of scotland and over the irish parts of scotland and over the irish sea towards northern ireland to stop m -arts of northern ireland more to d a trust. temperatures ciluse tu haves frost. . ietnperaturesclosestu freezing for haves frost. . iethperaturesctoseto freezing for england and or above freezing for england and wales. the day, some wintry wales. through the day, some wintry showers for eastern scotland, sunshine in west, and more sunshine in the west, and more showers coming into northern ireland. it becomes a bit less wet for england and wales. snow levels for england and wales. snow levets it's for england and wales. snow lavats it's going for england and wales. snow levets it's going to be mostly taiiiiing thruugh the data but rain falling through the day, but and cold, four to six. it cloudy and cold, four to six. it up cloudy and cold, four to six. it up a bit in east anglia brightens up a bit in east anglia and the south—east, temperatures could get higher for the second and the south—east, temperatures could get higherfor the second half gould get higherfor the second half the weekend, gguld get higherfor the second half the weekend, high pressure fiat/lay" the way towards the gifbyringfing hwbringginigrafi’ " 77777bring7in7g7a7lot 77 7 77 bringing a lot of7cloud. some uk. bringing a lot of cloud. some sunny frosty, sunny weather across scotland, fewer showers, scotts nd, fewet simmers gwrsllv but scotland, fewet simmers gwrsllv but clouding over from dry, but clouding overfrom northern ireland and still a lot of cloud for dry, but clouding overfrom northern ireland t and till a lot of cloud for dry, but clouding overfrom northern ireland t and wales. t of cloud for dry, but clouding overfrom northern ireland t and wales. t of some or rez'fe see :'e— se'zz ”as f— —— and 7 77 3521 55559 77 77 77 7 77 $521 55559 {357,77 showers and patchy rain, particularly for east anglia and

south—east england, but not as cold, even the work and pensions secretary and she's worried about the "covid generation's" work ethic — is she right?

to you live every weeknight from broadcasting house with the best insights and interviews. in 90 minutes' time, almost all staff at the world s later, we'll hear from the boss of the un's aids charity which relies on us government funding. at politico and host of their power play podcast. editor of the big issue paul mcnamee. and former special advisor to prime minister boris johnson samuel kasumu. it's certainly the most disruptive tech a threat to humanity. on monday world leaders, tech bosses and ai experts will meet in paris for a massive summit

on the future of ai. we're joined from there by stuart russell, who wrote the text book on al, and will be at the summit. welcome to newsnight. thank you. nice to be with _ welcome to newsnight. thank you. nice to be with you. _ welcome to newsnight. thank you. nice to be with you. great - welcome to newsnight. thank you. nice to be with you. great to - welcome to newsnight. thank you. nice to be with you. great to have i seize t“ he “gait"; a this google seize ta he “gait"; a this google dropped its you. this week, google dropped its previous commitment not to ai weapons and surveillance powered weapons and surveillance systems. what is your reaction to that? h systems. what is your reaction to that? , ., , . , ., that? it is an interesting decision. the history _ that? it is an interesting decision. the history of _ that? it is an interesting decision. the history of this _ that? it is an interesting decision. the history of this is _ that? it is an interesting decision. the history of this is google - that? it is an interesting decision. the history of this is google tookl the history of this is google took part in a project in 2017 called partin a protectjn 2017 called that was about using ai maven. that was about using ai for surveillance, which sounds harmles maven. that was about using ai for sur�* the ance, which sounds harmles maven. that was about using ai for sur�* the employ rich sounds harmles maven. that was about using ai for sur�* the employ ees sounds harmles maven. that was about using ai for

sur�* the employ ees ofjnds harmles maven. that was about using ai for sur�* the employ ees of google �*mles maven. that was about using ai for sur�* the employ ees of google were but the employ ees of google were worried the same technology would be used in weapons. that employee revolt led google to out of fest“ led�*ef�*f�*file�*f�*eell e�*e�*f�*t 7 install policy, project and install this policy, which said google products will not be used for weapons. and you be used for weapons. and so you might ask, well are they undoing policisome i'm sure 77 policisome i'm7sure that 77 77 policisome i'm7sure that the 77 the trump administration now in power something to do 777777 7 777i7t7. 7th7e777777 7 7 7777it7.7the77ma7rke7t777 7 7 7 777i7t7. the7m7a7rke7t7 777this 7 1 777it. 7th7e77r7r717a7rke7t7 t1711}; 7of with it. the market for this kind of software is not going to be very big, compared to google consumer or business so i don't think business market. so i don't think they're making this decision to they�*re mshingthisderisiorttomsice .- of m o ney they�*re mshingthisderisiorttomsice .- of money from autonomous lots of money from autonomous weapons. i think trying to weapons. i think they're trying to curry favour with the administration. may say why do curry favour with the adm need tion. may say why do curry favour with the

