tv The Interview BBC News May 21, 2023 1:30am-2:01am BST
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voice—over: this is bbc news. we'll have the headlines and all the main news stories for you at the top of the hour, straight after this programme. bangladesh's prime minister has beenin bangladesh's prime minister has been in powerfor the past 1a years. hersupporters been in powerfor the past 1a years. her supporters described her as a saviour and her critics say she is a dictator, accusing her of human rights abuses. in a rare and wide—ranging interview with the bbc sheikh hasina sits down to discuss some of the most
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important issues facing her country. she remains defiant when it comes to the treatment of the minority rohingya refugees and says that she is in no hurry to step down as the leader of the country. you are the world's longest serving female leader. often described as the iron lady of bangladesh, you are the daughter of the founder of the country. i just want to know, how have the last 14 years have been for you personally? the last 14 years have been the best time for bangladesh. in every aspect, we made tremendous development. we couldn't do it in the past because, after independence,
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our father of the nation got only three years and seven months to build up the strength of his country and develop the country. after the military ruler took over directly or indirectly, then in 2008, when we won the election, it was a continuous democratic process for 14 years. that really helped our country to develop. every sector we made some progress. your country has been described as a flawed muslim democracy, and then there are those who say it is sliding into autocracy under your rule. what went wrong? when you say autocracy, my whole life i struggled for democracy. our party, we established
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democracy in this country. and before that, i told you that we had military rule for 21 years, and then again a military backed government for another eight years. that was altogether 29 years out of 50 years. so, only this time, this 14 years, we have had a true democratic system and stability, and therefore, we could make progress. why then, does the un human rights chief raise concerns about allegations of extrajudicial killings, forced disappearances, torture, cracking down on the press? i don't know. but actually the allegation, they couldn't prove that much. well, some group, they mentioned a big number. when we inquired, it was
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perhaps five or six people. but, sometimes, people themselves... some people hide themselves because of different issues. but extrajudicial killing, we never support that. in our country i think, i don't know any other countries, that have these rules, but in our country, the law is there, and if there is anything being done wrong by our law enforcement agency, immediately, they go forjustice. any organisation, if they have done any misdeeds, immediately, they get punishment. why did the us imposed sanctions on one of your paramilitary organisations? that paramilitary organisation
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was set up by the us, and actually with their advice, it was established in 200a. all of the training, equipments, everything was provided by us. was provided by us. and i feel that the way they train them, now they are acting in such a way, so how and why they sanctioned it is really a big question to me. what do you think it is? what do you think the reason for it is? i don't know, maybe they don't want me to continue all the progress we are making for bangladesh to continue. they may not accept it. this is my feeling. because you see, terrorism at one stage becomes a big problem for every country. in our country, we control terrorism. we have had only one incident, after that, no more incidents took place.
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so our law enforcement agencies were working very hard to keep control, and also make the progress. i mean, the accusations — i want to pick up on a few things you've said. the accusations are that before the sanctions in 2018, while you were in power, there were 466 people killed by the security forces. in 2019, 388 people killed. in 2020, 188 people killed. then, when the sanctions were lessened, it went down to 15. the number they mentioned, they could not prove it. they were... killed by the law enforcement agencies or because we wanted the evidence. there are two whistle—blowers
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from the paramilitary organisation as part of a documentary that was done by dw, who said that the orders come at the highest level, meaning you, to kill some of these people. this was a documentary done by a german organisation. well how they made these allegations, i don't know. but what is happening in america, you can see. almost every day, even in a school or a shopping mall, or a restaurant, people are killing even schoolchildren. then other common people have been killed by either law enforcement agencies or carers. i think that you should look into that in their country. what is the situation? this is the children's life
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they are not taking care of that, their own people. but, the allegations they brought, or the number they said, we asked them to give us that evidence. they couldn't place that. and yet, the sanctions are not being lifted. well, sanctions... and counter—sanctions — this is some kind of game, i feel. it is still not clear to me why they put sanctions on our country. i can tell you one thing. look at me. my whole family was assassinated. my father. he was the president of the country. then my mother, my three brothers, the younger one was only ten years old. my two sisters in law altogether, 18 members. those killers, they got indemnity.
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that means you cannot punish then. i had no right to ask forjustice. i couldn't file any case against that. that time, they didn't put on any sanctions. there is still one killer, and he took shelter in america. time and again, i am asking or requesting their government, or the president directly. i sent a letter to them... why do you think they are not listening? i don't know. you have raised this in parliament as well. this idea they want that they want regime change. do you have any evidence that supports that? because you're raising this concern again now. that is the big question, why they put the sanction when the law enforcement
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agencies working to control terrorism. and... action attacking the violation of human rights, but why are they supporting the violator is not the victims. not the people. amnesty international, human rights watch, the un have all expressed concern. i know that, but they couldn't prove it. are they lying? i don't know. i don't know the international game. why would they want to remove you? well, they killed my father. those who kill our family, even my ten—year—old brother... perhaps those killers or conspirators never wanted anybody from my family to come to power. and then, when the military rule ruled over the country, they killed so many people.
