good morning, a great hour ahead. but first, a warning, politicians are on the prowl. careful, if there is a knock at the door. haw are on the prowl. careful, if there is a knock at the door.— are on the prowl. careful, if there is a knock at the door. how are you doin: , is a knock at the door. how are you doing. sorry _ is a knock at the door. how are you doing. sorry to _ is a knock at the door. how are you doing, sorry to disturb _ is a knock at the door. how are you doing, sorry to disturb you. - is a knock at the door. how are you doing, sorry to disturb you. they i doing, sorry to disturb you. they are after your — doing, sorry to disturb you. they are after your backing. _ doing, sorry to disturb you. they are after your backing. keir starmer wants to grab control in middle england and swindon. d0 wants to grab control in middle england and swindon.- wants to grab control in middle england and swindon. do you think, do ou england and swindon. do you think, do you believe _ england and swindon. do you think, do you believe that _ england and swindon. do you think, do you believe that britain - england and swindon. do you think, do you believe that britain deservesi do you believe that britain deserves better? , do you believe that britain deserves better? yes! the lib dems subtly usin: a better? yes! the lib dems subtly using a tractor — better? yes! the lib dems subtly using a tractor to _ better? yes! the lib dems subtly using a tractor to go after the countryside vote. the using a tractor to go after the countryside vote.— using a tractor to go after the count side vote. �* , , ., , countryside vote. the british people can send the — countryside vote. the british people can send the conservatives - countryside vote. the british people can send the conservatives are - countryside vote. the british people can send the conservatives are very| can send the conservatives are very strong message, that they are fed up of them. the strong message, that they are fed up of them. ~ , ., , of them. the prime minister on his home patch. _ of them. the prime minister on his home patch. yes. _ of them. the prime minister on his home patch, yes, pointing - of them. the prime minister on his home patch, yes, pointing out- of them. the prime minister on his home patch, yes, pointing out the| home patch, yes, pointing out the potholes. next month, the local elections are the first real fight for these two at the ballot box. and

early verdicts on the promises rishi sunak has made. we early verdicts on the promises rishi sunak has made.— sunak has made. we will have a s stem sunak has made. we will have a system whereby _ sunak has made. we will have a system whereby if _ sunak has made. we will have a system whereby if people - sunak has made. we will have a system whereby if people come | sunak has made. we will have a - system whereby if people come here illegally they won't be able to stay, they will be detained and swiftly removed. the stay, they will be detained and swiftly removed.— stay, they will be detained and swiftly removed. the loudest has been how to _ swiftly removed. the loudest has been how to get _ swiftly removed. the loudest has been how to get a _ swiftly removed. the loudest has been how to get a handle - swiftly removed. the loudest has been how to get a handle on - been how to get a handle on immigration. his and the home secretary's plans staring arguments too. , , . ., , too. refugees deserve sanctuary in britain! 0ne _ too. refugees deserve sanctuary in britain! one big _ too. refugees deserve sanctuary in britain! one big question _ too. refugees deserve sanctuary in britain! one big question this - britain! one big question this mornin: , britain! one big question this morning. how _ britain! one big question this morning, how should - britain! one big question this i morning, how should politicians manage those who want to make britain their home? this morning, for the first time, we arejoined live by the home secretary, suella braverman — the woman trying to sort out the mess of our migration system. what would labour's answers be? labour's lisa nandy joins us from salford. but that's not all — daring new world, grave danger, or maybe both. we'll talk to a billionaire investorjaan tallinn, who thinks artifical intelligence must be controlled. and her characters, her stories, are now heading

to the silver screen — judy blume, the author agony aunt for a whole generation of young women, whose books are being banned again in america, on waht�*s going on across the pond. bad stuff, and that's what i think of it, you know? bad politicians. and with me at the desk for the next 60 minutes — countryside queen, minette batters — president of the national farmers union. the uk boss of megawebsite, ebay, murray lambell. and the labour mayor of west yorkshire and former corrie and emmerdale star, tracy brabin. good morning and welcome to the programme. we'll look at the front pages in a second but do wait for that judy blume interview —

i've always wanted to speak to her. now, those front pages. sunday telegraph, staff could sue their boss if customers offend them. the observer says there is a crisis in care homes for children. and sunday times ones of more health strikes to come. the mail on sunday says there is a vegan plot to sabotage the grand national. the sunday mirror pays tribute to paul o'grady, the comic who passed away this week. the sunday express puts even more pressure on the prime minister over his migration commitments. we can get straight to that. welcome to you all and we will speak to the home secretary in a few minutes. forthe speak to the home secretary in a few minutes. for the farming industry, often you say you have to have immigration because you need people to pick things in fields, but the government says actually you can get brits to do it so what's going on, minette? it’s brits to do it so what's going on, minette? �* , ., brits to do it so what's going on, minette? �*, ., .,, ., _ .,, brits to do it so what's going on, minette? �*, ., ., _ ., minette? it's not as easy as that. we need about _ minette? it's not as easy as that. we need about 70,000 - minette? it's not as easy as that. we need about 70,000 people i minette? it's not as easy as that. | we need about 70,000 people for seasonal work alone, and that is to

pick, pack ourfruit seasonal work alone, and that is to pick, pack our fruit and vegetables and flowers. this is a bridge to an automated industry but that is five or ten years away and will take huge amounts of investment. we have made the case all along for a seasonal workers scheme and i'm pleased the home office has listened. we now have a scheme for 45,000, which is still a big shortfall. what this industry desperately needs is knowing what the road ahead is about, making sure we have a five year scheme so not every single year, which it has been to date we are having to battle, effectively to get these numbers down. iloathed are having to battle, effectively to get these numbers down. what about in a business — get these numbers down. what about in a business like _ get these numbers down. what about in a business like yours, _ get these numbers down. what about in a business like yours, murray. - get these numbers down. what about in a business like yours, murray. a i in a business like yours, murray. a new and modern business, so what's going on with the labour force and what's your view on immigration? i what's your view on immigration? i spend a tonne of time up and down the country— spend a tonne of time up and down the country talking to small businesses we represent and there is currently— businesses we represent and there is currently a _ businesses we represent and there is currently a shortage of skilled labour— currently a shortage of skilled labour doing technically advanced work and — labour doing technically advanced work and we need more of those people _ work and we need more of those people both domestically trained and to come _ people both domestically trained and

to come into the country, so attracting _ to come into the country, so attracting highly qualified migrants is what _ attracting highly qualified migrants is what we need in this country to boost _ is what we need in this country to boost the — is what we need in this country to boost the economy. the government would say there _ boost the economy. the government would say there is _ boost the economy. the government would say there is the _ boost the economy. the government would say there is the ownership - would say there is the ownership beyond business and everyone to train up brits and we have people here to do these jobs. —— the onus is on business. the here to do these 'obs. -- the onus is on business._ here to do these 'obs. -- the onus is on business. the government has had policies — is on business. the government has had policies that _ is on business. the government has had policies that were _ is on business. the government has had policies that were suspended i is on business. the government has had policies that were suspended or stopped _ had policies that were suspended or stopped that were there to help domestic skills. that's part of the equation — domestic skills. that's part of the equation. there is still a shortage, looking _ equation. there is still a shortage, looking at— equation. there is still a shortage, looking at what we need across the country. _ looking at what we need across the country, and i speak to hundreds of thousands— country, and i speak to hundreds of thousands of businesses we represent and they— thousands of businesses we represent and they have a problem with enough skills we _ and they have a problem with enough skills we need to bring into the country — skills we need to bring into the country |— skills we need to bring into the count . ., ., ., , country. i love the idea of people ”ackin country. i love the idea of people packing up _ country. i love the idea of people packing up their— country. i love the idea of people packing up their stuff _ country. i love the idea of people packing up their stuff for - country. i love the idea of people packing up their stuff for ebay i country. i love the idea of people packing up their stuff for ebay to | packing up their stuff for ebay to sell on the website. tracy, you live in west yorkshire, a lot of people voted for brexit there with the hope immigration would come down. what you make up the conversation now? we have the same problem murray was talking _ have the same problem murray was talking about — have the same problem murray was talking about. people _ have the same problem murray was talking about. people and _ have the same problem murray was i talking about. people and businesses speaking _ talking about. people and businesses speaking to— talking about. people and businesses speaking to me — talking about. people and businesses speaking to me about _ talking about. people and businesses speaking to me about the _ talking about. people and businesses speaking to me about the challenges| speaking to me about the challenges after brexit _ speaking to me about the challenges after brexit was _ speaking to me about the challenges after brexit was up _ speaking to me about the challenges after brexit was up however- speaking to me about the challenges after brexit was up however we - after brexit was up however we voted, — after brexit was up however we voted, it — after brexit was up however we voted, it is— after brexit was up however we voted, it is done _ after brexit was up however we voted, it is done and _ after brexit was up however we voted, it is done and dusted i after brexit was up however wel voted, it is done and dusted and after brexit was up however we - voted, it is done and dusted and we have to _ voted, it is done and dusted and we have to look— voted, it is done and dusted and we

