to abuse her while she slept. "shame must change sides" — this became the mantra of gisele pelicot, the wife, mother and grandmother who waived her right to be anonymous and became a global icon. it's a case that has shocked millions worldwide and nearly destroyed a family. we speak to their daughter, caroline darian, about surviving a nightmare, her campaign to raise awareness about people being drugged against theirwill, chemical submission, and about losing the man she will never again call �*dad'. caroline, hello. hello. thank you so much for talking to me, talking to us. thank you. thank you for having me today.

last month, yourfather, dominique pelicot, was found guilty and he was sentenced to prison — he's now in prison — and, you know, the world was watching, but you were there and ijust wondered if you could take us first to that — that moment, how that was for you. he was found guilty. it took 20 years but he had already done, you know, did four years injail, so... but i'm not sure, you know, the verdict — the final verdict was, you know, what i was expected. so, you don't think your father's sentence was long enough? my father's sentence is, you know, is the right sentence but i'm more talking about the other people, the other criminals. when you know that the majority of them only took between three and ten years, to me, it's not enough. and how was your mother on the day? for her, it was kind of a relief. i mean, my mother is 72 years

old, so what she did was extraordinary. but i think for her, i don't want to talk for her, for sure, but i think for her, it was a relief. just, "it's over now. "this trial, it's over." and she had become an icon to a lot of people — you know, she'd become very famous as well, even though that wasn't her goal. applause. yes, as you said, an icon, and i think it's a gift, you know, for some other victims who were sexually abused. she said on the steps of the court she never regretted opening the doors of this trial. you know, she waived her right to be anonymous so society could see what was happening. i wondered for you what that was like — that decision for her to do this — because it's notjust going to be her life that then is opened and her name that is known.

you know, that was a decision that we took all together. the main reason why we have lifted the closure of this trial was really for the — all of those criminals to face up their crimes publicly, so that the shame can change sides. it was really, you know, the purpose and the objective right from the start. so you, your two brothers — there's three children... yeah. ..and your mother made the decision? of course. of course, my mum was the one who decided in the end. she is the — you know, she was the main victim and the recognised victim, you know? but we are all supportive, yeah. we are all supportive on that decision. and i was — and i must say that i was the one who was the most convinced right from the start. really? back — yeah. i mean, back, you know, to the beginning, november 2020. i knew that we went

through something special, horrible, but that we have to go through it with dignity and strength. you are launching your book here in the uk, which is called i'll never call him dad again. it's a really powerful read. i commend you for being able to put it down on the page. and you say so clearly in it there is a time before and there is a time after when you get a terrible piece of news. how can you describe how you found out what your father had been doing to your mother? it was a monday. i received that call from my mum on the evening. and... she rang your husband, is that right? yeah. the very first person that she contacted was my husband in the afternoon on november 2nd, 2020.

and she told him that her world has collapsed, but she — she needed some time to find the best way to announce it to her three children. and i was the first one she — who she decided to contact. and when i received this call, i thought that she was about to announce me that my father was dead or, you know, we were in the middle of the covid period — i thought that he was sick and about to die. when she announced me that she discovered in the morning that he was drugging herfor about ten years for different men, unknown people, to rape her, it was like an earthquake or like a tsunami in my own living room. i was so close from my father.

you can't, you know, imagine how it hurts. it is, you know, it's a — it was a nightmare. do you remember what you did or what you said? i remember that i shout — i shouted, i cried and i even insulted him. and yes, it was one of the worst moments in my life. and you write of your recollection of it that you remember looking at the clock. yeah, i do remember — i mean, i still remember, you know, it was 8:25pm. and at this moment of my life, you know, you lose what is a normal life.

and we were like a normalfamily. we were a united family, really close to each other. i was really close from my father. the discovery of this was not because she woke up or she discovered this, this was because he was caught... she — yeah — she... ..in a supermarket taking photos up the skirts of women and the police, i understand, then came to the home, took his computers and found this entire collection of images and videos and what he had been sharing and that's when they saw how many men had also come to abuse your mother. mmm. she was shown, you know, several pictures of her where she were raped with a different man each time. imean... and this was by the police?

