is immigration working for you? we've got a special programme for the next two hours focussing on immigration. people say it will be the biggest ever, something akin to the population of leeds, we will see, they have counted them in an out, massive political issue, remember david cameron promising to bring it down to below 100,000 a year, then

he doubled down, no ifs, no buts, a lot of ifs and buts: taking back control, we are in control of legal migration, we grant the work visas, study visas, are you worrieded this is unsustainable, driving down wage, straining public services? are you encouraged, pleased we have the people we need the worker, the students keeping the great academic institutions solvent. migration, if we need it, we need it. and ukraine and hong kong are very much part of the mix here as well. we have top bbc experts, the best kind on hand, we have you on the phone, get in touch, if you have come here, you a business that needs migrant workers get in touch.

here is news. figures out figures out in around half an hour are likely to show net migration to show net migration reached a record high last year. the office for national statistics is expected to put the figure at around 700,000 well above the previous high of 500,000. the energy regulator has cut its price cap for england, wales and scotland. 0fgem says a typical household will pay £2,074 a year. that's down from £2,500. the biggest names in music have been paying tribute to tina turner, who's died aged 83. beyonce called her the "epitome of passion and power" and gloria gaynor said she "paved the way for so many women in rock music". and benny and bjorn from abba have shot down any idea of the band reforming for next year's eurovision in sweden. next year will be the 50th anniversary of the band winning the conest with their song waterloo.

politics books on the shelves are always repeats themselves, the politicians are cop standly talking about migration. it is complex and it is important we hearfrom about migration. it is complex and it is important we hear from you this morning, not racist to have concern, suella braverman made that clear in a speech, but of course, populist politics continues to rise the world over, and there are politicians ready to exploit and fuel people's fears. looking at the pollling, public attitudes to immigration, really interesting, it is going to be fascinating hearing from you on that this morning, who is leave, who is coming, for how long? how does the points system work? i have been looking at the list of professions we need, people

to work in. it is a fascinating, and diverse list ofjobs, from biological scientist, mechanical engineer, quality control engineer, choreographers, graphic designer, pipe welder, fishermen just been added as well. roofer, carpenters, plasterers, care workers of course, there was an exodus from that particular sector after brexit, which has been really difficult for that particular part of our society. so we will be addressing these issue, we want to hear from you and we have damian speaking toous, good morning to you, and in the studio dominic our home affairs correspondent. figures out come narc, at 9.30 this morning, and, the government are brace themselves, what they think are going to be bad headlines. , , , ., what they think are going to be bad headlines. , , , . , headlines. yes, yes, and they will be bad, because _

headlines. yes, yes, and they will be bad, because this _ headlines. yes, yes, and they will be bad, because this has - headlines. yes, yes, and they will be bad, because this has been - headlines. yes, yes, and they will be bad, because this has been a l be bad, because this has been a political pledge, now, since 2010, david cameron went into the then general election as tory leader, saying, and it is explicit they wanted to get net migration down to tens of thousands, the rate it was at, in the mid, early to mid 90s and he wanted to hit that, it never got anywhere near it. the general trend has been roughly round 200,000 a year. shall i explain what net migration is?— year. shall i explain what net migration is?_ so, | year. shall i explain what net. migration is?_ so, net migration is? please do. so, net miaration migration is? please do. so, net migration is _ migration is? please do. so, net migration is simple. _ migration is? please do. so, net migration is simple. it _ migration is? please do. so, net migration is simple. it is - migration is? please do. so, net migration is simple. it is a - migration is? please do. so, net| migration is simple. it is a useful way of measures how much immigration is adding to the population and the way you get it is you count all the people who are coming into the uk, so immigrants, and it is worth stressing that includes returning british citizen, so anyone who is coming in for at least a year, minus the people who are leaving for at least a year, and the balance of

thatis least a year, and the balance of that is net migration. and that is the number of people arming the lump sum of people we think have been added to the population there are a lot of, you know, limitations round that data, for many years it was based on the paper survey carried out at port, the office for national statistics who are responsible for coming up with the figure are doing a lot work to improve. they started using internal data captured at the border, data from tax, return, those kind of things, so it is getting more and more accurate as time goes on, so, the figure itself is an estimate, but in broad terms it gives us a real indication of the trend and the trend has been since the pandemic, whoosh, up, hand is because we had this extraordinary global lockdown, all sorts of people stopped travel, pandemic ends, guess what, people want to move, get on with their lives and they have british citizens coming back. find with their lives and they have british citizens coming back. and we

must not confuse _ british citizens coming back. and we must not confuse this _ british citizens coming back. and we must not confuse this with - british citizens coming back. and we must not confuse this with irregular| must not confuse this with irregular immigration, as well. yes. are those fi . ures, immigration, as well. yes are those figures, people coming immigration, as well. 1j:3 are those figures, people coming in on small boats they are not included? ida. boats they are not included? no, well, boats they are not included? no, well. yes. _ boats they are not included? no, well. yes. in _ boats they are not included? no, well, yes, in theory _ boats they are not included? iijr'r, well, yes, in theory they are, it is complicated this. so what you have got, is the broad categories of migration are people who come for work, so people who have been granted a work is a, people who come to study, similar grant add visa, people who have come for family reunion, maybe someone's met their life partner abroad or they are bringing in an elderly relative, something like that, again, these are visas issued by the home office, as they are the three main category, there are a few other bits and pieces round that as well, then you have the asylum and refugee cohorts, so they get counted but they are one part of overall picture. the bit that can't be counted, which is known among academics as irregular

migration but in the press as illegal migration, is people, is the group of people who come in or overstay a visa and are living in the uk without any right to be here, they are not counted as such but the figures reflect what is going on with asylum, but there tends to be a lag so if figure this morning on the asylum is a little behind separate data published by the home office. damian, our political correspondent, there as been move 789 on international students this week, the government announcing that international students will to longer be able to bring dependant, were they getting their defence in early? were they getting their defence in earl ? . . , were they getting their defence in earl ? , , , . ., were they getting their defence in earl? , , , . ., , early? yes, pretty much, that is sort of part _ early? yes, pretty much, that is sort of part of — early? yes, pretty much, that is sort of part of the _ early? yes, pretty much, that is sort of part of the political- sort of part of the political choreography of this week, the government knew that these figures are coming — government knew that these figures are coming today, knew that they were _ are coming today, knew that they were going to be a record high, we know_ were going to be a record high, we know that — were going to be a record high, we know that because we already have

seen the _ know that because we already have seen the home office issues, visa numbers— seen the home office issues, visa numbers up, family visa, so those are already— numbers up, family visa, so those are already indicated what we will land at. _ are already indicated what we will land at, and it could be that quarter, _ land at, and it could be that quarter, three—quarters of a million figure _ quarter, three—quarters of a million figure for— quarter, three—quarters of a million figure for net migration, so ahead of that, _ figure for net migration, so ahead of that, coming today, the governmentjust of that, coming today, the government just announced that one of the _ government just announced that one of the thing it will do to bring the numbers— of the thing it will do to bring the numbers down is to clampdown on the ability— numbers down is to clampdown on the ability of— numbers down is to clampdown on the ability of those coming here for postgraduate study, so masters course, — postgraduate study, so masters course, phds, those people, from abroad _ course, phds, those people, from abroad coming to bring dependents with them, so partners and children, and the _ with them, so partners and children, and the reason the government says it is doing _ and the reason the government says it is doing that is it has looked at the figures — it is doing that is it has looked at the figures that three years ago that was— the figures that three years ago that was round 16,000 visas issues and last— that was round 16,000 visas issues and last year was 136,000, so what it said _ and last year was 136,000, so what it said is _ and last year was 136,000, so what it said is that the most of those people — it said is that the most of those people will not be able to bring dependent, partners and children, the only—

dependent, partners and children, the only people would be those doing research _ the only people would be those doing research phd, usually phd so research _ research phd, usually phd so research studies, not your general taught— research studies, not your general taught masters course. the issue though. _ taught masters course. the issue though, think there some will say, well, _ though, think there some will say, well, that— though, think there some will say, well, that in the university sector certainty. — well, that in the university sector certainly, concern because they are saying _ certainly, concern because they are saying this — certainly, concern because they are saying this is a very competitive international sector, these are important _ international sector, these are important sort of source of revenue, people _ important sort of source of revenue, people for— important sort of source of revenue, people for the uk universities and the government needs to tread carefully. — the government needs to tread carefully, if it wants to make changes _ carefully, if it wants to make changes here.— carefully, if it wants to make chances here. j ,, . j ., ., changes here. and suella braverman made a speech _ changes here. and suella braverman made a speech the _ changes here. and suella braverman made a speech the other _ changes here. and suella braverman made a speech the other day - changes here. and suella braverman made a speech the other day which l made a speech the other day which seemed to suggest there were disagreemented in the cabinet about the workerrors we need to come here to do the jobs that need to be done, she said, we should be able to train our own drivers and people are saying it is not as easy as you think. , , , .,, ., think. yes, she said this was a seech think. yes, she said this was a speech to _ think. yes, she said this was a speech to a — think. yes, she said this was a speech to a conservative - think. yes, she said this was a - speech to a conservative gathering, and she talked about the uk training up and she talked about the uk training

up its own fruit pickers and lorry drivers, now those are two things where seasonal workers are being brought in to do jobs like fruit picking and lorry drivers, that has been a particular problem since brexit, as well, the government has had a policy to try and encourage more and that has been sort of bringing in more drivers, local drivers into hgv driving, but the idea there would be that if you train locally, then you don't need to bring those people in from abroad, some like fruit pickers are on temporary visas, what is interesting, there, is that you hear something similar, so echoed from opposition party, so the labour party have been saying that well, one of their policies is will be to improve the skills of local workforce here in the uk, so you don't have to import, but what they are talking about is slight definitely representjobs, they are talking about looking at the jobs, the minute companies can say there

is a shortage here, they, the government puts a particular profession you were talking about, the big list they have of shortage skills. then you can bring in people from abroad, labour says it would look at that list and say we should use that to target where we need to train people up in the uk, and over time that will bring those numbers down. i mean popular attitudes, and we will explore that this morning damian and dominic, interesting in this country, it is a political hot pot they toe, if you want a hot potato you need someone to pick them. i have been looking at polling, the british public split on the merits of immigration and migration. this is a recent polling from one of the big organisations, round one in five would reduce international student number, two thirds would prefer numbers to stay the same. 0nly thirds would prefer numbers to stay the same. only 29% of conservative supporters support reducing student

migration, immigration overall support for reducing immigration remains at its lowest level since this particular tracker survey began in 2015. four in ten people, 42% would prefer immigration to be reduced. 26% that it stays the same, 24% that it increases, but i suppose they would say, some of the politicians, that it is felt most and most of the concerns are in the constituencies they need to win damian. . , ., ., , constituencies they need to win damian. . , . ., , , damian. certainly, and i was 'ust literally before i damian. certainly, and i was 'ust literally before coming �* damian. certainly, and i was 'ust literally before coming to i damian. certainly, and i wasjust literally before coming to talk . damian. certainly, and i wasjust literally before coming to talk to | literally before coming to talk to you i was chatting to a conservative mp who is today on the back of when these figures come out, going to be writing to the prime minister, to rishi sunak, demanding a meeting, because he is concerned, and, he is part of a group who of right—wing conservative mps who say the government, the conservatives promised in their 2019 manifesto and

in fact in the three manifestoses before that, all the way back to david cameron, they promised to bring these migration numbers down, they haven't delivered that and a broken promise doesn't look good for them in the electorate any future election they think, but equally, they do say that they believe that this is a sort of broader economic issues as well, and that all of these questions that we have been talking about, bringing in people from abroad, when you bring them in you can pay a lower salary than from the typical salary for a uk worker, they say all of after that is is a distorted incentive that doesn't actually encourage people to invest in and hire locally, so and they do say very clearly they get a sense electorally back in their constituencies that this matters to people they believe. {lilia constituencies that this matters to people they believe. 0k, interesting on the skills — people they believe. 0k, interesting on the skills shortage _ people they believe. 0k, interesting on the skills shortage list _ people they believe. 0k, interesting on the skills shortage list dominic, l on the skills shortage list dominic, it is reported in the times they are adding fishermen to that, and they

will be able to pay them considerably less than they would pay fishermen here, as it were, do they, does migration drive down wage, that was a big driver of the brexit debate, what is the... this is a really — brexit debate, what is the... tji 3 is a really interesting thing which academics have argued overfor a long time, what we saw for instance after 2004 was the then chancellor gordon brown using the entry of workers from eastern europe, to keep a lid on eggs resignation. he workers from eastern europe, to keep a lid on eggs resignation.— a lid on eggs resignation. he said british jobs _ a lid on eggs resignation. he said british jobs for _ a lid on eggs resignation. he said british jobs for british _ a lid on eggs resignation. he said british jobs for british workers i a lid on eggs resignation. he said british jobs for british workers in | british jobs for british workers in a controversial statement and people didn't know what he was talking about. . . . . didn't know what he was talking about. , , ., , , didn't know what he was talking about. ,, ., , .., ., , didn't know what he was talking about. ,, , ., , about. issue was the ish economy was startin: to about. issue was the ish economy was starting to boom. _ about. issue was the ish economy was starting to boom. gordon _ about. issue was the ish economy was starting to boom. gordon brown - about. issue was the ish economy wasj starting to boom. gordon brown made a calculation if we allowed in more workers from eastern europe, it would be good for the economy, expand it and do it cheaply without pushing up wages and broadly speaking we saw that happen. 0f speaking we saw that happen. of course, that was, there was an

opportunity cost there which was the issue round social cohesion. now, one of the difficult questions is that, if you add and i am not an economist, and we need an economist to talk about this stuff, but the one of the questions is, do you reach a point where you have competition overjobs, and does that drive down wages? there is some evidence that at the bottom of the all the economic quartile, whatever the jar gone is, you do see some competition which drives down wages but in other sectors it doesn't necessarily do so, you see a lot of complementaryjobs being created complementary jobs being created are. complementaryjobs being created are. anybody who has lived in a big city in the uk over the last ten years you know, would not have failed to notice the huge expansion of coffee shops and a lot of them ex panned because they were staffed by cheap workers, from eastern europe. now those coffee shop, the businesses were saying these were

the only workers they could get hold of, similarly in agriculture. the sector flourished _ of, similarly in agriculture. the sector flourished are. yes, - of, similarly in agriculture. the sector flourished are. yes, andj of, similarly in agriculture. the | sector flourished are. yes, and i remember _ sector flourished are. yes, and i remember going _ sector flourished are. yes, and i remember going for _ sector flourished are. yes, and i remember going for instance . sector flourished are. yes, and i remember going for instance to | sector flourished are. yes, and i l remember going for instance to a farm round 2004, 2005, where they literally shipped in 1500 seasonal students, from eastern europe, some of whom would stay on for, you know for forever and of whom would stay on for, you know forforever and day, of whom would stay on for, you know for forever and day, settle of whom would stay on for, you know forforever and day, settle in the uk and critically they said it is not about replacing local worker, we need a steady workforce for the season and this is how we will get them, so, it is really complicated picture, the problem is it doesn't necessarily look that way for people who are seeing change round them and saying hang on a second... that a key political _ saying hang on a second... that a key political point, _ saying hang on a second... that a key political point, absolutely. . saying hang on a second... that a| key political point, absolutely. let us hear from you. 08085 909693. it is all about you, we have the figures at 9.30 from the office for national statistics. and we will be taking an early news so we get them

for you as they happen. candice is with us. derek in congleton, and rob in wokingham. morning all. what are your views on this red bull? goad your views on this red bull? good mornin: , your views on this red bull? good morning. nicky. — your views on this red bull? good morning. nicky. my _ your views on this red bull? good morning, nicky, my view- your views on this red bull? good morning, nicky, my view is - your views on this red bull? (1357er morning, nicky, my view is that we obviously need the net migration, because of the shortage of workers you were talking about. it would be interesting to see how much of the, it is down to ukraine and hong kong in these figures compared to previous years?— in these figures compared to previous years? in these figures compared to revious ears? ,, ., , ., previous years? stop right there, do we know dominic, _ previous years? stop right there, do we know dominic, hong _ previous years? stop right there, do we know dominic, hong kong, - previous years? stop right there, do . we know dominic, hong kong, ukraine, massive factor. it we know dominic, hong kong, ukraine, massive factor-— massive factor. it will be a big, big factor— massive factor. it will be a big, big factor in — massive factor. it will be a big, big factor in these, _ massive factor. it will be a big, big factor in these, we - massive factor. it will be a big, big factor in these, we have . massive factor. it will be a big, | big factor in these, we have had massive factor. it will be a big, - big factor in these, we have had two bil big factor in these, we have had two big spikes _ big factor in these, we have had two big spikes of people being invited in from _ big spikes of people being invited in from ukraine, they are the... do we in from ukraine, they are the... we know how in from ukraine, they are the... drr we know how many? so we know, let me pull the figures up here. he is a man with a laptop, which is all good. 50 man with a laptop, which is all ood. ., .,,

