period across eastern scotland. elsewhere, clear spells and showers, lighter winds in the midlands, eastern parts of england, lincolnshire. some dense fog patches are formed and they will be hanging around tomorrow morning so just be aware of that if you are heading out there is a thing, certainly for lincolnshire and eastern england. should lift into low cloud and then we are looking at another day of sunshine and showers. most of the showers on southern and western coasts where it will be windy and rain piling into eastern scotland. western scotland not faring badly with some sunshine 10—15. then saturday, a similar story. we have the rain piling into eastern scotland on the strong easterly breeze. elsewhere, a murky star and then scattered showers. later, the more organised heavy rain pushing into the south and south—west with some strong winds. temperatures 10-15, some strong winds. temperatures 10—15, pretty much what we have had the last few days. the belt of heavy rain and strong winds spread northwards in saturday night and sunday looks quite wet across the north of the uk. notice even as we go through sunday and monday,

low—pressure sticks close by. it starts to turn is quite cold in the north of scotland as we are pulling in some cold air from scandinavia. elsewhere, it is going to be a mixture of sunshine and showers. best chance of staying dry towards eastern england, temperatures ranging from single figures in the north, 15 in the south, that is it from me, back to you. thanks, stav. and that's bbc news at ten. there's more analysis of the day's main stories on newsnight, which isjust getting under way on bbc two. the news continues here on bbc one, as now it's time to join our colleagues across the nations and regions for the news where you are. but from the ten team, it's goodnight.

another day of death and misery in gaza — and another day of torment for the hostages and their families. can anyone see a way forward? while diplomats keep talking, the father of a young woman killed at the music festival — a man who previously funded a hospital in gaza — tells newsnight the only way to find peace is through brutalforce. so, we are going to flatten all of gaza, neighbourhood by neighbourhood. we believe that anyone

associated with hamas or islamichhad should not be alive, period. we'll talk to a former un diplomat, an international lawyer, and oxfam's uk leader. also tonight: after seven years on bail, twitter�*s secret defendant sees her fraud case thrown out of court. no longer secret, she talks to us exclusively. i was broken to the point of destruction. i was destroyed at that point. there was nothing left of the old me at that point. you know, like, when you say rock bottom, i was under the rock. i was in the mud underneath the water underneath the rock, you know, like, in a swamp. and this... he put the bass on, i put the drums on. the remaining beatles announce they will release their last song in a week's time, cobbled together with old recordings and new tech. should it count? this musicjournalist says yes...kind of. good evening. it's almost three weeks since

hamas — proscribed as a terrorist organisation by the uk government and many others — launched murderous attacks in israel. nearly three weeks of horror and bloodshed which began with the murder of 11100 israelis, and more than 220 taken hostage, and now sees civilians in gaza paying a heavy price, some desperately searching through rubble for family members, others struggling to find adeqaute food and water. more than 7000 people have now been killed in the gaza strip since israel began its air strikes, according to the hamas—run health ministry. hamas says that includes nearly 50 hostages — if true, it's a devastating blow to families who are desperate for hope that they might see their loved ones again. but as with so much in this war, facts are often hard to come by and there is no independent verification of hamas�* numbers. tonight we'll discuss the diplomatic efforts to find a way through and look again at what a ground attack by israel could look like. but first, emir has this report from israel.

shouting. another day with no news. a parent's love, manifest in fury. we another day with no news. a parent's love, manifest in fury.— love, manifest in fury. we are not sleeina! love, manifest in fury. we are not sleeping! 20 _ love, manifest in fury. we are not sleeping! 20 days! _ love, manifest in fury. we are not sleeping! 20 days! give _ love, manifest in fury. we are not sleeping! 20 days! give us... - sleeping! 20 days! give us... with each passing _ sleeping! 20 days! give us... with each passing day _ sleeping! 20 days! give us... with each passing day the _ sleeping! 20 days! give us... with each passing day the families of the 224 israeli hostages in gaza grow more desperate. hamas claimed today that almost 50 of those hostages have been killed by israel's and bums in the gaza strip. few outlets are taking the claim seriously but is real's devastating air strike campaign continues to claim lives widely. —— killed by israel's own bombs. according to the headmaster and minister of health the total is 7000 since the start of the war. 0ne number but is much slower. just 12 trucks of. —— one number rises much

slower. in the early hours, a probing incursion by israeli tanks in gaza, and in the strike the idf claims to have taken out a deputy head of hamas, while in tel aviv, a barrage of rockets from gaza set siren's ringing, intercepted by the irene dome, and the hostage families are scattered. —— intercepted by the iron dome. this man went looking for his daughter, missing after the rave. i his daughter, missing after the rave. ., , ., , ., his daughter, missing after the rave. ., ., ., rave. i was hoping at that time that she was not — rave. i was hoping at that time that she was not in _ rave. i was hoping at that time that she was not in the _ rave. i was hoping at that time that she was not in the car— rave. i was hoping at that time that she was not in the car or _ rave. i was hoping at that time that she was not in the car or she - she was not in the car or she was able to... was wounded something, able to... was wounded something, able to... was wounded something, able to escape off the car. both proved be wrong. my ex—wife, when we

did the funeral, she said i don't believe anyone and i were due to tell me, she asked me to identify her. so i went and looked at her. it was good because i know it's her so i get closure from it. so i am happy i get closure from it. so i am happy i saw her. yeah. she loved to dance. she danced a lot. egg]! i saw her. yeah. she loved to dance. she danced a lot.— she danced a lot. eyal employed palestinians, _ she danced a lot. eyal employed palestinians, believing _ she danced a lot. eyal employed palestinians, believing he - she danced a lot. eyal employed palestinians, believing he could | palestinians, believing he could help bring progress on top so i donated and raised $360,000 for a hospital in gaza, right before covid. 50 hospital in gaza, right before covid. ~ , ., covid. so i think we still need to no for covid. so i think we still need to go for peace- — covid. so i think we still need to go for peace. we _ covid. so i think we still need to go for peace. we still _ covid. so i think we still need to go for peace. we still need - covid. so i think we still need to l go for peace. we still need peace. it's not smart to continue killing each other. but it's not smart to continue killing each other-— it's not smart to continue killing each other. but his solutions for eace each other. but his solutions for peace are _ each other. but his solutions for peace are now— each other. but his solutions for peace are now severe. - each other. but his solutions for peace are now severe. we - each other. but his solutions for peace are now severe. we are l each other. but his solutions for - peace are now severe. we are going to flatten all — peace are now severe. we are going to flatten all of _ peace are now severe. we are going to flatten all of gaza, _ to flatten all of gaza, neighbourhood by neighbourhood. we believe anyone associated with hamas

