in that growth plan, so it wasn't a central part of it. clearly— so it wasn't a central part of it. clearly there was huge opposition as you have _ clearly there was huge opposition as you have probably reported, and it became _ you have probably reported, and it became a — you have probably reported, and it became a distraction, an obstacle to getting _ became a distraction, an obstacle to getting our— became a distraction, an obstacle to getting our message through and delivering the growth plan, and that is why— delivering the growth plan, and that is why the _ delivering the growth plan, and that is why the prime minister... how much less _ is why the prime minister... how much less growth _ is why the prime minister... how much less growth are _ is why the prime minister... how much less growth are you going to get by abandoning the policy? we are auoin to get by abandoning the policy? we are going to deliver— get by abandoning the policy? we are going to deliver a _ get by abandoning the policy? we are going to deliver a 2.596 _ get by abandoning the policy? we are going to deliver a 2.596 growth - get by abandoning the policy? we are going to deliver a 2.596 growth rate, | going to deliver a 2.5% growth rate, we will— going to deliver a 2.5% growth rate, we will stick — going to deliver a 2.5% growth rate, we will stick to that target. the top rate — we will stick to that target. the top rate measure was less than one 20th, _ top rate measure was less than one 20th. less — top rate measure was less than one 20th, less than 5% of the measures in that— 20th, less than 5% of the measures

in that plan — 20th, less than 5% of the measures in that plan. the chancellor made very clear— in that plan. the chancellor made very clear exactly how we are going to get _ very clear exactly how we are going to get to _ very clear exactly how we are going to get to that growth rate. we are going _ to get to that growth rate. we are going to _ to get to that growth rate. we are going to lower taxes for people and businesses, we are going to deregulate, make sure infrastructure -ets deregulate, make sure infrastructure gets built, _ deregulate, make sure infrastructure gets built, make sure our energy production— gets built, make sure our energy production is in the united kingdom not overseas, and if we do those things. _ not overseas, and if we do those things. we — not overseas, and if we do those things, we will deliver that high—growth and that will lead to higher— high—growth and that will lead to higher wages. high—growth and that will lead to higherwages. but high-growth and that will lead to higher wages-— high-growth and that will lead to hitcherwaes. �* ., , ., higher wages. but that is a huge if. we heard kwasi _ higher wages. but that is a huge if. we heard kwasi kwarteng - higher wages. but that is a huge if. we heard kwasi kwarteng say - higher wages. but that is a huge if. we heard kwasi kwarteng say in . higher wages. but that is a huge if. | we heard kwasi kwarteng say in that speech praising the bank of england, the independent bank of england and the independent bank of england and the office for responsibility, but of course we don't know if any of your plans are going to add up, or that 2.5% elusive growth is going to happen, because we have nothing to judge you want. we have still no scrutiny, no figures, no forecasts, so you can forgive your critics for saying, why should we believe in anything you say? you have you turned on a policy within ten days, what else might you u—turn on? it is what else might you u-turn on? it is a [an has what else might you u—turn on? it is a plan has specific steps and specific— a plan has specific steps and specific measures. you won't have lon- specific measures. you won't have long to _ specific measures. you won't have long to wait — specific measures. you won't have long to wait for the 0br forecast. the end _ long to wait for the 0br forecast.

