to forge a plan for peace. others, will work with ukraine on a plan to stop the united states. to give a news conference in the next hour. we are expecting a conference the uk prime minister in welcome to the programme.

found to the end of the fighting there, following russia's invasion. president macron here as well, i name check all of them earlier, we heard keir say that the france, i? prance, with uk and france, along with ukraine, are going to to forward 77 77 forward aéproposal, peace put forward a proposal, a peace plan, to the states. in or ”of " film? " ”of " iéliowgfén’mm " ”of " 'f;l[ow;’;n’f’il;&{' " ”of " idiow'sfén’f'ééig” week tiéékzsiw " monday, fwhen beginning last monday, when president macron went to the house to meet president white house to meet president trump, on thursday keir starrner to washington trump, on thursday keir starrder to washington to meet also went to washingtsnts' finest us president. that was all the us president. that was all to the groundwork for what to lay the groundwork for what happening today and to lay was happening today and to lay the for the meeting . friday . . ogfrldav between president of ukraine ogfrldav between bresident of ukraine and donald zelensky of ukraine andflonald but we zelensky of ukraine and'flonald but we saw how that trump. but we saw how that it was a fractious

wwihjqaf’" ' ' “iriindeiedjso,” ' ' “firindeed.7so,rin ' ' z'i'ejezeééfifi addition meeting indeed. so, in addition to trying to to plan peace here at 7 peace here at lancaster has for peace here at lancaster has today, people are considering where the eiee’eeneidenne where “the between ukraine relationship between ukraine the united states stands, and the united states stands, and the united states stands, and where that relationship and fihcr: that feieeieneh'ie' " " ' ' if»; the and fihcr: that feieeieneh'ie' " " ' ' free—re;— the united stands. keir starmer states stands. keir starmer to the bbc earlier today, spoke to the bbc earlier today, he said he did not want to get up he said he did not want to get up in all of that saegbt us in all eftbat' ' m but saegbl us in all eflbal�*” ' m but to saegbl as in all aflbal�*” ' m but to make outrage, but to make progress towards peace, lasting and adjusted piece, he said, for ukraine. the crowds outside cheering. that was totally spontaneous. wa nted wanted show wa nted 5:72 of wanted show z of feeling in the strength of feeling in relation to ukraine. i think that, you know, that we're

all with you, the people of ukraine, for as long as it takes and everyone around this table. of right and wrong. and many others, too. and in my conversations today, we agreed that a group of us will work with ukraine on a plan to stop the fighting. it forward together. that's really important. keir starmer, saying that the

is facing once a world is facing out once in a generation moment. joining me now is our diplomatic correspondent, james, you have here through the day. the leaders getting a few getting together for a few hours... tell us about the �*leaders like significance of leaders like the be“?! able“? meet 7 " 77" rather the be“?! able“? meet 7 77 7777 rather than the be“?! able“? meet 777 77 7777 rather than in 7712227 othef format. 7 othefformat. 7that any alberfarmall uses that - ~ ,,, any atherfarrnatl uses that - ~ ,,, a huge any stherfsrrnatl uses that - ~ ,,, a huge difference to it they can do? i think it does, siml they can do? i think it does, simply because _ they can do? i think it does, simply because they - they can do? i think it does, simply because they can - they can do? i think it does, i simply because they can assess mood �*each m7ood �* each other and see 533“? it seen fiffief sea we? also ens nine et seen effief sea the? also strength ens ease et seen effief ans {nee also strength of can also indicate strength of purpose what are purpose and what they are really what really concerned about, what they are relaxed about. it means they can also have side conversations and meetings, conversations and is a very large corridors, thislisa very large with an awful lot of over 7 over the years, this =:: = _22 has been used 7 7 7 753; bee'nlzéei f}? 7 building has been used for exactly this purpose. to exactly this purpose, ts get , , , together, to try leaders together.th try and some leaders togethergts try and some of common get some kind of common purpose. i think that is what will try to do they will try to do today. europe has a ijust europe has a problem, ijust made up of lots of separate

