former speaker of the house of representatives. is her democratic party right to stick with biden? nancy pelosi, welcome to hardtalk. my pleasure to be with you. it is a pleasure to have you on the show. now, you have always been seen as an incredibly internationalist american politician. i think in your years as speaker of the house and congresswoman you visited more than 80 countries. yes. but in that experience, would you say you have seen american power and influence on the wane? well, i certainly hope not. yes, i've visited over 80

countries, for 30 years i have been in intelligence as a member, as a top democratic intelligence committee, as speaker and leader, for 30 years been involved globally in terms of security, that is an oath we take to protect and defend. i think that the previous occupant occasionally of the white house was a setback for us in terms of... you mean donald trump? you don't want to name him, is that it, or...? for me, it is almost like a curse word. laughs to be clear, you are saying... that's who i'm referencing, yes. you are saying that america's standing and its reach and its influence has been affected by the trump... well, i think there were certain questions that arose when he was questioning our commitment to mutual security in nato and the rest. but not to be talking about him, we are very proud of our president, president biden, as to how he came into office.

again, we are back to nato full force in terms of our respect for the countries in nato, and then when the invasion of ukraine occurred, the president acted in a very respectful way to the other countries listening on how we came up with our approach, the timing, the scope of it and the rest. but isn't the truth that if we are to talk about the ark of putin's career with his decisions over time, starting perhaps in 2008 in georgia, to use russian force, the 2014 annexation of crimea and then of course in february 2022, the invasion, full—scale invasion of ukraine, isn't the truth that the signals were sent by a democratic white house to vladimir putin that he could get away with this? it was barack 0bama who basically looked at putin and said, "i want to reset relations with this guy,

"i want to work with this guy" despite what he had done in georgia, despite what he was doing in crimea. well, i think crimea — the georgia situation is a little bit different in that the determination to fight — we are supporting the ukrainian peoples�* fight for their democracy, this is an absolute invasion. i myself thought that we should have all of us, notjust the united states, but europe should have reacted differently to what happened in crimea. but the fact is the physical invasion, a violation of the border with the intention of taking over ukraine is something that has happened now, and the president of the united states listening and in collaboration with our allies and europe and even beyond europe — even beyond europe, butjust talking about nato right now, i think nato has been strengthened when putin thought it would be weakened, it is enlarged, but it

has also intensified its commitment to democracy. so i don't think you should put the invasion of ukraine at the doorstep of barack 0bama. i think that it is, again, we are all in this together, and i think that we all should have done something differently in crimea. the full—on war in ukraine has been raging for, what, 1.5 years now. yeah. ambassador mike mcfaul, who used to serve for the united states government in moscow, says thatjoe biden and his team have been far too concerned about threat of russian escalation, that because of that fear the us hasn't given zelensky and the ukrainians all of the tools they need to regain their lost territories. let's say — yielding

to the title of your programme, hardtalk — let's hardtalk about this, 0k? the fact is — is that, again, i willjust put this in the context of my story. when i was a student, i was at the inauguration of president kennedy, and in his speech that day, president kennedy said, "to citizens of the world, "ask not what america can do for you, but what we can do "working together for the freedom of mankind." that is what he said. and that is exactly whatjoe biden did — working together, not dictating, not condescension, but collaboration... sure, but the truth is... ..collaboration. and the fact is also that i have been a strong advocate since i was the first leader to go to — american leader to go to ukraine, come back with my delegation to the president to say we wanted more weapons, at the time it was about distance and speed and the rest

and, as you know, there are more things in terms of air power and the rest that we'd like to see. from all of us, and so some other countries are going forward and i don't think that... i think we do that again... i understand what you are saying about collaboration, but the fact is us abrams tanks, having been promised, are not yet on the battlefield, f—i6 fighter planes not yet being used by ukrainian pilots in the battle space, atacms, long—range weapons not being given by the us to ukraine, and ukraine right now is losing men, and the message from kyiv is if you gave us more, we could win this war. yes, and i, again, as i said, our group has always been on the forefront of asking for more of our government or our collaboration. but i do say this — is when they talk about the f—i6s, for example,

and they say, "well, they have to be trained," train them now. train them now. if they are not ready, by the time they are ready, the training will be effective. i don't think we have to do this consecutively, sequentially, we should — can do it at the same time — train as we prepare the planes. i do think that there is a legitimate concern about any use of this into russia that could precipitate a reaction from russia, that is a legitimate thing — it this going to... people are concerned, is this provocative of a greater... ..reaction from russia into other nato countries? isn't there also, though, a political problem here in the united states, and we see it in the opinion polling, which shows while still a majority of americans support... yes, they do.