have to look at _ voted, it is done and dusted and we have to look at our _ voted, it is done and dusted and we have to look at our new— voted, it is done and dusted and we have to look at our new relationship with the _ have to look at our new relationship with the markets. _ have to look at our new relationship with the markets. that's _ have to look at our new relationship with the markets. that's why - have to look at our new relationship with the markets. that's why as - with the markets. that's why as mayor _ with the markets. that's why as mayor i — with the markets. that's why as mayor i want _ with the markets. that's why as mayor i want further _ with the markets. that's why as mayor i want further control- with the markets. that's why as. mayor i want further control over skills _ mayor i want further control over skills because _ mayor i want further control over skills because businesses - mayor i want further control over skills because businesses are - skills because businesses are telling — skills because businesses are telling me _ skills because businesses are telling me what _ skills because businesses are telling me what we _ skills because businesses are telling me what we need - skills because businesses are telling me what we need and| skills because businesses are i telling me what we need and we skills because businesses are - telling me what we need and we can react guite _ telling me what we need and we can react quite swiftly _ telling me what we need and we can react quite swiftly on _ telling me what we need and we can react quite swiftly on the _ telling me what we need and we can react quite swiftly on the ground - telling me what we need and we can react quite swiftly on the ground to| react quite swiftly on the ground to deliver— react quite swiftly on the ground to deliver that — react quite swiftly on the ground to deliver that skilled _ react quite swiftly on the ground to deliver that skilled workforce - react quite swiftly on the ground to deliver that skilled workforce but i deliver that skilled workforce but we need — deliver that skilled workforce but we need the _ deliver that skilled workforce but we need the powers— deliver that skilled workforce but we need the powers and - deliver that skilled workforce but we need the powers and money, | deliver that skilled workforce but - we need the powers and money, the deeper— we need the powers and money, the deeper devolution— we need the powers and money, the deeper devolution to _ we need the powers and money, the deeper devolution to do _ we need the powers and money, the deeper devolution to do that. - we need the powers and money, the deeper devolution to do that. find? i deeper devolution to do that. andy street, the deeper devolution to do that. street, the birmingham mayor deeper devolution to do that.- street, the birmingham mayor made deeper devolution to do that— street, the birmingham mayor made a similar case will giving more powers to him when he was in the studio last week. thank you for being here and plenty more for you to talk about later in the programme. suella braverman quit as home secretary for inadvertently leaking information about the job first time round. but rishi sunak brought her back immediately to one of the biggest posts in the land when he became prime minister. most of her colleagues would characterise her as being on the right of their party, she's not shy of controversy, a proud brexiteer, who's said she wants to "get rid of this woke rubbish" — we'll ask her what that means later. let's talk about a pressing issue for lots of people who are just trying to have an easter holiday. there are all sorts of queues and

delays at dover so when will that be cleared? let delays at dover so when will that be cleared? , ., ., _ cleared? let me first of all say i really sympathise _ cleared? let me first of all say i really sympathise with - cleared? let me first of all say i really sympathise with familiesl cleared? let me first of all say i i really sympathise with families and school children who are trying to get to france for their easter holidays. no one wants to be waiting for hours, overnight at dover in a coach. there's been some really good working by the ferry companies will stop effectively what's happened is they have seen an acute pressure of bookings, of coaches and journeys across the channel. it's a very busy time of year and there has been some bad weather but they have been putting on extra journeys over night. they are positive that this will be eased very soon and i urge people to have a bit of patience. what do you mean by very soon? we have seen this before and it seems like every school holiday there is a big pressure and people have the beginning of their holiday ruined so can you tell people when it will be sorted? , , ., , ., ,, sorted? this is ultimately an issue for the ferry _ sorted? this is ultimately an issue for the ferry companies. _ sorted? this is ultimately an issue for the ferry companies. the - for the ferry companies. the government is in close contact with

the kent resilience forum, with companies and with authorities to make sure they have the right resources necessary. but ultimately it will ease and i ask everybody to check their journey times carefully but it's a busy time of year and i would say generally speaking our borders are flowing very well and we have very quick processes. it will just require a bit of patience. do ou just require a bit of patience. do you think it will happen every school holiday? is this just something we should expect now? trio. something we should expect now? no, not at all. something we should expect now? my, not at all. looking into recent years, things have been very smooth, operating smoothly at the border. we had strikes and industrial action over the christmas period, for example border force, within my remit, we had a lot of contingency arrangements in place and people were reporting faster than usual processing at the border when it came to the airports for example so i don't think this is a state of affairs to get worried. it i don't think this is a state of affairs to get worried.- i don't think this is a state of affairs to get worried. it will not be a regular _ affairs to get worried. it will not be a regular feature, _ affairs to get worried. it will not be a regular feature, along - affairs to get worried. it will not be a regular feature, along withj be a regular feature, along with packing your first aid kit, be a regular feature, along with packing yourfirst aid kit, your chargers and adapters, you hope it

will ease and we will not see it again? will ease and we will not see it auain? ~ ., ., will ease and we will not see it aaain? . ., . ., again? we have a particular combination _ again? we have a particular combination of _ again? we have a particular combination of factors - again? we have a particular combination of factors that l again? we have a particular- combination of factors that have occurred at this moment in time and i think we are supporting the port authorities and ferry companies and the local bodies to ensure people are properly supported. let’s the local bodies to ensure people are properly supported. let's talk about something _ are properly supported. let's talk about something else _ are properly supported. let's talk about something else that - are properly supported. let's talk l about something else that concerns the channel. one of your flagship policies and the prime minister's slogan to stop the boats. you think it is possible that 80,000 people will come across the channel in small boats this year but you have promised it will end. can you honestly say this morning it will not end this year, in 2023? at}! honestly say this morning it will not end this year, in 2023? of the prime minister _ not end this year, in 2023? of the prime minister has _ not end this year, in 2023? of the prime minister has made - not end this year, in 2023? of the prime minister has made a - not end this year, in 2023? of the prime minister has made a key i not end this year, in 2023? of ii�*uéi prime minister has made a key pledge to stop the boats. it will be pretty obvious when we have succeeded in achieving that. i will not put clear dates on everything. we have to take the steps as they evolve. we have introduced legislation very recently, in the last few weeks and that will make clear if you arrive here illegally you will be detained

and swiftly removed. we have reached and swiftly removed. we have reached a record deal with the french and we are moving forward and making progress on the asylum backlog, announcing new sites this week. we have to abide by various timelines in parliament or court but as quickly as possible is my ambition. but it will not be realistically this year because of what you have set out, it's a long process. share set out, it's a long process. are not going _ set out, it's a long process. are not going to _ set out, it's a long process. are not going to put _ set out, it's a long process. are not going to put a _ set out, it's a long process. fife: not going to put a firm date on it. we are in court, our partnership with rwanda is currently in litigation. we won in the high court emphatically at the end of last year and we are now being appealed. there is a hearing later this month and we need to wait for the court to adjudicate. i can't control court deadlines and therefore we will respect any decision from the court but we have to abide by the time line set byjudges.— but we have to abide by the time line set byjudges. line set by 'udges. we'll talk about that in a line set byjudges. we'll talk about that in a few _ line set byjudges. we'll talk about that in a few minutes' _ line set byjudges. we'll talk about that in a few minutes' time. - line set byjudges. we'll talk about that in a few minutes' time. your. that in a few minutes' time. your plan is to detain migrants to come to the country without permission. how many people are you expecting to detain and where are you going to put them? you know, you have

announced a couple of new sites this week but right now there's only space for a couple of thousand people. where are they going to go? that speak clear that our scheme to detain and swiftly remove doesn't require 50,000 new detention places and the government is in no way planning to do that.— and the government is in no way planning to do that. what happens if 50,000 planning to do that. what happens if 50.000 people _ planning to do that. what happens if 50,000 people arrive? _ planning to do that. what happens if 50,000 people arrive? we - planning to do that. what happens if 50,000 people arrive? we need - planning to do that. what happens if 50,000 people arrive? we need to l 50,000 people arrive? we need to increase our— 50,000 people arrive? we need to increase our detention _ 50,000 people arrive? we need to increase our detention estate. - 50,000 people arrive? we need to increase our detention estate. we l increase our detention estate. we have several thousand places already that we use and we have capacity there but we do need to increase some detention capacity. what we believe the work is that once we are able to relocate people from the uk to rwanda, pursuant to our world leading deal, that will have a significant deterrent effect and people will stop making the journey in the first place, they will stop paying evil people smuggling gangs in the first place and numbers will come down. that's notjust speculation, that is born out of experience from other countries who have rolled out a similar scheme, for example australia.— have rolled out a similar scheme, for example australia. that's what ou ho -e for example australia. that's what you hope will— for example australia. that's what you hope will happen. _ for example australia. that's what

you hope will happen. but - for example australia. that's what you hope will happen. but there i for example australia. that's what l you hope will happen. but there are still concerns you will need many more places. there are reports this morning a deal has been done to have a barge with a portland port authority, a floating barge of migrants. is it true that deal has been struck to cite a barge in that part of the country?— been struck to cite a barge in that part of the country? forgive me, i will not get _ part of the country? forgive me, i will not get into _ part of the country? forgive me, i will not get into the _ part of the country? forgive me, i will not get into the details - part of the country? forgive me, i will not get into the details of- will not get into the details of private commercial negotiations. it is in the newspapers this morning, you can tell us if it is true or not. ~ ., ., ~ you can tell us if it is true or not. . . ., ,, ., you can tell us if it is true or not. ~ . ., ~ ., ., ., , not. we are talking to operators, owners of — not. we are talking to operators, owners of lots _ not. we are talking to operators, owners of lots of _ not. we are talking to operators, owners of lots of different - not. we are talking to operators, owners of lots of different kinds l not. we are talking to operators, l owners of lots of different kinds of property around the country. we have announced sites earlier this week, those are sites where we have a level of confidence, and we are able to be public about those sites and we are aiming to roll them out quickly and start making them fit for accommodation purposes and relocate people on to those sites for asylum purposes. we are looking at all options. we are looking at all sorts of land and sites and vessels and we are in negotiations with a high number of operators

