this is bbc news. i'm annita mcveigh. the headlines at 9:003m... around 20,000 ambulance workers in england and wales, are striking for a second time over pay and staffing. health bosses warn of the impact to the nhs, but unions say the most urgent cases will be covered. a sense of deja vu in wales as a strikes resume and even with the prospect of a one—off payment put on the table by the welsh government, it's unlikely it will prevent further strike action in the future. in scotland, exams are being rescheduled as secondary teachers

strike in an ongoing dispute about pay. rail unions are appearing before a committee of mps this morning — with little sign of their long running dispute over pay and conditions being resolved. we'll bring you live coverage of that committee hearing at 9.30. counterterrorism police investigate how scrap metal containing traces of uranium arrived at london's heathrow airport last month. a star—studded comeback for the golden globes in hollywood, as colin farrell picks up the best actor award for the dark comedy the banshees of inisherin. good morning and welcome to bbc news. thousands of ambulance workers in england and wales are walking out for the second time this winter in a dispute over pay. managers have warned the impact is likely to be worse than that of the strike held before christmas, saying pressure facing the nhs means

it's in a more precarious position. in total, around 20,000 ambulance workers, including call handlers and ambulance dispatchers, are going on strike. two thirds of ambulance staff from the gmb and unison unions are involved in the industrial action. but bosses say they will still respond to the most urgent calls. gareth barlow reports. it's the second walk—out by ambulance staff this winter. workers, including paramedics, emergency care assistants, ambulance technicians, other 999 crew and control room staff across england and wales, are striking over pay, with nhs managers warning this round of action will be more severe than the last. more than 20,000 ambulance workers across england and wales are due to walk out. only the east of england ambulance service and the isle of wight nhs trust are unaffected.

the strike will involve all staff, including paramedics and call handlers who are unison or gmb members. between them, the two unions represent about two thirds of ambulance workers. some of the walk—outs started at midnight, but the duration and scale of disruption will vary across different parts of england and wales. services in scotland and northern ireland are unaffected. and where walk—outs do take place, categoryi calls for immediately life—threatening emergencies, such as cardiac arrest, will be covered. but not every emergency in the next category down will receive an ambulance response. our main focus is making sure that those people who have life—threatening illnesses have safe services, and that's why i am confident in saying to the public, ring 999. that is the most important message i can give. there will be disruption on the strike day. that is going to be inevitable. and so if you don't have a life—threatening illness, but you need an ambulance,

your call handler may advise you that you may have to wait longer than normal for an ambulance, or that you may have to make your own way to hospital. despite those reassurances, the government has warned that a national deal to agree a minimum level of cover hasn't been agreed, with crews already struggling to respond on time to calls for emergencies such as heart attacks and strokes. ambulance staff, along with other nhs workers, have been offered a pay rise averaging 4.75%. but unions want an above inflation pay increase, saying that low wages are contributing to staffing issues across the service. despite the strikes, the vital message to the public is, if it is a critical, life—threatening emergency, do still call 999. gareth barlow, bbc news. in a moment we can speak to health correspondent, sharon barbour, who is in gateshead for us, but first let's talk

to our wales correspondent tomos morgan, who is in newport. give us a sense of the likely impact of the industrial action there in wales, and also what the striking workers are saying about emergency cover. it’s workers are saying about emergency cover. �* , . , workers are saying about emergency cover. �*, . , , ., workers are saying about emergency cover. �*, . i, ., ., ., cover. it's really similar to what we had just _ cover. it's really similar to what we had just before _ cover. it's really similar to what we had just before christmas, l cover. it's really similar to what l we had just before christmas, the same union, the gmb union members who are on strike today. they make up who are on strike today. they make up around a quarter of the workforce in wales. we already had a couple of ambulances here in newport already go out. some people had to leave the picket line to staff those calls. it's those red calls that they are going out to, the most serious threat to life calls. so there is an impact. the welsh government, ambulance service and nhs saying that the public should protect themselves by only calling 999 if it is a life—threatening emergency. 0ne is a life—threatening emergency. one of the things that's different in wales is that health is devolved and the money comes from the welsh

government but the majority of their funding for the nhs does come from westminster. 0n funding for the nhs does come from westminster. on monday, first minister mark drakeford said he was going to put a deal on the table to try to avert further strike action, and one of the big parts of that deal was offering a one off payment. those talks will continue with unions tomorrow. crossing over to nathan from the gmb union. what do you make of the one—off payment and do you think talks tomorrow will go any way to averting further strike action or will that potential one—off payment and talks be enough? we welcome the welsh government have called us _ we welcome the welsh government have called us in _ we welcome the welsh government have called us in. it is far better than what's — called us in. it is far better than what's happening within westminster. we are _ what's happening within westminster. we are concerned that this offer being _ we are concerned that this offer being put— we are concerned that this offer being put on the table isjust a one-off— being put on the table isjust a one—off payment, so therefore it's not going — one—off payment, so therefore it's not going to go on people's salaries and on _ not going to go on people's salaries and on the — not going to go on people's salaries and on the 1st of april we are back to the _ and on the 1st of april we are back to the same — and on the 1st of april we are back to the same point. we welcome meeting — to the same point. we welcome meeting them on thursday and we will discuss _ meeting them on thursday and we will discuss those issues. clearly we don't _ discuss those issues. clearly we don't even — discuss those issues. clearly we don't even know what the offer will

be at _ don't even know what the offer will be at the _ don't even know what the offer will be at the moment.— don't even know what the offer will be at the moment. lastly, the welsh government — be at the moment. lastly, the welsh government say _ be at the moment. lastly, the welsh government say this _ be at the moment. lastly, the welsh government say this money - be at the moment. lastly, the welsh government say this money is - be at the moment. lastly, the welsh| government say this money is coming from their own pool of money and the reason they can't offer salary increases is because they don't have the money. they have marginal tax powers but they say it's not enough. do you accept that, do you accept they have a limit and can't do more? we do accept that to a degree. clearly— we do accept that to a degree. clearly they get a budget from westminster. they have to do everything with that budget. potentially if they give it to nhs, they have to take it off another area _ they have to take it off another area. clearly everything does eventually go back to westminster, giving _ eventually go back to westminster, giving the _ eventually go back to westminster, giving the correct budgets in the first place. giving the correct budgets in the first lace. ., ~ giving the correct budgets in the first lace. . ~ i. giving the correct budgets in the first place-— giving the correct budgets in the first lace. ., ~' . ., ~ , first place. thank you, nathan. as nathan mentioned, _ first place. thank you, nathan. as nathan mentioned, talks - first place. thank you, nathan. as nathan mentioned, talks with - first place. thank you, nathan. as nathan mentioned, talks with the | nathan mentioned, talks with the welsh government and unions are due to take place tomorrow but it's difficult to see at the moment if that one—off payment will be enough to prevent any further industrial action from unions in the near future. ., ., ., ,, action from unions in the near future. ., ., ., ~ future. tomos morgan, thank you, from nevvport- _ future. tomos morgan, thank you, from newport. let's _ future. tomos morgan, thank you, from newport. let's go _ future. tomos morgan, thank you, from newport. let's go to - future. tomos morgan, thank you, i from newport. let's go to gateshead and sharon barbour is therefore us.

what is the mood on the picket line there? it’s what is the mood on the picket line there? �* , ., , what is the mood on the picket line there? �*, ., , _, what is the mood on the picket line there? �*, ., , ., ., , there? it's really cold and damp this morning — there? it's really cold and damp this morning but _ there? it's really cold and damp this morning but people - there? it's really cold and damp this morning but people here, l there? it's really cold and damp - this morning but people here, those who came out onto the picket line were angry and determined. around 1000 ambulance strikers today, with unison, and gmb also striking, around 750 across the northeast and yorkshire. i'm next to the ambulances that will respond to any emergency category one calls, as has been agreed with the north east ambulance service. lee, you are one of the paramedics here today and your ambulance is here so what will your ambulance is here so what will your day be like? mr; your ambulance is here so what will vour day be like?— your ambulance is here so what will your day be like?— your day be like? my day will be sent on your day be like? my day will be spent on the — your day be like? my day will be spent on the picket _ your day be like? my day will be spent on the picket line - your day be like? my day will be spent on the picket line but - your day be like? my day will be spent on the picket line but i . your day be like? my day will be | spent on the picket line but i will be responding to life or limb calls. will it— be responding to life or limb calls. will it delay because, you responding from the picket line? he. responding from the picket line? no. the response time will be the same from the _ the response time will be the same from the picket line as any other day _ from the picket line as any other da . g ., , ., from the picket line as any other da . g . , ., ., from the picket line as any other da ., . , ., ., , from the picket line as any other da ., , ., ,, ., day. jane, you have been talking to us this morning _ day. jane, you have been talking to us this morning as _ day. jane, you have been talking to us this morning as to _ day. jane, you have been talking to us this morning as to why - day. jane, you have been talking to us this morning as to why you - day. jane, you have been talking to us this morning as to why you are l us this morning as to why you are here. remind us why it's so

important for you to be on the picket line now. irate important for you to be on the picket line now.— important for you to be on the picket line now. we are standing toaether picket line now. we are standing together as _ picket line now. we are standing together as a — picket line now. we are standing together as a united _ picket line now. we are standing together as a united union - picket line now. we are standing together as a united union to . picket line now. we are standing i together as a united union to make the government— together as a united union to make the government see _ together as a united union to make the government see that _ together as a united union to make the government see that we - together as a united union to make the government see that we need i together as a united union to make - the government see that we need some funding _ the government see that we need some funding for— the government see that we need some funding for the — the government see that we need some funding for the nhs— the government see that we need some funding for the nhs and _ the government see that we need some funding for the nhs and we _ the government see that we need some funding for the nhs and we need - funding for the nhs and we need better— funding for the nhs and we need better paid — funding for the nhs and we need better paid to _ funding for the nhs and we need better paid to retain _ funding for the nhs and we need better paid to retain our- funding for the nhs and we need better paid to retain our staff, i funding for the nhs and we need better paid to retain our staff, to let north — better paid to retain our staff, to let north east _ better paid to retain our staff, to let north east ambulance - better paid to retain our staff, to| let north east ambulance service provides— let north east ambulance service provides the great patient - let north east ambulance service provides the great patient safetyi provides the great patient safety and care that we _ provides the great patient safety and care that we have all these i and care that we have all these years it — and care that we have all these years it is _ and care that we have all these years. it is broken _ and care that we have all these years. it is broken and - and care that we have all these years. it is broken and patients and care that we have all these - years. it is broken and patients are suffering — years. it is broken and patients are sufferinu. ., years. it is broken and patients are sufferinu. . , , ~ years. it is broken and patients are sufferinu. . , , ,, ., suffering. claire, this strike today comes after _ suffering. claire, this strike today comes after the _ suffering. claire, this strike today comes after the government - suffering. claire, this strike today comes after the government said | suffering. claire, this strike today | comes after the government said it is mindful and planning to bring in new legislation to mean you will have to do have a minimum level of service. they say the unions didn't agree to a central minimum level of service. what's your response, are you angry today?— you angry today? unison has negotiated — you angry today? unison has negotiated cover. _ you angry today? unison has negotiated cover. with - you angry today? unison has negotiated cover. with all i you angry today? unison has - negotiated cover. with all ambulance employers. we have been asking for years— employers. we have been asking for years for— employers. we have been asking for years for the government to bring in minimum _ years for the government to bring in minimum staffing levels, so it's a