adm need to n. may say why do curry favour with the adm need to n. that? ay say why do curry favour with the adm need to n. that? the ay why do curry favour with the adm need to n. that? the reason do curry favour with the adm need to n. that? the reason is they need to do that? the reason is a court has found that they were an illegal monopoly and is running an illegal monopoly and is proposing break them up. um? eff —e 7::-—t it be they would change it on the 7 77 on7t7he7i5l7>nald77 777 7 on the donald trump 77 based on the donald trump administration?— based on the donald trump administration? �* , based on the donald trump adm this ration? �* , based on the donald trump adm this would �* �* .., , based on the donald trump adm this would be a based on the donald trump adrr this would be a change teeii based on the donald trump adrr this would be a change that at that this would be a change that would appeal to the trump administration. had a different. .... been they administration been elected they might have chosen something as a way of currying but they felt favour. but they presumably felt this the kind of change they this was the kind of change they could make that would signal their support for the administration and its views. again; yod!retat!sing .. autonomous its views. again; yod!retathing - autonomous weapons its views. again; yod!retathing- - autonomous weapons systems. about autonomous weapons systems. people they think ai, most people when theythinhaf ai. think of possibilities of they think of possibilities of revolutionising the economy or a té—sseway way to 77 7 way to cheat 7 way to cheat at 7 for good way to cheat at homework, for you, what does keep you awake at

night about al, is it this? �*t�*uu you, what does keep you awake at night about al, is it this? you make a aood night about al, is it this? you make a good people. _ night about al, is it this? you make a good people, most _ night about al, is it this? you make a good people, most people - night about al, is it this? you make a good people, most people think. a good people, most people think about good things like medical diagnosis, something to play diagnosis, having something to play chess with, and we, the ai community, want you know the community, don't wa nt'yaa'knawthe' of community. don't want'yoa'kncrwthe' of human beings community, don't want'yoa'kncrwthe' of human beings to be the death of human beings to be the first thing that comes to when first thing that comes to mind when you think about al. so there are at least two different going on least two different threads going on respect to the use of ai in with respect to the use of ai in weapons. so one is conventional weapons. so one is conventional weapons and those are being in geneva among most of count rips in h the count rips in the world. —— countries in the the countries in the world. the main concern is because ai enabled the countries in the world. the main concern to because ai enabled the countries in the world. the main concern to operate ai enabled the countries in the world. the main concern to operate entirely ed the countries in the world. the main concern to operate entirely without weapon to operate entirely without human supervision, that means that one person could push a button and launch perhaps a million weapons at once and wipe out population. once and wipe out entire population. we don't think that is a good idea,

but that seems to be the direction things are going right now. the that things are going right now. the discussions in geneva have not made a lot of progress, there are major powers, including the united states and collaborating on and russia collaborating on any discussion about preventing any discussion about banning these weapons. hues preventing any discussion about banning these weapons. think that scenario would be? to you think that scenario would be? tr? be honest, ithink you think that scenario would be? tr? be honest, i think it's... you think that scenario would be? tr? be honest, ithink it's... it you think that scenario would be? tr? be honest, i think it's... it is very likely. because what we are seeing in ukraine in particular, which is sort of a crucible for technological advancement in these weapons, is that the weapons are becoming more and more �* electronic because of electronic counter measures. it used to be that both h�*eeeefe? ee ese�*i�* tf�* ee h�*eefe�*h were h�*eeeefee !t bee? tf�* ee hteuete�*h were killing h�*eeeefee !t eeee�* te ee “eeetete�*h were killing each other using sides were killing each other using remotely piloted drones, which require a radio so, the

