pentagon the potomac river. the pentagon is - to — the potomac river. the pentagon is - to the _ the potomac river. the pentagon is to the north of it, to isjust to the north of it, to the — isjust to the north of it, to the _ of— isjust to the north of it, to the _ of the - the northwest of the airport for that— the northwest of the airport for that very, very close for the — for that very, very close for the it— for that very, very close for the it has— for that very, very close for the it has a very the it has a heliport very close _ the it has a heliport very close to _ the it has a heliport very close to the airport. trying to all the traffic in the weave all the traffic in the correct _ weave all the traffic in the correct directions for landing the different roadways at on the different roadways at reagan _ on the different roadways at reagan and to keep the helicopters away from them is a helimnters awav from them, is a balancin- helimnters awav from them, is a _ - balancing operation. ? helicopters away from them is a balancing operation. but real balancing operation. but because _ real balancing operation. but because the demands reagan real balancing operation. but becaus are e demands reagan real balancing operation. but becaus are so emands reagan real balancing operation. but becaus are so high tds reagan real balancing operation. but becaus are so high it's reagan real balancing operation. but becaus are so high it's reallyigan airport are so high it's really on airport are so high it's really _ on all- airport are so high it's really _ on all the - high—pressure on all the controllers. they do a 7517555725; 7777777777777"??? m at ni-ht—time, fiffiififjf 7777—77 remember, this happened at night, — remember, this happened at night, in _ remember, this happened at night, in the complete even 7 darkness, even though the visibility— darkness, even though the visibility was good it was viziijilit "a dd ', "a and visib'rlitywafl'fifid’itwas darkness and the controllers because _ darkness and the controllers because of the tight spaces in - they— because of the tight spaces in they were which they operate were pointing out to

7—' - m the aircraft inbound, including the one aircraft inbound, including the _ one the _ aircraft inbound, including the one the inbound and directin- the 7 and directing the pilots import and directing the pilots where — import and directing the pilots where to— import and directing the pilots where to look for the import and directing the pilots where to lo that rthe traveling helicopters that were traveling this helicopters that were traveling - this is _ helicopters that were traveling this is night—time, and aircraft have anti—collision beacons and they navigation lights on them. 77 only only trouble is is that the only trouble is is that this— the only trouble is is that this is— the only trouble is is that this is at— the only trouble is is that this is at low and there this is at low level and there are lights on both banks of the river, — are lights on both banks of the river, the _ are lights on both banks of the river, the lights of the city, the — river, the lights of the city, the lights of the had a helicopter pilot could look out - window _ helicopter pilot could look out window and say to the helicopter pilot could look out wir that and say to the helicopter pilot could look out wir that yes, ay to the helicopter pilot could look out wir that yes, iy to the helicopter pilot could look out wir that yes, i think1e helicopter pilot could look out wir that yes, i think i a —: the aircraft and have the aircraft and site is lookin- at except is looking at the wrong one or— except is looking at the wrong one or a — except is looking at the wrong one or a of lights he is the ai77 i is the aircraft. as 2 is the aifiwal the usa - the usa particularlyl =55 §h5 hi: gamma 5 has 55555 5h5' 5555 5555555545 _ has been i 55555 5h5' 5555 5555555545 has been taking washington has been taking risks— washington has been taking risks for— washington has been taking risks for years and it's come back— risks for years and it's come back to _ risks for years and it's come back to bite them. gil�*ijfi’r’ 5 point gm“? �* point that gtfi�*7 �* point that we gth�*7 �* point that we learn hhhh77 �* point that we learn from president trump's press is that they have mnference is that they have mnferente is that they have 11: the victims mnferehte is that they have 11: the victims of