by the — yeah, by the police officer. so she saw seven different pictures coming from the video from the — it was an extract. you come together with your brothers, who are also then told this information. you decide to go to be with your mother. and it is while you're in the south of france, you leave paris, you journey there, that you receive a telephone call from the police to come again to the police station because they had something else to show you. what was that? i was received by two police officers and they have to show me different pictures of me. i was assuming that it was about, you know, a sexual perversion. and when you arrived there, you were shown... and i was shown two pictures of me totally unconscious

with pants which is not mine. so, you know, i was in shock. did you recognise that it was you unconscious in the photo? right from the start, you know? i live what we call a kind of dissociation effect. i had some difficulties to recognise me right from the start. and then, the police officer told me, "but look, "madame, you have a brown mark on yourface." he told me, "it's you on those pictures, madame." because it matched. yes, it was matching. and then ijust — i, you know, i looked at those two pictures differently and... and you were just wearing

a top and some knickers? a top and pants and that's it. and i was laying down on my left side, like my mother on all of her videos and pictures. what do you think your father did to you? i know that he drugged me, probably for abuse — for sexual abuse — but i don't have any evidence. he has always denied. he has always denied but much more than that, he's a — he communicated different version. he told different versions each time. so he lied. do you think your father raped you? i think so. i'm convinced that he raped me, yes. have you thought that since you saw those photographs? obviously. definitely. he has, as you say, said different things at different times

but he's always said, if i look at the words... he is a sexual pervert. but he repeatedly has said, "i tell her straight "in the eyes i never touched her." he said in court, "caroline, i've never done anything "to you]. i don't believe him because he's always lying. there's nothing in you that thinks maybe... no, because, you know... even for gisele, even for my mother. you know, as long as you don't have, you don't have enough evidence, dominique is always lying. did you talk to your mother about it? right from the start. you know, i tried to tell my mum that i was convinced about, you know, the fact that i was drugged and probably raped. but for her, it was difficult to, i mean, to integrate. you know, she was raped more than 200 times by different people so for mum, i think it's difficult, you know, to have to integrate

all of that in one go. you know, you're also in this position of being the daughter of the torturer and the tortured. that's a terrible burden, to be honest, because i lost my dad and i have to go through this trial with my mum, beside my mum and my brothers. and you know, ourfamily will never be the same. i think one of your brothers said yourfamily�*s been annihilated. yeah. yeah, we've lost a part of something in court, you did scream at your father, at dominique pelicot, at one point. you said, "you'll die in lies, alone, alone in lies, "dominique pelicot. "i'll never come and see you,

never. "you will die alone like a dog." he replied, "we all die alone." and you replied, "you especially." and you had this outburst, you know. did it need to come out of you? did something in that space need to emerge? yes. because, you know, within the court, you are not supposed to talk, but it's so violent. and i knew that it was the very last time that i see him. you know that? i knew that. so it felt important to say? it was the very last step that he had a chance to say the truth. to you in that —— is there anything that he could've said to you in that moment, do you think? all the truth, the entire truth — even for my mum. but it didn't happen? no, it didn't happen. when you talked about being close to your father — i mean, your book's called i'll never call him dad again, you'vejust said you'll

never see him again — how can you think about your life? you know, can you think about your childhood? has it robbed you of that? so, when i look back, i don't really remember the father that i thought he was. i look straight to the criminal, to the sexual criminal he is. but you also have talked about him being a good father and supporting you and going cycling with you and supporting your dance ambitions. you know, to me, when i thought about dominique, i only see now someone who i don't know. it's an unknown person to me. it's a stranger. he's a stranger. and i know, like, i'm convinced that i was drugged

for being raped, i also know that he's one of the most important sexual criminals of the past 20 or 30 years, so there's a part of my life which is not existing any more. that part of your life not existing any more but where you are now and how you live your life with this knowledge now, how has it changed you day to day? it makes me the woman that i am now. this family affair strengthened who i am now. applause. i think the other thing to say is while your mother became a global name — in many ways an icon, someone people wanted to come and support, thousands of women outside the court, people lining up every day, mainly women — a lot of people might

