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the series in which leading artists and performers talk to me about their most significant cultural influences and experiences. i'm john wilson and my guest is oscar—winning actor nicole kidman who has been an international star for over 30 years now. i was really looking forward to meeting nicole in london, but even a superstar�*s travel plans can be ruined, so we talked virtually. nicole kidmanjoining us from los angeles, welcome to this cultural life. thank you, thank you for having me. you were born in hawaii and moved to sydney with your australian parents at the age of four. your father was a clinical psychologist and biochemist. was it a creative upbringing? yeah, absolutely. i mean, as much as i grew up the daughter of a scientist who became a psychologist, i was also the daughter of a nurse educator, but they were both academics. but there was an enormous love of the arts. i was always taken to the theatre, opera, symphonies, my mother loves opera.

what are your earliest memories of favourite films? i would go to a place called the independent theatre which would show films, and we were all allowed to flop around on beanbags — they didn't have chairs, they didn't have seats, they had beanbags. and you were allowed to run around as kids and you would watch the movie. and one of the first movies i remember seeing was a film called walkabout, which was an australian film. isn't that crazy? that is a very strong imprint cinematically, and then i would be taken to the theatre. and that was probably my first love, was theatre. i remember getting up on stage, i remember watching, you know, those outrageous, fun, funny, um, pantomimes — and that probably was some of my first desires to be on stage. were you a natural performer, did you always want to act? i was very tall and very pale and i had red, curly hair,

and covered in freckles. i would fit in through theatre, and reading and... there was a shyness, an innate shyness, but there was something i could do, which was act. and so whenever i went to drama school i would be able to get up on stage or read a scene and have just a very intuitive understanding immediately. and that was where i was able to express myself, and i suppose in a way shine. and so that became a place where i felt very comfortable. the first big influence you have chosen for this programme is the film—maker jane campion, best known for the piano and more recently the power of the dog. how did you meetjane campion? i was in a little drama school called the phillip street theatre, i would go on saturday morning, i would get up at about 6:30 am, i would catch a bus and train and another bus to get into the city. it was the highlight of my week.

and jane was in film school, so she was really young and i remember being told, "oh, this woman, "who's going to be directing a little film, "a student film, would like to see you". and i was like, "0th oh my gosh, my gosh!" and that was jane. we're talking a0 years later and i still know her. and still deeply close to her, actually — would tell her anything, will confide in her anything, and feel unbelievably safe with her. did she become a mentor to you at such a young age? i don't know if jane's a mentor. jane is a very, is an exquisite creature, i think she is a creature, so she is...she is just unusual. she became a guide, she became someone that i would go "what do you think?", or, and there were times when we drifted and came back together, i remember auditioning for sweetie, i didn't get it, i remember auditioning for another one of herfilms, i didn't get it — and finally portrait of a lady came along, and she wanted

me for that. there is a documentary about the making of portrait of a lady, in which we see you as isabel archer, sobbing in between takes. jane campion is comforting you and keeping you in the moment. what's happening there? jane walks through it with you. she's intense, so she is in your eyes, she is with you, she'll hold you... she'll hold your hand, she'll feel it with you. but she is still the director, so she is watching and she is going, "0k, what can i do with this?" i think i was incredibly young when i was working with her, i was very raw. and i think...just enormously trusting of her. is it sometimes really hard to step out of character when you finish shooting at the end of the day? yeah, it is sometimes, yep. mm—hmm.