..supporting ukraine... yes. ..they are less keen on sending more money and more equipment, and i'm going to quote you one congressman, he is a republican, andy harris, but he is co—chair of the ukraine caucus, he's been a long—time backer of kyiv, he says, "right now, we have to be realistic, that the war looks like it is not winnable, like the counteroffensive has failed, and that is affecting american public opinion." let me just reject that, 0k. you heard yesterday leaders of the second—in—command of the republicans in the senate, a leader in foreign policy in the senate, senator lindsey graham, you heard the chairman of the foreign affairs committee, a democrat, on the democrat side, and they say that we all support the effort in ukraine. this is the sidebar kind of a thing, it is not reflective. it may be reflective of some republicans in the house, but it's not reflective of us policy. the fight for democracy in ukraine is a fight for democracy in

ukraine and beyond. democracy writ large. we have to respect that. what is the solution this person has said? that we leave? that we don't support ukraine? hardtalk... we are there to win, we are in it to win it. we know what the leading candidates on the republican side of the race for the white house are saying. they are saying we need negotiations now. why? we have to end this war now, and if that means compromise with vladimir putin, that is what we will have to do. why? let me just say this. i wear this ring made by afghan women, and the issue of women in conflict, women being used as a weapon of war is something that many of us in the congress and in the country and in the white house, whether it was laura bush or michelle 0bama orjill biden... we were concerned about the women in those war areas. vladimir putin has had using women as a weapon of war

part of his demoralisation of the ukrainian people, that is what he thought. that his soldiers are raping women in front of their children, in front of their parents, kidnapping children, tens of thousands of them, and somebody saying, "we have got to negotiate with him, forget about the children, forget about the women, forget about the territory," and when the ukrainians are ready to negotiate, that is when we should be talking about it. it should not be thrust upon them. it is about their country, their democracy, their territory, their children, their women. let me talk to you about a couple of other challenges facing the united states on the world stage. one is china. now, you took a pretty remarkable decision, as speaker of the house, to visit taiwan, to go to taipei. joe biden did not want you to do that. well, you don't know that. why do you say that? well, becausejoe biden said that he felt, or at least the us military felt at the time that your trip

was not a good idea. no, who said that, though? that was biden talking about the us military. joe biden said that? yeah, he said that the us military felt that your trip was not a good idea. he said the military... well, he is the commander—in—chief. yeah, but he also said if china attacks taiwan, america will be there to defend taiwan, and then they sort of said, well, not really quite that... well, exactly, madam speaker, that is exactly what happened. joe biden appears unsure what america's strategic stance is on china, and that worries the rest of the world. no, it isn't unclear, it isn't unclear. what's clear is that we are for a one china policy, that didn't change by my trip. and, by the way, i was not the first to go there. members of the senate, leadership of the senate, all men, went there and china didn't say boo. now, let's be clear about this.

one china policy, that didn't change, any of that, legislation... no, with respect, what changed was strategic ambiguity, when biden was asked, would the us, with force, defend taiwan if it was attacked by china, he replied, "yes, if in fact there was an unprecedented attack." now, that is not strictly us policy. well, policy is to supply taiwan with what it needs to defend itself. the fact is that we are saying neither side should change the status quo, especially violently. but i guess the bottom line — do you think that the united states is in any position today to go to war with china over taiwan? war is a very last resort. i do think that part of the us—china relationship

is something that has to be addressed. about their unfair trade practices, about their military actions in the south china sea, as a deterrent to the free flow of shipping in the area, as well as of course the human rights policy. but i am not naive to think enough that people will care about genocide with the uyghurs, the destruction of democratic freedoms in hong kong, the changing of the culture of taiwan, faith, religion and culture of taiwan and threats... by the us doesn't need china when it comes to climate change. is the us showing leadership? because the reality is whilejoe biden is spending tens and tens of billions of dollars on the energy transition, on renewables, on infrastructure to create some sort of green economy, he is also supervising an economy where oil output is at record levels, record levels of exports of liquefied natural gas. the united states essentially is giving the world a message of "we want to have our cake and eat it too, we want to talk green but we want to deliver fossil fuel. well, in the spirit of your title of hardtalk, you are completely wrong.

in friendship, may i say. laughs i'm not offended, but i want to hear why. you're completely wrong. you are not making any differentiation. the liquefied natural gas issue is an issue to supply countries that need it because they don't have to be dependent on russia. that is more related to the ukraine situation, because the dependence on russia oil — europe has to diversify. they know that, they have said that. in the meantime — in the meantime, their economy, their society needs more fuel, and that is what that is about. so i myself have had my, again, my back and forth with the chinese government, and they invited me as speaker to come to china, have a fresh start and let's just talk about climate change. i said "i have to talk about human rights, but my focus will be on climate change." they are essential to saving the planet, there is no question about that.