not know your story. we just don't — we just have to bear in mind that she was raped because she was drugged. dominique used chemical submission to rape a wife, as he probably did the same thing to rape her daughter. the only difference between my mum and me, i don't have any evidence like she did. i think we just have to bear in mind that a lot of victims are not believed because there's no evidence, are not listened, are not supported. i'm very struck by something you said at the beginning where you said as a family, you decided to open the court to make sure that the world, in the end, notjust france, could see what was happening. you know, a huge cross—section

of society, of men, made up the 50 other men to dominique pelicot who were on trial, from ages in their 20s through to 60s, lots of different professions — a whole cross—section of society. your mum's mantra, some of the words she became famous for — and you said them yourself — was, "shame must change sides." have you been able to achieve that? have you been able to not feel shame? i'm not ashamed. i don't want to think that i'm dominique's daughter. i'm... i want to be proud of the rest of our family. i think we all have a responsibility to speak up. i suppose i asked the question because

when anything horrific happens, it's such a powerful emotion, shame. it can infect you almost immediately to be connected to somebody who had done these things, never mind being the daughter or the wife or the son. and it's such a powerful message that your family are promoting. and i wondered for anyone who was watching, who was struggling to not feel shame — even though they know they shouldn't — how would you perhaps advise them to get through that feeling or to not feel like that? because that is how you can make yourself feel, it's how society can make you feel. you know, as a daughter, i have the dna of dominique and the main reason why i'm so engaged, you know, for some other victims, invisible victims, it's also,

for me, a way to put a real distance with this guy. i'm totally different from dominique. what is your view as to why he did it? i think he's — he was always a sexual pervert. always. there's no way you can wake up in the morning, saying, "ok, i'm going to drug my wife for rape her." it doesn't make any sense. so, i think, yeah, there is two dominiques coexisting, you know, in him. you decide your own, you know, journey, your own life and what you do in your own life. so he decided to choose the dark side. and it has transpired, post—trial, yourfather attempted to rape a young female estate agent in 1999.

so these crimes go back for over 20 years and don't just concern your mother. you also write in the book about some of his missions — his failed missions — and some of the things you found out during the police investigations and you say at one point, "i'm looking down a well, "wondering how many women my father has raped". how many are there? i don't know. but, i mean, they are all invisible, so that's why i'm so engaged. i remember the day after the verdict. people, on the day of it — a lot of people on social media are very engaged with this story, were calling him a monster and then, other people were writing, "no, he's a real person. "he's not a monster. "this isn't a made—up thing." i mean, you may say that'sjust

talking about language but i wonder as the daughter of dominique pelicot and the daughter of gisele pelicot, what do you make of that? i don't know if he's a monster but he perfectly knew what he did. he's not sick. he did everything perfectly with his own mind — consciously, i mean. do you think he should die in prison? sure. he should die in prison. he is a dangerous man. he is dangerous. there's no way he can go out. no way. and when you say he's not sick, you know, there were those men alongside him who had family members, wives, girlfriends, their mothers, their fathers — some of whom, as i said, are appealing. you know, it's the largest rape trial in france.

what do you think you can say about society after this — and your own country, perhaps — if there is something specific, or maybe its society generally? the only question i want to ask is how do we educate ourselves, you know, about sexual abuse? we need to give more, to open the dialogue with our children. i have a son who is ten years old. does he know, your son, what's happened? 0nlyjust because you've brought him up? yeah. we told him the entire truth. because he had a strong relationship with his grandparents, didn't he? he was — he loved his grandfather. you know, but we didn't want to lie. so, we found the right word to explain to a six—year—old son, to a six—year—old child that he will never see him again.