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so enforcement agency, army, opposition, even our party. ——law enforcement agency, our a rmy, opposition, even our party. thousands of people have been killed. so, that time, we never saw any sanctions this. this is a question from me to the international community... why were they so blind at that time? they never said or put any sanctions on the military dictator or those who killed, even in broad daylight. there was an attack grenade attack on me and 22 members of my party, who were killed. nearly 700 people wounded. i didn't see any sanctions. the feeling is that the paramilitary organisation ordered the killings ofjournalists, opposition leaders, dissidents, activists...
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the observer says that earlier this year the police were accused of a coordinated campaign of violence against the opposition. officers have fired on peaceful protests. listen, i was in opposition. the ruling party have tortured us. we have no right to hold meetings. are you saying that at least 20,000 cases have been filed against the supporters of the opposition... more than 7000 members and activists have been arrested. a thousand people detained. is that what they did? they killed people. they threw molotov cocktails. they set fire to public buses. about 3800 public buses were burned with passengers in. they killed common people.
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in train, private car. they killed people. so, what is there to do? will you not file a case against them? not only that, the attack... 0ur public meeting, or the attack on common people... that is their movement. they said that it is their movement. that way, they kill people. so what is there to do? so you detained them. and anyone who has been a supporter of the opposition? no, it is not supporters. it is killers, those who torture people, those who kill people. that is why they got this punishment. they are all corrupt. i don't understand why all those organisations do not see what crimes they have done. well, they are saying the opposition, they are saying that sheikh hasina is dreaming of staying in powerforever without any election or competition. of course not.
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for electoral and voting rights i struggled for my whole life against the military ruler, and the system we have now introduced, it is only our party. when we are in power. listen, we passed the law to establish the election commission. we always wanted a free and fair elections. now, ourvoter list, it is with the photo and id card. we introduced a transparent ballot boxes. if you want to know about it, then you have to go back to our past, the history of our country, how elections have been manipulated or rigged. or, the result was...
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you got 96% of the vote in the last election. 88 people voted for me because of our work. more than some dictators in egypt, that figure. that's the same, on par as vladimir putin. listen, we have 170 million people, people are very conscious about the political right. since our public formed government, work for our people to ensure food security, reduce poverty levels, ensure health care, education, housing, all the basic needs we ensured. so of course, people always vote for us. why not? i want to bring this back to your election in 2018 and why the international community has concerns about the next election next year. transparency international said
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that they found irregularities. 47 out of the 50 constituencies surveyed, fake votes, ballot stuffing, voters and opposition are polling agents are barred from entering the centres. where is the proof? i want that. i want the document. because i'm telling you, 2008 election, there is no objection. nothing. nobody questioned the election, right? those political parties, altogether, how many seats did they get in the 2008 election? only 29 seats out of 300. because of their misrule. their corruption. their nepotism, terrorism activities. people rejected them.
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they voted for us. they voted for me and my party. and my allowance. in 2014, those parties did not participate. what they did, they started killing people. 500 schools were burned down. how brutally they act. but you are currently in power... let me finish. so, they didn't participate, but they tried to jeopardise the electoral system. why are these international observers saying that these elections were not fair and free? that, i do not know. that, i do not know how they look at it, but the election definitely was free and fair. in 2018 election, they participated at the beginning.
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but what was the situation? we had 300 constituencies, for 300 constituencies, you have to nominate 300 people, 300 candidates. but what was the situation? they nominated about 700, so they started fighting with each other. at one instance they withdrew from the election and did not participate. imean... my point is that, when they did participate in the election, when they withdrew, how can they claim that the election was not free and fair? they have no right to say that. it is not the opposition saying that. it is transparency international. i know that. they say... transpareny international say that, i have my doubts about their transparency, i can tell you. so you think that the un
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human rights watch... you didn't say that. but in terms of the human rights record, you are saying that there is... i told you, human rights, they never thought about me, about my human rights when i lost all of my family members. i never received any support from them. why? my whole family was assassinated, why didn't they raise... the americans, there are some people who think that the reason why they have imposed the sanctions on the paramilitary organisation is to put bangladesh back onto the path of the right human rights record. how do you respond to that? bangladesh always maintained human rights. human rights, it does not only mean the security of all. to me, human rights means security, right to food, the right to vote, the right
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to live, everything that we maintain. what about the rohingya? what about that community? rohingya community, you tell me. we give them shelter on human rights. which you received a lot of praise or internationally. they praise you for bringing 1 million people at a time of desperate need. the international community praised bangladesh, they praise you for bringing these people here. what has happened five years on is that there is overcrowding, arson, violence. there have been attempts to move them to another island. there is concern around the flooding in that island, and that some rohingya have attempted to flee. i am very sorry, have you been there? have you seen the island? how we developed that island for them? those who are living, how they are living... those who enter that island are now living in a better way
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as we made arrangements for 100,000 families. the house, hurricane shelter, everything is there. who told you it is flooding? it is false. those who didn't go there, they can say,... so that island does not flood prone? of course it is. it is flood proof, we built up an embankment. people are living there. children are getting at least health care and schooling, their livelihood is better than this camp. it is a cramped place. that area, it was totally destroyed.