around the country. but with a high number of operators around the country.— with a high number of operators around the country. but would you exect around the country. but would you exoect there _ around the country. but would you exoect there to — around the country. but would you expect there to be _ around the country. but would you expect there to be migrants - around the country. but would you | expect there to be migrants housed in that part of the country because the local mp there thinks it will happen and he also says it shouldn't happen. t happen and he also says it shouldn't ha en. ., . ., happen and he also says it shouldn't hauen. ., ., happen. i will not confirm and pre-empt _ happen. i will not confirm and pre-empt our— happen. i will not confirm and pre-empt our private - happen. i will not confirm and i pre-empt our private commercial pre—empt our private commercial discussions will stop you will have to wait a little bit longer.- to wait a little bit longer. there is a tension _ to wait a little bit longer. there is a tension here _ to wait a little bit longer. there is a tension here because - to wait a little bit longer. there is a tension here because you l to wait a little bit longer. there i is a tension here because you and the prime minister talk very regularly about bringing down migration, in particular bringing an end to the terrible trade of people crossing the channel and being exploited by people smugglers. except that the government has also just presided over half a million people coming here last year, a quarter of a million people expected to come next year. although we are hearing the government taking what i think you would say is a tougher line on immigration, tougher all the time, actually more people than ever before are coming to the uk. i time, actually more people than ever before are coming to the uk.- before are coming to the uk. i don't think it's fair — before are coming to the uk. i don't think it's fair to _ before are coming to the uk. i don't think it's fair to conflate _ before are coming to the uk. i don't think it's fair to conflate illegal - think it's fair to conflate illegal migration with legal migration. they are two very different cohorts of people. we have taken back control

over our migration rules after brexit. we set up a points—based system. therefore we have made us a government the decision to issue visas for work or study purposes, depending on legitimate rules we have set up. that's very different to people coming here illegally, putting their lives at risk, paying evil people smuggling gangs, breaking our rules and coming here to game our system. those can't be considered in the same... together, in the same way. considered in the same... together, in the same way-— in the same way. many viewers this mornin: in the same way. many viewers this morning might _ in the same way. many viewers this morning might think, _ in the same way. many viewers this morning might think, hang - in the same way. many viewers this morning might think, hang on, - in the same way. many viewers this morning might think, hang on, wel morning might think, hang on, we voted, many of them, to take back control of immigration, and for many that meant immigration coming down. and you said in october you wanted immigration to come down to the tens of thousands. if that's still what you would like? £31!" of thousands. if that's still what you would like?— you would like? our manifesto commitment _ you would like? our manifesto commitment is _ you would like? our manifesto commitment is very _ you would like? our manifesto commitment is very clear - you would like? our manifesto commitment is very clear we l you would like? our manifesto - commitment is very clear we want to get overall numbers down. [30 commitment is very clear we want to get overall numbers down.— get overall numbers down. do you think it should _ get overall numbers down. do you think it should be _ get overall numbers down. do you think it should be in _ get overall numbers down. do you think it should be in the _ get overall numbers down. do you think it should be in the tens - get overall numbers down. do you think it should be in the tens of i think it should be in the tens of thousands because you said that a few months ago? it’s

thousands because you said that a few months ago?— thousands because you said that a few months ago? it's legitimate to ruestion few months ago? it's legitimate to question whether _ few months ago? it's legitimate to question whether the _ few months ago? it's legitimate to question whether the levels - few months ago? it's legitimate to question whether the levels of - question whether the levels of lawful migration are sustainable. we haveissued lawful migration are sustainable. we have issued a record number of working visas in the last year. we have the highest level of net migration. we have several thousand people already in the uk who are out of work. we have heard from speakers they are talking about the labour market shortages. we have to get the balance right. we need to incentivise people already here to get back into the labour market and we need to get the balance right between the number of people coming in for labour purposes.— in for labour purposes. viewers this mornin: in for labour purposes. viewers this morning but— in for labour purposes. viewers this morning but want _ in for labour purposes. viewers this morning but want to _ in for labour purposes. viewers this morning but want to know - in for labour purposes. viewers this morning but want to know if - in for labour purposes. viewers this morning but want to know if you i in for labour purposes. viewers this morning but want to know if you as| morning but want to know if you as the person in charge of the system believe that legal migration should believe that legal migration should be in the tens of thousands rather than the half a million it was this year? it is a clear question, do you still think immigration should be in the tens of thousands? i support our manifesto commitment to get numbers down but i do believe we have the high numbers of people

coming in is high. it places pressure on accommodation supply, on school places, on health services. those are reasonable concerns and we need to make sure we are getting the balance right of encouraging our domestic workforce back into the labour market and also ensuring that we do allow those highly skilled workers, those people who will come and help various actors in our economy to thrive.— and help various actors in our economy to thrive. let's talk about our lan economy to thrive. let's talk about your plan for _ economy to thrive. let's talk about your plan for migrants _ economy to thrive. let's talk about your plan for migrants to _ economy to thrive. let's talk about your plan for migrants to go - economy to thrive. let's talk about your plan for migrants to go to - your plan for migrants to go to rwanda. i know you are proud of the deal you have done with the government there unhappy with the arrangements you have made. if migrants do end up there from the uk, if they are not happy, should they be able to protest about their living conditions once they get there? , . ., ,, , living conditions once they get there? ,. . ~' , . . there? our scheme makes it clear that if you — there? our scheme makes it clear that if you come _ there? our scheme makes it clear that if you come here _ there? our scheme makes it clear that if you come here illegally, i there? our scheme makes it clearj that if you come here illegally, we are going to be detained and thereafter swiftly removed to a safe country or the country from which

you came if it is safe. rwanda is our first choice of country to which we want to relocate you. rwanda is a safe country. that's been upheld authoritatively by the high court. we are in an appeal process, but there is an emphaticjudgment by seniorjudges who have looked at rwanda, looked at our arrangements with rwanda and concluded they are in compliance with international law, compliant with human rights laws, refugee convention laws, and actually that rwanda is a safe country. i havejust been actually that rwanda is a safe country. i have just been to actually that rwanda is a safe country. i havejust been to rwanda. but if people go there and the conditions are not upheld, should refugees in rwanda be able to protest at the conditions they are in? ~ ., protest at the conditions they are in? . ., ., , . in? we have dramatically reduced the avenues for legal _ in? we have dramatically reduced the avenues for legal challenge _ in? we have dramatically reduced the avenues for legal challenge because i avenues for legal challenge because what we have found... i need to get to it. we have found people use legal avenues in a vexatious and frivolous way to thwart our ability

to remove them or detain them. we need to dramatically reduce the legal avenues of challenge. but i'm askin: if legal avenues of challenge. but i'm asking if people _ legal avenues of challenge. but i'm asking if people are _ legal avenues of challenge. but i'm asking if people are sent _ legal avenues of challenge. but i'm asking if people are sent from - legal avenues of challenge. but i'm asking if people are sent from this | asking if people are sent from this country to rwanda, what would happen to them once they are there? is it safe to send refugees to rwanda from britain? you sound convinced of that. i britain? you sound convinced of that. ., britain? you sound convinced of that. . _, . britain? you sound convinced of that. . . ., ., i, that. i am convinced of that, yes. in 2018 a that. i am convinced of that, yes. in 2018 a group — that. i am convinced of that, yes. in 2018 a group of _ that. i am convinced of that, yes. in 2018 a group of refugees - that. i am convinced of that, yes. in 2018 a group of refugees in - in 2018 a group of refugees in rwanda did stage a protest because their food rwanda did stage a protest because theirfood rations rwanda did stage a protest because their food rations were rwanda did stage a protest because theirfood rations were reduced, do you know what happened to them? i’m you know what happened to them? i'm not you know what happened to them? my not familiar with that particular case. ~ . . ., ., case. according to the united nations refugee _ case. according to the united nations refugee body, - case. according to the united nations refugee body, a - case. according to the united | nations refugee body, a group case. according to the united - nations refugee body, a group of refugees staged a protest. the london police fired live rounds at them and i2 london police fired live rounds at them and 12 people were killed —— them and 12 people were killed —— the rwandan police. there was violence at the protests but eyewitnesses say live rounds were fired. we can show pictures of what happened in the aftermath of that

protest, and we have verified the location and the date on which that happened. are you sure still that it is safe to send refugees to rwanda? and i suppose the point here is if something went terribly wrong, would you end the arrangement with that country? would you say that was a mistake, bring people back? that was 2018, we mistake, bring people back? that was 2018. we are — mistake, bring people back? that was 2018, we are looking _ mistake, bring people back? that was 2018, we are looking at _ mistake, bring people back? that was 2018, we are looking at 2023 - mistake, bring people back? that was 2018, we are looking at 2023 and - 2018, we are looking at 2023 and beyond. the high court, senior expertjudges have looked into the detail and found rwanda to be a safe country and found our arrangements to be lawful. rwanda from which i have just returned takes 100,000 refugees and resettle them, and i met some on my recent visit from countries in the region. they have nothing but gratitude and thanks for rwanda for the resettlement scheme that rwanda has put on for over 100,000 people who are fleeing

