similar to this morning, cloud building up and showers again. some of the showers in scotland will be slow moving, heavy and thundery. fewer showers for northern ireland, england and wales and they should be lighter. winter light are still feeling warmer too. we finished the day with cloud and rain towards northern ireland —— the winds are light and still feeling warmer. into friday there will be strong winds to the south—west of the uk, rattling around the coast and the hills, gale force. a dryish start elsewhere but the rain extends almost across the uk through friday, some heavy and thundery. the far north of scotland will avoid the rain until the night. temperatures in the high teens, low 20s, feeling cooler as the wind strengthens, which it will even

further into saturday, unseasonably windy with more heavy and thundery downpours and staying cool. autumn rather than summer. _ downpours and staying cool. autumn rather than summer. more _ downpours and staying cool. autumn rather than summer. more on - downpours and staying cool. autumn rather than summer. more on all- downpours and staying cool. autumn rather than summer. more on all of. rather than summer. more on all of the top stories on newsnight with victoria derbyshire which is getting under way on bbc two. the news continues here on bbc one, as now it's time to join our colleagues across the nations and regions for the news where you are. but from the ten team, it's goodbye. thank you.

named by his wife — huw edwards is the famous star at the heart of accusations over sexually explicit photos. she says the newsreader is in hospital suffering from serious mental health issues. major questions tonight for the sun newspaper as police rule there was no evidence of a criminal offence in its allegations against huw edwards. we'll ask tonight, would its story ever have been published if it hadn't alluded to questions of criminality? and questions for the bbc, too, as new allegations emerge of inappropriate messages sent by the presenter on social media to junior employees within the organisation.

also tonight: the prime minister, rishi sunak, is set to make a decision on whether to give some public sector workers pay rises of around 6%. but where's the money coming from? and this... wham's andrew ridgeley tells newsnight exclusively he wants to create an abba—style show for wham. i think it could be done. i think it could be done exceptionally well. the technology exists now. it will only get better. the interview coming up in 30 minutes. good evening. the story about huw edwards is a personal one for him and his family. he's being treated as an in—patient in hospital according to his wife, who released a statementjust before six o'clock this evening. she said she was naming her own husband "primarily out of concern for his mental well—being and to protect our children". it's a story, too, about the media,

about how it — how we — report allegations and cover stories. and in particular, many believe it's about how the sun newspaper has conducted itself in recent days. tonight the met police said there was no information to indicate that a criminal offence has been committed by the presenter — something you may remember was alluded to in early reporting by the paper. of course, it remains a story, too, about the bbc. and tonight, as the suggestion of any possible criminality in those initial claims against huw edwards fell away, new allegations emerged that he had had sent inappropriate messages on social media to other people who work or worked at the bbc. we'll discuss all of this in detail in a moment. here's sima on the questions raised for the media and the sun after the events of the last five days. this is bbc news from london, buckingham palace has announced the death of her majesty queen elizabeth ii. fix, death of her ma'esty queen elizabeth ii. �* ., , ., ., ., ,

ii. a household name and the trusted voice of the — ii. a household name and the trusted voice of the bbc. _ ii. a household name and the trusted voice of the bbc. our— ii. a household name and the trusted voice of the bbc. our exit _ ii. a household name and the trusted voice of the bbc. our exit poll- ii. a household name and the trusted voice of the bbc. our exit poll is - voice of the bbc. our exit poll is suggesting that there will be from royal deaths to big election nights. huw edwards had presented at all. this triggered days of continuous coverage, with more allegations being made and people trying to guess who the anonymous presenter actually was. fit guess who the anonymous presenter actually wen-— guess who the anonymous presenter actually wac— actually was. at six huw edwards is the presenter _ actually was. at six huw edwards is the presenter accused _ actually was. at six huw edwards is the presenter accused of _ actually was. at six huw edwards is the presenter accused of being - actually was. at six huw edwards is the presenter accused of being a i the presenter accused of being a teenager— the presenter accused of being a teenager for explicit photos. in a statement _ teenager for explicit photos. in —. statement released on his behalf seconds before the six o'clock evening news bulletin his wife said...

there has been an outpouring of support for huw edwards on social media from friends and former colleagues. in some cases requesting that he now be left alone, and allowed to get better. journalistically this episode raises some significant questions. why the sun didn't provide hard evidence to support its initial claim, and why the denial of the young person wasn't included in the first report. is this fair and robustjournalism? another specific question for the paper is why it initially said the presenter gave a 17—year—old money for sordid pictures employing alleged criminality. though it didn't explicitly make that allegation. and later stories the people at the language changed little, reporting that the young person had been in contact with the presenter from 17, person had been in contact with the presenterfrom 17, rather person had been in contact with the presenter from 17, rather than the alleged sexual picture arrangement started when they were that age.

some media lawyers believe the initial claim could have helped the paper make a public interest case for publishing the story. tonight the newspaper says it has no plans to publish further allegations about him and will cooperate with the bbc�*s internal investigation process. it says we must also reemphasise that at no point in their original story did the sun alleged criminality. two police forces who were looking into some of the crimes said they had seen no information to indicate a criminal offence had been committed. as a bbc�*s director—general said today, at the heart of the story are real people with real problems. in the age of instant social media judgments some will feel he makes a fair point, and won many will reflect on. sima there. and as we said earlier, alongside those questions for the sun tonight there do remain questions for huw edwards and for the bbc 7 and new ones which bbc news broadcast this evening, actually around the time

of the statement released on behalf of huw edwards. lucy manning is special correspondent for bbc news and she's here 7 now, lucy, first off run us through the questions that remain for huw edwards tonight. first of all it is worth saying it has been a very difficult day in the bbc newsroom. we have had to report on things that have been hard for people to hear. the police have obviously decided that there is no criminality in the allegations but there is still a lot for the bbc to grapple with, most importantly what they did about the complaint that came in from the family involved, why it took so long for them to contact the family and why it took so long for them to speak to huw edwards about it. there have been other allegations made about huw edwards that will need looking at, the sun alleged he broke lockdown rules. we reported yesterday on a story about someone who said they had received abusive messages from

them after contact on a dating app. tonight the bbc has broadcasted some new claims about huw edwards. b, ibiblc new claims about huw edwards. a bbc emlo ee new claims about huw edwards. a bbc employee has — new claims about huw edwards. a bbc employee has told _ new claims about huw edwards. a bbc employee has told us _ new claims about huw edwards. a bbc employee has told us they _ new claims about huw edwards. eec employee has told us they received what they believe are inappropriate as it is that they had received, on social media from the presenter and i believe they were uncomfortable and left them feeling awkward. they told us sadly, from their experience he has been since sending suggestive messages to me, they were inappropriate, there is a power dynamics that makes them inappropriate. we have seen those messages which refer to the bbc staff members' appearance and they appear to be flirtatious. bud staff members' appearance and they appear to be flirtatious.— appear to be flirtatious. and they were sent this _ appear to be flirtatious. and they were sent this year. _ appear to be flirtatious. and they were sent this year. just - appear to be flirtatious. and they were sent this year. just to - appear to be flirtatious. and they were sent this year. just to add l appear to be flirtatious. and they| were sent this year. just to add to that newsnight has spoken to two other people, one who currently works at the bbc and one a former bbc employee, i spoke to one of them and this person told me they never met the newsreader and this person said they received a late night