separate agendas countries with separate agendas and approaches. there is z7— :7-= to say, has what has attempt to say, has what has over the last few z7 especially especially that explosion passion and a �* in 7passion and a �* in the sf passien and—a tentser in the office on friday, is that uval office set—fridays is that —— ———— —— to more united? we have 7 7 more united? we have to more m7ore try to find our more try to find our own do more to try to find our own to the war in ukraine. solution to the war in ukraine. yet, keir starmer is talking yet; keir starmer is'tal'aing .,, ~ a coalition of the about a coalition of the willing. it suggests that some might be more willing than 7 too, 7 7 too, for 7 7 too,for 7 put git on the in ukraine. i think that makes... it makes _ ukraine. i think that makes... it makes perfect _ ukraine. i think that makes... it makes perfect - one | ukraine. i think that makes. .. | it makes perfect - one of it makes perfect sense. one of the problems the european union has, as a sort of foreign :* body 7bod7y7,7i7t777777 7 7bod7y7,7i7t7ca7r17n7ot77 7" ebodyeietecannotact iwith unless there is unanimity with all 27 nations, unless know all 27 nations, unless we know —— as we know, there are many 7 eforexamp7le77 7 'f'.;..'.;...’...1g.;..'g’..'y, member european union, a member of theesrspean unisln, russia. it is lto ll. e“ eee’ 77t777°7f7ij71d77 2777777 ll .. tof|ndthatk|nd 7 7to7find7th7a7t7kin7d sf 77 difficult to find that kind of unanimity. you do not seek it,

you just see those countries who can help. some who can actually help. some countries do not have the to actually help. what military to actually help. what will try to do, i think, 2m get some countries together is get some countries together to actually present and offer, if you like, the americans. if you like,,to,t,he americans. this we, the can do in terms our own defence and also in of securing ukraine in our own defence and also in future. curing ukraine in our own defence and also in future. curini thereine in our own defence and also in future. curini there is: in our own defence and also in future. curini there is any = -7 775i; 7.17417 of a deal. 7to kind of a peace deal. simply to and proceed to the 7_ 7 americans to change their minds. at moment, the americans to change their minds. at mon in t, the americans to change their minds. at mon in the "re americans to change their minds. at mon in the words =7= donald trump, very military 7 military backstop to military backstop themselves. the military reality europe does not reality is that europe does not think it can really do it on reality is that europe does not thi own, an really do it on reality is that europe does not thi own, it| really do it on reality is that europe does not thi own, it needs do it on air coeer. logistical american cover, and american intelligence covered to provide proper deterrent against a proper deterrent against russian aggression the russian aggression in the future. ~ ., , future. where does the - relationship| future. where does the - - relationship stand diplgglsatic relationshipstand ukraine that us moment?

tbatlel the . m tbatlel the . [em office on friday. a ytjgye oval office on friday, a of offences need lot of diplomatic sffehcesneed be lot of diplomatic offencesneed be i think some of to be mended, i think some of the that will be there is to try to happening there is to try to work out what, if anything, president zelensky can do to try and get on speaking try and get back on speaking terms with donald and at terms with donald trump and at and whether or the white house. and whether or not the americans are the white house. and whether or nr de—escalate ans are the white house. and whether or nr de—escalate that. �*e the white house. and whether or nr de—escalate that. if you to de—escalate that. if you talk to they they are 7 they are getting signals yes, they are getting signals from the americans that they are to the dust are prepared ts let the asst ~ , , ~ ~ ~ but we do not know. settle. but we do not know. is a lot of questions there is a lot of questions there, what will the americans require for another z— mrtrump and mr between mr trump and mr will mr have zelensky? will mr zelensky have eat some pie? it is to be very ggirgg to be very difficult. briefly, if would, how very briefly, if you would, how is it when that important is it when that leaders emerge from here and we hear that statement, that news conference from keir starmer it �*that conference from keir starmer it �* that is a sense conference from keir starmer it �*that is a sense of and puep;s;777777777:7 77777777 77 and purpose? even if 557a 515585757555 like} 77 77 agree on all 7 7 7agr7e7e on7a7llt7he77 77 do not agree on all the precise