man with a laptop, which is all aood. ., .,, ., man with a laptop, which is all nood, . ., ., , . man with a laptop, which is all good. so we had as of the year to june good. so we had as of the year to june 2022. _ good. so we had as of the year to june 2022. we — good. so we had as of the year to june 2022, we had _ good. so we had as of the year to june 2022, we had 170,000 - good. so we had as of the year to i june 2022, we had 170,000 people june 2022, we had 170,000 people coming _ june 2022, we had 170,000 people coming in _ june 2022, we had 170,000 people coming in from ukraine, and 76,000 from hong _ coming in from ukraine, and 76,000 from hong kong, so the hong kong... considerable. from hong kong, so the hong kong... considerable-— considerable. they are people who are known as _ considerable. they are people who are known as british _ considerable. they are people who are known as british overseas - are known as british overseas national. _ are known as british overseas national, they had a right to come to the _ national, they had a right to come to the uk — national, they had a right to come to the uk. , ., ., ., . ,, to the uk. they are not going back. no, the to the uk. they are not going back. no. they are _ to the uk. they are not going back. no, they are refugees _ to the uk. they are not going back. no, they are refugees in _ to the uk. they are not going back. no, they are refugees in all- to the uk. they are not going back. no, they are refugees in all but - no, they are refugees in all but name. — no, they are refugees in all but name. but _ no, they are refugees in all but name, but they are on a visa, question— name, but they are on a visa, question is— name, but they are on a visa, question is how many of those go home: _ question is how many of those go home, history shows round the world very often— home, history shows round the world very often they move to new location and they— very often they move to new location and they put down roots as people would _ and they put down roots as people would the — and they put down roots as people would. the question here, is whether in spike _ would. the question here, is whether in spike will _ would. the question here, is whether in spike will come to outs height for the _ in spike will come to outs height for the year end figures for december 2022, and then start to decline _ december 2022, and then start to decline again, so that we will see a natural— decline again, so that we will see a natural drop off in net migration in 2023 _ natural drop off in net migration in 2023 on _ natural drop off in net migration in 2023 on wards, so by the time we get to general— 2023 on wards, so by the time we get to general election it may look a lot different.— to general election it may look a lot different. j «j ., ., lot different. and, think of the how our society — lot different. and, think of the how our society has _ lot different. and, think of the how

our society has been _ lot different. and, think of the how our society has been enriched - lot different. and, think of the how our society has been enriched by i lot different. and, think of the how. our society has been enriched by the are afghanistan a and kenyan asian immigration that happened, in the 19705, wasn't it. right, i mean rob do wow want to add anything else on that? it is very important? it that? it is very important? lit wasn't as big a percentage as i would have thought actually. derek. the key thing _ would have thought actually. derek. the key thing following, _ would have thought actually. derek. the key thing following, sorry - would have thought actually. derek. the key thing following, sorry the i the key thing following, sorry the key thing is putting the public services in schools, and doctors and the rest of it to back it up if you are going to bring this many people in. . , . are going to bring this many people in. , , , , , ., in. yes, yes. this is the other argument- — in. yes, yes. this is the other argument. people _ in. yes, yes. this is the other argument. people say - in. yes, yes. this is the other argument. people say i - in. yes, yes. this is the other argument. people say i hear. in. yes, yes. this is the other. argument. people say i hear all in. yes, yes. this is the other- argument. people say i hear all the time. it is a strain on public services and saying it is the government that has put a strain on public service but not investing properly, there by you have a debate. derek, good morning derek, what are your thoughts?— what are your thoughts? morning nic . what are your thoughts? morning nicky- what _ what are your thoughts? morning nicky- what do — what are your thoughts? morning nicky. what do you _ what are your thoughts? morning nicky. what do you any? - what are your thoughts? morning nicky. what do you any? well, i l what are your thoughts? morning - nicky. what do you any? well, i look at it from a — nicky. what do you any? well, i look at it from a different _ nicky. what do you any? well, i look at it from a different angle. - nicky. what do you any? well, i look at it from a different angle. i - at it from a different angle. i would regard myself as being

political, but not to any particular party, new labour encouraged university education at the extent of devaluing the education sector, tony blair taking us to war versus iraq and support for the americans, whether it was his conscience, he paraded himself round migrant campening which in my view signalled the uk was open to help immigration. david cameron on the other hand, closed off nursing bursary, pushing university direction for nursing, instead of on the job training, and, if you consider planning for the needs of population growth, people living longer, with more emphasis on top need for the nhs, relatively easy to determine, no planning or

encouragement for the needs of housing, the training for the needs of trade, builder, plumber, electrician, farmers, fruit and veg pickers. 0n the other hand, you have the support we have naturally given to ukraine population, hong kong, with the problems of china, and our own universities encouraging more investment by encouraging students, reducing the places for home—grown people to gain in the areas we need. can i pick up on that point. i tell you what derek you have been following this. but, dominic, the universities, that is real interesting one, the universities need the business, don't they. thea;r need the business, don't they. they sa the need the business, don't they. they say they do. — need the business, don't they. they say they do. and — need the business, don't they. they say they do, and you _ need the business, don't they. they say they do, and you know, there has been _ say they do, and you know, there has been this— say they do, and you know, there has been this long running tension between — been this long running tension between the universities and government over foreign students, in

effect, _ government over foreign students, in effect, the _ government over foreign students, in effect, the top universities say it is the _ effect, the top universities say it is the fees — effect, the top universities say it is the fees they charge which subsidise the tuition british students who are still having to pay £9,000 _ students who are still having to pay £9,000 a _ students who are still having to pay £9,000 a year, so there is a tension there. _ £9,000 a year, so there is a tension there. some — £9,000 a year, so there is a tension there, some of the arguments also, from _ there, some of the arguments also, from the _ there, some of the arguments also, from the universities are look, you want _ from the universities are look, you want britain — from the universities are look, you want britain to be a global leader, you want— want britain to be a global leader, you want to bring in the greatest talents _ you want to bring in the greatest talents from round the world, well, then we _ talents from round the world, well, then we have to have an open door policy— then we have to have an open door policy for— then we have to have an open door policy for students and post grads. and maintain our position of academic and research pre—eminence that some people were worried would fade away after brexit. yes. that some people were worried would fade away after brexit.— fade away after brexit. yes, i will rive ou fade away after brexit. yes, i will give you one _ fade away after brexit. yes, i will give you one specific _ fade away after brexit. yes, i will give you one specific example - fade away after brexit. yes, i will give you one specific example of| give you one specific example of that professor sir andrew grime, one of the _ that professor sir andrew grime, one of the co—discoverer of graphene, an incredible _ of the co—discoverer of graphene, an incredible substance which will be transformative in the 21st century because — transformative in the 21st century because of its extraordinary property, he is originally from

russia — property, he is originally from russia of— property, he is originally from russia of german extraction, came to study— russia of german extraction, came to study briefly— russia of german extraction, came to study briefly at the university of nottingham. there was is a great interview— nottingham. there was is a great interview with him on radio 4, if i am allowed — interview with him on radio 4, if i am allowed to say. he came to the university— am allowed to say. he came to the university of nottingham and came back to _ university of nottingham and came back to manchester and it was at match _ back to manchester and it was at match much he and his colleagues discovered — match much he and his colleagues discovered graphene, that is because of this— discovered graphene, that is because of this open— discovered graphene, that is because of this open door policy for post grad _ of this open door policy for post grad students. i think the interesting question there, is for somebody— interesting question there, is for somebody like him, if you are at that kind — somebody like him, if you are at that kind of early stage of your academic— that kind of early stage of your academic career, you are forming a family. _ academic career, you are forming a family. but— academic career, you are forming a family, but then there are restrictions on whether or not you can bring — restrictions on whether or not you can bring in— restrictions on whether or not you can bring in family members, what effect _ can bring in family members, what effect does — can bring in family members, what effect does that have on your, the calculation — effect does that have on your, the calculation you are making in your head _ calculation you are making in your head about — calculation you are making in your head about whether or not it is attractive — head about whether or not it is attractive to to go and study and research — attractive to to go and study and research this in the uk compared to somewhere — research this in the uk compared to somewhere else, the government has tried to _ somewhere else, the government has tried to get _ somewhere else, the government has tried to get a balancing act saying we are _ tried to get a balancing act saying we are only putting the restrictions on students much further down, that kind of— on students much further down, that kind of academic progression, but

these _ kind of academic progression, but these are — kind of academic progression, but these are the kind of... kind of academic progression, but these are the kind of. . ._ these are the kind of... students further down _ these are the kind of... students further down go _ these are the kind of... students further down go up _ these are the kind of... students further down go up the _ these are the kind of... students further down go up the ladder. i these are the kind of... students i further down go up the ladder. here is william, —— wilian it is. what is your situation, good morning? is william, —— wilian it is. what is yoursituation, good morning? i am your situation, good morning? i am t in: to your situation, good morning? i am trying to get — your situation, good morning? i am trying to get my- -- _ your situation, good morning? i am trying to get my- -- l— your situation, good morning? i am trying to get my... i think _ your situation, good morning? i am trying to get my... i think you - your situation, good morning? i am trying to get my... i think you have | trying to get my... i think you have the telly on — trying to get my... i think you have the telly on in _ trying to get my... i think you have the telly on in the _ trying to get my... i think you have the telly on in the background - trying to get my... i think you have the telly on in the background so i trying to get my... i think you have l the telly on in the background so we are getting feedback, so if you nip across, the urn the telly and off we can hear you properly, it is great to hear from can hear you properly, it is great to hearfrom people who have come here, so i extend the invitation, 08085 909693. text us as well. and also we want to hear from you about your concerns, and also, if you run a business that needs migrant worker, whether it be the agricultural sector or where ever. are we good?— agricultural sector or where ever. are we good?_ we - agricultural sector or where ever. are we good?_ we are l agricultural sector or where ever. | are we good?_ we are on agricultural sector or where ever. - are we good?_ we are on it. are we good? yes, yes. we are on it. so tell us- —

are we good? yes, yes. we are on it. so tell us. well. _ are we good? yes, yes. we are on it. so tell us. well, since _ are we good? yes, yes. we are on it. so tell us. well, since november - are we good? yes, yes. we are on it. so tell us. well, since november the | so tell us. well, since november the last ear i so tell us. well, since november the last year i tried _ so tell us. well, since november the last year i tried to _ so tell us. well, since november the last year i tried to do, _ so tell us. well, since november the last year i tried to do, to _ so tell us. well, since november the last year i tried to do, to take - so tell us. well, since november the last year i tried to do, to take my - last year i tried to do, to take my mother to live here in scotland. my mother to live here in scotland. my mother is 69, she has health problems so we do everything according by the law so mainly paperwork, and many mother last week go to the embassy in cuba and they say no. at the moment, we don't know why they say no, they not give to us any paper why no. we have to appeal to the, to them and at the moment nobody answers to us why no. this is a process that is harder for everybody in the family, the paperwork is amazing, the amount of paperwork. i paperwork is amazing, the amount of -a erwork. . paperwork is amazing, the amount of paperwork- you _ paperwork is amazing, the amount of paperwork. i bet. you have to, you

have to practically _ paperwork. i bet. you have to, you have to practically tell _ paperwork. i bet. you have to, you have to practically tell all - paperwork. i bet. you have to, you have to practically tell all your life. and i'm not getting any answer, it used to be a long time ago, to come to live in this country, you, you had to learn english, you had to do everything by the law, suddenly, everything is changing, everybody can come here... what is your status. we are going early for the news in a moment. i’m early for the news in a moment. i'm a chef, a early for the news in a moment. in a chef, a british citizen, all my family are working, my daughter is a worker, she is going to be a nurse, my son is working too. my wife is a hair dresser, so we all working in the house, and we are trying to get in touch with a home office to see why no they deny my mr to come here, they have not given any excuse or

nothing. they have not given any excuse or nothinu. . 4, they have not given any excuse or nothinu. ., ,, i. they have not given any excuse or nothinu. . ~ i. ., they have not given any excuse or nothin, ., ~j ., , nothing. thank you for telling us what ou nothing. thank you for telling us what you are _ nothing. thank you for telling us what you are wading _ nothing. thank you for telling us what you are wading through i nothing. thank you for telling us what you are wading through in | nothing. thank you for telling us - what you are wading through in terms of bureaucracy and it does be speak an important point, that to some people it can be arbitrary, look at the windrush scandal and there is a man who has been here for 20 years to get his mother #234r cuba. more of those experience, we will take an early news then the good morning. here is the data out in the next few minutes is expected to show net migration reached record levels last year. the energy regulator has reduced the price cap for households in england, wales and scotland. it means typical households will pay

2,074 pounds a year — just over £400 less than last year. musicians and other celebrities have been paying tribute to tina turner who's died at the age of 83. barack and michelle 0bama praised her for "singing her truth through joy and pain". florida's governor ron desantis, has officially launched his campaign for the republican presidential nomination. he's the main rival to donald trump, to be their party's candidate in the 2024 general election. football manager arne slot says he wants to stay as feyenoord boss — and has ruled himself out of contention for the vacant tottenham job. spurs have taken just four pts from their last six matches with ryan mason in current interim charge after both antonio conte and cristian stellini were dismissed this season. slot led feyernoord to the dutch title and insists "there has not been transfer conversation and all talks with the club

have always been in regards to an extension". brighton secured themselves a spot in the europa league for next season after drawing 1—1 with champions manchester city, izzy christiansen has told young girls to �*dream big' as she announces she'll retire from all football at the end of this season — the everton and england midfielder won the she believes cup with the lionnesses in 2019. and the french open tennis main draw is coming up this afternoon — but it won't feature any british women — that's the first time that's happened at a grand slam since 2009 — franjones, katie boulter and harriet dart all lost in yesterday's qualifying.

the first figures from the 0ns on net migration numbers coming up soon. we've got dominic casciani, our home affairs respondent, it is refreshing having him here. he is literally refreshing his laptop, the second will get the figures. it would be good to run through this for you, would be good to run through this foryou, ifind it would be good to run through this for you, ifind it really interesting, the list ofjobs for which there is a skills shortage. fisher people, fishermen have been added to that. public health directors and managers, care workers, obviously. chemical scientists, biological scientists, biochemists, scientists and construction, related engineering, geologists, civil engineers, design and development engineers, production engineers, quality control engineers. it analysts,

software developers. don't stop me now. web designers, cyber security specialists. the vats, architects, lab technicians, artists, dancers, choreographers, orchestral musicians, pay layers, masons, plasterers, carpenters. iwas musicians, pay layers, masons, plasterers, carpenters. i was going to ask you about the points—based system. can you do two things at once? how does the points—based system work? borisjohnson was talking about that a lot. system work? boris johnson was talking about that a lot.- talking about that a lot. being nerdy about — talking about that a lot. being nerdy about it, _ talking about that a lot. being nerdy about it, we _ talking about that a lot. being nerdy about it, we have - talking about that a lot. being nerdy about it, we have had i talking about that a lot. being i nerdy about it, we have had eight points—based system for ages, actually. itjust keeps getting rebooted and relaunched with slight tweaks. in essence, it's a system used in many countries around the world, including australia, and...

it was 606,000 in the year ending december 2022, it was 606,000 in the year ending december2022, uk it was 606,000 in the year ending december 2022, uk net migration. 606,000. that's interesting, because thatis 606,000. that's interesting, because that is reported on agency sources, that is reported on agency sources, thatis that is reported on agency sources, that is less than some people were predicting. that is less than some people were ”redictin. . that is less than some people were ”redictin. , ., , predicting. yes, that is actually less, because _ predicting. yes, that is actually less, because in _ predicting. yes, that is actually less, because in the _ predicting. yes, that is actually less, because in the year - predicting. yes, that is actually less, because in the year to - predicting. yes, that is actually i less, because in the year to june, less, because in the year tojune, it was 504,000. if net migration is 606, it is still a whopping new record, but what it seems to indicate is actually things may be stabilising. i think it goes back to this point about the effects of ukraine and hong kong. i'm speculating a little bit. i'm going to have to wait for the figures to p0p up to have to wait for the figures to pop up on the page. they are still not here on the page. in some respects, in political terms, not here on the page. in some respects, in politicalterms, i suspect this is going to become slightly more manageable for the government, given that it has been

bracing itself for enormous fallout. within that, you're still going to have a spike in immigration. immigration itself hits 1 have a spike in immigration. immigration itself hits1 million in the year tojune 2022. it's going to be interesting to see how this plays out. i'm wondering whether all this is to do with ukraine and hong kong. the figures are not here yet. shall i talk to you about the points? that is what is being _ i talk to you about the points? that is what is being reported at the moment. 606,000, which is somewhere between the population of edinburgh, the population of belfast. people will say it is still a lot of people. 0thers will say it is still a lot of people. others will say good, we need these people. a points—based system, as it were. borisjohnson, it was much vaunted by boris johnson, when he was making the brexit arguments. an australian —based points—based system was like a mantra for him. it -based points-based system was like a mantra for him.— a mantra for him. it was. it was the predecessor. _

a mantra for him. it was. it was the predecessor, the _ a mantra for him. it was. it was the predecessor, the labour _ a mantra for him. it was. it was the i predecessor, the labour government, that first talks about the points—based system. in fact, the way it works, the more valuable you potentially are as an incoming migrant, when he comes to live and work in the uk, the more points you get. more points in skills, education, you get points for how in demand you are in a particular sector where you work. it kind of builds up like that. brute sector where you work. it kind of builds up like that.— sector where you work. it kind of builds up like that. we can speak to the deu builds up like that. we can speak to the deputy director— builds up like that. we can speak to the deputy director of _ builds up like that. we can speak to the deputy director of migration - the deputy director of migration statistics at the office of national statistics. jay, good morning to you. tell is all you can, get into these figures for us.— you. tell is all you can, get into these figures for us. 0k, as you sa , these figures for us. 0k, as you say. these _ these figures for us. 0k, as you say. these are _ these figures for us. 0k, as you say, these are the _ these figures for us. 0k, as you say, these are the latest - these figures for us. 0k, as you j say, these are the latest figures released — say, these are the latest figures released today of the year ending december 2022. what i can say is that long—term immigration was estimated to be around 1.2 million, emigration. — estimated to be around 1.2 million, emigration, those leaving the country. _ emigration, those leaving the country, was 557,000, which means that net— country, was 557,000, which means that net migration continued to add

