the home office says e—gates are now operating as normal after long delays for some passengers travelling to uk airports. the disruption, which began on friday night, was due to an it issue which is now resolved. tv presenter holly willoughby says she is hurt after phillip schofield's admission about a relationship with a younger itv colleague, which he previously denied to her. it's the final day of campaigning in turkey ahead of one of the country's most divisive presidential elections where the economy and immigration are key voter concerns. huge political rallies have been held to drum up support. ukraine's most senior security official tells the bbc the country is ready to launch its long—expected

counter—offensive against russian forces. in a rare interview, oleksiy danilov describes the planned assault as an "historic opportunity". now on bbc news...political thinking with nick robinson. hello and welcome to political thinking, a conversation with rather than an interrogation of someone who shapes our political thinking about what has shaped theirs. every so often there's an issue that bubbles up. if you'll forgive the metaphor, and reaches beyond the westminster bubble. the issue we're talking about today is the issue of sewage, the quality of our waterways, our rivers and our seas. my

my guest this week is the man who is insured that no political figure can and should ignore the question of the waterways. he is keen angler, campaigner, and original lead singer with the undertones, fergal sharkey, a man who left the stage in order to campaign for musician's right before taking up his current position another one of the country's leading environmental campaigners. he began life in the bogside in derry.. as we will hear, he is now her out to people from the green party, to the readers of the daily telegraph, the countryside alliance, to surfers against sewage circle. welcome to political thinking. yet or thank you for having me. now, you have been described, i saw, for having me. now, you have been described, isaw, as for having me. now, you have been described, i saw, as a stroppy former punk rocker who will not take no for an answer. you plead guilty?

if i'm right in thinking, that might have been michael dugger. i am thinking, i'm seeing him in a few days�* time, i will remonstrate with him over that. it days' time, i will remonstrate with him over that. i— days' time, i will remonstrate with him over that. it former labour mp. former labour _ him over that. it former labour mp. former labour mp. _ him over that. it former labour mp. former labour mp. do _ him over that. it former labour mp. former labour mp. do i _ him over that. it former labour mp. former labour mp. do i take - him over that. it former labour mp. former labour mp. do i take no - him over that. it former labour mp. former labour mp. do i take no for| former labour mp. do i take no for an answer? i've never been very good at that. stroppy? well i will discuss that with michael further. we can expand on that one. i would p"°p we can expand on that one. i would prop you have to concede on that one. ~ ., ., , ., prop you have to concede on that one. ~ . ., , ~ prop you have to concede on that one. ~ . ., , ,, prop you have to concede on that one. . , ,, prop you have to concede on that one. what about punk rocker? do you think of yourself _ one. what about punk rocker? do you think of yourself as _ one. what about punk rocker? do you think of yourself as a _ one. what about punk rocker? do you think of yourself as a punk? _ one. what about punk rocker? do you think of yourself as a punk? because | think of yourself as a punk? because undertones clearly came in that area. but, ilooked undertones clearly came in that area. but, i looked at a video view the other day, you are not there with safety pins, you are there with a smartjacket, white shirt, not that different from today. you know, it was a moment _ that different from today. you know, it was a moment in _ that different from today. you know, it was a moment in time, _ that different from today. you know, it was a moment in time, where - that different from today. you know, | it was a moment in time, where there are things called punk rock in dairy? were we at the time developing a young band, and five

kids putting a band together that shared a lot of the same ethos and ideals? absolutely, without question. but, we are very clear about it. we were trying to make a great three minute pop songs. what great three minute pop songs. what about the punk _ great three minute pop songs. what about the punk bits? _ great three minute pop songs. what about the punk bits? you said it was, if it was anything, it was antiestablishment. it was the ability to say, there is something wrong with the way things are organised. for wrong with the way things are organised-— organised. for me, it is not necessarily _ organised. for me, it is not necessarily an _ organised. for me, it is not i necessarily an establishment, organised. for me, it is not - necessarily an establishment, it is anti—what is going on is not working. and, for us who are old enough, bearing in mind the mid—i9 70s, if the united kingdom was ever right for revelation, then it was a mid—i9 70s. now, in northern ireland and in derry, we had a kind of decade had start by that point for other reasons, but people here will remember. so, mountains of rubbish being disposed of and collected and held in leicester square. there was a three—day working week, there was electricity supply being rationed, and i think it was simply young