and there is certain roles that require not stepping out. and there is certain roles where you can be far more...it happens more easily. i think i still grapple with how to do it. i would never say i'm — i am still learning, i will always be learning. laughs and i would never say i know what i'm doing. - i don't mind not knowing everything, i don't mind not being in a place of leadership, i actually don't mind being in a place of, being a part of it. it's part of being an actor, because i always say as an actor you can't be a control freak. you have to be willing to give up control. jane campion spotted you when you were 14 years old, it was only four years later, i think you were 18 when you were cast in dead calm, the psychological thriller set in the middle of an empty ocean. did it feel like a big breakfor you? it was enormous, it was one of those extraordinary things

where at such a young age, i was given these chances and these opportunities with these world—class film—makers and writers. i was sort of launched that way, i remember getting on a plane and going to america with dead calm and going, "wow!" i got off the plane in new york and it was like... "oh, wow, this is the city that has broadway!" your character is facing a really tumultuous and terrible situation, but maintaining this icy calm, the sense of control. something i think we've seen in many of the roles, many of the characters you've played. i don't know if it's icy calm, i would hope it is resilience, and it is the ability to find strength from within, when all the odds are against you. i mean, that is a really interesting thing as a human being — i have been in that place where i myself have not known i've had the strength, not known i've had the fortitude to get through something, and kind ofjust by stepping forward every day, going, "i never knew i had this in me." you know?

which is a wonderful thing to play as an actor. there is a psychological depth or a tension or complexity to many of the characters you have played. do you draw any kind of link back to your father's work as a clinical psychologist, do you think? i would say more my upbringing gave me the sense of being able to see through different lenses, of notjudging, of — the compassion that was in my household was deep. there was never that judgement in our household, where there was good and evil. it was always far more complicated than that. the next big cultural influence that you have chosen is film—maker stanley kubrick, with whom you worked on eyes wide shut, the last film he made before he died. were you a big kubrick fan before you worked with him? yeah, yeah. i think if you are a cinephile then he is the top. you see philosophy, you see ideas, you see extraordinary

film—making, and you see masterful command of his language. and nothing is the same. every single one of his films — i mean, you would never predict what he was going to do next, and his knowledge wasjust abundant, and yet he was a mischievous kind of fun, um...extraordinary person to be around. so coming into my life at that time, oh, wow! i mean, that wasjust a beautiful thing, to suddenly collide with him. which was the first film of his that you saw? a clockwork orange. laughs which is like... by myself, where i wagged school, and i went and saw clockwork orange, i didn't understand any of it — i sat there with myjaw like "what"...and i was deeply disturbed. and they i saw the shining and made out to the shining,

which says something really weird about me. i had my first kiss in the shining, which is just really weird. i didn't see a lot of the shining, but yeah, it was my first — i can't believe i'm saying this — tongue kiss. i'd a kiss on stage in spring awakening. so anyway! laughs so i've seen - the film again and again, but you know — now i'm blushing. i saw a clockwork orange. but i have seen a lot of the films, a lot of them i didn't understand, i've seen them again, then understood them, had them explained to me, had them explained by film—makers, had them explained by... and you know, and by stanley! i mean, can can you imagine asking stanley — who hated being asked, may i add — about the films and what something meant. i think the question that irritated him the most was "what does that mean?" and he would be like, "ugh,

please, don't ask me that." eyes wide shut was a psychological thriller, based on a 1926 novella by arthur schnitzler. and you were cast with your then—husband tom cruise as a wealthy manhattan couple in a story about sex and infidelity and power and murder. why did you want to take on the role? why not? laughs i remember the emails - faxes actually at that time - - that were going back and forth, and it was like, "stanley kubrick is going to cast us in his film?" it was all so secretive and it was like going into this...other world. we didn't know we were going to be there for years. but i have always said, how great! i mean, i honestly would have shot that thing for five years. i didn't care. i'm with the greatest film—maker, i'm with my husband, i've got my kids there, and we're working. wow! that's as good as it gets.

