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tv   Newsnight  BBC News  June 12, 2023 10:30pm-11:10pm BST

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that is down to jealousy, other clubs have spent big and been less successful as city but nothing can take away from the glory of saturday night. take away from the glory of saturday niuht. , �* , take away from the glory of saturday niuht. ,, �* , a, take away from the glory of saturday niuht. ,, �*, a, , night. that's it from us in manchester. _ time for a look at the weather. here's louise lear. it was quite a downpour earlier. it did rain on the parade. what a day, plenty to tell you. warmest day of the year so far in northern ireland and for scotland. we saw temperatures in the high 20s in north wales and in cheshire, 31 degrees. it was hot, humid out there. the rain has been across highland scotland, a couple of inches of rainfall, it has been relentless. let's take a look at what i'm talking about. these were the thunderstorms in scotland, significant cluster pushing up from the south east heading towards
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manchesterjust the south east heading towards manchester just as they were trying to get on the bus. the showers are starting to ease away, things will turn quieter through the night. they will not be that much more comfortable for trying to get a good night's sleep. temperatures will hold up, quite a lot of cloud around as well across the south and west. a pretty warm start once again to our day and there will be lots of sunshine, yes, clouding the south—west but no, there are no showers across england and wales, just a few isolated ones but you will be unlucky if you catch them. most of the showers will be further north and west, across northern ireland and north—west scotland. heavy once again with rumbles of thunder but in comparison to today, really more straightforward. 21 to 27 in scotland, high perhaps around 27, may be 28 across england and wales. the rest of the week stays dry, settled and sunny but more
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importantly, it will feel a bit more comfortable, less humid. thanks, louise. and that's bbc news at ten on monday the 12th ofjune. there's more analysis of the day's main stories on newsnight with victoria derbyshire in london and kirsty wark in glasgow. that's just getting underway on bbc two. the news continues here on bbc one though, as now it's time to join our colleagues across the nations and regions for the news where you are, but from the ten team, it's goodnight. with the disruptor now on the outside, what does that mean for the governing party and the country?
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a row over mrjohnson�*s controversial resignation honours list escalates into a feud between the man who runs the country and the man who used to. we'll talk to tobias ellwood and the labour mp, chris bryant, who stepped back from chairing the privileges committee inquiry into mrjohnson. the next chapter of nicola sturgeon�*s life is not going to plan, after being arrested yesterday in connection to the investigation into snp finances, interviewed for seven hours and released without charge, she is protesting her innocence, refusing calls from fellow msps to step aside and pledging to be back in parliament
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soon. should her successor humza yousaf have refused to suspend her? we are in glasgow and we will talk to the former westminster snp leader, the labour leader in scotland and ash regan, who has called on nicola sturgeon to resign. and after a mother who was 32 to 3a weeks pregnant is sentenced to two years injailfor taking abortion pills, there are calls for a review of the 150—year—old law under which she was punished. we'll bejoined by we'll be joined by labour we'll bejoined by labour mp we'll be joined by labour mp stella creasy and spectatorjournalist creasy and spectator journalist james creasy and spectatorjournalist james mumford. and as the covid inquiry begins its public hearings tomorrow, we ask how prepared the uk is for the challenges of any future pandemic? the current conservative prime minister and the man who was conservative prime minister a year ago are at war politically. not over inflation or growth or ukraine, but over mrjohnson�*s controversial resignation honours list. borisjohnson has now formally quit as an mp because.
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it looks like the privileges committee — with a conservative majority — has concluded he had misled parliament over parties during lockdown. mrjohnson blames others for his downfall, but it was his decision to step down rather than face a vote on the committee's recommended sanction in a house of commons with a conservative majority, and rather than face voters in a by—election in his own consituency. today, a war of words between rishi sunak and mrjohnson over the omission of nadine dorries and others from that honours list — and with three by—elections looming, what does this feud mean for the converative party's electoral fortunes? nick's here. taking on all comers. a weekend of volleys from borisjohnson. and now, the reply. volleys from boris johnson. and now, the rel. i, , volleys from boris johnson. and now, the rel. volleys from boris johnson. and now, therel. ., the reply. boris johnson asked me to do something — the reply. boris johnson asked me to do something that _ the reply. boris johnson asked me to do something that i _ the reply. boris johnson asked me to do something that i was _ the reply. boris johnson asked me to do something that i was not - the reply. boris johnson asked me to| do something that i was not prepared to do. because i did not think it was right. that was to either overrule the community or make promises to people. i was not
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prepared to do that, i did not think it was right. prepared to do that, i did not think it was right-— prepared to do that, i did not think itwas riuht. ,,, ,_, it was right. rubbish, boris johnson shot back. more _ it was right. rubbish, boris johnson shot back. more from _ it was right. rubbish, boris johnson shot back. more from that - it was right. rubbish, boris johnson shot back. more from that voice - shot back. more from that voice perhaps later in the week when the highest committee is expected to find that he misled mps over lockdown parties.— find that he misled mps over lockdown parties. what is quite interesting _ lockdown parties. what is quite interesting in _ lockdown parties. what is quite interesting in this _ lockdown parties. what is quite interesting in this context - lockdown parties. what is quite interesting in this context is - interesting in this context is actually that the rules, the slow, plodding bureaucracy around parliament has actually finally caught up with him. find caught up with him. and so westminster— caught up with him. and so westminster is once - caught up with him. and so - westminster is once again transfixed by borisjohnson as he storms off whilst keeping his party guessing on a possible return. cabinet's voice on the commons stood up for the community investigating the former prime minister. indie community investigating the former prime minister.— community investigating the former prime minister. we have to be really strong about — prime minister. we have to be really strong about calling out _ prime minister. we have to be really strong about calling out people who | strong about calling out people who are attacking situations, people who are attacking situations, people who are attacking the house for carrying
