tv The Context BBC News January 23, 2025 8:30pm-9:01pm GMT
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hello, i'm christian fraser, here with sumi somaskanda. this is the context, live from washington dc, on bbc news. this is our special addition. president trump tells the world economic forum in davos that global oil prices should be lowered to end the war in ukraine. in the run—up to the election, donald trump told supporters he would end the war in ukraine on his first day in office, if not before. it is clear now, as it surely was back then, that it will take many more months to solve. the president said he is keen to meet vladimir putin. but he has been taking a more confrontational tone. he has warned on social
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media that he will be forced to impose more tariffs if the kremlin won't deal. and he told leaders at the world economic forum today that they need to cut the price of oil to force the russians to the table. if the price came down, the russia ukraine wari would end immediately. right now, the price is high enough thatl the war will continue. you got to bring down the oil price, you're . going to end that war. putin's spokesman, dmitry peskov said they are "waiting for signals that are yet to arrive". their team at the un say they want to see what president trump wants in the deal before taking any further steps. the ukrainians are warming to the idea. starved of resources, by europe's flagging supply lines, a ceasefire, pending negotiation could offer welcome relief. asked for his reaction to donald trump's warning to russia, the ukrainian foreign minister had this to say. it was a really strong message, and strong signal.
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we need to increase pressure on russia, and force russia to negotiate. we need usa leadership, we need more engagement of the usa. let's bring in rose gottemoeller, former deputy secretary general of nato. rose, very good to have you back on bbc news. you are donald trump say a little earlier he wants to meet with vladimir putin. dimitri putz goff said they were waiting for signals. what do you think russia takes that message —— dimitri peskov? it’s russia takes that message -- dimitri peskov?— dimitri peskov? it's clear that each man _ dimitri peskov? it's clear that each man is — dimitri peskov? it's clear that each man is trying _ dimitri peskov? it's clear that each man is trying to - dimitri peskov? it's clear that each man is trying to be - each man is trying to be stronger and more of the bully to the other. i do think that's very important as a way of setting the negotiating table, because from the outset, it was clear that for mr trump, it was important to come out of this war looking like the problem solver and not a loser. famously, putin said he wanted to impose defeat on ukraine,
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nato and the united states. he needs to get the signal early on that trump will have none of that. ~ ., . , on that trump will have none of that. ~ ., ., , , on that trump will have none of that. ~ ., .,, , , ., that. who has the upper hand here? at _ that. who has the upper hand here? at the _ that. who has the upper hand here? at the moment, - that. who has the upper hand here? at the moment, trump that. who has the upper hand - here? at the moment, trump has a lot of momentum. _ here? at the moment, trump has a lot of momentum. he's - here? at the moment, trump has a lot of momentum. he's really i a lot of momentum. he's really come on the back of a strong signalfrom the us come on the back of a strong signal from the us electorate that they want him in office. he is the man on the rise of the moment. for president putin, he's been in this war for almost three years. he has maintained a strong stance throughout. he's always put a very brave face on things, including his economic crisis. he hasn't wavered from a strong stance himself. but it is trump was the moment it is the moment. was the moment it is the moment-— was the moment it is the moment. �* ., ., moment. bringing down global rices, moment. bringing down global prices. what — moment. bringing down global prices, what is _ moment. bringing down global prices, what is the _ moment. bringing down global prices, what is the sense - moment. bringing down global prices, what is the sense that l prices, what is the sense that could end that war?— prices, what is the sense that could end that war? well, it is a very direct — could end that war? well, it is
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a very direct analysis! - could end that war? well, it is a very direct analysis! we - could end that war? well, it is a very direct analysis! we are | a very direct analysis! we are accustomed to seeing this from donald trump. to be honest, i'm not an economist on energy and i can't say for sure, but it is a clear signal that he is going to be pressuring putin and the russians at a time when they managed to escape a lot of sanctions by their great market approach. i will note that the team of biden and their last day really rammed a number of sanctions. oiland day really rammed a number of sanctions. oil and gas producers, we'll see if trump has more up his sleeve. the pressure could still be raised was a , ., pressure could still be raised was a . pressure could still be raised wasa ,, ., ., ., pressure could still be raised wasa ., w, , ,., was a you want nato members to send 5% was a you want nato members to spend 5% of— was a you want nato members to spend 5% of gdp _ was a you want nato members to spend 596 of gdp on _ was a you want nato members to spend 596 of gdp on defence. - spend 5% of gdp on defence. what message do you think he is sending to nato? the?