or islamicjihad should not be alive, period. the people that have done would happen, 1500 terrorists penetrated israel, we really messed up. our intelligence, our defence, what those guys have done, those creatures, is something that's inhuman, completely. so again, we're not against muslims. we are not islam. but the same as isis, hamas and islamichhad should not exist any more and we will do everything we can to do this.— we can to do this. such strong languages _ we can to do this. such strong languages are _ we can to do this. such strong languages are spoken - we can to do this. such strong languages are spoken by - we can to do this. such strong| languages are spoken by many families affected and by israeli pull—back more widely but it's still possible to find voices calling for another response. —— by israelimore widely. i another response. -- by israelimore widel . ~ , another response. -- by israelimore widel. ~ , ., widely. i think people are responding _ widely. i think people are responding in _ widely. i think people are responding in a _ widely. i think people are responding in a way - widely. i think people are| responding in a way that's widely. i think people are - responding in a way that's very understandable and human, which is wanting _ understandable and human, which is wanting revenge, which is wanting to hurt the _ wanting revenge, which is wanting to hurt the palestinians, to hit back at hamas. — hurt the palestinians, to hit back at hamas, the war crimes which were

perpetrated _ at hamas, the war crimes which were perpetrated against us cannot justify— perpetrated against us cannot justify perpetrating war crimes against — justify perpetrating war crimes against the population of gaza, that is itself_ against the population of gaza, that is itself a _ against the population of gaza, that is itself a largely civilian population, the majority of gazans are children from top so in this really— are children from top so in this really awful time for israeli society, _ really awful time for israeli society, the points of light are actually — society, the points of light are actually all these amazing initiatives that are about cooperation between jews and arabs, accepting _ cooperation between jews and arabs, accepting that we have both been hit by this— accepting that we have both been hit by this attack. gne accepting that we have both been hit by this attack-— by this attack. one group trying to rebuild fraught relations _ rebuild fraught relations between communities is here in southern is real. bedouin arabs, who lives alongsidejewish neighbours and alongside jewish neighbours and still alongsidejewish neighbours and still have close connections to gaza. ~ ., still have close connections to gaza. ~ . ' :: still have close connections to gaza. . ':: , ~ still have close connections to gaza. . 'ii , ~' , . gaza. we have 90 people killed since the war started. _ gaza. we have 90 people killed since the war started. we _ gaza. we have 90 people killed since the war started. we have _ gaza. we have 90 people killed since the war started. we have now- gaza. we have 90 people killed since the war started. we have now seven | the war started. we have now seven that are _ the war started. we have now seven that are missing, _ the war started. we have now seven that are missing, their— the war started. we have now seven that are missing, their destiny- the war started. we have now seven that are missing, their destiny is- that are missing, their destiny is not rcatty— that are missing, their destiny is not really known. _ that are missing, their destiny is not really known. we _ that are missing, their destiny is not really known. we have - not really known. we have volunteers from bedouin— not really known. we have volunteers from bedouin arab _ not really known. we have volunteers from bedouin arab communities - not really known. we have volunteers from bedouin arab communities and i from bedouin arab communities and alsojewish_

from bedouin arab communities and alsojewish communities, _ from bedouin arab communities and alsojewish communities, and - from bedouin arab communities and alsojewish communities, and we . alsojewish communities, and we bring _ alsojewish communities, and we bring food — alsojewish communities, and we bring food from _ alsojewish communities, and we bring food from also _ alsojewish communities, and we bring food from also volunteers l alsojewish communities, and we i bring food from also volunteers that are from _ bring food from also volunteers that are from both — bring food from also volunteers that are from both communities. - bring food from also volunteers that are from both communities. let's i bring food from also volunteers that| are from both communities. let's be togethen let's — are from both communities. let's be together. let's bring _ are from both communities. let's be together. let's bring some _ together. let's bring some positivity _ together. let's bring some positivity to _ together. let's bring some positivity to this _ together. let's bring some positivity to this all - together. let's bring some l positivity to this all darkness together. let's bring some - positivity to this all darkness that is hitting — positivity to this all darkness that is hitting us— positivity to this all darkness that is hitting us from _ positivity to this all darkness that is hitting us from every— positivity to this all darkness that is hitting us from every side. - positivity to this all darkness that i is hitting us from every side. iiriii�*hile is hitting us from every side. while one community _ is hitting us from every side. while one community pulls _ is hitting us from every side. one community pulls together, a short distance away, across the border, another continues to be pulled apart. broken parents, grieving their innocent children. so — what about the promised ground attack? as emir mentioned, israeli armoured vehicles moved into gaza last night and then returned in what the israeli defence forces said was an operation to gather intelligence and prepare for the next stage of its war. mark's here. in terms of that overnight incursion, what should we make of that? ~ , ., , ., ., that? when people heard with that the were that? when people heard with that they were going — that? when people heard with that they were going on, _ that? when people heard with that they were going on, some - that? when people heard with that they were going on, some sort, i that? when people heard with that they were going on, some sort, is| they were going on, some sort, is this it? i've looked at the footage, it looks like a few dozen armoured vehicles, perhaps a couple of

hundred troops. if you look at the map, it's what you might call two companies strength, for those that have been in the military, incursions to two places. about a kilometre into gaza, let's call it a reconnaissance force. that fits with ideas that seem to have been around in the israeli military, that it would start in the north. if we come around to this map on its depiction of the leaflets that were dropped a few days after, saying to lead from that shaded area and go south, leave from north of the wadi gaza, that everyone assumed was aware the ground offence would start and there was heavy bombing there, too. hundreds of people did head south, but it didn't happen, i think for lots of reasons but including, critically, that the movement of population is not exactly what israelis expected.— population is not exactly what israelis expected. population is not exactly what israelis exected. ~ . v , , israelis expected. what's your sense of wh it israelis expected. what's your sense of why it has — israelis expected. what's your sense of why it has taken _ israelis expected. what's your sense of why it has taken so _ israelis expected. what's your sense of why it has taken so long _ israelis expected. what's your sense of why it has taken so long for- israelis expected. what's your sense of why it has taken so long for this i of why it has taken so long for this operation to develop? that of why it has taken so long for this operation to develop?— of why it has taken so long for this

operation to develop? that factor is one of them- _ operation to develop? that factor is one of them- i— operation to develop? that factor is one of them. i think— operation to develop? that factor is one of them. i think some - operation to develop? that factor is one of them. i think some of - operation to develop? that factor is one of them. i think some of the i one of them. i think some of the people we were talking to, israeli senior military advisers, former senior military advisers, former senior military, were saying to us in the first few days that they expected hundreds of thousands of palestinians to move south, they clearly tried to precipitate that was the leaflets, and then to go into the sinai desert instead of into the sinai desert instead of into the sinai desert instead of into the southern part of the gaza strip, where they would also face bombing, as we can see. clearly for the palestinians, and i think to an extent for egypt, it was an absolute article of faith that they were not going to allow the population of the gaza strip to be emptied out for the military convenience of the israeli offensive. forthem, clearly, that had uncomfortable echoes of 1948, what happened to palestinian communities in terms of dispossession and all the rest of it. so they have done everything possible to keep the people in there, which means that israelis can't come in their terms, go into a more open battlefield. they have to count on the people being there. all of those cautions from the americans