to the _ that net migration continued to add to the population, with a net migration figure, six and in 6000. this is— migration figure, six and in 6000. this is the — migration figure, six and in 6000. this is the highest level we have seen _ this is the highest level we have seen on — this is the highest level we have seen on record, you are right to say _ seen on record, you are right to say it— seen on record, you are right to say. it compares with 148,000 for the year— say. it compares with 148,000 for the year ending december 2021. say. it compares with 148,000 for the year ending december2021. it's particularly high at the moment, because — particularly high at the moment, because of events like ukraine, but also the _ because of events like ukraine, but also the effects of coming out of lockdown, that has affected how travel— lockdown, that has affected how travel patterns work.— lockdown, that has affected how travel patterns work. yes, 606,000, we can now — travel patterns work. yes, 606,000, we can now confirm _ travel patterns work. yes, 606,000, we can now confirm and _ travel patterns work. yes, 606,000, we can now confirm and verify - travel patterns work. yes, 606,000, we can now confirm and verify that. l we can now confirm and verify that. without the hong kong situation and the ukraine situation, do we know what the figure would have been? it would have beenjust overi million. hong _ would have beenjust overi million. hong kong — would have beenjust overi million. hong kong and ukraine added about 160.000 _ hong kong and ukraine added about 160,000 to the immigration figure. 0k. 160,000 to the immigration figure. ok i_ 160,000 to the immigration figure. ok i am _ 160,000 to the immigration figure. 0k. lam reading 160,000 to the immigration figure. ok. i am reading that migration growth has slowed over recent quarters. so, that would indicate the temporary nature of certain impacts. the temporary nature of certain im acts. . the temporary nature of certain im acts. , ., ,

the temporary nature of certain imacts. , ., , ., the temporary nature of certain imacts. , . ., , impacts. yes, that is a really interesting — impacts. yes, that is a really interesting thing _ impacts. yes, that is a really interesting thing about - impacts. yes, that is a really| interesting thing about today. impacts. yes, that is a really - interesting thing about today. we are seeing perhaps a slowing down of that immigration. i mean, afterthe pandemic— that immigration. i mean, afterthe pandemic and the lockdown restrictions eased, we saw a large increase _ restrictions eased, we saw a large increase in— restrictions eased, we saw a large increase in the number of non—eu students — increase in the number of non—eu students coming here to study, and we are _ students coming here to study, and we are starting to see some of those. _ we are starting to see some of those, that is where they delayed their travel because of the pandemic. with the unprecedented world _ pandemic. with the unprecedented world events like ukraine and hong kong. _ world events like ukraine and hong kong. it _ world events like ukraine and hong kong, it could be that the increased immigration happened in the short—term, but we would need to watch _ short—term, but we would need to watch the — short—term, but we would need to watch the figures and know more about— watch the figures and know more about the — watch the figures and know more about the longer term trends. it is dominic casciani _ about the longer term trends. it 3 dominic casciani here. where do these figures are set in the long—term trend? 0bviously these figures are set in the long—term trend? obviously we have had the situation where since 2010 the government has sought to try to get net migration down to tens of thousands, but it strikes me that when you look year on year, the trend really is something which is

actually very, very difficult to change. it has been running at a reasonably high rate ever since then. is that a fair analysis? i think it has changed over recent years. _ think it has changed over recent years, long—term migration. in the 2010s. _ years, long—term migration. in the 2010s. we — years, long—term migration. in the 2010s, we saw a lot more people coming _ 2010s, we saw a lot more people coming from the eu, predominantly to work. _ coming from the eu, predominantly to work. net _ coming from the eu, predominantly to work, net migration was about 200.000. _ work, net migration was about 200,000, peaking at 300,000 at the time of— 200,000, peaking at 300,000 at the time of the _ 200,000, peaking at 300,000 at the time of the brexit vote. once the pandemic— time of the brexit vote. once the pandemic hit, we saw the numbers drop drastically, because people couldn't— drop drastically, because people couldn't travel. what we are seeing now is— couldn't travel. what we are seeing now is potentially a recovery from that. _ now is potentially a recovery from that. and — now is potentially a recovery from that, and more students coming in in 21 and _ that, and more students coming in in 21 and 22_ that, and more students coming in in 21 and 22 that would have perhaps, earlier~ _ 21 and 22 that would have perhaps, earlier. we're also seeing the humanitarian world events affecting figures _ humanitarian world events affecting figures as— humanitarian world events affecting figures as well. we have also included _ figures as well. we have also included asylum seekers in the figures — included asylum seekers in the figures for the first time, due to a new data — figures for the first time, due to a new data source. we had one in 12 of the new _ new data source. we had one in 12 of the new immigrants being asylum seekers — the new immigrants being asylum seekers. ~ . , ., , seekers. which figure should we be concentrating _ seekers. which figure should we be concentrating on, _ seekers. which figure should we be concentrating on, the _ seekers. which figure should we be concentrating on, the overall - concentrating on, the overall immigration figure or net migration?

it depends on the question you're asking _ it depends on the question you're asking. net migration gives you the change _ asking. net migration gives you the change in _ asking. net migration gives you the change in the population. if you want _ change in the population. if you want to— change in the population. if you want to know how the population has changed _ want to know how the population has changed over the previous year, there _ changed over the previous year, there is— changed over the previous year, there is an — changed over the previous year, there is an extra 666,000 people in there is an extra 666,000 people in the country— there is an extra 666,000 people in the country right now. immigration, when _ the country right now. immigration, when you _ the country right now. immigration, when you are looking at why people coma. _ when you are looking at why people come. it's— when you are looking at why people come. it's a — when you are looking at why people come, it's a really good source, because — come, it's a really good source, because you can see the 1.2 million who came — because you can see the 1.2 million who came to— because you can see the 1.2 million who came to the country, we understand that a million of those were _ understand that a million of those were from — understand that a million of those were from non—eu countries, and those _ were from non—eu countries, and those that— were from non—eu countries, and those that came from the non—eu, it was predominantly scared —— skilled work on _ was predominantly scared —— skilled work on health and social care. 0verall. — work on health and social care. overall, who left and why? the numbers leaving, _ overall, who left and why? the numbers leaving, it was 557,000. we are seeing _ numbers leaving, it was 557,000. we are seeing the numbers in the eu leaving. — are seeing the numbers in the eu leaving, and we are starting to see some _ leaving, and we are starting to see some of— leaving, and we are starting to see some of those students, non—eu students — some of those students, non—eu students that arrived, we are starting — students that arrived, we are starting to see some of those leaving — starting to see some of those leaving in— starting to see some of those leaving in larger numbers than

previously, when we had the increase in student— previously, when we had the increase in student immigration, starting to flow through to those leaving. thank ou ve flow through to those leaving. thank you very much _ flow through to those leaving. thank you very much for — flow through to those leaving. thank you very much for coming _ flow through to those leaving. thank you very much for coming on, - flow through to those leaving. tjiag�*iaz you very much for coming on, deputy director of migration statistics at the office of national statistics. damian grammaticas, our political correspondent, what will the political reaction to these figures be? 606,000 net migration. that’s be? 606,000 net migration. that's riuht. what be? 606,000 net migration. that's right. what will _ be? 606,000 net migration. that's right. what will be _ be? 606,000 net migration. that's right. what will be interesting - be? 606,000 net migration. tjjisgt�*3 right. what will be interesting as a couple of things. 606, lower than the number that was being banded around, that was more like 700, 750,000. you could say that was expectation management. so, that idea being floated so that this doesn't look quite as high as that. so, that is one thing, i think. the government will say it is not as much as it could have been. they will want to point to that. they will want to point to that. they will also want to point to this idea that, as you are hearing there, but a pretty large component of this are

those arrivals from ukraine and hong kong, and the like. the interesting thing here is where rishi sunak had set his own benchmark was around 500,000. so, the conservative manifesto in 2019 had said that immigration numbers, net migration numbers, would come down. then it was around 250,000. rishi sunak has backed away from that, he has said i will bring it down from where it was when i took over, about half a million. his 100,000 above that at the minute. this is a lot closer to his sort of numbers that he wants to achieve. that is probably why he set the 500,000 number. i think you will want to point to that and say he is on track. the other side of the argument, interestingly, we will see the opposition parties saying that a large component of this is still

there was people coming in on work visas and what the uk needs to do is to train and up skill, that is the labour argument, the uk needs a high skill economy and needs to train people for that, and what the conservatives are bringing is low skill immigration. so, it will be part of the political argument. the other argument that will be interesting and this is around education, because a large component of this, i think 400,000, just looking at the figures, people coming in for education visas, postgraduate education, that has been a priority of the government, to bring people in, to bring funding into universities. but the arguments will be, well, if it wants to bring the numbers down, how is it going to do that? who should be restricted from coming? university sector, the education side of things, particularly within the government,

there is a sign telling wacko sense they don't want to see the numbers coming down, it's an important source of revenue. so, that will be one area where i think there will be discussions. how do you, from this stage, look at bringing numbers down, if that is what you want to do? one thing i should say, interestingly, you mentioned earlier the background to this. there is a sense at which the background, public attitudes have shifted a bit. a decade ago, there was high concern about immigration, post the brexit referendum. they have been opinion polls that say people are more comfortable with the level or progression go immigration, when you ask what positions people should come in to fill, they are supportive of the nurses, the fruit pickers, the builders, the skilled occupations that are needed here.

that is the shifting attitude behind this that is worth bearing in mind. i think i raised earlier on, according to that tracker information, ipsos have been doing it since 2019, only 25% of conservative voters support reducing student immigration. is that at odds with what some politicians would say? some people might argue that. damian, it is such a political issue, it has been for so long. it seems an e—book ago when david cameron, 2010, was promising to bring net migration to below 100,000 per year. bring net migration to below 100,000 peryear. —— and bring net migration to below 100,000 per year. —— and epoch ago. his famous phrase, no ifs, no buts. and

2017, recent history, theresa may pledged to get the figure down to below 100000 and into the tens of thousands, if she won the election. what has changed, damien? lltlul’hat thousands, if she won the election. what has changed, damien? what you can sa is what has changed, damien? what you can say is that — what has changed, damien? what you can say is that one _ what has changed, damien? what you can say is that one thing _ what has changed, damien? what you can say is that one thing that - what has changed, damien? what you can say is that one thing that has - can say is that one thing that has changed is the brexit referendum. the government would say the sense that there is control over immigration, that the uk government decides who is on the occupation list, who should be given visas to come in, that has led to a slight change in attitudes and the atmosphere around the debate. a decade ago, it was on the back of the increase in eu migration coming here. people using freedom of movement, coming to fill all of thosejobs that dominic movement, coming to fill all of those jobs that dominic casciani was talking about earlier in the programme. at the time, that was being politically capitalised on. it was one of the reasons the

conservatives felt under pressure, there had been a surge in ukip, you saw that in the european elections. and then we saw the brexit referendum. interestingly, there is also that same attitude that you talk about, saying that similar sorts of shifts in attitudes towards more broad acceptance in some sectors of immigration is across other countries as well. and people looking at the benefit brought ruin to the education sector, perhaps, other sectors of the economy. the political side of this, when you break the numbers down, what appears to be the case is that some of the people that are concerned about immigration, the attitude surveys are tending to show that they are concentrated more amongst pro—conservative voters. some would say that the politicians are a little behind attitudes in the way

they talk about these issues. interesting, thank you very much indeed. we hear there may well be an urgent question in the commons from labour, and if it is in our time we will bring us line. there seems to have been a rebalancing, from fewer people coming from the eu, more from other parts of the world. rahul is from coventry. good morning. an interesting day, an important day. we've had the figures. what are your views, and how is it impacting on your life and your business? mr; your life and your business? my ersonal your life and your business? ii personal situation your life and your business? ijji: personal situation might your life and your business? m; personal situation might have been recruiting for specialist engineering positions for the last year and a half. 95% of all applicants have been from abroad. if i can identify an acute shortage of specialist skills in engineering that are being overlooked, even in our universities as of now. you can see companies like jaguar land

rover, you know, they are actually going abroad, countries like india or germany, for these technical expertise. i don't see these issues as a problem, immigration has to work hand—in—hand. i came here around 15 years ago for my masters. there was a group of 31 i first joined for my masters. i would say 27 of them were from abroad. it's about four times the number of british applicants. there has been income coming in, it is helping universities as well, but is it being aligned with what the industry actually needs?—

actually needs? candies, candice mason from _ actually needs? candies, candice mason from candice _ actually needs? candies, candice mason from candice coaches. - actually needs? candies, candice l mason from candice coaches. what actually needs? candies, candice - mason from candice coaches. what are your needs? i mason from candice coaches. what are our needs? . mason from candice coaches. what are your needs?— your needs? i 'ust need drivers. i run a your needs? i 'ust need drivers. i your needs? ijust need drivers. i run a coach company _ your needs? ijust need drivers. i run a coach company and - your needs? ijust need drivers. i run a coach company and i've - your needs? ijust need drivers. i l run a coach company and i've been sort of driver since i came out of the pandemic. ifeel fairly the pandemic. i feel fairly confident the pandemic. ifeel fairly confident that i can speak on behalf of the industry. not one of us is back to 100% capacity since we came out of lockdown. it's pretty devastating, really. the main reason is we cannot stuff the businesses. we can't stuff them with highly skilled drivers. we've done everything we can to try and train people to come into the industry, to the tune of anywhere between £3000 and £5,000. but when you get a young person or even a person changing career, when you get the behind the wheel of a coach, a £300,000 vehicle, you don't tend to send them into london or off to glasgow or europe. it's interesting your skills

shortage list there. because drivers are not on that list. we have been campaigning for two years to have that. hgvs were on there, when we came out of lockdown. the government did a really big push on driving for that. they almost pinched drivers from us and it became a war over wages and quality of work. to me, if immigration supports having a better and stronger workforce, great. immigration supports having a better and strongerworkforce, great. if immigration supports having a better and stronger workforce, great. if we can do something about potentially retraining or investing in people in the uk, great. ijust want to operate my business to 100% capacity. operate my business to 10096 ca aci . . operate my business to 10096 ca aci . , ., , operate my business to 10096 caaci . , ., , , capacity. fishermen have 'ust been added to that h capacity. fishermen have 'ust been added to that list. h capacity. fishermen have 'ust been added to that list. so _ capacity. fishermen havejust been added to that list. so obviously - capacity. fishermen havejust been added to that list. so obviously it l added to that list. so obviously it is a movable feast. i added to that list. so obviously it is a movable feast.— added to that list. so obviously it is a movable feast. i have noticed a chance in is a movable feast. i have noticed a change in people's— is a movable feast. i have noticed a change in people's approach - is a movable feast. i have noticed a change in people's approach to - is a movable feast. i have noticed a | change in people's approach to work since we came out of lockdown.

interesting. i since we came out of lockdown. interesting-— interesting. i think i have felt it m self. i interesting. i think i have felt it myself. i don't _ interesting. i think i have felt it myself. i don't think _ interesting. i think i have felt it myself. i don't think anybody i interesting. i think i have felt it - myself. i don't think anybody wanted to go back to how it was before, we all took stock of what works for us and where our priorities are. i have dealt with more males with mental health issues in the last two years than ever before. there is a sense as a business owner that people don't want to work to the same capacity as they used to. i, for one, and i know many colleagues of mine, have adapted the rotors to try to bring about a worklife balance. one industry that operates 24 hours a day, 36 to five days a year, that is very difficult. is a day, 36 to five days a year, that is very difficult.— is very difficult. is interesting, the psychology _ is very difficult. is interesting, the psychology of _ is very difficult. is interesting, the psychology of it. - is very difficult. is interesting, the psychology of it. why - is very difficult. is interesting, the psychology of it. why is i is very difficult. is interesting, l the psychology of it. why is that happening? has it changed? it has definitely changed. _ happening? has it changed? it has definitely changed. there - happening? has it changed? it has definitely changed. there is - happening? has it changed? it jji:3 definitely changed. there is no two ways about it. people's attitudes to a work—life balance has changed in my opinion. the a work-life balance has changed in my opinion-— a work-life balance has changed in m oinion. . , , ., my opinion. the pandemic is the sea chanie? i

my opinion. the pandemic is the sea change? lthink— my opinion. the pandemic is the sea change? i think that _ my opinion. the pandemic is the sea change? i think that was _ my opinion. the pandemic is the sea change? i think that was probably i change? i think that was probably the catalyst- _ change? i think that was probably the catalyst- l _ change? i think that was probably the catalyst. i think _ change? i think that was probably the catalyst. i think there - change? i think that was probably the catalyst. i think there was - the catalyst. i think there was probably things that have happened before that. typically, i work in a very male—dominated environment, and historically a male figure was the one that went out and earned. most of the drivers these days have a working family where both partners working family where both partners work and a share of childcare, and i absolutely commend that, we want women working, and i work myself. but that causes some gaps. and then where people have had time with theirfamilies, and have looked at theirfamilies, and have looked at the fact that your own personal well—being, watching your family grow up, that has become your top priority. and, actually, work is not your top priority. ifeel priority. and, actually, work is not your top priority. i feel the priority. and, actually, work is not your top priority. ifeel the onus on business owners is not about toulouse as much about offering a con tolkien contractual obligation.