collision but he did say this collision but he did say there were individuals from other 7 7 other countries several other countries involved there were some champion figure skaters we do expect 7 we do expect to7 that and we do expect to get that in about an hour as the nationality of some of to the nationality of some of those individuals who lost their lives. back over to you, matthew. their lives. back over to you, matthew— their lives. back over to you, matthew. ., ., ., ., ., matthew. you have to go for the next few minutes _ matthew. you have to go for the next few minutes . david - matthew. you have to go for the next few minutes . david is i next few minutes but david is still here with us and let us the i know you have listened communications with the to the communications with'the and donald trump ple 6ty77 a"; 25 t: 7 : plentygg ,,:: hui: plenty of comments about carer pour carer your obsewations you; t:i%’57 f" 7 you 7heard those where you heard those exchanges? i where you heard those exchanges?— where you heard those exchanges? where you heard those exchanaes? ~ ., c, exchanges? i know that the american — exchanges? i know that the american air _ exchanges? i know that the american air traffic - exchanges? i know that the american air traffic controll american air traffic control system notjust locally american air traffic control system not just locally at has been under m - ressure for a considerable pressure for a time and the predictions long titueaodthe predictions the federal investigation, by the federal investigation, faa the flight the faa and the flight safety foundation which is in international

american—based international organisation they've all been predicting that most aviation disaster �* aviation disaster that disaster aviation disaster that america will have is exactly hmhheh hh'hh hhhh 'hhhhehhh 77 kind of hmh“? hh'hh hhhh '%hhh=hhh 77 kind of disaster. they hh'h hf'he i�*f h'hhhhh“ thhh 777777777777 it and hh'h hh'hh hh hh'hhhhhr thhh it and enough, predicted it and sure enough, here we you have been controllers and c7o ntroll7e rs controllers a re controllers are under too the controllers are under too much pressure overamerica from says that this is and went from says that this is his fault and gigsfgggdecessor's fault and obama, well, yes i barack obama, well, yes i suppose you put it down 711-7— them but one of the things te them but hhh ef the ”was ~ , ~ ~ , ~ , , ~ that ta them but aae af the ”aa? ~ , ~ ~ , ~ , , ~ that the ta taaaa bat aaa ah taa ”aa? ~ , ~ ~ , ~ , , ~ that the aviation is that the federal aviation administration is the provider of air traffic it a of air traffic control, it is a government agency unlike what we have here. we have semi running a semi private outfit running our air traffic control and in america, it is a government it needs overnment

agency. it needs government funds. if trump is set on small government, he will de—funded the further in this risk the faa further in this risk will get worse and certainly will get worse and it certainly will get worse and it certainly will get worse and it certainly will get better. will get worse and it certainly will . get better.— will get worse and it certainly will. get better. will not get better. does make ou ou will not get better. does make you _ you hear i will not get better. does make you _ you hear a i you nervous when you hear a president almost prejudging the results of an investigation and rgegsgltszof an investigation and fingers at the 77 pilot, the helicopter pilot, pointing the fingers at air traffic controllers? it does make me nervous but _ controllers? it does make me nervous but - i _ controllers? it does make me. nervous but - i - that nervousbut theh ! suspect that knows that this is everybody knewsrthat this is we expect from everybody knewsrthat this is we expect from donald what we expect from donald trump. and therefore, i think the in the field will the experts in the field will not be taking too much notice hart-staking too much hptice he has got the power. however, he has got the power. he fund the faa properly 77 {fanang 77 77 b’f'u’nagarr’ 777 77 b’f'u’naarrh; 7 77 {ragga 7if7he7th7ihks77 7 are hiring all the wrong whatever 7 7 7—7 7 whataver it is a stub people, whatever it is a stub yes this thing about diversity, yes this thing about and says, the reason diversitu aaa a3e tha aamn we diversity aaa a3“ tha aasaa we got diversitu aaa a3e tha aasaa we got good air why wehaveo�*t got good air controllers is traffic controllers isrbecause . . ., are

