this is bbc news. the latest news and headlines follow after this programme. following the recent death of jerry springer, another chance to see stephen sackur�*s hard talk interview of 2014 with the king of us tabloid tv. welcome to hardtalk, i am stephen sackur. what do you really want to watch on tv? i'd like to believe it's the serious

challenging interviews you get here on hardtalk, but my guest today may be has and takes. jerry springer is the king of tabloid trash talking tv in the us. his show specialises in dysfunctional relationships and sex. his guests kurt and so chairs, sometimes they fight. critics call it cynical and manipulative tv, but it made him famous and rich. —— curse and throw chairs. but does he care? jerry springer, welcome to hardtalk. jerry springer, welcome to hardtalk-_ jerry springer, welcome to hardtalk. �*, . ., , hardtalk. it's nice to be here, thanks for— hardtalk. it's nice to be here, thanks for having _ hardtalk. it's nice to be here, thanks for having me. - hardtalk. it's nice to be here, thanks for having me. it's - thanks for having me. it's incredible, _ thanks for having me. it's incredible, your _ thanks for having me. it's incredible, your show from small beginnings in cincinnati 20 years ago has made you famous and it is still going across america and internationally. how come?

probably because it has a niche. when it first came on, at least in the state, i can only speak about what goes on in the states, we have never seen people that are on my show on television before. american television was primarily upper—middle—class white. all the sitcoms, friends, seinfeld, whatever, well scrubbed people speaking the queens english and all of that. and all of a sudden, in 1991, we came on with this show with people that don't speak the queens english, that maybe weren't so lucky in the gene pool of parents or whatever, didn't get an education, as much of an education. and yet, what they are concerned about is the same thing wealthy people are concerned about, except wealthy people learn to hide it better. i don't find any distance

between the people on my show, and i would even say, let's say the people that ultimately come on your show, except the people on your show, except the people on this show obviously are better educated. but to think that they are morally superior to the people on my show, i would say wrong, wrong, wrong. but aren't you missing out a step in your own story? when you switched from politics, mayor of cincinnati for a while, you moved to tv and it's great news. and when you got your interview show, as i understand it, it was a pretty serious show.— serious show. more like my show. serious show. more like my show the _ serious show. more like my show. the first _ serious show. more like my show. the first three - serious show. more like my l show. the first three years... and then you discover the best way to make money and ratings was to dumb it down. that way to make money and ratings was to dumb it down.— was to dumb it down. that is not accurate _ was to dumb it down. that is not accurate but _ was to dumb it down. that is not accurate but i _ was to dumb it down. that is not accurate but i can - not accurate but i can understand why you would think that. the show did change after three years. let's get the money thing out of the way, you make a lot more money making an 0prah type show than my show.

but how did we get to the kind of show we have, i'll tell you how it happened. at the time we started, there were 20 other talk shows on television. everyone was trying to be like 0prah. we were trying to appeal to the demographic that was referred to as middle—aged housewives. ricki lake was the first to go after high school and college age kids. 0ne first to go after high school and college age kids. one day walking down the street in chicago and the executive producer, i said to him, just as a business model, why are we trying to be one out of 20 shows like 0prah trying to be one out of 20 shows like oprah winfrey, let's go after ricki's show and be one out of two. that's what we did, we said, from now on, only young people on stage and young subject matter. young people are much wilder in their lives, much more open about their lives, so the show occasionally went crazy. universal bought us

and said, from now on, you are only allowed to do crazy. and that's what our show is. find that's what our show is. and ou that's what our show is. and you accepted _ that's what our show is. and you accepted the _ that's what our show is. and you accepted the rules, you only did crazy? flit you accepted the rules, you only did crazy?— you accepted the rules, you i only did crazy?_ you only did crazy? of course. you had a choice _ only did crazy? of course. you had a choice to _ only did crazy? of course. you had a choice to make, - only did crazy? of course. you had a choice to make, and - only did crazy? of course. you had a choice to make, and you chose... i'll tell you what i'm interested in, why you decided to go as far down this track as you did. again, fairly typical of your show, the people who don't know, sort of titles you turned out. pregnant by a transsexual. strip awards. honey i'm a call girl. my girlfriend is a guy. —— stripper wars. as your audience grew higher and you grew more and more, the show grew more and more, the show grew more and more, the show grew more and more crazy, you had a show called, i married my horse, a guy who had a five year sexual or romantic relationship with a horse. ~ , ., ., horse. well, if you are married. _ horse. well, if you are married, you - horse. well, if you are married, you think- horse. well, if you are i married, you think about horse. well, if you are - married, you think about it... even a lot of the affiliate is

