is often an unseen -roblem. we are _ is often ani unseen problem. we are talking is often an unseen -roblem. we are talkin of unseen problem. we are talking of light weight, prone to collapse material, especially if there is water ingress. used in the 50s, 60s and 70s and 80s. at least 700,000 children at risk. the government said its on the case. then there is the asbestos. get in touch, speak soon.

around 700,000 children are being taught in buildings that need repairs. the government said it has been investing in transforming schools. nine people are known to have died after a russian missile attack in ukraine. rescuers have spent the night looking for survivors in kramatorsk. the chancellor will meet with water and energy regulators to find out what they will do to lower prices. there are concerns that firms are exploiting inflation. and kevin spacey has arrived at his trial in london where he is accused of sexual assaulting men. he denies the charges against him.

the the national audit office found a third of school buildings has develop beyond their initial design life. a lot were put up quickly after the war. so we are talking of 24,000 after the war. so we are talking of 2a,000 buildings. the risk of injury or death from a school building or collapse has been assessed as very likely or critical. what the hell's going on. jessica hill is with us and racheljones, a head teacher at and racheljones, a head teacher at a school in cheshire. rachel, what is it like at your school and showing parents around? interesting,

a olouetic, showing parents around? interesting, apologetic, showing _ showing parents around? interesting, apologetic, showing people _ showing parents around? interesting, apologetic, showing people around, l apologetic, showing people around, embarrassing. at times with some areas. we are a very old building. we are a small rural church school, the building was built in 1851. the backlog of work, we have an old heating system, very poor wiring that has been patched up, but no overhaul, because we don't have the funds for it. stressful. and really difficult prioritising what to spend, what to do first and what to you need and any decisions that we make on buildings has a direct impact on standards in classroom and other budgetary requirements that are already stretched. for other budgetary requirements that are already stretched.— other budgetary requirements that are already stretched. for sure, we can aet are already stretched. for sure, we can get into — are already stretched. for sure, we can get into that. _ are already stretched. for sure, we can get into that. but _ are already stretched. for sure, we can get into that. but we _ are already stretched. for sure, we can get into that. but we are - are already stretched. for sure, we can get into that. but we are not i can get into that. but we are not talking about reinforced autoclaved

concrete. that was put up and it is cheap and not scheerful. your —— cheerful. your problems go further back? , ., ., , ., ~ back? yes the one example i talked and yesterday _ back? yes the one example i talked and yesterday was _ back? yes the one example i talked and yesterday was the _ back? yes the one example i talked and yesterday was the heating - and yesterday was the heating system. we have two areas of our school are very old, but this is quite new. well quite new, so going back to the 50s, 60s, with flat rooves. we have had issues with flooding and buildings are in disrepair and wejust flooding and buildings are in disrepair and we just patch them up where we can. the heating system is in need of overhaul. the cost of that, our initial prices for that would be £165,000. so we can bid for that, we can bid for a schools' condition allocation bid, but those bids are given out based on health and safety, but also whether things

are in a good state of working order, which our heating does work, it isjust not order, which our heating does work, it is just not brilliant. it is order, which our heating does work, it isjust not brilliant.— it isjust not brilliant. it is “ust very cold fl it isjust not brilliant. it is “ust very cold sometimes. i it isjust not brilliant. it is “ust very cold sometimes. we h it isjust not brilliant. it isjust. very cold sometimes. we could it isjust not brilliant. it isjust - very cold sometimes. we could be heading to something. jessica hill, investigations reporter for schools week. it could be akin to the cladding crisis. it seems to be coming to a head with a lot of the building getting past its shelf life at the same time. i building getting past its shelf life at the same time.— at the same time. i think you're riuht. i at the same time. i think you're right- i think— at the same time. i think you're right. i think it _ at the same time. i think you're right. i think it is _ at the same time. i think you're right. i think it is dangerous - at the same time. i think you're right. i think it is dangerous for| right. i think it is dangerous for the publie _ right. i think it is dangerous for the public. we were first alerted to this in_ the public. we were first alerted to this in 2018, there was a school in kent _ this in 2018, there was a school in kent which — this in 2018, there was a school in kent which had rack in its ceiling. it collapsed. luckily, the incident happened — it collapsed. luckily, the incident happened at the weekend and no one was hurt _ happened at the weekend and no one was hurt. but i think the school itself_ was hurt. but i think the school itself was — was hurt. but i think the school itself was only given 24 hours' notice — itself was only given 24 hours' notice that there was a problem.

that highlights that this is a serious _ that highlights that this is a serious issue and the government doesn't _ serious issue and the government doesn't have a handle on how bad things— doesn't have a handle on how bad things are — doesn't have a handle on how bad things are. we know there are 24 schools— things are. we know there are 24 schools that require emergency action — schools that require emergency action. but there could be more. there _ action. but there could be more. there is— action. but there could be more. there is 572_ action. but there could be more. there is 572 schools which we know may have _ there is 572 schools which we know may have been used. but one in ten councits— may have been used. but one in ten councils in— may have been used. but one in ten councils in multi—academy trusts haven't— councils in multi—academy trusts haven't responded to a government survey— haven't responded to a government survey that — haven't responded to a government survey that has been out for over a year. _ survey that has been out for over a year. asking — survey that has been out for over a year, asking whether they have rack in their— year, asking whether they have rack in their school estate. one in ten schools _ in their school estate. one in ten schools don't know, it could be more — schools don't know, it could be more it — schools don't know, it could be more it is— schools don't know, it could be more. it is prevalent in colleges and nurseries and other buildings too. and nurseries and other buildings toe but— and nurseries and other buildings toe but it — and nurseries and other buildings too. but it isjust that the focus at this— too. but it isjust that the focus at this points has been on schools and hospitals. | at this points has been on schools and hosnitats-_ at this points has been on schools and hospitals. i was going do make that oint.

and hospitals. i was going do make that point. sorry, _ and hospitals. i was going do make that point. sorry, i— and hospitals. i was going do make that point. sorry, ijust _ and hospitals. i was going do make that point. sorry, ijust bust - and hospitals. i was going do make that point. sorry, ijust bust the . that point. sorry, ijust bust the microphone with my hand! a lot of people are making that point. we want to hear from people are making that point. we want to hearfrom parents people are making that point. we want to hear from parents and teachers, do you sometimes look at the school and think, hang on? jessica, there, there was a national safety warning in 2018 after the roof of a primary school in kent collapsed with no warning. as you said, it occurred at the weekend when the building was empty. but experts are saying it is an unseen problem. tens of thousands of these structural panels exist across a broad set of buildings. many constructed in the 60s and 70s. many now showing signs of wear and tear and deterioration and the majority formed the roof strbg schur and it

—— structure and it is difficult to know what is going on up there? just because a building has rack in it, it doesh't— because a building has rack in it, it doesn't necessarily make it dangerous. it might be in the walls, but there _ dangerous. it might be in the walls, but there is— dangerous. it might be in the walls, but there is other material there is and it— but there is other material there is and it is— but there is other material there is and it is deemed to be safe. because it has— and it is deemed to be safe. because it has it _ and it is deemed to be safe. because it has it doesn't necessarily make it has it doesn't necessarily make it dangerous. but some are and it depends— it dangerous. but some are and it depends how old they are. this type of concrete — depends how old they are. this type of concrete has been compared to me as being. _ of concrete has been compared to me as being, from experts like an aerochocolate bar. because it is tight— aerochocolate bar. because it is tight and — aerochocolate bar. because it is light and liable to collapse. because it was light wait, it enabled _ because it was light wait, it enabled buildings to be put up quickly — enabled buildings to be put up quickly. and you can't tell from looking — quickly. and you can't tell from looking at — quickly. and you can't tell from looking at a building whether it has rack in— looking at a building whether it has rack in it — looking at a building whether it has rack in it. surveyors up and down

the country— rack in it. surveyors up and down the country are busy now being sent into schools — the country are busy now being sent into schools and other type of buildings try find out whether the buildings — buildings try find out whether the buildings have rack and if they do, how dangerous is it.— how dangerous is it. liable to colla se how dangerous is it. liable to collapse in — how dangerous is it. liable to collapse in some _ how dangerous is it. liable to collapse in some cases. - how dangerous is it. liable to collapse in some cases. let's| how dangerous is it. liable to - collapse in some cases. let's hear from you. if you're in the building trade and know about this let's talk to can dan in cheltenham.- trade and know about this let's talk to can dan in cheltenham. thank you. it is aood to can dan in cheltenham. thank you. it is good that — to can dan in cheltenham. thank you. it is good that you're _ to can dan in cheltenham. thank you. it is good that you're on. _ to can dan in cheltenham. thank you. it is good that you're on. we - to can dan in cheltenham. thank you. it is good that you're on. we are - it is good that you're on. we are talking notjust about rack, but other issues and i mentioned rachel jones, a school built way back in the 1860s. be there is the asbestos problem. tell us about your mum? mr; problem. tell us about your mum? my mum sadly passed away in 2017 of mesothelioma, _ mum sadly passed away in 2017 of mesothelioma, which— mum sadly passed away in 2017 of mesothelioma, which is— mum sadly passed away in 2017 of mesothelioma, which is an - mesothelioma, which is an asbestos—related - mesothelioma, which is an asbestos—related cancer. l mesothelioma, which is an i asbestos—related cancer. that mesothelioma, which is an - asbestos—related cancer. that was a great _ asbestos—related cancer. that was a great shock— asbestos—related cancer. that was a great shock to — asbestos—related cancer. that was a great shock to us. _ asbestos—related cancer. that was a great shock to us. my— asbestos—related cancer. that was a great shock to us. my mum -

asbestos—related cancer. that was a great shock to us. my mum was - asbestos—related cancer. that was a . great shock to us. my mum was coming to retirement _ great shock to us. my mum was coming to retirement age — great shock to us. my mum was coming to retirement age and _ great shock to us. my mum was coming to retirement age and in _ great shock to us. my mum was coming to retirement age and in general- to retirement age and in general good _ to retirement age and in general good health— to retirement age and in general good health until— to retirement age and in general good health until the _ to retirement age and in general good health until the latter- to retirement age and in general good health until the latter partl to retirement age and in general. good health until the latter part of her illness — good health until the latter part of her illness. but _ good health until the latter part of her illness. but sadly— good health until the latter part of her illness. but sadly she - good health until the latter part of her illness. but sadly she was - her illness. but sadly she was exposed — her illness. but sadly she was exposed to— her illness. but sadly she was exposed to asbestos - her illness. but sadly she was exposed to asbestos as - her illness. but sadly she was exposed to asbestos as a - her illness. but sadly she was - exposed to asbestos as a primary school _ exposed to asbestos as a primary school teacher _ exposed to asbestos as a primary school teacher in, _ exposed to asbestos as a primary school teacher in, as _ exposed to asbestos as a primary school teacher in, as many- exposed to asbestos as a primaryl school teacher in, as many people and your— school teacher in, as many people and your listeners _ school teacher in, as many people and your listeners will— school teacher in, as many people and your listeners will have - school teacher in, as many people and your listeners will have kind . school teacher in, as many people| and your listeners will have kind of understand, — and your listeners will have kind of understand, a— and your listeners will have kind of understand, a lot _ and your listeners will have kind of understand, a lot of— and your listeners will have kind of understand, a lot of these - and your listeners will have kind of. understand, a lot of these temporary hut-style _ understand, a lot of these temporary hut—style classroom _ understand, a lot of these temporary hut—style classroom buildings - understand, a lot of these temporary hut—style classroom buildings that i hut—style classroom buildings that are dotted — hut—style classroom buildings that are dotted around _ hut—style classroom buildings that are dotted around schools. - hut—style classroom buildings that are dotted around schools. in - hut—style classroom buildings that| are dotted around schools. in what was meant — are dotted around schools. in what was meant to — are dotted around schools. in what was meant to be _ are dotted around schools. in what was meant to be a _ are dotted around schools. in what was meant to be a temporary- are dotted around schools. in what i was meant to be a temporary solution to school— was meant to be a temporary solution to school teaching _ was meant to be a temporary solution to school teaching classrooms. - was meant to be a temporary solution to school teaching classrooms. so - was meant to be a temporary solution to school teaching classrooms. so it. to school teaching classrooms. so it was found _ to school teaching classrooms. so it was found that _ to school teaching classrooms. so it was found that my— to school teaching classrooms. so it was found that my mum _ to school teaching classrooms. so it was found that my mum was - to school teaching classrooms. so it. was found that my mum was exposed to school teaching classrooms. so it- was found that my mum was exposed to asbestos _ was found that my mum was exposed to asbestos when _ was found that my mum was exposed to asbestos when she _ was found that my mum was exposed to asbestos when she was _ was found that my mum was exposed to asbestos when she was a _ was found that my mum was exposed to asbestos when she was a teacher. - was found that my mum was exposed to asbestos when she was a teacher. and i asbestos when she was a teacher. and the latency— asbestos when she was a teacher. and the latency of— asbestos when she was a teacher. and the latency of the _ asbestos when she was a teacher. and the latency of the cancer— asbestos when she was a teacher. and the latency of the cancer and - asbestos when she was a teacher. and the latency of the cancer and sadly - the latency of the cancer and sadly 16 other— the latency of the cancer and sadly 16 other teachers _ the latency of the cancer and sadly 16 other teachers a _ the latency of the cancer and sadly 16 other teachers a year _ the latency of the cancer and sadly 16 other teachers a year on - the latency of the cancer and sadlyl 16 other teachers a year on average sadly— 16 other teachers a year on average sadly are _ 16 other teachers a year on average sadly are exposed _ 16 other teachers a year on average sadly are exposed and _ 16 other teachers a year on average sadly are exposed and die - 16 other teachers a year on average sadly are exposed and die in- 16 other teachers a year on average sadly are exposed and die in the . sadly are exposed and die in the same _ sadly are exposed and die in the same way— sadly are exposed and die in the same way as— sadly are exposed and die in the same way as my— sadly are exposed and die in the same way as my mum. - sadly are exposed and die in the same way as my mum. yes, - sadly are exposed and die in the same way as my mum. yes, it. sadly are exposed and die in the| same way as my mum. yes, it is sadly are exposed and die in the . same way as my mum. yes, it is a terminal— same way as my mum. yes, it is a terminal form _ same way as my mum. yes, it is a terminal form of— same way as my mum. yes, it is a terminal form of cancer— terminal form of cancer unfortunately. - terminal form of cancer unfortunately. the - terminal form of cancer- unfortunately. the government terminal form of cancer— unfortunately. the government know about _ unfortunately. the government know about this _ unfortunately. the government know about this~ i— unfortunately. the government know about this. i met _ unfortunately. the government know about this. i met with _

unfortunately. the government know about this. i met with david - unfortunately. the government know about this. i met with david laws, i about this. i met with david laws, the education _ about this. i met with david laws, the education minister— about this. i met with david laws, the education minister at - about this. i met with david laws, the education minister at the i about this. i met with david laws, i the education minister at the time. with my— the education minister at the time. with my mother— the education minister at the time. with my mother and _ the education minister at the time. with my mother and my— the education minister at the time. with my mother and my mp- the education minister at the time. with my mother and my mp and ii the education minister at the time. i with my mother and my mp and i think that the _ with my mother and my mp and i think that the government _ with my mother and my mp and i think that the government know— with my mother and my mp and i think that the government know about - with my mother and my mp and i think that the government know about this, i that the government know about this, they have _ that the government know about this, they have known — that the government know about this, they have known about _ that the government know about this, they have known about the _ that the government know about this, they have known about the sad - they have known about the sad standard — they have known about the sad standard of _ they have known about the sad standard of the _ they have known about the sad standard of the school - they have known about the sad standard of the school buildingj standard of the school building stock _ standard of the school building stock in — standard of the school building stock in the _ standard of the school building stock in the uk _ standard of the school building stock in the uk and _ standard of the school building stock in the uk and in - standard of the school building stock in the uk and in my- standard of the school building . stock in the uk and in my mum's cases— stock in the uk and in my mum's casesand— stock in the uk and in my mum's cases and other, _ stock in the uk and in my mum's cases and other, we _ stock in the uk and in my mum's cases and other, we think- stock in the uk and in my mum's cases and other, we think they . stock in the uk and in my mum's i cases and other, we think they have made _ cases and other, we think they have made a _ cases and other, we think they have made a cost — cases and other, we think they have made a cost risk— cases and other, we think they have made a cost risk analysis _ cases and other, we think they have made a cost risk analysis on - cases and other, we think they have made a cost risk analysis on the i made a cost risk analysis on the level— made a cost risk analysis on the level of— made a cost risk analysis on the level of exposure _ made a cost risk analysis on the level of exposure that _ made a cost risk analysis on the level of exposure that people i made a cost risk analysis on the. level of exposure that people are having _ level of exposure that people are having against _ level of exposure that people are having against the _ level of exposure that people are having against the cost _ level of exposure that people are having against the cost of- level of exposure that people are having against the cost of fixing i level of exposure that people are | having against the cost of fixing it all. having against the cost of fixing it all for _ having against the cost of fixing it all for my— having against the cost of fixing it all. for my mum. _ having against the cost of fixing it all. for my mum, that— having against the cost of fixing it all. for my mum, that was- having against the cost of fixing it all. for my mum, that was way. having against the cost of fixing it. all. for my mum, that was way too late _ all. for my mum, that was way too late the _ all. for my mum, that was way too late. the government— all. for my mum, that was way too late. the government keep - all. for my mum, that was way too late. the government keep data i all. for my mum, that was way too| late. the government keep data on teachers. _ late. the government keep data on teachers. but — late. the government keep data on teachers, but that _ late. the government keep data on teachers, but that is _ late. the government keep data on teachers, but that is not— late. the government keep data on teachers, but that is not to - late. the government keep data on teachers, but that is not to say i teachers, but that is not to say they— teachers, but that is not to say they don't— teachers, but that is not to say they don't keep _ teachers, but that is not to say they don't keep data _ teachers, but that is not to say they don't keep data on - teachers, but that is not to say i they don't keep data on cleaners teachers, but that is not to say - they don't keep data on cleaners and other— they don't keep data on cleaners and other employees _ they don't keep data on cleaners and other employees that— they don't keep data on cleaners and other employees that go _ they don't keep data on cleaners and other employees that go in - they don't keep data on cleaners and other employees that go in and i they don't keep data on cleaners and other employees that go in and out i other employees that go in and out of buildings — other employees that go in and out of buildings and _ other employees that go in and out of buildings and are _ other employees that go in and out of buildings and are perhaps - other employees that go in and out . of buildings and are perhaps exposed to the _ of buildings and are perhaps exposed to the same — of buildings and are perhaps exposed to the same risk, _ of buildings and are perhaps exposed to the same risk, but— of buildings and are perhaps exposed to the same risk, but are _ of buildings and are perhaps exposed to the same risk, but are not - to the same risk, but are not recorded _ to the same risk, but are not recorded in— to the same risk, but are not recorded in the _ to the same risk, but are not recorded in the stats - to the same risk, but are not recorded in the stats for- to the same risk, but are not| recorded in the stats for this. to the same risk, but are not i recorded in the stats for this. i think— recorded in the stats for this. i think it — recorded in the stats for this. i think it is _ recorded in the stats for this. i think it is a _ recorded in the stats for this. i think it is a larger— recorded in the stats for this. i think it is a larger problem i recorded in the stats for this. ii think it is a larger problem than recorded in the stats for this. i- think it is a larger problem than we perhaps— think it is a larger problem than we perhaps might, _ think it is a larger problem than we perhaps might, the _ think it is a larger problem than we perhaps might, the public- think it is a larger problem than we perhaps might, the public might. perhaps might, the public might think _ perhaps might, the public might think so — perhaps might, the public might think. so that— perhaps might, the public might think. so that is _ perhaps might, the public might

think. so that is my— perhaps might, the public might think. so that is my experiencel perhaps might, the public might- think. so that is my experience with my family — think. so that is my experience with my family g.— think. so that is my experience with m famil . �* , think. so that is my experience with m famil.�* , ., my family. a very important point, we are talking _ my family. a very important point, we are talking about _ my family. a very important point, we are talking about rack - my family. a very important point, we are talking about rack and i my family. a very important point, we are talking about rack and old | we are talking about rack and old buildings and asbestos. it was worth remembering it was common in construction until the late 70s when i think and i remember people were saying, hang on, there is more and more cases like your mum's and it was used in manufacturing, construction, shipping. the government banned most of the asbestos products in 1978. was it before then you think your mother contracted it? i before then you think your mother contracted it?— contracted it? i think as probably exerts contracted it? i think as probably experts will _ contracted it? i think as probably experts will explain, _ contracted it? i think as probably experts will explain, a _ contracted it? i think as probably experts will explain, a lot - contracted it? i think as probably experts will explain, a lot of i experts will explain, a lot of asbestos, _ experts will explain, a lot of asbestos, removing - experts will explain, a lot of asbestos, removing it- experts will explain, a lot of asbestos, removing it is- experts will explain, a lot ofi asbestos, removing it is very expensive _ asbestos, removing it is very expensive and _ asbestos, removing it is very expensive and it _ asbestos, removing it is very expensive and it has- asbestos, removing it is very expensive and it has not- asbestos, removing it is very- expensive and it has not necessarily been _ expensive and it has not necessarily been removed — expensive and it has not necessarily been removed from _ expensive and it has not necessarily been removed from all— expensive and it has not necessarily been removed from all school- expensive and it has not necessarilyl been removed from all school stock. it's been removed from all school stock. it's laid _ been removed from all school stock. it's laid in _ been removed from all school stock. it's laid in situ — been removed from all school stock. it's laid in situ and _ been removed from all school stock. it's laid in situ and where _ been removed from all school stock. it's laid in situ and where it - been removed from all school stock. it's laid in situ and where it is - it's laid in situ and where it is deemed — it's laid in situ and where it is deemed to _ it's laid in situ and where it is deemed to be _ it's laid in situ and where it is deemed to be safe _ it's laid in situ and where it is deemed to be safe s - it's laid in situ and where it is deemed to be safe s it- it's laid in situ and where it is deemed to be safe s it is- it's laid in situ and where it is i deemed to be safe s it is protected in sit _ deemed to be safe s it is protected in sit you — deemed to be safe s it is protected in sit you a— deemed to be safe s it is protected in sit you a lot— deemed to be safe s it is protected in sit you. a lot of— deemed to be safe s it is protected in sit you. a lot of school _ deemed to be safe s it is protected in sit you. a lot of school building i in sit you. a lot of school building retain— in sit you. a lot of school building retain asbestos— in sit you. a lot of school building retain asbestos within _