messages on social media including cases from you edwards, which they said they believed was an abuse of power and our colleague spoke to someone who still works here who told her how the presenter sent a private message on social media commenting on their physical appearance which gave them a cold shudder. i appearance which gave them a cold shudder. ~ . appearance which gave them a cold shudder. ~' ., , ., , shudder. i think there are questions for bbc bosses _ shudder. i think there are questions for bbc bosses about _ shudder. i think there are questions for bbc bosses about the _ shudder. i think there are questions for bbc bosses about the culture . shudder. i think there are questions for bbc bosses about the culture in | for bbc bosses about the culture in the newsroom and the way that complaints can be raised and the way people feel comfortable or not to raise them. two out of the three people said they felt they couldn't report what they think is inappropriate behaviour to bbc managers. one said that while the bbc bosses have said in the last day there are procedures put in place for whistle—blowing it is not really clear what to do and the person i spoke to said that they thought bbc managers should be looking into the relationship dynamics between when you have a very senior members of staff and senior members of staff,

someone on huge salaries and great deference is shown to the presenters. this is someone who is very loyal to the bbc and they believe it isn'tjust a bbc problem but a problem across all industry. the bbc responded to my saying it is encouraging staff to come forward if they have any concerns and the director—general did make this point in an e—mailall staff director—general did make this point in an e—mail all staff and that they are communicating with staff and they would continue to do so. thank ou. let's speak now to adam boulton, a friend of huw edwards, and former political editor of sky news, former creative director of the bbc, broadcaster, alan yentob, jacqui hames — a board director at the campaign group hacked off and a former police officer — and rod liddle, who writes for the sun and sunday times, owned by news uk, and he's a former editor of the bbc today programme. we did ask the sun's senior editors tojoin us again. they we did ask the sun's senior editors to join us again. they declined. thank you very much for being with us. adam boulton first of all, what has it been like seeing your friend

reported on and spoken about over the last few days? it is reported on and spoken about over the last few days?— the last few days? it is very sad of affairs and — the last few days? it is very sad of affairs and obviously _ the last few days? it is very sad of affairs and obviously pursue - the last few days? it is very sad of affairs and obviously pursue and l the last few days? it is very sad of. affairs and obviously pursue and his family and for vicky and his wife, it is very brave decision of her to go public at this stage. quite why do you think it is very? because clearly it has exposed few to allegations which may or may not turn out to be true but he has put his name there, and she has done it because she is a journalist herself and knows that presumably, the pressure was becoming unbearable. that said, we are alljournalists, he is a journalist, vicky is a journalist and i am a journalist. we are in the business of holding the powerful to account for their behaviour, not necessarily for criminality but for things, the sort of things which we have just been hearing from lucy about, so i don't think there is any case against the

sun on this, for misbehaviour. i think they have done what journalists have done and have done, indeed what the bbc has done and the bbc has been since thursday covering the story in that way but even here on newsnight you have made commendable virtue of looking at abuse of behaviour in westminster for example, so forjournalists in particular to say somehow the sun has done something wrong and looking into what is basically serious allegations of resulting in mistreatment over vulnerable young person i think is absolutely fine and that was how they justified person i think is absolutely fine and that was how theyjustified it, they didn't say crime had been committed. they said they were concerned and the parents of this child were concerned for the way they were being treated by huw. this was on friday. _ they were being treated by huw. this was on friday, a well—known presenter is accused of eight giving the team more than £35,000 since they were 17 in return for sordid images. sleazy messages were alleged to have started in 2020 when the

youngster was 17. on the 9th ofjuly bbc sex probe, top bbc start who paid child for sex pictures, could be charged by cops. jacqui hames, do you think the sun has any questions to answer or do you agree with what adam boulton hasjust to answer or do you agree with what adam boulton has just said? to answer or do you agree with what adam boulton hasjust said? i seer? adam boulton has 'ust said? i very rarely dispute — adam boulton has 'ust said? i very rarely dispute with— adam boulton hasjust said? i very rarely dispute with adam, - adam boulton hasjust said? i very rarely dispute with adam, a - rarely dispute with adam, a distinguished journalist of so many years— distinguished journalist of so many years lrut— distinguished journalist of so many years but i— distinguished journalist of so many years but i am profoundly depressed lry years but i am profoundly depressed try this_ years but i am profoundly depressed by this unashamed abuse of power by the sun _ by this unashamed abuse of power by the sun i_ by this unashamed abuse of power by the sun. i think there are urgent answers— the sun. i think there are urgent answers needed from the sun and as you say, _ answers needed from the sun and as you say, where are victoria newton and the _ you say, where are victoria newton and the editor rebekah brooks, they seem _ and the editor rebekah brooks, they seem to _ and the editor rebekah brooks, they seem to have forgotten that there are real_ seem to have forgotten that there are real people involved in this story — are real people involved in this story. they knew the people involved were vulnerable from a mental health perspective, and there was a suggestion in those headlines of criminality which screamed out at us, day— criminality which screamed out at us, day after day after day. why do ou sa it us, day after day after day. why do you say it is — us, day after day after day. why do you say it is an _ us, day after day after day. why do you say it is an abuse _ us, day after day after day. why do you say it is an abuse of— us, day after day after day. why do