across the us who took your show couldn't take that one, they said it was too extreme, too off the wall. it they said it was too extreme, too off the wall.— they said it was too extreme, too off the wall.- whyl too off the wall. it was. why did ou too off the wall. it was. why did you decide _ too off the wall. it was. why did you decide that - too off the wall. it was. why did you decide that was - too off the wall. it was. why did you decide that was the | did you decide that was the kind of tv you wanted to make? were you proud of it? i’m kind of tv you wanted to make? were you proud of it?— were you proud of it? i'm proud of my show. _ were you proud of it? i'm proud of my show. why _ were you proud of it? i'm proud of my show, why wouldn't - were you proud of it? i'm proud of my show, why wouldn't i - were you proud of it? i'm proud of my show, why wouldn't i be? j of my show, why wouldn't i be? because it's stupid.— because it's stupid. yes, it's a stuid because it's stupid. yes, it's a stupid show, _ because it's stupid. yes, it's a stupid show, i _ because it's stupid. yes, it's a stupid show, i always - because it's stupid. yes, it's a stupid show, i always say. a stupid show, i always say it's stupid, but for an hour it's stupid, but for an hour it's an escape from your regular life. i am it's an escape from your regular life. iam hired it's an escape from your regular life. i am hired to host a show, i don't use the guests, i'm never allowed to know what the show is about until i walk in and they hand me a card. 0n the card you see me a card. 0n the card you see me carrying on the show, all it has is the names of the guests. i am supposed to ask a question that you would ask sitting at home watching and then make jokes. it's not myjob. i would do a show on sports or politics. that's my interest. i'm not hired to do a show on

my interests.— my interests. but you are takin: my interests. but you are taking out _ my interests. but you are taking out your _ my interests. but you are taking out your own - my interests. but you are i taking out your own volition, you choose to do this show, nobody forces you. i’m you choose to do this show, nobody forces you.— nobody forces you. i'm not sa in: nobody forces you. i'm not saying i — nobody forces you. i'm not saying i shouldn't - nobody forces you. i'm not saying i shouldn't do - nobody forces you. i'm not saying i shouldn't do it, i. saying i shouldn't do it, i like doing it.— saying i shouldn't do it, i like doing it. you are telling me it's stupid _ like doing it. you are telling me it's stupid and _ like doing it. you are telling me it's stupid and you i like doing it. you are telling | me it's stupid and you would never watch it. it turns the people on the show into freaks and losers. people on the show into freaks and loam-— people on the show into freaks and losers. ., ., , ., and losers. no... you 'ust made and losers. no... you 'ust made an elitist — and losers. no... you 'ust made an elitistjudgment i and losers. no... youjust made an elitist judgment that - and losers. no... youjust made an elitist judgment that you i an elitist judgment that you are superior to the people on our show. you are not, they are educated. you had better luck in getting parents, that's what you got. you had a better life. we are all alike, do not think that well educated people are morally superior in any way to people of low income. for one hour a day, our show is about people that act outrageously. that's what the show is. when you do the news, do you say, i'm not going to report a murder because i find murder dysfunctional? ifind murder a dysfunctional? i find murder a horrible dysfunctional? ifind murder a horrible thing, i don't want to

be associated... i will not do a show that talks about murder and rape. you don't say that, that's your job to and rape. you don't say that, that's yourjob to report it. it doesn't mean you endorse it. my it doesn't mean you endorse it. myjob is to show dysfunctional behaviour. i dare you to say a man marrying a horse is not dysfunctional, of course it's dysfunctional.— dysfunctional, of course it's dysfunctional. but the mode as re orted dysfunctional. but the mode as reported in _ dysfunctional. but the mode as reported in the _ dysfunctional. but the mode as reported in the news _ dysfunctional. but the mode as reported in the news are i dysfunctional. but the mode as reported in the news are real, | reported in the news are real, tragic but real. yours is a circus show. —— the murders reported. circus show. -- the murders reported-— circus show. -- the murders reported. he is living with his horse, reported. he is living with his horse. you — reported. he is living with his horse, you don't _ reported. he is living with his horse, you don't think - reported. he is living with his horse, you don't think that i reported. he is living with his horse, you don't think that is| horse, you don't think that is real? it's real, trust me! if your kid came home one day and said, i'm marrying a horse, you would say that's real. you said, i'm marrying a horse, you would say that's real.— would say that's real. you may have found _ would say that's real. you may have found the _ would say that's real. you may have found the one _ would say that's real. you may have found the one human i would say that's real. you may l have found the one human being in the whole of america who thought he had married his horse, but let's not get stuck on the horse. let's watch a clip. the people who don't know jerry springer, it may be worth looking at the style of the show. this edition was about transsexuals, it was called transsexuals, it was called transsexuals attacks. we are going to see a woman, a transsexual, who is serious