persecution, fleeing conflict. they have a track record of successfully resettling and integrating people who are refugees or asylum seekers. i think we are on strong ground to say low —— rwanda is a safe country and it's the right solution for us grappling with our small boats problem and i believe it will strike the right balance of providing a humanitarian package of support whilst at the same time being a deterrent for those seeking a life in the uk. ., , deterrent for those seeking a life in the uk. .,, deterrent for those seeking a life inthe uk. . ., , in the uk. the un has said clearly it is not a safe _ in the uk. the un has said clearly it is not a safe place _ in the uk. the un has said clearly it is not a safe place for _ in the uk. the un has said clearly it is not a safe place for refugees. and the high court disagreed with the united nations. and we are going through the process. i side with the court. ultimately they listened to the united nations in evidence in this hearing, they disagreed with the united nations assessment. the un continues to work with rwanda to settle thousands of people every yearin settle thousands of people every year in rwanda regardless of those concerns, so in my view and in the

view of the court and in the view of 100,000 people who are already in rwanda, rwanda is a safe country and it's appropriate for our purposes to work in partnership. bud it's appropriate for our purposes to work in partnership.— work in partnership. and you are determined _ work in partnership. and you are determined to _ work in partnership. and you are determined to go _ work in partnership. and you are determined to go ahead - work in partnership. and you are determined to go ahead with - work in partnership. and you are determined to go ahead with it. | work in partnership. and you are i determined to go ahead with it. it's a complicated problem but i ask again the question, if something terrible like that happened where 12 refugees were shot at and lost their lives, if something awful happened when refugees were sent from the uk to rwanda, would you end the policy? our legislation makes provision for those extreme circumstances whereby if there is something unforeseeable, serious and irreversible harm, someone would be able to challenge the decision. we consider that to be a very outside chance, a very extreme situation, but there is always allowance in the legislation to allow for that. in always allowance in the legislation to allow for that.— to allow for that. in the deal as well, to allow for that. in the deal as well. which _ to allow for that. in the deal as well, which we _ to allow for that. in the deal as well, which we have _ to allow for that. in the deal as well, which we have had - to allow for that. in the deal as well, which we have had a - to allow for that. in the deal as| well, which we have had a good to allow for that. in the deal as - well, which we have had a good look at it, there's also a suggestion the uk will resettle some of rwanda's

most vulnerable refugees. how many people do you expect will come to the uk under this scheme? brute people do you expect will come to the uk under this scheme? we don't foresee that — the uk under this scheme? we don't foresee that happening. _ the uk under this scheme? we don't foresee that happening. it's - the uk under this scheme? we don't foresee that happening. it's in - the uk under this scheme? we don't foresee that happening. it's in the i foresee that happening. it's in the agreement- _ foresee that happening. it's in the agreement. are _ foresee that happening. it's in the agreement. are arrangement - foresee that happening. it's in the agreement. are arrangement is i agreement. are arrangement is focused on — agreement. are arrangement is focused on people _ agreement. are arrangement is focused on people coming - agreement. are arrangement is focused on people coming to i agreement. are arrangement is| focused on people coming to the agreement. are arrangement is - focused on people coming to the uk from safe countries and unlawfully and then being resettled to rwanda. but it is in the agreement, so why did you sign it if it's in the agreement?— did you sign it if it's in the agreement? did you sign it if it's in the aureement? ,. , , , agreement? our scheme is uncapped. it means agreement? our scheme is uncapped. it means we — agreement? our scheme is uncapped. it means we can _ agreement? our scheme is uncapped. it means we can potentially _ agreement? our scheme is uncapped. it means we can potentially send - it means we can potentially send over several thousands of people from the uk to rwanda. when i went to rwanda i saw with my own eyes how rwanda was getting ready to receive these people. but rwanda was getting ready to receive these people-— these people. but is there a limit on the number _ these people. but is there a limit on the number of _ these people. but is there a limit on the number of people - these people. but is there a limit on the number of people rwandaj these people. but is there a limit - on the number of people rwanda could send back to this country? because you have signed an agreement that says the uk will resettle a portion of rwanda's most vulnerable refugees. of rwanda's most vulnerable refu . ees. of rwanda's most vulnerable refugees-— of rwanda's most vulnerable refu~ees. ., . ., refugees. the balance and the reali of refugees. the balance and the reality of this _ refugees. the balance and the reality of this agreement - refugees. the balance and the

reality of this agreement is i refugees. the balance and the. reality of this agreement is that rwanda is taking people from the uk. we are resettling people who have arrived here illegally and therefore will be removed to rwanda. i have just seen the accommodation that is in train, they are building the housing that will be used to accommodate people who are coming from rwanda. ivisited accommodate people who are coming from rwanda. i visited a school that will be used to support their education needs. but will be used to support their education needs.— will be used to support their education needs. but it is in black and white that _ education needs. but it is in black and white that the _ education needs. but it is in black and white that the agreement - education needs. but it is in black and white that the agreement you signed also says the uk might have to take refugees from rwanda, but i think our viewers will hear that you don't want to address that point. the arrangement is very clear. on a balance and overwhelmingly rwanda will be taking people from the uk, not the other way round. let’s will be taking people from the uk, not the other way round. let's talk about an announcement _ not the other way round. let's talk about an announcement you - not the other way round. let's talk about an announcement you are i not the other way round. let's talk - about an announcement you are making today and will be talking about this week, about terrible abuse, sexual abuse of children and grooming gangs. you are announcing that after many years of this being made a suggestion, it will be mandatory for

people to report child abuse, whether it is a teacher, a social worker, it has to be reported. but how will that work? will it be if there is just a suspicion? how will that work? will it be if there isjust a suspicion? evidence? why will not make a difference? we have why will not make a difference? - have seen a large—scale problem, i would call it one of the largest scandals in recent british history whereby in towns around england and the country, vulnerable, white girls who have been living in troubled circumstances in challenging situations have been abused, exploited, drugged, raped by networks of gangs of rapists, and we have to be honest about the fact that some of these gangs have been overwhelmingly british pakistani males. the authorities, whether that is social workers or teachers or police officers, when they become aware of these problems have turned aware of these problems have turned a blind eye and roundly failed to take the requisite action to safeguard these vulnerable girls. many of these victims have not

secured justice. we therefore need to change the system. there's been a lot of inquiry and reporting on the problem. the government is now in a position to take action and that's why we will be introducing a mandatory duty on childcare professionals to report when they become aware of concerns relating to child sexual exploitation. you become aware of concerns relating to child sexual exploitation.— child sexual exploitation. you say this is a large-scale _ child sexual exploitation. you say this is a large-scale problem - child sexual exploitation. you say this is a large-scale problem and| this is a large—scale problem and you have said this morning it is an open secret. are you saying that in the british pakistani community, people are complicit in this abuse? the reports do demonstrate, if you read the report on rochdale and rotherham, the casey report, they do say that concerns about political correctness, worries about being called bigoted. south yorkshire police has come in for criticism in recent years for not taking seriously the very serious devastating claims by young white girls who have complained about

being raped and abused by networks and rapists who have come from the british pakistani male community. there has been a communal shutting down in these areas. is there has been a communal shutting down in these areas.— down in these areas. is the responsibility _ down in these areas. is the responsibility on _ down in these areas. is the responsibility on the - down in these areas. is the - responsibility on the community for not speaking out? the responsibility on the community for not speaking out?— not speaking out? the fault lies with obviously _ not speaking out? the fault lies with obviously the _ not speaking out? the fault lies with obviously the perpetrators| not speaking out? the fault lies - with obviously the perpetrators were carrying out these vile acts of depravity, but also the authorities. there's been a social ignorance. there's been a social ignorance. there's been a wilful turning of the blind eye. there's been a failure to act. there's been a failure... silence has enabled this abuse and we need to therefore ensure there is a duty, an obligation on those professionals that they can't get away with inaction.— professionals that they can't get away with inaction. what you are makin: away with inaction. what you are making strong — away with inaction. what you are making strong accusations - away with inaction. what you are making strong accusations that l making strong accusations that people are somehow complicit in abuse. who do you mean? because some of viewers might think, listening to you say the authorities have failed, well the conservatives have been in government for a long time and if you look at the system that is meant

to support these victims, often prosecutions never happen. we know child sexual abuse victims have to wait some times more than a year before their case gets to court, so who are you blaming?! before their case gets to court, so who are you blaming?— before their case gets to court, so who are you blaming? i didn't want to net who are you blaming? i didn't want to get political— who are you blaming? i didn't want to get political about _ who are you blaming? i didn't want to get political about it, _ who are you blaming? i didn't want to get political about it, but - who are you blaming? i didn't want to get political about it, but some l to get political about it, but some of these councils, counsellors, senior politicians in labour run areas over a period of years absolutely failed to take action because of cultural sensitivities, not wanting to come across as racist, not wanting to call out people along ethnic lines. justice hasn't been done for many of these victims. we now need to introduce a package of measures, that's what we are setting out today and tomorrow, are setting out today and tomorrow, a duty to report so professionals are obliged to take action. and actually, an energetic approach to tracking down these perpetrators, many of whom are still running free, and ensuring they don't continue with these vile abuses. i just

and ensuring they don't continue with these vile abuses. i 'ust want to close. with these vile abuses. i 'ust want to lose. i — with these vile abuses. i 'ust want to close. i think h with these vile abuses. i 'ust want to close. i think you _ with these vile abuses. i 'ust want to close. i think you are _ with these vile abuses. i just want| to close. i think you are somebody who believes you want to tell what you see as the truth very strongly, boldly, not afraid of people accusing you of being provocative or trying to stir things up. ijust wonder, for people listening to you this morning, you are relatively new in a big job, this morning, you are relatively new in a bigjob, what this morning, you are relatively new in a big job, what kind of home secretary do you think you are? and what kind of home secretary do you want to be? what do you want to be known for? i want to be? what do you want to be known for? ., want to be? what do you want to be known for?— known for? i want to be a home secretary _ known for? i want to be a home secretary who — known for? i want to be a home secretary who gets _ known for? i want to be a home secretary who gets things - known for? i want to be a homej secretary who gets things done, someone of action and results, overwhelmingly i want to be a home secretary who speaks really for the patriarch silent majority. a home secretary who reflects the views of her constituents in fareham who are decent, fair—minded, law—abiding people. a home secretary who will tell the truth about problems that we are grappling with in our society without fear of offending

celebrities or media outlets. but what about _ celebrities or media outlets. but what about offending parts of the public? do you care if you offend people? it’s public? do you care if you offend --eole? �* , ., public? do you care if you offend --eole? fl ., . public? do you care if you offend --eole? v ., . people? it's not about offending, it's about being _ people? it's not about offending, it's about being honest _ people? it's not about offending, it's about being honest and - it's about being honest and straightforward. whether it is ensuring we get common—sense policing and backing the police to take a robust line against an acceptable behaviour or protecting freedom of speech when it comes to non—crime hate incidents. getting them to visit every domestic burglary. whether it's taking a fair approach to migration, introducing a package of legislation and a deal to provide humanitarian support but also a robust deterrent. whether it is ensuring we overhaul our prevent scheme relating to counterterrorism. i will not shy away from the difficult conversations because we need to tell the truth, that's what the british people expect of us. suella braverman, thank you for coming in. i'm going to discuss what was said there with my panel but we want to hear from you too.