bit ironic— minimum staffing levels, so it's a bit ironic they are talking about it on a _ bit ironic they are talking about it on a strike — bit ironic they are talking about it on a strike day. but we have absolutely negotiated cover with the north east ambulance service. thank ou, north east ambulance service. thank you. claire. — north east ambulance service. thank you. claire. 999 _ north east ambulance service. thank you, claire. 999 calls— north east ambulance service. thank you, claire. 999 calls at— north east ambulance service. thank you, claire. 999 calls at category i you, claire. 999 calls at category one will be responded to and serious category to make calls as well. sharon barbour in gateshead, thank you. let's get more on this from our chief political correspondent, nick eardley. with the government questioning local arrangements for emergency cover and saying they are not good enough and there needs to be a minimum service agreement which it discussed in parliament yesterday, the unions on the other hand saying these local agreements are fine. we can really see the tension between the two sides in the dispute. it’s the two sides in the dispute. it�*s interesting, because we were chatting yesterday about how there were some signs of may be a bit of optimism in pay talks but today we are seeing some of those tensions play out. we had business secretary

grant shapps suggesting the union were putting lives at risk by not agreeing to respond to all category two ambulance calls across england. the union say they have local arrangements and they will absolutely work and they will make sure they are appropriate but there is some tension there and some concern in government about what will happen today. there is a lot of tension when it comes to that legislation yesterday which would legislate for minimum service standards in certain areas, particularly in emergency services like fire and ambulance strikes that are happening today. but the big question i think behind all of this is whether the government can come up is whether the government can come up with some sort of offer which would allow these strikes to be called off in future. we know that the health secretary stephen

berkeley is looking at the idea of a one—off payment, or potentially starting next year's pay deal three months early, so there would be a small boost in pay from the start of this year rather than from april. have a listen to what the health secretary told bbc breakfast this morning. we met again with the trade unions on monday to discuss this year's coming evidence to the pay review body so that we can ensure that does reflect the pressure we've seen on inflation, the pressure we've seen on the cost of living, _ and we want to work constructively with the trade unions to recognise that the nhs is under particular pressure, salaries and cost of living is also a challenge, and we want to make sure the evidence that goes to the pay review body reflects those concerns. the caveats are, we don't know what the deal would look like. we don't know if it will definitely come. we don't know if the unions would agree, and we don't know if it would be enough to call off the strikes.

my be enough to call off the strikes. my understanding is that no firm proposal has been put to the treasury as things stand at the moment, and there are no talks planned with striking health unions yet to discuss a concrete offer. so potentially that could still be a few days, potentially a few weeks actually, away from being put on the table. in the meantime we still have these strikes going ahead today with more planned for nurses next week, and we don't really have an obvious answer to the question of, are we in answer to the question of, are we in a place where these strikes could potentially be called off soon? flick potentially be called off soon? nick eardle , potentially be called off soon? nick eardley. chief _ potentially be called off soon? nick eardley, chief political correspondent, thank you. joining me now is thorrun govind, the chair of the royal pharmaceutical society in england. good to have you with us. on the face of it, the decision to call an ambulance, orto face of it, the decision to call an ambulance, or to call or visit your local pharmacist, it doesn't seem

like a like—for—like decision, but i wonder if there was any particular advice or help that pharmacists can offer today in this situation? across the country, pharmacists are open and supporting their patients. we have a bit of a different role to ambulance services and it's important we encourage patients to access the right care in the right place. in terms of how people can support themselves, i think it's really important that, obviously if there are some red flag symptoms you are concerned about and it is life—threatening, it's obviously important to call 999 as appropriate. but in your community pharmacy there is a hub of advice and colleagues have been working extremely hard over the winter period and during covid as well, which hasn't quite gone away. there's 65 million informal consultations every year in

england's pharmacies so it's an important part to play in the health service. we important part to play in the health service. ~ , . , important part to play in the health service. ~ . , ., service. we spoke recently about the increased footfall _ service. we spoke recently about the increased footfall and _ service. we spoke recently about the increased footfall and pressure i service. we spoke recently about the increased footfall and pressure on i increased footfall and pressure on pharmacies because of the general pressure in other parts of the nhs, in hospitals, a&e and gp surgeries in hospitals, a&e and gp surgeries in particular. are you still seeing that? s. in particular. are you still seeing that? ,, ., , ., , that? s, of course, we are still seeinr that? s, of course, we are still seeing greater— that? s, of course, we are still seeing greater numbers - that? s, of course, we are still. seeing greater numbers through that? s, of course, we are still- seeing greater numbers through our doors. —— yes, of course. i want to pay tribute to pharmacy colleagues in all sectors, in gp surgeries, in hospitals, and liaising with health colleagues across the nhs because they are all working so hard. in community pharmacy it has been relentless. from personal experience, people are obviously really encouraged by some of the services we provide and they keep coming back, which is great. but with the cuts in funding we have had, year on year cuts, particularly over the last couple of years, it has been really hard for us and we

are calling for the government to think about this and make sure they are funded services that community pharmacies can provide to assist patients. pharmacies can provide to assist atients. . ., ., ., patients. the chair of the royal pharmaceutical _ patients. the chair of the royal pharmaceutical society - patients. the chair of the royal pharmaceutical society in i patients. the chair of the royal i pharmaceutical society in england, thank you. secondary schools will be closed in scotland today as teachers take part in industrial action in a dispute over pay. it follows a strike by primary school teachers yesterday also over pay. last night scotland's education secretary said she would leave "no stone unturned" to reach a speedy resolution. 0ur scotland correspondent lorna gordon has this report. chanting: we want 10%, - to pay the bills and pay the rent! out on strike again, these teachers are clear about what they want. they say they'd rather be in the classroom but feel they have no choice but to pick up placards instead. i feel very strongly about it. i don't want to be here. i want to be in teaching, i want the kids to be in learning, but it's been left to this.

we can't do anything else. i've taught for 32 years, and this is the first time i've ever been out on strike, so it's not easy. it's not easy for the teachers, it's not easy for the parents. i'm a parent myself. families across scotland have been left feeling the impact of the strike, with primary schools closed yesterday and secondaries today. i think it's a complete carry on. i think the kids' education was ruined enough with covid, and i just think that it's ridiculous that they are putting the kids through this again. i get that they want more money, but i think there should be another way they can do it, they can go about it, where it's not causing an issue to the kids' education. who do you hold responsible? the government. but nicola sturgeon insists the scottish government is doing all it can to resolve this dispute. she also says she is against any westminster legislation curbing the right to strike. fundamentally oppose that legislation, and the snp will oppose it very, very vigorously at westminster. the offer that is on the table

now, it is affordable within the finite resources that the scottish government has. not so, insist the unions. even as all sides agree that children's education shouldn't suffer. that report from lorna gordon. french police say six people have been injured and one is in a serious condition after a knife attack at the gare du nord train station in paris this morning. police say a man was arrested, after they opened fire, wounding him — and that the attacker�*s motive is not immediately clear. france remains on a state of heightened security alert after a number of deadly attacks by militants since 2015. that news coming to us in the last short while. counterterrorism police are investigating how scrap metal containing traces of uranium arrived at london's heathrow airport last month. the bbc understands that one line of inquiry is whether it was the result

of "poor handling" in pakistan, which is where it came from. our home affairs correspondent daniel sandford says the material was found on december the 29th. a detector at heathrow airport, it turns out they do have detectors that can pick up radiation, triggered an alarm, and counterterrorism police officers were called in because there was this consignment of metal which seemed to be emitting radiation, and what they found was what was described to me as a very small amount of uranium, highly radioactive material, within this consignment of scrap metal. that caused great concern because why would somebody be trying to potentially smuggle uranium into the country. it triggers alarms about illegal movement of nuclear materials and also the risk of something like a dirty bomb, but i'm told that so far in terms of how the investigation is going, that's not

what seems to be the most likely scenario. it looks like this might be some kind of error, almost, and it's to do with the poor handling of materials in pakistan, is one of the most likely lines of inquiry. i should say the counterterrorism investigation is not complete so it can still change and new avenues can still open up in the investigation. daniel sandford. sainsbury�*s has reported a rise in sales over christmas, despite the cost—of—living crisis. the uk's second biggest supermarket, which includes argos, said sales were up nearly 6% for its festive quarter compared with the previous year. it says customers shopped early, buying festive treats more than once as well as looking for deals. it says it now thinks full year profits will be towards the upper end of what it expected. shamima begum, the british schoolgirl who travelled to syria to join so—called islamic state, has admitted to being a member of terror organisation in a new interview with the bbc. the now 23—year—old, who was 15 when she ran away

from her home in east london, was interviewed as part of a year—long investigation for the 5 live podcast i am not a monster where she revealed that she was fed comprehensive instructions by members of the terror group, but also undertook her own detailed planning for the trip in 2015. let's take a look. i'm curious about how you think people perceive you. this a i'm curious about how you think people perceive you. as a danger, is a risk, as people perceive you. as a danger, is a risk. as a — people perceive you. as a danger, is a risk, as a potential— people perceive you. as a danger, is a risk, as a potential risk _ people perceive you. as a danger, is a risk, as a potential risk to - people perceive you. as a danger, is a risk, as a potential risk to them, i a risk, as a potential risk to them, to their safety, to their way of living. to their safety, to their way of livina. ,, to their safety, to their way of livina. , ., , living. do you understand why society has — living. do you understand why society has so _ living. do you understand why society has so much _ living. do you understand why society has so much anger i living. do you understand why i society has so much anger towards you? society has so much anger towards ou? , ., , ., , you? yes, i do understand, but i don't think— you? yes, i do understand, but i don't think it's _ you? yes, i do understand, but i don't think it's actually _ you? yes, i do understand, but i don't think it's actually towards i don't think it's actually towards me. i think it's actually towards isis, but when they think of isis they think of me because i have been put on the media so much. but they think of me because i have been put on the media so much.— put on the media so much. but they onl did put on the media so much. but they only did that — put on the media so much. but they only did that because _ put on the media so much. but they only did that because you _ put on the media so much. but they only did that because you chose i put on the media so much. but they only did that because you chose to i only did that because you chose to go to isis. only did that because you chose to no to isis. ~ ., .,, only did that because you chose to no to isis. ~ . .,, ., only did that because you chose to aotolsis. . ,, go to isis. what was there to obsess over? we went _ go to isis. what was there to obsess over? we went to _ go to isis. what was there to obsess over? we went to isis, _ go to isis. what was there to obsess over? we went to isis, that's - go to isis. what was there to obsess over? we went to isis, that's it i over? we went to isis, that's it will stop it was over. they wanted to continue the story because it was a story, it was the big story. but