the end of— long to wait for the 0br forecast. the end of november. we long to wait for the obr forecast. the end of november.— long to wait for the obr forecast. the end of november. we have to make sure that all _ the end of november. we have to make sure that all of — the end of november. we have to make sure that all of the _ the end of november. we have to make sure that all of the policy _ the end of november. we have to make sure that all of the policy is _ the end of november. we have to make sure that all of the policy is on - sure that all of the policy is on the supply side, so reducing regulations that are fully laid out so the _ regulations that are fully laid out so the 0br can take them into consideration, and we have also got to set— consideration, and we have also got to set out— consideration, and we have also got to set out the medium term fiscal plan, _ to set out the medium term fiscal plan, that— to set out the medium term fiscal plan, that responsible approach we are going _ plan, that responsible approach we are going to take to reducing the ratio _ are going to take to reducing the ratio of— are going to take to reducing the ratio of debt to gdp, all of that will come — ratio of debt to gdp, all of that will come together on the 23rd of november. will come together on the 23rd of november-— will come together on the 23rd of november. ,, ., , ., ., ., ., november. should you have done that before the mini _ november. should you have done that before the mini budget? _ november. should you have done that before the mini budget? we _ november. should you have done that before the mini budget? we think - before the mini budget? we think caettin on before the mini budget? we think getting on with — before the mini budget? we think getting on with growth _ before the mini budget? we think getting on with growth is - before the mini budget? we think l getting on with growth is important. there _ getting on with growth is important. there are _ getting on with growth is important. there are things we want to signal to the _ there are things we want to signal to the market like lower taxes on the supply— to the market like lower taxes on the supply side measures we have announced. the energy package i don't _ announced. the energy package i don't think— announced. the energy package i don't think frankly could wait, that started _ don't think frankly could wait, that started on— don't think frankly could wait, that started on the ist of october. we started on the 1st of october. we knew that started on the ist of october. , knew that was coming. started on the 1st of october. we knew that was coming. that - started on the 1st of october. we knew that was coming. that was | started on the 1st of october. we | knew that was coming. that was a started on the 1st of october. we - knew that was coming. that was a day or two a . o knew that was coming. that was a day or two ago and — knew that was coming. that was a day or two ago and that _ knew that was coming. that was a day or two ago and that is _ knew that was coming. that was a day or two ago and that is saving - or two ago and that is saving households who would have faced bills of— households who would have faced bills of up — households who would have faced bills of up to £7,000, they won't be paying _ bills of up to £7,000, they won't be paying those bills thanks to liz truss _ paying those bills thanks to liz truss and _ paying those bills thanks to liz truss and kwasi kwarteng. instead an of the truss and kwasi kwarteng. instead any of the money _ truss and kwasi kwarteng. instead any of the money that _ truss and kwasi kwarteng. instead any of the money that they - truss and kwasi kwarteng. instead any of the money that they are - truss and kwasi kwarteng. instead i any of the money that they are going to get back either through the energy intervention or some of the tax cuts is going to be wiped out by mortgage repayments that are going to soar. they are already rising, they have risen as a result of the

mini budget announcement. people who are already struggling with the cost of living, a typical two—year fisc mortgage deal that had a rate of 2.4% is mortgage deal that had a rate of 2.1i% is now priced at 5.75%. how will people make those payments? for the last nine or 12 months, mortgage rates _ the last nine or 12 months, mortgage rates across — the last nine or 12 months, mortgage rates across the world have been increasing, — rates across the world have been increasing, and they have been increasing _ increasing, and they have been increasing more in the united statesm _ increasing more in the united states... , . , increasing more in the united states... , ., , ., , increasing more in the united states... , ., , states... this was as a result, the real-life consequence _ states... this was as a result, the real-life consequence of - states... this was as a result, the real-life consequence of what - states... this was as a result, the real-life consequence of what you j real—life consequence of what you announced in that mini budget. figs real—life consequence of what you announced in that mini budget. fissi announced in that mini budget. as i sa , announced in that mini budget. as i say. mortgage _ announced in that mini budget. as i say, mortgage rates have been rising. — say, mortgage rates have been rising, they form an important part of a wider— rising, they form an important part of a wider cost of living challenge, so you _ of a wider cost of living challenge, so you might ask the question what are we _ so you might ask the question what are we doing about that, and what we are we doing about that, and what we are doing _ are we doing about that, and what we are doing about the wider cost of living _ are doing about the wider cost of living challenge, much of which goes back to _ living challenge, much of which goes back to putin's illegal invasion of ukraine, — back to putin's illegal invasion of ukraine, we are making sure the energy— ukraine, we are making sure the energy prices which could have gone up energy prices which could have gone up to— energy prices which could have gone up to £7,000 are not going to. we are going _ up to £7,000 are not going to. we are going to— up to £7,000 are not going to. we are going to alleviate the burden of taxation— are going to alleviate the burden of taxation which people pay, and the taxation which people pay, and the tax measures in the growth plan a broadly— tax measures in the growth plan a broadly based, all of the 30 million