—— it is not as much about offering a contractual obligation, it is about the extras we need to be thinking about. sometimes i feel like i am a counselling service to my staff, rather than an employee. i think that has been a shift over time. . , . . think that has been a shift over time. . ,. . �* think that has been a shift over time. ., ,. ., �* ., think that has been a shift over time. . ,. ., �* ., time. fascinating. 0k. don't go too far awa . time. fascinating. 0k. don't go too far away- let's _ time. fascinating. 0k. don't go too far away. let's hear _ time. fascinating. 0k. don't go too far away. let's hear from _ time. fascinating. 0k. don't go too far away. let's hear from tabatha l time. fascinating. 0k. don't go too| far away. let's hear from tabatha in far away. let's hearfrom tabatha in the forest of dean. and amitab, i hope i got that right... laughter that doesn't sound like i got that right? that doesn't sound like i got that ri i ht? ., , ., that doesn't sound like i got that riiht? ., ., , ~, right? no, you got it perfectly riiht. right? no, you got it perfectly right- that _ right? no, you got it perfectly right. that is _ right? no, you got it perfectly right. that is a _ right? no, you got it perfectly right. that is a first! _ right? no, you got it perfectly right. that is a first! what - right? no, you got it perfectly right. that is a first! what do | right? no, you got it perfectly i right. that is a first! what do you want to say? _ right. that is a first! what do you want to say? l — right. that is a first! what do you want to say? i was _ right. that is a first! what do you want to say? i was wondering - right. that is a first! what do you i want to say? i was wondering about this -oli want to say? i was wondering about this policy of _ want to say? i was wondering about this policy of putting _ want to say? i was wondering about this policy of putting numbers - want to say? i was wondering about this policy of putting numbers on i this policy of putting numbers on net migration. i think it seems a retrograde step to do. if people are trying to migrate your country, it means your country is desirable, people want to come here. the whole

thing up trying to cut down the thing up trying to cut down the thing of saying we want to make the country less desirable, that was the whole thing about the hostile environment. saying don't come here, it is not so nice. it is working but making it less welcome to your own people also. i have lived in six different countries, i did my phd in the us. ifeel we are different countries, i did my phd in the us. i feel we are thinking different countries, i did my phd in the us. ifeel we are thinking in different countries, i did my phd in the us. i feel we are thinking in a retrograde manner, and just trying to reduce the figures, rather than grow the economy, and the country. you know, then everything pays for itself. in my own experience, i've seen the home office but on a scam, you could say, because any person that comes now has to pay all of these energy surcharges and you pay for every member of your family, £600, whatever, at once, for every visa you take. people are shelling

out a lot of money. you are probably not spending so much on the migrants, you are already taking an advance from them. so i think all of this seems... don't know what the right word is, politicking. this seems. .. don't know what the right word is, politicking.— right word is, politicking. insular? ithink right word is, politicking. insular? lthinkjust— right word is, politicking. insular? i thinkjust looking _ right word is, politicking. insular? i thinkjust looking at _ right word is, politicking. insular? i thinkjust looking at numbers i right word is, politicking. insular? | i thinkjust looking at numbers and reducing them is not the right way. that is the word that came to mind, from what you're saying, insular, inward —looking? that from what you're saying, insular, inward -looking?_ from what you're saying, insular, inward -looking? that could be one wa . m inward -looking? that could be one way. my experience, _ inward -looking? that could be one way. my experience, i— inward -looking? that could be one way. my experience, i did - inward -looking? that could be one way. my experience, i did my i inward -looking? that could be one way. my experience, i did my phd i inward -looking? that could be one| way. my experience, i did my phd in the us, i lived in six countries, it doesn't seem to give positive energy to the whole society.— to the whole society. fascinating, thank ou to the whole society. fascinating, thank you so _ to the whole society. fascinating, thank you so much. _ to the whole society. fascinating, thank you so much. tabatha, i to the whole society. fascinating, | thank you so much. tabatha, what would you like to say in the forest of dean? ,., ., ., . of dean? good morning! well, i didn't come _ of dean? good morning! well, i didn't come here _ of dean? good morning! well, i didn't come here for _ of dean? good morning! well, i didn't come here for work i of dean? good morning! well, i didn't come here for work or. of dean? good morning! well, i- didn't come here for work or school. i didn't come here for work or school. i came _ didn't come here for work or school. i came here — didn't come here for work or school. i came here follow. that didn't come here for work or school. i came here follow.—

i came here follow. that is what we want to hear- _ i came here follow. that is what we want to hear. -- _ i came here follow. that is what we want to hear. -- i _ i came here follow. that is what we want to hear. -- i came _ i came here follow. that is what we want to hear. -- i came here i i came here follow. that is what we want to hear. -- i came here for i want to hear. -- i came here for love. want to hear. -- i came here for love- its — want to hear. -- i came here for love- its a _ want to hear. -- i came here for love. it's a long _ want to hear. -- i came here for love. it's a long story. _ want to hear. -- i came here for love. it's a long story. we i want to hear. -- i came here for love. it's a long story. we had i want to hear. -- i came here for love. it's a long story. we had a| love. it's a long story. we had a real— love. it's a long story. we had a real tough— love. it's a long story. we had a real tough time going through the whole _ real tough time going through the whole process. we were denied our first time — whole process. we were denied our first time. but they kept all of the money— first time. but they kept all of the money we — first time. but they kept all of the money we put in. so the incentive to prove _ money we put in. so the incentive to prove somebody is low, if you are going _ prove somebody is low, if you are going to _ prove somebody is low, if you are going to keep all the funds. so we appealed — going to keep all the funds. so we appealed. and once again, we were denied _ appealed. and once again, we were denied this — appealed. and once again, we were denied. this was because one sheet of financial — denied. this was because one sheet of financial paper, basically, was missing — of financial paper, basically, was missing. and then the next time, we hired _ missing. and then the next time, we hired a _ missing. and then the next time, we hired a lawyer. that is obviously expensive _ hired a lawyer. that is obviously expensive. but we were obviously very desperate. my husband and i have _ very desperate. my husband and i have known each other for 20 years.

if i have known each other for 20 years. if i may _ have known each other for 20 years. if i may come — have known each other for 20 years. if i may come is your husband a brett? . if i may come is your husband a brett? , , if i may come is your husband a brett? . . ~ brett? yes, he is. we met when... he is a sound _ brett? yes, he is. we met when... he is a sound engineer. _ brett? yes, he is. we met when... he is a sound engineer. so _ brett? yes, he is. we met when... he is a sound engineer. so he _ brett? yes, he is. we met when... he is a sound engineer. so he tours. i brett? yes, he is. we met when... he is a sound engineer. so he tours. we i is a sound engineer. so he tours. we met when— is a sound engineer. so he tours. we met when he — is a sound engineer. so he tours. we met when he came to texas. if is a sound engineer. so he tours. we met when he came to texas.- met when he came to texas. if you married him. _ met when he came to texas. if you married him, would _ met when he came to texas. if you married him, would you _ met when he came to texas. if you married him, would you be - met when he came to texas. if you married him, would you be able i met when he came to texas. if you married him, would you be able to| married him, would you be able to stay? married him, would you be able to sta ? ~ . , , married him, would you be able to sta ? ~ . , . so stay? we did get married, yes. so what was the _ stay? we did get married, yes. so what was the problem? _ stay? we did get married, yes. so what was the problem? it - stay? we did get married, yes. so what was the problem? it doesn't| what was the problem? it doesn't work any more. _ what was the problem? it doesn't work any more. that _ what was the problem? it doesn't work any more. that interesting, | what was the problem? it doesn't| work any more. that interesting, i didn't know _ work any more. that interesting, i didn't know that. _ work any more. that interesting, i didn't know that. i _ work any more. that interesting, i didn't know that. i cannot - work any more. that interesting, i didn't know that. i cannot know i didn't know that. i cannot know everything. it’s didn't know that. i cannot know everything-— everything. it's awful, isn't it? dominic. _ everything. it's awful, isn't it? dominic, it _ everything. it's awful, isn't it? dominic, it is _ everything. it's awful, isn't it? dominic, it is interesting, i everything. it's awful, isn't it? | dominic, it is interesting, that? there is a minimum entry salary for a spouse or visa, which has become a real source of tension along some of the low skilled workers. so, you basically have to prove to the home office that as a family you are going to be any such an amount of money before you bring your spouse into the country. but money before you bring your spouse into the country.— into the country. but he is a sound eniineer, into the country. but he is a sound engineer. and _ into the country. but he is a sound engineer, and probably _ into the country. but he is a sound engineer, and probably putting i into the country. but he is a sound| engineer, and probably putting the plugs in for paul mccartney, you would have thought, all of that

stuff. ,, ., , ., stuff. sure, that is what we will sa . stuff. sure, that is what we will say- really _ stuff. sure, that is what we will say. really stressful. _ stuff. sure, that is what we will say. really stressful. awful- stuff. sure, that is what we willj say. really stressful. awful and expensive- _ say. really stressful. awful and expensive- l— say. really stressful. awful and expensive. i mean, _ say. really stressful. awful and expensive. i mean, we - say. really stressful. awful and expensive. i mean, we are i say. really stressful. awful and expensive. i mean, we are up l say. really stressful. awful and | expensive. i mean, we are up in say. really stressful. awful and i expensive. i mean, we are up in the range— expensive. i mean, we are up in the range of— expensive. i mean, we are up in the range of being pushed passed 15 grand, by the time with got permanent status last year. that is where _ permanent status last year. that is where we _ permanent status last year. that is where we were. i would say it is closer— where we were. i would say it is closer to — where we were. i would say it is closer to 20 _ where we were. i would say it is closer to 20 after everything was said and — closer to 20 after everything was said and done. that is where myself and my— said and done. that is where myself and my daughter. said and done. that is where myself and my daughter-— said and done. that is where myself and my daughter. where are you from oriiinall ? and my daughter. where are you from originally? l — and my daughter. where are you from originally? l was _ and my daughter. where are you from originally? i was born _ and my daughter. where are you from originally? i was born in _ and my daughter. where are you from originally? i was born in arizona, i originally? i was born in arizona, but lived in _ originally? i was born in arizona, but lived in texas. _ originally? i was born in arizona, but lived in texas. could - originally? i was born in arizona, but lived in texas. could you i originally? i was born in arizona, but lived in texas. could you do| originally? i was born in arizona, | but lived in texas. could you do if the other way _ but lived in texas. could you do if the other way round? _ but lived in texas. could you do if the other way round? if _ but lived in texas. could you do if the other way round? if you i but lived in texas. could you do if the other way round? if you were | but lived in texas. could you do if. the other way round? if you were to go back, would he be allowed back as your husband?— go back, would he be allowed back as your husband? yes, he could do. but, ou know, your husband? yes, he could do. but, you know. the — your husband? yes, he could do. but, you know, the love _ your husband? yes, he could do. but, you know, the love story _ your husband? yes, he could do. but, you know, the love story doesn't i you know, the love story doesn't 'ust you know, the love story doesn't just stop — you know, the love story doesn't just stop with my husband. i actually— just stop with my husband. i actually love england. i know that is controversial sometimes. try scotland, _ is controversial sometimes. tj'j; scotland, you will love that even more. it's interesting, it would work the other day in terms of

spousal affiliation, belonging to a nation, but more difficult this way, am i right in saying that? definitely.— am i right in saying that? definitely._ thisj am i right in saying that? l definitely._ this is am i right in saying that? i definitely._ this is a am i right in saying that? - definitely._ this is a hard definitely. tabatha? this is a hard count to definitely. tabatha? this is a hard country to get _ definitely. tabatha? this is a hard country to get into, _ definitely. tabatha? this is a hard country to get into, for _ definitely. tabatha? this is a hard country to get into, for sure. i definitely. tabatha? this is a hard country to get into, for sure. you | country to get into, for sure. you have added _ country to get into, for sure. you have added a _ country to get into, for sure. you have added a lot _ country to get into, for sure. you have added a lot to _ country to get into, for sure. mm, have added a lot to the debate. country to get into, for sure. mm have added a lot to the debate. i get the sense you have added a lot to the country as well. you get the sense you have added a lot to the country as well.— to the country as well. you are so sweet. to the country as well. you are so sweet- the _ to the country as well. you are so sweet. the course _ to the country as well. you are so sweet. the course of— to the country as well. you are so sweet. the course of true - to the country as well. you are so sweet. the course of true love . to the country as well. you are so i sweet. the course of true love never did run smooth, _ sweet. the course of true love never did run smooth, did _ sweet. the course of true love never did run smooth, did it? _ sweet. the course of true love never did run smooth, did it? no. - sweet. the course of true love never did run smooth, did it? no. but - sweet. the course of true love never did run smooth, did it? no. but if. did run smooth, did it? no. but if it is worth — did run smooth, did it? no. but if it is worth fighting _ did run smooth, did it? no. but if it is worth fighting for, _ did run smooth, did it? no. but if it is worth fighting for, you - did run smooth, did it? no. but if it is worth fighting for, you know. i it is worth fighting for, you know. yes _ it is worth fighting for, you know. yes. absolutely. thank you very much, tabatha, and amitabh as well. we are getting brilliant comments from our litters. —— listeners. keep those coming. we had net migration figures. 606,000 in the year ending december 2022. figures. 606,000 in the year ending december2022. not figures. 606,000 in the year ending december 2022. not as large as the government was suggesting they might be. all was that monitoring the story? so many different aspects to

this that we are exploring this morning. we want to hear from you, here on in. call me on 08085 909693. is immigration working for you? i will officially reset right now. is immigration working for you? in the last half hour new figures show that net migration added 606,000 people to the uk's population in 2022, the highest number on record. the bbc�*s best experts are with me and digging into the numbers to find out the detail behind the headline number. but i want to hear from you too. how do you feel about the uk's immigration system? is it working for you? dominic casciani. in damian

grammaticas. dominic casciani. is have you got direct experience of it? have you travelled to work or study in the uk? are you an employer who relies on foreign workers? or do you think the uk is letting too many people in? has immigration had an impact on where you live, what does it mean for public services? is it putting things like housing and schools under pressure? is immigration working for you? net migration hasjumped to a record level, tojust over 600,000.

the conservative party manifesto had promised to cut the figure, which is the difference between the number of people arriving in, and leaving the uk. most households in england, wales and scotland will have lower gas and electricity bills from july — after the regulator 0fgem, announced the new price cap. average bills will be around £2,074 a year, a reduction of around £1i00. martin lewis will have more at 1.00. two children's charities have warned that help with childcare costs in england — announced in the budget — "unfairly target" higher—income families. the government says it's removing barriers for parents who want to work. and music's biggest stars have been remembering tina turner, who's died aged 83. beyonce described her as a "beautiful spirit". sir mickjagger said she was "inspiring, warm, funny and generous."