we're not working on trash, we're working on extraordinary material. who cares how long it takes? so you became personally close to him as well? yeah, and deeply enamoured with him — and he is a professor, it was like, i'd sit on the floor of his office and read books, and he had books everywhere and it was a mess, and he had a sign saying "do not knock and do not come in", but i would ignore that. which he kind of liked. you were allowed. i was a little wilful. i don't think he minded, as i said he was mischievous. he died just a few days after completing the final cut on eyes wide shut. that must have been a terrible shock for you — do you remember where you were when you heard the news? absolutely. i was in new york, and i... he'd sent me a fax, and i'd said, i left him a message saying i'd call him in the morning. and when the phone rang, i thought it was stanley,

and it was his assistant, leon. and leon said, "stanley kubrick is dead", and i remember dropping the phone and screaming. screaming. and that was probably my first encounter with death, where it comes and a person you love is taken that quickly. and it doesn't seem real. and it was...horrendous. but having worked with him so intensely, what do you think was the lasting legacy of stanley kubrick on the work that you have done since? that it's art. don't be frightened of that, that it's important. his pursuit of excellence with it, and his, um...his, his lifetime dedication to it, i think has had an enormous impact on me. do you ever, nicole, when you're faced with a difficult decision, a career decision, think, "what would stanley do?" yes, but i remember when i was doing the blue room

and i was on stage and i chose to do a play at the beautiful donmarwarehouse, i remember inviting stanley to come and see it. i had him read the play back to me, and going "i can't read it." and i was like, oh no, he doesn't like it. and ijust remember, he didn't want me to use him as a guide or a judge. because i think he was so, he had such a high bar that everything wasn't going to be good. you know? so he didn't want to be that for me. but he came and saw me on stage in the blue room. he came — that is a huge thing for stanley. there is a photo somewhere, i don't have it, i would love someone to find it for me, of him leaving the theatre — but it is so touching to me that he came, because that is such a huge offering from him. and he came and he saw me. i can't remember what he said,

i just remember "stanley's in the audience!" i think it's really interesting that the blue room is the next big moment that you've chosen — a really important moment in your career, being on stage in london in 1998. interestingly, though, like eyes wide shut, it's adapted from a work by arthur schnitzler. yeah! is that a coincidence? it is?! yes! i mean, if there is such things as coincidences. or it was meant to be. but, yeah, isn't that crazy? but it was, yeah. and when sam said to me, and patrick... sam mendes? yeah, yeah. sam mendes was like, "oh, this" — i'm like, "hold on. "that — that's just totally weird. "le ronde — what?" but what was so just enthralling about that was that sam believed i could play the five different characters and that was like, you know, as an actor, i was like, "oh, wow! "play all of them? "ok, that's kind of exciting. "on stage? "wow, yeah." i look back at that and i think, "and i wasn't that scared ! " i didn't have stage fright

to the degree that i had it when i did photograph 5!— which i've now learned a lot of actors get — the stage fright becomes more intense as you get older. so, i'm one of those people. it was in a very small london theatre, a 2—hander with iain glen, and a really exposing role both physically and emotionally. did it feel like a risk? it felt like an amazing chance. it felt like i was back in sydney, and i think i've approached my whole career this way. i feel like i've just come out of, you know, the phillip street theatre and i'm like, "oh, wow! "this is a great chance! "yeah, let's try this!" because i don't overthink stuff until i'm in it and then, i'm like, "yikes, what have i done? "i've got to run for the hills." and by then, you're not allowed out. and i'm sort of well—known now for going, "i've got to get out of this! "i'm not going to be able to deliverfor you! "help, help, help!" but it was 17 years, i think,

until you were back on stage with photograph 5! — also, in london. why have you not done more theatre, do you think? i'm a mother. and it's very difficult as a mother, ifind, to do the eight shows a week and to not be there at bedtime. that was — that's been a big... when i did photograph 51, it was a big commitment from me to come to london, move my family to london, my husband has a big career. you know, i didn't think it all through and go, "oh, my gosh, you're going to have to sell tickets "on the west end about a play about science with a woman "that no—one's ever heard of and it's..." and i remember when the ticket sales at the beginning, iwas like... and people was a lot of looking, worried, and i'm like, "are they not selling?" and this was before it had opened. and they're like, "yeah, it's ok" — you know, they keep it all secret from you because they don't want you to lose complete faith. we were so lucky, and this is where you go thank you to the critics,