you say it is an abuse of power- us, day after day after day. why do you say it is an abuse of power on i you say it is an abuse of power on the sun's part?— the sun's part? because they are usin: a the sun's part? because they are using a very _ the sun's part? because they are using a very powerful _ the sun's part? because they are using a very powerful position - the sun's part? because they are using a very powerful position as| using a very powerful position as the dominator and dictator of the news _ the dominator and dictator of the news agenda in this country and you only have _ news agenda in this country and you only have to— news agenda in this country and you only have to look at how their article — only have to look at how their article has _ only have to look at how their article has dominated that news agenda — article has dominated that news agenda across broadcasting and print news over— agenda across broadcasting and print news over the last few days. at the same _ news over the last few days. at the same time — news over the last few days. at the same time there is a huge new story, happening _ same time there is a huge new story, happening behind the scenes, we have seen very— happening behind the scenes, we have seen very old newspaper editors being _ seen very old newspaper editors being wheeled out to defend newspapers to say that things have changed _ newspapers to say that things have changed since the misbehaviour of the past _ changed since the misbehaviour of the past i— changed since the misbehaviour of the past. ithink changed since the misbehaviour of the past. i think this shows that nothing — the past. i think this shows that nothing has changed.— nothing has changed. let's go straiaht nothing has changed. let's go straight to _ nothing has changed. let's go straight to rob _ nothing has changed. let's go straight to rob lyttle - nothing has changed. let's go straight to rob lyttle who - nothing has changed. let's go i straight to rob lyttle who works nothing has changed. let's go - straight to rob lyttle who works for news uk, is nothing changed? i don't think i news uk, is nothing changed? i don't think i have — news uk, is nothing changed? i don't think i have heard _ news uk, is nothing changed? i don't think i have heard so _ news uk, is nothing changed? i don't think i have heard so much abuse - news uk, is nothing changed? i don't think i have heard so much abuse in l think i have heard so much abuse in my life _ think i have heard so much abuse in my life the — think i have heard so much abuse in my life. the reason— think i have heard so much abuse in my life. the reason the _ think i have heard so much abuse in my life. the reason the sun - think i have heard so much abuse in my life. the reason the sun broke i my life. the reason the sun broke the story— my life. the reason the sun broke the story is— my life. the reason the sun broke the story is because _ my life. the reason the sun broke the story is because it— my life. the reason the sun broke the story is because it was- my life. the reason the sun broke the story is because it was in- my life. the reason the sun broke the story is because it was in the i the story is because it was in the public— the story is because it was in the public interest— the story is because it was in the public interest and _ the story is because it was in the public interest and the _ the story is because it was in the public interest and the fact - the story is because it was in the public interest and the fact that. public interest and the fact that every— public interest and the fact that every single _ public interest and the fact that every single newspaper- public interest and the fact that every single newspaper and - public interest and the fact thatj every single newspaper and the public interest and the fact that - every single newspaper and the bbc and itv— every single newspaper and the bbc and w have — every single newspaper and the bbc and itv have followed _ every single newspaper and the bbc and itv have followed it _ every single newspaper and the bbc and itv have followed it and - every single newspaper and the bbc and itv have followed it and made l every single newspaper and the bbc| and itv have followed it and made it

their number— and itv have followed it and made it their number story— and itv have followed it and made it their number story is _ and itv have followed it and made it their number story is because - and itv have followed it and made it their number story is because they. their number story is because they also considered _ their number story is because they also considered it _ their number story is because they also considered it was _ their number story is because they also considered it was in— their number story is because they also considered it was in the - their number story is because theyj also considered it was in the public interest _ also considered it was in the public interest the — also considered it was in the public interest. the reason _ also considered it was in the public interest. the reason was _ also considered it was in the public interest. the reason was involved. also considered it was in the publicl interest. the reason was involved in the story— interest. the reason was involved in the story is— interest. the reason was involved in the story is because _ interest. the reason was involved in the story is because the _ interest. the reason was involved in the story is because the family- interest. the reason was involved in the story is because the family of. the story is because the family of the story is because the family of the young — the story is because the family of the young person _ the story is because the family of the young person who _ the story is because the family of the young person who was - the story is because the family of the young person who was at - the story is because the family of the young person who was at the| the young person who was at the centre _ the young person who was at the centre of— the young person who was at the centre of the _ the young person who was at the centre of the very _ the young person who was at the centre of the very first _ the young person who was at the centre of the very first allegation went— centre of the very first allegation went to — centre of the very first allegation went to the — centre of the very first allegation went to the police. _ centre of the very first allegation went to the police. and - centre of the very first allegation went to the police. and the - centre of the very first allegation went to the police. and the bbci went to the police. and the bbc referred — went to the police. and the bbc referred the _ went to the police. and the bbc referred the matter _ went to the police. and the bbc referred the matter to - went to the police. and the bbc referred the matter to the - went to the police. and the bbc i referred the matter to the police. so the _ referred the matter to the police. so the notions _ referred the matter to the police. so the notions about _ referred the matter to the police. so the notions about illegality - referred the matter to the police. j so the notions about illegality are entirely— so the notions about illegality are entirely down, entirely _ so the notions about illegality are entirely down, entirely right - so the notions about illegality are entirely down, entirely right and i entirely down, entirely right and happened — entirely down, entirely right and ha ened. ~ , ., i. ~ entirely down, entirely right and hauened. ~ , ., ,, ., happened. why then do you think a few da s happened. why then do you think a few days later _ happened. why then do you think a few days later the _ happened. why then do you think a few days later the sun _ happened. why then do you think a few days later the sun then - happened. why then do you think a few days later the sun then said i happened. why then do you think a | few days later the sun then said the story is, sorry, it said in the story is, sorry, it said in the story on monday it is understood contact between the two started when the youngster was 17? change from friday to monday. when did it change? _ change from friday to monday. when did it change? this _ change from friday to monday. when did it change? this is _ change from friday to monday. when did it change? this is what _ change from friday to monday. when did it change? this is what they - did it change? this is what they said on friday, _ did it change? this is what they said on friday, the _ did it change? this is what they said on friday, the well-known| said on friday, the well—known presenter give the money since they were 17 in return for sordid images.