with her boyfriend because he has run off with another gay quy- has run off with another gay guy. b, has run off with another gay cu . ~ ., ., has run off with another gay i u _ �* ., ., ., �* has run off with another gay guy. a woman don't conduct themselves _ guy. a woman don't conduct themselves like _ guy. a woman don't conduct themselves like this... i guy. a woman don't conduct themselves like this... he i themselves like this... he wants to _ themselves like this... he wants to be _ themselves like this... he wants to be a _ themselves like this... he: wants to be a woman! he can't fulfil my shoes! look at this... �* , ., fulfil my shoes! look at this... i ., fulfil my shoes! look at this... �*, ., ., this... he's got you on the shirt- -- — this... he's got you on the shirt- -- i — this... he's got you on the shirt... i put _ this... he's got you on the shirt... i put time - this... he's got you on the shirt... i put time in i this... he's got you on the shirt... i put time in this i shirt... i put time in this relationship, _ shirt... i put time in this relationship, you're i shirt... i put time in this. relationship, you're going shirt... i put time in this i relationship, you're going to flush this down the toilet? it takes two... flush this down the toilet? it takes two. .. of— flush this down the toilet? it takes two... of course... i you're telling me that's not real? that those people are not really angry? 0f real? that those people are not really angry? of course they are. . �* , really angry? of course they are. ., �*, ., ., really angry? of course they are. ., i, ., ., , ., are. that's a great question about honesty _ are. that's a great question about honesty and - are. that's a great question about honesty and reality. i are. that's a great question i about honesty and reality. let me just explain to everyone watching, the town dropped out because you take out all swearing. hf because you take out all swearing-— because you take out all swearing. because you take out all swearinu. , ,

swearing. if they use the f word- -- — swearing. if they use the f word... but _ swearing. if they use the f word... but what - swearing. if they use the f word... but what you i swearing. if they use the f word... but what you do i swearing. if they use the f i word... but what you do see is [en word... but what you do see is plenty of _ word... but what you do see is plenty of fighting. _ word... but what you do see is plenty of fighting. -- - word... but what you do see is plenty of fighting. -- the i plenty of fighting. —— the sound dropped out. you talk about being real and honest, in 1998, 16 people who had been on your show went to the media and said, the fights are not even real, we are told when to fight and how, it is staged. bud real, we are told when to fight and how, it is staged.- and how, it is staged. and as it was proven, _ and how, it is staged. and as it was proven, they _ and how, it is staged. and as it was proven, they were i and how, it is staged. and as i it was proven, they were wrong, it was proven, they were wrong, it is not staged. the lawyers are all over it. they made that accusation, we got duped by them because they made up their stories, that sometimes happens. but i can tell you, if you come and watch ask, before the show starts, they meet in a room with the lawyers, there is a camera on them while they swear everything that happened... there are documents to show it is true. so to pick out that in 1998, someone said, you know... out that in 1998, someone said, you know- - -_ you know... they said it was sta . ed. you know... they said it was staged. none _ you know. .. they said it was staged. none of— you know... they said it was staged. none of it _ you know... they said it was staged. none of it is - you know... they said it was | staged. none of it is staged, that's wrong. _ staged. none of it is staged, that's wrong. a _ staged. none of it is staged, that's wrong. a guest - staged. none of it is staged, that's wrong. a guest may i staged. none of it is staged, | that's wrong. a guest may be dishonest from time to time.