ou a story, it was the big story. but you accept _ a story, it was the big story. but you accept you _ a story, it was the big story. but you accept you joined a terrorist group? you accept you “oined a terrorist arou - ? , you can find that interview in i'm not a monster: the shamima begum story — the second series of the award—winning podcast series on bbc sounds. a feature—length documentary is also due to broadcast on the bbc iplayer next month. prince harry has said claims he boasted in his new book about killing 25 taliban fighters while on duty in afghanistan are a "dangerous lie". the prince has been criticised for discussing killings in spare, with some military figures saying it was wrong to refer to the dead as "chess pieces". but on us tv, harry accused the press of taking his words out of context, endangering his family. without doubt the most dangerous lie that they have told. it's really troubling and very disturbing that they can get away with it. because they had the context. it wasn't like — here's just one line. they had the whole section, they ripped it away and just said,

here it is, he's boasting on this, when, as you say, that you've read it and everybody else will hopefully have a chance to read it. and that's dangerous. and my words are not dangerous. but the spin of my words are very dangerous. the foreign secretary, james cleverly, is visiting belfast today to meet northern ireland's political parties. the democratic unionist party says it won't return to power—sharing devolved government because of its opposition to the northern ireland protocol — the post—brexit trade border with the rest of the uk. there's been progress this week in negotiations on the issue between london and brussels but the dup has said its main concerns haven't been addressed yet. let's get all the latest from our ireland correspondent, chris page. remind us what the dup�*s main concerns are and what are the prospects of james cleverly�*s visit and can he change the dynamic and bring progress to this?—

bring progress to this? there is the sense that this _ bring progress to this? there is the sense that this is _ bring progress to this? there is the sense that this is the _ bring progress to this? there is the sense that this is the political i sense that this is the political season in northern ireland kicking off again after the midwinter break, but a successful endgame if it ever comes is still some way off. james cleverly is leading negotiations between the uk and eu on what is known as the northern ireland protocol. that is the arrangements for brexit here in northern ireland, basically in order to avoid the need for any checkpoints on the land border between northern ireland and the irish republic. there are now checks on goods arriving in northern ireland from the rest of the uk, a trade border in effect. the unionist, the democratic unionist party in particular, that is an economic barrier that separates northern ireland from great britain and therefore threatens northern ireland �*s place in the union. the dup has been for most of the year now, maintaining a veto on the power—sharing devolved government at stormont, so no ministers are currently in place, northern ireland is basically being run by civil

servants. the dup says it will not relent and it will not go back into a power and allow a new coalition to be formed unless the trade barrier is removed. in those negotiations between london and brussels this week there was an agreement on one of the matter is being negotiated, that was on the issue of information on customers being shared, but as someone close to the talks put it to me recently, a foothill has been climbed but there is still a mountain to scale. 0ne climbed but there is still a mountain to scale. one of the most difficult matters for the negotiators potentially is ultimately the legal jurisdiction over northern ireland. the dup has said it wants the european court of justice not to have a role in deciding laws here, because northern ireland is in essence still inside the eu single market, that appears to be one of the european union boss make red lines and they say they have to retain legal control over the single market. it's difficult to see how that matter in particular

will be resolved. from the foreign secretary's point of view, he will meet the main parties in the stormont assembly here in belfast this morning along with northern ireland secretary chris heaton—harris. he will brief them on the negotiations that have been happening between london and brussels. he will continue to press for an end to the deadlock here and a return to power—sharing. 0f for an end to the deadlock here and a return to power—sharing. of the other parties, their main nationalist party, sinn fein, the biggest party in the northern ireland assembly, they will say the british government is pandering to the dup and should apply more pressure to the dup to lift its veto. the cross community alliance party will say the whole of northern ireland are suffering because of this crisis. issues around public services and public sector pay are mounting up. the outlook for the next few months could be crucial not just for the future of power—sharing in northern ireland but also for the whole future of devolution in this part of the uk totally. ichris

whole future of devolution in this part of the uk totally.— part of the uk totally. chris page in belfast. _ part of the uk totally. chris page in belfast, thank _ part of the uk totally. chris page in belfast, thank you. _ the golden globes have returned to american television, a year after the hollywood awards show was dropped by the us broadcaster, nbc, over a row about diversity. it was revealed in 2021 that there were no black members of the body that selects the winners. following a series of reforms the hollywood foreign press association is attempting to win back the approval of audiences — and the entertainment industry, as peter bowes reports from los angeles. the golden globes are back, but are they forgiven? the hollywood foreign press association, the group behind the show, has been mired in controversy. allegations over a lack of diversity amongst the voters, and other ethical lapses, led to the globe is being led to the globes being boycotted by hollywood and dropped from tv last year. but the ceremony has returned to try to nurture a new, inclusive image, starting with the host. and i'll tell you why i'm here... i'm here because i'm black.

laughter. the comedianjerrod carmichael didn't shy away from the controversy, joking that as the first black host in the show�*s history, he was unfireable. i heard they got six new black members. congrats to them, whatever, sure. but it's not why i'm here. i'm here, truly, because all of you, i look out into this room and i see a lot of talented people. and so it was on with the awards. one of the night's big winners was everything everywhere all at once, a comedy—drama set in the multi—verse and starring michelle yeoh, a malaysian actress who plays the owner of a launderette. and this is also for all the shoulders that i stand on, all who came before me who look like me. we haven't been rowing. the banshees of inisherin, the dark comedy about a fractured relationship between two lifelong friends, won several awards, including best comedy,

and actor for colin farrell. i never expect films to work and to find an audience, i and when they do, it's shocking to me, and so i'm so horrified i by what's happened around banshees over the last couple of months, i in a thrilling kind of way. there was a change of tone when sean penn took to the stage. the veteran actor introduced a recorded message from the ukrainian president volodymyr zelensky. it is now 2023 and the war in ukraine is not over yet, but the tide is turning, and it is already clear who will win. in the tv categories, the main winners were the white lotus, abbott elementary and the game of thrones spin off house of the dragon. the organisers of the golden globes say they are committed to making more changes to make the awards more diverse. the show�*s future is far from certain, but hollywood seems to be in a mood to move on. peter bowes, bbc news, los angeles.

now it's time for a look at the weather. good morning. this morning we have seen quite a few showers across parts of the north and west. it has been drier and brighter with some sunshine in the east but as we go through the day the showers will merge as they cross england and wales, heavy and thundery with some hail. in scotland and northern ireland we also have showers, some wintry and the mountain tops in scotland. wind will be a feature of the weather today wherever you are. the strongest or touch gale force at times around the coasts and hills in the west and south. this evening and overnight, we lose the rain from the south—east, only to be replaced by more heavy rain coming in across northern ireland, southern scotland, england and wales. it will be a windy night, particularly so with gales around the coasts of the southwest and english channel and a colder night as we push further north with some local frost and we

could see ice on untreated surfaces. tomorrow we have the rain in the south, still windy especially in coastal counties. and a fair few showers coming across western scotland and northern ireland. in between, something drier and brighter, mild for many and a temperature range of 6—13. hello. we go live to westminster because the transport select committee is questioning trade union bosses this morning. mick went among those, the general secretary of the rmt, obviously one of the hot topics of more moment and there is mick lynch. ijust listen and no. that is the chair of the transport select committee. quite a complex situation. but before we do, ijust want quite a complex situation. but before we do, i just want to quite a complex situation. but before we do, ijust want to put quite a complex situation. but before we do, i just want to put the session in context. we are hearing from yourselves in this part of the session, laterwe

from yourselves in this part of the session, later we will be hearing from network rail and the rail delivery group, next week we will be having the rail minister in front of us. what i'm hoping we get out of these sessions is to get some greater clarity on where we are with the dispute, and what the prospects are of a resolution. sooner rather than later. so before we delve into the specific issues, can ijust ask the specific issues, can ijust ask the three of you, in very broad terms, how close are we to having these disputes resolved? 0n terms, how close are we to having these disputes resolved? on a scale of one — ten. 0ne, remaining on different planets, ten i can go out and buy a hat for the wedding. we had? i and buy a hat for the wedding. we had? ~ , ., .., and buy a hat for the wedding. we had? ~ i. . ., had? i think you can include zero in one to ten. — had? i think you can include zero in one to ten. we _ had? i think you can include zero in one to ten, we are _ had? i think you can include zero in one to ten, we are further- had? i think you can include zero in one to ten, we are further away i had? i think you can include zero in | one to ten, we are further away than than when we started. that one to ten, we are further away than than when we started.— than when we started. that is clear. i would

than when we started. that is clear. i would not — than when we started. that is clear. i would not be _ than when we started. that is clear. i would not be able _ than when we started. that is clear. i would not be able to _ than when we started. that is clear. i would not be able to say, - than when we started. that is clear. i would not be able to say, dependsi i would not be able to say, depends on discussions. _ i would not be able to say, depends on discussions. i'm _ i would not be able to say, depends on discussions. i'm not going to i i would not be able to say, dependsi on discussions. i'm not going to use a skill but we — on discussions. i'm not going to use a skill but we have _ on discussions. i'm not going to use a skill but we have not _ on discussions. i'm not going to use a skill but we have not got - on discussions. i'm not going to use a skill but we have not got an - a skill but we have not got an agreement— a skill but we have not got an agreement until— a skill but we have not got an agreement until we _ a skill but we have not got an agreement until we get i a skill but we have not got an agreement until we get an i a skill but we have not got an - agreement until we get an agreement, we are _ agreement until we get an agreement, we are hot— agreement until we get an agreement, we are not close — agreement until we get an agreement, we are not close to— agreement until we get an agreement, we are not close to it, _ agreement until we get an agreement, we are not close to it, really. - agreement until we get an agreement, we are not close to it, really. that i we are not close to it, really. that is not as optimistic— we are not close to it, really. that is not as optimistic as _ we are not close to it, really. that is not as optimistic as i _ we are not close to it, really. tiiiiih is not as optimistic as i had we are not close to it, really.- is not as optimistic as i had hoped. 0ur discussions happening —— our discussions happening at the moment? no. ~ �* , ., no. we've been invited to discussions _ no. we've been invited to discussions tomorrow. i no. we've been invited to - discussions tomorrow. discussions, we had a discussion _ discussions tomorrow. discussions, we had a discussion with _ discussions tomorrow. discussions, we had a discussion with network l we had a discussion with network rail yesterday _ we had a discussion with network rail yesterday and _ we had a discussion with network rail yesterday and we _ we had a discussion with network rail yesterday and we will - we had a discussion with network rail yesterday and we will have i we had a discussion with network. rail yesterday and we will have one with r06, _ rail yesterday and we will have one with r06, rail— rail yesterday and we will have one with rdg, rail delivery— rail yesterday and we will have one with rdg, rail delivery group, i rail yesterday and we will have one with rdg, rail delivery group, for. with rdg, rail delivery group, for the talks— with rdg, rail delivery group, for the talks on— with rdg, rail delivery group, for the talks on thursday. _ with rdg, rail delivery group, for the talks on thursday. can - with rdg, rail delivery group, for the talks on thursday.— with rdg, rail delivery group, for the talks on thursday. can you say what is happening _ the talks on thursday. can you say what is happening with _ the talks on thursday. can you say what is happening with you - the talks on thursday. can you say what is happening with you mr- the talks on thursday. can you say i what is happening with you mr lynch, you seem to be the most positive of the three, although it is relative. where do you see a possible landing zone for an agreement? it is it on pay, wider conditions, industry reform? where do you see a possible zone for coming to an agreementmac gray will all of those issues have