in sit you. a lot of school building retain asbestos within the - in sit you. a lot of school building retain asbestos within the walls l in sit you. a lot of school buildingl retain asbestos within the walls of the building — retain asbestos within the walls of the building it— retain asbestos within the walls of the building. it is— retain asbestos within the walls of the building. it isjust— retain asbestos within the walls of the building. it isjust the - the building. it isjust the asbestos _ the building. it isjust the asbestos experts - the building. it isjust the asbestos experts come i the building. it isjust the l asbestos experts come and the building. it isjust the _ asbestos experts come and determine whether— asbestos experts come and determine whether it _ asbestos experts come and determine whether it is _ asbestos experts come and determine whether it is safe. _ asbestos experts come and determine whether it is safe. of _ asbestos experts come and determine whether it is safe. of course, - asbestos experts come and determine whether it is safe. of course, i- whether it is safe. of course, i have _ whether it is safe. of course, i have done _ whether it is safe. of course, i have done a _ whether it is safe. of course, i have done a lot _ whether it is safe. of course, i have done a lot of _ whether it is safe. of course, i| have done a lot of campaigning whether it is safe. of course, i- have done a lot of campaigning about this, as _ have done a lot of campaigning about this, as have — have done a lot of campaigning about this, as have my— have done a lot of campaigning about this, as have my family, _ have done a lot of campaigning about this, as have my family, in— have done a lot of campaigning about this, as have my family, in school- this, as have my family, in school buildings — this, as have my family, in school buildings kids— this, as have my family, in school buildings kids are _ this, as have my family, in school buildings kids are kids _ this, as have my family, in school buildings kids are kids and - this, as have my family, in schooll buildings kids are kids and running around _ buildings kids are kids and running around and — buildings kids are kids and running around and it— buildings kids are kids and running around and it is— buildings kids are kids and running around and it is not— buildings kids are kids and running around and it is not necessarily- around and it is not necessarily safe _ around and it is not necessarily safe when _ around and it is not necessarily safe when the _ around and it is not necessarily safe when the fluidity- around and it is not necessarily safe when the fluidity and i around and it is not necessarily safe when the fluidity and the i around and it is not necessarily. safe when the fluidity and the use of the _ safe when the fluidity and the use of the building _ safe when the fluidity and the use of the building is _ safe when the fluidity and the use of the building is as _ safe when the fluidity and the use of the building is as it _ safe when the fluidity and the use of the building is as it should i safe when the fluidity and the use of the building is as it should be l of the building is as it should be in a child — of the building is as it should be in a child setting. _ of the building is as it should be in a child setting. it— of the building is as it should be in a child setting. it should i of the building is as it should be in a child setting. it should be . of the building is as it should be. in a child setting. it should be for play and — in a child setting. it should be for play and kids— in a child setting. it should be for play and kids will— in a child setting. it should be for play and kids will do _ in a child setting. it should be for play and kids will do what - in a child setting. it should be for play and kids will do what kids i in a child setting. it should be for play and kids will do what kids do and knock— play and kids will do what kids do and knock into _ play and kids will do what kids do and knock into thing. _ play and kids will do what kids do and knock into thing. i— play and kids will do what kids do and knock into thing. i mention. play and kids will do what kids do i and knock into thing. i mention the latency— and knock into thing. i mention the latency period _ and knock into thing. i mention the latency period is _ and knock into thing. i mention the latency period is about _ and knock into thing. i mention the latency period is about 20 - and knock into thing. i mention the latency period is about 20 to - and knock into thing. i mention the latency period is about 20 to 30 i latency period is about 20 to 30 years. _ latency period is about 20 to 30 years. depending _ latency period is about 20 to 30 years, depending on _ latency period is about 20 to 30 years, depending on the - latency period is about 20 to 30 i years, depending on the individual as to _ years, depending on the individual as to exposure _ years, depending on the individual as to exposure and _ years, depending on the individual as to exposure and to _ years, depending on the individual as to exposure and to getting i as to exposure and to getting symptoms— as to exposure and to getting symptoms of— as to exposure and to getting symptoms of what _ as to exposure and to getting symptoms of what my - as to exposure and to getting symptoms of what my mum i as to exposure and to getting i symptoms of what my mum had. as to exposure and to getting - symptoms of what my mum had. that means— symptoms of what my mum had. that means that _ symptoms of what my mum had. that means that when _ symptoms of what my mum had. that means that when my— symptoms of what my mum had. that means that when my mum _ symptoms of what my mum had. that means that when my mum was - symptoms of what my mum had. that i means that when my mum was exposed, there is— means that when my mum was exposed, there is children — means that when my mum was exposed, there is children in _ means that when my mum was exposed, there is children in her— means that when my mum was exposed, there is children in her school— there is children in her school setting — there is children in her school setting that _ there is children in her school setting that would _ there is children in her school setting that would have - there is children in her school setting that would have beenl there is children in her school- setting that would have been exposed at the _ setting that would have been exposed at the same _

setting that would have been exposed at the same time, _ setting that would have been exposed at the same time, with— setting that would have been exposed at the same time, with a _ setting that would have been exposed at the same time, with a latency- setting that would have been exposed at the same time, with a latency of i at the same time, with a latency of 20 or— at the same time, with a latency of 20 or 30 _ at the same time, with a latency of 20 or30 years. _ at the same time, with a latency of 20 or 30 years, so _ at the same time, with a latency of 20 or 30 years, so a _ at the same time, with a latency of 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old i 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old safe _ 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old safe in— 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old safe in a _ 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old safe in a school— 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old safe in a school at _ 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old safe in a school at that _ 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old safe in a school at that time - 20 or 30 years, so a ten—year—old safe in a school at that time may. safe in a school at that time may show _ safe in a school at that time may show symptoms _ safe in a school at that time may show symptoms as _ safe in a school at that time may show symptoms as my— safe in a school at that time may show symptoms as my mother, i safe in a school at that time may. show symptoms as my mother, 20 safe in a school at that time may- show symptoms as my mother, 20 or 30 years later. _ show symptoms as my mother, 20 or 30 years later. so— show symptoms as my mother, 20 or 30 years later. so the — show symptoms as my mother, 20 or 30 years later. so the government - show symptoms as my mother, 20 or 30 years later. so the government need i years later. so the government need to get— years later. so the government need to get a _ years later. so the government need to get a handle — years later. so the government need to get a handle on— years later. so the government need to get a handle on this _ years later. so the government need to get a handle on this and _ years later. so the government need to get a handle on this and on... i to get a handle on this and on... this— to get a handle on this and on... this should _ to get a handle on this and on... this should be _ to get a handle on this and on... this should be a _ to get a handle on this and on... this should be a safe _ to get a handle on this and on... this should be a safe place - to get a handle on this and on... this should be a safe place for. this should be a safe place for children— this should be a safe place for children and _ this should be a safe place for children and for— this should be a safe place for children and for employees, . this should be a safe place for. children and for employees, not this should be a safe place for- children and for employees, not just asbestos. _ children and for employees, not just asbestos. but — children and for employees, not just asbestos, but in _ children and for employees, not just asbestos, but in general, _ children and for employees, not just asbestos, but in general, there i asbestos, but in general, there should — asbestos, but in general, there should be — asbestos, but in general, there should be the _ asbestos, but in general, there should be the safe _ asbestos, but in general, there should be the safe place - asbestos, but in general, there should be the safe place for. should be the safe place for children— should be the safe place for children and _ should be the safe place for children and i— should be the safe place for children and i don't - should be the safe place for children and i don't think i should be the safe place for children and i don't think iti should be the safe place for. children and i don't think it the should be the safe place for- children and i don't think it the is at the _ children and i don't think it the is at the moment. _ children and i don't think it the is at the moment. and _ children and i don't think it the is at the moment. and it _ children and i don't think it the is at the moment. and it has - children and i don't think it the is at the moment. and it has beenl children and i don't think it the is i at the moment. and it has been left lyin- at the moment. and it has been left lying to— at the moment. and it has been left lying to just — at the moment. and it has been left lying to just build _ at the moment. and it has been left lying tojust build and _ at the moment. and it has been left lying tojust build and build - at the moment. and it has been left lying tojust build and build until- lying tojust build and build until a huge _ lying tojust build and build until a huge financial— lying tojust build and build until a huge financial deficit - lying tojust build and build until a huge financial deficit at - lying tojust build and build until a huge financial deficit at the i a huge financial deficit at the moment. _ a huge financial deficit at the moment. ~ ., ., a huge financial deficit at the moment-— a huge financial deficit at the moment. ~ ., ., ., ., . moment. we are leading on reforced concrete and — moment. we are leading on reforced concrete and l _ moment. we are leading on reforced concrete and i mentioned _ moment. we are leading on reforced concrete and i mentioned asbestos. | concrete and i mentioned asbestos. we are getting a lot of asbestos calls. we go with the flow. i would like you to listen to tony.- like you to listen to tony. good morning. _

like you to listen to tony. good morning. did — like you to listen to tony. good morning. did you _ like you to listen to tony. good morning. did you hear - like you to listen to tony. good morning. did you hear dan? i l like you to listen to tony. good i morning. did you hear dan? i heard the last part- _ morning. did you hear dan? i heard the last part- i— morning. did you hear dan? i heard the last part. i turned _ morning. did you hear dan? i heard the last part. i turned my _ morning. did you hear dan? i heard the last part. i turned my radio i morning. did you hear dan? i heard the last part. i turned my radio offl the last part. i turned my radio off to stop feedback and just heard the last couple of minutes. the latency. in some cases it is shorter. my brother retired from a life working in the public sector as a librarian and 14 years after his retirement in... late 2021 he passed away in hospital in hastings from asbestosis, contracted certainly from the last place he worked at, which was a public secondary school in lambeth. the building was evacuated and closed down, because of the asbestos. there is no ifs or buts about the fact that there was asbestos in the building and there are concerns about it. he went into hospital in late october of 21.

suffering with breathing difficulties, that was initially diagnosed as a pulmonary embolism, thatis diagnosed as a pulmonary embolism, that is a blood clot. but when he didn't respond to treatment, it was determined that he had very advanced asbestosis and two weeks later he passed away in hospital. and to put is in context. his blood oxygen nation levels in hospital were in the sort of upper 50 and low 60%s. in a normal healthy person it is 90%. his levels were worse than people who died of covid. to be put this, make it worse, my brother was, the carer for this, make it worse, my brother was, the carerfor his this, make it worse, my brother was, the carer for his wife, my sister—in—law, who suffered a stroke not long before that. he was her carer. now she has to be in a care home. because she can't manage by

herself. we home. because she can't manage by herself. ~ ~' ., home. because she can't manage by herself. ~ ~ ., ., home. because she can't manage by herself. ~ ~ ., ,, herself. we know about asbestosis. it is well and _ herself. we know about asbestosis. it is well and widely _ herself. we know about asbestosis. it is well and widely reported i herself. we know about asbestosis. it is well and widely reported on. i it is well and widely reported on. but it has possibly been ignored that this is still in a lot of public buildings and a lot of soos. dan —— schools. and dan's point. several years ago, i'm an e—it manager and i worked across different departments, including social services and helped put in all the it in local authorities. and every building we worked in, we had to look at the asbestos register for that building and if there was anies a y that building and if there was anies a y ies a bes y asbestos there we could not work there. and if there

wasn't, that building didn't have a asbestos register it had to be done before we could move in. that is the work we had to do. there was none of that going back. as that previous calling mentioned, it is notjust the safety of the staff, but the children that were being educated in those steaksments. —— those stea ksments. —— establishments. those steaksments. -- establishments.- those steaksments. -- establishments. , ., establishments. dan, listening to our friend tony, _ establishments. dan, listening to our friend tony, you _ establishments. dan, listening to our friend tony, you make - establishments. dan, listening to our friend tony, you make the i establishments. dan, listening to i our friend tony, you make the point, ourfriend tony, you make the point, dan, that it is all very well banning it in construction as it was in 1978, but getting rid of it, finding itand in 1978, but getting rid of it, finding it and replacing it is a massive challenge?- finding it and replacing it is a massive challenge? yes, it still remains in _ massive challenge? yes, it still remains in the _ massive challenge? yes, it still remains in the school _ massive challenge? yes, it still remains in the school stock. i massive challenge? yes, it still. remains in the school stock. yes, massive challenge? yes, it still- remains in the school stock. yes, it is a huge _ remains in the school stock. yes, it is a huge financial— remains in the school stock. yes, it is a huge financial burden _ remains in the school stock. yes, it is a huge financial burden for - remains in the school stock. yes, it is a huge financial burden for the i is a huge financial burden for the government— is a huge financial burden for the government to _ is a huge financial burden for the government to remove - is a huge financial burden for the government to remove it - is a huge financial burden for the government to remove it or-

is a huge financial burden for the government to remove it or the i government to remove it or the education — government to remove it or the education department- government to remove it or the education department to - government to remove it or the i education department to remove it. it education department to remove it. it needs— education department to remove it. it needs to — education department to remove it. it needs to be — education department to remove it. it needs to be managed _ education department to remove it. it needs to be managed safely- education department to remove it. it needs to be managed safely in i it needs to be managed safely in situ and — it needs to be managed safely in situ and i— it needs to be managed safely in situ and i don't— it needs to be managed safely in situ and i don't think— it needs to be managed safely in situ and i don't think from - it needs to be managed safely in situ and i don't think from my. situ and i don't think from my experience _ situ and i don't think from my experience it _ situ and i don't think from my experience it always - situ and i don't think from my experience it always is. - situ and i don't think from my experience it always is. and l situ and i don't think from myl experience it always is. and as sadly— experience it always is. and as sadly tony's _ experience it always is. and as sadly tony's story— experience it always is. and as sadly tony's story very - experience it always is. and as sadly tony's story very similarl experience it always is. and as l sadly tony's story very similar to my mother's. _ sadly tony's story very similar to my mother's, but _ sadly tony's story very similar to my mother's, but when - sadly tony's story very similar to my mother's, but when my- sadly tony's story very similar to j my mother's, but when my mum sadly tony's story very similar to i my mother's, but when my mum was diagnosed. _ my mother's, but when my mum was diagnosed. it— my mother's, but when my mum was diagnosed, it happened _ my mother's, but when my mum was diagnosed, it happened very- my mother's, but when my mum was diagnosed, it happened very quickly. diagnosed, it happened very quickly at a late _ diagnosed, it happened very quickly at a late stage — diagnosed, it happened very quickly at a late stage of— diagnosed, it happened very quickly at a late stage of treatment - diagnosed, it happened very quickly at a late stage of treatment and i diagnosed, it happened very quickly at a late stage of treatment and it l at a late stage of treatment and it is very— at a late stage of treatment and it is very difficult _ at a late stage of treatment and it is very difficult when _ at a late stage of treatment and it is very difficult when someone's . is very difficult when someone's very ill— is very difficult when someone's very ill to— is very difficult when someone's very ill to try _ is very difficult when someone's very ill to try to _ is very difficult when someone's very ill to try to establish - is very difficult when someone's very ill to try to establish and i very ill to try to establish and pick— very ill to try to establish and pick out — very ill to try to establish and pick out the _ very ill to try to establish and pick out the pieces _ very ill to try to establish and pick out the pieces of- very ill to try to establish and pick out the pieces of how i very ill to try to establish and i pick out the pieces of how they very ill to try to establish and - pick out the pieces of how they were exposed _ pick out the pieces of how they were exposed and — pick out the pieces of how they were exposed and all _ pick out the pieces of how they were exposed and all that _ pick out the pieces of how they were exposed and all that time _ pick out the pieces of how they were exposed and all that time ake - pick out the pieces of how they were exposed and all that time ake —— i exposed and all that time ake —— ago _ exposed and all that time ake —— ago it_ exposed and all that time ake —— ago it is— exposed and all that time ake —— ago it is a — exposed and all that time ake —— ago. it is a difficult— exposed and all that time ake —— ago. it is a difficult thing. - exposed and all that time ake —— ago. it is a difficult thing. i- ago. it is a difficult thing. i think— ago. it is a difficult thing. i think it _ ago. it is a difficult thing. i think it is _ ago. it is a difficult thing. i think it is a _ ago. it is a difficult thing. i think it is a larger- ago. it is a difficult thing. i think it is a larger problemi ago. it is a difficult thing. i- think it is a larger problem than perhaps— think it is a larger problem than perhaps peopie _ think it is a larger problem than perhaps peepie may— think it is a larger problem than perhaps people may think - think it is a larger problem thani perhaps people may think sadly. think it is a larger problem than - perhaps people may think sadly. ”i'he perhaps people may think sadly. department for education in 2018 started sur vague schools to understand —— surveying schools. as of march 202390% of schools had

responded and 8% had identified asbestos. no surprise, dan? hie. asbestos. no surprise, dan? no, sadl , asbestos. no surprise, dan? no, sadly. the _ asbestos. no surprise, dan? no, sadly. the new— asbestos. no surprise, dan? no, sadly, the new buildings are free of it. sadly, the new buildings are free of it but _ sadly, the new buildings are free of it but there — sadly, the new buildings are free of it but there is— sadly, the new buildings are free of it. but there is many— sadly, the new buildings are free of it. but there is many old _ sadly, the new buildings are free of it. but there is many old victorian i it. but there is many old victorian school _ it. but there is many old victorian school buildings _ it. but there is many old victorian school buildings out _ it. but there is many old victorian school buildings out there. - it. but there is many old victorian school buildings out there. and i it. but there is many old victorian . school buildings out there. and they have treen— school buildings out there. and they have been built _ school buildings out there. and they have been built upon _ school buildings out there. and they have been built upon year— school buildings out there. and they have been built upon year on - school buildings out there. and they have been built upon year on year, i have been built upon year on year, cobbled _ have been built upon year on year, cobbled together— have been built upon year on year, cobbled together over— have been built upon year on year, cobbled together over the - have been built upon year on year, cobbled together over the decadesi cobbled together over the decades and it— cobbled together over the decades and it exists— cobbled together over the decades and it exists in— cobbled together over the decades and it exists in the _ cobbled together over the decades and it exists in the school- cobbled together over the decades and it exists in the school building| and it exists in the school building stock _ and it exists in the school building stock stitt~ — and it exists in the school building stock still. every— and it exists in the school building stock still. every school— and it exists in the school building stock still. every school that - and it exists in the school building stock still. every school that has l stock still. every school that has asbestos — stock still. every school that has asbestos should _ stock still. every school that has asbestos should have _ stock still. every school that has asbestos should have an - stock still. every school that has i asbestos should have an asbestos report _ asbestos should have an asbestos report for— asbestos should have an asbestos report for people _ asbestos should have an asbestos report for people to _ asbestos should have an asbestos report for people to review - asbestos should have an asbestos report for people to review to - asbestos should have an asbestos i report for people to review to make sure and _ report for people to review to make sure and keep— report for people to review to make sure and keep people _ report for people to review to make sure and keep people onnest. - report for people to review to make sure and keep people onnest. thati report for people to review to make i sure and keep people onnest. that is what -- _ sure and keep people onnest. that is what -- hohest~ _ sure and keep people onnest. that is what —— honest. you _ sure and keep people onnest. that is what —— honest. you have _ sure and keep people onnest. that is what —— honest. you have a - sure and keep people onnest. that is what —— honest. you have a right - sure and keep people onnest. that is what —— honest. you have a right to. what —— honest. you have a right to request— what —— honest. you have a right to request that — what —— honest. you have a right to request that from _ what —— honest. you have a right to request that from the _ what —— honest. you have a right to request that from the school. - what —— honest. you have a right to request that from the school. not l request that from the school. not that people — request that from the school. not that people need _ request that from the school. not that people need to— request that from the school. not that people need to be _ request that from the school. not that people need to be overly- that people need to be overly worried, _ that people need to be overly worried, but— that people need to be overly worried, but perhaps - that people need to be overly worried, but perhaps that - that people need to be overly worried, but perhaps that is. that people need to be overlyi worried, but perhaps that is a that people need to be overly- worried, but perhaps that is a check and balance — worried, but perhaps that is a check and balance to _ worried, but perhaps that is a check and balance to keep— worried, but perhaps that is a check and balance to keep schools - worried, but perhaps that is a check and balance to keep schools on - worried, but perhaps that is a check and balance to keep schools on the | and balance to keep schools on the ball and balance to keep schools on the bail in— and balance to keep schools on the bail in this — and balance to keep schools on the bail in this to — and balance to keep schools on the ball in this to review _ and balance to keep schools on the ball in this to review it _ and balance to keep schools on the ball in this to review it every- and balance to keep schools on the ball in this to review it every year. ball in this to review it every year and make — ball in this to review it every year and make sure _ ball in this to review it every year and make sure that— ball in this to review it every year and make sure that is— ball in this to review it every year and make sure that is updated i ball in this to review it every year. and make sure that is updated along with the _ and make sure that is updated along with the local — and make sure that is updated along