traffic controllers isrbocauso . . ., are on traffic controllers isrbecause . , a are on diversity. they are hard on diversity. we don't have or this actually, wedon't have or this doesn't have enough america doesn't have enough controllers. that is real just as ou concluded problem. gustasogeuoo-aaaaaa sentence, problem. gsetasaueueooeluded - sentencmfi problem. gsetasaueueooeluded - sentence, the former i problem. gsetasaueueooeluded - sentence, the former us i chief has slammed transport chief has slammed donald trump quote, despicable attacks over the crash reaction coming in almost immediately to some of the things that donald some ofthe things that donald said in that news trump said in that news conference. tell me more about �* investigators will actually to 77 to the 77 to the b7ottom of what get tgozthe bottom of what happened. get tethe bottom of what happened. the get tiozthe bottom of what happened. the facts of happened. i think and no 77 777.3753 ho doubt they will and there's no doubt about it as you can they will and there's no doubt abta itas you can ”727 7 77 77 7 777 77 they will and there's no doubt abta numberj can ”727 7 77 77 7 777 77 they will and there's no doubt abta number ofan =hh17 7 77 77 7 777 77 they will and there's no doubt abc a number of agencies 7 77 77 7 77 7 77777 be taking 77 be taking pgrt in this would be taking part in this put the leader of the is the investigatian'isthe natibnal safety board and will their experts they will have their experts trying to �* black boxes

trying to recover black boxes on the aircraft. i'm sure -e ——— equipment. and militarvg77" 7 7 has equipment. and militarg77777 7 7 has on it but they helicopter has on it but they may be able to download details 7 the and so they from the software and so they can find out a great deal of from the software and so they can �* aboutta great deal of from the software and so they can �* about exactlyt deal of from the software and so they can �* about exactly what of from the software and so they can �* about exactly what the data about exactly what the aircraft was doing and this aircraft was doing and at this point, we have a lot of agint. we, have, a lasts-f data hhhhhhh'hhhhh'hh what agint. we, have, a lgtggf data 7777 7777 77 7 what the agint. we, have, a lgtggf data 77777 7777 77 7 what the aircraft was about what the aircraft was in their flying on the doing in their flying on the �*visibility dark night in clear visibility earls night in. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ , was heading north -=: the area and 7 the area and they're7 up the area and they're . to continue or expecting to continue more or in the northern direction on a runway on on a runway which is orientated towards the north. because reagan was so busy and because reagan was so busy trying to take off from the

runwa , the actuall same runway, the actually asked if they could take a different runway, one which crosses the runway, one which crosses the runway that he had been promised. crosses it from promised. which crosses it from the right. so we are to north a little bit g and he said yes, i can see more and he said yes, i can see it, i can see the and z= -: 727—777-7 77m7 77 7 fine we accept that's fine and we can accept that. and was he that. and what happened was he continued a little bit further north the potomac and turned to line—up the final left to line-up on the final and is left to line-up oh the fihal and is at that point, approach and is at that point, as he began to cross the just as he began to cross the �*that just as he began to cross the �* that the collision river that the collision took place. so, we know 7——— hi 77 actually see alreay actually see already what can actually see already what happened and what we want to know now is why the aircraft happened and what we want to kno�* allowed why the aircraft happened and what we want to kno�* allowed to y the aircraft happened and what we want to kno�* allowed to get e aircraft happened and what we want to kno�* allowed to get as ircraft happened and what we want to kno�* allowed to get as close: happened and what we want to kno�* allowed to get as close to o7ther7 7 7 7 7 other 7they7 7 7 other 7they7 were. 7 other 7 they7 were. an7d other 7 they7 were. and we each other as they were. and we know little bit about air traffic we re were relying on controllers were relying on visual contact the visual contact between the aircraft for the pilots to keep se - arated se-arated and as i a moment 777777773 517551755; £5577” mentioned a moment ago, the river surrounded with and loads of m

loads and loads of lights on either bank and there are other aircraft surround the aircraft surround in the vicinity too and so you can identify the aircraft and report the got the aircraft and and that you are trying to site and that you are trying to an in—depth colliding avoid an in—depth colliding with an aircraft you have not seen. in is that normalto rely solely on _ seen. in is that normalto rely solely on the _ seen. in is that normalto rely solely on the visuals? - seen. in is that normalto rely solely on the visuals? it is - solely on the visuals? 7 77 common america to rely quite common in america to rely on a combination of radar and visual. in this guidance and visual. in this country, major country, around major airports like we do not do like this; we lie het lie that; contact like this; we ate het tie that; contact with other visual contact with other aircraft, may seek it out aircraft, they may seek it out but the separation is a= very much under 22-— 7 7the we 7the we do the control of the way we do things and europe, very things here and in europe, very much more under control of the air traffic controllers here in america, it is the