a couple of days later, it is understood contact between the two started when the youngster was 17. how is that different? i don't understand _ how is that different? i don't understand how— how is that different? i don't understand how that - how is that different? i don't understand how that is - how is that different? i don't - understand how that is different. what _ understand how that is different. what the — understand how that is different. what the sun— understand how that is different. what the sun did, _ understand how that is different. what the sun did, it— understand how that is different. what the sun did, it seems- understand how that is different. what the sun did, it seems to i understand how that is different. what the sun did, it seems to be entirely— what the sun did, it seems to be entirely right, _ what the sun did, it seems to be entirely right, and _ what the sun did, it seems to be entirely right, and i— what the sun did, it seems to be entirely right, and i think- what the sun did, it seems to be entirely right, and i think adam i what the sun did, it seems to be . entirely right, and i think adam got this exactly— entirely right, and i think adam got this exactly right, _ entirely right, and i think adam got this exactly right, he was _ entirely right, and i think adam got this exactly right, he was a - entirely right, and i think adam got this exactly right, he was a friend l this exactly right, he was a friend of you. _ this exactly right, he was a friend of you. and — this exactly right, he was a friend of you. and a _ this exactly right, he was a friend of you, and a colleague _ this exactly right, he was a friend of you, and a colleague of- this exactly right, he was a friend of you, and a colleague of the - this exactly right, he was a friend i of you, and a colleague of the chap. i of you, and a colleague of the chap. i wish _ of you, and a colleague of the chap. i wish him _ of you, and a colleague of the chap. i wish him all— of you, and a colleague of the chap. i wish him all the _ of you, and a colleague of the chap. i wish him all the best. _ of you, and a colleague of the chap. i wish him all the best. illegality- i wish him all the best. illegality was raised. _ iwish him all the best. illegality was raised. it— i wish him all the best. illegality was raised, it wasn't _ i wish him all the best. illegality was raised, it wasn't raised - i wish him all the best. illegality was raised, it wasn't raised by. i wish him all the best. illegality. was raised, it wasn't raised by the sun, _ was raised, it wasn't raised by the sun. come — was raised, it wasn't raised by the sun. come out— was raised, it wasn't raised by the sun, come out wasters _ was raised, it wasn't raised by the sun, come out wasters by- was raised, it wasn't raised by the sun, come out wasters by the - was raised, it wasn't raised by the i sun, come out wasters by the police, it was— sun, come out wasters by the police, it was raised — sun, come out wasters by the police, it was raised by— sun, come out wasters by the police, it was raised by the _ sun, come out wasters by the police, it was raised by the family, _ sun, come out wasters by the police, it was raised by the family, and - sun, come out wasters by the police, it was raised by the family, and it- it was raised by the family, and it was raised — it was raised by the family, and it was raised by— it was raised by the family, and it was raised by the _ it was raised by the family, and it was raised by the bbc. _ it was raised by the family, and it was raised by the bbc. you - it was raised by the family, and iti was raised by the bbc. you cannot -et was raised by the bbc. you cannot get away— was raised by the bbc. you cannot get away from _ was raised by the bbc. you cannot get away from that. _ was raised by the bbc. you cannot get away from that. what - was raised by the bbc. you cannot get away from that. what the - was raised by the bbc. you cannot get away from that. what the sun| get away from that. what the sun did, the _ get away from that. what the sun did, the son's _ get away from that. what the sun did, the son's point _ get away from that. what the sun did, the son's point was _ get away from that. what the sun did, the son's point was a - get away from that. what the sun did, the son's point was a more i did, the son's point was a more basic— did, the son's point was a more basic point— did, the son's point was a more basic point which _ did, the son's point was a more basic point which was _ did, the son's point was a more basic point which was about - did, the son's point was a more basic point which was about the did, the son's point was a more - basic point which was about the bbc after savile. — basic point which was about the bbc after savile, which _ basic point which was about the bbc after savile, which was _ basic point which was about the bbc after savile, which was that - basic point which was about the bbc after savile, which was that people i after savile, which was that people have serious — after savile, which was that people have serious complaints _ after savile, which was that people have serious complaints about - have serious complaints about safeguarding _ have serious complaints about safeguarding are _ have serious complaints about safeguarding are given- have serious complaints about safeguarding are given short l have serious complaints about - safeguarding are given short shrift. that would — safeguarding are given short shrift. that would seem _ safeguarding are given short shrift. that would seem to _ safeguarding are given short shrift. that would seem to have _ safeguarding are given short shrift. that would seem to have been - safeguarding are given short shrift. that would seem to have been if. safeguarding are given short shrift. i that would seem to have been if not proven _ that would seem to have been if not proven by the — that would seem to have been if not proven by the fact _ that would seem to have been if not proven by the fact that _ that would seem to have been if not proven by the fact that it _ that would seem to have been if not proven by the fact that it took - proven by the fact that it took eight — proven by the fact that it took eight weeks. _ proven by the fact that it took eight weeks, nearly—

proven by the fact that it took eight weeks, nearly eight - proven by the fact that it took . eight weeks, nearly eight weeks proven by the fact that it took - eight weeks, nearly eight weeks for this particular— eight weeks, nearly eight weeks for this particular issue _ eight weeks, nearly eight weeks for this particular issue to _ eight weeks, nearly eight weeks for this particular issue to find - eight weeks, nearly eight weeks for this particular issue to find its - this particular issue to find its waym — this particular issue to find its wa ., , ., way... one of the parents went to the police — way... one of the parents went to the police and _ way... one of the parents went to the police and the _ way... one of the parents went to the police and the police - way... one of the parents went to the police and the police told - way... one of the parents went to the police and the police told that| the police and the police told that a parent there was no illegality. yes, but then the bbc went to the police _ yes, but then the bbc went to the police and — yes, but then the bbc went to the police and handed _ yes, but then the bbc went to the police and handed over— yes, but then the bbc went to the police and handed over the - yes, but then the bbc went to the police and handed over the files . yes, but then the bbc went to the| police and handed over the files to the police — police and handed over the files to the police i'ni _ police and handed over the files to the olice. �* ., ,, police and handed over the files to the olice. �* . ~ ., ., , the police. i'm talking about months auo. the the police. i'm talking about months ago- the dad — the police. i'm talking about months ago. the dad went _ the police. i'm talking about months ago. the dad went to _ the police. i'm talking about months ago. the dad went to the _ the police. i'm talking about months ago. the dad went to the police - ago. the dad went to the police months ago. and they were told there was no illegality. months ago. and they were told there was no illegality-— was no illegality. yes, and i am talkin: was no illegality. yes, and i am talking about _ was no illegality. yes, and i am talking about now. _ was no illegality. yes, and i am talking about now. the - was no illegality. yes, and i am talking about now. the bbc - was no illegality. yes, and i am - talking about now. the bbc handed the issue _ talking about now. the bbc handed the issue over— talking about now. the bbc handed the issue over to— talking about now. the bbc handed the issue over to the _ talking about now. the bbc handed the issue over to the police - talking about now. the bbc handedl the issue over to the police because they felt— the issue over to the police because they felt that — the issue over to the police because they felt that there _ the issue over to the police because they felt that there was _ the issue over to the police because they felt that there was a _ they felt that there was a possibility— they felt that there was a possibility of— they felt that there was a possibility of some - they felt that there was a - possibility of some illegality. the whole _ possibility of some illegality. the whole point — possibility of some illegality. the whole point of— possibility of some illegality. the whole point of the _ possibility of some illegality. the whole point of the son's - possibility of some illegality. the whole point of the son's study. possibility of some illegality. the i whole point of the son's study was not about — whole point of the son's study was not about illegality, _ whole point of the son's study was not about illegality, it _ whole point of the son's study was not about illegality, it was - whole point of the son's study was not about illegality, it was about l not about illegality, it was about how the — not about illegality, it was about how the bbc_ not about illegality, it was about how the bbc deals _ not about illegality, it was about how the bbc deals with - not about illegality, it was about . how the bbc deals with complaints from people — how the bbc deals with complaints from people who _ how the bbc deals with complaints from people who feel... _ how the bbc deals with complaints from people who feel... white - how the bbc deals with complaintsl from people who feel... white alan wants _ from people who feel... white alan wants to _ from people who feel... white alan wants to come _ from people who feel... white alan wants to come in. _ from people who feel... white alan wants to come in. young _ from people who feel... white alan wants to come in. young the - from people who feel... white alan wants to come in. young the police| wants to come in. young the police requested — wants to come in. young the police requested them _ wants to come in. young the police requested them to _ wants to come in. young the police requested them to hand _ wants to come in. young the police requested them to hand it - wants to come in. young the police requested them to hand it to - wants to come in. young the police requested them to hand it to him l requested them to hand it to him stop requested them to hand it to him sto ; �* , , ., requested them to hand it to him sto_ �* , , . �* �* stop let's remember that the bbc does have a _ stop let's remember that the bbc does have a duty _ stop let's remember that the bbc does have a duty of _ stop let's remember that the bbc does have a duty of care - stop let's remember that the bbc does have a duty of care not - stop let's remember that the bbc does have a duty of care notjustl does have a duty of care notjust to... i does have a duty of care not 'ust to... ., . . , does have a duty of care not 'ust to... . . . , . does have a duty of care not 'ust to... , ., , ,,