with the local council. _ and make sure that is updated along with the local council. two _ and make sure that is updated along with the local council.— with the local council. two great calls. jessica. — with the local council. two great calls. jessica, this _ with the local council. two great calls. jessica, this particular - calls. jessica, this particular problem, we will get back to reinforced autoclaved concrete in a second. somebody else who wants to talk about it. but the asbestos situation, your thoughts? i talk about it. but the asbestos situation, your thoughts? i guess the thing with _ situation, your thoughts? i guess the thing with asbestos _ situation, your thoughts? i guess the thing with asbestos is - situation, your thoughts? i guess the thing with asbestos is that i situation, your thoughts? i guess the thing with asbestos is that at | the thing with asbestos is that at least _ the thing with asbestos is that at least we — the thing with asbestos is that at least we know where it is. hopefully. least we know where it is. hepefully-_ least we know where it is. hopefully. least we know where it is. hoefull. , , hopefully. schools can take measures to make sure — hopefully. schools can take measures to make sure it _ hopefully. schools can take measures to make sure it is _ hopefully. schools can take measures to make sure it is safe. _ hopefully. schools can take measures to make sure it is safe. a _ hopefully. schools can take measures to make sure it is safe. a lot - hopefully. schools can take measures to make sure it is safe. a lot of - to make sure it is safe. a lot of health— to make sure it is safe. a lot of health incidents with asbestos, it is realty— health incidents with asbestos, it is really hard to prove when somebody gets ill when it was that — somebody gets ill when it was that... they may have been affected by asbestos. so it's caused loss of life over— by asbestos. so it's caused loss of life over decades, whereas rack is a hidden _ life over decades, whereas rack is a hidden danger. we haven't had any

loss hidden danger. we haven't had any toss of— hidden danger. we haven't had any toss of life — hidden danger. we haven't had any loss of life yet thank goodness, but that is _ loss of life yet thank goodness, but that is not — loss of life yet thank goodness, but that is not to say that that might not be _ that is not to say that that might not be the — that is not to say that that might not be the case in the future. gk, not be the case in the future. ok, let's talk about _ not be the case in the future. ok, let's talk about rack. _ not be the case in the future. oil, let's talk about rack. sean and we have professor chris goodyear. chris thank you. sean, hi, autoclave concrete. tell us about it. last s - rint , concrete. tell us about it. last spring. so _ concrete. tell us about it. last spring. so spring _ concrete. tell us about it. last spring, so spring 2022, - concrete. tell us about it. test spring, so spring 2022, easter, kidses about to come back to school and we had a report from the headmaster saying rack had been found and the building had been condemned and the kids couldn't go back. that was nice. we had just got back. that was nice. we had just got back from all the things that happened with the pandemic and everything. happened with the pandemic and

eve hint. , happened with the pandemic and everything-- 50 _ happened with the pandemic and everything.- so that - happened with the pandemic and everything. yeah. so that was not not another _ everything. yeah. so that was not not another thing. _ everything. yeah. so that was not not another thing. and _ everything. yeah. so that was not not another thing. and i'm - everything. yeah. so that was not not another thing. and i'm in - everything. yeah. so that was not not anotherthing. and i'm in the not another thing. and i'm in the construction industry. my concern was going to be this is going to take forever to sort out. but, it is some positive news, things have got sorted out quickly. i was impressed. we changed schools, i'm a catholic school, 1950s it was built and my concern was both the government and local and central and also to be fair the church, local and central and also to be fairthe church, i'm local and central and also to be fair the church, i'm famous for having short arms and long pockets when it comes to funding things and i thought it would be a nightmare and it would be a bun fight of who was going to pay. but the academy who runs the school, they were organised. the local authority stepped up well. we had the kids going to a school across the park

that had some spare classrooms. they went there for a while. it was not ideal. the funding, by the summer there was portacabins on the field. we are there now. the contract for the build is nearly sorted out. i don't know how long it will take. but if it was put up in a year we should be back in the new school. for three years. but... that should be back in the new school. for three years. but. . ._ should be back in the new school. for three years. but... at least. it was identified. _ for three years. but... at least. it was identified. kas _ for three years. but... at least. it was identified. kas in _ was identified. kas in worcestershire. . g worcestershire. thank you. my situation is _ worcestershire. thank you. my situation is i'm _ worcestershire. thank you. my situation is i'm a _ worcestershire. thank you. my situation is i'm a semi - worcestershire. thank you. my situation is i'm a semi retired l situation is i'm a semi retired teacher— situation is i'm a semi retired teacher and in 1921. we

situation is i'm a semi retired teacherand in 1921. we had situation is i'm a semi retired teacher and in 1921. we had come back— teacher and in 1921. we had come back from — teacher and in 1921. we had come back from covid. there was massive tomorrows. — back from covid. there was massive tomorrows, with global warming we -et tomorrows, with global warming we get huge _ tomorrows, with global warming we get huge thunder storm and there had been a _ get huge thunder storm and there had been a flooding event. walked into school _ been a flooding event. walked into school to _ been a flooding event. walked into school to find the head teacher and premises _ school to find the head teacher and premises manager rushing around with wetties— premises manager rushing around with wetties and _ premises manager rushing around with wellies and the roof of my classroom had caved _ wellies and the roof of my classroom had caved in. all the water was gushing — had caved in. all the water was gushing through like a water fool. -- water— gushing through like a water fool. —— water fall. i call it the great shoulder— —— water fall. i call it the great shoulder shrug in schools. you turn around _ shoulder shrug in schools. you turn around and — shoulder shrug in schools. you turn around and think, fine we are going to have _ around and think, fine we are going to have a _ around and think, fine we are going to have a rapid action here and get moved _ to have a rapid action here and get moved out — to have a rapid action here and get moved out. but no, it was like, business — moved out. but no, it was like, business as— moved out. but no, it was like, business as usual. get the kids in, try and _ business as usual. get the kids in, try and keep — business as usual. get the kids in, try and keep them calm. we will move things— try and keep them calm. we will move things out— try and keep them calm. we will move things out of— try and keep them calm. we will move things out of way and i was there with the — things out of way and i was there with the roof out, water coming through — with the roof out, water coming through. and for the next literally i’ili'it through. and for the next literally right up— through. and for the next literally right up untiljanuary we had to

have _ right up untiljanuary we had to have driers in, it stank of wet. it was _ have driers in, it stank of wet. it was a _ have driers in, it stank of wet. it was a nightmare. of course, overthe next year. _ was a nightmare. of course, overthe next year. 18— was a nightmare. of course, overthe next year, 18 months, theyjust kept trying _ next year, 18 months, theyjust kept trying to— next year, 18 months, theyjust kept trying to patch it up, there was scaffolding outside and the kids suffered. it was very difficult to work _ suffered. it was very difficult to work in — suffered. it was very difficult to work in. my thought is what other adult _ work in. my thought is what other adult in _ work in. my thought is what other adult in a — work in. my thought is what other adult in a work place would go in, vou're _ adult in a work place would go in, you're caring for kids, they're 11—year—oldsjust back you're caring for kids, they're 11—year—olds just back from you're caring for kids, they're 11—year—oldsjust back from covid and up _ 11—year—oldsjust back from covid and up tight. that is my story. i�*m and up tight. that is my story. i'm lad ou and up tight. that is my story. glad you told and up tight. that is my story. in glad you told it. hi, and up tight. that is my story. i�*n glad you told it. hi, chris. and up tight. that is my story. i'm glad you told it. hi, chris. good i glad you told it. hi, chris. good morning- _ glad you told it. hi, chris. good morning- i— glad you told it. hi, chris. good morning. i suppose _ glad you told it. hi, chris. good morning. i suppose it _ glad you told it. hi, chris. good morning. i suppose it is - glad you told it. hi, chris. good i morning. i suppose it is important we know it — morning. i suppose it is important we know it is _ morning. i suppose it is important we know it is there _ morning. i suppose it is important we know it is there in _ morning. i suppose it is important we know it is there in the - morning. i suppose it is important we know it is there in the first - we know it is there in the first place. tell us about rack. rack, we have been researching _ place. tell us about rack. rack, we have been researching rack- place. tell us about rack. rack, we have been researching rack for- place. tell us about rack. rack, we have been researching rack for the| have been researching rack for the last couple of years. it has been around since the 30s, 40s. invented in scandinavia. it was really popular in this country and many

countries int popular in this country and many countries in t 60s and 70s. it is a type of reinforced concrete, but it is autoclaved, so it is made in a big oven and a is for the air rated. when you're building with it, it is light and easy to install and to cut to size and it is good insulation. from a building point of view it is a fantastic material and it is still manufactured around the world. there is several thousand factories still producing the material. if you design it right, install it and look after it, it is fine. there is nothing fundamentally wrong with the material. but in this country and many countries we have not looked after our buildings well enough and many are older than they were designed to be and not looked a of. this material is a bit more fragile

nan traditional reinforced concrete, which is really heavy and strong. if you don't look after this, or you overload it, which has happened, thenit overload it, which has happened, then it can cause problems, we are seeing in the a few locations. taste seeing in the a few locations. we heard cas talking of the water gushing in, how is it affected by water ingress? this gushing in, how is it affected by water ingress?— gushing in, how is it affected by waterintress? , . . , , water ingress? this material is used a lot of flat — water ingress? this material is used a lot of flat roofs _ water ingress? this material is used a lot of flat roofs and _ water ingress? this material is used a lot of flat roofs and they're - a lot of flat roofs and they're notorious for being leaky. they need to be rewaterproofed every ten to 20 years you would apply a new water membrane. schools that are strapped for cash, this is not done. that membrane. schools that are strapped for cash, this is not done.— for cash, this is not done. that is our school- _ for cash, this is not done. that is our school- i— for cash, this is not done. that is our school. i was _ for cash, this is not done. that is our school. i was told _ for cash, this is not done. that is our school. i was told there - for cash, this is not done. that is. our school. i was told there wasn't enough _ our school. i was told there wasn't enough money. sorry for interrupting. it should have been

done _ they probably solve the league, but often the money gets taken from the maintain spot. this is important, because it is aerated, it can soak up because it is aerated, it can soak up water. when that happens, the weight increases, so the load increases, similar to a sponge, it bends. the strength does decrease slightly, around 10% when it is water heavy. there is steel reinforcement which corrodes. water and oxygen and steel, it rusts, and over time, that steel... and oxygen and steel, it rusts, and over time, that steel. . ._ over time, that steel... there is a finite life span. _ over time, that steel... there is a finite life span. it _ over time, that steel... there is a finite life span. it is _ over time, that steel... there is a finite life span. it is past -

over time, that steel... there is a finite life span. it is past the - finite life span. it is past the she” finite life span. it is past the shelf life in a lot of schools, which is the issue. in shelf life in a lot of schools, which is the issue.— shelf life in a lot of schools, which is the issue. . , ,. , which is the issue. in many schools, it is in perfect _ which is the issue. in many schools, it is in perfect condition _ which is the issue. in many schools, it is in perfect condition but - which is the issue. in many schools, it is in perfect condition but it - which is the issue. in many schools, it is in perfect condition but it is - it is in perfect condition but it is trying to identify those which are being installed cruelly and not looked after. that is the difficulty, because over a0 years, a lot of this has been painted numerous times. when you do an inspection all you see is pain. you think, is that concrete or is this special raac. just by looking at it, you can't tell, you need a screwdriver and break into to identify. screwdriver and break into to identi . ,, , ., screwdriver and break into to identi . ,, . ., �* identify. stay where you are, don't to identify. stay where you are, don't go anywhere- _ identify. stay where you are, don't go anywhere. tanya _ identify. stay where you are, don't go anywhere. tanya in _ identify. stay where you are, don't go anywhere. tanya in stevenage, | identify. stay where you are, don't i go anywhere. tanya in stevenage, we want to get your top line, tell us what happened and we will further explore after the news and sport, because i am looking at the clock. 0k, first off, what happened? mr;

0k, first off, what happened? ij�*i seven—year—old son, 0k, first off, what happened? ij�*i1: seven—year—old son, a 0k, first off, what happened? ii1 seven—year—old son, a strip 0k, first off, what happened? ii1: seven—year—old son, a strip light fitting, forefoot fitting, fell 31st and hit him on the head. haiti fitting, forefoot fitting, fell 31st and hit him on the head. hold that thouht. here is the news. a report from the national audit office is warning that around 700,000 children are being taught in buildings that could be unsafe. it says years of underfunding are to blame — the government says its spending billions to make sure schools can operate safely. the hollywood actor kevin spacey has arrived at southwark crown court in london to stand trial accused of sex offences against four men. he's facing 12 counts dating from 2001 to 2013 — and he strenuously denies all the charges.

rescuers are continuing to search through rubble after a russian missile strike in eastern ukraine. at least nine people — including three children — were killed when a restaurant was hit in the city of kramatorsk. and the chancellorjeremy hunt will meet watchdogs from the energy, water and telecoms industries today. the treasury says he'll ask what's being done to make sure companies pass on lower costs to their customers. england will look to improve on a record ofjust seven wins when play starts this morning. there is build—up and commentary from 10:25am. meanwhile, england have named their women's ashes squad. daniel gibson gets her first caller, and izzy one place. find munich are set to make an improved offerfor harry kane. there were reports of a

70 wooden pounds bid, butjames madison looks to be on the way in, they are close to completing a £1a deal. arsenal have put in another bid for declan rice worth hundreds million pounds. west ham still don't think the structure of the deal is right.

back to school safety in a minute, and more fun tanya in stevenage, the rest of that story, strip lighting fell on her son's head. coming up after 10, your questions for mps. it's prime minister's questions at 12, so we've assembled a panel of mps to take your questions. this week it's, lee rowley — the conservative mp for north east derbyshire and local government minister. justin madders — the labour mp for ellesmere port and neston and shadow employment rights minister. and christine jardine — the liberal democrat mp for edinburgh west — spokesperson on scotland, women and equalities and the cabinet office. there's plenty to discuss — the chancellor's been meeting with regulators to discuss the cost of living this morning, there's the situation in russia, mortgages and interest rates and as we've been hearing — unsafe schools. get your questions to mps in now.

call me on 08085 909693. text 85058. we havejennifer, we have jennifer, fell we havejennifer, fell in bristol, a professor in construction materials. lots of people talking about this concrete which has a specific shelf life, raac. tanya, in the gym, wasn't it? it life, raac. tanya, in the gym, wasn't it?— life, raac. tanya, in the gym, wasn't it?_ a i life, raac. tanya, in the gym, i wasn't it?_ a strip wasn't it? it was in a hall. a strip liht wasn't it? it was in a hall. a strip tight fitting _ wasn't it? it was in a hall. a strip light fitting fell _ wasn't it? it was in a hall. a strip light fitting fell on _ wasn't it? it was in a hall. a strip light fitting fell on your— wasn't it? it was in a hall. a strip light fitting fell on your son's - light fitting fell on your son's head from the ceiling.-

head from the ceiling. what happened? _ head from the ceiling. what happened? i _ head from the ceiling. what happened? i didn't - head from the ceiling. what happened? i didn't get - head from the ceiling. what happened? i didn't get the l head from the ceiling. twist happened? i didn't get the vocal until an hour happened? i didn't get the vocal untilan hourand a happened? i didn't get the vocal until an hour and a half after it happened, after he had eaten he said he felt sick and dizzy. that was the first i was made aware of it. when i spoke to them, they said they had decided to have it inside because the weather wasn't good. the strip lighting casing had fallen, i don't know what had happened. but the strip light and casing didn't have anything around it and it hit the back of his head.— anything around it and it hit the back of his head. when you got the call, what did _ back of his head. when you got the call, what did they _ back of his head. when you got the call, what did they say? _ back of his head. when you got the call, what did they say? we - back of his head. when you got the call, what did they say? we are - call, what did they say? we are terribly sorry but this has happened question yes, kind of. you terribly sorry but this has happened question yes, kind of.— question yes, kind of. you know, this has happened. _

question yes, kind of. you know, this has happened. they - question yes, kind of. you know, i this has happened. they explained question yes, kind of. you know, - this has happened. they explained it had happened awhile ago, and when i went into pick him up, he wasn't himself. he had been affected by it, he had mild concussion, i think. when i went into the hole to see what had happened, the light casing had fallen, hit him on the head and smashed on the floor. it was three feet long, i would not want to get hit with it. ~ y feet long, i would not want to get hit with it. ~ , y 1 hit with it. absolutely. jennifer, retired head _ hit with it. absolutely. jennifer, retired head of— hit with it. absolutely. jennifer, retired head of primary - hit with it. absolutely. jennifer, | retired head of primary schools, while gum. good morning. what was the state of repair or disrepair in your schools?— the state of repair or disrepair in your schools? the state of repair or disrepair in our schools? . ., ., ~ ., . , . your schools? when i took over as a head, obviously _ your schools? when i took over as a head, obviously i _ your schools? when i took over as a head, obviously i didn't _ your schools? when i took over as a head, obviously i didn't have - your schools? when i took over as a head, obviously i didn't have any - head, obviously i didn't have any experience of dealing with buildings, but it became obvious to me quickly that we needed to do

something whole school because the whole school was unfit, not only for the pupils, people forget about the teachers, teaching in bad situations. because the money is tight, they are doing piecemeal fixings, nobody looking at the whole building. at the tame became a grant—maintained building, and we were able to employer our own architects who took the job on. they were new architects, i was a new head. we decided to do the job as we saw fit. we looked at the whole school structure, rather than just a bit here and a bit of plaster there. the toilets, the children, the boys were weeing, they stank. they hadn't been plumbed in. they were watering the garden of everyone down the

road. all the pipework was open drain, so if you have a pink painting, you had a pink playground. the glass was all edwardian. the whole thing was that every window had been screwed and glued closed. and we had to have all of those replays. it took 28 years to get the school to white is now. so replays. it took 28 years to get the school to white is now. 50 it replays. it took 28 years to get the school to white is now.— school to white is now. so it was a while ago- — school to white is now. so it was a while ago- it— school to white is now. so it was a while ago- it is— school to white is now. so it was a while ago. it is current, _ school to white is now. so it was a while ago. it is current, but - school to white is now. so it was a while ago. it is current, but what i while ago. it is current, but what has happened. — while ago. it is current, but what has happened, the _ while ago. it is current, but what has happened, the academy - while ago. it is current, but what . has happened, the academy haven't kept contact with the architects and therefore they are undoing things we did, and the other thing to say, as we left the school, which was bang

up we left the school, which was bang up to standard, we were 0% energy users. we had our own blocks on the roof. this was a school for 800 children. we had water storage for the toilets and we had special heating system put in. every wall we touched, and this is where you can go for the big plan, because if you are going to touch a wall you then know what you want even ten years on. you can insulate the wall read for the next stage. i}i(. on. you can insulate the wall read for the next stage.— on. you can insulate the wall read for the next stage. 0k, loads. chris good ear, for the next stage. 0k, loads. chris goodyear, there's _ for the next stage. 0k, loads. chris goodyear, there's loads _ for the next stage. 0k, loads. chris goodyear, there's loads of - for the next stage. 0k, loads. chris| goodyear, there's loads of problems here in lots of schools and this will be a big...— will be a big... certainly the school built _

will be a big... certainly the school built in _ will be a big... certainly the school built in 1912 - will be a big... certainly the school built in 1912 in - school built in 1912 in southend—on—sea, not in wiltshire, it was at a conurbation of southend—on—sea. 800 children, 35 languages spoken. southend-on-sea. 800 children, 35 languages spoken-— southend-on-sea. 800 children, 35 languages spoken. loads of problems, and eo - le languages spoken. loads of problems, and people are — languages spoken. loads of problems, and people are identifying _ languages spoken. loads of problems, and people are identifying them. - and people are identifying them. chris, this will take a lot of money to fix? it chris, this will take a lot of money to fix? , , . ., , to fix? it is. in this country we have one _ to fix? it is. in this country we have one of — to fix? it is. in this country we have one of the _ to fix? it is. in this country we have one of the oldest - to fix? it is. in this country we | have one of the oldest building stocks — have one of the oldest building stocks in — have one of the oldest building stocks in the world, because of the industriat— stocks in the world, because of the industrial revolution we got there first with — industrial revolution we got there first with our infrastructure, buildings, including schools and hospitals. it was great then, we got there _ hospitals. it was great then, we got there first — hospitals. it was great then, we got there first, but now we have some of there first, but now we have some of the oldest _ there first, but now we have some of the oldest. as money is tight, we don't _ the oldest. as money is tight, we don't took— the oldest. as money is tight, we don't look after things quite as well as— don't look after things quite as well as we could because we are spending — well as we could because we are spending money on other things. now some of— spending money on other things. now some of these things are coming home to roost. _ some of these things are coming home to roost. and _ some of these things are coming home to roost, and often it costs more money _ to roost, and often it costs more money to — to roost, and often it costs more money to repair the fault rather than _ money to repair the fault rather than the — money to repair the fault rather

than the maintenance. i've got two kids are _ than the maintenance. i've got two kids are primary school, drop them off this _ kids are primary school, drop them off this morning, they are lucky, their— off this morning, they are lucky, their school is about 20 years old and made — their school is about 20 years old and made of timber. all materials eventuatty — and made of timber. all materials eventually degrade over time if you don't _ eventually degrade over time if you don't look— eventually degrade over time if you don't look after them. what eventually degrade over time if you don't look after them.— don't look after them. what about the asbestos? _ don't look after them. what about the asbestos? asbestos _ don't look after them. what about the asbestos? asbestos is - don't look after them. what about | the asbestos? asbestos is different to raac, because _ the asbestos? asbestos is different to raac, because it _ the asbestos? asbestos is different to raac, because it is _ the asbestos? asbestos is different to raac, because it is inherently. to raac, because it is inherently dangerous— to raac, because it is inherently dangerous to people. if you inhale it, dangerous to people. if you inhale it. over— dangerous to people. if you inhale it, overtime it does dangerous to people. if you inhale it, over time it does build up and causes _ it, over time it does build up and causes cancers and many other things — causes cancers and many other things it — causes cancers and many other things it is— causes cancers and many other things. it is different to raac. if you touch — things. it is different to raac. if you touch raac, it is fine, it is normat— you touch raac, it is fine, it is normal concrete. asbestos is bad for you. normal concrete. asbestos is bad for you in— normal concrete. asbestos is bad for you in the _ normal concrete. asbestos is bad for you. in the 1970s it was a wonder materiat. — you. in the 1970s it was a wonder material, fantastic properties, and many— material, fantastic properties, and many countries use it for many