people rebelling about what they were about to inherit and the state of the nation that they would be gifted by the adults and the people in control at the time.— in control at the time. now, and hundred words _ in control at the time. now, and hundred words we _ in control at the time. now, and hundred words we are _ in control at the time. now, and hundred words we are a - in control at the time. now, and hundred words we are a long - in control at the time. now, and| hundred words we are a long way in control at the time. now, and - hundred words we are a long way from that, but there was a poll recently shown that a vast number of people think things simply do not work in this country. it seems to me, and will talk specifically about water and a second, that may be that's what this house, forgive the pun, tapped into. a sense that things are good enough. i personally

have no doubt _ things are good enough. i personally have no doubt about _ things are good enough. i personally have no doubt about that _ things are good enough. i personally have no doubt about that at - things are good enough. i personally have no doubt about that at all. - have no doubt about that at all. there is an enormous sense of rage and anger and frustration across the board. it is not a party political broadcast, but we have created a nation where nurses are having to sit and make a choice at night between whether the children get fed or the heat gets capped on. this is a g7 member state, one of the leading national countries on the planet, one of the most open market—based economies, and we have created that situation. as the saying goes, a plague of locusts on all of our houses. it's a sewage campaign being used by some people to express that frustration and outrage? absolutely. because it has become a symptom of a much greater disease and malaise that this donation is suffering from. we will talk about derry _ donation is suffering from. we will talk about derry and _ donation is suffering from. we will talk about derry and the _ donation is suffering from. we will talk about derry and the influence | talk about derry and the influence it had a minute. first of all, why sewage, my water? why have all the things you might be passionate about... ., , , ., about... there i was, minding my own business- -- — about... there i was, minding my own business- -- it — about... there i was, minding my own business... it is _ about... there i was, minding my own business... it is a _ about... there i was, minding my own business... it is a love _ about... there i was, minding my own business... it is a love of _ about... there i was, minding my own business... it is a love of fishing. - business... it is a love of fishing. it it is. business... it is a love of fishing. it it is- the _ business... it is a love of fishing. it it is. the school _ business... it is a love of fishing. it it is. the school i _ business... it is a love of fishing. it it is. the school i went - business... it is a love of fishing. it it is. the school i went to, - it it is. the school i went to, christian brothers in derry had a very simple ethos, when that school was established, in the bogside, the community was made from one room houses with dirt floors, and perhaps

three families in one room. the whole ethos of the school was, we do not have the resources to provide these people with charity. what we can do is take care of figures. amongst other things, we were presented with a long list of after—school clubs and societies, and you are required to volunteer for six. ., .,, , .,, and you are required to volunteer for six. ., , .,, fl for six. one of those six was... fly fishin: , for six. one of those six was... fly fishing. fly — for six. one of those six was... fly fishing. fly tying- _ for six. one of those six was... fly fishing, fly tying. fishing, - for six. one of those six was... fly fishing, fly tying. fishing, there i fishing, fly tying. fishing, there will be people _ fishing, fly tying. fishing, there will be people watching - fishing, fly tying. fishing, there will be people watching who - fishing, fly tying. fishing, there l will be people watching who say, fishing, fly tying. fishing, there i will be people watching who say, i do not get it. what is a grown man doing with a stick? what is it? here's the thing. izaak walton said, is it is not an art to with a fly? i have always had one of those minds that i have 10,000 different things rattling around in the back of my mind all day every day. i find it quite a challenge on occasion to

back off and relax. fly fishing is one of those things that i have to concentrate on. bearing in mind, what you are doing is trying to deceive this beautiful, wild fish, a trout, that this thing you have assembled using feather and silk actually resembles a real life genuine insect.— actually resembles a real life enuine insect. ., ., ., , , genuine insect. you not only enthuse about fishing — genuine insect. you not only enthuse about fishing but _ genuine insect. you not only enthuse about fishing but are _ genuine insect. you not only enthuse about fishing but are the _ genuine insect. you not only enthuse about fishing but are the chair- genuine insect. you not only enthuse about fishing but are the chair of- about fishing but are the chair of the oldest angling club in england. and it is there that you see what is happening to the water. 15 and it is there that you see what is happening to the water.— happening to the water. is part of my handover. _ happening to the water. is part of my handover, and _ happening to the water. is part of my handover, and i _ happening to the water. is part of my handover, and i had _ happening to the water. is part of my handover, and i had been - happening to the water. is part of l my handover, and i had been aware that we were losing water, to the extent that the river was stagnating, they were talking about two and a half miles. this is one of the rarest river systems on the planet and we are treating it with that level of contempt. now, i went and this part of the handover had a number of conversations with the environment agency, and rapidly became aware that this was an issue that people had known about for the