due under certain circumstances that is shared between the pilots and the controllers. we heard fro; of controllers. we heard frame - of experts - controllers. we heard fre... , - of experts about number of experts talking about how the helicopter would number of experts talking about how been ilicopter would number of experts talking about how been wearing would number of experts talking about how been wearing night would number of experts talking about how been wearing night vision have been wearing night vision and wearing a helmet, ill" l“"h77ifr: visual capacity? i think they miaht visual capacity? i think they might have _ visual capacity? i think they might have been _ visual capacity? i think they might have been doing - visual capacity? i think they might have been doing thatj visual capacity? i think they i might have been doing that in this particular trip because us army has said was a fli - ht however, you flight however, you do training flight however, you do not go training a couple metres away from the hundred metres away from the in the usa. and glag'or airport in the usa. and, don't go there you don't go training there being extremely without being extremely you are not careful. you are not considering yourself to be under you under military conditions. you be wearing some military §=a=a e: -=7 77 but i7do not 7 77 but i7do not know 7 equipment but i do not know whether the pilots would have been relying upon night—vision

because the 7 715332; th7e777whole77 7 7 7 7153782; th7e777whole77idea 7 goggles because the whole idea of that a dark of that environment. a dark but clear visibility and night but clear visibility and with and lights on the aircraft, that is flashing 77 naturally 77 77 naturally7carrying in aaircraft naturally carrying in aircraft naturally carrying in air traffic controllers the air—traffic controllers to point out to each pilot the air—traffic controllers tl the nt out to each pilot the air—traffic controllers tl the other to each pilot the air—traffic controllers tl the other aircraft| pilot to be relative to them supposed to be relative to them using the of one using the clock system of one o'clock and one mile in your *— whi7 ficlock that sor o'clock that sort of thing. one o'clock that sort of thing. under circumstances like that, is a partnership between this is a partnership between the air traffic controllers and the air traffic controllers and the pilots. but it does contain risks. it is not a that we accept here because the aaaia baeauaa aau�*ra the say aaaia bctaux after: the say that aaaie beeauae eeu�*re the say that over baeie betaux efflare the say that over the president say that over the years, he has these president say that over the years, he has and e types of investigations and take years to conclude and they take years to conclude and he says, have pretty good he says, have some pretty good

ideas i will state thatis that is exactly ”ton; ago; 77 77 read 7 7 and that is exactly what he did in the �* us has slammed 7 7 775375 slammedthe77 77 has slammed the president chief has slammed the president for despicable attacks over chief has slammed the president for crash ;picable attacks over chief has slammed the president for crash but able attacks over chief has slammed the president for crash but in e attacks over chief has slammed the president for crash but in terms :ks over chief has slammed the president for crash but in terms of over chief has slammed the president for crash but in terms of that' what would you think timeline,, what would you think is likely to take before we get clear a nswer clear answer as to how this a clear answer as to how this actually happened? l actually happened? welcome i we know actually happened? welcome i - we know quite _ actually happened? welcome i - we know quite a - actually happened? welcome i - we know quite a lot - know, aside you know, leaving aside president trump, as he said, sense, we know the common sense, we know the these two trajectory. these two are taking. we know aeroplanes arertaisino. �*a’e isnot-e: circumstances under the circumstances under which they were operating the air they yvere operating in the air controllers hoping pilots to see to direct the pilots to see each other but obviously, one of them this identified the each other but obviously, one of the thats identified the each other but obviously, one of the thats was ified the each other but obviously, one of the thats was supposed to target that it was supposed to be and so, within one be avoiding and to within. one now, there be avoiding and ea— within one now, there will be -ie an interim report which is not an interim report which is not a final verdict that it gives