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what message do you think he is sending to nato?_ sending to nato? they seem to resent sending to nato? they seem to present not _ sending to nato? they seem to present not as _ sending to nato? they seem to present not as a _ sending to nato? they seem to present not as a ceiling - sending to nato? they seem to present not as a ceiling but - sending to nato? they seem to present not as a ceiling but as. present not as a ceiling but as a floor. even hesitant about spending this defence. —— even germany. like it in the gulf donald trump, i think this of a negotiating process. i would not be surprised to see nato in an upcoming summit this year. but they will look for ways to negotiate with mr trump over that 5% number. i negotiate with mr trump over that 596 number.— negotiate with mr trump over that 596 number. i do also want to ask about — that 596 number. i do also want to ask about one _ that 596 number. i do also want to ask about one question - that 596 number. i do also want to ask about one question of. to ask about one question of domestic policy here in the us, rose, of pete hegseth. it will go through the full senate on a vote. you think he is qualified for the post? to vote. you think he is qualified for the post?— vote. you think he is qualified for the post? to be honest with ou, i for the post? to be honest with you. i have _ for the post? to be honest with you, i have read _ for the post? to be honest with you, i have read his— for the post? to be honest with you, i have read his biography. | you, i have read his biography. i've read the concerning reports about drinking and so forth. i have my own private concerns, but whether he is
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capable of serving as the secretary of defence is a question of the senators. i have to say i'm not wrestling to the same degree. i will say i've had concerns about his reports on his behaviour. rose, thank you _ reports on his behaviour. rose, thank you for— reports on his behaviour. rose, thank you forjoining _ reports on his behaviour. rose, thank you forjoining us. - reports on his behaviour. rose, thank you forjoining us. we - thank you forjoining us. we just heard that the republican senator is going to vote no. they can lose three, but they still need the vote ofjd vance. this vote is not coming until friday afternoon. if i'm pete hegseth, i want to vote now. i think aside from the really bad stories, a lot of people are very split about hegseth. as an army officer, i think it's wonderful he's had boots on the ground experience. people would say he's a soldier, he's young and
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he's a soldier, he's young and he knows how things should run. on the flip side, he has virtually no management experience. he has one of the most difficultjobs in the federal government. i think personally for me, it's not so much the story that is bad, i just think he lacks the experience. despite may be personally good history as a soldier. ., , , ., , soldier. the one issue that is concerning — soldier. the one issue that is concerning to _ soldier. the one issue that is concerning to senators - - soldier. the one issue that is concerning to senators - and j soldier. the one issue that is| concerning to senators - and i concerning to senators — and i was listening to democratic veteran senator — saying the vetting by the white house is far too narrow, putting on a man who will run the most powerful military in the world and we don't have enough detail in his character. i and we don't have enough detail in his character.— in his character. i think to take a step _ in his character. i think to take a step back- in his character. i think to take a step back from - in his character. i think to i take a step back from that, this is bizarre. it's truly strange. i see the point that he was a soldier. lots of people in the united have been soldiers. most of them we will all agree should not go