about, you know, do everything possible not to harm civilians, are ringing in their ears. and basically, they are not sure how to progress the military side of this. thanks, mark. joining me now in the studio is nomi bar—yaacov, associate fellow in the international security programme at chatham house, sir mark lyall grant, former uk ambassador to the un, and former national security adviser to the pm, and danny sriskandarajah, 0xfam gb�*s ceo. thank you so much, all of you, for coming on to newsnight. mark, i'd like to start with you. the eu today called for poses to enable a humanitarian corridor, to enable eight to get in. how much chance to think there is of that happening? —— called for pauses to allow aid to get info so i don't think there's much chance of israel agreeing to a ceasefire, though that's what countries are asking for and that what un members will vote for,

possibly, this evening in the general assembly. possibly, this evening in the generalassembly. but possibly, this evening in the general assembly. but i do think there is a realistic prospect of israel agreeing humanitarian pauses, a limited period where they would stop the bombardment, maybe three hours a day or whatever, or even humanitarian corridors, once the ground offensive starts. that is certainly what the british and, american and some other governments are pressing israel to do and i think there is a possibility they might accept that. you think there is a possibility they might accept that.— think there is a possibility they might accept that. you seem to be auareein might accept that. you seem to be agreeing with _ might accept that. you seem to be agreeing with that, _ might accept that. you seem to be agreeing with that, do _ might accept that. you seem to be agreeing with that, do you - might accept that. you seem to be agreeing with that, do you think i agreeing with that, do you think there's a chance?— agreeing with that, do you think there's a chance? yes, i think it is more than — there's a chance? yes, i think it is more than a _ there's a chance? yes, i think it is more than a possibility. _ there's a chance? yes, i think it is more than a possibility. i - there's a chance? yes, i think it is more than a possibility. i think- more than a possibility. i think there — more than a possibility. i think there will— more than a possibility. i think there will be mounting pressure on israel— there will be mounting pressure on israel given the large toll on the civilian— israel given the large toll on the civilian population to have, i think pauses— civilian population to have, i think pauses is— civilian population to have, i think pauses is the lowest common denominator. there were some countries — denominator. there were some countries in the eu today, like spain. — countries in the eu today, like spain, calling for a ceasefire. it's 'ust spain, calling for a ceasefire. it's just given — spain, calling for a ceasefire. it's just given the make—up and the politics of— just given the make—up and the politics of the eu, that was the very— politics of the eu, that was the very lowest common denominator they agreed _ very lowest common denominator they agreed on. _ very lowest common denominator they agreed on, and i think humanity imposes — agreed on, and i think humanity imposes the very minimum that israel would _ imposes the very minimum that israel would agree to, but i think depending on how the ground offensive moves on, there will be

larger— offensive moves on, there will be larger pauses for humanitarian corridors _ larger pauses for humanitarian corridors. �* , ., ., ~ ., corridors. and before we talk about any ground — corridors. and before we talk about any ground offensive, _ corridors. and before we talk about any ground offensive, what - corridors. and before we talk about any ground offensive, what is - corridors. and before we talk about any ground offensive, what is the l any ground offensive, what is the situation now that you are hearing about in terms of on the ground for people in gaza? it is about in terms of on the ground for people in gaza?— people in gaza? it is terrifying, truly terrifying. _ people in gaza? it is terrifying, truly terrifying. we've got - people in gaza? it is terrifying, | truly terrifying. we've got brave colleagues _ truly terrifying. we've got brave colleagues in _ truly terrifying. we've got brave colleagues in gaza _ truly terrifying. we've got brave colleagues in gaza who - truly terrifying. we've got brave colleagues in gaza who should i truly terrifying. we've got brave. colleagues in gaza who should be running _ colleagues in gaza who should be running relief— colleagues in gaza who should be running relief services _ colleagues in gaza who should be running relief services but - colleagues in gaza who should be| running relief services but instead they are _ running relief services but instead they are running _ running relief services but instead they are running for— running relief services but instead they are running for their- running relief services but instead they are running for their lives. i they are running for their lives. i've they are running for their lives. we just — they are running for their lives. we just come _ they are running for their lives. i've just come back— they are running for their lives. i've just come back from - they are running for their lives. i've just come back from a - they are running for their lives. - i've just come back from a meeting in geneva, — i've just come back from a meeting in geneva, a — i've just come back from a meeting in geneva, a large _ i've just come back from a meeting in geneva, a large gathering - i've just come back from a meeting in geneva, a large gathering of- in geneva, a large gathering of humanitarians, _ in geneva, a large gathering of humanitarians, and _ in geneva, a large gathering of humanitarians, and i've - in geneva, a large gathering of humanitarians, and i've not. in geneva, a large gathering of. humanitarians, and i've not seen colleagues — humanitarians, and i've not seen colleagues so _ humanitarians, and i've not seen colleagues so distressed, - humanitarians, and i've not seen colleagues so distressed, not. humanitarians, and i've not seenl colleagues so distressed, not just about— colleagues so distressed, not just about the — colleagues so distressed, not just about the scale _ colleagues so distressed, not just about the scale and _ colleagues so distressed, not just about the scale and intensity - colleagues so distressed, not just| about the scale and intensity what is happening — about the scale and intensity what is happening in— about the scale and intensity what is happening in gaza _ about the scale and intensity what is happening in gaza but— about the scale and intensity what is happening in gaza but the - about the scale and intensity what is happening in gaza but the fact i is happening in gaza but the fact that the — is happening in gaza but the fact that the humanitarian _ is happening in gaza but the fact that the humanitarian principlesl is happening in gaza but the fact. that the humanitarian principles on which _ that the humanitarian principles on which many— that the humanitarian principles on which many of— that the humanitarian principles on which many of our _ that the humanitarian principles on which many of our organisations i that the humanitarian principles onl which many of our organisations are built are _ which many of our organisations are built are being— which many of our organisations are built are being thrown _ which many of our organisations are built are being thrown out _ which many of our organisations are built are being thrown out of- which many of our organisations are built are being thrown out of the - built are being thrown out of the window — built are being thrown out of the window and _ built are being thrown out of the window. and the _ built are being thrown out of the window. and the basic— built are being thrown out of the window. and the basic rules of l window. and the basic rules of protecting _ window. and the basic rules of protecting innocent _ window. and the basic rules of protecting innocent civilians i window. and the basic rules of protecting innocent civilians in| protecting innocent civilians in these — protecting innocent civilians in these sorts _ protecting innocent civilians in these sorts of— protecting innocent civilians in these sorts of circumstances l protecting innocent civilians in - these sorts of circumstances don't seem _ these sorts of circumstances don't seem to _ these sorts of circumstances don't seem to be — these sorts of circumstances don't seem to be followed. _ these sorts of circumstances don't seem to be followed. and - these sorts of circumstances don't seem to be followed. and that's . seem to be followed. and that's really _ seem to be followed. and that's really distressing. _ seem to be followed. and that's really distressing.— seem to be followed. and that's really distressing. israel has said, for example. _ really distressing. israel has said, for example, hamas _ really distressing. israel has said, for example, hamas have - really distressing. israel has said, for example, hamas have a - really distressing. israel has said, for example, hamas have a lot i really distressing. israel has said, for example, hamas have a lot of| for example, hamas have a lot of fuel they could give to hospitals. what do you understand is the case and how confident are you that if the supply chain is opened up and more fuel and food does get in, that it will get to the right people? gill