things — many countries use it for many things. 0nly more recently we've discovered — things. 0nly more recently we've discovered it does damage to health. unfortunately, it is already in the buildings — unfortunately, it is already in the buildings. if it is their inert and you don't— buildings. if it is their inert and you don't touch it, it is fine. it won't — you don't touch it, it is fine. it won't go — you don't touch it, it is fine. it won't go anywhere or do damage. but as we _ won't go anywhere or do damage. but as we att— won't go anywhere or do damage. but as we all do. — won't go anywhere or do damage. but as we all do, we like our diy, modifying _ as we all do, we like our diy, modifying our buildings and drilling in. modifying our buildings and drilling in even— modifying our buildings and drilling in. even putting up some shelves, you might — in. even putting up some shelves, you might drill into the asbestos and turn — you might drill into the asbestos and turn it— you might drill into the asbestos and turn it into dust, and it is that— and turn it into dust, and it is that you _ and turn it into dust, and it is that you can inhale and get inside you _ that you can inhale and get inside you as _ that you can inhale and get inside you. as long as we don't touch it, asbestos — you. as long as we don't touch it, asbestos is — you. as long as we don't touch it, asbestos is ok. we do more damage by trying _ asbestos is ok. we do more damage by trying to— asbestos is ok. we do more damage by trying to remove it. gn asbestos is ok. we do more damage by trying to remove it.— trying to remove it. on that point, fill in bristol, — trying to remove it. on that point, fill in bristol, tell— trying to remove it. on that point, fill in bristol, tell us _ trying to remove it. on that point, fill in bristol, tell us more. - trying to remove it. on that point, fill in bristol, tell us more. that i fill in bristol, tell us more. that is all well _ fill in bristol, tell us more. that is all well and _ fill in bristol, tell us more. that is all well and good _ fill in bristol, tell us more. trisgt is all well and good talking about historical things. this happened on monday, my partner was putting up a display at school, asked to put it

up display at school, asked to put it up by the way, was stapling into a wall and after they had finished it, were told don't mean to worry you, but that wall is an asbestos risk and were appointed to warning stickers, saying you shouldn't be using the wall. nobody in the school is bringing their serve, making my partner aware of this. the whole building is riddled with asbestos, it is in the guttering, and the kids were told, you can't use hard balls any more encase you knock any more down. nothing being done to address the problem, it isjust short down. nothing being done to address the problem, it is just short cuts around it. or in my partner's case, just letting her staple into it, creating dust, which she and the children are breathing. you creating dust, which she and the children are breathing.— children are breathing. you will want to hear—

children are breathing. you will want to hear from _ children are breathing. you will want to hear from this - children are breathing. you will want to hear from this caller. l want to hear from this caller. tallow is about your school. mr; tallow is about your school. my school has _ tallow is about your school. ii1: school has several tallow is about your school. ii1 school has several warning stickers on the classroom windows. it is scaring us, i have asthma. students have underlying health conditions. they will focus on building a new school gates when they got one or a new sixth form building, but not addressing asbestos and windows. it is scary. excellent, leads on the beautiful two tim. a load of problems, wide—ranging and widespread and extremely concerning. good morning. sadly that is the case _ good morning. sadly that is the case, across our 22,000 schools, as our previous — case, across our 22,000 schools, as our previous callers have said, we have _ our previous callers have said, we have expired stock with innumerable issues _ have expired stock with innumerable issues. again, the maintenance of those _ issues. again, the maintenance of those components and the fabric

should _ those components and the fabric should ensure it sees out its life expectancy, but many of those components are in excess of it and therefore — components are in excess of it and therefore have a finite life—cycle and coming towards the end of it. whether— and coming towards the end of it. whether it — and coming towards the end of it. whether it is leaking rooms, broken windows. _ whether it is leaking rooms, broken windows, asbestos, i'm afraid it is there. _ windows, asbestos, i'm afraid it is there. it _ windows, asbestos, i'm afraid it is there. it is — windows, asbestos, i'm afraid it is there, it is endemic. this is the legacy— there, it is endemic. this is the legacy of— there, it is endemic. this is the legacy of underinvestment for how many— legacy of underinvestment for how many generations. we have a £15 billion— many generations. we have a £15 billion backlog fund, higher than our help— billion backlog fund, higher than our help state.— billion backlog fund, higher than our help state. we're up the creek without paddle, _ our help state. we're up the creek without paddle, the _ our help state. we're up the creek without paddle, the famous - our help state. we're up the creek| without paddle, the famous greek. our help state. we're up the creek l without paddle, the famous greek. i suggest, they need to assess internal— suggest, they need to assess internal investment. i would advocate _ internal investment. i would advocate surely the investment in our stock — advocate surely the investment in our stock, in our pupils, and then realising — our stock, in our pupils, and then realising their potential, having the best—

realising their potential, having the best education would pay for a more _ the best education would pay for a more productive economy and a future which _ more productive economy and a future which will— more productive economy and a future which will produce a better gdp. they— which will produce a better gdp. they must— which will produce a better gdp. they must make that decision. although — they must make that decision. although they claim children are their— although they claim children are their first — although they claim children are their first priority, money seems to find itself— their first priority, money seems to find itself in — their first priority, money seems to find itself in other places.— find itself in other places. earlier on one of our— find itself in other places. earlier on one of our caller _ find itself in other places. earlier on one of our caller said - find itself in other places. earlier on one of our caller said he - on one of our caller said he suspects there is too much cost benefit analysis and not enough analysis of the safety of teachers and pupils and others. chris, do you want to come back in? i and pupils and others. chris, do you want to come back in?— want to come back in? i mean, i aree want to come back in? i mean, i agree with _ want to come back in? i mean, i agree with tim _ want to come back in? i mean, i agree with tim on _ want to come back in? i mean, i agree with tim on his _ want to come back in? i mean, i j agree with tim on his comments want to come back in? i mean, i - agree with tim on his comments about the infrastructure and the decades of underfunding. it is a story we hear across many different parts of the country and the government. we can't turn back the clock. what uc is what you get with these buildings. we don't have the historical records which is a problem. if they are hundred years

old, there aren't any drawings or specifications. you walk in there and you are looking around and getting tools around, doing investigations yourself. this costs a lot of money. a bit spent on maintenance saves you lot on spending on a new school later on. it is wise money spent, but we've got such a catch up to do. we will never catch. got such a catch up to do. we will never catch-— got such a catch up to do. we will never catch. tax. school buildings, most other — never catch. tax. school buildings, most other parts _ never catch. tax. school buildings, most other parts of _ never catch. tax. school buildings, most other parts of my _ never catch. tax. school buildings, most other parts of my daughter'sl most other parts of my daughter's primary school has been closed after an inspection said the beams were no longer to modern standard. this one, andrew, part of the problem is the schools are built by the lowest bidder. i'm a former teacher and work in education construction. the comment that schools are being thrown up isn't true, there is a big

risk procedure to ensure quality buildings are produced. i've had agencies offering me teaching jobs, so i would suggest more effort needs to keep teachers in the profession. not suggesting they are flat up. it was in the past that they were done rather hurriedly with perhaps materials that won't last forever. one more text. crumbling schools, teachers striking, are we in 2023 or 1983? that is for another opponent. michelle, the situation isn't bad in scotland and wales, but what is it like with your school?— scotland and wales, but what is it like with your school? well, we have a t m like with your school? well, we have a gym where — like with your school? well, we have a gym where we _ like with your school? well, we have a gym where we had _ like with your school? well, we have a gym where we had a _ like with your school? well, we have a gym where we had a leak- like with your school? well, we have a gym where we had a leak in - like with your school? well, we have a gym where we had a leak in the . a gym where we had a leak in the roof. it has been there for over a year now and it was never fixed, although we bid £100,000. the flow

has been destroyed, another 50 grand. the gym is shot, the kids can't use it. we have the ceiling in the cafeteria that has been sealed off because that is asbestos worries. we have teachers who are reporting getting electric shocks because of the water churning through the roof going into the electrical cupboard. we have windows falling out of the school and down onto the pavement, and windows sealed shut, building stock guidelines put up in them, so rooms too hot for children to study end. the school is falling apart. haifa the school is falling apart. how does it affect _ the school is falling apart. how does it affect the _ the school is falling apart. how does it affect the mentality of people studying and working there? i think it is terrible because my kids say there is not even toilet seat in

the girls toilets. my children are demoralised. they feel like... my daughter said she feels like she is going to school in a prison. the teachers are demoralised as well. we had someone to look at it and said it wouldn't get fixed in his lifetime. supposedly there's no money, which i don't believe. there's always money, it is just who is it getting spent on? it doesn't appear our children, our teachers, our schools are a priority. they are not number one on the list for a long time. not number one on the list for a long time-— not number one on the list for a long time. not number one on the list for a lon. time, ., , ., i, ., long time. tim, that is what you are sa in. it long time. tim, that is what you are saying. it certainly _ long time. tim, that is what you are saying. it certainly is. _ long time. tim, that is what you are saying. it certainly is. the _ saying. it certainly is. the competition _ saying. it certainly is. the competition now - saying. it certainly is. the competition now is - saying. it certainly is. the competition now is so - saying. it certainly is. the i competition now is so fierce, so there _

competition now is so fierce, so there are — competition now is so fierce, so there are 22,000 schools in the uk, half our— there are 22,000 schools in the uk, half our academies, allowed to bid every— half our academies, allowed to bid every year — half our academies, allowed to bid every year. every year about 4000 applications are made. this time, only 1033 — applications are made. this time, only 1033 were awarded. that is how fierce _ only 1033 were awarded. that is how fierce it— only 1033 were awarded. that is how fierce it is _ only 1033 were awarded. that is how fierce it is. the stories people are telling _ fierce it is. the stories people are telling you — fierce it is. the stories people are telling you is so commonplace, and it is an _ telling you is so commonplace, and it is an ugly— telling you is so commonplace, and it is an ugly contest, the race to the bottom. which school can prove they are _ the bottom. which school can prove they are in — the bottom. which school can prove they are in greater need, and the impact _ they are in greater need, and the impact it— they are in greater need, and the impact it is— they are in greater need, and the impact it is having on their ability to deliver— impact it is having on their ability to deliver its curriculum. it is very— to deliver its curriculum. it is very tough— to deliver its curriculum. it is very tough out there, it truly is. it very tough out there, it truly is. it is _ very tough out there, it truly is. it is a _ very tough out there, it truly is. it is a scandal, to be honest. some ofthe it is a scandal, to be honest. some of the new — it is a scandal, to be honest. some of the new schools, _ it is a scandal, to be honest. some of the new schools, we _ it is a scandal, to be honest. some of the new schools, we used i it is a scandal, to be honest. some of the new schools, we used to i it is a scandal, to be honest. some of the new schools, we used to do| of the new schools, we used to do schools questions and those are waiters academies are spectacular. they are, they have 50 schools, and greater— they are, they have 50 schools, and greater budget and reserves upon which _ greater budget and reserves upon which to—

greater budget and reserves upon which to invest in. in theory, they are equally— which to invest in. in theory, they are equally as a —— as exposed to the risks — are equally as a —— as exposed to the risks. there is a great way to use the _ the risks. there is a great way to use the budget in a proactive way. marie _ use the budget in a proactive way. marie in— use the budget in a proactive way. marie in manchester, good morning. what would you like to say? my sister has _ what would you like to say? ii1 sister has recentlyjust died with asbestos, she had the most massive tumour in the stomach. and we put it down to the school where she was out, but no one is accepting responsibility. but mainly i want to say people should be made more aware. it is no good saying once it has settled you don't need to touch it, it is everywhere, and she worked in a school for ten years. what did she do? she was a primary school

teacher. did she do? she was a primary school teacher. , , ., ., ., teacher. did you ever go into the school and _ teacher. did you ever go into the school and superstate _ teacher. did you ever go into the school and superstate of - teacher. did you ever go into the school and superstate of it? it i teacher. did you ever go into the i school and superstate of it? it was an old school. _ school and superstate of it? it was an old school, but _ school and superstate of it? it was an old school, but she _ school and superstate of it? it was an old school, but she was - school and superstate of it? it was an old school, but she was there l an old school, but she was there over ten years and when she left, she was only young, 50 something, the school then was pulled down and i thought that was strange. i knew it was an old school but i didn't think it was as bad as that. obviously, they tried to make people more aware, but no one wants to accept responsibility. it should be made aware that it is a dangerous substance and not say. lituihat made aware that it is a dangerous substance and not say.— made aware that it is a dangerous substance and not say. what was your sister's name? _ substance and not say. what was your sister's name? colette. _ substance and not say. what was your sister's name? colette. i— substance and not say. what was your sister's name? colette. i am - substance and not say. what was your sister's name? colette. i am so i sister's name? colette. i am so sor to sister's name? colette. i am so sorry to hear — sister's name? colette. i am so sorry to hear about _ sister's name? colette. i am so sorry to hear about colette. i sister's name? colette. i am so | sorry to hear about colette. was sister's name? colette. i am so i sorry to hear about colette. was she

aware it may have been the root cause of her problem question. she was always. — cause of her problem question. she was always. is _ cause of her problem question. she was always. is a _ cause of her problem question. she was always, is a primary school teacheri — was always, is a primary school teacher, you are putting up displays, _ teacher, you are putting up displays, putting drawing pins in. somebody also said it is the heating system _ somebody also said it is the heating system, during the winter you put it on, system, during the winter you put it on. and _ system, during the winter you put it on, and it blows through there. we've _ on, and it blows through there. we've got— on, and it blows through there. we've got no idea how she got it. but when — we've got no idea how she got it. but when she went for the diagnosis from the _ but when she went for the diagnosis from the doctor at the hospital, bay said you _ from the doctor at the hospital, bay said you have no idea how many people — said you have no idea how many people are — said you have no idea how many people are suffering from this illness — people are suffering from this illness. they said teachers, nurses and doctors. — illness. they said teachers, nurses and doctors, it is in all these old buildings — and doctors, it is in all these old buildins. . , buildings. ouri mean, chris goodyear. _ buildings. ouri mean, chris goodyear, what _ buildings. ouri mean, chris goodyear, what is _ buildings. ouri mean, chris goodyear, what is to - buildings. ouri mean, chris goodyear, what is to be i buildings. ouri mean, chris i goodyear, what is to be done? buildings. ouri mean, chris - goodyear, what is to be done? thank ou for goodyear, what is to be done? thank you for that — goodyear, what is to be done? thank you for that question! _ goodyear, what is to be done? thank you for that question! i _

goodyear, what is to be done? thank you for that question! i would - goodyear, what is to be done? trieria. you for that question! i would say to eradicate asbestos is almost an infinite amount of money. it is in universities, colleges, public infrastructure, homes, factories. you can't get rid of it completely because it is into many buildings. it would be trillions of pounds to take it out. where do we start? you might argue to start with schools, our children's safety. or you might say start with hospitals. it is difficult. what they are doing is building some new schools, new hospitals, and eventually we will replace our infrastructure, but it will take decades to go through the cycle. it will be here to stay, so we need to learn how to live with it, because we won't replace it all

anytime soon. it, because we won't replace it all anytime soon-— it, because we won't replace it all anytime soon. sorry, can i come in aain? it anytime soon. sorry, can i come in again? it shouldn't _ anytime soon. sorry, can i come in again? it shouldn't be _ anytime soon. sorry, can i come in again? it shouldn't be kept - anytime soon. sorry, can i come in again? it shouldn't be kept quiet, l again? it shouldn't be kept quiet, it should — again? it shouldn't be kept quiet, it should be kept secretive. it should — it should be kept secretive. it should be made, there should be signs— should be made, there should be signs everywhere. we didn't... well, we knew— signs everywhere. we didn't... well, we knew about asbestos, but we didn't— we knew about asbestos, but we didn't know it could be in anything she was— didn't know it could be in anything she was touching. we didn't know it could be in anything she was touching.— didn't know it could be in anything she was touching. we need to either remove it, she was touching. we need to either remove it. and _ she was touching. we need to either remove it, and it _ she was touching. we need to either remove it, and it is _ she was touching. we need to either remove it, and it is easy, _ she was touching. we need to either remove it, and it is easy, or - she was touching. we need to either remove it, and it is easy, or remove | remove it, and it is easy, or remove people from it, which is don't allow people from it, which is don't allow people near it. ifully people from it, which is don't allow people near it. i fully agree. people from it, which is don't allow people near it. ifully agree. yes. people near it. i fully agree. yes. i have a statement... _ people near it. i fully agree. yes. i have a statement... sorry, i people near it. i fully agree. yes. i have a statement... sorry, go i people near it. i fully agree. yes. i i have a statement... sorry, go on. i have a statement... sorry, go on. i think i have a statement... sorry, go on. i think the _ i have a statement... sorry, go on. i think the teachers, _ i have a statement... sorry, go on. i think the teachers, the _ i have a statement... sorry, go on. i think the teachers, the schools i i think the teachers, the schools and local— i think the teachers, the schools and local governments, they aren't being _ and local governments, they aren't being transparent about the state of

our schools. i didn't learn anything about— our schools. i didn't learn anything about it _ our schools. i didn't learn anything about it until i got involved in the parent— about it until i got involved in the parent teacher council, and it has been _ parent teacher council, and it has been going — parent teacher council, and it has been going on for years. i mean, i have _ been going on for years. i mean, i have been— been going on for years. i mean, i have been trying, i think parents will be _ have been trying, i think parents will be informed. ijust don't understand why parents don't know. why on _ understand why parents don't know. why on retelling parents of children? | why on retelling parents of children?— why on retelling parents of children? ~ �*, , , . . children? i think it's been such an im ortant children? i think it's been such an important discussion, _ children? i think it's been such an important discussion, i— children? i think it's been such an important discussion, i can't i children? i think it's been such an important discussion, i can't find | important discussion, i can't find everybody enough. you are all experts. i want to get this statement in from the department for education.

it is the responsible two of our schools who speak to their schools day—to—day to manage the maintenance and to alert us if there is a concern. we will always provide support on a case—by—case basis if we are alerted by the responsible bodies. made it. thank you very much again to everybody for taking part. do you want to ask the mp something? that is what they are here for, and what you are ready for. get in touch. sorry that was a bit of a campbell's ramble. now it is pmqs at midday. before that your own 05 to our guests. this week it's lee rowley — the conservative mp

for north east derbyshire and local government minister. justin madders — the labour mp for ellesmere port & neston and shadow employment rights minister. and christine jardine — the liberal democrat mp for edinburgh west, spokesperson on scotland, women and equalities and the cabinet office. plenty to discus. discuss. supermarkets, we were listening to these, the covid inquiry. do you accept matt hancock's apology. the situation in russia. unsafe schools. whatever you want. ring us on 08085 909693. or whatever you want. ring us on 08085 909693. 0r text whatever you want. ring us on 08085 909693. or text or whatever you want. ring us on 08085 909693. 0r text or 85058. here is the news atjust gone 10

o'clock. the public spending watchdog says 700,000 school pupils in england are being taught in buildings that could be unsafe — because they need major repairs. the department for education says it's allocated more than £15 billion for school safety since 2015 — and "nothing is more important". the oscar—winning actor, kevin spacey, has arrived in court in london, where his trial on sex offence charges is set to begin. the 63—year—old denies 12 charges dating from 2001 to 2013. russia's missile attack on the ukrainian city of kramatorsk is now known to have killed nine people — including three children — and injured more than 50. a missile hit a crowded restaurant, burying people under the rubble where rescuers are continuing to search. and the government's climate watchdog says the uk has lost its position as a world leader on global warming action. the climate change committee says efforts are worryingly slow — but ministers say the government has met all its carbon targets.