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out its work. are attacking the house for carrying out its work-— out its work. boris johnson allies are standing by _ out its work. boris johnson allies are standing by their hero. - out its work. boris johnson allies i are standing by their hero. my main sort of source of _ are standing by their hero. my main sort of source of truth _ are standing by their hero. my main sort of source of truth is _ are standing by their hero. my main sort of source of truth is the - are standing by their hero. my main sort of source of truth is the black l sort of source of truth is the black dog and if you spoke to my friend, he has a feeling, he cannot put a feeling on it, that they are out to stop brexit, out to get rid of boris and i feel many will feel the same. from inside government, one—time supporters are keeping their counsel. andrew griffith? good afternoon, how is the future looking for your very good friend, boris johnson? does he have a future? good afternoon. this place is witnessing afternoon. this place is witnessing a showdown with borisjohnson. sunak nor the commons privileges committee were spoiling for a fight, but when the former prime minister came out as a pugilist, the current prime minister decided he had to take a stand. and as for the commons committee, all the signs are that they will be censoring borisjohnson pretty heavily. a whitehall observer sees a clash between past and
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present prime ministers. what sees a clash between past and present prime ministers. what we can see is two different _ present prime ministers. what we can see is two different approaches - present prime ministers. what we can see is two different approaches from i see is two different approaches from different prime ministers and that is possibly a distinction rishi sunak is keen to draw. from number 10 we heard the line, we are following convention, which is possibly convenient for the prime minister because he does not have to make an active decision but from borisjohnson, of course the only prime minister who has gone against a decision made by the community about the propriety of the appointment of peers, he says you are the prime minister and you could have made a different decision if you want to do. they have different approaches to how to go about this. and today, rishi sunak about�*s patience snapped. according to a commentator on the conservative party. commentator on the conservative pa . , ,, .,~ commentator on the conservative pa . , ,, commentator on the conservative pa. , ,, , party. rishi sunak has slapped boris johnson down _ party. rishi sunak has slapped boris johnson down and _ party. rishi sunak has slapped boris johnson down and that _ party. rishi sunak has slapped boris johnson down and that is _ johnson down and that is significant, the most direct rebuke of the former prime minister since he entered number 10 and i suspect he entered number 10 and i suspect he was ready for the question to come and his plan of answer to say
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and it suggests rishi sunak has come to the end of his tether and he tried to befriend borisjohnson, you try to keep things amicable and after this weekend, all of those briefings, number10 after this weekend, all of those briefings, number 10 are starting to think if we cannot do that it is about time we stood up to him. looming large over our politics for two decades. borisjohnson now takes his leave. don't write me off, is his leave. don't write me off, is his message. that is precisely what
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we are planning to do, say his opponents. some news tonight? that is run, one of the _ opponents. some news tonight? t�*isgt is run, one of the core elements of setting borisjohnson. the failure of a number of peerages that he nominated to make the final cut in the cabinet office issued a statement that it is challenging claims from some of his supporters. we have been hearing that rishi sunak could have intervened to allow those peerages that out the final nest and could have intervened after they came unstuck when they went in front of the house of lords appointments commission and tonight nadine dorries, originally nominated for the peerage, she is directly on the piers morgan show and accused rishi sunak of engineering it so names did not make the final list by failing to spell out to those names what they needed to do and what that was, she says, she needed to give a public statement that she would resign within six months of receiving a nomination and she did not hear that, and so she has fallen off the list and is very bitter about that. tonight a cabinet office spokesperson said, holac did not support the nominations of the mps put forward by the former prime minister and it is unprecedented for a sitting prime minister to invite holac to reconsider the vetting of individual nominees one of former prime minister's resignation list, it is not there for a formality. there is an example of a sitting
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prime minister overturning holac, borisjohnson did that with peter crothers, but it would be unprecedented for a sitting prime minister to do that.— minister to do that. understood, thank ou minister to do that. understood, thank you very — minister to do that. understood, thank you very much. _ we asked for an interview with the government but they said no. we were also due to speak to an mp supportive of borisjohnson who pulled out earlier this evening. let's speak to the conservative mp and chair of the defence committee, tobias ellwood, who says borisjohnson's career is now over. and the labour mp who stepped back from chairing the privileges committee inquiry into mrjohnson, sir chris bryant. welcome. tobias ellwood, this right between the current prime minister and your previous prime minister, when people are struggling to afford mortgages, struggling to afford to pay their bills, struggling to afford to buy food, this looks completely out of touch and pathetic, doesn't it? oh it is, and we need to focus on those very