to be dealt with. our dispute that we put to the company is to be dealt with. our dispute that we put to the company— to be dealt with. our dispute that we put to the company is based on 'ob we put to the company is based on job security. _ we put to the company is based on job security. so — we put to the company is based on job security, so they _ we put to the company is based on job security, so they wanted i we put to the company is based on job security, so they wanted to i we put to the company is based on i job security, so they wanted to make thousands— job security, so they wanted to make thousands of— job security, so they wanted to make thousands of redundancies. - job security, so they wanted to make thousands of redundancies. that i job security, so they wanted to make| thousands of redundancies. that may change _ thousands of redundancies. that may change to— thousands of redundancies. that may change to the — thousands of redundancies. that may change to the lower _ thousands of redundancies. that may change to the lower thousands - thousands of redundancies. that may change to the lower thousands or - change to the lower thousands or into the _ change to the lower thousands or into the hundreds, _ change to the lower thousands or into the hundreds, we _ change to the lower thousands or into the hundreds, we don't - change to the lower thousands ori into the hundreds, we don't know, that network— into the hundreds, we don't know, that network rail— into the hundreds, we don't know, that network rail and _ into the hundreds, we don't know, that network rail and the - into the hundreds, we don't know, that network rail and the talks, i into the hundreds, we don't know, l that network rail and the talks, we have an _ that network rail and the talks, we have an issue — that network rail and the talks, we have an issue about _ that network rail and the talks, we have an issue about what _ that network rail and the talks, we have an issue about what they- that network rail and the talks, we have an issue about what they are i have an issue about what they are calling _ have an issue about what they are calling modernisation, _ have an issue about what they are calling modernisation, and - have an issue about what they are calling modernisation, and there i have an issue about what they are . calling modernisation, and there are some _ calling modernisation, and there are some aspects — calling modernisation, and there are some aspects of— calling modernisation, and there are some aspects of modernisation, - some aspects of modernisation, development _ some aspects of modernisation, development of— some aspects of modernisation, development of the _ some aspects of modernisation, development of the railway- some aspects of modernisation, development of the railway and i development of the railway and development _ development of the railway and development of— development of the railway and development of working - development of the railway and . development of working conditions and terms — development of working conditions and terms and _ development of working conditions and terms and conditions - development of working conditions and terms and conditions and - and terms and conditions and contractual— and terms and conditions and contractual elements. - and terms and conditions and contractual elements. we - and terms and conditions and i contractual elements. we are and terms and conditions and l contractual elements. we are a and terms and conditions and - contractual elements. we are a long way on _ contractual elements. we are a long way on pay — contractual elements. we are a long way on pay. the _ contractual elements. we are a long way on pay. the inflation— contractual elements. we are a long way on pay. the inflation rate - contractual elements. we are a long way on pay. the inflation rate we . way on pay. the inflation rate we use for— way on pay. the inflation rate we use for this — way on pay. the inflation rate we use for this year— way on pay. the inflation rate we use for this year is _ way on pay. the inflation rate we use for this year is currently - way on pay. the inflation rate we use for this year is currently in i use for this year is currently in excess — use for this year is currently in excess of— use for this year is currently in excess of 14%, _ use for this year is currently in excess of 14%, the _ use for this year is currently in excess of 14%, the one - use for this year is currently in excess of 14%, the one the - use for this year is currently in - excess of 14%, the one the railway use~ _ excess of 14%, the one the railway use the _ excess of14%, the one the railway use. the previous— excess of14%, the one the railway use. the previous offer— excess of 14%, the one the railway use. the previous offer we - excess of 14%, the one the railway use. the previous offer we had - excess of 14%, the one the railway use. the previous offer we had is. use. the previous offer we had is for. use. the previous offer we had is fun the — use. the previous offer we had is for. the inflation— use. the previous offer we had is for. the inflation for— use. the previous offer we had is for. the inflation for 22 _ use. the previous offer we had is for. the inflation for 22 and - use. the previous offer we had is for. the inflation for 22 and 23 i for. the inflation for 22 and 23 will be — for. the inflation for 22 and 23 will be in _ for. the inflation for 22 and 23 will be in excess _ for. the inflation for 22 and 23 will be in excess of _ for. the inflation for 22 and 23 will be in excess of 20%, - will be in excess of 20%, cumulatively. _ will be in excess of 20%, cumulatively. we - will be in excess of 20%, cumulatively. we have . will be in excess of 20%, i cumulatively. we have been will be in excess of 20%, _ cumulatively. we have been offered in the _ cumulatively. we have been offered in the talks— cumulatively. we have been offered in the talks s%, _ cumulatively. we have been offered in the talks 8%, for _ cumulatively. we have been offered in the talks 8%, for those _ cumulatively. we have been offered in the talks 8%, for those two - in the talks 8%, for those two years. — in the talks 8%, for those two years. tess _ in the talks 8%, for those two years, less than _ in the talks 8%, for those two years, less than half, - in the talks 8%, for those two years, less than half, and - in the talks 8%, for those two - years, less than half, and offered

9% by— years, less than half, and offered 9% by the — years, less than half, and offered 9% by the network— years, less than half, and offered 9% by the network rail, - years, less than half, and offered 9% by the network rail, less - years, less than half, and offered| 9% by the network rail, less than half again — 9% by the network rail, less than half again. let's _ 9% by the network rail, less than half again. let's not _ 9% by the network rail, less than half again. let's not forget, - 9% by the network rail, less than half again. let's not forget, we i half again. let's not forget, we have _ half again. let's not forget, we have not— half again. let's not forget, we have not had _ half again. let's not forget, we have not had a _ half again. let's not forget, we have not had a pay— half again. let's not forget, we have not had a pay rise - half again. let's not forget, we have not had a pay rise in - half again. let's not forget, we| have not had a pay rise in many half again. let's not forget, we i have not had a pay rise in many of these _ have not had a pay rise in many of these companies _ have not had a pay rise in many of these companies for— have not had a pay rise in many of these companies for three - have not had a pay rise in many of these companies for three or- have not had a pay rise in many of these companies for three or four| these companies for three or four years _ these companies for three or four years so — these companies for three or four years so we _ these companies for three or four years. so we are _ these companies for three or four years. so we are having - these companies for three or four years. so we are having our- these companies for three or fourl years. so we are having our wages reduced. _ years. so we are having our wages reduced. spending— years. so we are having our wages reduced, spending power- years. so we are having our wages reduced, spending powerat- years. so we are having our wages reduced, spending power at the i reduced, spending power at the supermarket, _ reduced, spending power at the supermarket, and _ reduced, spending power at the supermarket, and with - reduced, spending power at the supermarket, and with the - reduced, spending power at the . supermarket, and with the energy companies — supermarket, and with the energy companies and _ supermarket, and with the energy companies and everything - supermarket, and with the energy companies and everything else, . supermarket, and with the energy. companies and everything else, year on year— companies and everything else, year on year on _ companies and everything else, year on year on year. _ companies and everything else, year on year on year. and _ companies and everything else, year on year on year, and every _ companies and everything else, year on year on year, and every week- companies and everything else, year| on year on year, and every week that passes— on year on year, and every week that passes it _ on year on year, and every week that passes it gets — on year on year, and every week that passes it gets worse. _ on year on year, and every week that passes it gets worse. they— on year on year, and every week that passes it gets worse. they are - on year on year, and every week that passes it gets worse. they are also l passes it gets worse. they are also seeking _ passes it gets worse. they are also seeking such— passes it gets worse. they are also seeking such drastic _ passes it gets worse. they are also seeking such drastic changes - passes it gets worse. they are also seeking such drastic changes suchi passes it gets worse. they are also i seeking such drastic changes such as the elimination— seeking such drastic changes such as the elimination of— seeking such drastic changes such as the elimination of ticket _ seeking such drastic changes such as the elimination of ticket offices - seeking such drastic changes such as the elimination of ticket offices in . the elimination of ticket offices in britain, _ the elimination of ticket offices in britain, there _ the elimination of ticket offices in britain, there will— the elimination of ticket offices in britain, there will be _ the elimination of ticket offices in britain, there will be no, - the elimination of ticket offices in britain, there will be no, under. the elimination of ticket offices in. britain, there will be no, under the current— britain, there will be no, under the current proposals, _ britain, there will be no, under the current proposals, which— britain, there will be no, under the current proposals, which are - current proposals, which are sponsored _ current proposals, which are sponsored and _ current proposals, which are sponsored and put _ current proposals, which are sponsored and put forward l current proposals, which are i sponsored and put forward by current proposals, which are - sponsored and put forward by the department— sponsored and put forward by the department for— sponsored and put forward by the department for transport, - sponsored and put forward by the department for transport, there i sponsored and put forward by the i department for transport, there will be no _ department for transport, there will be no ticket — department for transport, there will be no ticket offices. _ department for transport, there will be no ticket offices. in _ department for transport, there will be no ticket offices. in the _ department for transport, there will be no ticket offices. in the last - be no ticket offices. in the last version — be no ticket offices. in the last version of— be no ticket offices. in the last version of the _ be no ticket offices. in the last version of the offer _ be no ticket offices. in the last version of the offer we - be no ticket offices. in the last version of the offer we had - be no ticket offices. in the last i version of the offer we had from be no ticket offices. in the last - version of the offer we had from the talks, _ version of the offer we had from the talks, there — version of the offer we had from the talks, there will— version of the offer we had from the talks, there will be _ version of the offer we had from the talks, there will be no _ version of the offer we had from the talks, there will be no guards - talks, there will be no guards either~ — talks, there will be no guards either. these _ talks, there will be no guards either. these are _ talks, there will be no guards either. these are very- talks, there will be no guards either. these are very stark l either. these are very stark choices, _ either. these are very stark choices, ptus— either. these are very stark choices, plus will— either. these are very stark choices, plus will die - either. these are very stark choices, plus will die lou i either. these are very stark - choices, plus will die lou oliver contractual— choices, plus will die lou oliver contractual terms— choices, plus will die lou oliver contractual terms and - choices, plus will die lou oliverl contractual terms and conditions virtuatty, — contractual terms and conditions virtually, so _ contractual terms and conditions virtually, so it's— contractual terms and conditions virtually, so it's a _ contractual terms and conditions virtually, so it's a very _ contractual terms and conditions virtually, so it's a very strong. virtually, so it's a very strong chattenge _ virtually, so it's a very strong chattenge -- _ virtually, so it's a very strong challenge —— plus _ virtually, so it's a very strong challenge —— plus will- virtually, so it's a very strong challenge —— plus will dilate i virtually, so it's a very strong. challenge —— plus will dilate our contractual— challenge —— plus will dilate our contractual terms. _ challenge —— plus will dilate our contractual terms. and - challenge —— plus will dilate ouri contractual terms. and including elements— contractual terms. and including elements aspires _ contractual terms. and including