because the critics came out in incredible support of that play and the tickets sold. and suddenly, it was sold out and you couldn't get a ticket. but i think if we'd been crucified, the play would have closed, you know, we wouldn't have made it because they certainly weren't selling on my name alone. but it's so great doing theatre! it's so fun! when it works, it works — there's nothing like it. and your immediate — and that's the thing i discovered doing it again, was this relationship with an audience that is so immediate and so direct. when the audience claps and cheers, there is so much gratitude as an actor because you're like, "i've given you what i can give you and you've "received it. "thank you." just interestingly, back to the blue room, though because that was an adaptation of le ronde by schnitzler by david hare and then, shortly after that, you were working on another dare — david hare adaptation and it was the hours and you were playing virginia

woolf. what did you learn from playing woolf, do you think? i mean, david hare gave me one of the greatest monologues, you know, about choice, and it is my choice. i still know those words. and deeply believe in them, may i add. it is my choice as a human being. your next choice, a big turning point in your career, and you've already mentioned it, is baz luhrmann�*s musical moulin rouge. why have you chosen that? once again, took a massive chance with me. believed i could sing and dance and act in the same film. gave me satine, who ijust became and loved and people still think i am, and gave me that and i watched that film and i'm like, "i can't believe i made that!" i'm so happy that exists.

i'm so happy i got to be satine. and i got to do it with ewen and i have such magical memories of it and i find the film magical and he's — baz is magical. you played satine, the consumptive courtesan, opposite ewan mcgregor as the struggling writer. was it the first time you'd sung professionally? i'd sung at drama school, you know, when i would go to the little weekend drama schools. i was never that good. i always had friends who could belt it out and i was never a belter. but baz, when i went and auditioned for him, he had the audition with the song # nobody does it better. that song — which is not in the movie — and i remember sort of acting singing it. and baz onset as a director, what did you take away from him? well, he's an actor. he started as an actor. so, he can act it. so, you're getting that support.

where he understands the actual process, he understands how to get you there. and he's very... you know, but then he'ill shape it. and he's also very visual. isn't it true that you broke a couple of ribs during the shooting of this movie? yeah, ifelland i broke a thing but, you know, they gave me the time and i was able to heal and onward, you know? which is, i think, part ofjust i don't have a sense of my own physicality a lot of time, so i'll take risks and then i'm like, "oh, i've got to be careful!" so, my sense of what i want to do physically, i sometimes can't live up to what i want to do physically, you know? i wish i could fly! so, you have this idea that you're capable of way more physically than you actually are. i mean, i have a — a quite fragile body. i think that's part of even as an actor. sometimes emotionally, i forget the fragility.

protecting that and being careful is part of my lifelong lesson. working in this, you know, all—singing, all—dancing musical with baz luhrmann, did it change your own idea of what you are capable of as an actor, do you think? yeah! pushed me. i'm not necessarily running out, going, "i want to do another musical" but, yeah, it pushed me into places i didn't even know i was capable of going. which is what's happened on the lucille ball film as — on being the ricardos, i was like — i mean, physical comedy, that is so hard. i did a tiny bit of it in moulin rouge, i was reminded the other day — you know, when i do the — on the floor going pants. and that was all sort of improvised and so fun, so there was some physical comedy in that, but lucy's physical comedy is clown.

i mean, it's broad and extraordinary and she created all that and it was like, "oh!" and my absolute, like — i cannot believe what she did. and how she could get a laugh — and she would do anything for a laugh — and how wonderful that is, releasing into physical comedy that way. it's so fun. but with a character like satine, you're creating — you're creating a character from scratch. with virginia woolf, you're interpreting it. with lucille ball, it has to be more of an impersonation, i guess, doesn't it? no! you have to study her. no, no. i mean, study her but aaron sorkin was adamant it wasn't to be an impersonation. he was like, "i don't want an impersonation". in recent years, you've become a producer as well. you've brought us the big little lies and the undoing and nine perfect strangers. did you have any ambition to director as well? no.