it will get to the right people? all i can say is that from what i'm hearing — i can say is that from what i'm hearing from _ i can say is that from what i'm hearing from colleagues, - i can say is that from what i'm hearing from colleagues, they i can say is that from what i'm - hearing from colleagues, they are barely— hearing from colleagues, they are barely surviving. _ hearing from colleagues, they are barely surviving. a _ hearing from colleagues, they are barely surviving. a few _ hearing from colleagues, they are barely surviving. a few litres - hearing from colleagues, they are barely surviving. a few litres of. barely surviving. a few litres of bottled — barely surviving. a few litres of bottled water _ barely surviving. a few litres of bottled water that _ barely surviving. a few litres of bottled water that they - barely surviving. a few litres of bottled water that they have i barely surviving. a few litres of bottled water that they have to barely surviving. a few litres of- bottled water that they have to pay a high _ bottled water that they have to pay a high price — bottled water that they have to pay a high price for. _ bottled water that they have to pay a high price for, that _ bottled water that they have to pay a high price for, that they- bottled water that they have to pay a high price for, that they have - bottled water that they have to pay a high price for, that they have to. a high price for, that they have to search, _ a high price for, that they have to search, go— a high price for, that they have to search, go far— a high price for, that they have to search, go far to _ a high price for, that they have to search, go far to find _ a high price for, that they have to search, go far to find any- search, go far to find any shops that have — search, go far to find any shops that have even _ search, go far to find any shops that have even basic— search, go far to find any shops that have even basic supplies. i search, go far to find any shops i that have even basic supplies. this these _ that have even basic supplies. this these are _ that have even basic supplies. this these are people _ that have even basic supplies. this these are people in _ that have even basic supplies. this these are people in desperate i these are people in desperate circumstances _ these are people in desperate circumstances and _ these are people in desperate circumstances and we - these are people in desperate circumstances and we can i these are people in desperate i circumstances and we can spend all day arguing — circumstances and we can spend all day arguing about _ circumstances and we can spend all day arguing about who _ circumstances and we can spend all day arguing about who had - circumstances and we can spend all i day arguing about who had stockpiles of vote _ day arguing about who had stockpiles of vote but— day arguing about who had stockpiles of vote but we — day arguing about who had stockpiles of vote but we need _ day arguing about who had stockpiles of vote but we need urgently - day arguing about who had stockpiles of vote but we need urgently to i day arguing about who had stockpiles of vote but we need urgently to turnl of vote but we need urgently to turn the electricity— of vote but we need urgently to turn the electricity back _ of vote but we need urgently to turn the electricity back on, _ of vote but we need urgently to turn the electricity back on, turn - of vote but we need urgently to turn the electricity back on, turn the i the electricity back on, turn the water— the electricity back on, turn the water back— the electricity back on, turn the water back on _ the electricity back on, turn the water back on and _ the electricity back on, turn the water back on and get - the electricity back on, turn the water back on and get fuel i the electricity back on, turn the water back on and get fuel so . the electricity back on, turn the i water back on and get fuel so the pumping — water back on and get fuel so the pumping stations— water back on and get fuel so the pumping stations for— water back on and get fuel so the pumping stations for what - water back on and get fuel so the pumping stations for what i- water back on and get fuel so the pumping stations for what i can i pumping stations for what i can start— pumping stations for what i can start running _ pumping stations for what i can start running again. _ pumping stations for what i can start running again.— pumping stations for what i can start running again. could hamas do that? i start running again. could hamas do that? l don't... — start running again. could hamas do that? l don't. .. they _ start running again. could hamas do that? i don't. .. they may _ start running again. could hamas do that? i don't. .. they may well i start running again. could hamas do that? i don't. .. they may well be i that? i don't. .. they may well be but the electricity _ that? i don't. .. they may well be but the electricity needs - that? i don't. .. they may well be but the electricity needs to i that? i don't. .. they may well be but the electricity needs to be i but the electricity needs to be turned — but the electricity needs to be turned back— but the electricity needs to be turned back on _ but the electricity needs to be turned back on by— but the electricity needs to be turned back on by the - but the electricity needs to be turned back on by the israeli i turned back on by the israeli authorities, _ turned back on by the israeli authorities, they— turned back on by the israeli authorities, they are - turned back on by the israeli authorities, they are after. turned back on by the israeli| authorities, they are after all turned back on by the israeli i authorities, they are after all the occupying — authorities, they are after all the occupying power— authorities, they are after all the occupying power and _ authorities, they are after all the occupying power and they - authorities, they are after all the occupying power and they have i authorities, they are after all the occupying power and they have aj occupying power and they have a responsibility, _ occupying power and they have a responsibility, even _ occupying power and they have a responsibility, even in— occupying power and they have a responsibility, even in time i occupying power and they have a responsibility, even in time of. occupying power and they have a i responsibility, even in time of war, to protect _ responsibility, even in time of war, to protect civilians _ responsibility, even in time of war, to protect civilians and _ responsibility, even in time of war, to protect civilians and not - responsibility, even in time of war, to protect civilians and not have i to protect civilians and not have collective — to protect civilians and not have collective punishments - to protect civilians and not have collective punishments of i to protect civilians and not have i collective punishments of innocent civilians _ collective punishments of innocent civilians in — collective punishments of innocent civilians in gaza. _ collective punishments of innocent civilians in gaza. [— collective punishments of innocent civilians in gaza.— civilians in gaza. i think there will be, civilians in gaza. i think there will be. you _ civilians in gaza. i think there will be, you know... - civilians in gaza. i think there l will be, you know... electricity will be, you know... electricity will be, you know... electricity will be turned on at some point. with fuel, i think it's more complicated, given that what fuels

the ammunition of hamas and therefore the international community has to find a mechanism whereby the fuel is followed all the way through into the hospitals and into where it should be. so i think fuel is much more tricky. it is going to be a long road and a long struggle. i think the pressure will mount on israel to reach a ceasefire. mark said that israel will not agree to a ceasefire now, but i do think the time will come when israel will have no choice but to agree to a ceasefire. sir when israel will have no choice but to agree to a ceasefire.— to agree to a ceasefire. sir mark, what is the _ to agree to a ceasefire. sir mark, what is the israeli _ to agree to a ceasefire. sir mark, what is the israeli calculation, i to agree to a ceasefire. sir mark, what is the israeli calculation, ifl what is the israeli calculation, if you can read it? they say, hamas could end this tomorrow, return the hostages, put down their arms. israel clearly wants to destroy hamas — israel clearly wants to destroy hamas. that is a legitimate objective given the atrocities that hamas— objective given the atrocities that hamas committed. the question is, can they— hamas committed. the question is, can they do — hamas committed. the question is, can they do that without a full—scale ground invasion of gaza? almost _ full—scale ground invasion of gaza? almost certainly not. possibly even