elements aspires the _ contractual terms. and including. elements aspires the government wants— elements aspires the government wants to — elements aspires the government wants to address, _ elements aspires the government wants to address, this _ elements aspires the government wants to address, this is - elements aspires the government . wants to address, this is completely directed _ wants to address, this is completely directed by— wants to address, this is completely directed by the _ wants to address, this is completely directed by the government - wants to address, this is completely directed by the government in - wants to address, this is completelyi directed by the government in every element, _ directed by the government in every element, and — directed by the government in every element, and i— directed by the government in every element, and i don't _ directed by the government in every element, and i don't know— directed by the government in every element, and i don't know if- directed by the government in every element, and i don't know if any- directed by the government in every element, and i don't know if any of. element, and i don't know if any of our members — element, and i don't know if any of our members will— element, and i don't know if any of our members will go _ element, and i don't know if any of our members will go anywhere - element, and i don't know if any ofi our members will go anywhere near accepting _ our members will go anywhere near accepting those _ our members will go anywhere near accepting those proposals, - our members will go anywhere near accepting those proposals, and - our members will go anywhere near. accepting those proposals, and there is such— accepting those proposals, and there is such profound _ accepting those proposals, and there is such profound changes— accepting those proposals, and there is such profound changes they - accepting those proposals, and there is such profound changes they will i is such profound changes they will be very— is such profound changes they will be very difficult _ is such profound changes they will be very difficult for— is such profound changes they will be very difficult for any— is such profound changes they will be very difficult for any union - is such profound changes they will be very difficult for any union to l be very difficult for any union to accept, — be very difficult for any union to accept, and _ be very difficult for any union to accept, and one _ be very difficult for any union to accept, and one of— be very difficult for any union to accept, and one of the - be very difficult for any union to accept, and one of the previousi accept, and one of the previous times— accept, and one of the previous times i— accept, and one of the previous times i was— accept, and one of the previous times i was there _ accept, and one of the previous times i was there we _ accept, and one of the previous times i was there we had - accept, and one of the previous times i was there we had the i accept, and one of the previous . times i was there we had the p80 chairman— times i was there we had the p80 chairman and _ times i was there we had the p80 chairman and he _ times i was there we had the p80 chairman and he said _ times i was there we had the p80 chairman and he said no - times i was there we had the p80 chairman and he said no union- times i was there we had the p80 chairman and he said no union in. times i was there we had the p80 i chairman and he said no union in its right— chairman and he said no union in its right mind— chairman and he said no union in its right mind witt— chairman and he said no union in its right mind will accept _ chairman and he said no union in its right mind will accept what - chairman and he said no union in its right mind will accept what i - chairman and he said no union in its right mind will accept what i want . right mind will accept what i want to propose. — right mind will accept what i want to propose. we _ right mind will accept what i want to propose, we are _ right mind will accept what i want to propose, we are in _ right mind will accept what i want to propose, we are in similar- to propose, we are in similar territory~ _ to propose, we are in similar territory. with _ to propose, we are in similar territory. with the _ to propose, we are in similar territory. with the railways l to propose, we are in similar| territory. with the railways at to propose, we are in similar- territory. with the railways at the moment — territory. with the railways at the moment the _ territory. with the railways at the moment. the landing _ territory. with the railways at the moment. the landing zone, - territory. with the railways at the moment. the landing zone, we . territory. with the railways at the l moment. the landing zone, we will have to _ moment. the landing zone, we will have to deat— moment. the landing zone, we will have to deal with _ moment. the landing zone, we will have to deal with all— moment. the landing zone, we will have to deal with all those - have to deal with all those elements. _ have to deal with all those elements, as _ have to deal with all those elements, as it— have to deal with all those elements, as it is- have to deal with all those elements, as it is called, i have to deal with all those . elements, as it is called, but have to deal with all those - elements, as it is called, but i cannot— elements, as it is called, but i cannot see _ elements, as it is called, but i cannot see the _ elements, as it is called, but i cannot see the landing - elements, as it is called, but i cannot see the landing zone . elements, as it is called, but i. cannot see the landing zone from here, _ cannot see the landing zone from here, we — cannot see the landing zone from here, we witt— cannot see the landing zone from here, we will have _ cannot see the landing zone from here, we will have to _ cannot see the landing zone from here, we will have to see - cannot see the landing zone from here, we will have to see what i cannot see the landing zone from i here, we will have to see what the talks _ here, we will have to see what the talks are _ here, we will have to see what the talks are and — here, we will have to see what the talks are and i_ here, we will have to see what the talks are and i don't _ here, we will have to see what the talks are and i don't know- here, we will have to see what the talks are and i don't know what - here, we will have to see what the | talks are and i don't know what our members _ talks are and i don't know what our members witt— talks are and i don't know what our members will make _ talks are and i don't know what our members will make of— talks are and i don't know what our members will make of that - talks are and i don't know what our members will make of that when . talks are and i don't know what our. members will make of that when they -et members will make of that when they get to— members will make of that when they get to read _ members will make of that when they get to read the — members will make of that when they get to read the stuff— members will make of that when they get to read the stuff in _ members will make of that when they get to read the stuff in detail. - get to read the stuff in detail. your— get to read the stuff in detail. your union— get to read the stuff in detail. your union settled _ get to read the stuff in detail. your union settled one - get to read the stuff in detail. your union settled one of- get to read the stuff in detail. your union settled one of the| your union settled one of the disputes, with network rail, but you remain in dispute with the r06? yes.

remain in dispute with the rdg? yes. from what you _ remain in dispute with the rdg? yes. from what you agreed _ remain in dispute with the rdg? yes from what you agreed with network rail, can you see a sort of spill—over, if that is the correct phrase, to reaching a settlement with the rdg? phrase, to reaching a settlement with the r06? taste phrase, to reaching a settlement with the rdg?_ phrase, to reaching a settlement with the rdg? ~ ., ., ., , with the rdg? we had two agreements with the rdg? we had two agreements with network rail, _ with the rdg? we had two agreements with network rail, one _ with the rdg? we had two agreements with network rail, one we _ with the rdg? we had two agreements with network rail, one we entered - with network rail, one we entered into tast _ with network rail, one we entered into last august and one on behalf of generat— into last august and one on behalf of general controllers which were settled _ of general controllers which were settled in — of general controllers which were settled in december. the concerns of our members were addressed in those claims _ our members were addressed in those claims we _ our members were addressed in those claims. we put both offers to the members — claims. we put both offers to the members and they voted overwhelmingly to accept them. they were in— overwhelmingly to accept them. they were in a _ overwhelmingly to accept them. they were in a totally different situation with the rdg, we talk about— situation with the rdg, we talk about talks through the rdg, the reality— about talks through the rdg, the reality is— about talks through the rdg, the reality is we continue in talks with the rdg, — reality is we continue in talks with the rdg, we get to a stage whereby we think— the rdg, we get to a stage whereby we think there's been some progress made, _ we think there's been some progress made. they— we think there's been some progress made, they go back to talk to their paymasters everything unfolds in front of— paymasters everything unfolds in front of us. we get an offer from the r06 —

front of us. we get an offer from the rdg that were no relationship in part to _ the rdg that were no relationship in part to the _ the rdg that were no relationship in part to the talks that just concluded, the offer that was on the table is _ concluded, the offer that was on the table is significantly different from — table is significantly different from what we settle down with network — from what we settle down with network rail. is it some sort of template — network rail. is it some sort of template because ——? it does suggest a way— template because ——? it does suggest a way forward but nothing more than that. .. ~ a way forward but nothing more than that. .. ,. , ., a way forward but nothing more than that. . ~' ,, ~ a way forward but nothing more than that. .. ~ ,, ~ u. a way forward but nothing more than that. . ~' i., ~ _, ., that. thank you. we will come on specifically _ that. thank you. we will come on specifically negotiations - that. thank you. we will come on specifically negotiations with - that. thank you. we will come on specifically negotiations with the | specifically negotiations with the rdg any moment but my final question for the moment, you said you were zero in terms of likelihood of a settlement, can you expand on that a little, please? settlement, can you expand on that a little. please?— little, please? yes, last week late on friday evening _ little, please? yes, last week late on friday evening leaked - little, please? yes, last week late on friday evening leaked to - little, please? yes, last week late on friday evening leaked to the i on friday evening leaked to the press before we had had the chance to look at it or say or open the e—mail was a deal that contained many of our red lines on things we had not discussed and actually smashed the enabling agreement we have because we do not deal with the

rdg, we are working through a group called the r irg and the three trade unions sign up for an agreement with them. part of the enabling agreement was that certain parts of the railway were excluded from severance, including signal persons, cards and drivers, receiving a deal that there will be no compulsory redundancies until 202a. also the deal told us what our people would do, where we would negotiate and broke the arrangements within the enabling agreement about how we would cascade any broadbrush agreement we might have made at a national level. my board, my committee will deal with that next monday. i am committee will deal with that next monday. lam naturally committee will deal with that next monday. i am naturally being questioned all the time and what my view on that deal is, i'm incredibly open and cannot recommend any one element of it and it may destroy the ability to go back to the stocks in future. i ability to go back to the stocks in future. ., ,., ., future. i will delve into some of those points — future. i will delve into some of those points and _ future. i will delve into some of those points and obviously - future. i will delve into some of those points and obviously we | future. i will delve into some of- those points and obviously we have, the other side of the table coming to us, injust under an hour, but cani to us, injust under an hour, but can i hand over to paul?