email kuenssberg@bbc.co.uk, use the hashtag bbclaurak on social media. tracy, what did you make of the home secretary? i tracy, what did you make of the home secreta ? ., ., , ., , secretary? i would ask where she has been because — secretary? i would ask where she has been because of— secretary? i would ask where she has been because of the _ secretary? i would ask where she has been because of the suggestion - secretary? i would ask where she has been because of the suggestion she'sj been because of the suggestion she's making are already in training. i think calling it the largest scandal in british history, we have had a conservative government for 13 years. she blamed labour councillors in her interview. she said some labour councillors didn't want to call it out. , ., councillors didn't want to call it out. , . ., , ., , out. the blame game is not helpful. we want solutions. _ out. the blame game is not helpful. we want solutions. we _ out. the blame game is not helpful. we want solutions. we have - out. the blame game is not helpful. we want solutions. we have seen i out. the blame game is not helpful. i we want solutions. we have seen with the new announcement, it feels like policy by press release at the moment, the new announcement that already hard working professionals should call out of course when they hear about child abuse, but that's

currently happening. anybody who works with children or with the nhs has that statutory obligation. i would suggest we need more hard—working professionals rather ha rd—working professionals rather than hard—working professionals rather than putting further legal expectations on them. and this is a home secretary that has also made it more difficult for victims of sex trafficking to be protected from those grooming gangs that she was talking about. so it feels like it's very headline, it feels very dog whistle, if i may say, and it doesn't actually deal with what's happening on the ground. for example, talking about, if i may quickly say that police will be called out to every burglary. in west yorkshire we already do that. it feels like she is out of touch with communities. i’m it feels like she is out of touch with communities.— it feels like she is out of touch with communities. i'm sure there will be a robust _ with communities. i'm sure there will be a robust conversation - with communities. i'm sure there. will be a robust conversation about some of the policies the government is announcing in the next couple of days. minette, we talked a lot about immigration and the government's overall approach. you were clear before that you need people to pick fruit in the fields. what you heard from suella braverman, do you think

she is sympathetic to your concerns? i think what businesses are missing effectively — i think what businesses are missing effectively are two policies. we simply — effectively are two policies. we simply don't have enough people who are unemployed in the country to do the jobs _ are unemployed in the country to do the jobs that are available so it is holding _ the jobs that are available so it is holding our whole economy back. for us in food _ holding our whole economy back. for us in food and farming, the whole supply— us in food and farming, the whole supply chain, it is massively challenging. there simply are not enough _ challenging. there simply are not enough people here. if i take herefordshire, with seasonal workers as an _ herefordshire, with seasonal workers as an example, there are currently 500 people unemployed and you have a requirement for 2500 seasonal workers — requirement for 2500 seasonal workers. , , , �* workers. interestingly she didn't re eat her workers. interestingly she didn't repeat her previous _ workers. interestingly she didn't repeat her previous comments l workers. interestingly she didn't i repeat her previous comments that she wanted immigration to be in the tens of thousands so maybe she is showing more flexibility than previously. i don't know. the bi . . est previously. i don't know. the biggest challenge, the home office has not _ biggest challenge, the home office has not engaged with business, they are the _ has not engaged with business, they are the hardest department to get involved _ are the hardest department to get involved with. you are the hardest department to get involved with.— involved with. you are knotting, murra . involved with. you are knotting, murray- i _ involved with. you are knotting, murray. i couldn't _ involved with. you are knotting, murray. i couldn't agree - involved with. you are knotting, murray. i couldn't agree more i murray. i couldn't agree more stronal murray. i couldn't agree more strongly with _ murray. i couldn't agree more strongly with minette - murray. i couldn't agree more strongly with minette will- murray. i couldn't agree morej strongly with minette will that murray. i couldn't agree more - strongly with minette will that the shortage — strongly with minette will that the shortage of— strongly with minette will that the shortage of skills _ strongly with minette will that the shortage of skills we _ strongly with minette will that the shortage of skills we have - strongly with minette will that the

shortage of skills we have in - strongly with minette will that the shortage of skills we have in the l shortage of skills we have in the uk. shortage of skills we have in the uk i_ shortage of skills we have in the uk iwas— shortage of skills we have in the uk. iwas happy_ shortage of skills we have in the uk. iwas happyto_ shortage of skills we have in the uk. i was happy to hear- shortage of skills we have in the uk. i was happy to hear the - shortage of skills we have in the i uk. i was happy to hear the home secretary— uk. i was happy to hear the home secretary make _ uk. i was happy to hear the home secretary make a _ uk. i was happy to hear the home secretary make a clear _ uk. i was happy to hear the home| secretary make a clear delineation between _ secretary make a clear delineation between legal _ secretary make a clear delineation between legal and _ secretary make a clear delineation between legal and illegal- between legal and illegal immigration. _ between legal and illegal immigration. 0n- between legal and illegal immigration. on a - between legal and illegal. immigration. on a personal between legal and illegal- immigration. on a personal level i hope _ immigration. on a personal level i hope as— immigration. on a personal level i hope as a — immigration. on a personal level i hope as a country— immigration. on a personal level i hope as a country we _ immigration. on a personal level i hope as a country we can - immigration. on a personal level i hope as a country we can treat - hope as a country we can treat people _ hope as a country we can treat people who — hope as a country we can treat people who come _ hope as a country we can treat people who come into - hope as a country we can treat people who come into the - hope as a country we can treat. people who come into the country illegally _ people who come into the country illegally with _ people who come into the country illegally with care _ people who come into the country illegally with care and _ people who come into the country illegally with care and dignity - people who come into the country illegally with care and dignity to i illegally with care and dignity to make _ illegally with care and dignity to make sure _ illegally with care and dignity to make sure wherever— illegally with care and dignity to make sure wherever they- illegally with care and dignity to make sure wherever they get i make sure wherever they get resettled _ make sure wherever they get resettled they _ make sure wherever they get resettled they can _ make sure wherever they get resettled they can do - make sure wherever they get resettled they can do so - resettled they can do so successfully _ resettled they can do so successfully and - resettled they can do sol successfully and happily. resettled they can do so - successfully and happily. on a personal— successfully and happily. on a personal level _ successfully and happily. on a personal level that— successfully and happily. on a personal level that matters i successfully and happily. on a personal level that matters to j successfully and happily. on a - personal level that matters to me. on the _ personal level that matters to me. on the topic— personal level that matters to me. on the topic of— personal level that matters to me. on the topic of legal— personal level that matters to me. on the topic of legal migration, i on the topic of legal migration, what _ on the topic of legal migration, what i _ on the topic of legal migration, what i had _ on the topic of legal migration, what i had a _ on the topic of legal migration, what i had a home _ on the topic of legal migration, what i had a home secretary. on the topic of legal migration, | what i had a home secretary say on the topic of legal migration, i what i had a home secretary say is we still— what i had a home secretary say is we still want — what i had a home secretary say is we still want to _ what i had a home secretary say is we still want to bring _ what i had a home secretary say is we still want to bring numbers - what i had a home secretary say is. we still want to bring numbers down and i_ we still want to bring numbers down and i still— we still want to bring numbers down and i still see — we still want to bring numbers down and i still see when— we still want to bring numbers down and i still see when i— we still want to bring numbers down and i still see when i talk— we still want to bring numbers down and i still see when i talk to - and i still see when i talk to businesses _ and i still see when i talk to businesses across— and i still see when i talk to businesses across the - and i still see when i talk to i businesses across the country, and i still see when i talk to - businesses across the country, they don't _ businesses across the country, they don't have _ businesses across the country, they don't have the — businesses across the country, they don't have the technical— businesses across the country, they don't have the technical skills - businesses across the country, they don't have the technical skills they. don't have the technical skills they require _ don't have the technical skills they require to — don't have the technical skills they require to enable _ don't have the technical skills they require to enable their— don't have the technical skills they require to enable their businesses| require to enable their businesses to run— require to enable their businesses to run in— require to enable their businesses to run in a — require to enable their businesses to run in a modern— require to enable their businesses to run in a modern economy- require to enable their businesses to run in a modern economy and i require to enable their businesses. to run in a modern economy and its skilled _ to run in a modern economy and its skilled labour— to run in a modern economy and its skilled labour where _ to run in a modern economy and its skilled labour where we _ to run in a modern economy and its skilled labour where we need - to run in a modern economy and its skilled labour where we need more| skilled labour where we need more people _ skilled labour where we need more people in— skilled labour where we need more people in the — skilled labour where we need more people in the country. _ skilled labour where we need more people in the country.— people in the country. there are some big changes _ people in the country. there are some big changes coming - people in the country. there are some big changes coming when| people in the country. there are. some big changes coming when it comes to technology. if you think of artificial intelligence the warnings this week were near—apocalyptic as elon musk and over a thousand senior tech executives published an open letter calling for a six—month pause in the development of the most powerful artificial intelligence systems

before they completely outsmart us humans. we know the latest ai chatbots such as microsoft's chatgpt sound like humans, perform in many ways better than humans, writing university essays in seconds. and ai is already everywhere around you — in your phone, your car, and is saving lives, mapping disaster zones and improving medicine. but ai can make the fake more convincing that the truth. this image of the pope in a massive puffa jacket that went viral recently was made by ai — even though it went right round the world. and it's definitely a threat to employment — two out of three jobs in the developed world will be affected by ai, say the bankers goldman sachs. but could it be much more dangerous than that? should we be excited or terrified, or both? billionaire jaan tallinn, one of the founders of skype, wants the world to take the threat seriously from increasingly advanced artificial intelligence.