is immigration working for you? cashis cash is here and another great man at the bbc stalking the corridors and doing good work, head of statistics robert cuff. i and doing good work, head of statistics robert cuff.- and doing good work, head of statistics robert cuff. i will take that review- _ statistics robert cuff. i will take that review. so _ statistics robert cuff. i will take that review. so tell _ statistics robert cuff. i will take that review. so tell us _ statistics robert cuff. i will take that review. so tell us what - statistics robert cuff. i will take that review. so tell us what you | statistics robert cuff. i will take - that review. so tell us what you can about these — that review. so tell us what you can about these figures. _ that review. so tell us what you can about these figures. i _ that review. so tell us what you can about these figures. i come - that review. so tell us what you can about these figures. i come bearing two story you _ about these figures. i come bearing two story you have _ about these figures. i come bearing two story you have been _ about these figures. i come bearing two story you have been talking - two story you have been talking about immigration so far, it is sup, it is a record level but not as up as we thought it was. and we can see the reasons behind that, also we have had new figures coming out on asylum claims and the backlog, we know that towards the end of last year we saw about 160,000 having their claims processed. the government have promised to bring it down, but the figure has gone up, it

has gone up to about 172,000, and the number of people who are waiting more than six months to have their claim processed, has gone up by nearly 20,000. so, there is a huge number of figures coming out today, we will bring more as we learn more about them. buried in the numbers is this story on asylum claims. find this story on asylum claims. and fewer people _ this story on asylum claims. and fewer people coming from the eu, more people coming from other part of the world?— of the world? yes, so what is happening. — of the world? yes, so what is happening, coming _ of the world? yes, so what is happening, coming back- of the world? yes, so what is happening, coming back to l of the world? yes, so what is i happening, coming back to the overall level of migration story, the number of people in the eu is taking away from the uk population, about 50,000 people overall, from the eu more left than came in, so the eu more left than came in, so the big driver in migration at the moment and the increases in migration that we are seeing is people coming from outside the eu and the big drivers are those, two reason, people coming to work, nearly doubled in a year and of course the exceptional events in ukraine and the hong kong visa programme so we saw about nearly a quarter of a million coming to work

from outside eu and 11a,000 people from outside eu and 11a,000 people from ukraine coming on the special schemes. ~._ . ~ ::" schemes. theresa may back in 2019, 2017 i schemes. theresa may back in 2019, 2017 i think, _ schemes. theresa may back in 2019, 2017 i think, saying, _ schemes. theresa may back in 2019, 2017 i think, saying, you _ schemes. theresa may back in 2019, 2017 i think, saying, you know- schemes. theresa may back in 2019, 2017 i think, saying, you know we i 2017 i think, saying, you know we want to get them into the tens of thousands, these figures, dominic, is that a pipe dream? some would say, you know, what is the problem with having migration at these levels but i mean, how would they be able to do that if they wanted to do that and if it was a desirable thing. i that and if it was a desirable thin. . ., i. that and if it was a desirable thin _ ., ., y., ., that and if it was a desirable thing. i am glad you asked that with robert sitting _ thing. i am glad you asked that with robert sitting next _ thing. i am glad you asked that with robert sitting next to _ thing. i am glad you asked that with robert sitting next to me _ thing. i am glad you asked that with robert sitting next to me who - thing. i am glad you asked that with robert sitting next to me who can i robert sitting next to me who can correct _ robert sitting next to me who can correct me — robert sitting next to me who can correct me. i have been trying to do some _ correct me. i have been trying to do some back— correct me. i have been trying to do some back of— correct me. i have been trying to do some back of the envelope calculations on this. let us put the eu thing _ calculations on this. let us put the eu thing to — calculations on this. let us put the eu thing to one side, because there are more _ eu thing to one side, because there are more eu — eu thing to one side, because there are more eu citizens leaving than arriving _ are more eu citizens leaving than arriving at — are more eu citizens leaving than arriving at the moment, so they are not adding — arriving at the moment, so they are not adding to the population let us look at _ not adding to the population let us look at the rest of the world, about 9240.000 — look at the rest of the world, about 9240,000 people arrived last year. if you _ 9240,000 people arrived last year. if you start — 9240,000 people arrived last year. if you start to stretch out o940,000. if you want to strip out

the number— o940,000. if you want to strip out the number of people who are seeking asylum, _ the number of people who are seeking asylum, so— the number of people who are seeking asylum, so under the current plan, before _ asylum, so under the current plan, before parliament, anybody who arrives _ before parliament, anybody who arrives without coming through a format— arrives without coming through a formal asylum route, would be blocked — formal asylum route, would be blocked and in theory sent to another— blocked and in theory sent to another country for their claim to be dealt — another country for their claim to be dealt with there. the high end that is_ be dealt with there. the high end that is 76,000 people out of the totat~ _ that is 76,000 people out of the totat~ if— that is 76,000 people out of the total. if you take out the arrival, the exceptional arrival of people from _ the exceptional arrival of people from hong kong and ukraine, that is another— from hong kong and ukraine, that is another 172,000 there, thereabouts, something _ another 172,000 there, thereabouts, something like that. and if the government bore down, as it also seems _ government bore down, as it also seems to— government bore down, as it also seems to want to do, on family nremhers— seems to want to do, on family members arriving alongside some students, — members arriving alongside some students, that could take out a chunk — students, that could take out a chunk. then you will get close to the number of people who are emigrating, when you take one away from the _ emigrating, when you take one away from the other it is possible that the government could get very very close _ the government could get very very close to _ the government could get very very close to hitting the net migration, except— close to hitting the net migration, except you — close to hitting the net migration, except you can't control immigration, so if the british economy— immigration, so if the british economy took off it is likely that

fewer— economy took off it is likely that fewer people would emigrate so the figure _ fewer people would emigrate so the figure would go up and also, within this is— figure would go up and also, within this is the — figure would go up and also, within this is the uncertainty of the intentions of people from other parts _ intentions of people from other parts of— intentions of people from other parts of the eu, and their arrivals, so, you _ parts of the eu, and their arrivals, so, you can— parts of the eu, and their arrivals, so, you can see kind of aspirational ways— so, you can see kind of aspirational ways of— so, you can see kind of aspirational ways of getting to the figures but the fact— ways of getting to the figures but the fact is event, the global economy and people's intentions in the uk _ economy and people's intentions in the uk to— economy and people's intentions in the uk to leave... and economy and people's intentions in the uk to leave. . ._ the uk to leave... and we need candlestick _ the uk to leave... and we need candlestick maker. _ the uk to leave... and we need candlestick maker. yinger- the uk to leave... and we need candlestick maker. yinger all. the uk to leave... and we need - candlestick maker. yinger all these thin . s candlestick maker. yinger all these things knock— candlestick maker. yinger all these things knock this _ candlestick maker. yinger all these things knock this h _ candlestick maker. yinger all these things knock this h even _ candlestick maker. yinger all these things knock this h even if - candlestick maker. yinger all these things knock this h even if the - things knock this h even if the government _ things knock this h even if the government do _ things knock this h even if the government do nothing - things knock this h even if the government do nothing net i things knock this h even if the - government do nothing net migration you would expect it to come down, hopefully the events in ukraine are exceptional, we won't see another 100,000 people fleeing the country next year, the increase in the number of people coming tost study in the uk, that is an increase now but most hang round for two or three year, so if you see a rise in people coming to study this year, you will see a rise in people leaving the country in two or three years. so evenif country in two or three years. so even if the government didn't do anything, everyone if they didn't bear down in all the ways described,

you would see this number come down from a peak, so probably before the next election, the government will have to make big choices to see the figures change substantially. rishi sunak has been _ figures change substantially. rishi sunak has been on _ figures change substantially. rishi sunak has been on this morning he is is not the new presenter he has been speaking in his capacity as prime minister, we will give you more of what he says, he has said net migration numbers are too high and i want to bring them down. more of that soon. anna in kent. dennis in conchester and general secretary of the nigerian student, all in touch. anna, you came from ukraine quite a while ago, tell us more about you life. your reaction to the news today. i life. your reaction to the news toda . �* . . life. your reaction to the news toda . �* ., . ., today. i didn't hear much at the moment. _ today. i didn't hear much at the moment. yes. _ today. i didn't hear much at the

moment, yes, but, _ today. i didn't hear much at the moment, yes, but, migration i today. i didn't hear much at the| moment, yes, but, migration in today. i didn't hear much at the i moment, yes, but, migration in the country, and the amount of people coming to the country is always been a worry for the government and people who live here. and especially, when they had a route for ukrainians to come before the war, and people was coming to work here, and everyone was pleased about it and obviously when it, the war start, it stops the people coming, except people who came here asking for homes for ukraine, and obviously, they start looking for jobs and settlement, which was nice but at the same time to have a people come over uk who do not looking forjob, and obvious that is the main issue, coming here. you think that is is a big issue? yes, yes, ithink you think that is is a big issue? yes, yes, i think personally, you do have a lot of percentage of people who dot not look forjob, who are

looking for nice and comfortable easy life in the uk, and to not look forjob. d0 easy life in the uk, and to not look for 'ob. ,, ~ easy life in the uk, and to not look forjob._ because i easy life in the uk, and to not look| forjob._ because we for 'ob. do you think... because we do forjob. do you think... because we do have a massive, _ forjob. do you think... because we do have a massive, sorry. - forjob. do you think. .. because we do have a massive, sorry. is- forjob. do you think... because we do have a massive, sorry. is i i forjob. do you think... because we do have a massive, sorry. is i was. do have a massive, sorry. is i was aroin to do have a massive, sorry. is i was going to ask _ do have a massive, sorry. is i was going to ask you _ do have a massive, sorry. is i was going to ask you basically - do have a massive, sorry. is i was going to ask you basically and i i going to ask you basically and i want to hear more from you on that. it is really interesting. uk net migration 606,000, in the year ending december 2022. the prime minister says it is too high, do you think it is too high? ii aii minister says it is too high, do you think it is too high?— think it is too high? if all the --eole think it is too high? if all the people looked _ think it is too high? if all the people looked for— think it is too high? if all the people looked forjob - think it is too high? if all the people looked forjob and i think it is too high? if all the i people looked forjob and work in the uk, it is not too high. because we with the seasonal workers in the country, and we bring more and more every year and we are looking for more and more people to come to work, if you think 606,000 in the country who will apply for jobs because it doesn't matter which industry you look, everywhere you got a shortage of people to work. and question is, where all that labour, where are the people, why

are we still suffering shortage of people to work? than? are we still suffering shortage of people to work?— are we still suffering shortage of people to work? are we still suffering shortage of --eole to work? . , ., , ., ., people to work? any thoughts on that rentlemen, people to work? any thoughts on that gentlemen. if — people to work? any thoughts on that gentlemen, if all _ people to work? any thoughts on that gentlemen, if all these _ people to work? any thoughts on that gentlemen, if all these people - people to work? any thoughts on that gentlemen, if all these people in i gentlemen, if all these people in the country why are there still people coming, why are there these skills shortages. aha, people coming, why are there these skills shortages.— skills shortages. a lot is about the nature of an _ skills shortages. a lot is about the nature of an open _ skills shortages. a lot is about the nature of an open economy, i skills shortages. a lot is about the nature of an open economy, the i skills shortages. a lot is about the l nature of an open economy, the uk for decades now has had a very flexible open economy where businesses are allowed to make their own decisions about how they choose to expand and look for opportunities, and that in itself becomes a driver, of demand for labour, we saw this in 2004, after the opening up of the european union to the eastern central european countries, businesses looked for opportunity, they sucked people in, when you have an economy the size of the uk with growing sector, i will give you an example. silicon den round cambridge, huge growing tech sector, that is going to be suck sex people in for decades to come if it

is going to be a success, they will try to recreate the best talents from round the world, competing with silicon valley in san francisco, but those parts of the economy suck in ancillary workers as well. for every factory full of clever techies. you will need cleaners as well, so where are you going to get the cleaners from, it has this magifying effect. and you need vets rthere is an ongoing effect. we and you need vets r there is an ongoing effect-— and you need vets r there is an ongoing effect. and you need vets r there is an onaroin effect. ~ ,.,,.,_ ., ., ongoing effect. we probably have an announcement _ ongoing effect. we probably have an announcement about _ ongoing effect. we probably have an announcement about the _ ongoing effect. we probably have an announcement about the building i ongoing effect. we probably have an announcement about the building of| announcement about the building of after giving factory in somerset to save the car industry, that will be a huge number ofjobs into that area, and ultimately they have to come from somewhere so you are taking them from elsewhere in the british labour force or they are coming in through migration and what businesses want is total flexibility so they can choose the best people, and that becomes a driver of immigration.—

and that becomes a driver of immiaration. .,, ., , , immigration. robert forly be with ou in a immigration. robert forly be with you in a second, _ immigration. robert forly be with you in a second, anna _ immigration. robert forly be with you in a second, anna why i immigration. robert forly be with you in a second, anna why did i immigration. robert forly be with | you in a second, anna why did you come in first place and what did you do when you came all those years ago? do when you came all those years aro? do when you came all those years aio? , ., , do when you came all those years aro? , ., , ., ., do when you came all those years ao? , ., ,., ., ago? over 25 years ago, i came here as a seasonal — ago? over 25 years ago, i came here as a seasonal worker, _ ago? over 25 years ago, i came here as a seasonal worker, picking - as a seasonal worker, picking strawberries, all kinds ofjob, outside on the farm. and also after that, working in a pack house, packing the fruit and working as a seasonal farm worker. what packing the fruit and working as a seasonal farm worker.— packing the fruit and working as a seasonal farm worker. what do you do now? i'm a — seasonal farm worker. what do you do now? i'm a farm _ seasonal farm worker. what do you do now? i'm a farm manager, _ seasonal farm worker. what do you do now? i'm a farm manager, it's - seasonal farm worker. what do you do now? i'm a farm manager, it's taken i now? i'm a farm manager, it's taken me a lona now? i'm a farm manager, it's taken me a long time _ now? i'm a farm manager, it's taken me a long time to _ now? i'm a farm manager, it's taken me a long time to grow _ now? i'm a farm manager, it's taken me a long time to grow and - now? i'm a farm manager, it's taken me a long time to grow and i - now? i'm a farm manager, it's taken me a long time to grow and i am i me a long time to grow and i am enjoying still being on the farm. i am enjoying to do what i do and it is nice to see people who does come and care about food growing and see how it, it is going and to when you are picking the fruit and sending is it away to supermarket, it is so beauty about it.—

it away to supermarket, it is so beauty about it. and getting fruit icker, beauty about it. and getting fruit picker. what _ beauty about it. and getting fruit picker, what is _ beauty about it. and getting fruit picker, what is that _ beauty about it. and getting fruit picker, what is that situation i beauty about it. and getting fruit l picker, what is that situation like? that has always been difficult, especially after the brexit, even before we had many people coming from poland, as we spoke before and after that romania, bulgaria, from poland, as we spoke before and afterthat romania, bulgaria, now from poland, as we spoke before and after that romania, bulgaria, now we have less and less people coming from europe and the majority coming from europe and the majority coming from far away, kyrgyzstan, uzbekistan, nepal. indonesia, it is a long way for them to come and people who doesn't speak english or just a bit of english, you do the growing and new to a whole farming situation, it is difficult to train them, explain what is very important for us, in that industry. it them, explain what is very important for us, in that industry.— for us, in that industry. it has been a privilege _ for us, in that industry. it has been a privilege hearing i for us, in that industry. it has been a privilege hearing from j for us, in that industry. it has i been a privilege hearing from you, thank you for getting in touch. dennis in colchester, on you go, it is all yours and good morning. i just wanted to make a comment about

suella braverman saying we could train people from the uk to pick fruit. it shows a lack of understanding, the people that. co—here, they can come here, pick fruit for a few year, pay for their education, even buy a house, people from the uk can't do that, so the money they would get paid for doing thatjob would be of less value, we need these people. haifa that job would be of less value, we need these people.— need these people. how do we get these people? _ need these people. how do we get these people? well, _ need these people. how do we get these people? well, i— need these people. how do we get these people? well, i think- need these people. how do we get these people? well, i think we i need these people. how do we get l these people? well, i think we have to take part — these people? well, i think we have to take part illegal _ these people? well, i think we have to take part illegal immigration... i to take part illegal immigration... irregular. it is a different thing, irregular. it is a different thing, i have to be up front, if it wasn't for immigration i wouldn't be here, all my grandparents were immigrants. so, you know... where from dennis? they are all from eastern europe, they are alljewish, so they are all from yearn europe, so only 2% of me is uk, the rest of me is 98% eastern

european, so it does mean a lot to me, but, we'vejust lost the european, so it does mean a lot to me, but, we've just lost the track, if it wasn't for immigration, as i say we wouldn't have marks and spencer, tesco, we wouldn't have a national health service. people have to forget... haste national health service. people have to forret... ~ ., �* ., ., to forget... we wouldn't have a lane to forget... we wouldn't have a large number — to forget... we wouldn't have a large number of _ to forget... we wouldn't have a large number of gold _ to forget... we wouldn't have a large number of gold medals, i to forget... we wouldn't have a i large number of gold medals, would we. ., large number of gold medals, would we. ila. and success in sport. thank we. no. and success in sport. thank ou ve we. ila. and success in sport. thank you very much indeed. loads of stuff that added to an enriched our country, that is not to say it is not legitimate to worry about the figure, thank you so much. rob, you want to come in here? it�*au figure, thank you so much. rob, you want to come in here?— want to come in here? you wouldn't have silver— want to come in here? you wouldn't have silver hair— want to come in here? you wouldn't have silver hair tongued _ want to come in here? you wouldn't have silver hair tongued head i want to come in here? you wouldn't have silver hair tongued head of i have silver hair tongued head of statistics either. i am a product of immigration. cracking down on irregular migration is something the numbers don't bear out, if we think about the total number it is close to a million, the

total number of people added to the population, small boats and stuff, it is maybe 75,000 in that ballpark, so even if you clampdown on that, that won't touch the sides of the total number of people coming to the country, of course, people are upset about it for a variety of different reasons are, there are rules being broken and the rest of it and people sometimes suspect the motivation, but not really as a solution, if you are worried about the overall levels. . .. ~ are worried about the overall levels. , ., ., ., levels. let us talk about the student situation. _ levels. let us talk about the student situation. general i levels. let us talk about the - student situation. general secretary of the central association of nigerians in the uk, dominic, remind us what the government is saying about students and depen dentses. let me tell you what the figures are in, let me tell you what the figures are in. 361,000 — let me tell you what the figures are in, 361,000 arrived on stewedy related — in, 361,000 arrived on stewedy related visas, that is an increase. that— related visas, that is an increase. that increase can be mainly

attributed say the 0ns to dependent, we have _ attributed say the 0ns to dependent, we have had an inunincrease in students — we have had an inunincrease in students bringing dependents, that has gone _ students bringing dependents, that has gone up, a doubling of number, that stands— has gone up, a doubling of number, that stands to reason because people have relayed their intention because of the _ have relayed their intention because of the pandemic. what the government has said. _ of the pandemic. what the government has said. in— of the pandemic. what the government has said, in relations to this, is that— has said, in relations to this, is that foreign _ has said, in relations to this, is that foreign postgraduate students on non—research course also no longer— on non—research course also no longer be — on non—research course also no longer be able to bring family members to the uk. under its proposals, so they made that announcement a couple of days before, — announcement a couple of days before, before the figures came out, and, before, before the figures came out, and. what _ before, before the figures came out, and, what they think this will do, is bear— and, what they think this will do, is bear down on that cohort because they this _ is bear down on that cohort because they this is — is bear down on that cohort because they this is a — is bear down on that cohort because they this is a route to abuse but it mathematically helps them, but robert _ mathematically helps them, but robert said in relation to the asylum — robert said in relation to the asylum fig ukraine the irregular migration, it is a tiny cohort overall. _ migration, it is a tiny cohort overall. it—