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issues and you are providing a lot of sensationalist coverage, westminster is not transfixed over this, as nick watt suggested. i understand why it is in the interest of who said what and where but step back and you see something much more significant taking place. the departure — significant taking place. the departure of— significant taking place. tue: departure of boris significant taking place. tte: departure of boris johnson significant taking place. "tt2 departure of boris johnson from departure of borisjohnson from parliament, deserting the political battlefield so abruptly and causing three by—elections in his wake and leaving the rest of us to pick up the pieces. there is no chance of any return for borisjohnson any time soon. this allows the prime minister to seize the moment and take advantage and continue on his vision and set out his stall is a competent centre—right party to talk about those... tt is competent centre-right party to talk about those. . ._ about those... it is not sensationalist - about those... it is not sensationalist to - about those... it is not| sensationalist to report about those... it is not - sensationalist to report what the prime minister said today, which was i direct rebuke to borisjohnson. it is the most critical, but mr sunak
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has been of mrjohnson and we are simply reporting it and asking for a reaction from people like yourself. let me ask another question. should borisjohnson be suspended from the conservative party for calling the privileges committee biased, kangaroo court, a political hitjob and a witchhunt? triat kangaroo court, a political hit “0b and a witchhunt?�* and a witchhunt? not for those reasons, again _ and a witchhunt? not for those reasons, again you _ and a witchhunt? not for those reasons, again you continue i and a witchhunt? not for those reasons, again you continue to | and a witchhunt? not for those - reasons, again you continue to pour a lot of headlines onto this... borisjohnson has walked and it is time to draw a line, time for the party to support rishi sunak, which is what colleagues want, and i think the nation wants to draw a line on this as well. no one has seen the privileges committee report unless they are actually on the community itself, it will be presented to parliament and parliament will make theirjudgment on it and i suspect parliamentarians will support the outcomes themselves. i do agree that what boris johnson outcomes themselves. i do agree that what borisjohnson has done in causing so much mayhem and pain to
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the rest of us who have to pick up the rest of us who have to pick up the pieces, he should have no opportunity to stand as a conservative parliamentary and any time soon. 5ir conservative parliamentary and any time soon. ,, , �* ,~ conservative parliamentary and any time soon. ,, , �* time soon. sir chris bryant, you have not seen _ time soon. sir chris bryant, you have not seen the _ time soon. sir chris bryant, you have not seen the report - time soon. sir chris bryant, you j have not seen the report either. time soon. sir chris bryant, you - have not seen the report either. the fact that boris johnson has have not seen the report either. the fact that borisjohnson has resigned means they have found he misled parliament and was facing a sanction. parliament and was facing a sanction-— parliament and was facing a sanction. ., ., , ., sanction. we only know this from boris johnson _ sanction. we only know this from boris johnson and _ sanction. we only know this from boris johnson and since - sanction. we only know this from boris johnson and since he - sanction. we only know this from boris johnson and since he was i borisjohnson and since he was accused of lying to parliament i would be sceptical about what the report says until it comes out but your right to ask the questions stop if you have the former prime minister and the present prime minister and the present prime minister taking lumps out of each other, the tory party within itself, you have to ask if this is properly a government at all any more? and in all of our our constituencies, people are thinking, i'm struggling to put food on the table, you have members of the armed forces using food banks. and yet the government is squabbling like children in a
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nursery over a broken rattle. hang on, can i nursery over a broken rattle. hang on. can i ask _ nursery over a broken rattle. hang on. can i ask you _ nursery over a broken rattle. hang on, can i ask you about, _ nursery over a broken rattle. hang on, can i ask you about, sir- nursery over a broken rattle. hang on, can i ask you about, sir chris bryant, about the question of the impartiality of this committee. you stepped back because you had written tweets, one said borisjohnson was a proven liar, last april. tweets, one said boris johnson was a proven liar, last april.— proven liar, last april. there were dozens, proven liar, last april. there were dozens. i'm _ proven liar, last april. there were dozens, i'm afraid. _ proven liar, last april. there were dozens, i'm afraid. it _ proven liar, last april. there were dozens, i'm afraid. it is _ proven liar, last april. there were dozens, i'm afraid. it is important thatl dozens, i'm afraid. it is important that i said — dozens, i'm afraid. it is important that i said it— dozens, i'm afraid. it is important that i said it repeatedly. - dozens, i'm afraid. it is important that i said it repeatedly. boris - that i said it repeatedly. boris johnson accused some members of the community and the chair of being biased because of previous tweets. why was she chairing the community when you step back? the why was she chairing the community when you step back?— when you step back? the house of commons decided _ when you step back? the house of commons decided unanimously . when you step back? the house of| commons decided unanimously she should. ,, ., , ., ., . , should. should she not have recused herself? and — should. should she not have recused herself? and boris _ should. should she not have recused herself? and boris johnson - should. should she not have recused herself? and boris johnson said - should. should she not have recused herself? and boris johnson said on l herself? and boris johnson said on the day that _ herself? and boris johnson said on the day that the _ herself? and boris johnson said on the day that the house _ herself? and boris johnson said on the day that the house voted - the day that the house voted unanimously to set up the community that he was completely relaxed about it. it is on a bit sour grapes. should she not have recused herself?