better part of 15 years. they had known what was causing it, what the solution was, but they did little to act upon it. to such an extent, that this river was dying. you act upon it. to such an extent, that this river was dying.— this river was dying. you took legal action, judicial _ this river was dying. you took legal action, judicial review. _ this river was dying. you took legal action, judicial review. we - this river was dying. you took legal action, judicial review. we didn't i action, 'udicial review. we didn't aet action, 'udicial review. we didn't net to action, judicial review. we didn't net to the action, judicial review. we didn't get to the high _ action, judicial review. we didn't get to the high court _ action, judicial review. we didn't get to the high court quite, - action, judicial review. we didn't get to the high court quite, but| action, judicial review. we didn't| get to the high court quite, but i was banging furiously on the door, ringing the bell demanding entry. thankfully, at the last minute, as i normally refer to it, the grown—ups were let into the room. did normally refer to it, the grown-ups were let into the room.— were let into the room. did you at that moment _ were let into the room. did you at that moment think, _ were let into the room. did you at that moment think, this _ were let into the room. did you at that moment think, this is - were let into the room. did you at that moment think, this is the - that moment think, this is the beginning of a new phase in my life? the beginning of a great campaign? a wager can get that bit of ribbon... that's not what i was interested in. however that experience... there's only 60 members of the group, and it pricked my curiosity. as i now explained it, naively, i scratched that itch. and every day, i scratch it, and i end up with a bigger itch.

there is another puzzle looking at you. which is why it took you to get those 60 men and women to much. does that then take us all the way back to your upbringing in derry? your mum and dad marching? that you grew up mum and dad marching? that you grew up in the place where the civil rights marches in northern ireland in the 19605 really right5 marches in northern ireland in the 19605 really began? this rights marches in northern ireland in the 1960s really began?- in the 1960s really began? this is where we get _ in the 1960s really began? this is where we get freudian. _ in the 1960s really began? this is where we get freudian. is - in the 1960s really began? this is where we get freudian. is that i in the 1960s really began? this is - where we get freudian. is that where the possibility — where we get freudian. is that where the possibility of— where we get freudian. is that where the possibility of change, _ where we get freudian. is that where the possibility of change, they - where we get freudian. is that where the possibility of change, they need i the possibility of change, they need to campaign comes from? it is the possibility of change, they need to campaign comes from?— to campaign comes from? it is very freudian, to campaign comes from? it is very freudian. yes _ to campaign comes from? it is very freudian. yes you _ to campaign comes from? it is very freudian, yes you can _ to campaign comes from? it is very freudian, yes you can blame - to campaign comes from? it is very freudian, yes you can blame the i freudian, yes you can blame the parents. my father was the chairman of the labour party in derry in the early 19605. of the labour party in derry in the early19605. ican of the labour party in derry in the early 19605. i can vividly remember him pulling out a beaten up copy of the morning star, where he appeared in a generic photograph on the front page of delegates leaving the front page of delegates leaving the tuc conference at blackpool

winter garden5 the tuc conference at blackpool winter gardens 1963. when my father passed away, he was... the irish times ran an obituary and time5 ran an obituary and highlighted how he had sent a lot of the 19505 trying to reach out... clearly, we were catholics, coming from derek... trying to reach out to the protestant working classes and protestant workers that he was convinced indu5triali5t5 in northern ireland is reusing the hatchet of 5ectariani5m to divide the working classes and its like them. he sectarianism to divide the working classes and its like them. he didn't think this was _ classes and its like them. he didn't think this was in _ classes and its like them. he didn't think this was in essence _ classes and its like them. he didn't think this was in essence battle - think this was in essence battle between religiou5 think this was in essence battle between religious groups? there was a class battle. between religious groups? there was a class battle-— a class battle. completely. in reali , a class battle. completely. in reality. he — a class battle. completely. in reality, he was _ a class battle. completely. in reality, he was a _ a class battle. completely. in reality, he was a socialist - a class battle. completely. in i reality, he was a socialist trying to unite and combine the greater power and influence of the working classes to do a good deal with the indu5trialist5. find classes to do a good deal with the industrialists.— industrialists. and yet as a boy, rurowin industrialists. and yet as a boy, growing up _ industrialists. and yet as a boy, growing up in — industrialists. and yet as a boy, growing up in catholic— industrialists. and yet as a boy, growing up in catholic derry, i growing up in catholic derry, nationalist derry, republican derry, at the moment when the ira wa5