to... i accept that, but the issue is we are — to... i accept that, but the issue is we are spending _ to... i accept that, but the issue is we are spending time - to... i accept that, but the issue is we are spending time talking i is we are spending time talking about— is we are spending time talking about illegality. the illegality is about illegality. the illegality is a side _ about illegality. the illegality is a side issue. the issue is behaviour that many— a side issue. the issue is behaviour that many people would potentially, if it is _ that many people would potentially, if it is true — that many people would potentially, if it is true, would disapprove of, and the — if it is true, would disapprove of, and the interests of a series of young — and the interests of a series of young people who have been in contact, — young people who have been in contact, they say, in an unpleasant way with— contact, they say, in an unpleasant way with this person. i do contact, they say, in an unpleasant way with this person.— way with this person. i do not think the bbc is in _ way with this person. i do not think the bbc is in denial _ way with this person. i do not think the bbc is in denial about - way with this person. i do not think the bbc is in denial about this. - way with this person. i do not think the bbc is in denial about this. we| the bbc is in denial about this. we do not know the truth because they are doing their own inquiry. to predicate this on the sun made a false _ predicate this on the sun made a false claim — predicate this on the sun made a false claim that he had broken the law is— false claim that he had broken the law isjust — false claim that he had broken the law isjust not false claim that he had broken the law is just not what false claim that he had broken the law isjust not what happened. i have law isjust not what happened. have not law isjust not what happened. i have not said that. i am - law isjust not what happened. i have not said that. i am just - law isjust not what happened. i i have not said that. i am just asking have not said that. i am 'ust asking ruestions. have not said that. i am 'ust asking questions. ee * have not said that. i am 'ust asking questions. go ahead. ii have not said that. i am just asking questions. go ahead. ithink- have not said that. i am just asking questions. go ahead. i think it- have not said that. i am just asking questions. go ahead. i think it is. questions. go ahead. ithink it is tellin: questions. go ahead. ithink it is telling that _ questions. go ahead. ithink it is telling that the _ questions. go ahead. ithink it is telling that the sun _ questions. go ahead. ithink it is telling that the sun failed i questions. go ahead. ithink it is telling that the sun failed to i questions. go ahead. i think it is. telling that the sun failed to print in that— telling that the sun failed to print in that very first article the young person's— in that very first article the young person's account that nothing criminal—

person's account that nothing criminal happened and downplayed it. that shows _ criminal happened and downplayed it. that shows the tenure of that article — that shows the tenure of that article and what they were trying to achieve _ article and what they were trying to achieve and what has been a long—standing campaign by rupert murdoch— long—standing campaign by rupert murdoch to undermine the bbc... no, it hasn't. murdoch to undermine the bbc... no, it hasn't- what — murdoch to undermine the bbc... no, it hasn't. what the sun did in its first— it hasn't. what the sun did in its first article — it hasn't. what the sun did in its first article was _ it hasn't. what the sun did in its first article was to _ it hasn't. what the sun did in its first article was to point - it hasn't. what the sun did in its first article was to point out i it hasn't. what the sun did in its first article was to point out the i first article was to point out the problem — first article was to point out the problem is _ first article was to point out the problem is that _ first article was to point out the problem is that the _ first article was to point out the problem is that the couple i first article was to point out the problem is that the couple hadl first article was to point out the i problem is that the couple had in getting _ problem is that the couple had in getting any— problem is that the couple had in getting any satisfaction - problem is that the couple had in getting any satisfaction out - problem is that the couple had in getting any satisfaction out of i problem is that the couple had in| getting any satisfaction out of the bbc. getting any satisfaction out of the bbc that — getting any satisfaction out of the bbc that was _ getting any satisfaction out of the bbc. that was the _ getting any satisfaction out of the bbc. that was the sole _ getting any satisfaction out of the bbc. that was the sole point i getting any satisfaction out of the bbc. that was the sole point of. getting any satisfaction out of the i bbc. that was the sole point of the first article — bbc. that was the sole point of the first article. many— bbc. that was the sole point of the first article. many things _ bbc. that was the sole point of the first article. many things have i first article. many things have happened _ first article. many things have happened since _ first article. many things have happened since then, - first article. many things have happened since then, and i first article. many things have happened since then, and of. first article. many things have - happened since then, and of course many— happened since then, and of course many things— happened since then, and of course many things have _ happened since then, and of course many things have happened - happened since then, and of course many things have happened since . many things have happened since indeed _ many things have happened since indeed the — many things have happened since indeed the name _ many things have happened since indeed the name of— many things have happened since indeed the name of huw- many things have happened since indeed the name of huw edwards| many things have happened since i indeed the name of huw edwards was made _ indeed the name of huw edwards was made public, — indeed the name of huw edwards was made public, but _ indeed the name of huw edwards was made public, but also _ indeed the name of huw edwards was made public, but also since _ indeed the name of huw edwards was made public, but also since we - indeed the name of huw edwards was made public, but also since we began to know— made public, but also since we began to know a _ made public, but also since we began to know a little — made public, but also since we began to know a little bit _ made public, but also since we began to know a little bit more _ made public, but also since we began to know a little bit more about- made public, but also since we began to know a little bit more about it i to know a little bit more about it by monday— to know a little bit more about it by monday this _ to know a little bit more about it by monday this week. _ to know a little bit more about it by monday this week. i’m“ - to know a little bit more about it by monday this week.— to know a little bit more about it by monday this week. i'm going to brine alan by monday this week. i'm going to bring alan yentob _ by monday this week. i'm going to bring alan yentob back— by monday this week. i'm going to bring alan yentob back in. - by monday this week. i'm going to bring alan yentob back in. on i by monday this week. i'm going to bring alan yentob back in. on the | bring alan yentob back in. on the programme tonight, lucy and myself have reported claims from others, some who continue to work for the bbc, some who used to work at the

bbc, some who used to work at the bbc, who have said they felt private messages were inappropriate, and so the bbc has to continue with its inquiry now diligently.— the bbc has to continue with its inquiry now diligently. number one, this letter was _ inquiry now diligently. number one, this letter was actually _ inquiry now diligently. number one, this letter was actually a _ inquiry now diligently. number one, this letter was actually a very i this letter was actually a very moving... vicky's letter, a very bold one to do that. she declared the name of her husband. i am asking what the bbc — the name of her husband. i am asking what the bbc does _ the name of her husband. i am asking what the bbc does now. _ the name of her husband. i am asking what the bbc does now. first of i what the bbc does now. first of all, they have a — what the bbc does now. first of all, they have a duty of— what the bbc does now. first of all, they have a duty of care. she i they have a duty of care. she has said he is now in hospital, he has severe mental health problems, and it is not a matter of the bbc dropping this case, the bbc will now begin to investigate this, take the time to do it effectively and come up time to do it effectively and come up with conclusions when they have done so. but there is still... there is family to think about, on both sides, and turning this into a continuing disproportionate dialogue with newspaper headlines week after week is not a good idea. i5