with every generation they are getting more and more competent, and the only way we can control them right now is by being more competent, understanding to work better than they are, than they do. so we can still so—called pull the plug. however, it's not guaranteed, as they get very competent, it's not guaranteed that we can continue to control them in a way that we would like. it's quite a leap, though, for most people to imagine that something could change our real life environment. could you give us practical examples of the dangers humans might face? sure. again, i think it's kind of important to look at what humans have done on this planet as a result of our economy. i mean, the biggest acknowledged problem that humanity has caused, the global warming, that is a side effect of our economic activity on this planet. we are concerned about things like significant increase of temperature on this planet.

now imagine if you substitute human civilisation with al civilisation, civilisation that could potentially run millions of times faster than humans. if i'm pressed for things that, 0k, what is the concrete thing that can go wrong, then i'm going... i'm starting to think about things like nano, nanotechnology. for example, ai taking over labs that can produce, that can synthesise dna, that can pull proteins into free structures, that can take enough and then manipulate much, much faster than anything human scale can. some experts in your industry, though, think your letter was over—the—top and there is some scaremongering going on. what do you say to that? last year there was a questionnaire among top published machine—learning researchers in the field. and half of them — and i repeat, half of them — thought that al can be

an existential risk. the probability of ai being an existential risk is 10% or higher. so i think it's important to know this, that if you have, as the metaphor goes, imagine that you are boarding a plane and there's an announcement that half of the engineers who built the plane think that this plane is going to crash, or there is at least a 10% chance that this plane will crash. then the correct response is to not fly. do you think politicians understand the risks? i think they increasingly do, yes. the thing with the current product of ai is that there is this big, so—called pre—training regime. i mean, gpt, gpt means generative pre—trained transformer. so the pre—training phase is a really expensive, really big experiment, so they are comparable to the enrichment of uranium. so there is a direct analogy to the nuclear proliferation controls,

because you have this expensive phase in al. in a nuclear case, it is the enrichment of uranium, and in the ai case it is the pretraining phase. there are huge benefits for humankind from this technology, though. oh, yeah, yeah. i mean, at the end of the day i'm a technologist, so i'm definitely not calling for a complete stop on al research. in fact, my letter was very explicit about that. the worry really is those big pretraining experiments that are run, that are resulting in uncontrollable ai. i think the rest of the ai field isjust fine. is it realistic that governments can regulate here? isn't it down to the very powerful companies and very wealthy tech leaders like you to do it? i mean, i know personally, like many of the people who are at the leading front of ai revolution, so to speak, they are also human.

and they want to live, right? so it's almost egoistic interests to make sure that this thing goes well. but of course they have very different constraints than i do. i am not, like... i don't have thatjob of leading any ai companies, therefore i can speak more freely than they can, but behind closed doors they are very sympathetic to these concerns. and even not behind closed doors. do you regret your own involvement and investment in developing this type of technology? my rationale for investing in al companies is that this gives me a ticket to hang around in the kitchens of ai companies and talk about the risks of ai, and always make sure that i'm not a majority investor, so realistically if i hadn't invested they would have got investment from elsewhere, from venture capitalists etc, who don't share the concerns that i have.

jaan tallinn, thanks very much. the first billionaire i think we've had on the programme. murray, you run a business may be not as big as the one he has been involved in, but you run a big tech business, ebay, and you hear that and think, this is and you hear that and think, this is a really dangerous thing. should we be concerned? is some of this hype? i think the first thing is that al as you mentioned has been around for many years and we are all exposed to it in many ways. thinking in our business, we recently acquired an ai business, we recently acquired an ai business to protect consumers and businesses from fraudulent activity. that is good ai. irate businesses from fraudulent activity. that is good ill-— that is good ai. we translate millions of — that is good ai. we translate millions of products - that is good ai. we translate millions of products from - that is good ai. we translate millions of products from all| that is good ai. we translate - millions of products from all over the world so they can buy products from british company is that happens at a scale that hasn't before the stop what is clear with generative ai, it's a new scale of evolution.

it's hard to legislate on that. it's hard to know what it might mean but what's important is how you stay ahead of that and stay clear about what technology is coming.- what technology is coming. tracy, don't be disappointing _ what technology is coming. tracy, don't be disappointing about - what technology is coming. tracy, don't be disappointing about your| don't be disappointing about your former colleagues in westminster, but do you think the way politicians set up regulation, do you think they have a cat's chance in hell of staying ahead of this? we have a cat's chance in hell of staying ahead of this? we see at the moment with — staying ahead of this? we see at the moment with the _ staying ahead of this? we see at the moment with the data _ staying ahead of this? we see at the moment with the data bill— staying ahead of this? we see at the moment with the data bill that - staying ahead of this? we see at the moment with the data bill that no, i moment with the data bill that no, the uk _ moment with the data bill that no, the uk is _ moment with the data bill that no, the uk is behind others in understanding how important it is to be ahead _ understanding how important it is to be ahead of the game. of course, it's an _ be ahead of the game. of course, it's an amazing thing, ai. be ahead of the game. of course, it's an amazing thing, al. the be ahead of the game. of course, it's an amazing thing, ai.- be ahead of the game. of course, it's an amazing thing, ai. it's an amazing thing, al. the uk is really good — it's an amazing thing, al. the uk is really good at _ it's an amazing thing, al. the uk is really good at it — it's an amazing thing, al. the uk is really good at it as _ it's an amazing thing, al. the uk is really good at it as well. _ it's an amazing thing, al. the uk is really good at it as well. it's - it's an amazing thing, al. the uk is really good at it as well. it's good . really good at it as well. it's good in health and _ really good at it as well. it's good in health and other _ really good at it as well. it's good in health and other things - really good at it as well. it's good in health and other things will. really good at it as well. it's good. in health and other things will stop in health and other things will stop in bradford we have the most postgrad _ in bradford we have the most postgrad ai analytic students in the country. _ postgrad ai analytic students in the country, and i'm very proud of that, the most _ country, and i'm very proud of that, the most diverse and youngest city in the _ the most diverse and youngest city in the uk — the most diverse and youngest city in the uk. but we need to be ahead of it and _ in the uk. but we need to be ahead of it and on— in the uk. but we need to be ahead of it and on top of it because if we are not. _ of it and on top of it because if we are not. this — of it and on top of it because if we are not, this is the country people come _ are not, this is the country people come to, — are not, this is the country people come to, to — are not, this is the country people come to, to go further than we need and we _ come to, to go further than we need and we have — come to, to go further than we need and we have to listen to these 1000 tech experts because if we don't, who knows — tech experts because if we don't, who knows where we are heading.