laughs. not at all? no! no. i love being an actor. as i said, i don't have the — i don't have the control! i don't want to make the big decisions! i want to be part of the group, i don't want to be the leader. i'm happy to be in the group. i don't want to be the director. really? but i ask that, nicole, because you've worked with so many great independent directors, in particular, the gus van sant and... i want to support them, i'm happy to support them. i love to support them. i want to find them, i want to support them, i want to — i want them to have the chance to do their work. but having seenjane campion or gus van sant or lars von trier or anthony minghella — any of these directors — at close hand, you don't think you, you know, you could take what you've seen, what you've experienced and then reinterpret it? no. you really don't want to direct, do you? i believe a director is a director. there is... right.

they want to direct. i'm watching it — my daughter right now, i'm watching her — she only wants to be a director. that's all she wants to do. she is obsessed with being a director. and i do believe the great directors, that's what they do. so, ijust... that's not for me. i want to be an actor. i am open. i am always ready to go on the nextjourney. i cannot believe i still have the passion for that because i've been working since i was 14. so, if ever there was a reason to believe that it's in your blood, it's just in my blood, and i do say it's not a choice. i've tried to not do this and i actuallyjust keep coming back to it. it is — it keeps me sane. it's my path, it's my voice, it's how i express myself

and it's how i'm part of this world. nicole kidman, thank you very much, indeed. thank you. voice-over: for podcast i episodes of this cultural life go to bbc sounds or wherever you get your podcasts. hello there. weather conditions are remaining on the unsettled side for the time of year, all thanks to low pressure. we could see some pretty wet weather across the south and the south—east of the country through tuesday. probably the best of the sunshine a bit further northwards. but even here, for much of the rest of the country away from the south, there'll be plenty of showers around, too. now we've got two weather fronts around. this one's a weakening one in the north. this one is a developing one. and this is going to bring some wet

weather to southern britain through this morning. and the rain will pep up, become heavier, in fact, as we head through the morning across the south and the south—east, maybe some thundery bursts in there. this weather front across scotland and northern ireland will be weakening as it moves southwards, and on either side, it'll be sunshine and showers. these sorts of temperatures are below par for the time of year, but depending on how much sunshine we get in the south does depend on the temperatures. at the moment, it looks like it could be quite wet. temperatures around the mid—teens for the southeast. so we could see some significant disruptions to play at wimbledon with this rain, which will tend to last through the afternoon, perhaps into the evening, turning heavier as it develops into an area of low pressure. it does look like the low countries will bear the brunt of that. elsewhere, it's clear spells and a few showers to start wednesday. so there's that area of low pressure heading towards denmark, deepening as it does so. for us, we're in between weather systems on wednesday, so not a bad day, i think. there will be plenty of sunshine from the word go, but then showers could develop anywhere. most of them will be across scotland and northern ireland,

closer to this area of low pressure, and some of them could be heavy, maybe thundery for western scotland. temperature—wise, maybe a degree or so up because the winds will be lighter and maybe some more sunshine around, so up to 2! degrees. and then for thursday, this area of low pressure starts to push towards the west of the country. higher pressure begins to build towards the near continent. so i think thursday, not a bad—looking day. we start to switch our winds up from the south. that will be drawing up some warm airfrom france and iberia. so, with more sunshine around, winds coming up from the south, we could see higher temperatures, 22 or 23 degrees there. this is the pressure set—up for the end of the week, friday and the weekend. a deep low out to the west. this weather front will bring some thundery rain to the west of the country. but for england and wales, we'll be drawing up a southerly wind. so it could be quite warm on friday, with some sunshine in the south, but with low pressure nearby, there will always been an increasing threat of showers and thunderstorms.

israel launches one of its biggest military operations in years. gun battles rage and tensions flare in the west bank city ofjenin. one of the eight pro—democracy activists targeted by the hong kong police speaks to bbc news. and tensions appear to be easing in france as mayors hold rallies calling for an end to the violence.