working _ broadly based, all of the 30 million working people will benefit from the national _ working people will benefit from the national insurance cut and the cut to the _ national insurance cut and the cut to the basic rate, rich and poor alike _ to the basic rate, rich and poor alike will— to the basic rate, rich and poor alike will benefit from those reductions, and that will help with the cost _ reductions, and that will help with the cost of— reductions, and that will help with the cost of living situation, and most _ the cost of living situation, and most of — the cost of living situation, and most of all the answer to your question— most of all the answer to your question is growth, because without growth, _ question is growth, because without growth, we — question is growth, because without growth, we are not going to see rising _ growth, we are not going to see rising wages. the growth, we are not going to see rising wages-— rising wages. the supply-side reforms that _ rising wages. the supply-side reforms that we _ rising wages. the supply-side reforms that we were - rising wages. the supply-side reforms that we were talking l rising wages. the supply-side - reforms that we were talking about before kwasi kwarteng took to his feet, he mentioned them again in the way that you have just done. he said stripping eu laws from the uk. which bits? , ., ., , ., bits? there is going to be a full review of all _ bits? there is going to be a full review of all of _ bits? there is going to be a full review of all of those. - bits? there is going to be a full review of all of those. but - bits? there is going to be a full| review of all of those. but which bits? i'm review of all of those. but which bits? l'm rrot — review of all of those. but which bits? i'm not going _ review of all of those. but which bits? i'm not going to _ review of all of those. but which bits? i'm not going to pre-emptj review of all of those. but which - bits? i'm not going to pre-empt the result of that _ bits? i'm not going to pre-empt the result of that review. _ bits? i'm not going to pre-empt the result of that review. so _ bits? i'm not going to pre-empt the result of that review. so how- bits? i'm not going to pre-empt the result of that review. so how can i bits? i'm not going to pre-empt the| result of that review. so how can we 'ud . e if result of that review. so how can we judge if that — result of that review. so how can we judge if that is _ result of that review. so how can we judge if that is going _ result of that review. so how can we judge if that is going to _ result of that review. so how can we judge if that is going to help - result of that review. so how can we judge if that is going to help the - judge if that is going to help the growth? in judge if that is going to help the urowth? , ., growth? in the next six to eight weeks, growth? in the next six to eight weeks. there — growth? in the next six to eight weeks, there will— growth? in the next six to eight weeks, there will be _ growth? in the next six to eight weeks, there will be about - growth? in the next six to eight| weeks, there will be about eight announcements by different secretaries of state spelling out the supply—side reforms in more detail, _ the supply—side reforms in more detail, and — the supply—side reforms in more detail, and i can give you one or two examples. jacob rees—mogg is business _ two examples. jacob rees—mogg is business secretary is going to set out how— business secretary is going to set out how we will alleviate small business — out how we will alleviate small business regulations, particularly on businesses with under 500

employees. we will hear from the transport — employees. we will hear from the transport secretary about expediting infrastructure projects. we will hear— infrastructure projects. we will hear from _ infrastructure projects. we will hear from the desperate secretary about _ hear from the desperate secretary about how — hear from the desperate secretary about how we can help farmers become more -- _ about how we can help farmers become more -- the _ about how we can help farmers become more —— the defra secretary about how we _ more —— the defra secretary about how we can — more —— the defra secretary about how we can help farmers. but more -- the defra secretary about how we can help farmers. but many of these rules never— how we can help farmers. but many of these rules never got _ how we can help farmers. but many of these rules never got onto _ how we can help farmers. but many of these rules never got onto the - these rules never got onto the statute books, because they were dropped. you tweeted, yet another property speculator targeting my house thanks to the labour council handing out planning permissions so freely. i thought you wanted to have freedom for planning permissions. bromley and sutton look after the character of their area, same national rules. croydon labour has turned our borough into a magnet for speculators. so in public you want to regulations and freedom for planning, but not perhaps on your doorstep? edi planning, but not perhaps on your doorste - ? _, , planning, but not perhaps on your doorste - ? .., , .,, planning, but not perhaps on your doorste - ? _, , .,, .,, doorstep? of course development has to be a priority. _ doorstep? of course development has to be a priority, and _ doorstep? of course development has to be a priority, and suburbs - doorstep? of course development has to be a priority, and suburbs like - to be a priority, and suburbs like that all— to be a priority, and suburbs like that all the — to be a priority, and suburbs like that all the green frankly... not in our back that all the green frankly... not in your back yard? — that all the green frankly... not in your back yard? not _ that all the green frankly... not in your back yard? not in _ that all the green frankly... not in your back yard? not in any - your back yard? not in any inappropriate _ your back yard? not in any inappropriate areas -