reborn a5 at the moment when the ira wa5 reborn as an active terrorist organisation... you couldn't not be political, could you? you have to be dragged into that. the political, could you? you have to be dragged into that.— dragged into that. the thing is, i've said dragged into that. the thing is, we said all _ dragged into that. the thing is, i've said all of _ dragged into that. the thing is, i've said all of that _ dragged into that. the thing is, i've said all of that about i dragged into that. the thing is, i've said all of that about my i i've said all of that about my father, but my father was not the politician of the house. he wasn't the one who was a campaign and the driver of events, that was my mother. i am driver of events, that was my mother. iam more driver of events, that was my mother. i am more comfortable talking about this in the modern world. fergal i5 talking about this in the modern world. fergal is not my first name. i am named after two dead ira men killed in an attack on a police station in northern ireland in 1957. what does that tell you about my mother's politics? it was my mum who, on the morning of the 9th of april 1969, who, on the morning of the 9th of april1969, bundled who, on the morning of the 9th of april 1969, bundled everybody into the family car and demanded that dad drove us to the other side of ireland where, as a family, we took part in the people's democracy civil rights march between belfast and right5 march between belfast and dublin, processing and highlighting

injustices in northern ireland. fine injustices in northern ireland. one ofthe injustices in northern ireland. one of the defining _ injustices in northern ireland. one of the defining events of the period the lead what we now call, euphemistically, the troubles. i am ten ears euphemistically, the troubles. i am ten years old _ euphemistically, the troubles. i am ten years old at _ euphemistically, the troubles. i am ten years old at this _ euphemistically, the troubles. i —n ten years old at this much walking down the middle of the main road between belfast and dublin waiting very enthu5ia5tically, i have to say, what a later would discover wa5 say, what a later would discover was commonly referred to as an anarchist flag. you are ten years old, it is a doubt, it is fantastic. you flag. you are ten years old, it is a doubt, it is fantastic.— doubt, it is fantastic. you say you are comfortable _ doubt, it is fantastic. you say you are comfortable talking _ doubt, it is fantastic. you say you are comfortable talking now, i doubt, it is fantastic. you say you are comfortable talking now, so l doubt, it is fantastic. you say you i are comfortable talking now, so much changed, notjust the celebrating of the good friday belfast agreement. in those days, to admit that you are named after an ira man, that would lead to rage, hatred. the named after an ira man, that would lead to rage, hatred.— lead to rage, hatred. the truth is, in those days. _ lead to rage, hatred. the truth is, in those days, you _ lead to rage, hatred. the truth is, in those days, you are _ lead to rage, hatred. the truth is, in those days, you are very - lead to rage, hatred. the truth is, l in those days, you are very careful. this applied to both communities. you would be very careful and judicial about where you went at night and which parts of town you are prepared to enter, and which you are prepared to enter, and which you are not, and which you would avoid.

because, 5imply are not, and which you would avoid. because, simply for that fact, you could end up in an awful lot of trouble. they kind of had a shorthand ver5ion, trouble. they kind of had a shorthand version, to tie in the 19605 and 705, ironically enough, highlighting the injustice of the place, you will be asked a simple question... what school would you go to? ., ., , , ., question... what school would you go to? ., asa to? that was your label. as a teenager. — to? that was your label. as a teenager, that _ to? that was your label. as a teenager, that depended i to? that was your label. as a i teenager, that depended whether to? that was your label. as a - teenager, that depended whether you are going to be beaten up. as an adult, that dictated whether you're going to be offered thatjob you thought you were going to get, by that simple answer, that would expose whether or not you are expo5e whether or not you are catholic or protestant. find expose whether or not you are catholic or protestant. and whether or not ou catholic or protestant. and whether or not you have _ catholic or protestant. and whether or not you have a _ catholic or protestant. and whether or not you have a future. _ catholic or protestant. and whether or not you have a future. gear i catholic or protestant. and whether or not you have a future. gear at i or not you have a future. gear at the time in derry, i think it was about 60% of men in derry... the vast majority of those, 99%, were catholic. you grow up with this injustice. with this passionate and political family. injustice. with this passionate and politicalfamily. what injustice. with this passionate and political family. what do they teach you? mum and dad, you said it was freudian for me... what are they teach about the politics? you are