i doubt anyone would want to do these negotiations in the public domain, which you guys have to, but in terms of, i will direct this critically at mr lynch and mr ward. i want to understand why you rejected the rail delivery group's initial offer of? you said that it contained elements that should never have been discussed, and then omitted significant points that had been negotiated. can you elaborate a little on that? i thank you for the submissions that we got. it little on that? i thank you for the submissions that we got.- little on that? i thank you for the submissions that we got. it was not art of the submissions that we got. it was not part of the discussions _ submissions that we got. it was not part of the discussions we - submissions that we got. it was not part of the discussions we have - submissions that we got. it was not l part of the discussions we have been having _ part of the discussions we have been having recently with the rdg, and the talks— having recently with the rdg, and the talks that we had been having made _ the talks that we had been having made some progress, when they came

back with _ made some progress, when they came back with a _ made some progress, when they came back with a formal offer... it came out of— back with a formal offer... it came out of nowhere for us. so much so that i_ out of nowhere for us. so much so that i asked — out of nowhere for us. so much so that i asked our negotiators when do we start— that i asked our negotiators when do we start talking about this? and i was told — we start talking about this? and i was told quite categorically that we had not _ was told quite categorically that we had not been talking about it at all. ., . ., had not been talking about it at all-_ things i all. no reference to it? things within the _ all. no reference to it? things within the offer— all. no reference to it? things within the offer that _ all. no reference to it? things within the offer that were - all. no reference to it? things l within the offer that were totally unacceptable to us. a pay offer of 4% for— unacceptable to us. a pay offer of 4% for last — unacceptable to us. a pay offer of 4% for last year and this year, and as mr— 4% for last year and this year, and as mr lynch — 4% for last year and this year, and as mr lynch has quite rightly referred. _ as mr lynch has quite rightly referred, inflation for the rail industry— referred, inflation for the rail industry is running at 14%. 4% does not, industry is running at 14%. 4% does not. will— industry is running at 14%. 4% does not. will not — industry is running at 14%. 4% does not, will not help a lot of her lower— not, will not help a lot of her lower paid members. the deal done with network rail was 5% in 2022 and 4% in— with network rail was 5% in 2022 and 4% in 2025 _ with network rail was 5% in 2022 and 4% in 2023. but with a minimum of 1750 for— 4% in 2023. but with a minimum of 1750 for lower paid workers. there is no _ 1750 for lower paid workers. there is no bottom for lower paid workers in the _ is no bottom for lower paid workers in the rdg — is no bottom for lower paid workers in the rdg offer, we are asked to

make _ in the rdg offer, we are asked to make commitments in terms of delivering — make commitments in terms of delivering on the modernisations referred — delivering on the modernisations referred within the railway, that we will not _ referred within the railway, that we will not take any industrial action between — will not take any industrial action between signing of the agreement and april 2024. at the same time, we have _ april 2024. at the same time, we have been— april 2024. at the same time, we have been given a commitment that there _ have been given a commitment that there will— have been given a commitment that there will be no compulsory redundancies before the 1st of april 2024 _ redundancies before the 1st of april 2024. they can propose compulsory redundancies injanuary 24, enact them _ redundancies injanuary 24, enact them in _ redundancies injanuary 24, enact them in april, but we cannot take industrial— them in april, but we cannot take industrial action about it until after— industrial action about it until after those people have been made compulsorily redundant and left the industry _ compulsorily redundant and left the industry. it isjust not acceptable. in industry. it isjust not acceptable. in addition— industry. it isjust not acceptable. in addition to that, there were offers— in addition to that, there were offers from network rail, improved terms _ offers from network rail, improved terms and — offers from network rail, improved terms and conditions which we don't -et terms and conditions which we don't get anything. we don't get anything from the _ get anything. we don't get anything from the rail delivery group in terms — from the rail delivery group in terms of— from the rail delivery group in terms of terms and conditions, so

there _ terms of terms and conditions, so there is— terms of terms and conditions, so there is not— terms of terms and conditions, so there is not even a sweetener there for our— there is not even a sweetener there for our members, as far as that's concerned — for our members, as far as that's concerned. the agreement rant of january— concerned. the agreement rant of january 2025, clearly members working — january 2025, clearly members working for train operating companies are asking why those employees in the rail industry who work for— employees in the rail industry who work for network rail have got no compulsory redundancy untiljanuary compulsory redundancy until january 25 and _ compulsory redundancy untiljanuary 25 and there is only april 24? and what _ 25 and there is only april 24? and what plans— 25 and there is only april 24? and what plans their employers might have for— what plans their employers might have for them. it is a lot of uncertainty, does not address the concerns— uncertainty, does not address the concerns in— uncertainty, does not address the concerns in regards to pay, and there _ concerns in regards to pay, and there is— concerns in regards to pay, and there is nothing else that would sweeten — there is nothing else that would sweeten it, as far as our members are concerned. we consult with their representatives before we decide what to _ representatives before we decide what to do with any offer that we -et what to do with any offer that we get from — what to do with any offer that we get from the employer, and every single _ get from the employer, and every single one — get from the employer, and every single one of our representatives says this — single one of our representatives says thisjust won't single one of our representatives says this just won't wash. in single one of our representatives says this just won't wash. says this 'ust won't wash. in terms ofthe says this just won't wash. in terms of the structure _ says this just won't wash. in terms of the structure of _ says this just won't wash. in terms of the structure of a _ says this just won't wash. in terms of the structure of a deal, - says this just won't wash. in terms of the structure of a deal, the - says this just won't wash. in terms of the structure of a deal, the way| of the structure of a deal, the way the one you have accepted that, a bias towards the lower paid players

getting a slightly higher percentage, that's the sort of thing that could be a step in the right direction, is that a fair, ? it that could be a step in the right direction, is that a fair,? it would be a step in _ direction, is that a fair,? it would be a step in the _ direction, is that a fair,? it would be a step in the right _ direction, is that a fair,? it would be a step in the right direction, i be a step in the right direction, would — be a step in the right direction, would also _ be a step in the right direction, would also be a step in the right direction — would also be a step in the right direction would be an offer for management staff and an offer for controllers. we have not received any offer— controllers. we have not received any offer for managing staff and controllers, and it is notable when we did _ controllers, and it is notable when we did the — controllers, and it is notable when we did the deal is with network rail. _ we did the deal is with network rail. the — we did the deal is with network rail, the first day we settled was for management staff, that was the first offer— for management staff, that was the first offer we got, we settle with them _ first offer we got, we settle with them in — first offer we got, we settle with them in that. we have not even had an offer— them in that. we have not even had an offer and — them in that. we have not even had an offerand we them in that. we have not even had an offer and we have asked repeatedly for office for both those groups _ repeatedly for office for both those groups of— repeatedly for office for both those groups of staff, and we have been told they— groups of staff, and we have been told they don't have the authority from _ told they don't have the authority from the — told they don't have the authority from the dft to make us any offer. just coming — from the dft to make us any offer. just coming back to the driver on the second, said that suddenly brought into discussion at a late point. any casual observer of what is going on in the release at the moment would be aware that there is pressure from government and others to come up with more driver only

operations, so i'm a little surprised it was a surprise, if you see what i mean. i understand what you're saying that it does not seem to be specifically looked at. is it something you just don't see as being feasible at all? orders at the factory are worried about the fact it is being pushed to complaints pensively? i notice from some of the submissions you talk the cases where you combine a deal at a particular station, puts from the girl to risk because of the tie. are the spaces we would see the driver only operation is still practical? or is itjust a no completely? i want to understand whether it is a. ? irate understand whether it is a. ? we will not accept driver only operation _ will not accept driver only operation in _ will not accept driver only operation in any - will not accept driver onlyi operation in any company. will not accept driver only- operation in any company. we will never— operation in any company. we will never sign — operation in any company. we will never sign up _ operation in any company. we will never sign up to— operation in any company. we will never sign up to accept _ operation in any company. we will never sign up to accept a - operation in any company. we will never sign up to accept a deal, - operation in any company. we will never sign up to accept a deal, it. never sign up to accept a deal, it will never— never sign up to accept a deal, it will never happen _ never sign up to accept a deal, it will never happen while - never sign up to accept a deal, it will never happen while i'm - never sign up to accept a deal, it will never happen while i'm the i will never happen while i'm the general— will never happen while i'm the general secretary, _ will never happen while i'm the

general secretary, i— will never happen while i'm the general secretary, i will - will never happen while i'm the general secretary, i will never. general secretary, i will never happen— general secretary, i will never happen as _ general secretary, i will never happen as long _ general secretary, i will never happen as long as _ general secretary, i will never happen as long as the - general secretary, i will never happen as long as the rmt i general secretary, i will never - happen as long as the rmt exists. it is not happen as long as the rmt exists. is not very clever in a negotiation, in my opinion, and it is the dft... that have insisted on this. not the executives coming in. they will have to do what they're told, because that's what the contractors. the contracts that _ that's what the contractors. the contracts that these train operators have with _ contracts that these train operators have with the — contracts that these train operators have with the dft— contracts that these train operators have with the dft size _ contracts that these train operators have with the dft size one - contracts that these train operators have with the dft size one that - contracts that these train operators have with the dft size one that the j have with the dft size one that the secretary _ have with the dft size one that the secretary of — have with the dft size one that the secretary of state _ have with the dft size one that the secretary of state is _ have with the dft size one that the secretary of state is entirely- secretary of state is entirely responsible _ secretary of state is entirely responsible for— secretary of state is entirely responsible for the - secretary of state is entirely| responsible for the industrial mandate. _ responsible for the industrial mandate, the _ responsible for the industrial mandate, the negotiating. responsible for the industrial- mandate, the negotiating mandate, too, mandate, the negotiating mandate, too. he _ mandate, the negotiating mandate, too. he has — mandate, the negotiating mandate, too. he has to— mandate, the negotiating mandate, too, he has to approve _ mandate, the negotiating mandate, too, he has to approve the - mandate, the negotiating mandate, too, he has to approve the dispute i too, he has to approve the dispute handling _ too, he has to approve the dispute handling programme, _ too, he has to approve the dispute handling programme, and - too, he has to approve the dispute handling programme, and three, l too, he has to approve the dispute i handling programme, and three, they will make _ handling programme, and three, they will make no— handling programme, and three, they will make no communication - handling programme, and three, they will make no communication with - handling programme, and three, they will make no communication with the| will make no communication with the trade _ will make no communication with the trade unions — will make no communication with the trade unions without _ will make no communication with the trade unions without his _ will make no communication with the trade unions without his prior- trade unions without his prior approval. _ trade unions without his prior approval, including _ trade unions without his prior approval, including writing i trade unions without his prior approval, including writing a i approval, including writing a business _ approval, including writing a business as— approval, including writing a business as usual— approval, including writing a business as usual letter. - approval, including writing a business as usual letter. if i | approval, including writing a - business as usual letter. if i write to any— business as usual letter. if i write to any train— business as usual letter. if i write to any train operating _ business as usual letter. if i write to any train operating company, i business as usual letter. if i write . to any train operating company, they have to _ to any train operating company, they have to inform — to any train operating company, they have to inform the _ to any train operating company, they have to inform the dft— to any train operating company, they have to inform the dft within - to any train operating company, they have to inform the dft within three i have to inform the dft within three working _ have to inform the dft within three working days — have to inform the dft within three working days for _ have to inform the dft within three working days for the _ have to inform the dft within three working days for the contents - have to inform the dft within three working days for the contents of. working days for the contents of that letter— working days for the contents of that letter are, _ working days for the contents of that letter are, not _ working days for the contents of that letter are, not because - working days for the contents of. that letter are, not because phone calls and _ that letter are, not because phone calls and discussions _ that letter are, not because phone calls and discussions as _ that letter are, not because phone calls and discussions as well, - calls and discussions as well, according _ calls and discussions as well, according to _ calls and discussions as well, according to the _ calls and discussions as well, according to the contract, - calls and discussions as well, according to the contract, so| according to the contract, so nothing _