migration, it is a tiny cohort overall, if they took out, if they halved — overall, if they took out, if they halved the _ overall, if they took out, if they halved the rate of dependents arriving — halved the rate of dependents arriving alongside students who have arriving alongside students who have a visa _ arriving alongside students who have a visa to _ arriving alongside students who have a visa to go _ arriving alongside students who have a visa to go university in the uk. that— a visa to go university in the uk. that isle — a visa to go university in the uk. that isle only 40,000 out of a total of, that isle only 40,000 out of a total of. about— that isle only 40,000 out of a total of. about a — that isle only 40,000 out of a total of, about a million people, it's a have _ of, about a million people, it's a have very— of, about a million people, it's a have very small cohort there. there is muddering _ have very small cohort there. there is muddering between _ have very small cohort there. there is muddering between the - have very small cohort there. ii—ii” is muddering between the lines from some people, there is a bit of scamming going on and that sort of stuff, sometimes it is uncomfortable stereotyping. irate stuff, sometimes it is uncomfortable stereotyping-— stuff, sometimes it is uncomfortable stereotyping. we have had stories up an down through _ stereotyping. we have had stories up an down through the _ stereotyping. we have had stories up an down through the years _ stereotyping. we have had stories up an down through the years about i an down through the years about mushroom colleges where you have these colleges which look like they are offering, you know, proper courses but they are a scam and very often the students could be a victim often the students could be a victim of that as well. what this has been driven by is by universities and british universities and degrees are prized across the world. many have an overseas campus and they train up the students and bring them into the

uk short—term was a it is good cash and brings that money into the economy. and brings that money into the econom . ~ . and brings that money into the econom .~ ., ., , and brings that money into the economy-— and brings that money into the econom . ~ ., ., , , ., ., and brings that money into the econom .~ ., ., , , ., ., economy. what does this mean do you, what the government _ economy. what does this mean do you, what the government have _ economy. what does this mean do you, what the government have said - what the government have said shoyemi? no longer to be able to bring dependents?— bring dependents? thank you for that. bring dependents? thank you for that- when _ bring dependents? thank you for that. when we _ bring dependents? thank you for that. when we heard _ bring dependents? thank you for that. when we heard the - bring dependents? thank you for that. when we heard the news i bring dependents? thank you for i that. when we heard the news we, it was unbelievable. the issue now is not blaming the student, or their depep don'ts but it meant enough to go government of the day, how to address the issue. the university are... it the emotional... but, the issue —— each university, they are

not coming fork the government come again and say they are dependents, i don't believe, our data, and one, one in five always comes with their dependent, the majority of the student here in the uk, doing their master programme, they are single. i don't see where they got that permission from, that nigerian students come here with dependents. this is what he said, the told the cabinet round 136,000 visas were granted to dependants an eight fold increase from 2019. under this announcement partners, children

other than on courses designated as research programmes will no longer be allowed to come in. hello david. kelvin in dorking, morning all. kelvin in dorking, morning all. kelvin you go first, what do you want to say?— kelvin you go first, what do you want to say? well i 'ust think the government h want to say? well i 'ust think the government ned i want to say? well i 'ust think the government ned to]— want to say? well i just think the government ned to grow - want to say? well i just think the government ned to grow a i want to say? well i just think the i government ned to grow a backbone and start dealing with inflation, dealing with the asylum—seeker, dealing with the asylum—seeker, dealing with the asylum—seeker, dealing with immigration, they don't seem to be getting a hold of it at all, there is e number of pounds to fund how the country is run, that comes from the taxpayer, and the way this country is going, there is not enough money in the system, we cannot keep taking people in, without the funds to look after them. they are not billing enough houses, we don't have enough hospital place, we don't have another school place, and the number of people in the country is just

growing and growing, and the consequences of that, the taxpayer, is having to pay more and more. now i am retired but i don't think it is fair on the taxpayer to keep funding all this immigration, the way it is, especially when you look the state of the country, and the state of our roads. they are throwing money at something that is untenable, and they need to grow a backbone and deal with it. they need to grow a backbone and deal with it— deal with it. what about the argument — deal with it. what about the argument that _ deal with it. what about the argument that net - deal with it. what about the | argument that net migration deal with it. what about the i argument that net migration helps the economy and we have skills shortages. irate the economy and we have skills shortages-— the economy and we have skills shortaies, ., ,, ., ., , shortages. we have skills shortages es, i shortages. we have skills shortages yes. i don't — shortages. we have skills shortages yes, i don't disagree _ shortages. we have skills shortages yes, i don't disagree with _ shortages. we have skills shortages yes, i don't disagree with that i shortages. we have skills shortages yes, i don't disagree with that and i yes, i don't disagree with that and some migration is good. we don't mind people coming here that are prepared to work, we don't mind students coming here, i a lot of the overseas students are visibly subsidising the universities for our student, it is a good thing. but it isjust purely

student, it is a good thing. but it is just purely the numbers, we don't have enough homes, we don't have enough school places and they are just not dealing with the sheer number of people that are coming here, illegally. that is the biggest issue. if. here, illegally. that is the biggest issue. . here, illegally. that is the biggest issue. , , , here, illegally. that is the biggest issue. . . . ,, issue. is it the biggest issue? robert was — issue. is it the biggest issue? robert was saying, _ issue. is it the biggest issue? robert was saying, that i issue. is it the biggest issue? robert was saying, that is i issue. is it the biggest issue? | robert was saying, that is not issue. is it the biggest issue? i robert was saying, that is not the biggest issue is it?— robert was saying, that is not the biggest issue is it? about a million cominr , biggest issue is it? about a million coming. fewer— biggest issue is it? about a million coming, fewer than _ biggest issue is it? about a million coming, fewer than 100,000 i biggest issue is it? about a million i coming, fewer than 100,000 claimed asylum, so the main reason, that people are coming is to study, to work, and last year there is an exemption of people fleeing the coun reflect in ukraine. bind exemption of people fleeing the coun reflect in ukraine.— reflect in ukraine. and we give the visas out. reflect in ukraine. and we give the visas out- so _ reflect in ukraine. and we give the visas out. so we _ reflect in ukraine. and we give the visas out. so we are _ reflect in ukraine. and we give the visas out. so we are taking - reflect in ukraine. and we give the visas out. so we are taking back i visas out. so we are taking back control. ~ ., �* ., ., �* control. we don't mind that, i don't mind people _ control. we don't mind that, i don't mind people coming _ control. we don't mind that, i don't mind people coming from _ control. we don't mind that, i don't mind people coming from the i control. we don't mind that, i don't i mind people coming from the ukraine, we need to help, russia is out of order, it is being dealt with, we are helping those with can, but it is the numbers coming in, that are purely a cost, we are spending millions of pounds a day on asylum—seekers in hotel room, it is wrong. it doesn't take that long to

process somebody.— wrong. it doesn't take that long to l process somebody._ it process somebody. dominic first. it is a really interesting _ process somebody. dominic first. it is a really interesting point, - process somebody. dominic first. it is a really interesting point, it- process somebody. dominic first. it is a really interesting point, it is- is a really interesting point, it is true _ is a really interesting point, it is true we — is a really interesting point, it is true we are _ is a really interesting point, it is true we are spending about 5 million a day— true we are spending about 5 million a day on _ true we are spending about 5 million a day on the — true we are spending about 5 million a day on the costs of housing asylum—seekers waiting for a decision— asylum—seekers waiting for a decision on whether they should be given— decision on whether they should be given protection in the uk. two things— given protection in the uk. two things about that, so the first is when _ things about that, so the first is when you — things about that, so the first is when you drill into the countries where _ when you drill into the countries where people are coming from, figures — where people are coming from, figures today show a quarter of people — figures today show a quarter of people who arrived on small boats with from — people who arrived on small boats with from afghanistan, so we are not necessarily— with from afghanistan, so we are not necessarily saying these people are coming _ necessarily saying these people are coming from safe countries and that shows— coming from safe countries and that shows the _ coming from safe countries and that shows the complexity of this. we have _ shows the complexity of this. we have had — shows the complexity of this. we have had the albanian issue. the national— have had the albanian issue. the national crime agency says, this is linked _ national crime agency says, this is linked to— national crime agency says, this is linked to complex organised crime, so there _ linked to complex organised crime, so there are — linked to complex organised crime, so there are nuances in there, but i think— so there are nuances in there, but i think the _ so there are nuances in there, but i think the most important thing about thinking _ think the most important thing about thinking about the asylum and the costs— thinking about the asylum and the costs of— thinking about the asylum and the costs of after that is the home office — costs of after that is the home office backlog, there are 172,000 0ffice backlog, there are 172,000 people _ 0ffice backlog, there are 172,000 people in— 0ffice backlog, there are 172,000 people in the uk who have sought asylum _ people in the uk who have sought asylum who are waiting for a

decision, _ asylum who are waiting for a decision, and that is a decision about— decision, and that is a decision about whether or not they can settle and therefore get a job, go into education. _ and therefore get a job, go into education, whatever get on with their— education, whatever get on with their lives— education, whatever get on with their lives or be removed. that backlog — their lives or be removed. that backlog has been growing year on year since — backlog has been growing year on year since 2018, and it is not clear exactly _ year since 2018, and it is not clear exactly why— year since 2018, and it is not clear exactly why that has happened. so, in effect, _ exactly why that has happened. so, in effect, there is an argument there _ in effect, there is an argument there that _ in effect, there is an argument there that these costs are down to notiust_ there that these costs are down to notjust the there that these costs are down to not just the arrivals, but also home office _ not just the arrivals, but also home office decision making. john notjust the arrivals, but also home office decision making.— office decision making. john reed all those years — office decision making. john reed all those years ago _ office decision making. john reed all those years ago said _ office decision making. john reed all those years ago said the i office decision making. john reed all those years ago said the home office was not fit for purpose and many people say that hasn't particularly changed and there are calls to you know separate it and have one bit deal with policeling and another to deal with immigration. kelvin, you have made a lot of points and i am pleased you got in touch because you are making points a lot of people in the texts just one. points a lot of people in the texts just one. ~ ., ., ., �* ., just one. want to go bernadette, if i aet a

just one. want to go bernadette, if i get a chance _ just one. want to go bernadette, if i get a chance i _ just one. want to go bernadette, if i get a chance i will— just one. want to go bernadette, if i get a chance i will come _ just one. want to go bernadette, if i get a chance i will come back - just one. want to go bernadette, if i get a chance i will come back to i i get a chance i will come back to you. bernadette? i i get a chance i will come back to you. bernadette?— i get a chance i will come back to you. bernadette? ivery quickly, i 'ust want you. bernadette? ivery quickly, i just want to _ you. bernadette? ivery quickly, i just want to make _ you. bernadette? ivery quickly, i just want to make a _ you. bernadette? ivery quickly, i just want to make a couple - you. bernadette? ivery quickly, i just want to make a couple of- you. bernadette? ivery quickly, i. just want to make a couple of point, i live in uk for last 20 years. i work for nhs for last ten years as a nurse, and i always up to today, i feel like immigration is always presented like a disease of this country. you very rarely put anything positive about immigration, we always present it in this bad light, you know, we always take everything, we claim benefits and not working, so that i would say the majority of your people have about immigration, and secondly, ifind interesting but as brexit, the view about immigration has changed and people start to recognise the benefit of immigration, because they can actually feel what this mean, shortage of labour, what it means

when you go to shop and the prices are going up and up and up. and immigration ina are going up and up and up. and immigration in a way contributes as well to those prices. so that... do ou well to those prices. so that... do you experience on a personal level, kind of hostility, antipathy you have been here forever, to years did you say? == have been here forever, to years did ou sa ? :: , . , have been here forever, to years did ousa? ii, have been here forever, to years did ousa? you say? -- 20 years did you say on sinule, you say? -- 20 years did you say on single. single _ you say? -- 20 years did you say on single. single day. _ you say? -- 20 years did you say on single, single day, you _ you say? -- 20 years did you say on single, single day, you know, - you say? -- 20 years did you say on single, single day, you know, every| single, single day, you know, every single, single day, you know, every single day, you do, and, it is sad, i am not saying that, you know every single time you have a contact with another people, but very often, yes. an atmosphere? another people, but very often, yes. an atmosphere?_ another people, but very often, yes. an atmosphere? yes, or somebody will sa like, an atmosphere? yes, or somebody will say like. you — an atmosphere? yes, or somebody will say like. you 0k — an atmosphere? yes, or somebody will say like, you ok because _ an atmosphere? yes, or somebody will say like, you ok because you _ an atmosphere? yes, or somebody will say like, you ok because you are - say like, you ok because you are working but there is other immigrant, iam immigrant working but there is other immigrant, i am immigrant as well. i immigrant, iam immigrant as well. i always immigrant, i am immigrant as well. i always work, i have my own house, you know, i have two children, who i

raised on my own, ifeel sad about the fact i work so hard and despite that i always have been seen like this immigrant who shouldn't be here. 50 this immigrant who shouldn't be here, ., ., this immigrant who shouldn't be here. ., ., this immigrant who shouldn't be here, ., ., y., “ this immigrant who shouldn't be here. ., ., ~ ., here. so what do you think about the lanauuae here. so what do you think about the language that _ here. so what do you think about the language that politicians _ here. so what do you think about the language that politicians use - here. so what do you think about the language that politicians use about i language that politicians use about this? that must make you given where you are coming from... i this? that must make you given where you are coming from. . ._ you are coming from... i think politicians _ you are coming from... i think politicians should _ you are coming from... i think politicians should be - you are coming from... i think politicians should be extra - you are coming from... i think - politicians should be extra careful, the way they speak about immigration and we all remember for instance borisjohnson, how many millions of the nhs will get after we get, you know, when we get out of eu. we have to now think how accurate this flftion actually was.

is it just is itjust using immigration as a hot topic to get what they want? i wish you well. you guys are looking with great interest on laptops, is there anything you can tell us? or have you drifted off? i there anything you can tell us? or have you drifted off?— have you drifted off? i have been sent an e-mail_ have you drifted off? i have been sent an e-mail from _ have you drifted off? i have been sent an e-mail from a _ have you drifted off? i have been sent an e-mail from a contact . have you drifted off? i have been sent an e-mail from a contact in| sent an e—mailfrom a contact in immigration, buried in the figures is a hint that the numbers may be coming down, because the last figures we had were tojune, the ons have published figures to the end of the year. he is telling me that in between then, the numbers went up and then they came down a little bit towards the end of the year. so they peaked in septemberfor towards the end of the year. so they peaked in september for the year to september, and now they are drifting down. as we have been saying, there is reason to believe the numbers will come down, fewer people coming from ukraine, a variety of other things going on. maybe not at the speeds and people would hope, but the record we are seeing is for a calendar year. 2022 is the highest ever. that is why i got into the laptop very quickly. it may not be the most super fascinating,

laptop very quickly. it may not be the most superfascinating, sorry... it all adds to the picture. every pixel makes a picture. i it all adds to the picture. every pixel makes a picture.- it all adds to the picture. every pixel makes a picture. i have so many spreadsheets _ pixel makes a picture. i have so many spreadsheets i _ pixel makes a picture. i have so many spreadsheets i could - pixel makes a picture. i have so| many spreadsheets i could show pixel makes a picture. i have so - many spreadsheets i could show you. we could spend hours doing a xl phone and, if you ever have time. —— excel. phone and, if you ever have time. -- excel. ~ . ~ , phone and, if you ever have time. -- excel. ~ ., ~ , ., , ., excel. we are keeping an eye on the house of commons, _ excel. we are keeping an eye on the house of commons, the _ excel. we are keeping an eye on the house of commons, the shadow - excel. we are keeping an eye on the i house of commons, the shadow home secretary yvette cooper is set to ask an urgent question of the government very soon. we are on it, don't worry. david in the isle of dogs, hello. don't worry. david in the isle of dogs. hell0-_ don't worry. david in the isle of l dogs, hello._ good dogs, hello. good morning. good mornin: dogs, hello. good morning. good morning to _ dogs, hello. good morning. good morning to you- _ dogs, hello. good morning. good morning to you. your _ dogs, hello. good morning. good morning to you. your considered | morning to you. your considered thoughts? morning to you. your considered thou~hts? ~ ., ., ., , thoughts? well, immigration has never been _ thoughts? well, immigration has never been good _ thoughts? well, immigration has never been good for _ thoughts? well, immigration has never been good for the - thoughts? well, immigration has i never been good for the indigenous working class people of this country. because when there are 600,000 immigrants, nobody builds a 600,000 immigrants, nobody builds a 600,000 new homes, nobody supplies 600,000 new homes, nobody supplies 600,000 new homes, nobody supplies 600,000 new school places, new

university places, or even 600,000 newjobs. and so therefore when people are coming in, they drag on the services. and that's no fault of their�*s, it is ourfault, because the services. and that's no fault of their�*s, it is our fault, because we don't plan immigration. therefore, we end up with people that we don't necessarily need or whatever. you know, you talk about fruit pickers, but we also need scientists and engineers. there should be the priority system. let engineers. there should be the priority system-— engineers. there should be the priority system. let me ask you this, this word _ priority system. let me ask you this, this word indigenous, - priority system. let me ask you this, this word indigenous, it i priority system. let me ask you this, this word indigenous, it is| this, this word indigenous, it is kind of loaded. isn't it? what does it actually mean? it kind of loaded. isn't it? what does it actually mean?— it actually mean? it means the --eole it actually mean? it means the people that — it actually mean? it means the people that are _ it actually mean? it means the people that are already - it actually mean? it means the people that are already here. i it actually mean? it means the i people that are already here. we it actually mean? it means the - people that are already here. we are all immigrants, these islands have grown that way. but the point is, the people that are paying taxes for years and years, their interests are not looked after. business always

has their say, we want cheaper labour, you have cheaper labour by having people in from immigration. maybe these businesses should think about their training programmes, what happens to adult education programmes? why do we have so many universities nowadays churning out people with sociology degrees, and not skills of plumbers? because most of those universities used to be technical colleges. you of those universities used to be technical colleges.— of those universities used to be technical colleges. you are echoing much of what _ technical colleges. you are echoing much of what suella _ technical colleges. you are echoing much of what suella braverman - technical colleges. you are echoing| much of what suella braverman was saying in a speech last week. thank you. we are quickly going to go to the news. all views welcome. numbers on effects on — the news. all views welcome. numbers on effects on locals, _ the news. all views welcome. numbers on effects on locals, the _ the news. all views welcome. numbers on effects on locals, the data _ the news. all views welcome. numbers on effects on locals, the data is - on effects on locals, the data is not great on wager facts. migration is probably a little bit good for people who are in grad jobs, not great for people on lower paid jobs. the fact is estimated at ip or 2p per hour in wage, so not massive,

but the data is not super conclusive. the government have been missing home—building targets for years and years, aiming for 300,000, nowhere near. there are two ways to deal with that, let less people in or build more houses. we deal with that, let less people in or build more houses. we should look at the effect — or build more houses. we should look at the effect on _ or build more houses. we should look at the effect on public _ or build more houses. we should look at the effect on public services, - at the effect on public services, people say the use of the nhs, what about people who work in the nhs? here is yvette cooper. to about people who work in the nhs? here is yvette cooper.— here is yvette cooper. to make a statement _ here is yvette cooper. to make a statement of _ here is yvette cooper. to make a statement of net _ here is yvette cooper. to make a statement of net migration - here is yvette cooper. to make a | statement of net migration figures today _ statement of net migration figures toda . ., ., ., today. net migration to the united kinudom is today. net migration to the united kingdom is far _ today. net migration to the united kingdom is far too _ today. net migration to the united kingdom is far too high. _ today. net migration to the united kingdom is far too high. that - today. net migration to the united kingdom is far too high. that was l kingdom is far too high. that was already clearfrom the kingdom is far too high. that was already clear from the previous set of official data. the ons have today amended their previously published estimate for the year ending june 2022, to 606,000. the statistics published today indicate that net migration has flatlined since then.