44,000 guests... i'm sure if someone was on the show and didn't tell the truth, they duped you, that doesn't mean don't watch hardtalk because people lie. you talk to politicians, so it's given that they are not telling the truth! may be politicians come into a different category, but let's stick with what you do and talk about vulnerability. you have thousands of guests on the show over the years, you can't even remember how many, so many of them. there were many people who have been on your show who probably were on your show against their own better interests. how often do your staff, your team of researchers, come across a great story, an unbelievable story of emotional turmoil, and say, you know what, we are not going to put you on tv because that would be counter to your own interests?— own interests? quite a few times. own interests? quite a few times- i'll— own interests? quite a few times. i'lltell_ own interests? quite a few times. i'll tell you - own interests? quite a few times. i'll tell you exactly i times. i'll tell you exactly what the process is. we get thousands of calls a week from people who want to be on the show. they give us the story,

and the producers and researchers checked to make sure it's true. every once in a while, during that interview process, it becomes clear, for example, that a person may not be mentally stable, or, as you say, really vulnerable. and then they don't get on the show. �* ., ., , show. but unfortunately sometimes _ show. but unfortunately sometimes they - show. but unfortunately sometimes they do i show. but unfortunately sometimes they do get| show. but unfortunately i sometimes they do get on the show. i'm thinking about the panic story... you knew i would have to bring this up. panic story. .. you knew i would have to bring this up.— have to bring this up. that's fine, but — have to bring this up. that's fine, but it _ have to bring this up. that's fine, but it assumes, i have to bring this up. that's fine, but it assumes, which| have to bring this up. that's i fine, but it assumes, which is what i'm fighting against, it assumes that because a person is of low income... you in the news would never ever ask a question about... news would never ever ask a question about. . ._ news would never ever ask a question about... hang on, this is not about _ question about... hang on, this is not about to _ question about... hang on, this is not about to do _ question about... hang on, this is not about to do with - question about... hang on, this is not about to do with income, | is not about to do with income, this is about to do with what happened after one of your shows. nancy came on the show with her ex—husband ralph. he was in a new relationship. the new woman came on the show. the new woman came on the show. the new woman came on the show. the new woman and ralph panned the ex—wife, they called her old and fat, the audience got involved, there was a lot of

shouting. nancy went off that show distraught apparently, but not so long after when the show was aired on tv, within hours, there had been a murder. ralph was convicted of murdering nancy. was convicted of murdering nan . ., , ., nancy. having exactly nothing to do with _ nancy. having exactly nothing to do with the _ nancy. having exactly nothing to do with the show, - nancy. having exactly nothing to do with the show, which i nancy. having exactly nothing to do with the show, which is| to do with the show, which is the part you didn't bother to tell. ., ., ~ ., the part you didn't bother to tell. ., ., ,, ., because tell. how do you know? because the court determined... - tell. how do you know? because the court determined... i'm i the court determined... i'm your question, you made the insolence that because someone one was —— someone was on a show, four months later they commit a murder and that has to do with the show? you don't know what happened that day. they got into a big fight about being evicted from a house which had nothing to do with the choke. 44,000 people on the show, if any one of the 44,000 people subsequently ever committed a crime, of course... you give me any population of

44,000 people and i'll tell you, a certain percentage of them will have committed crimes. don't connect it to the show... ., . ., , ., show... the warring couple who ended up _ show... the warring couple who ended up in _ show... the warring couple who ended up in this _ show... the warring couple who ended up in this tragedy - show... the warring couple who ended up in this tragedy after i ended up in this tragedy after the show was aired, hours after the show was aired, hours after the show was aired... i wonder whether you sat down and for a moment, had a think about whether it was time to move on, to do something else?— whether it was time to move on, to do something else? they were fine when the _ to do something else? they were fine when the show _ to do something else? they were fine when the show ended. i to do something else? they were fine when the show ended. you i fine when the show ended. you are going back to your assumption, which i'm respectfully saying were totally incorrect. you did not mention to the audience what caused the murder. it was four months later. why do you bring that... it months later. why do you bring that... . , months later. why do you bring that... .,, ,., months later. why do you bring that... .,, ., ., that... it was borne out of the dysfunctional _ that... it was borne out of the dysfunctional relationship i dysfunctional relationship which you aired on national television. i'mjust wondering, whether having done that and seeing the couple... it whether having done that and seeing the couple. . ._ seeing the couple... it had nothin: seeing the couple... it had nothing to _ seeing the couple... it had nothing to do _ seeing the couple... it had nothing to do with - seeing the couple... it had nothing to do with the i seeing the couple... it had - nothing to do with the show... excuse me, no, i'm not responsible for the behaviour of 44,000