with newspaper headlines week after week is not a good idea. is it disproportionate, _ week is not a good idea. is it disproportionate, adam boulton? week is not a good idea. is it i disproportionate, adam boulton? i think there was a public interest and who this person was and what was done _ and who this person was and what was done. those people who say the sun did not— done. those people who say the sun did not produce the evidence, the obey the — did not produce the evidence, the obey the law and took steps to not expose this person themselves. that is what they did. that is why they did not— is what they did. that is why they did not publish a lot of evidence because — did not publish a lot of evidence because that would have led people to the details of the case, which they could — to the details of the case, which they could not disclose. so they raised an— they could not disclose. so they raised an issue about the young person. — raised an issue about the young person, the concerns of the parents, and the _ person, the concerns of the parents, and the conduct of the person in question — and the conduct of the person in question. and i do have to say that in spite _ question. and i do have to say that in spite of— question. and i do have to say that in spite of all that is being said, neither— in spite of all that is being said, neither huw nor vicky have denied the allegations. they have not said it is all— the allegations. they have not said it is all untrue, what is said is they— it is all untrue, what is said is they will— it is all untrue, what is said is they will route respond in due course — they will route respond in due course and you as any bad way. this

campaign _ course and you as any bad way. this campaign saying rupert murdoch is trying _ campaign saying rupert murdoch is trying to— campaign saying rupert murdoch is trying to destroy the bbc and destroy— trying to destroy the bbc and destroy huw isjust not borne out by what has _ destroy huw isjust not borne out by what has happened. what destroy huw isjust not borne out by what has happened.— destroy huw isjust not borne out by what has happened. what we need to do is rive it what has happened. what we need to do is give it time _ what has happened. what we need to do is give it time to _ what has happened. what we need to do is give it time to allow _ what has happened. what we need to do is give it time to allow this - do is give it time to allow this investigation to take place. bend do is give it time to allow this investigation to take place. and the sun has said — investigation to take place. and the sun has said it _ investigation to take place. and the sun has said it will— investigation to take place. and the sun has said it will not _ investigation to take place. and the sun has said it will not continue i sun has said it will not continue with— sun has said it will not continue with the — sun has said it will not continue with the story.— sun has said it will not continue with the story. why do you think it will not continue _ with the story. why do you think it will not continue with _ with the story. why do you think it will not continue with the - with the story. why do you think it will not continue with the story? l will not continue with the story? because it does not want to create more _ because it does not want to create more pressure and more unhappiness for the _ more pressure and more unhappiness for the people involved. having brought— for the people involved. having brought it to public attention. is brought it to public attention. somebody brought it to public attention. i3 somebody who writes for the sun, go ahead, then i will bring jacqui back in. , ., , , ahead, then i will bring jacqui back in. , , ., ,, ahead, then i will bring jacqui back in. the problem is that the sun has behaved impeccably _ in. the problem is that the sun has behaved impeccably through i in. the problem is that the sun has behaved impeccably through this i in. the problem is that the sun has. behaved impeccably through this and done exactiv— behaved impeccably through this and done exactly the _ behaved impeccably through this and done exactly the right _ behaved impeccably through this and done exactly the right thing. - behaved impeccably through this and done exactly the right thing. it - behaved impeccably through this and done exactly the right thing. it has i done exactly the right thing. it has done _ done exactly the right thing. it has done acceptably _ done exactly the right thing. it has done acceptably tabloid _ done exactly the right thing. it hasl done acceptably tabloid journalism, which _ done acceptably tabloid journalism, which is _ done acceptably tabloid journalism, which is holding _ done acceptably tabloid journalism, which is holding the _ done acceptably tabloid journalism, which is holding the powerful- done acceptably tabloid journalism, which is holding the powerful to- which is holding the powerful to account — which is holding the powerful to account it _ which is holding the powerful to account. it has _ which is holding the powerful to account. it has done _ which is holding the powerful to account. it has done so - which is holding the powerful to account. it has done so with- which is holding the powerful to account. it has done so with a l account. it has done so with a degree — account. it has done so with a degree of— account. it has done so with a degree of measured - account. it has done so with a i degree of measured carefulness, it has tried _ degree of measured carefulness, it has tried not— degree of measured carefulness, it has tried not to _ degree of measured carefulness, it has tried not to hurt _ degree of measured carefulness, it has tried not to hurt people - degree of measured carefulness, it

has tried not to hurt people in- degree of measured carefulness, it has tried not to hurt people in the. has tried not to hurt people in the way that— has tried not to hurt people in the way that it — has tried not to hurt people in the way that it has _ has tried not to hurt people in the way that it has done _ has tried not to hurt people in the way that it has done it. _ has tried not to hurt people in the way that it has done it. it - has tried not to hurt people in the way that it has done it. it did i has tried not to hurt people in the way that it has done it. it did noti way that it has done it. it did not name _ way that it has done it. it did not name huw— way that it has done it. it did not name huw edwards, _ way that it has done it. it did not name huw edwards, it _ way that it has done it. it did not name huw edwards, it came i way that it has done it. it did not. name huw edwards, it came down way that it has done it. it did not- name huw edwards, it came down to huw edwards' — name huw edwards, it came down to huw edwards' family— name huw edwards, it came down to huw edwards' family to _ name huw edwards, it came down to huw edwards' family to do _ name huw edwards, it came down to huw edwards' family to do that, - name huw edwards, it came down to huw edwards' family to do that, as l huw edwards' family to do that, as you say, _ huw edwards' family to do that, as you say. very— huw edwards' family to do that, as you say, very briefly. _ huw edwards' family to do that, as you say, very briefly. and - huw edwards' family to do that, as you say, very briefly. and there . huw edwards' family to do that, as you say, very briefly. and there isi you say, very briefly. and there is absolutely— you say, very briefly. and there is absolutely no _ you say, very briefly. and there is absolutely no case _ you say, very briefly. and there is absolutely no case to _ you say, very briefly. and there is absolutely no case to answer- you say, very briefly. and there is| absolutely no case to answer from the sun _ absolutely no case to answer from the sun whatsoever. _ absolutely no case to answer from the sun whatsoever.— absolutely no case to answer from the sun whatsoever. jacqui, you are chuckfinu the sun whatsoever. jacqui, you are chuckling a — the sun whatsoever. jacqui, you are chuckling a moment _ the sun whatsoever. jacqui, you are chuckling a moment or— the sun whatsoever. jacqui, you are chuckling a moment or two - the sun whatsoever. jacqui, you are chuckling a moment or two ago, - chuckling a moment or two ago, shaking your head in disagreement. the sun has reported with measured carefulness... it is the sun has reported with measured carefulness. . ._ carefulness. .. it is very difficult to hold someone _ carefulness. .. it is very difficult to hold someone like _ carefulness. .. it is very difficult to hold someone like the - carefulness. .. it is very difficult to hold someone like the sun l to hold someone like the sun newspaper to account because they are completely unaccountable. those screaming headlines would, by any normal person's assumption, be that this unknown presenter was responsible for criminality. and the fact... . responsible for criminality. and the fact... , . , fact... let her finish. please, let herfinish- _ fact... let her finish. please, let her finish. let _ fact... let her finish. please, let her finish. let her— fact... let her finish. please, let her finish. let her finish - fact... let her finish. please, let her finish. let her finish full- fact... let her finish. please, let| her finish. let her finish full stop go ahead. her finish. let her finish full stop no ahead. .. ., , her finish. let her finish full stop no ahead. .. . , ., go ahead. the fact that they omitted in that very first _