the facts that have been the faetflhatha’eeaee�* �* donald likes facts or not, i do trump likes facts or not, i do not know. of the facts will be within a month from national trans - ortation = safety board board. a biases-ere to ou safety board board. a seas; - to you and _ safety board board. e seas; - to you and thank- safety board board. e seas; - to you and thank you] talking to you and thank you forjoining us on bbc news. you for that analysis. thank you for that analysis. so, some of the details so, some of the latest details we were showing you the latest and we will have more washington here on the frent washington here on them; ~ . ~ ~ ~ and the next little programme and the next little while but you see in the while but there, you see in the corner of the screen, that other major developing story to the course of the day. we have the meme fihhedae hewhee: 7 those pictures the seen those pictures from the middle east for more than a hundred palestinian prisoners been arriving in the have been arriving in the west bank ...-. being from jail, 1:22; 777; hhtti h jail, all a77part of the israeli7jail7,77all a part of the that we have seen exchanges that we have seen �* in the and see exchanges that we have seen the �* in the and see exchanges that we have seen the�* in the three see exchanges that we have seen the�* in the three more in the hostages. three more ~ . . . ~ ~~ hostages returned and israeli hostages returned and five thai nationals also return

let's bring in our and let's bring in our correspondent was watching correspondent—was watching all that to the course of the correspondent—was watching all t and o the course of the correspondent—was watching all tand let's course of the correspondent—was watching all t and let's start ;e of the correspondent—was watching all t and let's start with these day and let's start with these pictures and ramallah because some huge, huge out to 7 to greet 7 to greet these 7 7 7 to7greet7these people 7 7 to greet these people as there to greet these people as they home. there to greet these people as they - home-— they return home matthew. and the absolutely matthew. and the sheer number of gives absolutely matthew. and the she an|umber of gives absolutely matthew. and the she an |umber of of gives absolutely matthew. and the she an |umber of of how gives absolutely matthew. and the she an |umber of of how this 5 a big for 7 a big for people 7 a big a for people 7 a big a moment' people 7 a big a moment that ple 7 a big a moment that was of course because the said they were israelis said they were postponing by a few hours and turned out to be the case the of the 110 palestinian release of the 110 palestinian prisoners and the justification from the israeli side is that they looked at what happened this morning in the south of the strip where there was 7 7 7 7 latest of from gaza 77 7 77777fror7n77g7aza7a7nd the site hostages from gaza and the site of one young surrounded of one young woman surrounded ljy

of one young woman surrounded by dozens of gunmen, by dozens of fighters, gunmen, that angered and upset a lot of here in israel the people here in israel and the israeli government they israeli government said they got a guarantee the media israeli government said they got a this rantee the media israeli government said they got a this delicate the media israeli government said they got a this delicate process nedia israeli government said they got a this delicate process that a from this delicate process that and subsequent hostage releases, will not be a releases, there will not be a repeat of that and the was difficuttytoday was because were there but also hamas were there but also another palestinian another group, palestinian islamicjihad and they were with one another as far arguing with one another as far . we could see and that all as are seals see and thatatt for this chaotic scene. l come to events �* because benjamin earlier because benjamin has been talking netanyahu has been talking about that and but about that and speaking but what is happening in west what is happening in the west bank and ramallah, tell us bank. and ramallah. tellrus . ~ ... . the of this 110 about the makeup of this 110 or so have been lt’s about the makeup of this 110 or so have been — so have been released. it's a combination _ so have been released. it's a combination of _ so have been released. it's a combination of prisoners, i so have been released. it's a i combination of prisoners, some of minor offences and some of them minor offences and some

of them minor offences and some of them minor offences and some of them not charge or at all in other hand, there are on the other hand, there are some key figures in militant groups who have been in prison rouns who have been in nrison . r r a groups who have been in prison a long time, 30 or so 7 extremely long and serving extremely long and serious and of serious sentences and those of : as: of serious sentences and those of t as: of staging u-oin back as 7 going back as far 7 7 going back as far as7 attacks going back as far as 2002, for example in which we re 77 testing 7 77 7were7kill7ed and 7 7 7 77 7were7kill7ed and 5.707, 77 7were7kill7ed and $707,735 israelis were killed and so, as a �* this, 7 77 7a7r71g7ry7by77 77sit7es people very angry by the sites they seeing in they are seeing in ramallah this evening and long serving being prisoners being released from prisoners being released from prison part �*the and also. some cease—fire deal and also, some of who have been freed of those w