and your charity, your organisation, tell me — tell us all — what you want to do with it. we've been trying to drive awareness of what is in reality chemical submission, to make better understand that it's not limited to ghb, also known as the date rape drug. but it's more than that. it's... it's coming from the family's medicine cabinet. painkillers, it's sedatives. combining and using things from the pharmacy? it's all of that. it's medication. it's not mdma, cocaine. it's — it's a minor part of it. and also, you know, in more than a0%, the victim know their sexual abuser. it's coming from the inside. how is your mother doing at the moment? is she looking to the future?

how is she? a lot of people are thinking of her, perhaps, and wondering. she's... i don't want to talk for her but i think she's recovering, you know, from this ordeal. and for you, you're going to focus on your work that you've talked about here. and i suppose it's important to stress that, you know, the love of your brothers, your husband — this has been able to help you survive this. that's the way i'm able to move forward, really. and your little boy. of course. my son, my lovely son. for you now, when you look to your future, how does it look? you know, i'm someone who really loves life. i've got a lot of projects.

so, you know, i see it positively and i want optimistic, so everything should be positive. optimistic, so everything should be... caroline, thank you very, very much for talking to me. thank you.

hello there. it's looking pretty chilly as we head into this weekend. we're importing some colder air to the south of the uk from the near continent around this large area of high pressure, which has brought pretty benign weather for the past week or so. a lot of dry weather continues into this weekend. like i mentioned, it will be turning colder and there will be some morning mist and fog, some dense fog around, which could linger through the day for england and wales. this big area of high pressure is bringing the fine, unsettled weather but we've got this plume of colder air to the south of us being drawn up on a very gentle southerly breeze. so, for saturday then, it's a cloudy start for many. some sunshine from the word go for northern scotland. more of a breeze around northern and western areas through the irish sea, so that will help break up the cloud here, so we should see some sunshine for parts of wales, northern england, northern ireland, northern scotland. but i think for large parts of central, southern and eastern england, it will stay rather grey and gloomy with some murkiness and only 4 or 5 degrees — it will feel quite cold —

but a little less cold across the northwest of scotland. but with that colder air in place, saturday night will be a cold one. we'll see, ithink, a bit more of a widespread frost and some dense mist and fog patches across england and wales. very little change to the pressure pattern as we head through sunday but this weather front will try to edge into northwestern areas but it won't get far because it's bumping up against high pressure. so, a cold, frosty start with some fog around, which could be slow to clear for england, certainly central and eastern parts. the best of the sunshine, again, across northern and western areas. this weather front will bring some rain to western scotland and northern ireland into the afternoon. temperatures here 10 degrees, where we have some less cold air, but for most, it's a chilly day — 3—8 celsius. sunday night much the same — rather cloudy, a few gaps in the cloud allowing temperatures to fall where we see the gaps. this is where we're going to see frost down to —2, —3 degrees but less cold for western scotland and northern ireland as that weather front moves in. the weather front moves away and we stay in a benign pressure pattern, though, through monday and tuesday but from midweek, we start to see high pressure retreating

and that will allow lower pressure to begin to move in off the atlantic, so there are some changes to the weather as we push towards the end of the new week. so, the short term — it remains quite cloudy and cool with limited sunshine and then, it's more unsettled and a little less cold by the end of the week.

this is bbc news. live from washington. the israeli cabinet votes to approve the gaza ceasefire and hostage agreement after a meeting that lasted more than six hours. prime minister benyamin netanyahu says the first hostages are expected to be released as early as sunday. and deadly air strikes in gaza.

the palestinian agency says that 116 palestinians have been killed since the deal was announced. hello, i'm ros atkins. welcome to a bbc news special programme on the gaza ceasefire deal which the israeli cabinet has approved this evening. it's the first phase of a a deal which, if implemented in full, will end the 15 month war in gaza. their meeting lasted more than six hours, with some ministers who threatened to resign arguing the agreement rewards hamas. the first hostages are due to be released as early as sunday. in return, israel says it will release dozens of palestinian prisoners. they include some detainees as young as 16. hamas will return 33 israeli hostages over six weeks. these pictures are from egypt where trucks are waiting to bring aid into gaza. under the deal israel will allow 600 trucks into gaza every day — that's 12 times more than at the moment.