responsible for the behaviour of a4,000 people who at some time in their life was on our show. if later on in life, they commit a show. if later on in life, they commita crime, show. if later on in life, they commit a crime, you're going to say that the reason they committed the crime, because for 20 by by the way, the motor had nothing to do with what they were arguing about on the show. but you just told everyone that i show had something to do without. . �* , i show had something to do without. ., �*, ., ., , without. that's totally incorrect. _ without. that's totally incorrect. what - without. that's totally incorrect. what you i without. that's totally | incorrect. what you do without. that's totally - incorrect. what you do on your show... i incorrect. what you do on your show... . , incorrect. what you do on your show... ., , ., show... i am saying there is no correlation- — show... i am saying there is no correlation. let _ show... i am saying there is no correlation. let me _ show. .. i am saying there is no correlation. let me talk- show... i am saying there is no correlation. let me talk about | correlation. let me talk about the course — correlation. let me talk about the course of _ correlation. let me talk about the course of american - correlation. let me talk about| the course of american culture over 20 years of your programme. when it started a huge step because it was, as we've discussed, doing something different. pretty much every nation the world has what they call reality tv and gives voices to people that you've set in america so long with voiceless, that properly isn't so much the case anymore. do you think the role that your show played has served its

purpose, but it is not the novelty, does not have the shock value bit hard? it’s novelty, does not have the shock value bit hard? it's not summed _ shock value bit hard? it's not summed to _ shock value bit hard? it's not supposed to have _ shock value bit hard? it's not supposed to have shock- shock value bit hard? it's not. supposed to have shock value. let's say this. when television get too impressed with ourselves like we are really shaping society. let me tell you. human behaviour has not deteriorated because of television. in fact, deteriorated because of television. infact, i deteriorated because of television. in fact, i would argue that human behaviour has not deteriorated period. there is nothing you will ever see on any television show in england, great britain or america or anywhere in the world that is something that has not existed for thousands of years. the difference is, 3000 years ago people would gather in the marketplace, gather in the town square and they were chat with each other about who was doing what in the neighbourhood. the differences we now have technology and technology has made the neighbourhood global, so all of a sudden and now with kids grow with their facebook, going on internet with their cellphones, everybody is talking about what they do in

their lives so the whole world knows. ' ~ their lives so the whole world knows. ' . ,., knows. the difference... do they need — knows. the difference... do they need jerry _ knows. the difference... do they need jerry springer - knows. the difference... do they need jerry springer to l knows. the difference... do i they need jerry springer to put they need jerry springer to put people on a sat in a tv studio? doing it hardtalk anymore? that's a great question, i'm just asking. that's a great question, i'm just asking-— that's a great question, i'm 'ust askinu. , ~ . . just asking. yes! we are social beinus. just asking. yes! we are social beinqs- we — just asking. yes! we are social beings. we are _ just asking. yes! we are social beings. we are fascinated - just asking. yes! we are social beings. we are fascinated by l beings. we are fascinated by what other humans are doing. it's not needed. it's television! it's television! it's not critical. i love the honesty which you tell me that you wouldn't watch the show and you wouldn't watch the show and you think the show is stupid. if i make my want to get personal and reflect on how you feel about a long and successful career doing this show when so many ways your earliest point something else. you are hired to work by bobby kennedy and 1968 before he was assassinated? you are very committed politically as a lawyer who turned to politics, you are a progressive liberal city matt hanson is an article.

you clearly believed in things. you clearly believed in things. you are a passionate progressive.- you are a passionate progressive. still are. politics _ progressive. still are. politics is _ progressive. still are. politics is a _ progressive. still are. politics is a major... i progressive. still are. . politics is a major... how progressive. still are. - politics is a major... how do you feel about spending so long in this particular niche in the tv business?— in this particular niche in the tv business? the way you ask the question, _ tv business? the way you ask the question, which _ tv business? the way you ask the question, which is - tv business? the way you ask the question, which is good, l the question, which is good, you are a great interviewer, that we are asking the question, you make it seem like this is something i should feel bad about. i am still as passionate about my politics as i've ever people in the state particularly in ohio know that i am every week giving political speeches, raising money, organising campaigns, i am very politically active. that has not changed. he wanted to change the world. i that has not changed. he wanted to change the world.— to change the world. i still do! that's _ to change the world. i still do! that's not _ to change the world. i still do! that's not how- to change the world. i still do! that's not how i - to change the world. i still do! that's not how i make | to change the world. i still. do! that's not how i make my living. in other words, do! that's not how i make my living. in otherwords, i believe in politics like i believe in politics like i believe in politics like i believe in my religion. i take it very seriously. i don't want dictated by the need to make a living. i believe that when politicians have to make a living being re—elected, that