but that doesn't mean that domestic... ..production in the united states is an indication ofanything... now, one thing that i... all right, well, i'm going to... one thing we have to do in terms of what we've done, $370 billion in tax incentives and the rest but one thing that we need to do that we haven't done enough of is to get the resources — and this is hard to do in a republican congress that doesn't — who want to reverse everything we've done in climate — is to supply other countries with more resources to help address the climate crisis. so, that's an international priority of yours. let's now talk to domestic politics, because we have to. american politics is in turmoil and that's largely because of one man, donald trump. he faces 91 separate charges in four forthcoming trials — allegations which, of course, trump still denies — yet, if you look at the opinion polls, he is running neck and neck as next president of the united states with the incumbentjoe biden.

does that challenge your faith in the american people, in american democracy? oh, no — but... 43% of them, right now, would vote for donald trump for president. well, let me just say that's more of a statement about the republican party and that's something you should take up with the republicans because it is in their party where he has that support. he doesn't have it in the democratic party. but i'll say this — the election is about our democracy as well. it's notjust about two people, it's about our democracy and the integrity of our democracy. and your question, no. i have faith in the goodness of the american people and nobody should ever underestimate the strength of america's democracy.

a second term for this person would be a challenge because he has not honoured the oath of office to protect and defend. but i will promise you this — at the end of this election, our flag will still be there as our national anthem calls for, and ourflag was still there with liberty and justice for all, and that's what the election is about. let me just ask you a personal question. you were at the centre of the storm onjanuary six, 2021... yeah. ..when the capitol was invaded by a rioting mob. they invaded your office. yeah. people have since been prosecuted, convicted and imprisoned for what they did. you said at the time, it was caught on camera — and you didn't know it was being filmed — but you said at the time all this was unfolding and you'd been forced to flee, you said about the prospect of trump coming to the capitol, "i hope he comes. "i want to punch him out. "this is the moment. "i've been waiting for it.

"i want to punch him out. "i'm gonna go to jail and i'm gonna be happy." that's right. i said that. no, i didn't realise that would be broadcast or put out there, but yeah. i understand the level of your anger but doesn't that suggest that you, in a sense, were drawn into this toxic political culture which many americans right now could lead to further political violence? no, no, no. nobody could get any equation or equivalence to my saying "i want to punch him out" — which i've wanted to do for a long time but now, he gave me more reason — to what is happening at the capitol, so, don't try to put any equivalence... i'm not suggesting that equivalence. all i'm saying is that your anger, yourfury, your sense that this was undermining america's democratic system has its own feedback loop and that right now, american politics... yeah, but we were on the right track. we are honouring our oath of office to protect and defend the constitution of the united states.

now, the constitution of the united states on that day said that the peaceful transfer of power would be that congress would accept the electoral college vote. that is why they were there that day — to disrupt the peaceful transfer of power, yeah. my oath of office said i have to defend that, whatever way that... but my point, i guess, is that the anger in american politics has not gone away — in fact, it has intensified. and do you think it is wise for america, for americans — america's system to be prosecuting donald trump, possibly convicting, possibly even imprisoning donald trump, who is, in effect, the leader of the republican party, may well be their nominee for president, at the very time a presidential election is unfolding? yes, i do. i do. no—one is above the law. and you might — what inference i draw from what you're saying

is that we should let him go because there's an election? no. no—one is above the law, no matter what the timing is, and neither is he. isn't the point — and you won't use his name — but isn't that the point that donald trump has tapped into some really raw, powerful feelings... that's right, absolutely. ..but many americans hold — particularly working—class americans. they feel alienated, left behind and they feel... some of them. ..your party, the democratic party, no longer represents their voice. the democrat data scientist david shor, who says his work suggests college—educated people have taken over the issue prioritisation of your democratic party at the expense of working—class white people who were in the party, and even at the expense of working—class non—white people who are in the party today, and that's driving those working—class people away. well, let me address that. that's a point of view. do you worry about it? that you're now seen as a party of the progressive elite? i don't agonise, i organise, 0k? i don't agonise, i organise. the fact is the difference between the two parties is a trickle—down economics of tax bills that 83%

of the benefits went to i% of the population and unintelligible $2 trillion to the national debt. _ versusjoe biden, a bubble—up economy, built from the middle, so that everyone can artici ate an: , �* and the fact is that the press, frankly, use the term �*uneducated' — that wasn't something we said. they said uneducated — i think that was wrong. these people are not uneducated. they accuse you, nancy pelosi, of being out of touch. no, they don't. look. they do. well, they say a lot of things about me but i don't care what they say about me. what i care about is winning elections... and a final point... ..and not to be a fear monger but to be a message of hope. there are many americans — again, according to the polls — who thinkjoe biden should not run again because he's simply too old. only three years older than don — what's his name, yourfriend — he's three years older than him.