according to the contract, so nothing happens _ according to the contract, so nothing happens in - according to the contract, so nothing happens in this - according to the contract, so i nothing happens in this industry without— nothing happens in this industry without the _ nothing happens in this industry without the secretary— nothing happens in this industry without the secretary of- nothing happens in this industry without the secretary of state, i nothing happens in this industry. without the secretary of state, and the 50 _ without the secretary of state, and the 50 people _ without the secretary of state, and the 50 people in _ without the secretary of state, and the 50 people in the _ without the secretary of state, and the 50 people in the dft— without the secretary of state, and the 50 people in the dft today - without the secretary of state, and| the 50 people in the dft today that are working — the 50 people in the dft today that are working on _ the 50 people in the dft today that are working on this _ the 50 people in the dft today that are working on this dispute - the 50 people in the dft today that are working on this dispute and - the 50 people in the dft today that. are working on this dispute and what they call— are working on this dispute and what they call workforce _ are working on this dispute and what they call workforce reforms, - are working on this dispute and what they call workforce reforms, 50 - they call workforce reforms, 50 people — they call workforce reforms, 50 people working _ they call workforce reforms, 50 people working full—time - they call workforce reforms, 50 i people working full—time besides they call workforce reforms, 50 - people working full—time besides the politicians _ people working full—time besides the politicians right — people working full—time besides the politicians right now. _ people working full—time besides the politicians right now. so _ people working full—time besides the politicians right now. so they- politicians right now. so they insisted _ politicians right now. so they insisted right _ politicians right now. so they insisted right at _ politicians right now. so they insisted right at the - politicians right now. so they insisted right at the end - politicians right now. so they insisted right at the end that| politicians right now. so they. insisted right at the end that if the executives— insisted right at the end that if the executives involved - insisted right at the end that if the executives involved in - insisted right at the end that if the executives involved in this| the executives involved in this industry— the executives involved in this industry told _ the executives involved in this industry told you _ the executives involved in this industry told you the - the executives involved in this industry told you the truth, i the executives involved in this. industry told you the truth, they will tell— industry told you the truth, they will tell you _ industry told you the truth, they will tell you that— industry told you the truth, they will tell you that they _ industry told you the truth, they will tell you that they knew- industry told you the truth, they l will tell you that they knew before they put _ will tell you that they knew before they put that _ will tell you that they knew before they put that on _ will tell you that they knew before they put that on the _ will tell you that they knew before they put that on the table - will tell you that they knew before they put that on the table it - will tell you that they knew before they put that on the table it would be rejected. — they put that on the table it would be rejected, and _ they put that on the table it would be rejected, and mr— they put that on the table it would be rejected, and mr william - they put that on the table it would be rejected, and mr william will. be rejected, and mr william will speak— be rejected, and mr william will speak on— be rejected, and mr william will speak on his _ be rejected, and mr william will speak on his behalf, _ be rejected, and mr william will speak on his behalf, because i be rejected, and mr william will. speak on his behalf, because there are two— speak on his behalf, because there are two sets — speak on his behalf, because there are two sets of _ speak on his behalf, because there are two sets of people _ speak on his behalf, because there are two sets of people on - speak on his behalf, because there are two sets of people on these - are two sets of people on these trains, — are two sets of people on these trains, so— are two sets of people on these trains, so it_ are two sets of people on these trains, so it is _ are two sets of people on these trains, so it isjust— are two sets of people on these trains, so it isjust not- are two sets of people on these trains, so it isjust not very- trains, so it isjust not very bright _ trains, so it isjust not very bright to— trains, so it isjust not very bright to do— trains, so it isjust not very bright to do that. - trains, so it isjust not very bright to do that. why - trains, so it isjust not very. bright to do that. why would trains, so it isjust not very- bright to do that. why would you, if you are _ bright to do that. why would you, if you are seekihg _ bright to do that. why would you, if you are seekihg a _ bright to do that. why would you, if you are seeking a solution - bright to do that. why would you, if you are seeking a solution to - bright to do that. why would you, if you are seeking a solution to a - you are seeking a solution to a serious — you are seeking a solution to a serious industrial— you are seeking a solution to a serious industrial dispute - you are seeking a solution to a serious industrial dispute that| you are seeking a solution to a. serious industrial dispute that is hi-h serious industrial dispute that is high profile, _ serious industrial dispute that is high profile, you _ serious industrial dispute that is high profile, you wait _ serious industrial dispute that is high profile, you wait until- serious industrial dispute that is high profile, you wait until the l high profile, you wait until the suhday— high profile, you wait until the sunday afternoon— high profile, you wait until the sunday afternoon at _ high profile, you wait until the sunday afternoon at four - high profile, you wait until the i sunday afternoon at four o'clock high profile, you wait until the - sunday afternoon at four o'clock to put sunday afternoon at four o'clock to but hihe _ sunday afternoon at four o'clock to put nine clauses _ sunday afternoon at four o'clock to put nine clauses into— sunday afternoon at four o'clock to put nine clauses into a _ sunday afternoon at four o'clock to put nine clauses into a document l put nine clauses into a document that were — put nine clauses into a document that were hot _ put nine clauses into a document that were not in _ put nine clauses into a document that were not in the _ put nine clauses into a document that were not in the previous - that were not in the previous version? _ that were not in the previous version? it _ that were not in the previous version? it is _ that were not in the previous version? it is daft. _ that were not in the previous version? it is daft. to - that were not in the previous version? it is daft. to me - that were not in the previous version? it is daft. to me it. that were not in the previousl version? it is daft. to me it is sabotaged _ version? it is daft. to me it is sabotaged. and _ version? it is daft. to me it is sabotaged. and they- version? it is daft. to me it is sabotaged. and they wanted i version? it is daft. to me it is . sabotaged. and they wanted the strikes _ sabotaged. and they wanted the strikes to— sabotaged. and they wanted the strikes to go _ sabotaged. and they wanted the

strikes to go ahead. _ sabotaged. and they wanted the strikes to go ahead. they - sabotaged. and they wanted the strikes to go ahead. they knew. sabotaged. and they wanted the . strikes to go ahead. they knew that going _ strikes to go ahead. they knew that going forward — strikes to go ahead. they knew that going forward with _ strikes to go ahead. they knew that going forward with the _ strikes to go ahead. they knew that going forward with the imposition . strikes to go ahead. they knew that| going forward with the imposition of chahge _ going forward with the imposition of chahge ih _ going forward with the imposition of change in network— going forward with the imposition of change in network rail— going forward with the imposition of change in network rail would - going forward with the imposition of i change in network rail would provoke a reaction. _ change in network rail would provoke a reaction. they— change in network rail would provoke a reaction, they got _ change in network rail would provoke a reaction, they got the _ change in network rail would provoke a reaction, they got the reaction - a reaction, they got the reaction and tet— a reaction, they got the reaction and let the — a reaction, they got the reaction and let the strikes _ a reaction, they got the reaction and let the strikes go— a reaction, they got the reaction and let the strikes go ahead - a reaction, they got the reaction| and let the strikes go ahead over christmas, — and let the strikes go ahead over christmas, they— and let the strikes go ahead over christmas, they did _ and let the strikes go ahead over christmas, they did not - and let the strikes go ahead over christmas, they did not lift - and let the strikes go ahead over christmas, they did not lift the l christmas, they did not lift the telephone _ christmas, they did not lift the telephone or— christmas, they did not lift the telephone or lift _ christmas, they did not lift the telephone or lift a _ christmas, they did not lift the telephone or lift a finger- christmas, they did not lift the telephone or lift a finger to - christmas, they did not lift the | telephone or lift a finger to get them _ telephone or lift a finger to get them off, — telephone or lift a finger to get them off, they— telephone or lift a finger to get them off, they brought- telephone or lift a finger to get them off, they brought forward stage-managed _ them off, they brought forward stage—managed releases- them off, they brought forward stage—managed releases in- them off, they brought forwardi stage—managed releases in the them off, they brought forward - stage—managed releases in the last week about — stage—managed releases in the last week about minimum _ stage—managed releases in the last week about minimum service - stage—managed releases in the lastl week about minimum service levels, but disruption — week about minimum service levels, but disruption and _ week about minimum service levels, but disruption and all _ week about minimum service levels, but disruption and all the _ week about minimum service levels, but disruption and all the rest - week about minimum service levels, but disruption and all the rest of - but disruption and all the rest of the com — but disruption and all the rest of the com about _ but disruption and all the rest of the com about me _ but disruption and all the rest of the com about me and _ but disruption and all the rest of the com about me and various . but disruption and all the rest of - the com about me and various other people _ the com about me and various other people irr— the com about me and various other people in the — the com about me and various other people in the industry, _ the com about me and various other people in the industry, all— the com about me and various other people in the industry, all primed i people in the industry, all primed through— people in the industry, all primed through certain _ people in the industry, all primed through certain press _ people in the industry, all primed through certain press outlets. - people in the industry, all primed| through certain press outlets. the whole _ through certain press outlets. the whole thing — through certain press outlets. the whole thing has _ through certain press outlets. the whole thing has been _ through certain press outlets. the whole thing has been completelyi whole thing has been completely stage-managed _ whole thing has been completely stage—managed leading - whole thing has been completely stage—managed leading up- whole thing has been completely stage—managed leading up until| stage—managed leading up until mohday's— stage—managed leading up until monday's sessions— stage—managed leading up until monday's sessions with - stage—managed leading up until monday's sessions with the - stage—managed leading up untili monday's sessions with the trade unions _ monday's sessions with the trade unions as— monday's sessions with the trade unions as far— monday's sessions with the trade unions. as far as _ monday's sessions with the trade unions. as far as i— monday's sessions with the trade unions. as far as i can _ monday's sessions with the trade unions. as far as i can see. - monday's sessions with the trade unions. as far as i can see. so i unions. as far as i can see. so there — unions. as far as i can see. so there is— unions. as far as i can see. so there is a _ unions. as far as i can see. so there is a deliberate _ unions. as far as i can see. so. there is a deliberate torpedoing unions. as far as i can see. so - there is a deliberate torpedoing of there is a deliberate torpedoing of the talks— there is a deliberate torpedoing of the talks which _ there is a deliberate torpedoing of the talks which could _ there is a deliberate torpedoing of the talks which could have - the talks which could have developed _ the talks which could have developed. that's - the talks which could have developed. that's why- the talks which could havei developed. that's why dlo the talks which could have i developed. that's why dlo is the talks which could have - developed. that's why dlo is in there. _ developed. that's why dlo is in there. not— developed. that's why dlo is in there, not because _ developed. that's why dlo is in there, not because it— developed. that's why dlo is in there, not because it would - developed. that's why dlo is ini there, not because it would have helped _ there, not because it would have helped resolve _ there, not because it would have helped resolve the _ there, not because it would have helped resolve the dispute. - there, not because it would have helped resolve the dispute. [m i helped resolve the dispute. i'm auoin to helped resolve the dispute. i'm going to try _ helped resolve the dispute. going to try and stick to the question i asked in the first place, i know my colleagues will come back round in discussions and questions about the specifics of government intervention or not, and the