you built into it and incentive for at least intellectual dishonesty. if i know that the only way i'm putting food on the table for my family is by winning the election, there is going to be real incentive for me to say whatever the public wants to hear whether it is but i honestly feel and not because i honestly feel and not because i have to win the election, that's how i make my living. i earlier decided my politics would always be pure, but i'd never stop being a liberal, i have never stopped being progressive always decided i would not make a living in politics so myjob as being an entertainer, my passion is political. and i am just as active, i worked tirelessly for barack 0bama, campaigning all around the country for him, contributing a ton of money to him and i do the same to hillary, god bless her. you can't assume because i have a job... can't assume because i have a 'ob... ~ . can't assume because i have a 'ob...~ . . job... what i find fascinating it's a cliche, _ job... what i find fascinating it's a cliche, the _ job... what i find fascinating it's a cliche, the journey - job... what i find fascinating it's a cliche, the journey of l it's a cliche, the journey of your life, because it is incredible. people won't know that your parents just, thank

god, escaped nazi europe and your grandparents did not and were killed in the camps. i know very close to your parents and in a sense a lot of your life has been reflecting on what they went through. again, i come back to this point, you have been a huge success but were there not other things you really wanted to do in your public life that meant at some point you might want to leave the tv business? i point you might want to leave the tv business?— the tv business? i tell you wh . the tv business? i tell you why- i'll— the tv business? i tell you why- i'll say _ the tv business? i tell you why. i'll say it _ the tv business? i tell you why. i'll say it again. - the tv business? i tell you why. i'll say it again. i- the tv business? i tell you why. i'll say it again. i am| why. i'll say it again. i am very active politically. understood. so i have not given up understood. so i have not given up on that. ijust don't run for office. ijust said the reason i don't run for office, i am 70 now, what's the point, but i don't run for office because that's not how i want to make a living. politics is my religion, not only, i am jewish, but it is like a religion to me, as i really

believe in the liberal causes, so that's really important to me. i don't compromise on that. but i make my living high make money, i am an entertainer. why in a free enterprise system do i apologise for being an entertainer? but my views, someone to challenge me on my political views.— politicalviews. listen, as we close, politicalviews. listen, as we close. let's _ politicalviews. listen, as we close, let's talk _ politicalviews. listen, as we close, let's talk politics - politicalviews. listen, as we close, let's talk politics a - close, let's talk politics a little bit. you've always been very open about maybe you're more left than most democratic abuse. you are very quote unquote progressive. you've just seen barack 0bama in powerful, what, a term and a half? yes. there are many liberals in america who are disappointed with what 0bama has actually delivered. are you one of them?— has actually delivered. are you one of them? no. look, what i like him to _ one of them? no. look, what i like him to be _ one of them? no. look, what i like him to be successful - one of them? no. look, what i like him to be successful in - like him to be successful in every single thing he has been in favour of that i'm in favour of? of course. but i realised

we were president of the united states you're not a dictator you don't get everything you want or everything i want. what i am happy about on the big issues, boy, he has been a great president. big issues. he came in and save the financial system, he saved the auto industry, he saved the economy, he got asked almost out of iraqi, out of afghanistan, and now for the first time embarrassingly we americans with dale mciver last to the table with health insurance for our people so at least now we got off to a sloppy start, and a couple of years from now all americans will have health insurance. god bless them for that. history will look back and see these achievements and say, well, great, in that hundred % that he got everything? know, but no president does. i’m everything? know, but no president does. i'm happy with them. iwonder, _ president does. i'm happy with them. iwonder, coming - president does. i'm happy with them. i wonder, coming back. president does. i'm happy with l them. i wonder, coming back to them. iwonder, coming back to them. iwonder, coming back to the point of changing social energies, do you think and serve as adjuster this is true, america is still a deeply