he's three — yeah. so, that's a big deal. i don't wish to be ungallant but you are 82 and you have handed over power in the democratic party, in the house of representatives, to what you called a new generation. that's right. should joe biden be learning from you? no. joe biden is the president of the united states. if we said we have a great president. but the american... he's accomplished more... the american people seejoe biden�*s mental and physical health. they see it every day on their tv screens. they are drawing conclusions. a clear majority say he is too old, he should not run again — and that's democrats as well as republicans. and many of those democrats — and if you ask those democrats, they supportjoe biden. they're not supporting somebody else becausejoe biden is old. joe biden is wise, he has knowledge, he has a beautiful vision for america, he has knowledge of the issues — therefore, judgement and wisdom. he has strategic thinking about getting things done. that's why his presidency has been so successful on the domestic front. he has empathy and cares

about working—class families and — and — we have to communicate that better to the american people, and that is what our campaign is about. i didn't hear you say any complimentary thing about anything that people had said about the president or our performance as elected officials. we don't care about the negative. we're about the positive. it's not about fear, it's about hope. and you'll see, 15 months from now, joe biden re—elected as president of the united states with great pride. as you say, we'll see. we'll see. chuckles. nancy pelosi, thank you very much for being on hardtalk. thank you. my pleasure.

hello there. 0ur september heatwave is set to continue with more sunshine around the corner over the next few days. now temperatures on tuesday reached 30.8 degrees celsius in hampshire. we don't see 30 degrees every single september. we had similar kind of temperatures back in 2021 and 2020. now, so far this year, the highest temperature we've recorded all year was 32.2 degrees celsius. and we're going to get really close to that during wednesday. if we get past 32.2, well, that becomes something quite unusual. there have only been four years in the last century that have had the hottest temperature of the year recorded in september. so we'll be keeping a close eye on that stat. now, right now, we've got some low cloud filtering in and around some of our north sea coasts, a little bit of mist and fog around as well, but otherwise clear and starry skies and pretty warm as well. temperatures only towards dawn getting down to around

15 to 17 celsius. now, you might have been hearing about the extreme rainfall we've seen across south—east europe with some severe flooding here. we're underneath this area of high pressure, though, and that's what's bringing us the fine, settled and sunny weather. so we've got more of that to come on wednesday. any morning mist and fog, low cloud will tend to burn away from these eastern coast and then the sunshine comes out. it's going to be another hot day. temperatures quite widely in scotland and northern ireland reaching the mid 20s. but for england and wales, somewhere between 26 and 32 degrees for most of us, very hot for the time of year and could be the hottest day of the year so far. now for thursday, more of the same to come. a few subtle changes — there'll be a little bit more in the way of high cloud across north—western areas, making the sunshine little hazy. and you'd be unlucky, but you could see an odd shower in the west as well. most, though, will continue with the hot, dry, sunny weather with those high temperatures as well. for friday, probably a little bit more in the way of mist and fog patches running both through the irish sea coasts

and also our north sea coasts. but aside from that, it's another dry day with lots of sunshine around for the vast majority. top temperatures well, again, mid to high 20s, pretty widely. low 30s in the very hottest areas. and we've got more of the same into the weekend. it's only really probably during the second part of the weekend and more especially next week, that we start to see the weather pattern breaking down, rain starts to arrive and those temperatures drop closer to normal for the time of year.

welcome to newsday. reporting live from singapore, i'm arunoday mukharji. the headlines. the former leader of the far—right proud boys — henry enrique tarrio has been sentenced to 22 year injailfor his role in the us capitol riots. the russian mercenary group wagner is to be declared a terrorist organisation by the british government. birmingham city council — the largest local authority in europe — in effect, declares bankruptcy. the spanish football federation appoints its first ever female coach for the women's national team — after it sacked its world cup winning coach.

live from our studio in singapore, this is bbc news. it's news day. —— newsday. welcome to bbc news — broadcasting to viewers in the uk and around the world. we begin with the breaking news from the us, where the former leader of the proud boys militia, the far right group that took part in the january 6th attack on the us capitol has been sentenced to 22 years. henry "enrique" tarrio was convicted of seditious conspiracy and other charges. he wasn't present in washington during the riot — having been arrested and ordered to leave the city before the unrest. i spoke with our correspondent in washington — wyre davies about the latest from inside the courtroom. 22 years is by far the biggest sentence handed down to a member of the proud boys.