welcome to our mps. good to have you on and behave yourself, you're on the telly as well! we have lee rowley. how are you? i’m the telly as well! we have lee rowley. how are you? i'm good. how are ou. rowley. how are you? i'm good. how are yom you — rowley. how are you? i'm good. how are you. you were _ rowley. how are you? i'm good. how are you. you were head _ rowley. how are you? i'm good. how are you. you were head boy - rowley. how are you? i'm good. how are you. you were head boy at - are you. you were head boy at school, always _ are you. you were head boy at school, always set _ are you. you were head boy at school, always set for - are you. you were head boy at i school, always set for greatness, always on the road to no 10. how do you become head boy, i was a million miles from that? i you become head boy, i was a million miles from that?— miles from that? i think it was my first election. _ miles from that? i think it was my first election. a _ miles from that? i think it was my first election. a long _ miles from that? i think it was my first election. a long time - miles from that? i think it was my first election. a long time ago. i miles from that? i think it was my. first election. a long time ago. you were an elected _ first election. a long time ago. you were an elected representative? i l were an elected representative? i believe so. come _ were an elected representative? i believe so. come on, _ were an elected representative? i believe so. come on, you - were an elected representative? i believe so. come on, you can. . were an elected representative? i i believe so. come on, you can. what were your — believe so. come on, you can. what were your qualities? _ believe so. come on, you can. what were your qualities? i _ believe so. come on, you can. what were your qualities? i think- believe so. come on, you can. what were your qualities? i think they - were your qualities? i think they needed somebody _ were your qualities? i think they needed somebody to _ were your qualities? i think they needed somebody to do - were your qualities? i think they needed somebody to do it. - were your qualities? i think they needed somebody to do it. that| were your qualities? i think they i needed somebody to do it. that is where i stepped up.— where i stepped up. you're hiding our li . ht where i stepped up. you're hiding your light under _ where i stepped up. you're hiding

your light under a _ where i stepped up. you're hiding your light under a bushell. - where i stepped up. you're hiding your light under a bushell. justin| your light under a bushell. justin madders. do you still have your labrador? i madders. do you still have your labrador? ., madders. do you still have your labrador?- i _ madders. do you still have your labrador?- i have - madders. do you still have your labrador?- i have a - madders. do you still have your labrador? i do. i have a labradoras labrador? i do. i have a labrador as well. i labrador? i do. i have a labrador as well- i know — labrador? i do. i have a labrador as well. i know in _ labrador? i do. i have a labrador as well. i know in the _ labrador? i do. i have a labradoras well. i know in the past, he is 15 now, will there is something gorgeous about old dogs. he is the love of my life. well, one of them. you have to be careful about these things _ you have to be careful about these thins. ., ., , ,, ., ~ you have to be careful about these thins. ., ., , ,, things. you have been speaking about the labrador's — things. you have been speaking about the labrador's inclination _ things. you have been speaking about the labrador's inclination to _ things. you have been speaking about the labrador's inclination to eat - the labrador's inclination to eat anything. they are insatiable. yes meals have _ anything. they are insatiable. yes meals have been ruined, because we have left_ meals have been ruined, because we have left something too low down and they are _ have left something too low down and they are masters at taking opportunities. we they are masters at taking opportunities.— they are masters at taking opportunities. they are masters at taking o- ortunities. ~ ., ., opportunities. we have to, in the summer there _ opportunities. we have to, in the summer there is _ opportunities. we have to, in the summer there is a _ opportunities. we have to, in the summer there is a convention - opportunities. we have to, in the summer there is a convention on | summer there is a convention on wandsworth common of labrador owners at 6am before the picnics start. i think i have lost a few votes from

my dog _ think i have lost a few votes from my dog helping herself to constituent's picnics. and wif christine jardine, _ constituent's picnics. and wif christine jardine, from - constituent's picnics. and wif christine jardine, from the i constituent's picnics. and wif- christine jardine, from the liberal democrat. a big taylor swift fan. that will be a rush for tickets. are you waiting to long on? —— log on? no, my daughter is going, i'm hoping she will_ no, my daughter is going, i'm hoping she will be _ no, my daughter is going, i'm hoping she will be loud _ no, my daughter is going, i'm hoping she will be loud enough _ no, my daughter is going, i'm hoping she will be loud enough for— no, my daughter is going, i'm hoping she will be loud enough for me - no, my daughter is going, i'm hoping she will be loud enough for me to - she will be loud enough for me to ear from — she will be loud enough for me to ear from the _ she will be loud enough for me to ear from the guarden. _ she will be loud enough for me to ear from the guarden. because i. ear from the guarden. because i could _ ear from the guarden. because i could hear— ear from the guarden. because i could hear bruce _ ear from the guarden. because i could hear bruce springsteen. ear from the guarden. because ll could hear bruce springsteen and that saved — could hear bruce springsteen and that saved many' _ could hear bruce springsteen and that saved many' fortune. - could hear bruce springsteen and that saved many' fortune. i - could hear bruce springsteen and that saved many' fortune. i will . could hear bruce springsteen and i that saved many' fortune. i will say in the _ that saved many' fortune. i will say in the garden _ that saved many' fortune. i will say in the garden. we _ that saved many' fortune. i will say in the garden. we have _ that saved many' fortune. i will say in the garden. we have a _ that saved many' fortune. i will sayl in the garden. we have a cockapoo. we don't _ in the garden. we have a cockapoo. we don't have — in the garden. we have a cockapoo. we don't have labradors, _ in the garden. we have a cockapoo. we don't have labradors, because i in the garden. we have a cockapoo. i we don't have labradors, because we lost a _ we don't have labradors, because we lost a few— we don't have labradors, because we lost a few dinners _ we don't have labradors, because we lost a few dinners that _ we don't have labradors, because we lost a few dinners that were - we don't have labradors, because we lost a few dinners that were left - lost a few dinners that were left unattended _ lost a few dinners that were left unattended. my _ lost a few dinners that were left unattended-— unattended. my theory on the labrador is — unattended. my theory on the labrador is i _ unattended. my theory on the labrador is i think... - unattended. my theory on the labrador is i think... justin, i unattended. my theory on the i labrador is i think... justin, they have probably got still the wolf genein have probably got still the wolf gene in there and they don't they are going to eat for another month

and they need to get it in now. we have got, we are going to stay with food. we have gotjill. hello, jill. good morning, nicky. i food. we have got jill. hello, jill. good morning, nicky.— food. we have got jill. hello, jill. good morning, nicky. i spoke to you esterda good morning, nicky. i spoke to you yesterday and _ good morning, nicky. i spoke to you yesterday and l _ good morning, nicky. i spoke to you yesterday and i thought _ good morning, nicky. i spoke to you yesterday and i thought you - good morning, nicky. i spoke to you yesterday and i thought you would i yesterday and i thought you would want to speak to your mp5. you were absolutely spitting feathers weren't you at the supermarkets? yes. absolutely spitting feathers weren't you at the supermarkets?— you at the supermarkets? yes, i'm not so you at the supermarkets? yes, i'm rrot so spitting _ you at the supermarkets? yes, i'm not so spitting feathers _ you at the supermarkets? yes, i'm not so spitting feathers this - not so spitting feathers this morning, i'm rathertired. not so spitting feathers this morning, i'm rather tired. but not so spitting feathers this morning, i'm rathertired. but it was basically, i wanted to ask the question, what do the mp5 or those in government at the moment going to do about the profiteering from the supermarkets that is going on. it is so obvious. i listened to something yesterday and they seemed to sit there trying to justify the unjustifiable. it was plainly ridiculous. there are so many

examples of prices where they haven't gone up one or two pence, they have gone up 60 or 70%. git“? haven't gone up one or two pence, they have gone up 60 or 70%. give us an example- — they have gone up 60 or 70%. give us an example- in _ they have gone up 60 or 70%. give us an example. in asda, _ they have gone up 60 or 70%. give us an example. in asda, it _ they have gone up 60 or 70%. give us an example. in asda, it was - they have gone up 60 or 70%. give us an example. in asda, it was 30p i they have gone up 60 or 70%. give us an example. in asda, it was 30p a i an example. in asda, it was 30p a bottle and you're _ an example. in asda, it was 30p a bottle and you're forced _ an example. in asda, it was 30p a bottle and you're forced to - an example. in asda, it was 30p a bottle and you're forced to buy i an example. in asda, it was 30p a bottle and you're forced to buy the j bottle and you're forced to buy the more expensive product. the basics, they were 55 pence a bag and now they're 90p. i go to the same shop and buy the same things. and ijust walk around shaking my head. i think we are alljust being ripped off and we are alljust being ripped off and we are alljust being ripped off and we are having to suck it up. clearly. we are having to suck it up. clearl . ., �* . we are having to suck it up. clearl. ., �* . j clearly. you're convinced they're profiteering? — clearly. you're convinced they're profiteering? absolutely. - profiteering? absolutely. absolutely, _ profiteering? absolutely. absolutely, it _ profiteering? absolutely. absolutely, it is - profiteering? absolutely. absolutely, it is so i profiteering? absolutely. i absolutely, it is so obvious to

profiteering? absolutely. - absolutely, it is so obvious to the ordinary shopper who goes to the supermarkets and buys the same things. it is becoming ridiculous. and when you're on a low income, you're cut to the bone to start with. there is no way you can go. you love labrador, i love animals, i have a cat and a dog.— you love labrador, i love animals, i have a cat and a dog. what about the rice of have a cat and a dog. what about the price of pet — have a cat and a dog. what about the price of pet food? _ have a cat and a dog. what about the price of pet food? yes, _ have a cat and a dog. what about the price of pet food? yes, people i have a cat and a dog. what about the price of pet food? yes, people are i price of pet food? yes, people are stru: aalin price of pet food? yes, people are struggling to _ price of pet food? yes, people are struggling to feed _ price of pet food? yes, people are struggling to feed their— price of pet food? yes, people are struggling to feed their pets. it i price of pet food? yes, people are struggling to feed their pets. it is| struggling to feed their pets. it is awful. what is going to be done? pets are part of the family and they are important for people and their mental health.— are important for people and their mental health._ lee, i mental health. absolutely. lee, rowle , mental health. absolutely. lee, rowley. from — mental health. absolutely. lee, rowley, from the _ mental health. absolutely. lee, rowley, from the government, | mental health. absolutely. lee, i rowley, from the government, are the supermarkets taking the what? the peas? supermarkets taking the what? the -eas? . supermarkets taking the what? the eas? , ., supermarkets taking the what? the -eas? , ., , supermarkets taking the what? the eas? , ., , ., peas? there is two things, one the oint peas? there is two things, one the point about — peas? there is two things, one the point about profit _ peas? there is two things, one the point about profit and _ peas? there is two things, one the point about profit and the - peas? there is two things, one the point about profit and the second i point about profit and the second about _ point about profit and the second about inflation. if there are problems, issues where individual companies — problems, issues where individual companies are not doing the right

thing. _ companies are not doing the right thing, then obviously there are processes— thing, then obviously there are processes in place which we can look at that— processes in place which we can look at that and _ processes in place which we can look at that and where it... jill processes in place which we can look at that and where it. . ._ at that and where it... jill says the 're at that and where it... jill says they're profiteering. _ at that and where it... jill says they're profiteering. are i at that and where it... jill says| they're profiteering. are they? at that and where it... jill says i they're profiteering. are they? the competitions and markets authority has been _ competitions and markets authority has been looking at petrol prices for example for a number of months, because _ for example for a number of months, because there was a suggestion that there was— because there was a suggestion that there was a problem about a year ago _ there was a problem about a year ago prices — there was a problem about a year ago. prices on petrol and diesel have _ ago. prices on petrol and diesel have come _ ago. prices on petrol and diesel have come down, but the cma will publish _ have come down, but the cma will publish their report on whether there _ publish their report on whether there was— publish their report on whether there was a problem there. and the government, if there is, can take action _ government, if there is, can take action that— government, if there is, can take action. that is the process you would — action. that is the process you would take to assess whether there is a profit _ would take to assess whether there is a profit issue. but most of these increases, — is a profit issue. but most of these increases, as— is a profit issue. but most of these increases, as unfortunate and as difficult — increases, as unfortunate and as difficult as — increases, as unfortunate and as difficult as they are, are down to energy— difficult as they are, are down to energy prices, supply difficult as they are, are down to energy prices. supply chains difficult as they are, are down to energy prices, supply chains being messed _ energy prices, supply chains being messed up around the world result of ukraine _ messed up around the world result of ukraine and _ messed up around the world result of ukraine and covid and that all it being _ ukraine and covid and that all it being worked through. we are starting — being worked through. we are starting to see i hope some of those prices _ starting to see i hope some of those prices top _ starting to see i hope some of those prices top off and come down. but i do get, _ prices top off and come down. but i do get, it— prices top off and come down. but i do get, it is— prices top off and come down. but i do get, it isa— prices top off and come down. but i do get, it is a real challenge when we go _ do get, it is a real challenge when we go to— do get, it is a real challenge when we go to the supermarkets and i hope

that prices— we go to the supermarkets and i hope that prices will come down through the normal— that prices will come down through the normal competitive process, within— the normal competitive process, within supermarkets, which has worked — within supermarkets, which has worked well over the past 20 years. but there _ worked well over the past 20 years. but there are processes that can identify— but there are processes that can identify profiteering. fire but there are processes that can identify profiteering.— identify profiteering. are you assuaged. — identify profiteering. are you assuaged. do _ identify profiteering. are you assuaged, do you _ identify profiteering. are you assuaged, do you feel i identify profiteering. are you | assuaged, do you feel better, identify profiteering. are you i assuaged, do you feel better, jill? yes, absolutely. i'm so convinced now that there is no profiteering, i listened to those four yesterday and i was relieved that they convinced there was no profiteering. what a joke! if you're profiteering, you can hardly come on the the media and say, hands up, yeah, we have been a bit greedy and i'm sorry, what are we going to do is bring the prices right down. the big four supermarkets are all in bed together. if you go on to petrol and diesel prices, at the asda garage, i

think its about £1.43 a litre. just along the road in shropshire there is an independent garage that has been selling diesel cheaper than petrol. i'm yet to be convinced there is no profiteering going on. it is a series of cover ups. if you can make money, then you're going to, untilsomebody can make money, then you're going to, until somebody really investigates. it is poor. christine, do ou investigates. it is poor. christine, do you want _ investigates. it is poor. christine, do you want to — investigates. it is poor. christine, do you want to come _ investigates. it is poor. christine, do you want to come back? i investigates. it is poor. christine, | do you want to come back? before that, the communications regulator ofcom says it is launching an investigation into bt, following the uk—wide disruption of 999 call system on sunday. ofcom says our investigation will seek to establish the facts and examine whether there are reasonable grounds to believe bt failed to comply with its

obligations. more on this on the bbc web—site and on five live. christine jardine�*s response to the accusation that the supermarkets are profiteering? we that the supermarkets are profiteering?— profiteering? we need an investigation. _ profiteering? we need an investigation. we - profiteering? we need an investigation. we need i profiteering? we need an l investigation. we need the competition— investigation. we need the competition and _ investigation. we need the competition and markets l investigation. we need the - competition and markets authority investigation. we need the _ competition and markets authority to look into _ competition and markets authority to look into the — competition and markets authority to look into the big _ competition and markets authority to look into the big supermarkets. - look into the big supermarkets. regardless— look into the big supermarkets. regardless of— look into the big supermarkets. regardless of what _ look into the big supermarkets. regardless of what the - look into the big supermarkets. - regardless of what the government may see, _ regardless of what the government may see, pe0ple _ regardless of what the government may see, pe0ple are _ regardless of what the government may see, people are seeing - regardless of what the government may see, people are seeing prices i may see, people are seeing prices going _ may see, people are seeing prices going up. — may see, people are seeing prices going up. they're _ may see, people are seeing prices going up, they're seeing _ may see, people are seeing prices going up, they're seeing you - may see, people are seeing prices going up, they're seeing you know their cost—of—living _ going up, they're seeing you know their cost—of—living is _ going up, they're seeing you know their cost—of—living is living - going up, they're seeing you know their cost—of—living is living is- their cost—of—living is living is already— their cost—of—living is living is already going _ their cost—of—living is living is already going through - their cost—of—living is living is already going through the - their cost—of—living is living is. already going through the roof. their cost—of—living is living is- already going through the roof. we need to— already going through the roof. we need to look— already going through the roof. we need to look into _ already going through the roof. we need to look into what _ already going through the roof. we need to look into what is _ already going through the roof. we need to look into what is going - already going through the roof. we need to look into what is going on. l need to look into what is going on. the government— need to look into what is going on. the government needs _ need to look into what is going on. the government needs extend - need to look into what is going on.| the government needs extend free school _ the government needs extend free school meals — the government needs extend free school meals and _ the government needs extend free school meals and more _ the government needs extend free school meals and more money - the government needs extend free school meals and more money to l school meals and more money to support— school meals and more money to sopport farmers _ school meals and more money to support farmers so _ school meals and more money to support farmers so they're - school meals and more money to support farmers so they're not i school meals and more money to . support farmers so they're not being hit. support farmers so they're not being hit all— support farmers so they're not being hit all food — support farmers so they're not being hit. all food producer— support farmers so they're not being hit. all food producer are _ support farmers so they're not being hit. all food producer are being - support farmers so they're not being hit. all food producer are being hit. hit. all food producer are being hit lly hit. all food producer are being hit ly the _ hit. all food producer are being hit by the rise — hit. all food producer are being hit by the rise in— hit. all food producer are being hit by the rise in energy— hit. all food producer are being hit by the rise in energy cost - hit. all food producer are being hit by the rise in energy cost and - hit. all food producer are being hit by the rise in energy cost and we i by the rise in energy cost and we need _ by the rise in energy cost and we need to— by the rise in energy cost and we need to do— by the rise in energy cost and we need to do more _ by the rise in energy cost and we need to do more to _ by the rise in energy cost and we need to do more to support- by the rise in energy cost and we | need to do more to support them by the rise in energy cost and we - need to do more to support them and keep the _ need to do more to support them and keep the cost— need to do more to support them and keep the cost down. _ need to do more to support them and keep the cost down. we _ need to do more to support them and keep the cost down. we need - need to do more to support them and keep the cost down. we need an- keep the cost down. we need an investigation _ keep the cost down. we need an investigation to— keep the cost down. we need an investigation to reassure - keep the cost down. we need an| investigation to reassure people. because — investigation to reassure people. because we — investigation to reassure people.

because we are _ investigation to reassure people. because we are going _ investigation to reassure people. because we are going into - because we are going into supermarkets _ because we are going into supermarkets and - because we are going into supermarkets and seeing i because we are going into i supermarkets and seeing the because we are going into - supermarkets and seeing the prices goings _ supermarkets and seeing the prices goihgs up _ supermarkets and seeing the prices goihgs up week— supermarkets and seeing the prices goihgs up week on— supermarkets and seeing the prices goings up week on week. _ supermarkets and seeing the prices goings up week on week. and - supermarkets and seeing the prices goings up week on week. and it - supermarkets and seeing the prices goings up week on week. and it is i goings up week on week. and it is getting _ goings up week on week. and it is getting more _ goings up week on week. and it is getting more and _ goings up week on week. and it is getting more and more _ goings up week on week. and it is getting more and more difficult. goings up week on week. and it is| getting more and more difficult for people _ getting more and more difficult for people we — getting more and more difficult for people. we might— getting more and more difficult for people. we might be _ getting more and more difficult for people. we might he being - getting more and more difficult for people. we might he being unfairl getting more and more difficult for. people. we might he being unfairto the retailers. — people. we might he being unfairto the retailers, but _ people. we might he being unfairto the retailers, but we _ people. we might he being unfairto the retailers, but we won't - people. we might he being unfairto the retailers, but we won't know- the retailers, but we won't know unless _ the retailers, but we won't know unless the — the retailers, but we won't know unless the cma _ the retailers, but we won't know unless the cma investigates - the retailers, but we won't know unless the cma investigates and finds— unless the cma investigates and finds out— unless the cma investigates and finds out what _ unless the cma investigates and finds out what is _ unless the cma investigates and finds out what is going - unless the cma investigates and finds out what is going on - unless the cma investigates and finds out what is going on and l unless the cma investigates and finds out what is going on and if| finds out what is going on and if there _ finds out what is going on and if there profiteering _ finds out what is going on and if there profiteering does - finds out what is going on and if. there profiteering does something. finds out what is going on and if- there profiteering does something. i do enjoy— there profiteering does something. i do ehioy labour— there profiteering does something. i do enjoy labour questions _ there profiteering does something. i do enjoy labour questions about. do enjoy labour questions about brexit, because they get nervous and timid as they have been accused of being, because they don't want to upset anyone by taking a particular stand on it. justin, industry leaders have warned that after brexit, red tape could push up food prices and worsen the inflation crisis. this is the fresh produce consortium that represents 60

members. they have written to the government about these cross border checks. costs, delay and disruption. that is a brexit effect isn't it? it that is a brexit effect isn't it? it sounds like it and it is not what people — sounds like it and it is not what people voted for and one of the things— people voted for and one of the things we — people voted for and one of the things we would be people voted for and one of the things we would he look to do is have _ things we would he look to do is have a _ things we would he look to do is have a veterinary agreement with the eu and _ have a veterinary agreement with the eu and that _ have a veterinary agreement with the eu and that would help with the red tape _ eu and that would help with the red tape in _ eu and that would help with the red tape. in terms of what the supermarkets are doing, i watched with interest their evidence to the select— with interest their evidence to the select committee yesterday and i will be _ select committee yesterday and i will be very interested to see what report _ will be very interested to see what report they come outwith. i don't that the _ report they come outwith. i don't that the supermarkets put up a convincing display as to why these ihcreases — convincing display as to why these increases have happened. the competition and markets authority investigation into petrol prices will be — investigation into petrol prices will be illuminating. i can recall last year— will be illuminating. i can recall last year on holiday in scotland gettihg — last year on holiday in scotland getting some petrol from a supermarket on the way home, going

past the _ supermarket on the way home, going past the same supermarket in my own constituency, just a couple of miles down _ constituency, just a couple of miles down the _ constituency, just a couple of miles down the role from an oil refinery and it— down the role from an oil refinery and it was— down the role from an oil refinery and it was 10 pence a litre more. those _ and it was 10 pence a litre more. those questions will no doubt raise suspicions— those questions will no doubt raise suspicions among people about what is going _ suspicions among people about what is going oh~ — suspicions among people about what is going on. i think the combination of those _ is going on. i think the combination of those two pre—budget reports, wheh _ of those two pre—budget reports, wheh -- _ of those two pre—budget reports, wheh -- of— of those two pre—budget reports, when —— of those two reports will -ive when —— of those two reports will give us _ when —— of those two reports will give us an— when —— of those two reports will give us an idea of if more needs to be done _ give us an idea of if more needs to be done. .,, �* give us an idea of if more needs to be done. �* ., , give us an idea of if more needs to be done. �* .,, ,. be done. post brexit red tape, you sa it is be done. post brexit red tape, you say it is not _ be done. post brexit red tape, you say it is not what _ be done. post brexit red tape, you say it is not what people _ be done. post brexit red tape, you say it is not what people voted - be done. post brexit red tape, you| say it is not what people voted for, but it is, they voted for leaving the eyou. l but it is, they voted for leaving the e ou. ., �* ~' but it is, they voted for leaving thee ou. ., �* ,, , but it is, they voted for leaving thee ou. ,, , the eyou. i don't think it is, you can leave _ the eyou. i don't think it is, you can leave the _ the eyou. i don't think it is, you can leave the eu _ the eyou. i don't think it is, you can leave the eu and _ the eyou. i don't think it is, you can leave the eu and not - the eyou. i don't think it is, you can leave the eu and not cut. the eyou. i don't think it is, you can leave the eu and not cut off the eyou. i don't think it is, you i can leave the eu and not cut off all ties and _ can leave the eu and not cut off all ties and get into a world with any regulatory— ties and get into a world with any regulatory convergence is an anathema. it is possible to have a closer— anathema. it is possible to have a closer and — anathema. it is possible to have a closer and more... we anathema. it is possible to have a closer and more. . ._ closer and more... we are a third count prince. _ closer and more... we are a third count prince. christine? -- - closer and more... we are a third count prince. christine? -- we i

closer and more... we are a third | count prince. christine? -- we are closer and more... we are a third i count prince. christine? -- we are a count prince. christine? —— we are a third country? christine. you count prince. christine? -- we are a third country? christine.— third country? christine. you can't den it third country? christine. you can't deny it has — third country? christine. you can't deny it has an _ third country? christine. you can't deny it has an impact, _ third country? christine. you can't deny it has an impact, because . third country? christine. you can't deny it has an impact, because if. deny it has an impact, because if you take the food processing industry in the north—east, they were very hard hit by the fact that fishermen were having to go to the continent to land their catches, because it was the only way they could get it to europe. what we are feeling is a knock on effect of prebgt. —— brexit. we have been through two things in covid and brexit and we have to accept brexit is one of them.— is one of them. christine, what is our is one of them. christine, what is your policy. _ is one of them. christine, what is your policy. you _ is one of them. christine, what is your policy. you did _ is one of them. christine, what is your policy, you did before? - is one of them. christine, what is your policy, you did before? you| your policy, you did before? you changed? we your policy, you did before? you chanced? ~ ., , your policy, you did before? you chanced? ~ . , ., changed? we need a build a relationship, _ changed? we need a build a relationship, as _ changed? we need a build a relationship, as a _ changed? we need a build a relationship, as a country i changed? we need a build a| relationship, as a country we changed? we need a build a - relationship, as a country we need to build a relationship with europe

and re—establish the links that will get us you know into strong trading position where europe and with other parts of world. but we have to recognise that it has been damaging and that people feel let down. they feel what they voted for is not what they got and that is increasing as time goes by and they see this brexit bonus doesn't exist. let me move on, because _ brexit bonus doesn't exist. let me move on, because there _ brexit bonus doesn't exist. let me move on, because there has - brexit bonus doesn't exist. let me move on, because there has been| brexit bonus doesn't exist. let me| move on, because there has been a lot of speculation about the state of our water industry. the boss at thames water quit yesterday, unexpectedly, reports the government is drawing up contingency plans for wh to do if the —— whether to do if the company collapses. defra says it is a matter to the company and its shareholders. we prepare for a range of scenario, we prepare forera range