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i don't think so, it is worth bearing in mind that the community was advised by sir ernest ryder, the former head of the tribunal service, a seniorjudge, that i am certain if he thought there was any point at which they were straying from the straight and narrow in terms of ensuring due process and a fair hearing, and the government paid £250,000 in legalfees hearing, and the government paid £250,000 in legal fees for boris johnson. i think it is rich to call this a kangaroo court. but i am not, in case you ask, i will not opine on whether this is a contempt of parliament because it is possible this will end up being a matter that is referred to a future committee of privileges of which i might be chairing. privileges of which i might be chairina. ~ , . privileges of which i might be chairina. ~ , ., , , privileges of which i might be chairin~.~ ,~ , , , chairing. why are some members being riven extra chairing. why are some members being given extra security? _ chairing. why are some members being given extra security? some _ chairing. why are some members being given extra security? some people - given extra security? some people have been ramping _ given extra security? some people have been ramping up— given extra security? some people have been ramping up the - given extra security? some people have been ramping up the rhetoric| have been ramping up the rhetoric against them. have been ramping up the rhetoric against them-— have been ramping up the rhetoric against them. what has led to them bein: riven against them. what has led to them being given security _ against them. what has led to them being given security in? _ against them. what has led to them being given security in? there - against them. what has led to them being given security in? there have| being given security in? there have been all sorts _ being given security in? there have been all sorts of— being given security in? there have been all sorts of threats, _ being given security in? there have been all sorts of threats, i - being given security in? there have been all sorts of threats, i don't . been all sorts of threats, i don't know what the specific threats are. i have been so careful not to speak to any of them about anything happening on the privileges
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committee, i meet them every week because they are also on the standards committee and it is worth bearing in mind that three members of the community sat on the standards committee when we investigated whether borisjohnson had inappropriately, not properly declared a free holiday in mustique. we find him innocent at the time so those who condemn these people on the select committee have been very unfair. should the house of commons be given the chance now to debate the play privileges committee report and whatever it comes up with? the rocess whatever it comes up with? the process must — whatever it comes up with? the process must be _ whatever it comes up with? the process must be followed and chris bryant _ process must be followed and chris bryant is— process must be followed and chris bryant is closer to this. do you want that _ bryant is closer to this. do you want that in — bryant is closer to this. do you want that in the _ bryant is closer to this. do you want that in the future? - bryant is closer to this. do you want that in the future? it - bryant is closer to this. do you want that in the future? it is i bryant is closer to this. do you i want that in the future? it is right whether there _ want that in the future? it is right whether there is _ want that in the future? it is right whether there is a _ want that in the future? it is right whether there is a prime - want that in the future? it is right whether there is a prime ministerj want that in the future? it is right i whether there is a prime minister or any member of parliament if they have to _ any member of parliament if they have to go through the process of being _ have to go through the process of being scrutinised that that scrutiny is concluded. the nation wants to see that — is concluded. the nation wants to see that i— is concluded. the nation wants to see that. i want to correct something you said earlier, that the
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government is squabbling. we are having _ government is squabbling. we are having a _ government is squabbling. we are having a debate about what the prime minister_ having a debate about what the prime minister said and he made it very clear— minister said and he made it very clear he — minister said and he made it very clear he was following protocol. and now a _ clear he was following protocol. and now a former member of parliament is saying. _ now a former member of parliament is saying. a _ now a former member of parliament is saying, a former member of parliament, to stress that? it is for the — parliament, to stress that? it is for the rest _ parliament, to stress that? it is for the rest of us to support the prime _ for the rest of us to support the prime minister and get back to those very issues— prime minister and get back to those very issues that we want to talk about — very issues that we want to talk about it— very issues that we want to talk about. , , , ., about. it is interesting you describe — about. it is interesting you describe your _ about. it is interesting you describe your former i about. it is interesting you | describe your former prime about. it is interesting you - describe your former prime minister who only three years ago one an 80 seat majority as a former member of parliament now. that seat majority as a former member of parliament now.— parliament now. that is what it is, wh are parliament now. that is what it is, why are you _ parliament now. that is what it is, why are you trying _ parliament now. that is what it is, why are you trying to _ parliament now. that is what it is, why are you trying to dress - parliament now. that is what it is, why are you trying to dress it i parliament now. that is what it is, why are you trying to dress it up . parliament now. that is what it is, | why are you trying to dress it up as anything _ why are you trying to dress it up as anything else? he has decided to go and has _ anything else? he has decided to go and has triggered three by—elections at the _ and has triggered three by—elections at the same time and his stock has fallen _ at the same time and his stock has fallen a_ at the same time and his stock has fallen a lot — at the same time and his stock has fallen. a lot of people have been surprised — fallen. a lot of people have been surprised and disappointed that somebody who we loaded and praised and appreciated the hard work he did as the _ and appreciated the hard work he did as the mayor of london and then winning — as the mayor of london and then winning the election should then treat— winning the election should then treat his — winning the election should then treat his own party in this way. the rest of— treat his own party in this way. the rest of us _ treat his own party in this way. the rest of us now need to support the prime _ rest of us now need to support the prime minister. it is this prime