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all the plant and everything. it was a deep forest, but it is totally gone. and now, they are fighting with each other, they are involved in drug trafficking or human trafficking, so we wanted that either the international community... before they brought this allegation, they should make sure that they go back to their own country. and they should live a better life. you mean go back to myanmar. yes. they should go back to their own country. do you think it is safe for them to go there? the un and other organisations should take care of that. in their own country, they are safe. it is their duty to do it, not ours. when they suffered, we brought them to our country we made all that they needed. 40,000 women are pregnant. we had to establish a field hospital and we made sure that they got all of the treatment, food,
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everything. at the beginning, nobody came forward. it was bangladesh people, people from our country, they came forward and they supported them. and in the island, that island is totally safe. those who are living there are living in a better way. what about these repatriation is back to myanmar? the un says that no one should be forced to return. we are hearing reports, the bbc, that a group of about 20 rohingya were sent back to go and look at a facility to see if they could live there. and they have said that there were also junta leaders brought to cox's bazar, and they have told human human rights groups that they were lied to and deceived into meeting with these militaryjunta by bangladeshi authorities. i don't know why they said that, they voluntarily went there because their representative came to talk
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to them voluntarily. they went there to see. nobody is telling lies, why should they lie? and tell you one thing, how can one country bear this burden of 10 million... i mean, 1 million people? day by day, it is increasing. how long can we bear this burden? they should go back to their own country. and yes voluntarily, they went there to see the condition. we didn't force them. how are you going to deal with this? well, we are asking the international community like the human rights commission, and un, and other international organisations they should make room for these people to go back to their country. it is their duty. they cannot forever put this burden on us. already, our country is overpopulated, and our common people
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they are suffering. do you feel supported by the international community? yes, they are supporting us, but they can make anything yes, they are supporting us, but they couldn't make anything positive. that is the unfortunate thing, that yes they are, when we discussed with them, they are supportive, they say, yes they should go back, and this and that, but they can't do anything in a positive way. that is my question. now, on humanitarian grounds, we give shelter to the rohingya people, right? it is humanitarian grounds. tell me one thing. when we give shelter such as for a big community,
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a big group, then how can this international community blame us, that we are violating human rights in our country when we can give shelter to other people from other countries? why should we violate human rights in our own country? so, all of the allegations are totally fabricated. i don't know why they are doing it. that is my question. why this allegation to bangladesh. tell me. hello there. it's been a lovely start to the weekend, especially across england and wales where we have had lots of sunshine so blue skies over these blue bell woods in south wales near pontypridd. you can see the extent of the sunshine. a bit more cloud for scotland and northern
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ireland but still managed some bright spells and, actually, for scotland, northern ireland, england and wales we have temperatures reaching the low 20s in warmest spots, 21.5 there making the warm day the warm day of the year so far for wales. over the next few hours we have another weatherfront moving in, pipping up bringing a bit of heavy rain for a time to scotland and northern ireland but as we get towards dawn that will tend to start to fizzle away. clear skies for england and wales allowing temperatures to dip down to around 5—8 celsius. a cool start to sunday morning for england and wales. a weak weather front moves into an area of high pressure. the high—pressure will squish the weather front so not a lot of rain on it, really, as we head into sunday. just a stripe of cloud. a few spots around that generally some bright weather coming through at times. england and wales again have the best of the weather with plenty of sunshine and a bit of cloud developing through the afternoon across east anglia and the south—east. but again those temperatures are not bad for this time of year, average, really with temperatures
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into the upper teens. 20, maybe 22 in the warmer spots. into next week a similar scenario, weak weather fronts try to come out the top side of this area of high pressure and again you may see an odd spit of rain for scotland and northern ireland but not much. most of the day will be dry with some sunny spells coming through and again it is england and wales will have the best of the day's sunshine and we continue to see those temperatures in the warm spots climb into the low 20s. deep into next week the jet stream takes this pattern. high—pressure will be close by in these troughs around southern europe will ensure we can see heavy thundery showers across southern europe which is quite unusual, really, for this time of year. and here is the forecast in a bit more detail over the next several days you can see the extent of the dry weather and temperatures again holding for the most part around 18— 21 celsius. fine weather next week.
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