minette, _ who knows where we are heading. minette, to ask you about some farming issues but quickly on this, we read that robots can be the answer to picking fruit. it is happening- _ answer to picking fruit. it is happening- we _ answer to picking fruit. it is happening. we have - answer to picking fruit. it is happening. we have robots that can pick strawberries— happening. we have robots that can pick strawberries but _ happening. we have robots that can pick strawberries but the _ happening. we have robots that can pick strawberries but the dexterity i pick strawberries but the dexterity of the _ pick strawberries but the dexterity of the human— pick strawberries but the dexterity of the human hand _ pick strawberries but the dexterity of the human hand is _ pick strawberries but the dexterity of the human hand is absolutely i pick strawberries but the dexterity . of the human hand is absolutely key. humans _ of the human hand is absolutely key. humans are — of the human hand is absolutely key. humans are still— of the human hand is absolutely key. humans are still faster? _ of the human hand is absolutely key. humans are still faster? much - humans are still faster? much faster. humans _ humans are still faster? much faster. humans will— humans are still faster? much faster. humans will pick - humans are still faster? much faster. humans will pick ten i faster. humans will pick ten strawberries— faster. humans will pick ten strawberries for— faster. humans will pick ten strawberries for every- faster. humans will pick ten strawberries for every one i faster. humans will pick ten - strawberries for every one picked by a robot— strawberries for every one picked by a robot and — strawberries for every one picked by a robot and it's _ strawberries for every one picked by a robot and it's the _ strawberries for every one picked by a robot and it's the same _ strawberries for every one picked by a robot and it's the same with- a robot and it's the same with apples — a robot and it's the same with apples and _ a robot and it's the same with apples and everything - a robot and it's the same with apples and everything else. i a robot and it's the same with. apples and everything else. the technology— apples and everything else. the technology exists _ apples and everything else. the technology exists but _ apples and everything else. the technology exists but it - apples and everything else. the technology exists but it is - apples and everything else. the i technology exists but it is nowhere near fast _ technology exists but it is nowhere near fast enough _ technology exists but it is nowhere near fast enough and _ technology exists but it is nowhere near fast enough and it _ technology exists but it is nowhere near fast enough and it relies- technology exists but it is nowhere near fast enough and it relies on. near fast enough and it relies on human— near fast enough and it relies on human teaching _ near fast enough and it relies on human teaching to _ near fast enough and it relies on human teaching to get _ near fast enough and it relies on human teaching to get it - near fast enough and it relies on human teaching to get it up - near fast enough and it relies on human teaching to get it up to i near fast enough and it relies on- human teaching to get it up to speed but it's— human teaching to get it up to speed but it's a _ human teaching to get it up to speed but it's a long — human teaching to get it up to speed but it's a long way— human teaching to get it up to speed but it's a long way off— human teaching to get it up to speed but it's a long way off and _ human teaching to get it up to speed but it's a long way off and huge - but it's a long way off and huge investment— but it's a long way off and huge investment is— but it's a long way off and huge investment is needed. - but it's a long way off and huge investment is needed. i- but it's a long way off and huge investment is needed.- but it's a long way off and huge investment is needed. i want to talk to ou investment is needed. i want to talk to you about — investment is needed. i want to talk to you about another— investment is needed. i want to talk to you about another issue - investment is needed. i want to talk to you about another issue for - investment is needed. i want to talk to you about another issue for the i to you about another issue for the future, getting carbon emissions down except what that means for farmers is being told what they can feed their cows. without being to classroom language about it, we are trying to control bovine belches. what will farmers feel about being told what to feed their flocks? it’s told what to feed their flocks? it's a treat told what to feed their flocks? it's a great opportunity for agriculture to get— a great opportunity for agriculture to get to — a great opportunity for agriculture to get to net _ a great opportunity for agriculture to get to net zero _ a great opportunity for agriculture to get to net zero and _ a great opportunity for agriculture to get to net zero and we - a great opportunity for agriculture to get to net zero and we believe i to get to net zero and we believe with the — to get to net zero and we believe with the right _ to get to net zero and we believe with the right innovation, - with the right innovation,

technology— with the right innovation, technology and _ with the right innovation, technology and policy - with the right innovation, technology and policy we | with the right innovation, - technology and policy we can get there _ technology and policy we can get there and — technology and policy we can get there and meet— technology and policy we can get there and meet the _ technology and policy we can get there and meet the governmentl there and meet the government targets — there and meet the government targets we _ there and meet the government targets we can— there and meet the government targets. we can feed _ there and meet the government targets. we can feed animals i targets. we can feed animals probiotics_ targets. we can feed animals probiotics to _ targets. we can feed animals probiotics to make _ targets. we can feed animals probiotics to make sure - targets. we can feed animals probiotics to make sure cows| targets. we can feed animals - probiotics to make sure cows emit less methane, _ probiotics to make sure cows emit less methane, that's _ probiotics to make sure cows emit less methane, that's a _ probiotics to make sure cows emit less methane, that's a good - probiotics to make sure cows emit less methane, that's a good thing| less methane, that's a good thing and it's_ less methane, that's a good thing and it's already _ less methane, that's a good thing and it's already online. _ less methane, that's a good thing and it's already online. also - less methane, that's a good thingi and it's already online. also better genetics _ and it's already online. also better genetics and — and it's already online. also better genetics and health _ and it's already online. also better genetics and health status. - and it's already online. also better genetics and health status. i- and it's already online. also better genetics and health status. i think| genetics and health status. i think we can— genetics and health status. i think we can really— genetics and health status. i think we can really be _ genetics and health status. i think we can really be world _ genetics and health status. i think we can really be world leaders - we can really be world leaders effectively, _ we can really be world leaders effectively, leading _ we can really be world leaders effectively, leading how- we can really be world leaders effectively, leading how we i we can really be world leadersl effectively, leading how we get we can really be world leaders - effectively, leading how we get to carbon _ effectively, leading how we get to carbon neutral— effectively, leading how we get to carbon neutral food _ effectively, leading how we get to carbon neutral food production. i effectively, leading how we get to i carbon neutral food production. this is one _ carbon neutral food production. this is one part _ carbon neutral food production. this is one part of— carbon neutral food production. this is one part of it _ carbon neutral food production. this is one part of it. it’s _ carbon neutralfood production. this is one part of it— is one part of it. it's more serious than a cheap _ is one part of it. it's more serious than a cheapjoke _ is one part of it. it's more serious than a cheapjoke about _ is one part of it. it's more serious than a cheapjoke about cows. - is one part of it. it's more serious| than a cheapjoke about cows. and is one part of it. it's more serious i than a cheapjoke about cows. and i than a cheap joke about cows. and i did say flock, and of course it is a flock of sheep and a herd of cows before my e—mail explodes with agricultural language. something else in the papers today, we have talked a lot about the artemis mission to the moon. there the giant rocket. the sunday telegraph this morning features three of the women vying to be on that next lunar trip back to the moon. we hope after easter we might be able to speak to one of them from the space centre across the atlantic. let's get on

with other business now. we heard at length from the home secretary. we can talk to lisa nandy from the labour party, the shadow communities secretary, joining us from salford. if the home secretary is right and the government's rwanda policy works and reduces the number of people making the dangerous crossing across the channel, would labour keep it if you won the election? this the channel, would labour keep it if you won the election?— you won the election? this is so far a oli you won the election? this is so far a policy that _ you won the election? this is so far a policy that has — you won the election? this is so far a policy that has cost _ you won the election? this is so far a policy that has cost the _ you won the election? this is so far a policy that has cost the british i a policy that has cost the british taxpayer a huge amount of money and hasn't seen a single person go to rwanda so i think the evidence so far suggests this is yet another outlandish nonsense acclaim from the home secretary that is unable to do the very basics of getting her own system working. she complains about an asylum system that's broken and i think she really does need to ask who broke it and the answer to that lies by looking a mirror. i think this is a con trick being perpetrated on the british people. the government is not processing asylum claims. they have an enormous

backlog and have had it £500 million to the costs because of these delays that have been caused by them pursuing all these new strategies, barges that don't exist, claims to send people to rwanda that haven't materialised. what we need is a government that gets a grip. ii the government that gets a grip. if the scheme works _ government that gets a grip. if the scheme works does _ government that gets a grip. if the scheme works does labour- government that gets a grip. if the scheme works does labour want to retain it. you have criticised what happened so far but the home secretary is determined to go again and if against your prediction it works would labour dismantle it? i don't think we will ever be in a situation where we have to dismantle this, because i don't think it's real. just like the barges that turned out not to exist, this is another way of distracting from the fact they are only processing 1% of the asylum claims of people who arrived last year. the reason our hotels are full is because they haven't got a grip on the asylum system, they are not processing claims and haven't got a system with france. we would set up a and get a

grip on the asylum system which is the only way to run a fair, humane, effective system that commands the confidence of the british people, and frankly she should be ashamed for touring the tv studios making bold claims when she can't even do the basics of her own job. bold claims when she can't even do the basics of her ownjob. lisa the basics of her own 'ob. lisa nand , the basics of her own 'ob. lisa mandy. she-sh the basics of her own 'ob. lisa nandy, she's also _ the basics of her ownjob. lisa nandy, she's also raised the issue of grooming cams this morning. she said it's been an open secret in some communities around the country that british pakistani men have been abusing white girls. do you agree with her? he abusing white girls. do you agree with her? ., �* ., , ., ., with her? he won't find anyone who is more concerned _ with her? he won't find anyone who is more concerned about _ with her? he won't find anyone who is more concerned about child - with her? he won't find anyone who l is more concerned about child sexual exploitation than me. 20 years ago i was working with children who had been through that horrendous experience of being groomed by gangs, raped, sexually assaulted, struggling to get access to justice and was calling for mandatory reporting for child professionals who were involved in their case. bud

who were involved in their case. and ou have who were involved in their case. and you have been _ who were involved in their case. and you have been raising this for a long time. you have done work on it for many years, but suella braverman actually accused labour councils of turning a blind eye. is she right? in the cases of rochdale and rotherham, the reports were clear that there were politicians and officers who didn't report, sometimes forfear of officers who didn't report, sometimes for fear of political correctness. i think ten years ago when those convictions happened, everyone accepted that was the case across the political spectrum, and we needed to put measures in place to deal with it. but the home secretary is an absolute joke, for her to turn up in the tv studios today talking about a wilful blind eye, near complicit silence, talking about a lack of action. she's basically describing herself. the number of convictions for prosecutions has halved in the last year's, and prosecutions has halved in the last four years for child

exploitation. people are waiting nearly two years on average just to get to court. if anybody could be accused of turning a blind eye to what is a very real problem in this country across all backgrounds and ethnicities, it is the home secretary herself.- ethnicities, it is the home secretary herself. ethnicities, it is the home secreta herself. . ., . secretary herself. she would have cost challenge _ secretary herself. she would have cost challenge that _ secretary herself. she would have cost challenge that strongly - secretary herself. she would have cost challenge that strongly and i secretary herself. she would have i cost challenge that strongly and say that's why she's making that plan. do you welcome the introduction of the mandatory reporting requirement? i would 100% welcome it, but what she has announced today is a consultation. how can it possibly be that 11 years after we had the convictions in the rochdale case, all we have got is another consultation? there is a near widespread agreement that one of the problems with bringing people to justice and stopping child sexual exploitation is that people working in and around children don't feel the confidence to report on what is happening. if that's the case, surely we need to make it crystal clear that that has to happen. there is no excuse for any more delays and