your back yard? not in any inappropriate areas in - your back yard? not in any inappropriate areas in the | your back yard? not in any - inappropriate areas in the country. we want _ inappropriate areas in the country. we want to— inappropriate areas in the country. we want to see development in the film we want to see development in the right places, brownfield sites, investment zones that we have talked about, _ investment zones that we have talked about, which will be agreed with local— about, which will be agreed with local authorities, they will be a red line — local authorities, they will be a red line on— local authorities, they will be a red line on a map, within those investments own standby agreement they will— investments own standby agreement they will be greater planning freedoms and local taxes. we don't want to— freedoms and local taxes. we don't want to see — freedoms and local taxes. we don't want to see projects held up with endless — want to see projects held up with endlessjudicial want to see projects held up with endless judicial reviews and endless delays _ endless judicial reviews and endless delays. there is nothing inconsistent in that position. i inconsistent in that position. think inconsistent in that position. i think people might make a judgment about the inconsistency. abs, think people might make a 'udgment about the inconsistency._ about the inconsistency. a question for ou. about the inconsistency. a question for you- we — about the inconsistency. a question for you. we have _ about the inconsistency. a question for you. we have this _ about the inconsistency. a question for you. we have this event - about the inconsistency. a question for you. we have this event on - for you. we have this event on november the 23rd which is about adding credence to what the government is saying in terms of adding fiscal responsibility. any chance that will be brought forward? that is still a long time away, and you have said we have got to wait for the obr to do the sums, but they came to the government in the summer and said that they could have done the sums in time for the event last time, so i'm sure they can do it before an event that is almost two months away. the before an event that is almost two months away-— before an event that is almost two months away. the focus needs to be u dated to months away. the focus needs to be updated to reflect _ months away. the focus needs to be updated to reflect the _ months away. the focus needs to be updated to reflect the new _ months away. the focus needs to be updated to reflect the new policy - updated to reflect the new policy that is _ updated to reflect the new policy that is announced, it takes time for the 0br— that is announced, it takes time for the obr to — that is announced, it takes time for the 0br to respond to that. it