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minister— prime minister. it is this prime minister that is allowing us to regroup— minister that is allowing us to regroup straight after returning to number— regroup straight after returning to number ten. regroup straight after returning to numberten. | regroup straight after returning to number ten-— number ten. i made the point... i want chris— number ten. i made the point... i want chris bryant _ number ten. i made the point... i want chris bryant to _ number ten. i made the point... i want chris bryant to come - number ten. i made the point... i want chris bryant to come in i number ten. i made the point... i | want chris bryant to come in here. there are some questions for rishi sunak. i don't understand why grant shapps like yesterday about whether or not rishi sunak was involved in the process at all. he or not rishi sunak was involved in the process at all.— the process at all. he said he understood — the process at all. he said he understood he _ the process at all. he said he understood he had _ the process at all. he said he understood he had not i the process at all. he said he understood he had not beenl the process at all. he said he - understood he had not been involved. so there was some wriggle room, ok, fine. secondly, as rishi sunak says today, he thought borisjohnson was asking him to do something improper. why didn't he take the whip of him immediately? if he was being asked to do something he thought was improper. why did he then allowed the resignation honours list to go through at all. i don't think we should have won. i don't want to come across as a hypocrite because i have onlyjust been knighted myself, but i don't think a prime minister who has been ousted and removed in disgrace, as borisjohnson is, should be allowed to present resignation honours list with all
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his cronies on it, some of the most discredited people in british politics. discredited people in british olitics. . ~ discredited people in british olitics. ., ~' , ., discredited people in british olitics. ., ,, , ., , discredited people in british olitics. ., ,, , �* politics. thank you, chris bryant and tobias _ politics. thank you, chris bryant and tobias ellwood, _ politics. thank you, chris bryant and tobias ellwood, thank- politics. thank you, chris bryant and tobias ellwood, thank you l politics. thank you, chris bryant i and tobias ellwood, thank you for your time. thank you both very much and now to kirsty, who is live for us in glasgow. kirsty. murkiness also lies at the heart of scottish politics tonight, which could effect support for the snp and impact the wider independence movement. scotland's former first minister nicola sturgeon is now embroiled in operation branchform, the police investigation into the funding and finances of the snp, triggered after allegations that more than £600,000 gathered through crowdfunding, specifically for a second independence referendum campaign, cannot be accounted for. nicola sturgeon's successor, humza yousef, today refused to suspend nicola sturgeon from the party after calls from two snp msps for her to quit while the probe is ongoing, something she refused to do after her arrest yesterday and questioning by detectives for more than seven hours before being released without charge. she later issued a statement saying
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that she knows beyond doubt that she is innocent of any wrongdoing, and pledged to be back in the scottish parliament soon. her arrest came two months after that of her husband, the former chief executive of the snp, peter murrell, and the party's former treasurer, colin beattie, both of whom had also been released without charge after questioning. humza youself who said it was so important that the presumption of innocence is upheld and that the news of his predecessor's arrest was personally painful was in turn criticsed by the snp mp angus mcneil who said there should be "political distance" between the snp and its former leader. in a moment we'll be joined by the snp's westminister leader ian blackford and labour's leader in scotland, annas sarwar, but first, earlier this afternoon i spoke to one—time leadership contender ash regan about why she is among those msps calling for nicola sturgeon to resign. i think the political implications are if this is damaging the party and it is quite distracting,
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so i was suggesting this morning that is quite normal in a number of organisations that if there was something of this nature someone would, you know, potentially, and in nicola's case, temporarily resign the whip until this matter is concluded. let's be absolutely clear, nicola sturgeon has protested her innocence vehemently. i think if we are going to put the party first i am sure a politician of nicola's stature would be considering the effect this is having both on the party and also on the new leader, humza yousaf, it is putting him into a difficult position i would say. most people would realise he has inherited a rather challenging set of circumstances that he has got to find his way through now. let's be quite clear, if you found yourself in a similar situation, you would immediately resign? i would, yes. has humza yousaf failed the leadership test on suspending
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nicola sturgeon, suspending the whip, given you said there were precedents? has he failed the test? i actually think that, you know, suspending nicola sturgeon, former first minister, colleague of humza, mentor of humza, i think many people would realise that will be a very difficult thing for him to do, so that is why i was suggesting it might be more appropriate for nicola to consider temporarily resigning the whip herself. i'm joined now by former snp westminster leader ian blackford. this is potentially hugely damaging, but also a distraction for the party. would it not be better if nicola sturgeon stood aside until the operation does its business at least? ., ., ., , ., least? no, it would not. there is a live police — least? no, it would not. there is a live police inquiry, _ least? no, it would not. there is a live police inquiry, let's _ least? no, it would not. there is a live police inquiry, let's get - live police inquiry, let's get through to the end of that. what we have got is a new first minister
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discharging his obligations. he was in inverness today officially opening a new national treatment centre. we have got a government thatis centre. we have got a government that is focused on the job in front of it. reference has been made there to the polls. since humza yousaf became leader support for the snp and independence has remained stable. we know we have a job to do over the course of the coming period. it is all about delivery and i am sure we will get to the end of the process of the police investigation. let's respect that and make sure we are focused on delivering for the people of scotland which is what humza yousaf will be doing. scotland which is what humza yousaf will be doing-— will be doing. probity, ian blackford. _ will be doing. probity, ian blackford, is _ will be doing. probity, ian blackford, is much - will be doing. probity, ian blackford, is much more. will be doing. probity, ian - blackford, is much more important here than a loyalty to a former first minister, the longest serving minister. it is about probity. nicola sturgeon absolutely says without a shadow of doubt that she is innocent of everything. for hamza yusuf would not be better had he suspended her which would let him get on with this and let that