one minute having an alliance with the labour party, the next with the duke of wellington, you are forming cross—party alliances. young mac goe5 cross—party alliances. young mac goes back to my father. some people might say he was being brilliantly insightful. might say he was being brilliantly insiuhtful. ., _ might say he was being brilliantly insiuhtful. ., , insightful. some would say foolish to stop trying _ insightful. some would say foolish to stop trying to — insightful. some would say foolish to stop trying to reach _ insightful. some would say foolish to stop trying to reach out - insightful. some would say foolish to stop trying to reach out to i insightful. some would say foolish to stop trying to reach out to the l to stop trying to reach out to the protestant working classes and say, all of us, as a class, are being exploited by indu5trialist5, and we need to cut out the sectarianism and the things dividing u5 need to cut out the sectarianism and the things dividing us because, as a group, we will be better, 5tronger, group, we will be better, stronger, and bigger, and more capable of controlling the future for the working classes in northern ireland. did they make you believe change was possible? plenty of people, growing up possible? plenty of people, growing up in that sort of politics, that sort of disadvantage, might think forget it, life is never going to work for me. it forget it, life is never going to work for me.— work for me. it gave me two things- -- _ work for me. it gave me two things- -- my _ work for me. it gave me two things... my mother- work for me. it gave me two things... my mother was i work for me. it gave me two things... my mother was a l work for me. it gave me two i things... my mother was a driver work for me. it gave me two - things... my mother was a driver in all of this. it became almost a

demand of us. i think three things. one, if you saw a social injustice, 0ne, if you saw a social injustice, you had an obligation to confront it and deal with it. second, i was brought up in a world where i sat in a kitchen where the housewife, the plumber, electrician, the schoolteacher debated and discussed and planned civil disobedience and rebellion. and i watched first—hand as a rebellion. and i watched first—hand a5 a 12 old the5e schoolteachers, bricklayer5, electricians, unemployed, bring down the nationalist government in northern ireland, and play a substantial part in bringing about the destruction of the government in northern ireland. so, the house i grew up in... is possibly the biggest element of all. i was in the title to have an opinion, and i can have pretty much any opinion i wanted. i needed to be intellectually justified any opinion i wanted. i needed to be intellectuallyjustified you any opinion i wanted. i needed to be intellectually justified— intellectually 'ustified you are clear that intellectually justified you are clear that this _ intellectually justified you are clear that this is _ intellectually justified you are clear that this is now - intellectuallyjustified you are l clear that this is now discussion you can have, people have moved on.

on this forecast, i have spoken to most of the people in northern ireland. mo5t most of the people in northern ireland. most of them are deeply deeply scarred. either actually blown up, shot, or their relatives were... it forms a part of who they were... it forms a part of who they were. i think that people listen to you don't know your story, they may nevertheless be surprised because they remember the undertones a5 a nonpolitical band who sang about girls. and happine55. i’m nonpolitical band who sang about girls. and happiness.— nonpolitical band who sang about girls. and happiness. i'm not trying to over dramatise _ girls. and happiness. i'm not trying to over dramatise this. _ girls. and happiness. i'm not trying to over dramatise this. frequently, i to over dramatise this. frequently, i would find myself immediately spread—eagled on my fingertips with my legs being kicked back, being searched and questioned. that was not some injustice being perpetrated on mean as an individual. a male teenager living in derry frequenting the places i did, that was teenager living in derry frequenting the places i did, that wa5ju5t a