the 0br to respond to that. doesn't the 0br to respond to that. it doesn't take two months. the obr to respond to that. it doesn't take two months. we | the obr to respond to that. it - doesn't take two months. we also need to set _ doesn't take two months. we also need to set out _ doesn't take two months. we also need to set out the _ doesn't take two months. we also need to set out the medium-termj need to set out the medium—term fiscal— need to set out the medium—term fiscal plan— need to set out the medium—term fiscal plan that the chancellor referred — fiscal plan that the chancellor referred to, so we do need to get this right, — referred to, so we do need to get this right, it— referred to, so we do need to get this right, it is fair to say that as a _ this right, it is fair to say that as a lesson _ this right, it is fair to say that as a lesson one might take and time to make _ as a lesson one might take and time to make sure it is all set out so that— to make sure it is all set out so that when— to make sure it is all set out so that whenjo and to make sure it is all set out so that when jo and her colleagues ask me questions, we are already, so we are going _ me questions, we are already, so we are going to— me questions, we are already, so we are going to do this right and in a way that— are going to do this right and in a way that is— are going to do this right and in a way that is fiscally responsible and in a way— way that is fiscally responsible and in a way that gets the economy growing. — in a way that gets the economy growing, because that will lead to higher wages, growing, because that will lead to higherwages, betterjobs and higher wages, better jobs and sustainable higherwages, betterjobs and sustainable taxes. i higher wages, better 'obs and sustainable taxes._ higher wages, better 'obs and sustainable taxes. i was 'ust going to sa , sustainable taxes. i was 'ust going to say. was — sustainable taxes. i was 'ust going to say. was it h sustainable taxes. i was 'ust going to say. was it a h sustainable taxes. i was 'ust going to say, was it a mistake _ sustainable taxes. i wasjust going to say, was it a mistake not - sustainable taxes. i wasjust going to say, was it a mistake not to - sustainable taxes. i wasjust going l to say, was it a mistake not to have that in place? was it a mistake not to have the obr forecasts there? to liz truss herself and said we should have laid the ground better. that liz truss herself and said we should have laid the ground better.- have laid the ground better. that is a fair comment _ have laid the ground better. that is a fair comment by _ have laid the ground better. that is a fair comment by the _ have laid the ground better. that is a fair comment by the prime - a fair comment by the prime minister. _ a fair comment by the prime minister, but there was an urgent conversation where people's prices were soaring, we took that of the table. _ were soaring, we took that of the table. we — were soaring, we took that of the table, we protected hassles from bills that — table, we protected hassles from bills that could have gone as high as £7,000. there was an urgency in laying _ as £7,000. there was an urgency in laying out _ as £7,000. there was an urgency in laying out the growth plan because we want _ laying out the growth plan because we want to get the country growing as quickly— we want to get the country growing as quickly as possible, sol we want to get the country growing as quickly as possible, so i don't think— as quickly as possible, so i don't think it — as quickly as possible, so i don't think it is — as quickly as possible, so i don't think it is wrong to do this was a

sense _ think it is wrong to do this was a sense of urgency.— think it is wrong to do this was a sense of urgency. have they been sa inc sense of urgency. have they been saying they _ sense of urgency. have they been saying they want _ sense of urgency. have they been saying they want to _ sense of urgency. have they been saying they want to bring - sense of urgency. have they been saying they want to bring it - saying they want to bring it forward? they have been saying that to us. i forward? they have been saying that to us. .., forward? they have been saying that to us. .. , ., ., ., to us. i can understand that what we need to do — to us. i can understand that what we need to do it — to us. i can understand that what we need to do it properly _ to us. i can understand that what we need to do it properly as _ to us. i can understand that what we need to do it properly as well, - to us. i can understand that what we need to do it properly as well, but . need to do it properly as well, but we have _ need to do it properly as well, but we have been listening and there was obviously— we have been listening and there was obviously a _ we have been listening and there was obviously a lot of complaints, and i'm obviously a lot of complaints, and i'm sure _ obviously a lot of complaints, and i'm sure you — obviously a lot of complaints, and i'm sure you heard as well about 45p and the _ i'm sure you heard as well about 45p and the prime minister listened to that, _ and the prime minister listened to that, so— and the prime minister listened to that, so i— and the prime minister listened to that, so i think it is fair to say that— that, so i think it is fair to say that this — that, so i think it is fair to say that this is _ that, so i think it is fair to say that this is a government that does listen _ that this is a government that does listen and — that this is a government that does listen and does respond when appropriate, but what we are not going _ appropriate, but what we are not going to — appropriate, but what we are not going to do is be diverted from our mission _ going to do is be diverted from our mission which is to get the economy growing _ mission which is to get the economy growing to— mission which is to get the economy growing to benefit everyone in the form of _ growing to benefit everyone in the form of higher wages, betterjobs and more — form of higher wages, betterjobs and more sustainably funded public sector _ and more sustainably funded public sector l _ and more sustainably funded public sector. ~ ., , ., and more sustainably funded public sector. ~ ., ., ., ., ., sector. i know you have got to go in a moment. — sector. i know you have got to go in a moment. but— sector. i know you have got to go in a moment, but before _ sector. i know you have got to go in a moment, but before you - sector. i know you have got to go in a moment, but before you do, - sector. i know you have got to go in a moment, but before you do, you | a moment, but before you do, you mentioned the policy, the reversal of the 45p cut. pippa has tweeted in the guardian, that it was in fact you had the idea, presenting truss and kwarteng. was it you? i was