—— for a range of scenarios. the sector as a whole is financially resilient. 0ffwatt continues to monitor the companies. away from that the times suggesting bills could rise by 40% to fix sewage. who should pay? lee? ilrrul’ell could rise by 40% to fix sewage. who should pay? lee?— could rise by 4096 to fix sewage. who should pay? lee? well the money has to come from — should pay? lee? well the money has to come from somewhere. _ should pay? lee? well the money has to come from somewhere. so, - should pay? lee? well the money has to come from somewhere. so, that i should pay? lee? well the money has to come from somewhere. so, that is| to come from somewhere. so, that is the reality. _ to come from somewhere. so, that is the reality, with all these conversations, christine was talking about _ conversations, christine was talking about that _ conversations, christine was talking about that all costs money, money has to— about that all costs money, money has to be _ about that all costs money, money has to be found. if you take the sewage — has to be found. if you take the sewage question in particular, one of reasons— sewage question in particular, one of reasons why the water companies were privatised back in the 80s without— were privatised back in the 80s without rerunning discussions that happened — without rerunning discussions that happened when i was a kid, is because — happened when i was a kid, is because when it was on the national

balance _ because when it was on the national balance sheet, you had to fight for money— balance sheet, you had to fight for money for— balance sheet, you had to fight for money for investment, for the things that we _ money for investment, for the things that we now— money for investment, for the things that we now are needed to sort out the sewage, with hospitals and schools — the sewage, with hospitals and schools and pensions and other things — schools and pensions and other things. part of reason who the reason — things. part of reason who the reason they were privatised was to open _ reason they were privatised was to open up _ reason they were privatised was to open up to— reason they were privatised was to open up to a heap of private investment.— open up to a heap of private investment. . ., , �* ., ~ open up to a heap of private investment. . ., , �* ., ,, m investment. that hasn't worked. what is our investment. that hasn't worked. what is your definition _ investment. that hasn't worked. what is your definition of _ investment. that hasn't worked. what is your definition of work _ investment. that hasn't worked. what is your definition of work something i is your definition of work something in-? is your definition of work something ing? that _ is your definition of work something ing? that is — is your definition of work something ing? that is not having sewage leaking into schools and the people who own the companies get massive bonuses. ., who own the companies get massive bonuses. . , , , who own the companies get massive bonuses. . , ,, . ., , bonuses. that process was created be bonuses. that process was created be b the bonuses. that process was created be by the victorians. _ bonuses. that process was created be by the victorians. we _ bonuses. that process was created be by the victorians. we have _ bonuses. that process was created be by the victorians. we have to - bonuses. that process was created be by the victorians. we have to try - by the victorians. we have to try and mitigate it. but this is all, exactly— and mitigate it. but this is all, exactly why politics doesn't work, because _ exactly why politics doesn't work, because there is a conversation about— because there is a conversation about trade offs. ten years ago i remember— about trade offs. ten years ago i remember talking to thames water about— remember talking to thames water about trying to ensure that bills didn't—

about trying to ensure that bills didn't go— about trying to ensure that bills didn't go up through leakage. a huge amount— didn't go up through leakage. a huge amount of— didn't go up through leakage. a huge amount of work went on. now we need to most— amount of work went on. now we need to most vulnerable on to sewage. —— to most vulnerable on to sewage. —— to move _ to most vulnerable on to sewage. —— to move on _ to most vulnerable on to sewage. —— to move on to— to most vulnerable on to sewage. —— to move on to sewage. but the idea this is— to move on to sewage. but the idea this is new— to move on to sewage. but the idea this is new is — to move on to sewage. but the idea this is new is created for party political— this is new is created for party political purposes.— this is new is created for party political purposes. don't see that to the public- _ political purposes. don't see that to the public. they _ political purposes. don't see that to the public. they won't - political purposes. don't see that to the public. they won't like - political purposes. don't see that l to the public. they won't like that. they're seeing the sewage in the rivers. and maybe instead of... hang on. instead of privatising it, and the money going to directors and massive bonuses, maybe if that money had gone into investing in our water system over the past few years. the liberal democrats' proposal is to nationalise the water companies and there _ nationalise the water companies and there will— nationalise the water companies and there will be less money in the water— there will be less money in the water industry and to fixing the sewage — water industry and to fixing the sewage issues. why water industry and to fixing the sewage issues.— water industry and to fixing the sewage issues. water industry and to fixing the sewaae issues. ~ , , ., ., ., sewage issues. why did you vote down an amendment — sewage issues. why did you vote down an amendment to _ sewage issues. why did you vote down an amendment to stop _ sewage issues. why did you vote down an amendment to stop private - sewage issues. why did you vote down an amendment to stop private water i an amendment to stop private water companies from dumping raw sewage into rivers? �* , ., ,

into rivers? there because there was alread a into rivers? there because there was already a plan- _ into rivers? there because there was already a plan. that _ into rivers? there because there was already a plan. that is _ into rivers? there because there was already a plan. that is working - already a plan. that is working well. as christine _ already a plan. that is working well. as christine keeps - already a plan. that is working well. as christine keeps tells l already a plan. that is working i well. as christine keeps tells me this is working _ well. as christine keeps tells me this is working well, _ well. as christine keeps tells me this is working well, this - well. as christine keeps tells me this is working well, this issue i well. as christine keeps tells me | this is working well, this issue has been _ this is working well, this issue has been around for longer we have been alive and _ been around for longer we have been alive and there has been significant investment. we only know because the conservative monitor the sewage. people _ conservative monitor the sewage. people don't remember it as being as bad. i people don't remember it as being as bad. , ., ., bad. i we put the monitoring equipment — bad. i we put the monitoring equipment in _ bad. i we put the monitoring equipment in to _ bad. i we put the monitoring equipment in to have - bad. i we put the monitoring equipment in to have this i equipment in to have this econversation. to shine a light on what _ econversation. to shine a light on what is _ econversation. to shine a light on what is happening. there is a price ta- what is happening. there is a price tag running — what is happening. there is a price tag running into hundreds of billions _ tag running into hundreds of billions that we have to do something and we are through our plans— something and we are through our plans and — something and we are through our plans and we will get on with what we are _ plans and we will get on with what we are doing, that is to incrementally reduce it and improve it over— incrementally reduce it and improve it over years. the entirety of the rest of _ it over years. the entirety of the rest of debate is not realistic. justin — rest of debate is not realistic. justin madders. i�*m rest of debate is not realistic. justin madders.— rest of debate is not realistic. justin madders. i'm used to the conservatives _ justin madders. i'm used to the conservatives blame _ justin madders. i'm used to the conservatives blame the - justin madders. i'm used to the conservatives blame the last i justin madders. i'm used to the - conservatives blame the last labour government, — conservatives blame the last labour government, but— conservatives blame the last labour government, but to _ conservatives blame the last labour

government, but to blame - conservatives blame the last labour government, but to blame the - government, but to blame the victorians _ government, but to blame the victorians. lit— government, but to blame the victorians-— victorians. it is not true the entire system _ victorians. it is not true the entire system was - victorians. it is not true the entire system was on - victorians. it is not true the entire system was on the i victorians. it is not true the i entire system was on the basis victorians. it is not true the - entire system was on the basis that overflows— entire system was on the basis that overflows have to go somewhere. which _ overflows have to go somewhere. which bit — overflows have to go somewhere. which bit of that is inaccurate? we can all— which bit of that is inaccurate? we can all talk— which bit of that is inaccurate? we can all talk about that. the #2r50u9 truth is _ can all talk about that. the #2r50u9 truth is the _ can all talk about that. the #2r50u9 truth is the system was set up 150 year ago _ truth is the system was set up150 year ago to— truth is the system was set up 150 year ago to have overflows. now the idea it _ year ago to have overflows. now the idea it is _ year ago to have overflows. now the idea it is a _ year ago to have overflows. now the idea it is a problem that hasjust appeared — idea it is a problem that hasjust appeared. it has been there for a century— appeared. it has been there for a century and a half.— century and a half. that says something — century and a half. that says something about _ century and a half. that says something about our - century and a half. that says something about our system century and a half. that says - something about our system that it has been _ something about our system that it has been ignored _ something about our system that it has been ignored for— something about our system that it has been ignored for so _ something about our system that it has been ignored for so long. - something about our system that it has been ignored for so long. the i has been ignored for so long. the irk issue — has been ignored for so long. the irk issue with _ has been ignored for so long. the irk issue with thames _ has been ignored for so long. the irk issue with thames water, - has been ignored for so long. the irk issue with thames water, it i irk issue with thames water, it doesn't — irk issue with thames water, it doesn't seem _ irk issue with thames water, it doesn't seem to _ irk issue with thames water, it doesn't seem to be _ irk issue with thames water, it doesn't seem to be run - irk issue with thames water, it doesn't seem to be run very. irk issue with thames water, it i doesn't seem to be run very well, irk issue with thames water, it - doesn't seem to be run very well, if it has— doesn't seem to be run very well, if it has this _ doesn't seem to be run very well, if it has this debt. — doesn't seem to be run very well, if it has this debt. i— doesn't seem to be run very well, if it has this debt. i expect— doesn't seem to be run very well, if it has this debt. i expect and - doesn't seem to be run very well, if it has this debt. i expect and hope i it has this debt. i expect and hope the government— it has this debt. i expect and hope the government come _ it has this debt. i expect and hope the government come forward - it has this debt. i expect and hopel the government come forward with it has this debt. i expect and hope i the government come forward with a statement _ the government come forward with a statement about— the government come forward with a statement about what _ the government come forward with a statement about what is _ the government come forward with a statement about what is going - the government come forward with a statement about what is going to - statement about what is going to happen— statement about what is going to happen there _ statement about what is going to happen there and _ statement about what is going to happen there and it— statement about what is going to happen there and it means - statement about what is going to happen there and it means that i statement about what is going to i happen there and it means that we need _ happen there and it means that we need to— happen there and it means that we need to look— happen there and it means that we need to look carefully— happen there and it means that we need to look carefully at _ happen there and it means that we need to look carefully at how - happen there and it means that we need to look carefully at how all i need to look carefully at how all these _ need to look carefully at how all these companies _ need to look carefully at how all these companies run, _ need to look carefully at how all these companies run, because i need to look carefully at how all - these companies run, because they're clearly— these companies run, because they're clearly not _ these companies run, because they're clearly not being — these companies run, because they're clearly not being run _ these companies run, because they're clearly not being run properly- these companies run, because they're clearly not being run properly at - clearly not being run properly at the moment _

clearly not being run properly at the moment-— clearly not being run properly at the moment. ., , ., ., , ., the moment. people are furious about this, i'm in the moment. people are furious about this. i'm in the — the moment. people are furious about this, i'm in the business _ the moment. people are furious about this, i'm in the business of _ the moment. people are furious about this, i'm in the business of trying - this, i'm in the business of trying to understand how people feel about stuff. £14 billion in debt thames water. one in every four litres of water in its pipes leaks. nearly one litre in every four lost. that leakage rate is at a five—year high. high is it at a five—year high? h high is it at a five—year high? i presume that thames had a big programme around that, when i was a councillor— programme around that, when i was a councillor in _ programme around that, when i was a councillor in london 15 years ago, one in— councillor in london 15 years ago, one in every— councillor in london 15 years ago, one in every three litres were lost. i'm one in every three litres were lost. i'm not— one in every three litres were lost. i'm not here — one in every three litres were lost. i'm not here to defend thames, where there _ i'm not here to defend thames, where there is— i'm not here to defend thames, where there is poor— i'm not here to defend thames, where there is poor behaviour by companies, they should be held to account _ companies, they should be held to account. do they deserve their

dividends— account. do they deserve their dividends the directors. i can't dividends the directors. ican't comment— dividends the directors. i can't comment on that. i know over 0 years there _ comment on that. i know over 0 years there has— comment on that. i know over 0 years there has been more private investment in the water industry for the benefit — investment in the water industry for the benefit of those people who are using _ the benefit of those people who are using it _ the benefit of those people who are using it than there has been dividends that have been taken out. if dividends that have been taken out. if there _ dividends that have been taken out. if there is _ dividends that have been taken out. if there is not private sector involvement in the industry, then we cannot— involvement in the industry, then we cannot access private capital and it will need _ cannot access private capital and it will need to be allocated via government spend and will mean less money— government spend and will mean less money for— government spend and will mean less money for hospitals and schools and pensions _ money for hospitals and schools and pensions. all of politics is a trade off. pensions. all of politics is a trade off much— pensions. all of politics is a trade off. much as people want to lg noer that~ _ off. much as people want to lg noer that~ -- _ off. much as people want to lg noer that. —— ignore that. to fix and mitigate — that. —— ignore that. to fix and mitigate the issues on sewage, sort out the _ mitigate the issues on sewage, sort out the leaks and do many of the other— out the leaks and do many of the other things in other areas. if other things in other areas. anyone other things in other areas. if anyone wants to comment, feel free. can i read some texts. we are already paid the water companies to deal with the sewage. it is on our

bills. the issue is due too the government allowing them to dump waste. let them use the money they have already taken from us. make thames water and sort it out. we are paying for that are bonuses. blaming the victorians now? brilliant! ! ! ! the water companies have been paying out over a billion in div kends dividends in years. and now they say we should pay. lee, your line would not seem to be according to the texts i'm looking at and the messages, a vote—winner? texts i'm looking at and the messages, a vote-winner? politicians have not to messages, a vote-winner? politicians have got to be — messages, a vote-winner? politicians have got to be honest _ messages, a vote-winner? politicians have got to be honest with _ messages, a vote-winner? politicians have got to be honest with people - have got to be honest with people and the _ have got to be honest with people and the issue is we have a system

that was— and the issue is we have a system that was build 150 years ago and we have to _ that was build 150 years ago and we have to try— that was build 150 years ago and we have to try and improve that. i don't _ have to try and improve that. i don't disagree with the need to improve — don't disagree with the need to improve it. that is why we have the plan in _ improve it. that is why we have the plan in place — improve it. that is why we have the plan in place to do that. any politician _ plan in place to do that. any politician that says, oh, this is is something — politician that says, oh, this is is something that has appeared in the last few— something that has appeared in the last few year, that is not correct. if politicians don't define the problem properly and the reason why things— problem properly and the reason why things are _ problem properly and the reason why things are in place, this is a very long-term — things are in place, this is a very long—term the issue, where some progress — long—term the issue, where some progress has been made, but more needs— progress has been made, but more needs to _ progress has been made, but more needs to be — progress has been made, but more needs to be done. if we are not honest— needs to be done. if we are not honest with people, you get into random — honest with people, you get into random places that don't fix the problem — random places that don't fix the problem. to random places that don't fix the roblem. ., ,._ random places that don't fix the roblem. ., ._ , random places that don't fix the roblem. ., , �*, problem. to say it is disraeli's fault, a problem. to say it is disraeli's fault. a lot _ problem. to say it is disraeli's fault, a lot of— problem. to say it is disraeli's fault, a lot of people - problem. to say it is disraeli's fault, a lot of people are - problem. to say it is disraeli's - fault, a lot of people are laughing. they should have fixed it. you're saying it is a victorian problem. i saying it is a victorian problem. i thatis saying it is a victorian problem. i that is a great example of where we caricature _ that is a great example of where we caricature politics. what is the ultimate — caricature politics. what is the ultimate problem? it is we have a system _ ultimate problem? it is we have a system that has been around for a century— system that has been around for a century that was physically designed

to do this _ century that was physically designed to do this a century and a half ago, otherwise — to do this a century and a half ago, otherwise the sewage would come back into our— otherwise the sewage would come back into our houses there. has been a significant — into our houses there. has been a significant amount of work done to resolve _ significant amount of work done to resolve that, but more is needed. you have — resolve that, but more is needed. you have to — resolve that, but more is needed. you have to understand the problem in the _ you have to understand the problem in the first— you have to understand the problem in the first place. that is a long time _ in the first place. that is a long time ago — in the first place. that is a long time ago in _ in the first place. that is a long time ago in its making. but in the first place. that is a long time ago in its making.- time ago in its making. but it should have _ time ago in its making. but it should have been _ time ago in its making. but it should have been done - time ago in its making. but it| should have been done before time ago in its making. elf it should have been done before now. it is all very well to say the victorians designed it 150 years ago. i don't remember, it was before my time, i imagine when the industry was privatised the justification was there could be private investment, because it would need improvement. if we are blaming 150 years ago. why hasn't it been updated and the investment put back into the water industry to prevent us getting to the situation where we have a water

system which, companies which are failing, we hear about leaks, and sewage, in our rivers, in our chalk streams. all of this surely there has been money in the system which could have prevented it getting to this point. could have prevented it getting to this oint., , could have prevented it getting to this oint., . i. could have prevented it getting to this oint., , ,. . could have prevented it getting to this oint. . i. . , this point. justin, you have spoken about this. — this point. justin, you have spoken about this, haven't _ this point. justin, you have spoken about this, haven't you, _ this point. justin, you have spoken about this, haven't you, it - this point. justin, you have spoken about this, haven't you, it is - about this, haven't you, it is apparent the industry is not taking its responsibility to keep our rivers clean and you have criticised the water companies. will keir starmer go in with his waders, how will you fix it. will you privatise the water companies, nationalise thatis the water companies, nationalise that is the is the word i'm look for. it that is the is the word i'm look for. . ., ., that is the is the word i'm look for. . ,, ., that is the is the word i'm look for. . ,, . for. if we can agree access to clean

water is a — for. if we can agree access to clean water is a basic— for. if we can agree access to clean water is a basic hue _ for. if we can agree access to clean water is a basic hue plan _ for. if we can agree access to clean water is a basic hue plan right, - for. if we can agree access to clean water is a basic hue plan right, we| water is a basic hue plan right, we have _ water is a basic hue plan right, we have to _ water is a basic hue plan right, we have to look— water is a basic hue plan right, we have to look at _ water is a basic hue plan right, we have to look at the _ water is a basic hue plan right, we have to look at the way _ water is a basic hue plan right, we have to look at the way the - water is a basic hue plan right, we have to look at the way the modelj water is a basic hue plan right, we i have to look at the way the model is working _ have to look at the way the model is working when — have to look at the way the model is working. when we _ have to look at the way the model is working. when we are _ have to look at the way the model is working. when we are seeing - have to look at the way the model is i working. when we are seeing massive profits _ working. when we are seeing massive profits and _ working. when we are seeing massive profits and massive _ working. when we are seeing massive profits and massive debts, _ working. when we are seeing massive profits and massive debts, we - working. when we are seeing massive profits and massive debts, we have i profits and massive debts, we have to ask— profits and massive debts, we have to ask whether— profits and massive debts, we have to ask whether the _ profits and massive debts, we have to ask whether the model - profits and massive debts, we have to ask whether the model is - profits and massive debts, we have i to ask whether the model is working. what is _ to ask whether the model is working. what is a _ to ask whether the model is working. what is a better— to ask whether the model is working. what is a better model? _ to ask whether the model is working. what is a better model? we - to ask whether the model is working. what is a better model?— what is a better model? we can't commit to — what is a better model? we can't commit to re-nationalisation. - what is a better model? we can'tj commit to re-nationalisation. but ou want commit to re-nationalisation. but you want to _ commit to re—nationalisation. you want to change the model? commit to re-nationalisation. but i you want to change the model? we have to get tougher on regulation and fines— have to get tougher on regulation and fines for— have to get tougher on regulation and fines for failing _ have to get tougher on regulation and fines for failing to _ have to get tougher on regulation and fines for failing to monitor. and fines for failing to monitor sewage — and fines for failing to monitor sewage dumps. _ and fines for failing to monitor sewage dumps, getting - and fines for failing to monitor sewage dumps, getting a - and fines for failing to monitor. sewage dumps, getting a proper long-term — sewage dumps, getting a proper long-term plan— sewage dumps, getting a proper long—term plan into _ sewage dumps, getting a proper long—term plan into the - sewage dumps, getting a proper. long—term plan into the companies sewage dumps, getting a proper- long—term plan into the companies to make _ long—term plan into the companies to make sure _ long—term plan into the companies to make sure they— long—term plan into the companies to make sure they do _ long—term plan into the companies to make sure they do the _ long—term plan into the companies to make sure they do the investment. i make sure they do the investment. one of— make sure they do the investment. one of the — make sure they do the investment. one of the problems _ make sure they do the investment. one of the problems with - make sure they do the investment. one of the problems with the - one of the problems with the privatisation _ one of the problems with the privatisation of— one of the problems with the privatisation of water- one of the problems with the privatisation of water is - one of the problems with the i privatisation of water is you've create — privatisation of water is you've create private _ privatisation of water is you've create private sector— privatisation of water is you've i create private sector monopolies privatisation of water is you've - create private sector monopolies and the incentive — create private sector monopolies and the incentive in— create private sector monopolies and the incentive in company— create private sector monopolies and the incentive in company law- create private sector monopolies and the incentive in company law is - create private sector monopolies and the incentive in company law is to. the incentive in company law is to make _ the incentive in company law is to make a _ the incentive in company law is to make a profit— the incentive in company law is to make a profit and _ the incentive in company law is to make a profit and make _ the incentive in company law is tol make a profit and make dividends, not invest— make a profit and make dividends, not invest in— make a profit and make dividends, not invest in the _ make a profit and make dividends, not invest in the common - make a profit and make dividends, not invest in the common good. i make a profit and make dividends, - not invest in the common good. there is rofit not invest in the common good. there is profit and — not invest in the common good. there is profit and profit. _ not invest in the common good. there is profit and profit. would _ not invest in the common good. there is profit and profit. would you - not invest in the common good. is profit and profit. would you like to speak to joshua? is profit and profit. would you like to speak tojoshua? who who wants to