details. l do not agree on all the precise details. ~ details. i think what they will want to do — details. i think what they will want to do is _ details. i think what they will want to do is to _ details. i think what they will| want to do is to _ is vvant te eels: terseek teaafe . . start of a process, to say the start of a process, to say we are beginning to take a bit ownership of77 ownership of 7this process. of ownership of this process. this discussion we have been having about finding the peace ukraine began a couple of and ukraine; begana couple of ago and ukrainelbegapa couple of ago with donald trump the russians. now this an the russians. now this an attempt ssians. now this an attempt byans. now this is an attempt by the europeans to say that we need to get a bit ownership, get to say that we need to get a b�* the ownership, get to say that we need to get a b�* the owners and get to say that we need to get a b�* the owners and come 7 ' 7 7with 7 7 7with our with our own ideas. i will hope today is think they will hspe tsday'is' 7 ~ ~ ~ ..... f . start of that process. =: you for the moment, thank thank you for the moment, thank you very muchjames, our diplomatic correspondent. we can speak to dr olga krasnyak who is an associate professor at the national research university higher school of economics in moscow. i appreciate you joining us, i think there is viewed in the i appreciate you joining us, i think atere is viewed in the i appreciate you joining us, i think at the s viewed in the i appreciate you joining us, i think at the moment in the i appreciate you joining us, i think at the moment about what west at the moment about what moscow �* all moscow is thinking of all of what the kremlin is this, what the kremlin is of all of this. give thinking of all of this. give more insight into that ss nnsre insight ints that; .. .. . right now. i us more insight intertbat ——~—~——~—— ~— riaht now. ., thinking right now. i would like to mention _ thinking right now. i would like to mention two -

thinking right now. i would| like to mention two points, thinking right now. i would - like to mention two points, two elements of we see the elements of how we see the situation right now. first one is, is doing what it is is, russia is doing what it is supposed to do order to supposed to do in order to provide its safety and security in ukraine. it means everything is to continue on the is going to continue on the battlefield, and russian military are going military forces are going further into the west of 7507 .. so no 7 7 so 7no matter7 7 7 so 7no matter what 7 7 so 7no matterwhat will from 7777f7ro7mt7h7e77 7777 7 77f7ro7m t7h7e biher77 7 77 7777f7ro77r7i717t7h7eolher77s7ide, 7 7777f7ro7mt7h7e otherside, 7 w; be from the other side, yes, we have our our goal, and we moving forward. second, we are moving forward. second, we can see from the other side, can see from the other side. so—called western the sen called western th is z— of western community of western countries. we definitely see it displayed, twe definitelylseeitdisplayed. split between the twe definitelylseelitdisplayed. split between the united the split between the united states and the european and definitely countries, and definitely we this some changes will consider this some changes will happen. the common answer from both of these parties. and of course, probably we would see moving towards the end

we are moving towards the end of full support, and support of uk7i7'aine. 77 7|| titiean because i believe that european union asst united as have 77 have 7need to 77 have need to consider well have a need to consider their own economic because developments, because definitely they are in 77_7 7 so7in this case, recession. so in this case, yes, no matter what the 77 7 is that comes from decision is that comes from european russia will and it would be move forward. end “u“ to net move forward. end tweet-u “