go ahead. the fact that they omitted in that very first article _ go ahead. the fact that they omitted in that very first article that - go ahead. the fact that they omitted in that very first article that the - in that very first article that the young person involved had denied any criminality i think is very telling in the slanted way that it was produced. unfortunately, you know it has picked up. the average person in the street will see day after day is an allegation of criminality. you only have to look at social media fallout to see that that is the message that was picked up. lastly; message that was picked up. why didn't the journalist include any story on friday the what's app from the young person at the centre of their claims? the denial of the story. their claims? the denial of the sto . ~ . their claims? the denial of the sto . ~ , , ., , their claims? the denial of the sto. story. when the first story was written, story. when the first story was written. my — story. when the first story was written, my guess _ story. when the first story was written, my guess is _ story. when the first story was written, my guess is they - story. when the first story was written, my guess is they had l story. when the first story was i written, my guess is they had not seen _ written, my guess is they had not seen it _ written, my guess is they had not seen it they— written, my guess is they had not seen it. they spoke _ written, my guess is they had not seen it. they spoke to _ written, my guess is they had not seen it. they spoke to the - written, my guess is they had not i seen it. they spoke to the parents. let me _ seen it. they spoke to the parents. let me finish _ seen it. they spoke to the parents. let me finish. they— seen it. they spoke to the parents. let me finish. they were _ seen it. they spoke to the parents. let me finish. they were dealing i let me finish. they were dealing exclusively— let me finish. they were dealing exclusively at _ let me finish. they were dealing exclusively at that _ let me finish. they were dealing exclusively at that point - let me finish. they were dealing exclusively at that point with - let me finish. they were dealing exclusively at that point with the parents. — exclusively at that point with the parents. and _ exclusively at that point with the parents, and they— exclusively at that point with the parents, and they were - exclusively at that point with the parents, and they were very- exclusively at that point with the - parents, and they were very worried attout— parents, and they were very worried about the _ parents, and they were very worried about the health _ parents, and they were very worried about the health of _ parents, and they were very worried about the health of the _ parents, and they were very worried about the health of the young - parents, and they were very worried | about the health of the young person who was _ about the health of the young person who was involved _ about the health of the young person who was involved in _ about the health of the young person who was involved in this. _ about the health of the young person who was involved in this. i— about the health of the young person who was involved in this. i think- who was involved in this. i think all of— who was involved in this. i think all of this— who was involved in this. i think all of this show—

who was involved in this. i think all of this show is _ who was involved in this. i think all of this show is a _ who was involved in this. i think all of this show is a sure - all of this show is a sure tiahluuptcy— all of this show is a sure bankruptcy and - all of this show is a sure bankruptcy and bias - all of this show is a sure bankruptcy and bias of l all of this show is a sure . bankruptcy and bias of the all of this show is a sure - bankruptcy and bias of the hacked off petitioh — bankruptcy and bias of the hacked off petition. we _ bankruptcy and bias of the hacked off petition-— off petition. we are talking about the sun- -- _ off petition. we are talking about the sun... we _ off petition. we are talking about the sun... we will _ off petition. we are talking about the sun... we will have - off petition. we are talking about the sun... we will have to - off petition. we are talking about the sun... we will have to pause | the sun... we will have to pause there. thank _ the sun... we will have to pause there. thank you _ the sun. .. we will have to pause there. thank you all— the sun... we will have to pause there. thank you all very - the sun... we will have to pause there. thank you all very much. l there. thank you all very much. thank you for talking to our audience. tomorrow the government's expected to say what pay rise it's prepared give to teachers, junior doctors, prison officers, the police, armed forces and civil servants. it's understood the independent pay review bodies have recommended a rise of 6 or 6.5%. such an increase could bring the wave of strikes to an end. but the chancellorjeremy hunt is reported to have told ministers there's no more money beyond the 3.5% that's already been budgeted for by different departments. delivering the full pay rise implies more cuts to the public services they deliver. we'll get the politics from our new insight editor, joe pike, in a moment. but first, with the economics, here's ben. what would the economic impact of granting a 6% plus pay rise for public sector workers for 2023/24 be? that's what we understand

the independent public sector pay review bodies have recommended to ministers. and what would the impact of not granting that award be? those are the questions the government is grappling with right now. would it be inflationary? that's what the chancellor and the prime minister have both recently suggested. but here's some important context. the yellow line shows private sector pay currently rising at around 7.1% year on year. the blue line shows public sector pay currently running below the private sector at 5.9%. and as you can see, it's been below it for the past two years. economists look at this evidence and mostly conclude the argument that a 6% pay rise for the public sector would lead to a dangerous wage price spiral in the uk is not particularly credible. however, public finance experts do estimate that a 6% public sector pay rise across the public sector would cost roughly an additional £5 billion relative to the existing government spending plans. and if that were funded by government borrowing, it would inject more spending power into the economy and it would, at least to some degree,

add to inflationary pressure. would that extra borrowing have a negative impact on the public finances? it would certainlyjeopardise the chances of meeting the government's chosen fiscal rules. this shows the amount of headroom jeremy hunt gave himself against meeting his chosen target of having debt falling as a share of gdp in five years' time in the march budget, £6.5 billion. as you can see, this was the lowest comparable headroom of any chancellor against their own fiscal rules since 2010. the reality is that £5 billion of extra borrowing for public sector pay probably would wipe out that headroom. in light of this, we understand the treasury has told departments that if they want to pay public sector staff an extra 6%, they'll have to find the extra money from within their own existing budgets. with reports of departments and their cabinet ministers like steve barclay and gillian keegan being asked to identify additional savings of £2 billion. but of course public services are under considerable strain already.

what would the impact be of further cuts to services such as education, prisons, the courts and the police? it will mean that already faltering performance gets worse. there, quite simply, isn't any meaningful fat to trim in these public service budgets at the moment. there's nothing that you could quickly salami slice without that having a noticeable impact on public service performance. also, unions, such as the teachers say they are on strike not only for higher pay, but because they say schools are badly under—resourced. it's far from clear that they would stop their industrial action if their pay rises meant cuts elsewhere in education services. many economists are urging the government to get out of this bind by raising taxes to pay for the public sector pay rise. this would offset any inflationary impact, protect the fiscal rules, and avoid the need for cuts to public services.