speak tojoshua. speak to our mps. speak tojoshua. speak to our mp5. the minute we speak of water. h speak to joshua. speak to our mps. the minute we speak of water. i have a drain in my — the minute we speak of water. i have a drain in my garden _ the minute we speak of water. i have a drain in my garden and _ the minute we speak of water. i have a drain in my garden and when - the minute we speak of water. i have a drain in my garden and when it - a drain in my garden and when it rains it overflows and itjust washes sewage into my garden and pollutes a river which is backs on to. every time it is the same. thames water say hydraulic overload, because it is raining, it is people putting extra strain on the system and that is their excuse to get out of it. they need to stop their excuses and you know... issy wong it has been happening since 2020. issy wong it has been happening since 2020-_ issy wong it has been happening since 2020. . .. . �* ,, ., since 2020. thames water didn't know it existed until— since 2020. thames water didn't know it existed until i _ since 2020. thames water didn't know it existed until i told _ since 2020. thames water didn't know

it existed until i told them. _ since 2020. thames water didn't know it existed until i told them. that - it existed until i told them. that goes to show how much they know about their own system. i am not even with thames water, theyjust own the infrastructure, so they come out and do the clean—up. it takes day. one day i had a pair of knickers floating in my garden. who is rushing knickers down the toilet for one thing? it is back washing into my garden. it is the train that is backing up. i am tempted to say this is pants. what is your question? what are they going to do. why is it making a public so much of a problem? you talk about making a monopoly, but if it works and it is fair, it is not a monopoly when it is owned by the people. do you see

what i'm in? it would be great it works in principle. when water companies were privatised in 1980, it was accepted they would run well, so money goes on solving it. it sounds terrible, i agree it sounds like it needs to be fixed. if you want to nationalise a company, you need to spend money on buying the company, you'd then get less access to private capital, less money coming in from other places. you have to spend more money from the balance sheet, which will go on schools and pensions and other things. schools and pensions and other thins. .. schools and pensions and other thins. ., , . . things. you can virtue signal and sa , it is things. you can virtue signal and

say, it is taken _ things. you can virtue signal and say, it is taken money _ things. you can virtue signal and say, it is taken money from - things. you can virtue signal and - say, it is taken money from schools. would _ say, it is taken money from schools. would you _ say, it is taken money from schools. would you happily have kids running around _ would you happily have kids running around in _ would you happily have kids running around in sewage? when it was nationalise, we didn't have this problem — nationalise, we didn't have this problem. you're saying buying a bike or take _ problem. you're saying buying a bike or take the _ problem. you're saying buying a bike or take the money away. that is not necessarily— or take the money away. that is not necessarily the case. where is the proof— necessarily the case. where is the proof of— necessarily the case. where is the proof of work to show how they solve the problems? theyjust make excuses — the problems? they 'ust make excuses. �* . , ., the problems? they 'ust make excuses. . , . ,, , excuses. i've had similar issues in my patch. — excuses. i've had similar issues in my patch. we've _ excuses. i've had similar issues in my patch, we've had _ excuses. i've had similar issues in my patch, we've had expansions l excuses. i've had similar issues in | my patch, we've had expansions of capacity in my major town i represent. there are ways to do it. politics, when you boil it down, it does present a series of choices. if people want to nationalise the water industry, that is a lot of money not going into fixing these issues. we need to focus on how we fix it, which is the plan the government

have brought forward is trying to do. .. have brought forward is trying to do. ., . ., , , have brought forward is trying to do. ., .. , , . do. how can they fix it if they are in debt? every — do. how can they fix it if they are in debt? every time _ do. how can they fix it if they are in debt? every time there - do. how can they fix it if they are in debt? every time there is - do. how can they fix it if they are in debt? every time there is a i do. how can they fix it if they are i in debt? every time there is a lead, the company _ in debt? every time there is a lead, the company gets — in debt? every time there is a lead, the company gets fine. _ in debt? every time there is a lead, the company gets fine. it _ in debt? every time there is a lead, the company gets fine. it thames i the company gets fine. it thames water gets a fine every time you get knickers in your garden, they will be much quicker. haifa knickers in your garden, they will be much quicker.— knickers in your garden, they will be much quicker. how can they afford to fix it if you — be much quicker. how can they afford to fix it if you keep _ be much quicker. how can they afford to fix it if you keep finding _ be much quicker. how can they afford to fix it if you keep finding it? - to fix it if you keep finding it? there are waterfalls and water calls, and we are getting a lot of them. the minute we mention water... every time it rains, i hear the same excuses. they will say hydraulic overload, and that is case close for them. .. .. �* overload, and that is case close for them. ., ., �* overload, and that is case close for them. ., , overload, and that is case close for them. ., i] them. you don't sound bass please. i ut u- them. you don't sound bass please. i put up with — them. you don't sound bass please. i put up with it- — them. you don't sound bass please. i put up with it. thames _ them. you don't sound bass please. i put up with it. thames water - them. you don't sound bass please. i put up with it. thames water said - put up with it. thames water said the extraordinary _ put up with it. thames water said the extraordinary water _ put up with it. thames water said the extraordinary water costs - put up with it. thames water said the extraordinary water costs and |

the extraordinary water costs and whether storms were outplayed. we may come back to it after the news and sport, because there is a volume of... i did originate the phrase, they make no apologies, that when they make no apologies, that when they apologise, i did say sorry seems to be the hardest heard. it seems to be the hardest heard. it seems appropriate to say now because of eltonjohn. if you want to ask a question, feel free. we are coming back. al tansley has the 5 live news. the department for education says "nothing is more important" than school safety. it's after a report by the national audit office which said up to 700,000 pupils in england are being taught in buildings that need to be repaired or replaced. the trial of kevin spacey is expected to begin shortly at southwark crown court in london.

the hollywood actor — who was artistic director of the city's old vic theatre for 11 years — denies all 12 of the sex offence charges against him. six teenagers have been charged with murdering a 14—year—old boy in newcastle. gordon gault died in hospital six days after he was assaulted in the elswick area last november. the suspects, who are all male and aged 16 and 17, are due before magistrates today. therefore says it is ready for a number of things after its secretary step down, prompting questions about its future. the step down, prompting questions about its future. ., , , step down, prompting questions about its future. .,, , . , . ,, step down, prompting questions about its future. , ., . ,, , its future. the toss has taken place ahead of the _ its future. the toss has taken place ahead of the ashes _ its future. the toss has taken place ahead of the ashes test _ its future. the toss has taken place ahead of the ashes test with - its future. the toss has taken place i ahead of the ashes test with england 1-0 down~ _ ahead of the ashes test with england 1-0 down. . ., ahead of the ashes test with england 1-0 down. . . ., .,, , 1-0 down. england have won the toss and roll bowl — 1-0 down. england have won the toss and roll bowl first, _ 1-0 down. england have won the toss and roll bowl first, ben _ 1-0 down. england have won the toss and roll bowl first, ben stokes - and roll bowl first, ben stokes looked —

and roll bowl first, ben stokes looked relieved _ and roll bowl first, ben stokes looked relieved because - and roll bowl first, ben stokes looked relieved because it - and roll bowl first, ben stokes looked relieved because it is i and roll bowl first, ben stokes - looked relieved because it is murky. it looked relieved because it is murky. it should _ looked relieved because it is murky. it should help — looked relieved because it is murky. it should help the _ looked relieved because it is murky. it should help the seamers, - looked relieved because it is murky. it should help the seamers, going i looked relieved because it is murky. j it should help the seamers, going in without— it should help the seamers, going in without a _ it should help the seamers, going in without a spinner. _ it should help the seamers, going in without a spinner. neighbour- it should help the seamers, going in without a spinner. neighbour lion i without a spinner. neighbour lion plays— without a spinner. neighbour lion plays his — without a spinner. neighbour lion plays his 100th _ without a spinner. neighbour lion plays his 100th concert _ without a spinner. neighbour lion plays his 100th concert of- without a spinner. neighbour lion plays his 100th concert of marchl without a spinner. neighbour lion i plays his 100th concert of march for australia _ plays his 100th concert of march for australia. mitchell— plays his 100th concert of march for australia. mitchell stark _ plays his 100th concert of march for australia. mitchell stark comes - plays his 100th concert of march for australia. mitchell stark comes into play for _ australia. mitchell stark comes into play for the — australia. mitchell stark comes into play for the team _ australia. mitchell stark comes into play for the team who _ australia. mitchell stark comes into play for the team who won - australia. mitchell stark comes into play for the team who won at - play for the team who won at edgbaston— play for the team who won at edgbaston for— play for the team who won at edgbaston for australia - play for the team who won at edgbaston for australia 1—0 i play for the team who won at i edgbaston for australia 1—0 up, play for the team who won at - edgbaston for australia 1—0 up, and everything — edgbaston for australia 1—0 up, and everything get _ edgbaston for australia 1—0 up, and everything get under— edgbaston for australia 1—0 up, and everything get under way _ edgbaston for australia 1—0 up, and everything get under way in - edgbaston for australia 1—0 up, and everything get under way in 25- everything get under way in 25 minutes — everything get under way in 25 minutes. , everything get under way in 25 minutes. . . , minutes. there is build-up right now. minutes. there is build-up right now- england — minutes. there is build-up right now. england women _ minutes. there is build-up right now. england women have - minutes. there is build-up right i now. england women have recalled issy wong to the ashes squad. bayern munich have said to improved their offerfor hurricane. it munich have said to improved their offer for hurricane. it was reported they have made a £70 million bid —— harry kane. james madison looks set to go to tottenham for £30 million. arsenal have it for declan rice, but it is understood west ham don't believe the structure of the offer is acceptable. manchester city will not try to match the latest bid.

my my goodness me, my goodness be. we have a lee rowley mp. we havejustin madders mp from the conservative party. shadow ministerfor employment rights. and we have christine jardine. and we've got

just a load of calls on water since we mentioned it. who have we got now? we have gotjames in rugby. hello, james. good morning. we go with the flow, as they say. let's talk about water. h with the flow, as they say. let's talk about water.— with the flow, as they say. let's talk about water. i would love to, and it sounds _ talk about water. i would love to, and it sounds like _ talk about water. i would love to, and it sounds like i'm _ talk about water. i would love to, and it sounds like i'm moaning i talk about water. i would love to, | and it sounds like i'm moaning but it is something basic. why have we let this get to this state where we discharge effluent into the oceans, and why is the infrastructure being allowed to disintegrate? that is what it is doing, with the extra people we have living in the asylum now. why don't we just nationalise it again. instead of these private water boards that let people, shareholders in it take their 25% or

whatever it is a year, and we don't just keep within the system, and do like we did in the 19505 and rebuilt our water system and our sewage and everything else? why has it got so complicated? it never used to be that bad. , . , complicated? it never used to be that bad. . . , ., , .. that bad. james, when others say one ofthe that bad. james, when others say one of the reasons — that bad. james, when others say one of the reasons there _ that bad. james, when others say one of the reasons there is _ that bad. james, when others say one of the reasons there is such _ that bad. james, when others say one of the reasons there is such a - that bad. james, when others say one of the reasons there is such a to - that bad. james, when others say one of the reasons there is such a to do i of the reasons there is such a to do about this, obviously it is disgusting, my wife is a wild swimmer. 50 disgusting, my wife is a wild swimmer-— disgusting, my wife is a wild swimmer. .. swimmer. so i might, i love the cornish beaches. _ swimmer. so i might, i love the cornish beaches. exactly. - swimmer. so i might, i love the cornish beaches. exactly. you i swimmer. so i might, i love the - cornish beaches. exactly. you don't know what you _ cornish beaches. exactly. you don't know what you are _ cornish beaches. exactly. you don't know what you are getting - cornish beaches. exactly. you don't know what you are getting yourself| know what you are getting yourself into. they are saying we are better at testing now. it has always been there but we are identifying it now. do you believe it? i do, but in victorian times it was a problem and

we sorted it out. london used to be terrible, the thames was dead. they sorted it out and there was salmon swimming up the thames, for goodness' sake. in this age, why can't we not simplified with all the money they take from people, which is fair enough, from the water boards, back into the system, instead of paying other people? some don't even live in this country. i've got to go to you, lee. you have emphasise your points very articulately, but do it again. br; articulately, but do it again. by the time we got to the late 19805, whilst _ the time we got to the late 19805, whilst a _ the time we got to the late 19805, whilst a lot of the infrastructure had been — whilst a lot of the infrastructure had been successfully built in the early— had been successfully built in the early 20th century, we had significant underinvestment in the water— significant underinvestment in the water industry. either you are getting — water industry. either you are getting that of the national balance sheet, _ getting that of the national balance sheet, your taxes, or looking for an

alternative — sheet, your taxes, or looking for an alternative model. a lot of additional capital came in so we didn't— additional capital came in so we didn't have to raise taxes on people _ didn't have to raise taxes on people. that has work to some extent — people. that has work to some extent. reducing leaks, trying to improve — extent. reducing leaks, trying to improve things, but on the sewage issue. _ improve things, but on the sewage issue, there is more to do. which is why we _ issue, there is more to do. which is why we have — issue, there is more to do. which is why we have brought forward the plan. _ why we have brought forward the plan, i_ why we have brought forward the plan, i hope it will work and we are making _ plan, i hope it will work and we are making progress already. it is important. if i look at my own constituency, the river near the village — constituency, the river near the village i— constituency, the river near the village i grew up, 30 years ago it was one — village i grew up, 30 years ago it was one of— village i grew up, 30 years ago it was one of the most polluted in europe — was one of the most polluted in europe. there was no animal life whatsoever in there, that has been cleaned _ whatsoever in there, that has been cleaned up — whatsoever in there, that has been cleaned up progressively, both through— cleaned up progressively, both through government intervention and the intervention of other companies over the _ the intervention of other companies over the course of 30 years. that is an example — over the course of 30 years. that is an example of why a problem has been solved _ an example of why a problem has been solved now— an example of why a problem has been solved. now we have a more articulated problem over sewage,

which _ articulated problem over sewage, which we — articulated problem over sewage, which we will solve. | articulated problem over sewage, which we will solve.— which we will solve. i am sorry to interru -t which we will solve. i am sorry to interrupt you- — which we will solve. i am sorry to interrupt you. that _ which we will solve. i am sorry to interrupt you. that is _ which we will solve. i am sorry to interrupt you. that is a _ which we will solve. i am sorry to interrupt you. that is a localised | interrupt you. that is a localised area. everybody says, we are getting on top of it, we are trying to rectify. while we trying to rectify stub that should have been done years ago? why we still learning? this is 2023, we should have a wonderful water supply, we should have stopped the leaks. we love 30% out of our national reservoirs through leaks. before we know it, things will get drier, we will need to get on top of this. and quickly. because there will be a water shortage. because there will be a water shorta . e. ~ because there will be a water shortage-— because there will be a water shortaae. . . . ., shortage. we await the drought. thank you. _ shortage. we await the drought. thank you, james. _ shortage. we await the drought. thank you, james. lots - shortage. we await the drought. thank you, james. lots of - shortage. we await the drought. thank you, james. lots of calls. | thank you, james. lots of calls. let's move on. we will be back with this one. i know all our mp5 can

understand the fury. i want you to listen to a bit of mr hancock, speaking at the covid inquiry. this hue error speaking at the covid inquiry. this huge error in _ speaking at the covid inquiry. this huge error in the doctrine uk, and the whole — huge error in the doctrine uk, and the whole western world, had in how to tackle _ the whole western world, had in how to tackle a _ the whole western world, had in how to tackle a pandemic. and that flawed — to tackle a pandemic. and that flawed doctrine underpins many of the problems that made it extremely difficult _ the problems that made it extremely difficult to respond. and if i may say so, — difficult to respond. and if i may say so, i— difficult to respond. and if i may say so, i am _ difficult to respond. and if i may say so, i am profoundly sorry for the impact — say so, i am profoundly sorry for the impact that had. i am profoundly sorry for— the impact that had. i am profoundly sorry for each death that has occurred _ sorry for each death that has occurred. and i also understand why for some _ occurred. and i also understand why for some it — occurred. and i also understand why for some it will be hard to take that apology from me. i understand that, _ that apology from me. i understand that, i_ that apology from me. i understand that, i get— that apology from me. i understand

that, i get it. that apology from me. i understand that. i get it-_ that, i get it. christine jardine, should people. _ that, i get it. christine jardine, should people, those - that, i get it. christine jardine, should people, those who - that, i get it. christine jardine, should people, those who lost| that, i get it. christine jardine, - should people, those who lost loved ones, should they accept that apology? ! ones, should they accept that a -tolo ? ~ �* , ones, should they accept that a-aolo ? ~ 3 m apology? ithink it's difficult. i think people _ apology? ithink it's difficult. i think people are _ apology? ithink it's difficult. i think people are not _ apology? ithink it's difficult. i think people are not yet - apology? ithink it's difficult. i think people are not yet overl apology? ithink it's difficult. i. think people are not yet over the grief they are still feeling, and the betrayal so many feeling. because of everything we are hearing from the mistakes made. but as well the mistakes, the bad behaviour, the thinking that the government who made the rules was above the rules and there could be parties. at the moment people are still in grief. we all understand it was a very difficult situation. that the government was facing an unprecedented situation. but that is not the problem, it is how they dealt with it that people find difficult. i don't think, and i don't say this out of any malice, i

went through it, i saw my friend suffer, i saw close friends lose family not be able to say goodbye. i don't think we will have closure on it and be able to accept what is a genuine apology from matt hancock until we feel the government as a whole has accepted its responsibility, and of the government as a whole has acknowledge it got so many things wrong. i think that is the point at which people will accept it. justin madders question _ which people will accept it. justin madders question i _ which people will accept it. justin madders question i think - which people will accept it. justin madders question i think when you hear those kind of words, they do ring hollow from someone whose political career is over and who was very emphatic at the time that things were being correctly and everything was in place, social ring around care, for example. that they

were ramping _ around care, for example. that they were ramping up — around care, for example. that they were ramping up tests, _ around care, for example. that they were ramping up tests, pp - around care, for example. that they were ramping up tests, pp in - around care, for example. that they were ramping up tests, pp in place. | were ramping up tests, pp in place. ithink— were ramping up tests, pp in place. i think those — were ramping up tests, pp in place. i think those who are still in government ought to be showing the same _ government ought to be showing the same nozzles of candour —— levels of candour~ _ same nozzles of candour —— levels of candour~ i_ same nozzles of candour —— levels of candour. i accept no government would — candour. i accept no government would have — candour. i accept no government would have got this right, because it was— would have got this right, because it was a _ would have got this right, because it was a unique situation that clearly— it was a unique situation that clearly we weren't prepared for as a country _ clearly we weren't prepared for as a country the — clearly we weren't prepared for as a country. the roots of that go back some _ country. the roots of that go back sometime — country. the roots of that go back some time. but when you have the cronyism _ some time. but when you have the cronyism that went on, the parties in downing — cronyism that went on, the parties in downing street, the lies, people will feel— in downing street, the lies, people will feel that quite a lot of the humility— will feel that quite a lot of the humility matt hancock is showing is iarring _ humility matt hancock is showing is jarring with what went on at the time _ jarring with what went on at the time. ~ ., jarring with what went on at the time. ~. . . ,, i. time. lee, matt hancock, did you work with him, _ time. lee, matt hancock, did you work with him, do _ time. lee, matt hancock, did you work with him, do you _ time. lee, matt hancock, did you work with him, do you know- time. lee, matt hancock, did you work with him, do you know himl work with him, do you know him question i know him a little bit. i question i know him a little bit. i don't know him particular well. i