in the year ending december 2022, they estimate that net migration remains at 606,000. these particularly high figures are, in large part, due to temporary and exceptional factors such as the uk's ukraine and hong kong schemes. last year, 150,000 hong kong british nationals overseas made use of that. these schemes command broad support for the british public, and we were right to introduce them. the government remains committed to reducing migration to sustainable levels. that was a solid promise we made in our manifesto and we are unwavering in our determination to deliver it. this week, we announced

steps to tackle the substantial rise in the number of student dependents coming to the uk. the package of measures will ensure that we can reduce migration whilst continuing to benefit from the skills and resources our economy needs. because universities should be in the education business, not the immigration business. we expect this package to have a tangible impact on net migration. taken together with the easing of temporary factors like our exceptional humanitarian offers, we expect net migration to fall to pre—pandemic levels in the medium term. mr speaker, the public rightly expect us to control our borders. whether that is stopping the boats and addressing illegal migration, or whether it is ensuring levels of legal migration do not place undue pressure on public services, on housing supply or integration. the government market was taking decisive action on both counts.

under the points—based system, that we have reduced post—brexit, we can control immigration, we must control immigration and we will.— immigration and we will. thank you, mr speaker- — immigration and we will. thank you, mr speaker. today's _ immigration and we will. thank you, mr speaker. today's extraordinary i mr speaker. today's extraordinary figures, _ mr speaker. today's extraordinary figures, including doubling the number— figures, including doubling the number of work visas since the pandemic, _ number of work visas since the pandemic, show that the conservatives have no plan and no -rip conservatives have no plan and no grip on _ conservatives have no plan and no grip on immigration. they show the chaos_ grip on immigration. they show the chaos in— grip on immigration. they show the chaos in this — grip on immigration. they show the chaos in this government. work visas are up— chaos in this government. work visas are up 119% _ chaos in this government. work visas are up 119% since before the pandemic. conservatives have totally failed _ pandemic. conservatives have totally failed to _ pandemic. conservatives have totally failed to tackle endemic skill shortages and get people back to work _ shortages and get people back to work. net migration is more than twice _ work. net migration is more than twice the — work. net migration is more than twice the level that ministers were aiming _ twice the level that ministers were aiming for. — twice the level that ministers were aiming for, and considerably more than that, — aiming for, and considerably more than that, compared to the home secretary's claimed aims. the asylum backlog _ secretary's claimed aims. the asylum backlog is— secretary's claimed aims. the asylum backlog is at — secretary's claimed aims. the asylum backlog is at a record high. the opposite — backlog is at a record high. the opposite of the prime minister's promised — opposite of the prime minister's promised to clear the backlog this year~ _ promised to clear the backlog this year~ i'm — promised to clear the backlog this year. i'm less than 1% of last

year's — year. i'm less than 1% of last year's small boat arrivals have had a decision — year's small boat arrivals have had a decision. yet where is the home secretary. — a decision. yet where is the home secretary, who is in charge of these policies? _ secretary, who is in charge of these policies? she has gone to ground. there _ policies? she has gone to ground. there are — policies? she has gone to ground. there are reports she is not going to do— there are reports she is not going to do media, she has not come to this house. — to do media, she has not come to this house, she is on internal meetings, _ this house, she is on internal meetings, presumably more private courses— meetings, presumably more private courses arranged by the civil servants _ courses arranged by the civil servants. what is the point of her? net migration should come down, and we would _ net migration should come down, and we would expect it to do so. but the continued _ we would expect it to do so. but the continued gap between the government's rhetoric and the reality— government's rhetoric and the reality is— government's rhetoric and the reality is very damaging. rightly, the uk _ reality is very damaging. rightly, the uk has given support ukraine and hon- the uk has given support ukraine and hong kong, and rightly we welcome international students who bring substantial benefits. changes in family— substantial benefits. changes in family are sensible. international recruitment will always be important, so we get the skills and talent _ important, so we get the skills and talent we _ important, so we get the skills and talent we need. this is a major increase — talent we need. this is a major increase in— talent we need. this is a major increase in employers turning to overseas — increase in employers turning to overseas recruitment, and the government market has no plan to increase _ government market has no plan to increase training or properly tackle the skill— increase training or properly tackle the skill shortages from here at home —

the skill shortages from here at home on — the skill shortages from here at home. on health and social care, one of the _ home. on health and social care, one of the biggest areas, why will he not agreed to labour's plan to increase — not agreed to labour's plan to increase the training for nurses and doctors _ increase the training for nurses and doctors in _ increase the training for nurses and doctors in the uk, paid for by getting — doctors in the uk, paid for by getting rid of the non—dom exemption? will he ditch the unfair 20% wage — exemption? will he ditch the unfair 20% wage discount that means shortage — 20% wage discount that means shortage occupations can actually undercut — shortage occupations can actually undercut and pay below the going rate, _ undercut and pay below the going rate, making it even harder to get the training — rate, making it even harder to get the training and skills, the fair recruitment that we need? everyone should _ recruitment that we need? everyone should he _ recruitment that we need? everyone should be paid the going rate. mr deputy— should be paid the going rate. mr deputy speaker, there has been no action— deputy speaker, there has been no action at— deputy speaker, there has been no action at all to address the huge backlog — action at all to address the huge backlog in— action at all to address the huge backlog in the asylum system, to make _ backlog in the asylum system, to make sure — backlog in the asylum system, to make sure that claims are properly processed — make sure that claims are properly processed. we need immigration, it is important — processed. we need immigration, it is important to this country, and we need _ is important to this country, and we need a _ is important to this country, and we need a system that works. but it has to he _ need a system that works. but it has to be properly controlled and managed, ratherthan to be properly controlled and managed, rather than the chaos that the government has created. thank ou, mr the government has created. thank you. mr speaker- — the government has created. thank you, mr speaker. the _ the government has created. thank

you, mr speaker. the labour- the government has created. thank you, mr speaker. the labour party | you, mr speaker. the labour party feigns interest in cutting net migration, but i can assure the right honourable lady that nobody is buying it. last week, the chair of the labour party said that under labour net migration would go up in the short term, the leader of the labour party stood on a campaign pledge to defend freedom of movement if the uk remained outside of the eu. he said that there is a racist undercurrent which permeates all immigration laws. does the home secretary agree with that. at every possible opportunity, labour have voted against every measure that this government has brought forward to control migration. they voted against ending free movement, and at every turn they voted against measures to tackle illegal migration. just recently, they voted against the illegal migration bill. because the truth is, mr speaker,

the labour party have no interest in controlled and orderly migration. the conservative party is taking tangible steps to bring down net migration. yesterday, we took a decisive step to clamp down on student dependents, because universities should be selling education, not immigration. belatedly, the shadow home secretary says she agrees with that. mr speaker, the conservative party made a solemn promise to the british public to reduce net migration. in and it carries on on the parliament channel, a solemn promise to reduce net migration and tangible steps are being taken. i believe there is some interesting stuff coming out between the lines? robert the interesting stuff coming out between the lines? robe- the lines? robert the start of the statement. _ the lines? robert the start of the

statement, he _ the lines? robert the start of the statement, he said _ the lines? robert the start of the statement, he said that - the lines? robert the start of the statement, he said that it - the lines? robert the start of the statement, he said that it had - statement, he said that it had flatlined, the same as it was as reported injune. if you have an eagle eyed memory, you will remember what we were talking about in november about the figures published injune, this doesn't sound right. but what has actually happened is that the ons, the people that produce the figures, they have revised the june figures upwards for last year, so that is why the story has kind of mcdonnell changed a bit. migration for 2022 is the highest we have ever seen. record numbers are added to the uk population. at that peakis added to the uk population. at that peak is not cruising upward throughout the year, it seemed to get close to the peak injune, go up a little bit in september and come back down a bit. the reason why the figures have changed is because, if you forgive me, to get into a real stats rabbit hole, we used to estimate it on the basis of asking people when they came through airports, do you plan to stay for a year? the ons will talk about 4000 people per year and base estimates on that. that system was starting to creak. hundreds of millions of

people come through airports every year, talking to 4000 will not give a great picture. they started to pull together lots of data from the tax and benefit system, visas, flight data on universities, to try to make a picture migration. but it's like putting together a jigsaw puzzle, with pieces from different boxes. what they do as they keep on going as they are advised of the figures, as the numbers get better, they are adding asylum seekers now in a different source of information, so the figures will change a little bit as we go forwards. so, back to the main picture, 2022, record year, probably flattening out. picture, 2022, record year, probably flattening out-— flattening out. fatima in london, ton in flattening out. fatima in london, tony in birmingham, _ flattening out. fatima in london, tony in birmingham, and - flattening out. fatima in london, - tony in birmingham, and muhammad in ealing. let's go with you, first of all, mohammed. what is your experience? all, mohammed. what is your experience?— all, mohammed. what is your exerience? ., experience? good morning, nicky. i don't know— experience? good morning, nicky. i don't know where _ experience? good morning, nicky. i don't know where to _ experience? good morning, nicky. i don't know where to start, - experience? good morning, nicky. i| don't know where to start, honestly. first of all, a bit of background. i've been in the uk for almost ten years, roughly. ifirst came in

2011, bound these years count towards british citizenship. 2019, i am doing my masters, with my partner, who is not british but she has a settled status and is now my fiance. after doing my masters, i found a job here in london, they gave me a working visa, which was great. usually you need five years to get british citizenship. so i've got roughly about two years left. unfortunately, i have to change jobs, which means i don't have a skilled worker visa, so i need to sort myself out. i have to find a job that will give me a sponsored visa, or i need to switch on to my partner, spouse visa. so, what do i need to do? i need to be on to the spouse visa, on its own, it's a bit weird, you need to prove your

relationship, you need to show them photos, have information from people that know you. fine, i can get my head around that. no problem. but what is shocking to me is that if i do get onto the spouse visa, my years of citizenship start all over again, from zero. just because i'm not on the same type of visa. it's a bit strange. you are earning money, paying taxes, you have been here five years, you get citizenship. why do they need to go about embarrassing people by choosing the visa and how to prove their relationship with their spouse? it's a bit too much. in my personal experience, the home office has been terrible, extremely unhelpful. they talk about the need to reduce net migration. my recent experience, which will make yourjaw drop, i was

on a trip to lisbon, six months ago, and i was not allowed to come back to the uk because i lost this card. not even my passport, my british identity card. not even my passport, my british identity card-— not even my passport, my british identity card. what did they say to ou? you identity card. what did they say to you? you went — identity card. what did they say to you? you went through _ identity card. what did they say to you? you went through customs i identity card. what did they say to i you? you went through customs and they said, hang on? ida. you? you went through customs and they said, hang on?— they said, hang on? no, the airline said i don't — they said, hang on? no, the airline said i don't have _ they said, hang on? no, the airline said i don't have the _ they said, hang on? no, the airline said i don't have the brp, - they said, hang on? no, the airline said i don't have the brp, i - they said, hang on? no, the airline said i don't have the brp, i had - they said, hang on? no, the airline said i don't have the brp, i had to| said i don't have the brp, i had to go to spain, apply for an emergency visa, which they only gave me for single entry, one day entry to the uk, and that took about six weeks for me to wait in madrid, to get the emergency visa. bear in mind i am a uk resident, i have a house and job here. funnily enough, i owed my own house, it is not like i am renting orany house, it is not like i am renting or any of that. i'm also an investor here in the uk. back to my point, i had to fly to madrid, emergency visa, wait six weeks for the emergency visa, which allowed me to come to the uk on a single entry,

and bear in mind, this process, twice, i had to fly back to the uk, go to another immigration centre, get my fingerprints all over again. and then to be told i need to wait 12 weeks for my brp to be sent to my home address. in those 12 weeks, i am not allowed to leave the uk. so overall, as a resident, who travel abroad and lose your card, the risk you are not allowed to come back in for at least another eight weeks, until they check your fingerprints, then they have your passport. that has ureatl then they have your passport. that has greatly added to the sum of human knowledge. fatima, hi. iii. human knowledge. fatima, hi. hi, aood human knowledge. fatima, hi. hi , good morning. human knowledge. fatima, hi. hi, good morning. good _ human knowledge. fatima, hi. hi, good morning. good morning. - human knowledge. fatima, hi. hi, | good morning. good morning. what human knowledge. fatima, hi. hi, - good morning. good morning. what you want to say? — good morning. good morning. what you want to say? oh. _ good morning. good morning. what you want to say? oh, ok. _ good morning. good morning. what you want to say? oh, ok. i— good morning. good morning. what you want to say? oh, ok. i am _ good morning. good morning. what you want to say? oh, ok. i am an _ good morning. good morning. what you want to say? oh, ok. i am an asylum i want to say? oh, ok. i am an asylum seeker, want to say? oh, ok. i am an asylum seeker. me — want to say? oh, ok. i am an asylum seeker. me and _ want to say? oh, ok. i am an asylum seeker, me and my _

want to say? oh, ok. i am an asylum seeker, me and my husband. - seeker, me and my husband. we arrived into the uk here in december 20, 2020, and half a year later. we are still waiting for the results of our asylum cases, which is very difficult from any point of view, but psychologically especially. during this time we have been separated three times, although we have been living together for 30 years. so, it's very very complicated. it's notjust the problem of the british nation, how to accept immigration and what to do with my case, but it's also difficult for any asylum seekers, any migrants. the process is really... we are russian, it is killing, psychologically. in the

meantime, i wanted to mention that we are not young people, we are over 50. the vetting process is also deaf we came here to work, not to be retired, you know? everything in our lives, it means that we are having less chances to get life's work and our hopes. that is why it is a problem also, for any asylum seeker, between each other, you know? psychologically.— between each other, you know? ps cholouicall . , ., ., psychologically. these are important oints to psychologically. these are important points to put — psychologically. these are important points to put to _ psychologically. these are important points to put to our— psychologically. these are important points to put to our exploits - psychologically. these are important points to put to our exploits in - points to put to our exploits in just a second. —— our experts. fatima and mohammed, thank you. tony in manchester, steve, i will be right with you. getting as many voices as we can on this. tony, good morning. fire away.—

morning. fire away. good morning. where are you _ morning. fire away. good morning. where are you from _ morning. fire away. good morning. where are you from originally? - morning. fire away. good morning. | where are you from originally? from malawi. i where are you from originally? from malawi- i came _ where are you from originally? from malawi. i came here _ where are you from originally? from malawi. i came here in _ where are you from originally? f'frr’n malawi. i came here in 2005. with my family. it was under protection. i have lived here for 18 years. —— eight years. and i got my qualifications. and then i applied for the first time, and you have to live in the united kingdom to qualify. i was still waiting outside for three years to do that. i see the government complaining about a shortage of nurses. we have tried