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straight to that to running the defense department. the idea that we are here as a nation in the republican senators will know that this man has no business running the department of defense, most of them walk the plank and vote for him anyway. maybe not enough to get them through, maybejust them through, maybe just enough. them through, maybejust enough. it is a real statement on how far the country and the republican party that's governing it have moved not just towards the right, but towards the truly strange and dangerous. the other thing i would say is we were talking about his leadership. pete hegseth does have leadership excreted. he ran two nonprofits to burnish his image. this is not an auspicious image. i guess if you look at some of the opposition, who has been more controversial... it will also be a testament of testing
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donald trump's influence in congress. donald trump's influence in congress-— congress. it's possible that the' nomination _ congress. it's possible that the' nomination is - congress. it's possible that the' nomination is the - the' nomination is the equivalent of the matt gaetz nomination. no one thought it would get this far. gaetz dropped out within a matter of days. it possible that the point was to tee up someone who would not get confirmed so whoever replaces him sales through. whoever replaces him sales throu~h. ~ ., ., ., , through. who would that be? probably somebody _ through. who would that be? probably somebody with - through. who would that be? | probably somebody with more complex experience.— probably somebody with more complex experience. they have confirmed _ complex experience. they have confirmed john _ complex experience. they have confirmed john ratcliff - complex experience. they have confirmed john ratcliff this - confirmed john ratcliff this afternoon. cia director, big role to play in the middle east. just a file quick word that donald trump wants to meet vladimir putin immediately. are we talking the next few weeks, helsinki style? i we talking the next few weeks, helsinki style?— helsinki style? i doubt many eo - le helsinki style? i doubt many people have _ helsinki style? i doubt many people have an _ helsinki style? i doubt many people have an idea. - helsinki style? i doubt many people have an idea. i- helsinki style? i doubt many people have an idea. i have l helsinki style? i doubt many i people have an idea. i have not been pleasantly surprised by a lot recently. the fact that
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trump did not sell out ukraine on the first day i think is great. but that's not super encouraging to me. like what david said, i am cautiously optimistic that donald trump seemed slightly more confrontational towards russia. it always did... confrontational towards russia. it always did. . ._ it always did... crosstalk there is a _ it always did... crosstalk there is a feeling _ it always did... crosstalk there is a feeling that - it always did... crosstalk there is a feeling that he i it always did... crosstalk | there is a feeling that he was very tough on china and easy on russia his first term, so i'm cautiously optimistic. hopefully will putin a higher standard than before. he did say the ukrainian president said he's ready to make a deal, so... crosstalk they moved as well. they seem to want to know. we'll see who that goes. around the world and across the uk. you're watching bbc news.
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you might recall this. on inauguration day, with just hours left in office, joe biden signed a swathe of pre—emptive pardons for members of his own family. fearing, and perhaps with some merit, that they would be subject to future congressional inquiries and prosecution. donald trump said on inauguration day that he intended to put an end to the weaponisation of government, but in his first sit—down interview with fox news last night, suggested it might have been a mistake thatjoe biden didn't pardon himself. this guy went around - giving everybody pardons. and you know, the funny thing — maybe the sad thing — _ is he didn't give l himself a pardon. and if you look at it, - it all had to do with him. i mean, the money went to him. but what of the pardons donald trump has issued? the first executive order he signed on monday night pardoned 1,500 people convicted for their involvement in january 6th.