after that, — almost certainly not. possibly even afterthat, it almost certainly not. possibly even after that, it will not achieve that aim _ after that, it will not achieve that aim. certainly decapitating hamas as aim. certainly decapitating hamas as a political— aim. certainly decapitating hamas as a political organisation, which they have also— a political organisation, which they have also stated as an objective, looks— have also stated as an objective, looks to — have also stated as an objective, looks to be — have also stated as an objective, looks to be extremely difficult. the further _ looks to be extremely difficult. the further problem is what happens the day after? _ further problem is what happens the day after? this is a question that the israelis — day after? this is a question that the israelis are not really prepared to engage — the israelis are not really prepared to engage on at the moment, but it is a question that many western governments are considering very seriously — governments are considering very seriously. even if israel succeeds in its _ seriously. even if israel succeeds in its objective of destroying hamas. _ in its objective of destroying hamas, what happens then? they do not want _ hamas, what happens then? they do not want to— hamas, what happens then? they do not want to stay in occupation of gaza _ not want to stay in occupation of gaza indefinitely, the palestinian authority— gaza indefinitely, the palestinian authority which runs the west bank has not _ authority which runs the west bank has not got either the capability or the credibility to run gaza. so who is going _ the credibility to run gaza. so who is going to — the credibility to run gaza. so who is going to administer 2.3 million people _ is going to administer 2.3 million people once the ground operation, the military phase of this conflict is over? — the military phase of this conflict is over? that is where i think diplomacy_ is over? that is where i think diplomacy will come back into play. and that _ diplomacy will come back into play. and that does feel a very long way off. nomi, would you say... if we talk about the ground invasion, is

it possible to defeat hamas? i do not think so- _ it possible to defeat hamas? i do not think so. i _ it possible to defeat hamas? i if not think so. i think it is possible to... it is possible to get rid of their military capability. i think we need to separate between the military wing and the political wing. as mark said, the political wing. as mark said, the political wing has a life outside gaza. and i don't think that the political wing. .. may don't think that the political wing... may be the people who are reading it now will no longer be a part of it, but certainly there is an ideology there. it may not be called hamas, it might be called something else, but it will be the same ideology. i don't think it is going away. i think we need to think about the end game now, it is not that far off. unless you know what the endgame is, you are really getting into a situation that is horrific. in getting into a situation that is horrific. , ., ., .,

horrific. in terms of who will have influence over _ horrific. in terms of who will have influence over that _ horrific. in terms of who will have influence over that endgame, i horrific. in terms of who will have influence over that endgame, orl influence over that endgame, or getting us to that endgame, i expect, for example, is there a scale of civilians suffering in gaza that would lead to a withdrawal of support for israel by the us, for example? i support for israel by the us, for examle? ., ., ~' support for israel by the us, for examle? ., ., ~ support for israel by the us, for example?— support for israel by the us, for examle? ., ., ~ ., example? i do not think so, no. the united states _ example? i do not think so, no. the united states has _ example? i do not think so, no. the united states has been _ example? i do not think so, no. the united states has been full- example? i do not think so, no. the united states has been full square i united states has been full square behind _ united states has been full square behind israel for 50 years, united states has been full square behind israelfor50 years, more united states has been full square behind israel for 50 years, more so than even _ behind israel for 50 years, more so than even the british government and other europeans. i do not think there _ other europeans. i do not think there is— other europeans. i do not think there is any realistic prospect of that _ there is any realistic prospect of that. however, ido there is any realistic prospect of that. however, i do think a lot of israel's _ that. however, i do think a lot of israel's allies, other allies, will start— israel's allies, other allies, will start to — israel's allies, other allies, will start to desert israel if the suffering goes on, and potentially -ets suffering goes on, and potentially gets a _ suffering goes on, and potentially gets a lot — suffering goes on, and potentially gets a lot worse once a ground invasion— gets a lot worse once a ground invasion starts. having set the bar by having — invasion starts. having set the bar by having this siege and cutting off all humanitarian provisions into gaza, _ all humanitarian provisions into gaza, israel has actually caused something of a rod for its own back. as time _ something of a rod for its own back. as time goes on, the suffering will -et as time goes on, the suffering will get worse. — as time goes on, the suffering will get worse, yet the ground invasion is still— get worse, yet the ground invasion is still being delayed. wide 0htani, can you _ is still being delayed. wide 0htani,