fact of life. the places i did, that was 'ust a fact of mi fact of life. there was any one moment where _ fact of life. there was any one moment where i _ fact of life. there was any one moment where i can - fact of life. there was any one moment where i can see i fact of life. there was any one moment where i can see in i fact of life. there was any one i moment where i can see in which fact of life. there was any one - moment where i can see in which the undertones did embrace politics. 0n undertones did embrace politics. on top of the pops with bobby sands. the hunger strike 5aw top of the pops with bobby sands. the hunger strike saw him die. for those from northern ireland, this was a profound moment. an ira man in prison who staffed himself to death pri5on who staffed himself to death to make a political point —— max starved. plenty of people who were not supporters of the ira had sympathy. not supporters of the ira had sympathy-— not supporters of the ira had s math . , , , ., sympathy. the truth is, yes, to the ori . inal sympathy. the truth is, yes, to the original question, _ sympathy. the truth is, yes, to the original question, people _ sympathy. the truth is, yes, to the original question, people in - sympathy. the truth is, yes, to the original question, people in derry, | original question, people in derry, and particularly young men breed this every day. the last thing the 40 this every day. the last thing the a0 or 50 people, our peers, 17 or 18

years old, the last thing they needed on a friday night was u5 lecturing them about politics and injustice. 0utside, lecturing them about politics and injustice. outside, there was a british army checkpoint, all they had to do a step out of the door. when it came to that particular event, here is a man, a citizen of the united kingdom, who has event, here is a man, a citizen of the united kingdom, who ha5ju5t staffed himself to death and been overseen in that situation, created and driven by the state does allow that to happen. at that point, you have broken everyone's resolve, and everyone has to stand up. if that meant wearing black man is on top of the box, so be it. it is meant wearing black man is on top of the box, so be it.— the box, so be it. it is going to ha en. the box, so be it. it is going to happen- i _ the box, so be it. it is going to happen- i tune _ the box, so be it. it is going to happen. itune i— the box, so be it. it is going to happen. i tune i know - the box, so be it. it is going to happen. i tune i know well. it. the box, so be it. it is going to i happen. i tune i know well. it had a message. it happen. i tune i know well. it had a messaue. , , message. it is basically... it came u . message. it is basically... it came u- once message. it is basically... it came up once upon _ message. it is basically... it came up once upon in — message. it is basically... it came up once upon in northern - message. it is basically... it came up once upon in northern ireland, | up once upon in northern ireland, covered bloody sunday... the story was told there, and it was true, i

was told there, and it was true, i was on the ground at the time, the single event, the following day, that swelled the ranks of the ira buy untold multiples. because, people were simply not prepared to accept that kind of active violence by the state against its own citizens. it by the state against its own citizens. , ., ., , ., citizens. it is quite a 'ourney from their service h citizens. it is quite a 'ourney from their service alliancei citizens. it is quite a journey from their service alliance with - citizens. it is quite a journey from their service alliance with the i citizens. it is quite a journey from | their service alliance with the duke of wellington. long before you did the sewage campaign, you have alluded to it, as well as being a music professional, you campaign for mu5ic professional, you campaign for the rights of musicians. you have moved here, he said he didn't want your little boy to have the same upbringing a5 your little boy to have the same upbringing as you... how easy wa5 your little boy to have the same upbringing as you... how easy was it to operate in the british establishment. becau5e to operate in the british establishment. because that is what you did to deliver change in the music industry, with the sort of background and values you have been brought up with. background and values you have been brought up with-— brought up with. hopefully i have hiuuhlihted brought up with. hopefully i have highlighted here _ brought up with. hopefully i have highlighted here are... _ brought up with. hopefully i have highlighted here are... some i brought up with. hopefully i have highlighted here are... some of. highlighted here are... some of those values were about being very focused on what you want to achieve,

being very clear, intellectually, on how you want to achieve it, being very empathetic to the people that you're talking to, and understanding their point of view, and their challenges, their objectives, and trying to explore and find that commonality in that middle ground... and being able to express and narrate it. and ultimately, being able to create that kind of argument where people will see the justification and the right behind the kind of point you are trying to make, and be prepared to follow up and commit themselves to achieving the same goal. that is called politics, i didn't know that at the time, but that is what i believe is politics. the inference you made, and i did say to him, and he fell on the floor rolling with laughter, a little while back, and i was having a conversation with the duke of wellington. it occurred to me, i said, i've had this thought, this government are so utterly hopeless that they have actually managed to put the song of a republican iri5h family and the duke of wellington on