inaction. the home secretary needs to come forward with more than just a press release. after 13 years she needs to come forward with measures that will keep children safe in this country. that will keep children safe in this count . ., �*, that will keep children safe in this count. ., �*,, that will keep children safe in this count . , , country. labour's big promise this week is that _ country. labour's big promise this week is that you _ country. labour's big promise this week is that you would _ country. labour's big promise this week is that you would freeze - week is that you would freeze council tax for people around the country. the last time we spoke a few weeks ago you said you wanted councils to have much more power, you wanted them to be in charge of their own destiny, so why are you telling councils how much they can charge people? we telling councils how much they can charge people?— telling councils how much they can charge people? we are not. we are --roosin~ charge people? we are not. we are proposing the _ charge people? we are not. we are proposing the government - charge people? we are not. we are proposing the government use - charge people? we are not. we are proposing the government use of i charge people? we are not. we are i proposing the government use of the money from the windfall tax to compensate councils for the lost revenue that's taken from them so they don't have to put up taxes on working people at a time when people's food bills are rising, energy bills are rising, and now their taxes are rising as well. shore their taxes are rising as well. are ou their taxes are rising as well. are you telling _ their taxes are rising as well. are you telling labour councils they should freeze council tax right now? because you know it's unlikely the government will change windfall tax. they only had a budget a couple of

weeks ago. so as things stand, are you asking councils to freeze it? even in your own area, wigan, they are putting up council tax by 5%. we still are putting up council tax by 5%. - still have one of the lowest rates in england. the reason they are putting it up is because the government has given them two choices, they can either cut services or put taxes up on working people. that's why the tory leader of bournemouth recently resigned, because he said it's not acceptable. and across the country, tory councils are charging more on average in council tax than labour areas. you pay about £345 more on average if you happen to live in a tory authority than a labour authority. so it's not a question of labour councils wanting to put up council tax, labour councils wanting to put up counciltax, in labour councils wanting to put up council tax, in fact they have been moving heaven and earth to try to protect people from the unfair choices by this government. but we think the government should make their choices right now and say to

councils we will actually fund you this year so you don't have to put up this year so you don't have to put up taxes and fast councils of every political persuasion to put taxes up to defend basic services. in political persuasion to put taxes up to defend basic services.— to defend basic services. in the last couple _ to defend basic services. in the last couple of— to defend basic services. in the last couple of weeks, _ to defend basic services. in the last couple of weeks, your - to defend basic services. in the | last couple of weeks, your boss to defend basic services. in the - last couple of weeks, your boss and the prime minister have both revealed their tax returns, and we have all seen how much tax they paid, rathera have all seen how much tax they paid, rather a lot for rishi sunak and rather a lot in capital gains which is the tax people pay on investments or selling property, not on your normal wages. you can see on the screen how much it is, and keir starmer also paid a lot although not on the same scale. your colleague angela rayner said those returns reveal a tory tax system where the prime minister pays an unfair lower share of tax than the rest of us, except then your other colleague rachel reeves said you wouldn't necessarily change the capital gains rate, so is it the case you are happy to bash it but you don't want to change it? the happy to bash it but you don't want to change it?—

to change it? the tax system has a hirh to change it? the tax system has a high burden _ to change it? the tax system has a high burden on _ to change it? the tax system has a high burden on people _ to change it? the tax system has a high burden on people across - to change it? the tax system has a high burden on people across the l high burden on people across the board, particularly on working people and we are concerned about that. we have said we want to see taxes on working people come down. i'm not going to get into making announcements about capital gains tax or other reforms to the system 18 months out from a general election when we don't know what situation we will inherit. we believe in fairness, that will be the principle that guides us, and for the detail you will have to wait closer to the election when we know what the economic situation allows. lisa nandy, thank you forjoining us from salford. for those of us a certain age, the tattered copy is probably still somewhere on the shelf — the books of american author judy blume provided wise counsel and revealing details about what would happen as you grew up to millions of girls. the stories were disected and earnestly discussed by gaggles of friends then and now, including my gang's 11—year—old selves.

if you missed out on the work of the writer who has sold 75 million books, her novel, "are you there god? it's me, margaret" is finally, after many years, and many requests, hitting our cinema screens. so long after it was first written, i asked ms blume, why now? it was the right moment because it was the right team. ijust felt it in my gut. i'm here to speak to you today about your changing bodies... and it's true, it's so wonderful, i'm so glad i waited. because it couldn't please me more. i love it. please, please, please, please, please, please, please. - i think it was my son who said to me, just wait until all those people who grew up with your books are in power in hollywood, and you are going to see what happens. and i'm so glad that i'm around to see it. now, you say you love the film, but what was it like for you to see it after all of these years? i was with my husband and we watched it and we were,

both of us, you know, we cried, we laughed, we cried. and we... what can i say, we became fans. and then the first time i saw it in a theatre with an audience was a thrill because it's a very different feeling. the laughter, you know, the laughter, the tears, people coming up to you after. i mean, women... women who are very well—known writers came up to me and they just sobbed. they weren't sobbing because the movie was so sad. they were sobbing because it was their childhoods. it took them back and they remembered. now, you've had so much success, but there's also been a lot of opposition to your books and the topics they discuss, like sex, or young people being gay. and even now some of them are being taken out of schools. what do you make of that?

well, you know, i came through the '80s when book banning was really at its height. and it was terrible. and then libraries and schools began to get policies in place and we saw a falling off of the desire to censorship, i mean to censor books. now it is back. it is back much worse — this is in america. it is back so much worse than it was in the '80s. butjudy, you live in florida and the governor there, ron desantis, has recently proposed expanding a controversial measure, the so—called "don't say gay law", and that restricts talking about gender and sexuality in schools. stepping back for a second, what do you think�*s really going on in the united states right now? bad stuff. and that's what i think of it, you know? bad politicians, who,

drunk with power, who want to get out there and, i don't know what they are trying to prove, really. i mean, there's a group of mothers now going around saying that they want to protect their children. protect them from what? you know, protect them from talking about things? protect them from knowing about things? because even if they don't let them read books, they are still, you know, their bodies are still going to change, and their feelings about their bodies are going to change. and you just can't control that. they have to be able to read, to know, to question. if you want to be in the club, then you have to wear... a bra. and what do you think margaret and her mother would have to say about all of that? you don't want to hear the words

that i would use about that, but i know that margaret and her mother would be very much wanting to protect a young person, any person's right to read, right to intellectual freedom, right to choose. judy blume, thank you so much for speaking to us. thank you so much. i was lucky enough to see the film already, it is out on may the 19th and it is gorgeous. tracy, where you are fan growing up? she and it is gorgeous. tracy, where you are fan growing up?— are fan growing up? she is an icon, but there is — are fan growing up? she is an icon, but there is something _ are fan growing up? she is an icon, but there is something very - are fan growing up? she is an icon, but there is something very serious about what she's talking about and the idea we will clampdown on women's knowledge about growing up and the things that face us. certainly in america she has every right to be worried.— right to be worried. what did you make of what _ right to be worried. what did you make of what she _ right to be worried. what did you make of what she has _ right to be worried. what did you make of what she has to - right to be worried. what did you make of what she has to say, - right to be worried. what did you - make of what she has to say, murray? i'm so thrilled to seejudy getting i'm so thrilled to see judy getting advice _ i'm so thrilled to see judy getting advice again to talk about the

topics — advice again to talk about the topics of— advice again to talk about the topics of diversity. it's alarming these _ topics of diversity. it's alarming these things can regress so quickly, and so _ these things can regress so quickly, and so making sure these topics about— and so making sure these topics about diversity are important and then we — about diversity are important and then we think about all the diversity we need to bring into the workplace — diversity we need to bring into the workplace and government to make sure we _ workplace and government to make sure we make fairer and better policies — sure we make fairer and better olicies. ~ ., , ., ., ., policies. minette, are you going to see the movie? _ policies. minette, are you going to see the movie? i— policies. minette, are you going to see the movie? i can't _ policies. minette, are you going to see the movie? i can't wait. - policies. minette, are you going to see the movie? i can't wait. i - see the movie? i can't wait. i hiuhl see the movie? i can't wait. i highly recommend _ see the movie? i can't wait. i highly recommend it. - see the movie? i can't wait. i highly recommend it. i - see the movie? i can't wait. i highly recommend it. i think| see the movie? i can't wait. i i highly recommend it. i think i'm allowed to say that in the studio. it's been great to have you here giving your insights on a wide range of issues and it's good to close the programme and something to make you feel good. having talked about serious dangers from technology — and that hard question

we started with this morning — how should our politicians manage the risks and opportunities of migration, the home secretary told us she wants to reduce immigration but it was interesting to me at least that she would not commit to the previous conservative promise of getting it below 100 000 a year. ido i do believe the number is high. but when it comes

this is bbc news broadcasting in the uk and around the globe. i'm shaun ley and these are the latest headlines: pope francis presides over palm sunday mass at the vatican — just a day after leaving hospital in rome for treatment for bronchitis. and these are live pictures of st peter's square where the 86—year—old has been addressing tens of thousands of worshippers who've gathered to mark the mass which is a major event in the church calendar. severe storms batter the north—east of the united states after leaving a trail of devastation in the south and midwest. at least 21 people are known to have died. these are two of three british men

the uk foreign office says it is trying to get in touch with since being detained by secret