about traditional us allies in west. give us your the west. give us your l the west. give us your theeghte' .. ... between theeahterll between the theeahterll statesaetween the theeahterll states and een the we united states and russia, we can look at two perspectives from diplomatic and the perspective and the economic perspective. the 7 perspective, perspective, we see diplomatic perspective, we see the improvement �*relations 7777773), may be that restoration of and may be that restoration of diplomatic here in diplomatic missions here in �*and in washington, so moscow and in washington, so just from diplomatic part looks very nice. 7 looks very nice. but everything looks very nice. but at the time, i would be it at the same time, i would be it may be more optimistic about economic relations, donald trump s——: 7 the sanctions, that extended the sanctions, that sanctions against for more year. so, one more year. so. definitely. the situation, the from the situation, the united is from this 77 it explains77 why conflict. it explains why exemptions been gyxyeygiptions have been prolonged. again, from the gyxyeygiptions have been prolonged. diplomaticim the political— gyxyeygiptions have been prolonged. diplomatic perspective, al— gyxyeygiptions have been prolonged. diplomatic perspective, we

and diplsrnatic perspective; �*e'e good and diplsrnatic perspective. vve good signs relations see good signs of relations restoring. but from economic, is not to very well by now. what do you think vladimir — by now. what do you think vladimir putin _ by now. what do you think vladimir putin ito - by now. what do you think vladimir putin ito do i vladimir putin my to do about any possibility that —— might do about any possibility in 7 in ukraine caught? he 777777777iié7q§7ul7d 77 77 77 he would move on that7 and .’..’.;.;.;.’;’h;.€.f tyhink he would move on that if meant the deal was achieved. it meant the deal was achieved. i do not think so. do not i do not think so. we do not the repetition of the want the repetition of the minsk agreement, just a few 1: "e 73797077 "": " l"" 77a77g7o, 7 they 7 years ago, because they would not it to be not consider it to be reliable from the european side. i do from the european; side. ids believe that from the eurspean; side. ids believe that russia not believe that russia would accept the of 2:2 —— of foreign troops diplomacy —— of foreign troops on territory. i sn ukrainian territsry. i think. should sniikrainianterritsry. i think. should be neutral, that is m- 7 757.5.jid77 77 should not 7 7 gm 507th; 7 should not be changed think it shesld net lee shaneed ...a....a..a-. ......,.- our think. it shesld net lee shangee .. .. . .. .. .. our mind and in our perspective. thank you very much. perspective. thank you very much- i'm _ perspective. thank you very much. i'mjust_ perspective. thank you very much. i'm just going - perspective. thank you very much. i'm just going to - perspective. thank you very | much. i'm just going to take

perspective. thank you very i much. i'm just going to take a look behind i told that are expecting, and i can see we arelexpecting, andican see cars lined over to my we are ex-cectin some right, we are expecting some from the right. we are expecting some from the summit here lancaster house in london. at lancaster house,,in london. soon. a fairly soonga'reminder. then. we are due to have a that we are due to have a a news conference statement, a newsfconference that uk prime minister a later which we will little later which we will bring to you live. you will be {o . tofollow 777lif7e 7675126477 7777l7if7e7 12577 able to follow along life on bbc news website and app as geglle e: ce i7 1 7777779143171 get all �*the details well to get all of the details there and analysis from our team �* bbc experts. those team of bbc experts. those talks have been going on for a �*e'l" hee hee"; "m a". �*a-e we, 1—11—1 ~ ~— �* hours �*e'l" hee hee"; "m a". �*e-e we, 1—11—1 ~ ~— �* hours now, �*e'l" bee bee"; "m a"; �*e-e we, 1—11—1 ~ ~— �* hours now, we �*e'lf' bee bee"; m" m"; fere 1117 17711" .. ... �* hours now, we heard our few hours now, we heard our diplomatic say dielersatic cerreseendenteay . .. 1 1 it dielersatic cerreseendenteay 1 1 1 1 it is really dielersatic cerreseendenteay 1 11 11 1 it is really important, that it is really important, moments this, that it is really important, leaders oments this, that it is really important, leaders in'|ents this, that it is really important, leaders in the s this, that it is really important, leaders in the same this, to get leaders in the same that to gyetyleaders in the same that they to get leaders in the same that they can to gyetyleaders in the same that they can have building. that they can have face—to—face and to7 to an understanding come to an understanding itjust would not face—to—face. itjust would not in �* manner. we happen inanstherrsanner. til/e keep a eye on any 777:%e: e n..any any words from developments, any words from departing leaders, although