and kwarteng. was it you? i was asked to present _ and kwarteng. was it you? i was asked to present a _ and kwarteng. was it you? i was asked to present a variation - and kwarteng. was it you? i was asked to present a variation on | asked to present a variation on about— asked to present a variation on about 20 — asked to present a variation on about 20 or 30 different policies for consideration, but it ultimately wasn't _ for consideration, but it ultimately wasn't my— for consideration, but it ultimately wasn't my decision and i wasn't advocating _ wasn't my decision and i wasn't advocating particularly for this. i certainly— advocating particularly for this. i certainly didn't write a paper on this specific policy. 30 certainly didn't write a paper on this specific policy.— this specific policy. so was it a bad idea? _ this specific policy. so was it a bad idea? as _ this specific policy. so was it a bad idea? as i _ this specific policy. so was it a bad idea? as i have _ this specific policy. so was it a bad idea? as i have been - this specific policy. so was it a - bad idea? as i have been explaining in studios, i'm not— bad idea? as i have been explaining in studios, i'm not sure _ bad idea? as i have been explaining in studios, i'm not sure if _ in studios, i'm not sure if including— in studios, i'm not sure if including yours, there are economic grounds _ including yours, there are economic grounds to— including yours, there are economic grounds to do this. i'm just trying to give _ grounds to do this. i'm just trying to give a — grounds to do this. i'm just trying to give a straight answer to the question — to give a straight answer to the question. there are good economic grounds _ question. there are good economic grounds to— question. there are good economic grounds to do this. it question. there are good economic grounds to do this.— grounds to do this. it was a good idea that you _ grounds to do this. it was a good idea that you couldn't _ grounds to do this. it was a good idea that you couldn't get - grounds to do this. it was a good i idea that you couldn't get through? let me finish answering the question. there are good economic grounds, _ question. there are good economic grounds, to— question. there are good economic grounds, to encourage people to locate _ grounds, to encourage people to locate into this country and make us competitive, but labour had this as the 13 years, but as you would have picked up talking to mp5, the public, — picked up talking to mp5, the public, it— picked up talking to mp5, the public, it didn't command public support— public, it didn't command public support or— public, it didn't command public support or parliamentary support, and so _ support or parliamentary support, and so because the government is one that listens, _ and so because the government is one that listens, we responded to that. it a that listens, we responded to that. it a from _ that listens, we responded to that. it a from what is a fantastic fantastic— it a from what is a fantastic fantastic wider growth plan, so the prime _ fantastic wider growth plan, so the prime minister rightly decided to remove — prime minister rightly decided to remove it. but there were economic

reasons— remove it. but there were economic reasons for— remove it. but there were economic reasons for it, political reality intervened and we responded. that is how a _ intervened and we responded. that is how a democracy and particularly a parliamentary democracy works. good a ou to parliamentary democracy works. good a you to come — parliamentary democracy works. good a you to come and _ parliamentary democracy works. good a you to come and join _ parliamentary democracy works. (13cm a you to come and join us. we will let you go. richard, listening to all of that. particularly on this supply side, are you confident that government is going to be able to get out of the way of business to let you invest and grow? i get out of the way of business to let you invest and grow?- get out of the way of business to let you invest and grow? i think the intent is right. _ let you invest and grow? i think the intent is right. they _ let you invest and grow? i think the intent is right. they are _ let you invest and grow? i think the intent is right. they are on - let you invest and grow? i think the intent is right. they are on the - intent is right. they are on the right track. but as a banker friend of mine, i asked why on earth at the markets in meltdown, because after all that is only £2 billion, so why is evelyn falling apart around us? they have stabilised. thea;r is evelyn falling apart around us? they have stabilised.— is evelyn falling apart around us? they have stabilised. they have, so there is a bit _ they have stabilised. they have, so there is a bit of— they have stabilised. they have, so there is a bit of noise, _ they have stabilised. they have, so there is a bit of noise, but - they have stabilised. they have, so there is a bit of noise, but he - they have stabilised. they have, so there is a bit of noise, but he said l there is a bit of noise, but he said they didn't provide the modelling. they need to show exactly how they are going to do this, and the sooner the better, and i think that will stabilise the markets.-