require a radio link so, the operator can see the camera. 77t 77ja7mming, 7155151715511]; 77 77 jamming, the link7s are starting with jamming, the links are starting to become impossible. if you want your weapon to do useful, have 77 7 7 have to make 7 7 have to make it 7 you have to make it fully autonomous. that's already happened. you said left unchecked ai ai 1 m2} —..—. .. 7ml7a7y7bte7t77777 e. .. 7m7a7y7bte7a77777 77 7 m27y7b7e7a7thr7eat77 77 7 mz7y7b7e7a7thr7eat7to77 77 7 m27y7b7e7a7thr7eat7t707i71umanity. you; e :e e ttteettt you giv: as e eettt asta: you give us a 7 you give7 us a timeline 7 you give us a timeline on 7 you give7 us a timeline on that? 7 can you give us a timeline on that? that is a separate issue. the kinds of ai being proposed for weapons can being very simple. it is a actually being very simple. it is a lot easier to a weapon than a lot easier to do a weapon than a self—driving car, which google is self-driving car, which google is donein self-driving car, which google is done in america. the kinds ie um we are talkin about that of ai that we are talking about that present an existential threat are ai systems that are far more simply ai systems that are far more intelligent than human beings. there a lo7r71g record 77

a lo7r71g record of 77 a long record of more a lo7r71g record of more inte77lligent is a long record of more intelligent species, such as us, wiping out less intelligent species, such as the one million species we have put out of million species we have per-trout of if we create systems that business. if we create systems that are more intelligent than us we business. if we create systems that are mo figured gent than us we business. if we create systems that are mo figured outt than us we business. if we create systems that are mo figured out how1 us we business. if we create systems that are mo figured out how 1 1 control e haven't figured out how to control them then we are going to them forever, then we are going to be in big trouble. this is a view thatis be in big trouble. this is a view that is now pretty much a consensus leading researchers and among leading ai researchers and the ceos of the among leading ai researchers and the ceos of ., ceos of companies. the other wor in: ceos of companies. the other worrying scenario _ ceos of companies. the other worrying scenario is _ ceos of companies. the other worrying scenario is people'sl ceos of companies. the other - worrying scenario is people's fears ceos of companies. the other - worryir their nario is people's fears ceos of companies. the other - worryir theirjobs. is people's fears ceos of companies. the other - worryir theirjobs. for aople's fears ceos of companies. the other - worryir theirjobs. for people fears around theirjobs. for people watching tonight, who be watching tonight, who might be worried, do you have any sense of which professions might be which professions you might be protected and wh proprofessions will go? tt protected and wh proprofessions will

ro? , ., , go? it is a move being target, we thou~ht go? it is a move being target, we thought the _ go? it is a move being target, we thought the creative _ go? it is a move being target, we thought the creative professions, | thought the creative professions, those will be around forever, but with generative ai that can write an entire book in the style of james bondin entire book in the style of james bond in ten seconds, that can churn out quality art by the that can write music, that thousand, that can write music, that can reach the top of the charts, the creative clearly the creative professions under threat. we saw the hollywood writers go on insisting that writers go on strike, insisting that al not be used in writings crypts takin- their point to livelihoods. it is hard to point to any except possibly politicians, because they're the ones that write ruiies and they’re hut guihg tu the rules and they're not going to allow to be replaced. su sites themselves to eefe’eeeeeq need sites themselves teth�*eptace—d need to be politicians! thank

77777777 very very useful information and you, very useful information and worrying. stuart russell thank you. my worrying. stuart russell thank you. my pleasure. next, some people on benefits are "taking the mickey", says the work and pensions secretary and she's worried about in the next few weeks, we're going to find out more liz kendall told itv news that many people on benefits desperately want to work, but she also had this to say about some people who don't work. have a listen. i've no doubt, as there always have been, are people and that is not good enough. the brilliant work they're doing with a charity to get young people into work, and we saw two things.

and stay in work. but also the manager saying there were some young people who felt, you know, just turning up on time, or working the day that they needed to, and not always taking breaks, they had to understand that that was the world of work. the covid generation, but we can't have a situation where doing a day's work is in itself seen as stressful. we are going to come back to the covid generation. but i want to pick up with our panel. paul mcnamee, it up with our panel. paul mcnamee, sounds from she is saying, like it sounds from she is saying, like the government is lining up cuts to the government iseliningeupcuts to what do you think about welfare? what do you think about that? j welfare? what do you think about that? , ,_ , welfare? what do you think about that? like , _ , welfare? what do you think about that?- like there _ welfare? what do you think about that?- like there is _ welfare? what do you think about that? t like there is a as welfare? what do you think about that? t like there is a lot of something like there is a lot of people taking the mickey, i don't know if it is calculated or if it is just being flippant, because it damages everything else that is happening. if there are cuts coming,