highlighted _ don't know him particular well. i highlighted issues— don't know him particular well. i highlighted issues to _ don't know him particular well. i highlighted issues to him - don't know him particular well. i highlighted issues to him that i don't know him particular well. i. highlighted issues to him that were working. _ highlighted issues to him that were working. or— highlighted issues to him that were working. or not _ highlighted issues to him that were working, or not working _ highlighted issues to him that were working, or not working in - highlighted issues to him that were working, or not working in my- highlighted issues to him that were working, or not working in my partl working, or not working in my part of the _ working, or not working in my part of the world — working, or not working in my part of the world. when _ working, or not working in my part of the world. when i _ working, or not working in my part of the world. when i razor, - working, or not working in my part of the world. when i razor, he - working, or not working in my part of the world. when i razor, he was always— of the world. when i razor, he was always helpful _ of the world. when i razor, he was always helpful. we _ of the world. when i razor, he was always helpful. we are _ of the world. when i razor, he was always helpful. we are going - of the world. when i razor, he was. always helpful. we are going through always helpful. we are going through a process. _ always helpful. we are going through a process. there _ always helpful. we are going through a process, there are _ always helpful. we are going through a process, there are no— always helpful. we are going through a process, there are no doubt- a process, there are no doubt mistakes _ a process, there are no doubt mistakes were _ a process, there are no doubt mistakes were made. - a process, there are no doubt mistakes were made. in- a process, there are no doubt mistakes were made. in any. a process, there are no doubt- mistakes were made. in any process whereby— mistakes were made. in any process whereby in _ mistakes were made. in any process whereby in any— mistakes were made. in any process whereby in any pandemic, _ mistakes were made. in any process whereby in any pandemic, that'll- mistakes were made. in any process whereby in any pandemic, that'll bel whereby in any pandemic, that'll be a difficult _ whereby in any pandemic, that'll be a difficult thing _ whereby in any pandemic, that'll be a difficult thing to _ whereby in any pandemic, that'll be a difficult thing to get _ whereby in any pandemic, that'll be a difficult thing to get through. - a difficult thing to get through. the point — a difficult thing to get through. the point of— a difficult thing to get through. the point of the _ a difficult thing to get through. the point of the inquiry- a difficult thing to get through. the point of the inquiry is - a difficult thing to get through. the point of the inquiry is to. a difficult thing to get through. i the point of the inquiry is to get to the _ the point of the inquiry is to get to the root— the point of the inquiry is to get to the root causes _ the point of the inquiry is to get to the root causes of— the point of the inquiry is to get to the root causes of the - the point of the inquiry is to get. to the root causes of the mistakes, and to— to the root causes of the mistakes, and to understand _ to the root causes of the mistakes, and to understand where _ to the root causes of the mistakes, and to understand where we - to the root causes of the mistakes, and to understand where we did . and to understand where we did things— and to understand where we did things well— and to understand where we did things well and _ and to understand where we did things well and where _ and to understand where we did things well and where we - and to understand where we did things well and where we can i and to understand where we did - things well and where we can improve and plan _ things well and where we can improve and plan we — things well and where we can improve and plan. we have _ things well and where we can improve and plan. we have to— things well and where we can improve and plan. we have to look— things well and where we can improve and plan. we have to look at - and plan. we have to look at everything. _ and plan. we have to look at everything, which _ and plan. we have to look at everything, which will- and plan. we have to look at everything, which will take i and plan. we have to look at - everything, which will take some time _ everything, which will take some time we — everything, which will take some time we will— everything, which will take some time. we will see _ everything, which will take some time. we will see over— everything, which will take some time. we will see over the - everything, which will take some i time. we will see over the coming months _ time. we will see over the coming months all— time. we will see over the coming months all the _ time. we will see over the coming months all the people _ time. we will see over the coming months all the people going - time. we will see over the coming months all the people going to - time. we will see over the coming| months all the people going to the inquiry— months all the people going to the inquiry to— months all the people going to the inquiry to talk— months all the people going to the inquiry to talk about _ months all the people going to the inquiry to talk about it, _ months all the people going to the inquiry to talk about it, it - months all the people going to the inquiry to talk about it, it will - months all the people going to the inquiry to talk about it, it will be i inquiry to talk about it, it will be a continuous _ inquiry to talk about it, it will be a continuous thing. _ inquiry to talk about it, it will be a continuous thing. matt - inquiry to talk about it, it will bel a continuous thing. matt hancock inquiry to talk about it, it will be i a continuous thing. matt hancock is an important— a continuous thing. matt hancock is an important voice, _ a continuous thing. matt hancock is an important voice, because - a continuous thing. matt hancock is. an important voice, because whether you like _ an important voice, because whether you like him — an important voice, because whether you like him or— an important voice, because whether you like him or not, _ an important voice, because whether you like him or not, he _ an important voice, because whether you like him or not, he was - an important voice, because whetherl you like him or not, he was somebody at the _ you like him or not, he was somebody at the centre — you like him or not, he was somebody at the centre of— you like him or not, he was somebody at the centre of it, _ you like him or not, he was somebody at the centre of it, and _ you like him or not, he was somebody at the centre of it, and his— at the centre of it, and his testimony— at the centre of it, and his testimony needs- at the centre of it, and his testimony needs to - at the centre of it, and his testimony needs to be - at the centre of it, and his. testimony needs to be heard at the centre of it, and his- testimony needs to be heard so we can learn—

testimony needs to be heard so we can learn from _ testimony needs to be heard so we can learn from it. _ testimony needs to be heard so we can learn from it. just— testimony needs to be heard so we can learn from it.— can learn from it. just as a footnote. _ can learn from it. just as a footnote, christine, - can learn from it. just as a footnote, christine, you i can learn from it. just as a - footnote, christine, you proposed a motion in the house of commons to prevent mp5 from taking part in reality tv programmes, didn't you? the famous sword carrier, any mordant, comedy programme, and i have been others. matt hancock has done who dares wins? what i was talking about, if you are a government minister, you have a responsibility in government, if you are an mp, you have a responsibility to your constituents. you are paid

to your constituents. you are paid to be an mp during the week and your constituents at the weekend. you shouldn't make reality tv, that is a dereliction of your duty as a member of parliament. what about writing columns? i do that, but i write a columns? i do that, but i write a column which i am not paid for, which talks about the issues we face in government, and is my way of communicating with my constituents. that is not taken part in a reality tv show. 50 that is not taken part in a reality tvshow. that is not taken part in a reality tv show. i. .. �* that is not taken part in a reality tv show. i. ., �* .. that is not taken part in a reality tvshow. ., ., . i] tv show. so you won't do strictly? i will never do _ tv show. so you won't do strictly? i will never do that, _ tv show. so you won't do strictly? i will never do that, even _ tv show. so you won't do strictly? i will never do that, even after- tv show. so you won't do strictly? i will never do that, even after an - will never do that, even after an mp. ., .., will never do that, even after an mp. ., , , , , will never do that, even after an mp. you can be the surprise person who tets mp. you can be the surprise person who gets all — mp. you can be the surprise person who gets all the _ mp. you can be the surprise person who gets all the way _ mp. you can be the surprise person who gets all the way through. - mp. you can be the surprise person who gets all the way through. john, good morning, john. what would you like to ask? it is good morning, john. what would you like to ask? . . like to ask? it is about the independent _ like to ask? it is about the independent pay - like to ask? it is about the independent pay review. like to ask? it is about the - independent pay review bodies. i like to ask? it is about the _ independent pay review bodies. i am a retired _ independent pay review bodies. i am a retired prison governor, and the

bodies _ a retired prison governor, and the bodies were around when i was working — bodies were around when i was working. every year when they put a recommendation in, the government, successive _ recommendation in, the government, successive governments ignored them and said _ successive governments ignored them and said you aren't having 4%, you are having — and said you aren't having 4%, you are having to— and said you aren't having 4%, you are having to percent. what is the point? _ are having to percent. what is the point? and — are having to percent. what is the point? and the clue is in the title, independent. they are not independent at all. did you encounter _ independent at all. did you encounter this _ independent at all. did you encounter this when - independent at all. did you encounter this when you i independent at all. did you | encounter this when you are independent at all. did you - encounter this when you are working in the prison service? what a job. thank you for your service. i did thank you for your service. i did encounter _ thank you for your service. i did encounter it. _ thank you for your service. i did encounter it. i _ thank you for your service. i did encounter it. i remember- thank you for your service. i did encounter it. i remember one year the peabody recommended 4% —— a body _ the peabody recommended 4% —— a body how— the peabody recommended 4% —— a body. how do you know what inflation is going _ body. how do you know what inflation is going to _ body. how do you know what inflation is going to be? i don't see the point — is going to be? i don't see the point of— is going to be? i don't see the point of them, because the government don't listen to them. justin _ government don't listen to them. justin madders? it is government don't listen to them. justin madders?—

justin madders? it is a relevant toic justin madders? it is a relevant topic when _ justin madders? it is a relevant topic when we've _ justin madders? it is a relevant topic when we've got _ justin madders? it is a relevant topic when we've got more - justin madders? it is a relevant - topic when we've got more industrial action on the way. i think you start from the point of view, if you have a pay body, you should honour its recommendations. clearly there will be differences where the circumstances on possible. as we've seen over the lack six months, where we've had strikes across the public sector, the government response has been, we are honouring the independent pay bodies recommendations, and it turns out they may not stick to it. it undermines industrial relations. this approach will set us up for more unrest in the future. i think the public sector workers who are going on strike or sending a clear message. it going on strike or sending a clear messate. , ., , going on strike or sending a clear messate. , . _ ., i. going on strike or sending a clear messate. , ., , , message. it is easy for you because ou are in message. it is easy for you because you are in opposition. _ message. it is easy for you because you are in opposition. i _ message. it is easy for you because

you are in opposition. i think- message. it is easy for you because you are in opposition. i think your l you are in opposition. i think your question comes, john, because of the report rishi sunak could overrule recommendations by the independent pay review bodies on teachers and doctors and so forth. rachel reeves has said that she would not rule out blocking public sector pay rises. do you think they should always go with it, the recommendation? i you think they should always go with it, the recommendation?— you think they should always go with it, the recommendation? i mean a lot of --eole it, the recommendation? i mean a lot of people might _ it, the recommendation? i mean a lot of people might not _ it, the recommendation? i mean a lot of people might not be _ it, the recommendation? i mean a lot of people might not be aware, - it, the recommendation? i mean a lot of people might not be aware, but - it, the recommendation? i mean a lot of people might not be aware, but i i of people might not be aware, but i am still— of people might not be aware, but i am still in _ of people might not be aware, but i am still in touch with my colleagues in the _ am still in touch with my colleagues in the prison service. they are saying — in the prison service. they are saying it — in the prison service. they are saying it is _ in the prison service. they are saying it is on its knees at the minute — saying it is on its knees at the minute. they've left years of experience work out of the gate, and now they _ experience work out of the gate, and now they are struggling to staff the places _ now they are struggling to staff the places. they are talking about building — places. they are talking about building new ones. where will they -et building new ones. where will they get the _ building new ones. where will they get the stuff from? it is ridiculous. the pay is appalling now _ ridiculous. the pay is appalling now. when they got rid of all the experience, they lowered the wages for starting staff. it wasjust

false — for starting staff. it wasjust false economy. they are dangerous now _ false economy. they are dangerous now. , ., false economy. they are dangerous now. , . ., .. false economy. they are dangerous now. ., ., , ,, now. the state of our prisons is something _ now. the state of our prisons is something we _ now. the state of our prisons is something we have _ now. the state of our prisons is something we have discussed, | now. the state of our prisons is i something we have discussed, and will discuss again because it is such an important discussion to have. if you look after the present, you look at the society, because there is criminal research which says that. lee, do you want to come in on sector pay review? this says that. lee, do you want to come in on sector pay review?— in on sector pay review? this is a difficult area. _ in on sector pay review? this is a difficult area. we _ in on sector pay review? this is a difficult area. we have _ in on sector pay review? this is a difficult area. we have followed i in on sector pay review? this is a| difficult area. we have followed a number of the pay body's recommendations, in a number of sectors. .. , .. recommendations, in a number of sectors. ., . �* recommendations, in a number of sectors-_ we - recommendations, in a number of| sectors-_ we have sectors. no, you haven't. we have done it in — sectors. no, you haven't. we have done it in a — sectors. no, you haven't. we have done it in a number— sectors. no, you haven't. we have done it in a number of— sectors. no, you haven't. we have done it in a number of seconds. i sectors. no, you haven't. we have. done it in a number of seconds. the reality is, which you rightly highlighted, there may be recruitment issues or capacity issues, that is what the independent pay review body should look at and

try to make recommendations on. ultimately, the government does have to take a broader perspective. it isn'tjust because... if the government wasn't there, what is the point of the government? they have to look at how spending is necessary, the amount of money coming in through the door, the debt and deficit. we've had significant increases in the national debt over the last decade. for many instances, such as going through bowls. the government will have to think through the context of what it can do —— going through covid. we want to make sure wages are effective, but also try how the broader context of recognising money has to come from somewhere and we need to fund it. . ~ , ., , . from somewhere and we need to fund it. thank you very much. let's go to our final question, _ it. thank you very much. let's go to our final question, and _ it. thank you very much. let's go to our final question, and it _ it. thank you very much. let's go to our final question, and it comes - ourfinal question, and it comes from, let me see, it is from

south—east london, james. mortgages. i spoke to you the other day, and it is a grim situation.— is a grim situation. reminders of our is a grim situation. reminders of your situation. _ is a grim situation. reminders of your situation. yes, _ is a grim situation. reminders of your situation. yes, so _ is a grim situation. reminders of your situation. yes, so we - is a grim situation. reminders of your situation. yes, so we are i is a grim situation. reminders of your situation. yes, so we are in| is a grim situation. reminders of. your situation. yes, so we are in a position where our fixed rate is coming to an end, towards the end of this year. we are trying to arrange with our mortgage advisor to get a rate locked in in the next next week, july, six months before our current 1.8 fixed rate expires. obviously the increase we are looking at is i watering, around £1000 on top of what we pay a moan. we are looking at an increase of that, so i wondered what the mp5 are planning to help out the millennial is who have bought at the top of the housing market, have borrowed large

sums. any pearls of wisdom from your panel would be fantastic. the sums. any pearls of wisdom from your panel would be fantastic.— panel would be fantastic. the pearls are alen panel would be fantastic. the pearls are aplenty this _ panel would be fantastic. the pearls are aplenty this morning. _ panel would be fantastic. the pearls are aplenty this morning. justin - are aplenty this morning. justin madders, what would labour do for mortgage lenders? that. madders, what would labour do for mortgage lenders?— madders, what would labour do for mortgage lenders? as someone who is comint off mortgage lenders? as someone who is coming off their _ mortgage lenders? as someone who is coming off their fixed _ mortgage lenders? as someone who is coming off their fixed rate, _ mortgage lenders? as someone who is coming off their fixed rate, i _ coming off theirfixed rate, i empathise with the situationjames is in. we think the government's proposals are good but don't go far enough. there are! million homeowners who won't be covered by the plans. we want to make sure people have the flexibility to switch to interest only, that there is no risk to credit scores, they can lengthen the mortgage term, and also they can switch back if circumstances change. we have to look carefully at how the banks and building societies are operating. they have been quick to pass on interest rates to mortgage holders,

but savings accounts... it interest rates to mortgage holders, but savings accounts. . ._ interest rates to mortgage holders, but savings accounts... it does seem to be the case- _ but savings accounts... it does seem to be the case. there _ but savings accounts... it does seem to be the case. there is _ but savings accounts. .. it does seem to be the case. there is for— but savings accounts... it does seem to be the case. there is for million i to be the case. there is for million -ounds to be the case. there is for million pounds extra _ to be the case. there is for million pounds extra that _ to be the case. there is for million pounds extra that the _ to be the case. there is for million | pounds extra that the organisations have made in additional profits. we have made in additional profits. we have put more pressure on to make it compulsory for them to sign up and people are able to meet the bills arriving. people are able to meet the bills arrivint. , ., , people are able to meet the bills arrivin.. . . , . i. people are able to meet the bills arrivin... , arriving. james, can i ask you your olitics? arriving. james, can i ask you your politics? i — arriving. james, can i ask you your politics? i am _ arriving. james, can i ask you your politics? i am a — arriving. james, can i ask you your politics? i am a complete - arriving. james, can i ask you your politics? i am a complete defence| politics? i am a complete defence sector, to politics? i am a complete defence sector. to be _ politics? i am a complete defence sector, to be honest _ politics? i am a complete defence sector, to be honest with - politics? i am a complete defence sector, to be honest with you. - politics? i am a complete defence| sector, to be honest with you. that is a perfect — sector, to be honest with you. that is a perfect answer _ sector, to be honest with you. that is a perfect answer -- _ sector, to be honest with you. that is a perfect answer -- a _ sector, to be honest with you. trust is a perfect answer —— a complete fence sitter. fence sitters, floating voters, the people who are getting all the problems with their mortgages, they are the classic, the holy grail of politics. they are middle england, middle scotland, middle wales. these are the people you guys need. in a

middle wales. these are the people you guys need-— you guys need. in a lot of ways, floatin: you guys need. in a lot of ways, floating voters, _ you guys need. in a lot of ways, floating voters, back _ you guys need. in a lot of ways, floating voters, back to - you guys need. in a lot of ways, floating voters, back to the - you guys need. in a lot of ways, i floating voters, back to the water, those _ floating voters, back to the water, those who — floating voters, back to the water, those who decide _ floating voters, back to the water, those who decide elections. - floating voters, back to the water, those who decide elections. i- floating voters, back to the water, those who decide elections. i canl those who decide elections. i can sympathise. _ those who decide elections. ! can sympathise. my— those who decide elections. i can those who decide elections. i can sympathise. _ those who decide elections. ! can sympathise. my— those who decide elections. i can sympathise, my mortgage - sympathise, my mortgage - those who decide elections. i can sympathise, my mortgage is - those who decide elections. i can those who decide elections. i can sympathise, my mortgage is - those who decide elections. i can sympathise, my mortgage is up, | those who decide elections. i can - sympathise, my mortgage is up, and fixed rate _ sympathise, my mortgage is up, and fixed rate in— sympathise, my mortgage is up, and fixed rate in october. _ sympathise, my mortgage is up, and fixed rate in october. i— sympathise, my mortgage is up, and fixed rate in october. i am _ sympathise, my mortgage is up, and fixed rate in october. i am not - fixed rate in october. lam not looking — fixed rate in october. lam not looking forward _ fixed rate in october. lam not looking forward to _ fixed rate in october. lam not looking forward to it. - fixed rate in october. lam not looking forward to it. we - fixed rate in october. lam not looking forward to it. we need fixed rate in october. i am not i looking forward to it. we need a better— looking forward to it. we need a better mortgage _ looking forward to it. we need a better mortgage support - looking forward to it. we need a i better mortgage support scheme. looking forward to it. we need a - better mortgage support scheme. we can't overlook— better mortgage support scheme. we can't overlook the _ better mortgage support scheme. we can't overlook the fact _ better mortgage support scheme. we can't overlook the fact that _ better mortgage support scheme. we can't overlook the fact that as - better mortgage support scheme. we can't overlook the fact that as a - can't overlook the fact that as a consequence _ can't overlook the fact that as a consequence as _ can't overlook the fact that as a consequence as well— can't overlook the fact that as a consequence as well for- can't overlook the fact that as a consequence as well for the - can't overlook the fact that as a i consequence as well for the rest can't overlook the fact that as a . consequence as well for the rest of the economy— consequence as well for the rest of the economy for— consequence as well for the rest of the economy for people _ consequence as well for the rest of the economy for people renting. inj sympathise, my mortgage is up, | the economy for people renting. in edinburgh — the economy for people renting. in edinburgh we've— the economy for people renting. in edinburgh we've had _ the economy for people renting. in edinburgh we've had a _ the economy for people renting. in edinburgh we've had a higher- edinburgh we've had a higher increase _ edinburgh we've had a higher increase over— edinburgh we've had a higher increase over the _ edinburgh we've had a higher increase over the past - edinburgh we've had a higher increase over the past year. edinburgh we've had a higherj increase over the past year in rental— increase over the past year in rental rates _ increase over the past year in rental rates. they _ increase over the past year in rental rates. they have - increase over the past year in rental rates. they have gonel increase over the past year in i rental rates. they have gone up increase over the past year in - rental rates. they have gone up by 13~7%~ _ rental rates. they have gone up by 13~7%~ lt— rental rates. they have gone up by 13.796. , �* . ., rental rates. they have gone up by 13-7%-_ part - rental rates. they have gone up by 13.7%._ part of. 13.796. it is b&b central. part of the problem — 13.796. it is b&b central. part of the problem is _ 13.796. it is b&b central. part of the problem is that _ 13.796. it is b&b central. part of the problem is that people - 13.796. it is b&b central. part of the problem is that people who| the problem is that people who bought— the problem is that people who bought properties _ the problem is that people who bought properties have - the problem is that people who. bought properties have mortgages the problem is that people who- bought properties have mortgages on them and _ bought properties have mortgages on them and they— bought properties have mortgages on them and they are _ bought properties have mortgages on them and they are renting _ bought properties have mortgages on them and they are renting them - bought properties have mortgages on them and they are renting them out. i them and they are renting them out. they are _ them and they are renting them out. they are now— them and they are renting them out. they are now looking _ them and they are renting them out. they are now looking to _ them and they are renting them out. they are now looking to pay- them and they are renting them out. they are now looking to pay their. they are now looking to pay their mortgages — they are now looking to pay their mortgages this— they are now looking to pay their mortgages. this is— they are now looking to pay their mortgages. this is a _ they are now looking to pay their mortgages. this is a massive - mortgages. this is a massive problem. _ mortgages. this is a massive problem, which _ mortgages. this is a massive

problem, which the - mortgages. this is a massive i problem, which the government mortgages. this is a massive - problem, which the government have taken _ problem, which the government have taken steps. — problem, which the government have taken steps. but _ problem, which the government have taken steps, but haven't _ problem, which the government have taken steps, but haven't done - taken steps, but haven't done enough — taken steps, but haven't done enough we _ taken steps, but haven't done enough. we need _ taken steps, but haven't done enough. we need more - taken steps, but haven't done enough. we need more to - taken steps, but haven't donel enough. we need more to help taken steps, but haven't done - enough. we need more to help people. we have _ enough. we need more to help people. we have to _ enough. we need more to help people. we have to leave — enough. we need more to help people. we have to leave it _ enough. we need more to help people. we have to leave it there. _ he denies the allegations can enough. we need more to help people. we have to leave it there. have - enough. we need more to help people. we have to leave it there. have a - we have to leave it there. have a look at the properties in edinburgh and you think, lovely. but then you see the prices. well played, all of you. all magnificent in your own ways. i hope you come back. thank you for listening and watching. live from london. this is bbc news. at least nine people are dead and more than 50 injured, after russia strikes a restaurant and shopping area in the ukrainian city of kramatorsk. belarus welcomes yevgeny prigozhin the head protests in paris after a 17—year—old boy was shot dead by police for refusing a traffic stop. the actor kevin spacey arrives at court accused of sexual offences against four men —