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the decision sits uncomfortably with some of the president's republican allies, and it has been criticised by the police unions and the courts. the bbc�*s analysis editor ros atkins has more. january 6th, 2021 looked like the end of donald trump's political career. over 1,500 of his supporters would be charged for actions including attempting to overthrow the government, assaulting police officers and obstructing the certification of the election result. but it was far from the end. and on the campaign trail, donald trump signalled he was considering pardoning those convicted. on precisely who vice president jd vance said recently... in many cases, that's exactly what happened. on the day
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he returned to power, donald trump called the january 6th prisoners hostages, which they aren't. and here at the white house, he pardoned almost all of them. others had their sentences commuted, which means they'll be released. but their convictions remain on the record. one of them is stewart rhodes, founder of the far right militia group the oath keepers. he received 18 years for trying to overthrow the overthrow the government. another is jacob chansley, whose image became closely associated with the riot. i got the news from my lawyer when i was at the gym, and i walked outside and i screamed "freedom" at the top of my lungs, and then gave a good native american war cry. then there's the former leader of the far—right group, the proud boys. henry enrique tarrio was serving 22 years also for planning to overthrow the government. now he's received a full pardon. and since his release, he's claimed... many others involved have been pardoned, too, and the outrage from
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some is palpable. one police officer who was attacked on january the 6th says... the biggest police union, which endorsed trump during the election, said the pardon sent a sent a dangerous message, and one legal analyst says that the move corrupts the rule of law and rewrites history. donald trump dismisses such claims. he argues all the cases against him were politically motivated, and for him, these january the 6th pardons reinforce his message that the justice system can be political and unjust. it's a claim his critics fear will apply to him in his second term, according to npr. trump himself has made more than 100 threats to prosecute or punish perceived enemies. across the road from the capitol building is the supreme court, which recently gave presidents partial immunity from criminal prosecution. law and politics have always, to some degree, been intertwined in america. but on the day that power changed hands, we saw the extent to which that's now the case. in december, joe biden pardoned his son, hunter, who was facing sentencing for two criminal cases. then, minutes before he left office, he pre—emptively pardoned a number of people, including other members of his family and members of the house committee that
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investigated january sixth. investigated january the 6th. he referenced concern about politically motivated prosecutions after watching this play out. politico reported that both presidents on the same day stretched the pardon power to new, questionable frontiers in wildly different ways. and on his return to power, there's one word that donald trump has been using a lot. and i will win for you. we are going to win like never before. l right now, donald trump is winning. he's president. and his political success rests in part on a sense of grievance that america's institutions are against him and can't be trusted. but with each attack on the justice system. but with each attack on the justice system, with each pardon, faith in the fairness of american justice is being tested,
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and the distinction between law and politics becomes harder to make out. . you caught us! crosstalk north carolina. known as the people of the dark water, and it goes on to say the tribes members were descendents and it looks as if it in order to recognise... looks as if it in order to recognise. . .— looks as if it in order to recognise... looks as if it in order to recounise... ., , recognise... hears some live -ictures recognise... hears some live pictures in — recognise... hears some live pictures in the _ recognise. .. hears some live pictures in the oval- recognise... hears some live pictures in the oval office. . pictures in the oval office. he's obviously talking to the media. maybe dive into that a little later, but let's pick up where we were.— little later, but let's pick up where we were. talking about those who _ where we were. talking about those who are _ where we were. talking about those who are given _ where we were. talking about those who are given pardons. | among released was stewart rhodes, founder of the oath keepers militia. he was jailed for 18 years for sedition. his sentence was commuted by the president, monday night, and he was released three years into his sentence. within house of his release, he was back at the scene of the crime, meeting lawmakers
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at the us capitol. so what more is he after? i don't want to relitigate the case, but i do want to ask you about enrique tarrio, who's been freed from his sentence, 22 years for sedition. he's called for "retribution" — what would retribution look like for you? accountability and justice. i want the two police officers we caught red handed with video proof lying on the stand — that's harry dunn and officer lazarus — i want them charged with perjury. and i also want the prosecutors or put them up to it charged with subordination of perjury, and conspiracy to commit perjury. norm pattis is a lawyer who has defended several rioters, including zachary rehl and joseph biggs — two former leaders of the proud boys group sentenced to 15—17 years in prison.
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he killed witnesses, including the mother of a four—year—old. if you want to talk about public threat, that's the threat. what happened on january the 6th 2021 was obviously unfortunate. there was some violence in my view is the violence, while extraordinary, was sought with extraordinary, was sought with extra ordinary vengeance. the justice department had a right to make a point. this will never be tolerated again. i think they overdid it and i was relieved to see my clients pardoned. i'm not going to justify their conduct. i just think the consequences were too draconian to sit well with me. i've heard interviews between you and your clients in the recent days calling for representation, but these men were not put injail representation, but these men were not put in jail by representation, but these men were not put injail byjoe biden. they are charged by the fdi by a jury of their peers. —— convicted. surely you'd
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