that has to go hand in hand with of work. we know that possibilityeofework.etoleeknow that actually, as you know from t:-:= report, and 7 report, and this7 part report, an7d7 this7 part of this report, and this is part of problem, there is 200,000 people who on benefits who said if there mu mmm [millim- m m work, ifthat there tur theme there tur them these eruuiid iiike was there for them, they would tike work. but those kind of stories to work. but those kind of stories are missed, because all we have got is her saying people are taking the is hersayingpeoplearetakingthe what that will do is i think nieeee�* eeee eftee bill ee ie ! tfiififi. allows a demonization of it allows a demonization of everybody, ratherthan, it allows a demonization of everybody, rather than, there is a lot of people who need it. is lot of people who need it. there is people who want to get into work and or people who due to can't or people who due to disabilities or wherever they are, get in. because she won't get in. because she says people are taking the mickey, it deee'e ae tahies the mfket . ~ ~ ~ . ~ . ~ it fair game deee'e ae tahihs the mfket . ~ ~ ~ . ~ . ~ it fair game for eeee'e ae tahihs the m'ket . ~ ~ ~ . ~ . ~ it fair game for everyone. leaves it fair gamefor everyone. is damaging. leaves it. fair game for. everyone leaves itfair game forev . . . ~ is damau-in. leaves itfair game forev . . . ~ is damauain. ., that is damaging. samuel kasumu are ou cuts? that is damaging. samuel kasumu are you - cuts? cuts _ that is damaging. samuel kasumu are you - cuts? cuts l of - you expecting cuts? cuts in of itself won't — you expecting cuts? cuts in of itself won't fix _ you expecting cuts? cuts in of itself won't fix the _ you expecting cuts? cuts in of itself won't fix the challenges | you expecting cuts? cuts in of. itself won't fix the challenges we have _

itself won't fix the challenges we have. 0ver nine people of working have, over nine people of workit are have. over nine people of worki 7 have. over nine people of working are claiming some form of age are claiming some form of benefit — age are claiming some form of benefit. we spend 65 billion a year on benefits. that will rise to a hundred — on benefits. that will rise to a hundred billion. that is not sustainable. if if you rewind —z= = -z= to 2010, w7 to 2010, wa up - to 2010, wa up with l - to 2010, wa up with a back to 2010, we came up with a flexible — back to 2010, we came up with a flexible work programme, that was a 6 billion_ flexible work programme, that was a 6 billion pound programme designed tie—t7 7t7 77777777 t t—t777 77 t 7g7e77t7pe7op7le 7of7f be7n7efi7ts7an7d7 into 7 7 to get people off benefits and into work _ to get people off benefits and into work we — to get people off benefits and into work. we had record levels of _ before _ work. we had record levels of before conservative and so 'ust sa in m good. and sojust saying there are people _ good. and sojust saying there are people who are benefits cheats won't fix the _ people who are benefits cheats won't fix the situation. just trying to t _ttt t t change policy won't fix the situation. they're going to have to invest _ situation. they're going to have to invest a _ situation. they're going to have to invest a lot — situation. they're going to have to invest a lot of money and resource and focus — invest a lot of money and resource and focus on — invest a lot of money and resource and focus on trying to get all those people _ and focus on trying to get all those people who can work into work. anne mcelvoy what — people who can work into work. anne mcelvoy what do _ people who can work into work. anne mcelvoy what do you _ people who can work into work. fifu�*ure mcelvoy what do you think of taking the mickey, she was talking about a specific cohort, small cohort specific cohort, a small cohort potentially. how you it?