opportunity to go through the annual summer detail then, opportunity to go through the annual summer detailthen, but opportunity to go through the annual summer detail then, but whether you are saying there's actually no way any train will run with the 00? gray we will not accept that. we won't continue with any talks that has that as a prerequisite. quite simply, i have given everything to this body before, the position remains the same, the train drivers who do it hate it and think it is unsafe, we believe it is inherently unsafe. prior to the pandemic the whole industry was moving in a different direction, all the travelling public and all passenger focused and everybody wanted a visible presence in safe presence on every train. we have seen sexual assaults in a railway increase by 180%, county lines and drugs, areas with people refusing to

move without security guards in trains and certain times of night, unfortunately society has not got more polite or safe, and since then the relatively standard laws have designated train drivers as lone worker so every role has to be re—evaluated in light of us being lone workers, so when there is no one in booking offices or on trains, we do not believe it is a safe railway for the travelling public, but also we do believe you need everybody in all those positions to run a safe railway and we will not be supporting doo run a safe railway and we will not be supporting 000 as part of this deal or any future deal. {line be supporting d00 as part of this deal or any future deal. one quick ruestion, deal or any future deal. one quick question. is _ deal or any future deal. one quick question, is there _ deal or any future deal. one quick question, is there a _ deal or any future deal. one quick question, is there a difference - deal or any future deal. one quick i question, is there a difference from your perspective, of driver only operated and driver —controlled operated? ie there is another person on the train, they might not be opening and shutting the doors? trio. opening and shutting the doors? no, it's about opening and shutting the doors? iirr, it's about dispatch comments about our victorian infrastructure, it's about 000 was delivered at a time with three—car trains and you drop

the windowed on the side and you can see back along the length of the train. it was not designed for 12 or 13 car trains with 1300 people on and one body to protect them, and if that one body got injured or has a medical incident, there is nobody to look after the travelling public. that was not what d00 was designed for. also d00 initially was in intensive urban areas where there was a station every couple of minutes. modern proposals are for d00 everywhere where maybe 27 or 30 minutes or an error between stations where anything can happen to the travelling public and there is no protection, and we cannot support that. . . . protection, and we cannot support that. ., , ., , , ' that. that is a slightly different osition that. that is a slightly different position has — that. that is a slightly different position has been _ that. that is a slightly different position has been taken, - that. that is a slightly different position has been taken, i - that. that is a slightly different| position has been taken, i want that. that is a slightly different. position has been taken, i want to come back the sense that you are saying it is not appropriate for the long big change for the little ones is when it was introduced in the first place, as there are therefore not still a window for some use in certain environmentsl don't believe so, i think the real problem with the nature of modern society and the

dangers of the travelling public... and to the staff and the railway preclude anybody from working alone. my preclude anybody from working alone. my questions are mainly to mr whelan, and first rent an offer on pay and conditions, have you received an offer from rdg? the first i received an offer from rdg? the first i knew _ received an offer from rdg? the first i knew was _ received an offer from rdg? tie: first i knew was when received an offer from rdg? tte: first i knew was when my received an offer from rdg? tt9 first i knew was when my media person rang me up and said what do you say about the offer? if i can go slightly backwards to explain the chronology, it might assist. i had been approached by mr montgomerie who will you will speak to later, on the friday christmas week, saying can we meet next week i smack i had met mr harper and mr merryman prior that and we were awaiting that meeting before further talks because we needed to understand the role of the rail minister and facilitation of the talks. but also pointing out that at that point in time unfortunately, like anyone else, my negotiating team has had to take

leave and had no availability. two of the three were out of the country and we could not anyway. i very quickly received an e—mail from the real minister's departments include we meet and we met on monday, the first available slot, the same reason i gave to the negotiators of the art irg. to my surprise, i did have a text from mr montgomerie on the friday morning, at least two be filtering back and finish other things that they, could be talking my things that they, could be talking my first knowledge of the deal that contains red lines is only things we had not discussed was when we had been asked by the press are view on the deal. i went back to my e—mails later after having said i had not seen the deal to find out i had been sent an e—mail at 15:18. and then the press release went out 20 minutes later. in the press release went out 20 minutes later.— the press release went out 20 minutes later. , :, . minutes later. in terms of the deal ou've minutes later. in terms of the deal you've been _ minutes later. in terms of the deal you've been offered, _ minutes later. in terms of the deal you've been offered, which - minutes later. in terms of the deal| you've been offered, which aspects of that are acceptable to your

members and which are not? there is not one line — members and which are not? there is not one line in — members and which are not? there is not one line in that _ members and which are not? there is not one line in that deal, _ members and which are not? there is not one line in that deal, from - members and which are not? there is not one line in that deal, from the - not one line in that deal, from the opening comments to the final., that i could recommend, because the deal basically says we rip up every agreement we have, local and national, forever and the day, have no rights to negotiate in the future, and it will be forced upon members, which is not what we agreed within the enabling agreement. what we agreed tojoin within the enabling agreement. what we agreed to join trade unions, and the enabling agreement, that we would create a high level things we passed down to our 15 negotiating groups on the talks and they would then negotiate safely on those items of the code. and if they could then make a recommendation, we would then put that to our members in those different companies. part of the difficulty we have is there is not a one size fits all deal. i have companies because of the rationalisation of the railway and the cutting and carving up of the map, i have three sets of drivers in different conditions in one company. every deal an aspect of the deal may impact upon those terms and conditions and the ability to do a

deal a different way.— conditions and the ability to do a deal a different way. what would you like to see deal _ deal a different way. what would you like to see deal to _ deal a different way. what would you like to see deal to make _ deal a different way. what would you like to see deal to make it _ deal a different way. what would you like to see deal to make it so - deal a different way. what would you like to see deal to make it so that. like to see deal to make it so that it would be near to something you would accept? t it would be near to something you would accept?— would accept? i think we are very much getting _ would accept? i think we are very much getting to _ would accept? i think we are very much getting to the _ would accept? i think we are very much getting to the point - would accept? i think we are very much getting to the point after i would accept? i think we are very l much getting to the point after four years without a pay offer, a significant pay offer, a significant payoff, that we need a clear pay offer to move forward, to get out of the current strife we are in. to go back to the table clean, moving forward. most of what is contained in that deal, there is no modernisation or reform, it is the productivity grab, hundreds of millions of pounds of productivity for nothing for a 20% cut in pay. and strange enough, i do see the role of trade unions to protect the standards of living and the people they represent. [30 standards of living and the people they represent-— they represent. do you recognise there is a need _ they represent. do you recognise there is a need to _ they represent. do you recognise there is a need to modernise - they represent. do you recognise i there is a need to modernise certain terms and conditions? in there is a need to modernise certain terms and conditions?— terms and conditions? in the areas where we have _ terms and conditions? in the areas where we have to _ terms and conditions? in the areas where we have to modernise, - terms and conditions? in the areas where we have to modernise, i- terms and conditions? in the areas i where we have to modernise, i think i'm the person that signed off st pancras, both my colleagues made public statements about where we facilitate modernisation before. there has been —— has not been a major project in the uk that has not

happened without the buying and willingness of the trade unions. we want to grow railways, i don't want there being no toilets on trains, going to two or three coloured lights at an ato, i want to green railway, a central green revolution, that we decarbonise and deliver kyoto, paris, whatever, what we are currently seeing unfortunately seen not modernisation, it is a productivity grab of a wish left that all the countries could not achieve in the us to have their case, because on many occasions they could not afford them. in case, because on many occasions they could not afford them.— could not afford them. in terms of -a could not afford them. in terms of pay increase. _ could not afford them. in terms of pay increase, the _ could not afford them. in terms of pay increase, the average - could not afford them. in terms of pay increase, the average driver. pay increase, the average driver salary is more or less double the average salary in my constituency, would you expect that it is right for my constituents to have to pay more to fund these increases to driver salary spice t more to fund these increases to driver salary spice— more to fund these increases to driver salary spice i find it rather intriguing. _ driver salary spice i find it rather intriguing, because _ driver salary spice i find it rather

intriguing, because we - driver salary spice i find it rather intriguing, because we don't - driver salary spice i find it rather. intriguing, because we don't work for dft, we don't work for the treasury or the government. i have 15 different disputes with 15 train operating companies who are declining profits and paying dividends, and in any e economic organisation, you would have fixed costs first before the dividends or profits, and i look in the industry and see the high profits of the venture capitalists and we find ourselves in a monty python world where they are funding the shareholders to keep private interest within industry itself, and thatis interest within industry itself, and that is not going to happen. rail union bosses _ that is not going to happen. rail union bosses continuing to talk to members of the transport select committee. the hearing began with the chair of the committee asking them what the likelihood was of any resolution to the strike action that railway workers have taken, with one

being the site remaining on different planets, ten being it was time to buy a hat for the wedding, and in response mick whelan said i think you can include zero, we are further away than when we started, that was the beginning of the hearing. we will be back in a little while when bosses from the rail industry are also up for the transport select committee, but right now it is time to take a look at the weather forecast. today's forecast is one of gusty winds, and also heavy downpours. we started off on a dry —— there is moving in across england and wales and across western scotland and northern ireland. in between, fewer servers as we go through the latter part of the afternoon but it will be one day once again, strongest winds in the coasts and hills in the west and south. we carry on the showers overnight but heavy rain comes in across northern ireland, southern scotland, england and wales, falling

on ground that is already saturated, once again exacerbating the flooding risk. still mild in the south, killer in the north, but we can see some ice on untreated surfaces, possibly a touch of frost. tomorrow, rain in the south, south—west and approaches, more rain across england and wales and showers across england and wales and showers across parts of scotland and northern ireland. in between something brighter with highs up to 13.

this is bbc news. i'm annita mcveigh. the headlines at 10:00am... around 20,000 ambulance workers in england and wales are striking for a second time over pay and staffing. health bosses warn of the impact to the nhs, but unions say the most urgent cases will be covered. in scotland, exams are being rescheduled as secondary teachers strike in an going dispute about pay. strike in an ongoing dispute about pay. rail unions appear before a committee of mps, with little sign of their long running dispute over payjob security and working conditions being resolved. i wouldn't be able to say. it depends on discussions. i'm not going to use a scale, but we haven't got an agreement until we get an agreement and we are not close to it, really. counterterrorism police investigate how scrap metal containing traces of uranium arrived

at london's heathrow airport last month.