conservative country with a small see?— small see? no. we all give conservative _ small see? no. we all give conservative speeches - small see? no. we all give conservative speeches but| small see? no. we all givel conservative speeches but if you look at how people live, liberals always win in the end. i'll say it again. liberals always win in the end. in the beginning conservatives will fight stop conservatives fought against america social security, now no american would even think about going without social security. conservatives fought against civil rights, now we have an african american president. conservatives fought against women's rights and we may have a woman president and women have much more equality in america are now compared to 20, 30 years in america are now compared to 20,30 years ago. in america are now compared to 20, 30 years ago. conservatives fought against gay marriage and now as you said, over 50% of the country is accepting gay marriage and liberalism ultimately will win but there will be battles along the way. if you had your time over again, would you choose to have the political career that you try to have but in the end did

not go national, or would you still take the deal that you actually have? if still take the deal that you actually have?— still take the deal that you actually have? still take the deal that you actuall have? , ., actually have? if god comes to me and says. _ actually have? if god comes to me and says, gerald, - actually have? if god comes to me and says, gerald, i- actually have? if god comes to me and says, gerald, i formedi me and says, gerald, iformed them, gerald, iwill give, you can have another life. and you can have another life. and you can sign for the exact life you've had or take your chances on another one, god, where do i sign? i am the luckiest person in the world. i have no right to complain about anything. i have a privileged lucky life and i say luck, i didn't choose to be born, i didn't use to whom i'd be born, with what health, with what brain in what country, the whole bit. i was born here in england, by the way. all of this is a gift, life is a gift, short, i work hard, but lots of people work hard, but lots of people work hard, but lots of people work hard, but i don't know why i got lucky. but what i say nine? held, yeah. jerry springer, that's a great way to end.

thank you for being on high torque. thank you for being on high torn ue. , . , thank you for being on high toruue. , ., , . torque. this has been great, thank yom — hello. sunday brought some pretty warm weather in parts of the uk, but it also brought some really heavy downpours. there are some further showers in the forecast for bank holiday monday, but equally some spells of sunshine. many of us will again feel relatively warm, particularly in the sunshine. but northern parts, particularly scotland, will start to turn rather chilly because of this cold front. now, it doesn't look like much here on the chart. it's just going to bring some extra clouds, a little bit of rain. but behind it, it will introduce some chilly air, particularly across parts of scotland. most of us, though, starting monday morning on a mild note,

bit of showery rain across some eastern parts of england. across england and wales, we are going to see some spells of sunshine, scattered showers which could be heavy and thundery, particularly from east wales eastwards, west wales, the south west of england, not seeing too many showers. northern ireland brightening up through the afternoon with some spells of sunshine. most of us temperatures between 1a and 17 degrees. but through the afternoon, those temperatures dropping across the northern half of scotland. behind our weather front, some cloud, the odd spot of rain, that frontal system sinking further southwards as we go through monday night. not much more than a band of cloud, really, but to the north of it, it is going to be quite a chilly start to tuesday. we could well see a touch of frost across some parts of the highlands. so for tuesday morning, a rather chilly start. for many, this band of cloud likely to be left across the uk. maybe the odd spot of rain, the odd shower breaking out. but most places, i think, will be dry and we should see some spells of sunshine, but a little on the cool side across northern scotland and down into the eastern side of england, ten to 12 degrees

even further south and west, not as warm as it has been. now, on wednesday, a weak front is likely to bring a bit of patchy rain through northern ireland and western scotland. some showers may start to develop down towards the south as the winds begin to pick up through the day. temperatures generally between ten and 16 degrees. as we head towards the end of the week, we will see frontal systems squashing in from the southwest, reintroducing the chance for some rain and for a time a brisk easterly breeze, which will make it feel rather chilly, particularly for some eastern coasts. but through the week, a lot of dry weather for a time through tuesday into wednesday, but then turning more unsettled.

live from london, this is bbc news. mac the un urges sudan to respect _ mac the un urges sudan to respect the ceasefire as they deliver— respect the ceasefire as they deliver supplies.— respect the ceasefire as they deliver supplies. ukraine is on hiuh deliver supplies. ukraine is on high alert _ deliver supplies. ukraine is on high alert as _ deliver supplies. ukraine is on high alert as aerated - deliver supplies. ukraine is on high alert as aerated alarms i high alert as aerated alarms sound explosions rocked eastern regions. welcome to the programme. the united nations has urged rival military factions fighting in sudan to stick to the latest

truce to prevent a humanitarian disaster. a ceasefire