the same side of an argument. a brilliant move, well done. that was the alliance — brilliant move, well done. that was the alliance that _ brilliant move, well done. that was the alliance that produced - brilliant move, well done. that was the alliance that produced some i the alliance that produced some change, in the regulation of the water campaign. and may have led to the moment the other day where an apology wa5 the moment the other day where an apology was issued by water companies and promised to spend £10 million. i spoke to you, thinking you would be pleased, do you blow it up. maybe this is what that thing about being a punk campaigner means, you basically said he didn't believe a word of it and that they should give the 10 billion back to ordinary people. pl. give the 10 billion back to ordinary --eole. �* ~' ., ., give the 10 billion back to ordinary --eole. �* ~ ., ., ., , give the 10 billion back to ordinary --eole. �* ~ . ., ., , ., people. a week ago today they made that apology- — people. a week ago today they made that apology- as _ people. a week ago today they made that apology. as it _ people. a week ago today they made that apology. as it turns _ people. a week ago today they made that apology. as it turns out, - people. a week ago today they made that apology. as it turns out, it i that apology. as it turns out, it didn't take a week even before united utilities, severn trent water, two of the biggest sewage dumpers in the country announced in the last a8 hours that they are going to pay £550 million in dividends to their shareholders over the next couple of weeks. so, they

weren't that 5orry, were they? then;r weren't that sorry, were they? they sa , if weren't that sorry, were they? they say. if you — weren't that sorry, were they? they say. if you don't— weren't that sorry, were they? they say. if you don't pay _ weren't that sorry, were they? they say, if you don't pay dividends, you don't have shareholders, if you don't have shareholders, if you don't have shareholders, if you don't have them you don't have investment, if you are an investment, if you are an investment, you don't have smarter sewers. �* , investment, you don't have smarter sewers. �* y ., y investment, you don't have smarter sewers. ~ , ., , ., ., , ., sewers. any money that goes into the s stem sewers. any money that goes into the system comes — sewers. any money that goes into the system comes out _ sewers. any money that goes into the system comes out of— sewers. any money that goes into the system comes out of our— sewers. any money that goes into the system comes out of our pockets. i sewers. any money that goes into the system comes out of our pockets. fori system comes out of our pockets. for me, i thought it was the most incredible lack of foresight and planning, and management, and leadership within the industry to put that statement out. take out the apology bit, you must know at this point the level of anger, frustration, and rage amongst your customers. at what you have done over the last 30 years. fiend customers. at what you have done over the last 30 years.— over the last 30 years. and yet, someone _ over the last 30 years. and yet, someone who, _ over the last 30 years. and yet, someone who, i— over the last 30 years. and yet, someone who, i am _ over the last 30 years. and yet, someone who, i am afraid, i over the last 30 years. and yet, someone who, i am afraid, in i over the last 30 years. and yet, i someone who, i am afraid, in the rules of this business has to say anonymous, who has worked with you on these issues in the past, has said, he has got silly, you must know that you can't give £10 billion back to the customers, the money has gone. back to the customers, the money has one. ,., ., , , ., back to the customers, the money has one. ,., .,, , ., ., ~ gone. the point i was trying to make

by illustrating _ gone. the point i was trying to make by illustrating that, _ gone. the point i was trying to make by illustrating that, by _ gone. the point i was trying to make by illustrating that, by bringing i by illustrating that, by bringing that up, is a simple one. in my opinion, the regulator is trying to cover their rear end. there was a letter written to the companies a year and a half ago reminding them of their statutory obligations, that they have a binding legal obligation to build, operate, and maintain sewage systems, and i am now quoting, capable of effectively dealing with the contents of those in sewers. so you have a legal obligation to do it. the regulators say, you have had all of the funding to comply with that obligation. water companies have to certify annually that they have got all of the funding they need it. well, you clearly haven't spent it in the sewage system, so where is it going? where is our money gone? the people listenin: to where is our money gone? the people listening to this _ where is our money gone? the people listening to this will— where is our money gone? the people listening to this will be _ where is our money gone? the people listening to this will be saying, - listening to this will be saying, why are we limiting fergal to water? here is the thing. as a musician, i