and it might help end the strikes. yet it should be noted that taxes are already rising sharply. and with a general election looming, this is, for obvious reasons, not an attractive avenue for ministers. but with the independent pay review reports on ministers desks and a decision expected very soon, it seems to be a choice they cannot duck. let's talk tojoe pike, our insight editor. joe, has the prime minister decided what to do? not formally, victoria. but tomorrow he will meet with jeremy not formally, victoria. but tomorrow he will meet withjeremy hunt, they will make a decision, and i am told they will announce it soon after. i am told by a senior government source, who has been involved in this process, that everything is moving towards a point where rishi sunak decides to accept the recommendations of this pay review body. it would mean around a 6% pay rise. i am told that funding gap

will be felled not through further borrowing but through finding, as ben touched on there, further efficiencies in government budgets. this solves two problems potentially, brings in a third problem. not borrowing more money, if that is not going to happen, great. he avoid some criticism from his party felt he could have avoided, projected the recommendations. one minister said he should do that because, we have no money. but the prime minister in recent months has used the independence of these organisations to distance himself from these complex decisions, slightly depoliticise this whole issue. it seems he wants to keep that situation as it has. finally, the problem this potentially creates, if this is the decision, where does he find the money in departmental budgets? one government source has told me this isjust budgets? one government source has told me this is just about re—prioritising spending, but of

course health and education are all ready arguing there is no fat left to cut in departmental budgets. also, they have been arguing for months that it is about far more than just pay. months that it is about far more thanjust pay. it months that it is about far more than just pay. it is relevant because one education union in england said their members are voting forfurther england said their members are voting for further strike action. tomorrow, junior doctors in england who are members of bma are starting this five—day industrial action. that is unprecedented and it could make rishi sunak achieving his big pledge of reducing waiting lists far more difficult.— pledge of reducing waiting lists far more difficult. . ~ , ., , . andrew ridgeley was in one of the biggest bands of the 1980s, wham. and now a new documentary on netflix celebrates the friendship of him and george michael and the success of the two best friends who formed the group together as teenagers. i've been talking to andrew ridgeley about the doc, which features only interviews from the time as well as old footage.

he talked about how the band coped with fame back then, about the undesireable consequences of it, the dilemmas george michael faced about his own sexuality, and we also talked about whether andrew ridgeley could envisage creating an abba—style avatar show for wham. first we began with the old days. early on in the documentary, george asks, "how could these two idiots become so bloody massive"? how? yes, a good question. well, the music was superb. we took the recording, the songwriting and the recording seriously. but not us. neither of us went into formed a band initially as schoolboys to be celebrities or to have fame thrust upon us. we did it to write songs and perform. george says this of you in the documentary. "andrew was this kind of idol that i had". "he was the first person i'd ever hung around with that was much

stronger than me". "almost everything came from andrew". "andrew changed my life and exactly the way someone needed to change my life if i was going to be a pop star". no one knew then in the eighties, when wham were at the height of theirfame, really what your contribution was, how important you were to this band. you co—wrote wham rap, club tropicana, careless whisper. what was it like to have your role, then, minimised by the critics and by outsiders? it irritated a wee bit at first, but our, my relationship with yog was very much one of equals. it can never have been worked otherwise, and wham was always more than the sum of its parts. that's what i think gave its sort of unique quality and character. so i learned to live with it. did you? yeah. you know, one can't let those things weigh one down.

they'd be an encumbrance that would inhibit so much of life. it's my first top of the pops. and it's their first top of the pops. wham! famously, you were invited on top of the pops, which i should say to our younger viewers, absolutely every teenager watched back then. how important was that tv appearance in taking one to stratospheric heights? it was really the moment because it's a national audience and it revealed us to our public. and had we not had that, unlikely that we'd have had released another track, to be honest. # let me take you to the place where never sits a smiling face...# we see in the doc that after shooting the video for club tropicana in ibiza, one morning george told you that he might be gay or bisexual. how would you describe that period? how did you react?

well, we were riding high, we were... club trop was our first location video, and it was the first kind of inkling of our elevation in status. and we were sort of shooting a video but also on holiday. he gave me a ring and asked me to go and see him orjust to come and have a chat. it made no difference to us. i couldn't see that it would make any difference. actually, at the time, i didn't see that it made much difference to wham. the difference we thought it make would be to his dad, and that's why we counselled against him making it public. but as he says in the documentary, that came at a bit of a cost, that decision not to. he said for many years, "my support system was andrew."

did that ever feel like a responsibility, a big responsibility? no, it didn't. and i was unaware of that. you know, we... ourfriendship was such that the support was there by dint of that fact. certainly that's how i felt. we had been in each other�*s company, pockets for a decade and more. and i think he's referring, he was referring to when he then embarked upon his george michael career proper. because it's when you're... when you're on your own, it's a very different kettle of fish. you met each other at school. what did you think of him when you saw him first, george? keeping it as clean as you can. well, it's difficult, really. what did i first think of him? i thought he was pretty loud. you know, brash, young thing. you admired him, in other words.

oh, yeah, yeah. i thought, "now there's a boy i want to sit next to." george speaks of the end of the band. "if i was looking for happiness, i should not be trying to catch up with michaeljackson or madonna." does that suggest that the nature of his personality, you could call it his ego — that's a word used pejoratively, i don't mean it like that — but do you think that's george's...? he did have an ego. ok, fairenough. yeah. but was that a cause of his unhappiness at points? it drove him. right. and his ambition, it had consequences. what do you mean by that? well, it drove him to compete and drove him to position himself alongside those that he perceived as his peers and as at the very elite level. and, you know, that and, you know, that ambition and aspiration ambition and aspiration did have a personal cost. did have a personal cost.

it would have a personal it would have a personal cost for anyone. cost for anyone. how would you describe how would you describe the personal cost to him, then? the personal cost to him, then? well, he was a very private man, well, he was a very private man, and he enjoyed the company and he enjoyed the company of his friends. of his friends. he wasn't particularly gregarious he wasn't particularly gregarious beyond that situation. beyond that situation. and he didn't like the intrusion. and he didn't like the intrusion. he didn't really... he didn't really... it was very much a it was very much a sort of faustian pact sort of faustian pact that he had with success that he had with success because he really...he really didn't because he really...he really didn't like the aspects of fame, like the aspects of fame, the negative aspects of fame the negative aspects of fame that came with success. that came with success. i know you went to see abba voyage i know you went to see abba voyage in east london, where we see 2d in east london, where we see 2d versions of abba from 1979. versions of abba from 1979. they are avatars. they are avatars. what did you think of it? what did you think of it? i absolutely loved it. i was transported. # when you're near me, darling