potentially. how did you read it? are starting to talk politicians are starting to talk like shock— politicians are starting to talk like shockjocks. _ politicians are starting to talk like shockjocks. they- politicians are starting to talk like shockjocks. they are - politicians are starting to talk - like shockjocks. they are applying to be _ like shockjocks. they are applying to be talk— like shockjocks. they are applying to be talk show— like shockjocks. they are applying to be talk show hosts _ like shockjocks. they are applying to be talk show hosts and - like shockjocks. they are applying j to be talk show hosts and probably want a _ to be talk show hosts and probably want a podcast _ to be talk show hosts and probably want a podcastjob. _ to be talk show hosts and probably want a podcast job. the _ to be talk show hosts and probably want a podcastjob. the change - to be talk show hosts and probably| want a podcastjob. the change the want a podcastjoh: the ahangethe want a podcastrjoh: the changethe - politicians use language, - want a podcastrjoh: the ahangethge—l. . - politicians use language, taking ej——e—— e — e s. éfi— e t-y777 7 77 77 tt7 tt—ttttt tt_tttt tt tt-jt has ever said. has eversaid. i has ever said. i take paul's you're ver said. i take paul's you're putting, itake paul's you're putting, i t many ul's point, you're putting too many people — point, you're putting too many people in— point, you're putting too many people in one _ point, you're putting too many people in one basket. - point, you're putting too many people in one basket. she - point, you're putting too many. people in one basket. she did on point, you're putting too many- people in one basket. she did on in your. and — people in one basket. she did on in your. and beyond _ people in one basket. she did on in your. and beyond to _ your clip and bevondio _ between i id$ _ between people up my _ between people she is differentiate between people she is saying _ differentiate between people she is saying were — differentiate between people she is saying were not _ differentiate between people she is saying were not motivating - saying were not motivating themselves _ saying were not motivating themselves and _ saying were not motivating themselves and were - saying were not motivating i themselves and were sitting saying were not motivating - themselves and were sitting around themselves and were sittingaarouandaaa needed themselves and were sitting-around i needed to, i think she was saying at needed to, i think she was saying they need _ at needed to, i think she was saying they need to — at needed to, i think she was saying they need to be _ at needed to, i think she was saying they need to be squeezed _ at needed to, i think she was saying they need to be squeezed to - at needed to, i think she was saying they need to be squeezed to go - at needed to, i think she was saying they need to be squeezed to go to l they need to be squeezed to go to work _ they need to be squeezed to go to work and — they need to be squeezed to go to work and the _ they need to be squeezed to go to work. and the - the - they need to be squeezed to go to i work. and the - the problem work. and the problem, the problem is also _ work. and the problem, the problem is also we _ work. and the problem, the problem is also we have — work. and the problem, the problem is also we have a _ work. and the problem, the problem is also we have a system, _ work. and the problem, the problem is also we have a system, you - is also we have a systemyourould - m— is also we have a systemyoufould - remember the name - is also we have a systemyoufould - remember the name of- is also we have a systemyoufould - remember the name of the l barely remember the anameof t" and barely remember the anameof the _w_ barely remember the name of the — —“ you know barely remember the anameof the _ and you know theml barely remember the anameof t'e. . _ and you know them very programmes and you know them very well and _ programmes and you know them very well and i_ programmes and you know them very well and i probably— programmes and you know them very well and i probably should _ programmes and you know them very well and i probably should know- programmes and you know them veryj well and i probably should know them well and! probable arm-no enosgrnerfl back well and! probable eran-no bra-flu annn - back longer, - to - well and! probable eran-no bra-flu annn - back longer, - to work, i going back longer, welfare to work, welfare _ going back longer, welfare to work, welfare to— going back longer, welfare to work, welfare to work— going back longer, welfare to work,

welfare to work- we _ going back longer, welfare to work, welfare to work- we had - going back longer, welfare to work, welfare to work- we had job i the idea that ou were not seekers, the idea that you were not unemployed, — seekers, the idea that you were not unemployed, you _ seekers, the idea that you were not unemployed, you were _ seekers, the idea that you were not unemployed, you were a _ seekers, the idea that you were notl unemployed, you were a i seeker. unemployed, you were a job seeker. how has _ unemployed, you were a job seeker. how has the — unemployed, you were a job seeker. how has the system _ unemployed, you were a job seeker. how has the system supported - unemployed, you were a job seeker. | how has the system supported that? the system _ how has the system supported that? the system has — how has the system supported that? the system has ended _ how has the system supported that? the system has ended i it - how has the system supported that? the system has ended i it is - how has the system supported that? j the system has ended i it is worse the system has ended up, it is worse since _ the system has ended up, it is worse since covid, — the system has ended up, it is worse since covid, if— the system has ended up, it is worse since covid, if you're _ the system has ended up, it is worse since covid, if you're signed - the system has ended up, it is worse since covid, if you're signed i on i since covid. if you're signed - that since covid. if you're signedoffiore _ that there is _ since covid. if you're signedoffiore _ that there is a _ since covid. if you're signedoffiore _ that there is a sense - since covid. if you're signedoffiore _ that there is a sense of. sickness, that there is a sense of that is— sickness, that there is a sense of that is you — sickness, that there is a sense of that is you done. _ sickness, that there is a sense of that is you done. and _ sickness, that there is a sense of that is you done. and benefits. sickness, that there is a sense ofl that is you done. and benefits are low and _ that