can you give us a sense of what used to go— can you give us a sense of what used to go to _ can you give us a sense of what used to go to gaza — can you give us a sense of what used to go to gaza every day compared with now? — to go to gaza every day compared with now? ~ ., , , ., ., ~ with now? what is the situation like com ared with now? what is the situation like compared with _ with now? what is the situation like compared with what _ with now? what is the situation like compared with what it _ with now? what is the situation like compared with what it was - with now? what is the situation like compared with what it was before? | with now? what is the situation like l compared with what it was before? it is important to recognise that this so-called — is important to recognise that this so—called humanitarian— is important to recognise that this so—called humanitarian corridor. is important to recognise that this so—called humanitarian corridor is| is important to recognise that this. so—called humanitarian corridor is a trickle _ so—called humanitarian corridor is a trickle of— so—called humanitarian corridor is a trickle of aid — so—called humanitarian corridor is a trickle of aid. so far _ so—called humanitarian corridor is a trickle of aid. so far we _ so—called humanitarian corridor is a trickle of aid. so far we think- trickle of aid. so far we think since — trickle of aid. so far we think since the _ trickle of aid. so far we think since the border— trickle of aid. so far we think since the border was - trickle of aid. so far we think. since the border was reopened trickle of aid. so far we think- since the border was reopened some 70 trucks— since the border was reopened some 70 trucks had — since the border was reopened some 70 trucks had been— since the border was reopened some 70 trucks had been allowed - since the border was reopened some 70 trucks had been allowed in. i 70 trucks had been allowed in. before — 70 trucks had been allowed in. before the _ 70 trucks had been allowed in. before the escalation - 70 trucks had been allowed in. before the escalation of - before the escalation of hostilities, _ before the escalation of hostilities, 100 - before the escalation of hostilities, 100 trucks i before the escalation of hostilities, 100 trucks a| before the escalation of i hostilities, 100 trucks a day before the escalation of - hostilities, 100 trucks a day were coming _ hostilities, 100 trucks a day were coming per— hostilities, 100 trucks a day were coming per day _ hostilities, 100 trucks a day were coming per day a_ hostilities, 100 trucks a day were coming per day. a tiny— hostilities, 100 trucks a day were coming per day. a tiny fraction i hostilities, 100 trucks a day were coming per day. a tiny fraction of the aid _ coming per day. a tiny fraction of the aid that— coming per day. a tiny fraction of the aid that is— coming per day. a tiny fraction of the aid that is necessary- coming per day. a tiny fraction of the aid that is necessary is- coming per day. a tiny fraction of| the aid that is necessary is getting on. the aid that is necessary is getting on we _ the aid that is necessary is getting on we have — the aid that is necessary is getting on~ we have to— the aid that is necessary is getting on. we have to solve _ the aid that is necessary is getting on. we have to solve for— the aid that is necessary is getting on. we have to solve for that i the aid that is necessary is getting on. we have to solve for that and i on. we have to solve for that and the fact— on. we have to solve for that and the fact that _ on. we have to solve for that and the fact that there _ on. we have to solve for that and the fact that there are _ on. we have to solve for that and the fact that there are many i on. we have to solve for that and | the fact that there are many parts of southern — the fact that there are many parts of southern gaza _ the fact that there are many parts of southern gaza that _ the fact that there are many parts of southern gaza that are still- of southern gaza that are still being — of southern gaza that are still being bombed. _ of southern gaza that are still being bombed. there - of southern gaza that are still being bombed. there are - of southern gaza that are still being bombed. there are no. of southern gaza that are still- being bombed. there are no safe zones _ being bombed. there are no safe zones for— being bombed. there are no safe zones for civilians _ being bombed. there are no safe zones for civilians to _ being bombed. there are no safe zones for civilians to go. - being bombed. there are no safe zones for civilians to go. it - being bombed. there are no safe zones for civilians to go. it is - being bombed. there are no safe zones for civilians to go. it is an i zones for civilians to go. it is an escalation— zones for civilians to go. it is an escalation or _ zones for civilians to go. it is an escalation or a _ zones for civilians to go. it is an escalation or a ground - zones for civilians to go. it is ani escalation or a ground invasion, where _ escalation or a ground invasion, where do — escalation or a ground invasion, where do innocent _ escalation or a ground invasion, where do innocent people - escalation or a ground invasion, where do innocent people go? i escalation or a ground invasion, . where do innocent people go? that escalation or a ground invasion, - where do innocent people go? that is something _ where do innocent people go? that is something that — where do innocent people go? that is something that we _ where do innocent people go? that is something that we have _ where do innocent people go? that is something that we have to _ where do innocent people go? that is something that we have to confront. i something that we have to confront. to your _ something that we have to confront. to your point — something that we have to confront. to your point about _ something that we have to confront. to your point about how _ something that we have to confront. to your point about how many - something that we have to confront. to your point about how many more | to your point about how many more lives, _ to your point about how many more lives, one _ to your point about how many more lives, one of— to your point about how many more lives, one of the _ to your point about how many more lives, one of the most— to your point about how many more lives, one of the most moving - lives, one of the most moving conversations _ lives, one of the most moving conversations i've _ lives, one of the most moving conversations i've had - lives, one of the most moving conversations i've had is - lives, one of the most moving conversations i've had is withi lives, one of the most movingi conversations i've had is with a colleague — conversations i've had is with a colleague who _ conversations i've had is with a colleague who said, _ conversations i've had is with a colleague who said, how - conversations i've had is with a colleague who said, how many| conversations i've had is with a - colleague who said, how many more lives witt— colleague who said, how many more lives will need — colleague who said, how many more lives will need to _ colleague who said, how many more lives will need to be _ colleague who said, how many more lives will need to be lost _ colleague who said, how many more lives will need to be lost before - lives will need to be lost before this comes _ lives will need to be lost before this comes to _ lives will need to be lost before this comes to an _ lives will need to be lost before this comes to an end, - lives will need to be lost before i this comes to an end, therefore, lives will need to be lost before - this comes to an end, therefore, for the sake _ this comes to an end, therefore, for the sake of— this comes to an end, therefore, for the sake of israelis _ this comes to an end, therefore, for the sake of israelis and _ the sake of israelis and palestinians, _ the sake of israelis and palestinians, we - the sake of israelis and palestinians, we can i the sake of israelis and . palestinians, we can break the sake of israelis and - palestinians, we can break this tragic—

palestinians, we can break this tragic circie _ palestinians, we can break this tragic circle of _ palestinians, we can break this tragic circle of violence? - palestinians, we can break this tragic circle of violence? nomi, when it comes _ tragic circle of violence? nomi, when it comes to _ tragic circle of violence? nomi, when it comes to hamas, - tragic circle of violence? nomi, when it comes to hamas, who l tragic circle of violence? nomi, i when it comes to hamas, who has power or influence over hamas? first power or influence over hamas? first and foremost. _ power or influence over hamas? first and foremost, qatar _ power or influence over hamas? f “sit and foremost, qatar has the most influence stop we very much hoping to see hostages being released. we have seen four on friday and monday. there is an expectation that more hostages are going to be released very soon. qatar probably have the most leverage over hamas, but there are other countries that also have relations with them, like turkey and egypt have been classically mediating in the past between hamas and israel. given that egypt borders with gaza and given that egypt occupied gaza from 1948 to 1967, they know the territory, the gaza strip, intimately. they have a very, very close... relationship with what

goes on there. they know exactly what goes on. so i think egypt will have to be involved in whatever happens. i think saudi arabia will have to be involved. i think you need the largest gulf country. i think the only way forward, really, will be for peace to be... to override war. if we see a peace process whereby there will be two states, a palestinian state in the west bank and gaza, and an israeli state, and if that peace process will be supported by the arab states, the arab peace initiative, which was a saudi initiative, and if the saudis will take the lead with the saudis will take the lead with the united states and israel on it, then at least that an endgame, we know where we are headed. that then at least that an endgame, we know where we are headed. that is a ve lona know where we are headed. that is a very long term _ know where we are headed. that is a very long term prospect. _ know where we are headed. that is a very long term prospect. i— know where we are headed. that is a very long term prospect. i think - know where we are headed. that is a very long term prospect. i think one | very long term prospect. i think one thing _ very long term prospect. i think one thing is _ very long term prospect. i think one thing is clear, that when the military— thing is clear, that when the military phase of this conflict ends. — military phase of this conflict ends, there is no going back to the pre—0ctober seven situation. there