was gifted the most beautiful, wonderful, glorious thing. for decades of my adult life, all of my aduu decades of my adult life, all of my adult life, random people have walked up to me in the street, all over the world, and simply wanted to introduce themselves and talk about music. now, what a glorious thing to happen, people talk about gigs they went to, records. overthe happen, people talk about gigs they went to, records. over the last few years, that has a vault onto another level, they now want me to talk about effluents in rivers. for me, i would be really happy to talking about music as quickly and efficiently as possible. i genuinely have no ambition to go and stand for parliament... , that is someone else�*s job. parliament... , that is someone else'siob-_ else's job. you could be lord feraal. else's job. you could be lord fergal. that _ else's job. you could be lord fergal. that would _ else's job. you could be lord fergal. that would be - else's job. you could be lord fergal. that would be a - else's job. you could be lord| fergal. that would be a great else's job. you could be lord - fergal. that would be a great thing for the republican boy from derry. your mac there would be so story to sell. a little boy becoming lord fergal. lunch at the house of lords

with the duke of wellington every day? that's not a denial... an odd denial. thank you forjoining me. thank you the opportunity. usually appreciated. thank you the opportunity. usually appreciated-— appreciated. now whether or not fer al it appreciated. now whether or not fergal it becomes _ appreciated. now whether or not fergal it becomes a _ appreciated. now whether or not fergal it becomes a lord, - appreciated. now whether or not fergal it becomes a lord, and - appreciated. now whether or not fergal it becomes a lord, and i i appreciated. now whether or not i fergal it becomes a lord, and i got the sense that he really wouldn't mind, he has a lot to teach people about how to bring about change, being prepared to work with people you disagree with as well as those you disagree with as well as those you agree with. always being willing to be personable, and realising, that a win at any campaign, you have to know your facts, that a win at any campaign, you have to know yourfacts, you have that a win at any campaign, you have to know your facts, you have to that a win at any campaign, you have to know yourfacts, you have to be intelligent, capable of debating but, above all, communicating and conveying passion about a subject many people may not have given a moments thought to. in a way that makes them want to be part of your course. thanks for watching.

hello there. it really was a gorgeous day to day across england and wales, lots of sunshine around. temperatures in west yorkshire 24.3 celsius, the warmest day of the year so far in northern ireland, and in scotland, more cloud for a while, producing one of three spots of rain, that was mainly due to a very weak weather front heading out into the north sea. following that, we have some cool air coming around our area of low pressure from the north, temperatures for many of us a little bit lower on sunday. we start chilly, clearerskies bit lower on sunday. we start chilly, clearer skies in eastern areas of scotland, temperatures could be close to freezing in one or two places. more cloud coming into the north—west, that will be affecting eastern parts of england

and the north sea. sunshine at times in scotland and northern ireland, the cloud coming and going, particularly in the north—west. with the north—easterly breeze, because east of england, that will push the cloud further west, although hanging on to the best of the franchise in the west of wales and england and the west of wales and england and the south coast. it sets it will be cooler further north and the east, significant drops of temperature at the north—east of england. still dry, high pressure in charge, the position of the high means that there will be stronger winds on monday into shetland, blowing and more cloud. also a stronger east to north—easterly brain de mag went affecting the southern parts of england, it will feel cooler. blowing in some cloud in the morning to the midlands and eastern england which will break up in the afternoon, lots of sunshine around on bank holiday monday. cool air in place across england and wales, highest temperatures further west in northern ireland and scotland, a little bit warm on monday. temperatures back into the low 20s. high pressure remains in charge on

monday and tuesday, the position is unchanging, like twins for many, strong winds through the english channel and southern england. with the wind coming in off the north sea, we could see some more cloud through much of the day on tuesday, the eastern areas of england, always going to be warm up towards the west and the north. temperatures getting into the low 20s, in scotland, highs of 24 degrees or so on tuesday. all week, we are dominated by high pressure, still dry, sunshine most days, and those temperatures reaching the mid 20s for the middle part of the week.

live from washington, this is bbc news. ukraine's most senior security official tells the bbc the country is ready to launch its long—expected counter—offensive against russian forces. passport e—gates are now working normally at the uk's ports, after a breakdown caused long queues for thousands of arrivals. still no deal on the us debt talks, but reports say president biden and speaker kevin mccarthy will speak by phone. hello, i'm carl nasman, thanks forjoining me. we start in ukraine, as the country's most senior security official tells the bbc ukrainian forces are now ready to launch a long—awaited counter—offensive.