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particular investigation follow its course until its end?— course until its end? let's make sure that natural _ course until its end? let's make sure that naturaljustice - course until its end? let's make sure that naturaljustice plays i course until its end? let's make| sure that naturaljustice plays its course. there is an investigation under way, three people have been questioned, peter mark, the former treasurer colin beattie and of course the former first minister. i have spoken to many colleagues... can ijust say have spoken to many colleagues... can i just say we are have spoken to many colleagues... can ijust say we are in a situation where there is most likely to be an election next year and it is incredibly important for people who are going to be perhaps giving you their dear votes that actually clarity is done here. do you think yourself that there is something to see here? that £600,000 is unaccounted for? that is the allegation. that unaccounted for? that is the allegation-— unaccounted for? that is the alleuation. �* ., ., allegation. at the end of the day i am not getting — allegation. at the end of the day i am not getting into _ allegation. at the end of the day i am not getting into the _ allegation. at the end of the day i am not getting into the police i am not getting into the police inquiry, but there is an important promise of innocent unless proven guilty. i have spoken to many
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parliamentarians, msps, mps, party members, party supporters, overthe course of the last 2a hours and there is a well support for what nicola sturgeon has gone through. i understand why you are putting these questions, but we will be doing and focusing on, what the first minister will be doing, is delivering on the people's priority. today with the national treatment centre in inverness it was very important, making sure we are driving down waiting times, something to celebrate for people across the highlands and something that will be replicated up and down the length and breadth of scotland. you replicated up and down the length and breadth of scotland.— and breadth of scotland. you are such a seasoned _ and breadth of scotland. you are such a seasoned politician, ian i such a seasoned politician, ian blackford, and you are a businessman and you particularly look at finance and you particularly look at finance and so forth. is it not the case it would do the snp well to have more transparency in their financial dealings? transparency in their financial deafinas? . transparency in their financial dealinas? ., ., , , dealings? humza yousaf is focusing on exactly that. _ dealings? humza yousaf is focusing on exactly that. there _ dealings? humza yousaf is focusing on exactly that. there is _ dealings? humza yousaf is focusing on exactly that. there is a - dealings? humza yousaf is focusing on exactly that. there is a review i on exactly that. there is a review taking place to make sure we have got best practice in place and that is what will happen. he will show
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that we will win the trust of the people of scotland as we head to the election next year. i am working with him on the economic perspective, making sure that we are delivering the green job that scotland needs. we are making sure we are showing people there is a way through the cost of living crisis. have you spoken to nicola sturgeon since her resignation and after she was questioned? t since her resignation and after she was questioned?— was questioned? i speak to the former first — was questioned? i speak to the former first minister— was questioned? i speak to the former first minister regularly, j was questioned? i speak to the i former first minister regularly, but i have not spoken to her in the last 24—hour. i have not spoken to her in the last 24-hour. ~ ., ., , ., i have not spoken to her in the last 24-hour. ~ ., ., i. i have not spoken to her in the last 24-hour. ~ ., ., ., 24-hour. what would you say to her toniaht? i 24-hour. what would you say to her tonight? | think — 24-hour. what would you say to her tonight? i think what _ 24-hour. what would you say to her tonight? i think what many - 24-hour. what would you say to her tonight? i think what many people | tonight? i think what many people have said to _ tonight? i think what many people have said to me _ tonight? i think what many people have said to me is, _ tonight? i think what many people have said to me is, please - tonight? i think what many people have said to me is, please send i tonight? i think what many people. have said to me is, please send our love to nicola sturgeon. people feel for what she had to go through yesterday. there is a sense of tremendous affection towards her. talking about the polling, the approval ratings of nicola sturgeon have been very high throughout scotland. . ~ have been very high throughout scotland. ., ,, , ., , . have been very high throughout scotland. . ~ , ., , . ., scotland. thank you very much for “oininr scotland. thank you very much for joining us- — thank you very much forjoining us. here's scottish labour leader anas sarwar.
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all three have been released without charge, there could be nothing to see here. . , ., ., see here. the police investigation has to be allowed _ see here. the police investigation has to be allowed to _ see here. the police investigation has to be allowed to take - see here. the police investigation has to be allowed to take its i see here. the police investigation i has to be allowed to take its course and there _ has to be allowed to take its course and there should be no prejudice in the investigation. but what a mess. if the investigation. but what a mess. it you _ the investigation. but what a mess. it you look— the investigation. but what a mess. if you look at british politics over the last— if you look at british politics over the last 48 hours and if you see the clown _ the last 48 hours and if you see the clown show — the last 48 hours and if you see the clown show we have going on at westminster with borisjohnson clown show we have going on at westminster with boris johnson and rishi sunak and what you see happening in scotland, i think at a time _ happening in scotland, i think at a time when — happening in scotland, i think at a time when we have a twin crisis of a cost of— time when we have a twin crisis of a cost of living — time when we have a twin crisis of a cost of living crisis and an nhs crisis _ cost of living crisis and an nhs crisis we — cost of living crisis and an nhs crisis we have two political parties that are _ crisis we have two political parties that are in — crisis we have two political parties that are in meltdown and now two dysfunctional government and that is bad for— dysfunctional government and that is bad for people right across this country — bad for people right across this count . ., �* ., . ,, ., bad for people right across this count . ., �* ., , country. ian blackford is saying humza yousaf _ country. ian blackford is saying humza yousaf is _ country. ian blackford is saying humza yousaf is getting - country. ian blackford is saying humza yousaf is getting on i country. ian blackford is saying| humza yousaf is getting on with country. ian blackford is saying i humza yousaf is getting on with the business of government. t am humza yousaf is getting on with the business of government.— business of government. i am not sure that is _ business of government. i am not sure that is what _ business of government. i am not sure that is what is _ business of government. i am not sure that is what is happening i business of government. i am not sure that is what is happening in i sure that is what is happening in practice — sure that is what is happening in practice. this is a party martin