has to— pre—0ctober seven situation. there has to be _ pre—0ctober seven situation. there has to be something different. the harsh— has to be something different. the harsh reality is that israel has tried — harsh reality is that israel has tried to — harsh reality is that israel has tried to manage the palestinian problem — tried to manage the palestinian problem over the last 15, 20 years through— problem over the last 15, 20 years through purely security means. with a very— through purely security means. with a very strong defence of the iron dome, _ a very strong defence of the iron dome, with aggressive policing and occupation of the west bank, containment of gaza. for some years, that policy— containment of gaza. for some years, that policy appeared to be successful in the sense that there was relative security in israel and some _ was relative security in israel and some of the arab neighbours started normalising relations, but i am afraid _ normalising relations, but i am afraid that _ normalising relations, but i am afraid that tragic atrocities that happened on the 7th of october shows that ultimately that policy failed. there _ that ultimately that policy failed. there needs to be a political track atongside — there needs to be a political track alongside the security track. it will take — alongside the security track. it will take many years, but it needs to start _ will take many years, but it needs to start at — will take many years, but it needs to start at the end of this military phase _ to start at the end of this military hase. , ., , . . , phase. needs to start immediately. i'm afraid phase. needs to start immediately. i'm afraid we _ phase. needs to start immediately. i'm afraid we have _ phase. needs to start immediately. i'm afraid we have run _ phase. needs to start immediately. i'm afraid we have run out - phase. needs to start immediately. i'm afraid we have run out of- phase. needs to start immediately. i'm afraid we have run out of time. | i'm afraid we have run out of time. thank you so much. thank you very much for coming, all of you, on newsnight. we are asking another

question. what does international law say about all this? joining me now isjudge chile eboe—osuji who was president of the international criminal court from 2018 to 2021. thank you so much for coming on newsnight, chile eboe—osuji. can i just ask you first, as the icc investigating what is happening in gaza right now? i investigating what is happening in gaza right now?— gaza right now? i would not know that, i am — gaza right now? i would not know that. i am no _ gaza right now? i would not know that, i am no longer— gaza right now? i would not know that, i am no longer at _ gaza right now? i would not know that, i am no longer at the - gaza right now? i would not know that, i am no longer at the icc. i that, i am no longer at the icc. evenif that, i am no longer at the icc. even if i were, i would not know because i was a judge. investigation happens on the prosecutorial site. but i can tell you that what we are seeing is really heartbreaking to seeing is really heartbreaking to see on both sides.— see on both sides. what is your assessment _ see on both sides. what is your assessment of _ see on both sides. what is your assessment of whether - see on both sides. what is your assessment of whether there . see on both sides. what is your. assessment of whether there are crimes being committed? how far does israel's right to defend itself go? definitely in an armed conflict, the

party that is attacked has a right to defend its self against the combatant that engaged in that attack. but a basic proposition in international law, international humanitarian law is that civilians must be spared in an armed conflict on both sides. civilians must be spared and there is no question of discriminating about who that civilian is. that is important to stress. what we are seeing is targeting from both sides, the effects of this war, this armed conflict in both israeli civilians and palestinian civilians in gaza. listening to what your... the interview you had earlier, one thing that keeps coming up, i understand

where this is coming from, as a human being, if yourfamily member has been killed in this kind of way or kidnapped, the passion will run high. but what is important for everyone to keep in mind is that the talk about wiping out a whole group of people, it is not allowed in international law to declare that you will take no quarters or you will exterminate a group. that is very, very important to keep in mind on both sides. very, very important to keep in mind on both sides-— on both sides. even if they are a u-rou on both sides. even if they are a group that _ on both sides. even if they are a group that is _ on both sides. even if they are a group that is a _ on both sides. even if they are a group that is a proscribed - on both sides. even if they are a l group that is a proscribed terrorist organisation by many countries? essen organisation by many countries? even if ou call organisation by many countries? even if you call somebody _ organisation by many countries? even if you call somebody a _ if you call somebody a terrorist group. if you engage in combat with them, that is one thing, but once it is not necessary to kill somebody who is shooting at you, the obligation is to arrest that person,

disarm them, and put them through a trial process, not to kill somebody because they hurt you in the past. again, international law does not allow that. , ., , allow that. sorry to interrupt, in terms of hamas, _ allow that. sorry to interrupt, in terms of hamas, is _ allow that. sorry to interrupt, in terms of hamas, is hamas - allow that. sorry to interrupt, in i terms of hamas, is hamas covered allow that. sorry to interrupt, in - terms of hamas, is hamas covered by international law? taking hostages, the deaths of civilians, as you say, these are crimes.— these are crimes. everybody is covered, these are crimes. everybody is covered. every _ these are crimes. everybody is covered, every human - these are crimes. everybody is covered, every human being . these are crimes. everybody is covered, every human being is covered, every human being is covered by international law. the difference really is that there are certain people that are recognised as legitimate combatants, wearing uniform, wearing insignia, respecting... if you do that any proper armed conflict, international law allows you to engage in an armed conflict, but if you do not do that, then you fall outside of international law's protection in the sense... not in the sense of being killed, but in the sense that you are not entitled to engage in

battle. some people are entitled to engage in battle. and if they are captured, they will become prisoners of war, to be traded or released at the end of the conflict. but others who engage in armed conflict as unlawful combatants will be subject to trial, they will be prosecuted for taking part in the armed conflict in that way. as opposed to somebody who is entitled to engage in an armed conflict if they are captured, they will not be prosecuted for taking part in the armed conflict, they will be taken prisoner as a prisoner of war. ifiliiiie prisoner as a prisoner of war. chile eboe-osuji. _ prisoner as a prisoner of war. chile eboe-osuji, thank _ prisoner as a prisoner of war. chile eboe-osuji, thank you _ prisoner as a prisoner of war. chile eboe—osuji, thank you very much for coming on the programme, very illuminating. crispin blunt has revealed he has been arrested in connection with a rape allegation. the conservative mp outed himself on social media after reports about an arrest of a parliamentarian. surrey police had confirmed only that it had arrested a man yesterday on suspicion of rape and possession of controlled substances. today mr blunt issued a statement saying the reports referred to him.

joe is here. and, joe, it doesn't usually happen like this, certainly not. what we have witnessed this evening is really a striking series of developments. unlike many other mp5 who have been arrested in recent years, unlike them, crispin blunt, as you say, has outed himself, named himself as a parliamentarian in the headlines. putting a statement online including these words. he has said, "i have now been interviewed twice in connection with this incident. the first time three weeks ago when i initially reported my concern over extortion. the second time was earlier this morning under caution following arrest. the arrest, he says, was unnecessary, as i remain ready to cooperate fully with the investigation that i am confident will end without charge. i have not been able to get through by phone to crispin blunt this evening, so it is not possible to understand what he means by those words, my concern over extortion, but i think it is clear that he does not deny the ——