stabilise the markets. there is still a flaw _ stabilise the markets. there is still a flaw with _ stabilise the markets. there is still a flaw with this _ stabilise the markets. there is still a flaw with this because i stabilise the markets. there is l still a flaw with this because the bank— still a flaw with this because the bank of— still a flaw with this because the bank of england made that huge intervention. the bank of england made that huge intervention.— intervention. the £65 billion for pensions- _ intervention. the £65 billion for pensions. the _ intervention. the £65 billion for pensions. the funding - intervention. the £65 billion for pensions. the funding for - intervention. the £65 billion for pensions. the funding for that l intervention. the £65 billion for| pensions. the funding for that is awoin to pensions. the funding for that is going to come — pensions. the funding for that is going to come to _ pensions. the funding for that is going to come to an _ pensions. the funding for that is going to come to an end - pensions. the funding for that is going to come to an end on - pensions. the funding for that is l going to come to an end on about pensions. the funding for that is - going to come to an end on about the 10th of— going to come to an end on about the 10th of october, and that will be another— 10th of october, and that will be another crunch point, and i think this point— another crunch point, and i think this point we are talking about, vicki. _ this point we are talking about, vicki. this — this point we are talking about, vicki, this fiscal event, i think there — vicki, this fiscal event, i think there will— vicki, this fiscal event, i think there will be huge pressure from mps, _ there will be huge pressure from mps, because when you hit 0ctober mps, because when you hit october the 10th. _ mps, because when you hit october the 10th, there could be a question on have _ the 10th, there could be a question on have the — the 10th, there could be a question on have the markets got confidence in kwasi _ on have the markets got confidence in kwasi kwarteng, and the only real way to— in kwasi kwarteng, and the only real way to solve that is to show the sums — way to solve that is to show the sums. �* , ., , way to solve that is to show the sums. . , ., , ., sums. and they are relying on the obr coming _ sums. and they are relying on the obr coming up — sums. and they are relying on the obr coming up with _ sums. and they are relying on the obr coming up with the _ sums. and they are relying on the obr coming up with the right - sums. and they are relying on the - obr coming up with the right answer. this is all reliant on the obr saying that this will produce the growth. they have to look at the sums, and then what happens. band growth. they have to look at the sums, and then what happens. and one other example. — sums, and then what happens. and one other example, when _ sums, and then what happens. and one other example, when you _ sums, and then what happens. and one other example, when you say _ sums, and then what happens. and one other example, when you say they - other example, when you say they have got to find ways to find that growth, fracking, for example. they have lifted the ban, but when will it start? there was no definition about what sort of public consent would look like in terms of allowing the six to go ahead. bhd