also. why don't they try something like that, to address the shortage? another really telling tradition. steve in bristol?— another really telling tradition. - steve in bristol?_ what steve in bristol? how are you? what is our steve in bristol? how are you? what is your reaction _ steve in bristol? how are you? what is your reaction to _ steve in bristol? how are you? what is your reaction to what _ steve in bristol? how are you? what is your reaction to what you're - is your reaction to what you're hearing? if is your reaction to what you're hearina ? . , is your reaction to what you're hearina ? ., , , ., , ., hearing? it was interesting how you ose the hearing? it was interesting how you pose the question, _ hearing? it was interesting how you pose the question, does _ hearing? it was interesting how you | pose the question, does immigration work for— pose the question, does immigration work for you? — pose the question, does immigration work foryou? i— pose the question, does immigration work for you? i see _ pose the question, does immigration work for you? i see yet _ pose the question, does immigration work for you? i see yet more - pose the question, does immigration work for you? i see yet more about. work for you? i see yet more about this massive — work for you? i see yet more about this massive population— work for you? i see yet more about this massive population growth. i work for you? i see yet more aboutl this massive population growth. the rough _ this massive population growth. the rough population— this massive population growth. the rough population figure _ this massive population growth. the rough population figure is _ this massive population growth. the| rough population figure is something like half— rough population figure is something like half a _ rough population figure is something like half a million _ rough population figure is something like half a million deaths _ rough population figure is something like half a million deaths in - rough population figure is something like half a million deaths in 2022, i like half a million deaths in 2022, the birth— like half a million deaths in 2022, the birth rate _ like half a million deaths in 2022, the birth rate is _ like half a million deaths in 2022, the birth rate is 620,000. - like half a million deaths in 2022, the birth rate is 620,000. add i like half a million deaths in 2022, i the birth rate is 620,000. add that to 600,000. — the birth rate is 620,000. add that to 600.000. your— the birth rate is 620,000. add that to 600,000, your population- the birth rate is 620,000. add that to 600,000, your population is- to 600,000, your population is increasing — to 600,000, your population is increasing lry— to 600,000, your population is increasing by a _ to 600,000, your population is increasing by a massive - to 600,000, your population is increasing by a massive amount to 600,000, your population is- increasing by a massive amount each year~ _ increasing by a massive amount each year~ its— increasing by a massive amount each year~ it's fine — increasing by a massive amount each year~ it's fine to _ increasing by a massive amount each year. it's fine to say _ increasing by a massive amount each year. it's fine to say we _ increasing by a massive amount each year. it's fine to say we need - increasing by a massive amount each year. it's fine to say we need to - year. it's fine to say we need to build _ year. it's fine to say we need to build more _ year. it's fine to say we need to build more houses, _ year. it's fine to say we need to build more houses, nobody- year. it's fine to say we need to i build more houses, nobody really questions — build more houses, nobody really questions the _ build more houses, nobody really questions the impact _ build more houses, nobody really questions the impact on - build more houses, nobody really questions the impact on the - questions the impact on the environment. _ questions the impact on the environment. you _ questions the impact on the environment. you know, . questions the impact on the environment. you know, allj questions the impact on the . environment. you know, all of questions the impact on the - environment. you know, all of this has to— environment. you know, all of this has to he _ environment. you know, all of this has to he built _ environment. you know, all of this has to be built in _ environment. you know, all of this has to be built in green _ environment. you know, all of this has to be built in green space, - has to be built in green space, fields, — has to be built in green space, fields, little — has to be built in green space, fields, little woodland, - has to be built in green space, fields, little woodland, all- has to be built in green space, i fields, little woodland, all being destroyed — fields, little woodland, all being destroyed on— fields, little woodland, all being destroyed on a _ fields, little woodland, all being destroyed on a regular- fields, little woodland, all being destroyed on a regular basis, i

fields, little woodland, all being i destroyed on a regular basis, with fields, little woodland, all being - destroyed on a regular basis, with a increase _ destroyed on a regular basis, with a increase year—on—year. _ destroyed on a regular basis, with a increase year—on—year. that's - destroyed on a regular basis, with a increase year—on—year. that's the i increase year—on—year. that's the worry— increase year—on—year. that's the worry i_ increase year—on—year. that's the worry i do— increase year—on—year. that's the worry i do have _ increase year—on—year. that's the worry i do have, the _ increase year—on—year. that's the worry i do have, the overall- worry i do have, the overall population— worry i do have, the overall population increase - worry i do have, the overall population increase in - worry i do have, the overall population increase in the i worry i do have, the overall- population increase in the country that is— population increase in the country that is primarily— population increase in the country that is primarily driven _ population increase in the country that is primarily driven by- that is primarily driven by immigration _ that is primarily driven by immigration and - that is primarily driven by immigration and the - that is primarily driven by. immigration and the impact that is primarily driven by- immigration and the impact on our own environment. _ immigration and the impact on our own environment. how _ immigration and the impact on our own environment. how do - immigration and the impact on our own environment. how do we - immigration and the impact on our| own environment. how do we want immigration and the impact on our. own environment. how do we want to live? _ own environment. how do we want to live? what— own environment. how do we want to live? what is— own environment. how do we want to live? what is the _ own environment. how do we want to live? what is the world _ own environment. how do we want to live? what is the world want - own environment. how do we want to live? what is the world want to - own environment. how do we want to live? what is the world want to live i live? what is the world want to live in? 0n— live? what is the world want to live in? on a _ live? what is the world want to live in? on a very— live? what is the world want to live in? on a very small— live? what is the world want to live in? on a very small landmass. - live? what is the world want to live in? on a very small landmass. an. in? on a very small landmass. an increasingly— in? on a very small landmass. an increasingly dense _ in? on a very small landmass. an increasingly dense population. . in? on a very small landmass. an increasingly dense population. i. increasingly dense population. i have _ increasingly dense population. i have visited _ increasingly dense population. i have visited cities _ increasingly dense population. i have visited cities like - increasingly dense population. i have visited cities like tokyo . increasingly dense population. ll have visited cities like tokyo and other— have visited cities like tokyo and other places _ have visited cities like tokyo and other places in _ have visited cities like tokyo and other places in the _ have visited cities like tokyo and other places in the world, - have visited cities like tokyo and other places in the world, and ii have visited cities like tokyo and i other places in the world, and i do worry— other places in the world, and i do worry about — other places in the world, and i do worry about how— other places in the world, and i do worry about how that _ other places in the world, and i do worry about how that will - other places in the world, and i do worry about how that will affect i worry about how that will affect people's — worry about how that will affect people's lives _ worry about how that will affect people's lives in _ worry about how that will affect people's lives in future. - worry about how that will affect people's lives in future.- worry about how that will affect people's lives in future. what is the word. _ people's lives in future. what is the word, megalopolis? - people's lives in future. what is the word, megalopolis? i- people's lives in future. what is the word, megalopolis? i live i people's lives in future. what isj the word, megalopolis? i live in bristol, there _ the word, megalopolis? i live in bristol, there is _ the word, megalopolis? i live in bristol, there is a _ the word, megalopolis? i live in bristol, there is a periphery - the word, megalopolis? i live in bristol, there is a periphery of l bristol, there is a periphery of little _ bristol, there is a periphery of little towns. _ bristol, there is a periphery of little towns. there _ bristol, there is a periphery of little towns. there are - bristol, there is a periphery of| little towns. there are massive house—building _ little towns. there are massive house—building projects - little towns. there are massive house—building projects in - little towns. there are massive . house—building projects in towns, expanding — house—building projects in towns, expanding into _ house—building projects in towns, expanding into the _ house—building projects in towns, expanding into the green - house—building projects in towns, expanding into the green belt. . house—building projects in towns, i expanding into the green belt. years a-o expanding into the green belt. years ago they— expanding into the green belt. years ago they were — expanding into the green belt. years ago they were warning _ expanding into the green belt. years ago they were warning about - expanding into the green belt. years ago they were warning about the - ago they were warning about the impact _ ago they were warning about the impact of— ago they were warning about the impact of human— ago they were warning about the impact of human population - ago they were warning about the - impact of human population growth. one other— impact of human population growth. one other point _ impact of human population growth. one other point i _ impact of human population growth. one other point i want _ impact of human population growth. one other point i want to— impact of human population growth. one other point i want to make, - one other point i want to make, nothing — one other point i want to make, nothing to— one other point i want to make, nothing to do _ one other point i want to make, nothing to do the _ one other point i want to make, nothing to do the environment. i one other point i want to make, i nothing to do the environment. if

your population _ nothing to do the environment. if your population perceives - nothing to do the environment. if your population perceives that. nothing to do the environment. if. your population perceives that your government— your population perceives that your government has— your population perceives that your government has an _ your population perceives that your government has an out—of—controll government has an out—of—control immigration — government has an out—of—control immigration policy, _ government has an out—of—control immigration policy, that— government has an out—of—control immigration policy, that it - government has an out—of—control immigration policy, that it is - government has an out—of—control immigration policy, that it is not i immigration policy, that it is not controlled, — immigration policy, that it is not controlled, i_ immigration policy, that it is not controlled, i wonder— immigration policy, that it is not controlled, i wonder that - immigration policy, that it is not controlled, i wonder that people immigration policy, that it is not. controlled, i wonder that people do move _ controlled, i wonder that people do move towards — controlled, i wonder that people do move towards extreme _ controlled, i wonder that people do move towards extreme viewpoints, | move towards extreme viewpoints, towards _ move towards extreme viewpoints, towards the — move towards extreme viewpoints, towards the far— move towards extreme viewpoints, towards the far right. _ move towards extreme viewpoints, towards the far right. if _ move towards extreme viewpoints, towards the far right. if they- towards the far right. if they perceive _ towards the far right. if they perceive that— towards the far right. if they perceive that you _ towards the far right. if they perceive that you don't - towards the far right. if they perceive that you don't havei towards the far right. if they. perceive that you don't have a towards the far right. if they- perceive that you don't have a grip on it _ perceive that you don't have a grip on it. , , l, perceive that you don't have a grip on it. , , a, perceive that you don't have a grip on it. , h, , on it. they exploit it, absolutely. i said that _ on it. they exploit it, absolutely. i said that earlier— on it. they exploit it, absolutely. i said that earlier on, _ on it. they exploit it, absolutely. i said that earlier on, but - on it. they exploit it, absolutely. i said that earlier on, but the - on it. they exploit it, absolutely. i i said that earlier on, but the wave of political populism. it's a legitimate concern, we live in one of the most nature depleted countries on the planet. let's take one more, then we will get thoughts of robert and dominic as well. nonah in birmingham, tell us about your family? mr; in birmingham, tell us about your famil ? y . family? my son arrived in the uk in 2020, at family? my son arrived in the uk in 2020. at a — family? my son arrived in the uk in 2020. at a time — family? my son arrived in the uk in 2020, at a time there _ family? my son arrived in the uk in 2020, at a time there were - family? my son arrived in the uk in 2020, at a time there were 12 - family? my son arrived in the uk in 2020, at a time there were 12 and l 2020, at a time there were 12 and 13, and they have lived here ever since, and they have never left the country. they applied for asylum on arrival from africa. they attended school in finished school, and they could not accept student finance because it is only for british

people, immigrants are not allowed to access student finance. by the grace of god, some churches put money together for one of our sons, who is hard—working and intelligent, and he managed to go to do film production and media pa. when he finished his first year, because he did so well, he was granted century bursary to finish his degree. 50 the church only had to pay for one year. he has finished now, he graduated, he is sitting at home and cannot wait because of it till now it has been almost ten years later, still fighting the asylum system, we are not approved and allowed to work. still? , , ., ., still? just sitting at home, the bo s are still? just sitting at home, the boys are sitting _ still? just sitting at home, the boys are sitting at _ still? just sitting at home, the boys are sitting at home. - still? just sitting at home, the boys are sitting at home. i'm l still? just sitting at home, the i boys are sitting at home. i'm not working, i'm not allowed to work. they met a girl at university of the goal is to go to spain, but they can't go to spain because they don't have a passport. they keep being

refused and refused. year in, year out. they will be ten years in this country in september, in the next few months. but we don't even know what is going to happen. wejust live on the £36 that we get. which is not the ideal life that we wanted. if we have been given leave to remain in this country, surely i will work, surely my children will work so that they can have a better life. and use what they have learned in the education system of the uk. so, immigration is definitely not working for me and my family, it's not working for many people who are in this country. there is a belief in this country. there is a belief in people from the uk that we are here to take free money. that is not what we want. we have professions before we left our country. and i would do anything to leave the house and go to work, and make my own money, ratherthan and go to work, and make my own money, rather than sitting in the house that is leaking, that i cannot

do anything about, because i must wait 4g —— gas or do anything about, because i must wait ag —— gas or serco, when i could do it myself i was working. they need to have a bank account, might sons do not even have a bank account because they are not allowed. ., ., ., ,, , ., account because they are not allowed. ., ., ., ,, . ., account because they are not allowed. ., ., ., . ., ., allowed. nonah, thank you. what an interestin: allowed. nonah, thank you. what an interesting array _ allowed. nonah, thank you. what an interesting array of _ allowed. nonah, thank you. what an interesting array of callers, - allowed. nonah, thank you. what an interesting array of callers, i - interesting array of callers, i suppose you could call them case studies. fantastic, that these people have got in touch. you used the word creaking earlier on. we haven't got a statement specifically on these cases from the home office. but it doesn't sound coming from our callers and contributors, that the system is working incredibly well? two big stories, one is the big increase in net migration that has been trailed for days, and the other is the real evidence of problems in the asylum system that nonah typifies. she's been waiting for ten

years, the number of those waiting with their lives on hold, waiting for their first asylum decision, before they even go to appeal, that has gone up to 20,000. the few promised to bring that down, and it's not happening. they are increasing the staffing, but it is not coming through. the other story, the net migration number, one thing to emphasise, it does look as if it is starting to come down and you would expect it to, hopefully the situation in ukraine balances out. if you see a big rise of students coming in, you will see a big rise in people leaving. taste coming in, you will see a big rise in people leaving.— coming in, you will see a big rise in people leaving. we are hearing heartbreak _ in people leaving. we are hearing heartbreak for _ in people leaving. we are hearing heartbreak for many _ in people leaving. we are hearing heartbreak for many people - in people leaving. we are hearing l heartbreak for many people coming in people leaving. we are hearing - heartbreak for many people coming to this country. fin heartbreak for many people coming to this count . heartbreak for many people coming to this country-— this country. on the net migration fiuure, this country. on the net migration figure. two _ this country. on the net migration figure, two interesting _ this country. on the net migration figure, two interesting pieces - this country. on the net migration figure, two interesting pieces of l figure, two interesting pieces of correspondence from independent experts who have been messaging me and robert, to basically say, look, everybody should stop panicking about this, it's a high water mark, it will come down, partly because of ukraine. those numbers will become a

trickle. but the delays in students of students due to the pandemic, they say those numbers are likely to increase. so, measures such as the kurds on family members, you know, that may have a short—term impact once they are in force. overall, they are not going to be part of the picture. there have been some really interesting flashbacks. migration watch uk, which has a long—standing campaign against levels of net migration to the uk, it has really criticise these figures this morning. they have put out a statement saying that this is unsustainable and they are going to launch a new campaign to cut immigration, together with the national petition. they have said that the prime minister has abandoned any effort to cut immigration from the stratospheric

levels. so, clearly, this is a real source of political and social concern, among some politicians. it will not go away for the prime minister. it will not go away for the prime minister. ., ., ., ., ., minister. it will not go away on a short-term. _ minister. it will not go away on a short-term, mid-term _ minister. it will not go away on a short-term, mid-term or - minister. it will not go away on a - short-term, mid-term or long-term short—term, mid—term or long—term with climate change, is it? all experts say we ain't seen nothing yet. for migration across europe, in ten years or 20 years' time, it will be interesting to hear from the politicians then, and there will be political consequences to that in what politicians say, and audiences that politicians play too. if what politicians say, and audiences that politicians play too.— that politicians play too. if you could have _ that politicians play too. if you could have predicted - that politicians play too. if you could have predicted the - that politicians play too. if you could have predicted the war. that politicians play too. if you| could have predicted the war in ukraine and the number of people coming from around the world here, you would be making more money than i am. . ~ you would be making more money than i am. . ,, , ., you would be making more money than i am. . ~' , ., , you would be making more money than iam. .mg, , . i am. thank you very much indeed. both of vom _ i am. thank you very much indeed. both of you. thank _ i am. thank you very much indeed. both of you. thank you _ i am. thank you very much indeed. both of you. thank you to - i am. thank you very much indeed. both of you. thank you to robert i both of you. thank you to robert kath and dominic casciani. good to have the experts on hand. good to have the experts on hand. good to have the experts on hand. good to have the expertise from so many of you. i can't thank you enough for getting in touch with us, as ever, we read all of the text messages as well. thank you for listening, and i

will see you tomorrow. maybe you will see you tomorrow. maybe you will hear me, maybe you will see me, depending on how you consume. have a good day. live from london. this is bbc news uk net migration reaches a record high — with a figure of more than 600,000 people. florida's republican governor ron desantis formally the outgoing police chief constable of lee scotland admits this could be nation in his force. it’s of lee scotland admits this could be nation in his force.— nation in his force. it's great for me to state _ nation in his force. it's great for me to state institutional - nation in his force. it's great for| me to state institutional racism, sexism, misogyny and discrimination exists. police scotland is institutionally racist and discriminatory. florida's republican governor ron desantis formally launches his presidential campaign — but the announcement on a twitter livestream is hit by technical glitches. the cost of war — we meet one ukrainian family that's paid a heavy

price for the defence of bakhmut.