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scandal, martin division and incomplete meltdown and distracted from the _ incomplete meltdown and distracted from the job of delivering for the scottish— from the job of delivering for the scottish people.— scottish people. nicola sturgeon made it perfectly _ scottish people. nicola sturgeon made it perfectly clear, innocentj made it perfectly clear, innocent of all charges, wants to get back to business and humza yousaf said innocent until proven guilty, so there is no need to suspend nicola sturgeon. there is no need to suspend nicola sturreon. ., , ., , ., sturgeon. ultimately that is a decision for _ sturgeon. ultimately that is a decision for the snp - sturgeon. ultimately that is a i decision for the snp and humza yousaf as— decision for the snp and humza yousaf as the leader. when nicola sturgeon was first minister she set the precedent that what was the bar in terms _ the precedent that what was the bar in terms of— the precedent that what was the bar in terms of summer crossing that in order— in terms of summer crossing that in order to _ in terms of summer crossing that in order to get — in terms of summer crossing that in order to get suspended. were there all sorts of different _ order to get suspended. were there all sorts of different ways _ order to get suspended. were there all sorts of different ways that i order to get suspended. were there all sorts of different ways that was i all sorts of different ways that was dealt with. there was ways of suspension and resignation, there was no hard and fast rule. tt is suspension and resignation, there was no hard and fast rule.- was no hard and fast rule. it is for humza yousaf _ was no hard and fast rule. it is for humza yousaf and _ was no hard and fast rule. it is for humza yousaf and the _ was no hard and fast rule. it is for humza yousaf and the snp - was no hard and fast rule. it is for humza yousaf and the snp to i was no hard and fast rule. it is for. humza yousaf and the snp to decide how they— humza yousaf and the snp to decide how they operate a political party and whether she should be suspended or not _ and whether she should be suspended or not but _ and whether she should be suspended or not. but this is a first minister that is— or not. but this is a first minister that is weak, that is not strong enough — that is weak, that is not strong enough to— that is weak, that is not strong enough to take on the establishment in his— enough to take on the establishment in his own _ enough to take on the establishment in his own political party. he is a self-styled — in his own political party. he is a self—styled continuity candidate, but if _ self—styled continuity candidate, but if this — self—styled continuity candidate, but if this cultural cover—up and secrecy— but if this cultural cover—up and secrecy is — but if this cultural cover—up and secrecy is how these people do government, a culture of government -- cover-up _ government, a culture of government —— cover—up and secrecy, that has real— —— cover—up and secrecy, that has real consequences for people, people waiting to _ real consequences for people, people waiting to get vital nhs treatment, people _ waiting to get vital nhs treatment, people struggling to put the food on the table _ people struggling to put the food on the table. and at the same time we
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see this _ the table. and at the same time we see this across the uk and people across— see this across the uk and people across this — see this across the uk and people across this country deserve better. and a _ across this country deserve better. and a sour. — across this country deserve better. and a sour, thank you very much indeed. victoria. —— anat sarwar. the covid inquiry gets under way tomorrow as it starts to examine how prepared the uk was at the start of 2020 to face the pandemic. but questions are already being asked in scientific communities about how ready we are for the next one. today, deputy prime minister oliver dowden launched a new "biothreats radar" designed to sniff out any potential biological threats to the uk — including those which could become the next pandemic. but pandemic threats could come from many sources, and key to minimising the impact is being prepared. our science correspondent kate lamble's been looking at what worked, what didn't and what we can learn about how to prepare for next time around. there will almost certainly be another pandemic. we just don't know when. it's why ongoing vaccine research here in oxford is crucial. but from testing labs to vaccine hubs, the uk has been packing up
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much of its covid—19 response. we have a number of huge challenges that threaten human populations. there's climate change. we also prepare ourselves for military threats, and we have billions invested every year in those, quite rightly. but we don't do anything close to that for preparing for pandemics. so no, we're not doing enough. those whose work on vaccines helped lead the uk out of lockdown are convinced preparation for the next pathogen needs to start now, not when the threat is on our doorstep. the vaccine development was presented as a very rapid development, but the truth is that we had 20 years of research on coronavirus vaccines that had been established before the pandemic. so we should really look at it as 20 years and 11 months because of all that work. the problem for the future, for pandemics that could threaten us, is we don't have that 20 years
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back story for many of the other viruses which could cause pandemics. some suggest that means the state needs to invest, notjust in research but manufacturing and emergency government systems too. the uk, i think, led the world in terms of the science innovation, in terms of the diagnostic capacity, the genomic surveillance, the astrazeneca oxford vaccine. the clinical trials were the best in the world. but a lot of that is actually being dismantled, and you can understand that there are competing priorities in government. so i think there are elements that were realjewels in the crown of the uk response that have seen no strategic investment going forward. the government says pandemic response plans are continually updated, and points to an idea it put forward to the g7 in 2021... a mission to deploy safe and effective diagnosis and vaccines within the first 100 days of a new pandemic.
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we were clear that we all need to build back better in a way that delivers for all our people and for the people of the world. that means preventing a pandemic like this from ever happening again. what i haven't seen is that initiative translated into a real roadmap of how we're going to get there. and i think it has fallen off the political agenda. vaccines are one thing, but first you've got to diagnose the problem. for covid—19, testing became crucial. at one stage, the uk was managing to run hundreds of thousands of tests a day. today, the majority of the so—called lighthouse labs contracted to process covid tests have stopped that work. now, it's not reasonable to expect laboratories to wait on hand for potentially decades. what we need to work out is how do we get from a situation where we don't need something — and it'd be really costly to keep hold of it the whole time — to a situation where actually we needed it yesterday.