would look like in terms of allowing the six to go ahead.— the six to go ahead. and on the frinwes the six to go ahead. and on the fringes of _ the six to go ahead. and on the fringes of this _ the six to go ahead. and on the fringes of this conference, - the six to go ahead. and on the | fringes of this conference, every cabinet — fringes of this conference, every cabinet minister is being asked, would _ cabinet minister is being asked, would you — cabinet minister is being asked, would you like fracking to be next door to _ would you like fracking to be next door to you, and the idea they were saying _ door to you, and the idea they were saying they— door to you, and the idea they were saying they want to bring it back, but we _ saying they want to bring it back, but we local consent, is essentially not bringing it back at all. it not bringing it back at all. won't not bringing it back at all. it won't happen at all because it requires — won't happen at all because it requires local— won't happen at all because it requires local consent. - won't happen at all because it requires local consent.- requires local consent. jacob rees-mogg _ requires local consent. jacob rees-mogg has _ requires local consent. jacob rees-mogg has said - requires local consent. jacob rees-mogg has said that - requires local consent. jacob rees-mogg has said that it i requires local consentm rees—mogg has said that it would requires local consent.m_ rees—mogg has said that it would be done on local consent. do you think local people will have the confidence in local people carrying out the surveys? i confidence in local people carrying out the surveys?— out the surveys? i think not, but the will out the surveys? i think not, but they will need _ out the surveys? i think not, but they will need a _ out the surveys? i think not, but they will need a sweetener - out the surveys? i think not, but they will need a sweetener in . out the surveys? i think not, but i they will need a sweetener in some way, but there was talk about could they get reductions in their own bills if you had this kind of thing happening. it doesn't feel workable, certainly... it happening. it doesn't feel workable, certainl , , ., certainly... it is diminishing or anywhere _ certainly... it is diminishing or anywhere in — certainly... it is diminishing or anywhere in terms _ certainly... it is diminishing or anywhere in terms of - certainly... it is diminishing or anywhere in terms of the - certainly... it is diminishing or. anywhere in terms of the global energy— anywhere in terms of the global energy pricing _ anywhere in terms of the global energy pricing do— anywhere in terms of the global energy pricing-— energy pricing. do you think liz truss and _ energy pricing. do you think liz truss and kwasi _ energy pricing. do you think liz truss and kwasi kwarteng - energy pricing. do you think liz truss and kwasi kwarteng willl energy pricing. do you think liz i truss and kwasi kwarteng will feel that they have managed to stabilise the mood? difficult because you have been sat here with me, but do you think that they will feel that they have managed not to make any further

news with that particular speech, they hope, and that the jitters in they hope, and that the jitters in the conservative party looking at polls that put labour 17—33 points ahead, that those have calmed? i ahead, that those have calmed? i think that this will have cauterise the wound — think that this will have cauterise the wound somewhat, that had they not dealt _ the wound somewhat, that had they not dealt with the 45p issue, it would — not dealt with the 45p issue, it would have got to dangerous levels, but the _ would have got to dangerous levels, but the challenge they now have is that the _ but the challenge they now have is that the rebels, michael gove and grant _ that the rebels, michael gove and grant shapps who moved against this measure. _ grant shapps who moved against this measure, they will move onto the next thing — measure, they will move onto the next thing. the corporation tax, are you going _ next thing. the corporation tax, are you going to— next thing. the corporation tax, are you going to give businesses a £17 billion— you going to give businesses a £17 billion tax— you going to give businesses a £17 billion tax cut when you can't race benefits? — billion tax cut when you can't race benefits? what about bankers bonuses? the fact is the conservative parliamentary party is pretty— conservative parliamentary party is pretty ungovernable at the moment. liz truss _ pretty ungovernable at the moment. liz truss did not win with more than half the _ liz truss did not win with more than half the mp5, and they are very much going _ half the mp5, and they are very much going to _ half the mp5, and they are very much going to keep on this war, so a bit of peace _ going to keep on this war, so a bit of peace for— going to keep on this war, so a bit of peace for now, but i don't think the long — of peace for now, but i don't think the long lt— of peace for now, but i don't think the lonw. ., , of peace for now, but i don't think the lonw. .,, , of peace for now, but i don't think the lonw. , ., of peace for now, but i don't think the lon. , ., , of peace for now, but i don't think thelon.. , ., , , ,, the long. it has been a very busy 24 hours here — the long. it has been a very busy 24 hours here at _ the long. it has been a very busy 24 hours here at the _ the long. it has been a very busy 24 hours here at the conference. - the long. it has been a very busy 24| hours here at the conference. thank you very much to my guests who have joined me for kwasi kwarteng's speech. that's all for today,

but i will be back tomorrow with more politics live from the conservative party conference, at 12:15 here on bbc two and on bbc iplayer. have a very good rest of the afternoon. goodbye.

this is bbc news. the headlines the chancellor says he's had a "tough day" as he addresses the conservative party conference — just hours after abandoning plans to cut the top rate of tax for the highest earners. the uk faces a 'significant risk�* of gas shortages this winter — according the energy regulator 0fgem. it could lead to supplies being cut to power stations — which use gas to generate electricity. a man's been remanded in custody

after appearing in court — charged with the murder of nine—year—old