does deny the allegations, and he seems to have initiated contact with the police. some would argue that this is particularly very crispin blunt because he is brutally honest. he has been radically up in recent years, certainly talking about his regular use of poppers, talking about the potential medicinal benefits of magic mushrooms, most controversially recently after a co ntroversially recently after a fellow controversially recently after a fellow mp was convicted of child sex abuse offences, mr blunt said that imran khan's conviction was a dreadful miscarriage ofjustice. he was criticised, retracted those statements, then repeated something very similar. he has faced controversy and been outspoken and radically on this before. and controversy and been outspoken and radically on this before.— radically on this before. and he has now been suspended _ radically on this before. and he has now been suspended by _ radically on this before. and he has now been suspended by the - now been suspended by the conservatives? he now been suspended by the conservatives?— now been suspended by the conservatives? he is now an independent _ conservatives? he is now an independent mp, _ conservatives? he is now an independent mp, he - conservatives? he is now an independent mp, he joins i conservatives? he is now an l independent mp, he joins this conservatives? he is now an - independent mp, he joins this ragtag bunch of 16 independent mps alongsidejeremy corbyn, diane alongside jeremy corbyn, diane abbott, alongsidejeremy corbyn, diane abbott, matt hancock, people who are independent for very different reasons. more of them now than the

lib dems, even though the lib dems have added a parliamentarian through the by—elections. this has restarted a debate around safeguarding staff in parliament. one trade union, prospect trade union, has said that if an mp is under investigation for violent or sexual offences, this is an allegation of rape, they should be banned from the parliamentary estate. mr blunt has agreed not to come to the estate. and he is, we should say, standing down at the next general election. for now, he has denied the allegations, he has not been charged with anything, and the police investigation continues. thank you. a grandmother held on bailfor seven years after being accused of fraud has said every part of her life has been "destroyed" by the experience. krista brown goes by the pseudonym the secret defendant on twitter, now known as x, and now for the first time has revealed her true identity. for months she's been

detailing herjourney through the criminaljustice system after being arrested in 2017 and charged three years later. the case against her was dropped last week after prosecutors said, "we will offer no evidence on all counts". in an exclusive interview with newsnight, the 51—year—old said she'd been through seven years of "hell" waiting for her case to come to trial, after pleading her innocence throughout. sima has been speaking to her about her assessment of thejudicial system. what were you arrested for? i was arrested for various charges to do with fraud, cheating the public revenue, money laundering, and fraud by false representation. what went through your mind when you were arrested? as much as it was horrifying what happened, i was thinking, they're going to... everyone... everyone, we all thought that they're going to realise this is a huge mistake. she's got no reason to arrest this woman. so the arrest was in 2017. january 2017, yeah. and then you were charged. they kept me on conditional bail. and then i didn't hear anything from them. i received a letter out of the blue, november 2017, to say that i was now released under investigation.

i was on unconditional bail. if i moved house, i had to let them know. but apart from that, i was free to do whatever, live my life or whatever. what was that like for you, being in a state of limbo, i guess? your life's in other people's control. your life's in other people's hands. it's completely... there's nothing you can do. and i think that that was one of the most frustrating things. i think if i felt like if i could just go knock on the court door and speak to a judge myself and take all my paperwork, it could be sorted out so much quicker. when i've spoken to the government about delays previously, i've been told that a lot of it is down to the backlog... ..pandemic. .. it's nothing to do with the pandemic. _ ..barrister strikes. doesn't all of that have an impact... it feeds into it, yeah. ..on how soon your case was sorted? and some might say, well, that is understandable. no, because you could use that as some of the... ..as some of the excuses, maybe justifications. but i got arrested in

2017, and i heard back that i was being charged in february 2020. the pandemic hadn't even started then, and it had taken them three years and nine... it took them three years and nine months to actually get my charges to me. you were charged in 2020. so when you were finally charged... finall . ., .., , ., . how did that make you feel? it totalled just under... it totalled between £550,000 and £600,000 altogether. it took my business, everything i had worked so hard for since 2008. i was a single mum that opened her own business, and it turned into this amazing multi—award winning building. we changed so many people's lives as employers. it was gone just like that, through no fault of my own. i couldn't have tried any harder. they were accusing you... of cheating the public revenues and not paying... tax. yeah, it was not paying...not filing the right amounts, not paying the right amounts, and not having paid employers ni at all for, like, a four—year period. i got a call out of the blue,

driving home from work one night, "oh, i've got some bad news, krista, you're going to get charged." and it wasjust, like, out the blue. like, to the point there was a pothole in the road and i was so upset i didn't see it and wrote off the front of my car. i was so shocked. so, i got home that night, i was hysterically crying. like, hysterically, i couldn't believe it. like, you think you're going to be all right and you think it's not going to affect you, but it does affect you. like, nobody can underestimate the emotional impact and the impact to your mental health of this journey. so, how many times was the case actually delayed? it's had three total adjournments for various reasons, different reasons each time. so, when did you find out that they were throwing out the court case? i got a call out of the blue last... on the 15th or something. something like that, 15th of october, from my solicitor. i was at work. and then he said, "it's all right," and he just burst into this emotional — and he's not emotional at all — and he literallyjust burst into this emotional, "we don't need our barrister because they've absolutely dropped all the charges. you've done it, krista. you've done it."

he was in tears. i was in tears. i slid down the wall, started howling. i think kids came running around because they thought something had happened to me. but i didn't even have any chance to process it because i was at work. i had to get up and deal with all these kids in the middle of a class, so... | tell me what impact... how hasn't it | impacted me? ..this whole ordeal has had on you. how hasn't it impacted me more than... i think the fact that ultimately i did get myjustice, it destroyed who i was. i'm a fraction of who i used to be because it impacts every area of your life — financially, mentally, physically. it's affected my body. i had savings to live on for a little while, but then there came a point that i had to go and get benefits. and yeah, that was very, very... that was the bit where i'd say i was broken to the point of destruction. i was destroyed at that point. there was nothing left of the old me at that point. you know, like, when you say rock bottom, i was under the rock. i was in the mud underneath the water underneath the rock, you know, like in a swamp. at that point, i can't even... i tried to kill myself

on the a12 one day. i didn't actually do it, but i was going to. and it was the thought of my children or other people being affected. i didn't want to die. i just wanted it all to stop because i'm only an ordinary mum. i'm just an ordinary single mum. like, i'm an ordinary person. i haven't got... i haven't got, like... i'm not a superhero. like, there's only so much people can take it. what's your assessment of the criminaljustice system as a result of what you've experienced? for people like me, ordinary working class people — i come from a council estate background, i grew up in care, like, i've got no access to assets or resources and stuff like that, it's just through people that i know — it's impossible. it's hard enough for somebody that's got the right things in place. a lot of people have said to me to chase for compensation. i don't want the money. it'd be like paying me back in my own blood money. like, what have i gone through to get that money? like, i should never have had to go through it in the first place. so, for me, i'm looking forward to the moment that i feel

like i can celebrate, i think is the honest answer. i'm not quite there yet. sima kotecha there talking to krista brown. we asked the hmrc for a statement, and they told us: "we are unable to comment on the tax affairs of identifiable individuals or businesses due to strict confidentiality laws." the crown prosecution service gave us this statement: now, it's nearly 50 years since they split up, nearly 43 years since john lennon was murdered, and almost 22 since the death of george harrison. but today the beatles announced they will release the last song

featuring all four members in a week's time.