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part of that is securing buildings and equipment. researchers suggest there are more important factors. i'm not saying it's easy to get a building, but actually, comparatively speaking, the thing that takes the time is getting people who know what they're doing to get a test working at the very beginning. without being able to make sure testing can be automated and accurate, scaling the technology up can be tricky — just like we saw in the early days of the pandemic. i think what would happen if we got another challenge like covid is we would again have that slow phase of ramping up response. i think we really do have the opportunity to build on it. i think we do have people with those skills in the uk. we're really lucky because of the biotechnology sector we have. the other big lesson of the pandemic, of course, was that it wasn'tjust the response of scientists which mattered. it was the response of society too. thinking back on previous planning and exercising, it tended to be seen as a sort
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of nhs and social care thing and something that public health folk do. the pandemic we've lived through taught us that the response was a whole of society response. so planning for economic resilience, planning for maintaining good communications infrastructure, planning for how you keep schools and the education system open for as long as humanly possible was equally important to planning for ppe and ventilator capacity and vaccination systems and infrastructure. so getting that bit right in planning and exercising, it's kind of a whole society type of thing. we need to think on that. most plans won't survive a pandemic intact, but not being prepared can mean delays, disorder, potentially deaths. tomorrow, the covid inquiry will start to unpack our last attempt to prepare for a pandemic in the hope we're better placed to deal with the next one. a mum of three has been sentenced to more than two years in prison for taking abortion pills
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after the legal uk limit. in a case which the judge described as tragic, the 44—year—old received the medication following a remote consultation where she wasn't honest about how far along she was in her pregnancy. the "pills by post" scheme, introduced in lockdown, allows pregnancies up to ten weeks to be terminated at home. prosecutors said the woman had knowingly misled the british pregnancy advisory service by saying she was below the 10 week cut—off, when she believed she was about 28 weeks pregnant. doctors later concluded the foetus was from 32 to 34 weeks' gestation — that's seven to eight months. in england, scotland and wales, abortion is generally legal up to 24 weeks? but is carried out in a hospital or clinic after 10 weeks. with me to discuss this is the labour mp stella creasy, who campaigned to establish women s access to abortion as a human right. and the writer and academic who opposes abortion,
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james mumford, author of vexed: ethics beyond political tribes, and whose oxford phd published in 2013 was "ethics at the beginning of life". welcome to both of you. stella creasey, the court heard this mother of three lied, that she pleaded guilty and had she pleaded guilty earlier she would have avoided a jail sentence.— earlier she would have avoided a “ail sentence. ~ ., , i. , , jail sentence. what is your response to her punishment? _ jail sentence. what is your response to her punishment? i— jail sentence. what is your response to her punishment? i don't - to her punishment? i don't understand and whose interest in this case was only must remember there have been a number of investigations, 67 in the last ten years, underthis investigations, 67 in the last ten years, under this legislation, which is a hangoverfrom years, under this legislation, which is a hangover from the 1800s, that puts having an abortion on the same paras puts having an abortion on the same par as using gunpowder to blow up a building. we have a mother of three, one of whom have special educational needs,in one of whom have special educational needs, in prison tonight rather than with her children. it is a horrible case. but it also shows the truth that when you say abortion is legal
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in this country, actually it is not. under some circumstances that you will not be prosecuted.— will not be prosecuted. abortion is le . al u - to will not be prosecuted. abortion is legal up to 24 _ will not be prosecuted. abortion is legal up to 24 weeks _ will not be prosecuted. abortion is legal up to 24 weeks and - will not be prosecuted. abortion is legal up to 24 weeks and up i will not be prosecuted. abortion is legal up to 24 weeks and up to i will not be prosecuted. abortion isj legal up to 24 weeks and up to full term in certain circumstances? tt is term in certain circumstances? it is onl leral term in certain circumstances? it is only legal in _ term in certain circumstances? tt 3 only legal in northern ireland where there is a human rights framework that says you have the legal right but in this country you are exempted from prosecution under this very legislation if you fulfil a certain condition, if two doctors say if you did not have an abortion it would cause greater harm. what this prosecution and the other live cases, other women are being investigated, it shows this is not fit for purpose because abortion is a health care issue, it is not a criminal matter. and however awful people feel about this case, and there is no doubt it has arisen strong feelings, if people have a right to choose and we need to make sure the law reflects that that is how we want to perceive this. there is no other health care service
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which are subject to a criminal foundation and with further prosecutions potentially along the way, this could have a very chilling effect on people being able to exercise their right to choose and thatis exercise their right to choose and that is something the vast majority of the public recognise and support, the woman's right to bodily autonomy. the woman's right to bodily autonomy-— the woman's right to bodily autonomy. the woman's right to bodily autonom , ~ ., , the woman's right to bodily autonom. , ~ ., , ., ., autonomy. james mumford, this woman was vulnerable — autonomy. james mumford, this woman was vulnerable and _ autonomy. james mumford, this woman was vulnerable and the _ autonomy. james mumford, this woman was vulnerable and the judge _ was vulnerable and the judge acknowledge that and she moved back with a partner at the start of lockdown while carrying another man's baby and the judge so that she was an emotional turmoil and was depressed and had deep remorse and had flashbacks about her dead child's face. she is a mother of three. is a 28 month sentence justified? this three. is a 28 month sentence 'ustified? �* , . three. is a 28 month sentence 'ustified? ~ , ., , ., justified? as a 'udge said, it is a hue justified? as a 'udge said, it is a huge tragedy. — justified? as a judge said, it is a huge tragedy, particularly i justified? as a judge said, it is a| huge tragedy, particularly having three _ huge tragedy, particularly having three children at home. but in this country— three children at home. but in this country we — three children at home. but in this country we have a very extreme abortion— country we have a very extreme abortion on— country we have a very extreme abortion on demand culture, it is
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out of— abortion on demand culture, it is out of line — abortion on demand culture, it is out of line with the rest of europe.

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