the departing leaders, although i suspect they may be leaving i suspect they may be leaving of 7 i suspect they may be leaving of that to sir keir starmer all of that to sir keir starmer as the host of the we as the host of the summit. we will see about that. i think now we can talk to justin. i think now we can talk tojustin. let's now speak tojustin crump — ceo of defence company sibylline. hello. thank you very much for our hello. thank you very much for your time _ hello. thank you very much for your time today. _ hello. thank you very much for your time today. lots - hello. thank you very much for your time today. lots to - from discussyfrom political, iiiiiily y and of diplomatic perspective, and of course into of that course into all of that comes about military. and military, and how the military, and how peacekeeping force could be established ukraine. do you established in ukraine. do you think zelensky about 7 about security 7 talks about security guarantees, that that is what he means? troops on the ground? or is an alternative to that 7 7thatwould7g7i7v7e7 77 7 that that would give ukraine the sort of security guarantees that it seeks? are the sort of security guarantees that it seeks? _ that it ===l=“ 11 shapes, there are of shapes, there are two factors at play. the first one of shapes, there are two factors at is y. the first one of shapes, there are two factors at is showing st one of shapes, there are two

factors at is showing that|e 7 the 7 ukraine can stay in the fight, at the russia... smells at the moment russia... smells in the water. a big part blood in the water. a big part of whatever 7ta kes. if you 7takes. if you go back the _lan put 77777777 7 7 7 777 7 7777 7 :7= strategic plan put forward by last autumn, a big 7 -77 of that was 7 of that was security 7 part of that was security guarantees in the form of troop presence, and a true and overt defence ar�*dat.e aredwet . ~ . . 1 —; to ukraine's 7 there have been many integrity. there have been many talks about what that looks like, a cold face—off like, a cold war, face—off russian probably not. russian invasion? probably not. some people are talking it a oil and other fer1e “frees; end effie? 777 7 7 in fer1e “heep; and 7e7the7i7 777 7 7 in cou ntry capabilities in the country to increase the stakes of just to increase the stakes of an escalation and is just very guarantees? it just very clear guarantees? the for is that have been here multiple they have been here multiple times before, they have been let down by and times before, they have been let down by repeatedly, did guarantees repeatedly, that did not have teeth. that is one of

reasons zelensky has taken the reasons zelensky has taken wants to see a very clear commitment, an unmistakable unmistakable commitment to future —— zelensky wants to see an commitment 7 commitment to unmistakable commitment to ukrainian security, and future ukrainian security, and cannot blame ukraine for l1 by thet11 1111111111—1—e1le ,. �* by one thet11 11111111111—e1le ,. �* by one 0771.11 guests earlier by one of my guests today that guarantees that today that guarantees from that usa come in form usa could come in the form of enhanced intelligence gathering to �* ukraine enhanced intelligence gathering to �*ukraine and to enhanced intelligence gathering to �* ukraine and to keep a ts allow ukraine and ts iceep a on anything ts allow ukraine and ts keep a on anything that russia check on anything that russia be doing. is that might be doing. is that something you think would into7 7 int; p7la7y77777 .1;; 111—tai come into play? ze? that come into play? gee? that seaks to come into play? zee1 - that speaks to what come into new: - that speaks to what the things. that speaks to what the us brings nato, brings to the is kind 7iskind to alliance. is kind of hardto thin tanks troops gardens and ships and so 7 77t77hey7do7 7 77 7 7 77 7 7 77t77hey7do7 ha7v7e7 7 77 7 7 77t77hey7do7 page; 77 7 7 77 can; haveéshépfeity —*e— —7 —*e— —m 7 critical capabilities that we are used to relying on within nato, it is �* placement of nato, it is her placement of those is actually more those that is actually msre in a way than the challenging in a way than the other parts �* being able other parts of being able to defend ukraine 1682