>> from our studios in new york, this is "charlie rose." >> i support all of my teammates.

i love all the members unconditionally. i do feel like i have great support. i have spoken to a lot of teammates. gomes.to speak to jonny >> the yankees third baseman has been suspended for the 2000 14 season for using performance- enhancing drugs. the ruling was handed down over the weekend by the chief arbitrator. suspension forst doping in the history of baseball. filed claims against the mlb and the players union. withnutes had a interview the man who supplied his drugs. once alice rugg redress -- what were the test us -- what were the --

>> testosterone. human growth hormone. different forms of peptides. >> all of them banned? >> all of them banned. >> and he knew that? >> yes, he did. >> and you knew that. >> yes. >> was he injecting himself with these? times he would ask me to inject. >> eu injected him personally. >> tony bosch told us he became his client in 2010. he says he can -- supplied athletes with drugs for 10 years. a corrupt sideline to his anti- aging clinic. >> he wanted to know. he would study the product. hisuse he wanted to achieve

, the moste objectives important one was the hundred home run club. love. 800 home run it was going to have only one member. alex rodriguez. >> i am pleased to have met the table. tell me where is this now? we have seen bosch on 60 minutes last night. a-rodsonally injected with drugs. where is the game? , clearly herator believe the evidence that he presented in the hearing. alex rodriguez is challenging the suspension and the accusations. the interesting thing here is, he is entire alien -- entirely

alone in the lawsuit. notplayers association are doing a better job of defending him. he is saying the ruling is not just wrong, but he wasn't impartial. about alexs this say rodriguez? is it that he has nothing to lose? therefore he will go down fighting to the last moment? think that certainly is a part of it. you have to remember the resources and he has to his advantage. he has the two bridges contracts in baseball history. this is not your ordinary player. this is someone who can withstand a long, legal process if that is what he chooses. >> a sea of any argument? >> not that i can see. this arbitrator's

opinion, part of the lawsuit, it had to be part of the lawsuit because originally they try to get a tro. , a temporary restraining order, stopping the suspension. the judge said you cannot do that and not unseal the arbitrator's opinion. they decided to go ahead and file the suit anyway. it opened at the door to unsealing this opinion. it was supposed to be kept secret for the rest of time. it is read the opinion, devastating. absolutely devastating. >> how question are >> chapter and verse the charges they have against him. the interviews with bosch. everything that bosch said last tenfold. the purchases he'd made from

them on these drugs. the fact they had core breading evidence. -- quite rating evidence. had aleague baseball solid case. it was irrefutable. >> what is the picture we get? the richestte, contract in baseball, doing everything he can to enhance his performance? >> yes. that is what these things are all about. as bosch pointed out, a rod came to him and said i want to be the 800 club. the only guy in history to hit 800 home runs. i thought it was interesting that they were showing on the injected, hesy got would have fabulous days where he was hitting a home run against somebody.

this is the first i have ever seen proof of how steroids work. >> he would play better. >> right. >> you are left with the of baseball and what damage this does to baseball. we had bud selig who was overwhelmed. >> and so was the arbitrator. in that ruling, the arbitrator said this length of suspension thebe unprecedented, so was misconduct he committed. that is saying a mouthful for a sport that has been rippled with the steroids problem for the better part of two decades or more. i think on the one hand, it helps major league baseball because it shows they're going after the player no matter how rich. if you violate the agreement, they will go after you.

this is unusual. whenever there has been strange -- change on these issues, ,ambling, cocaine, or steroids it is always the federal government that has provided the outside agent of change for these issues. this is the first time to my knowledge that a came internally. no federal involvement. major league baseball department of investigations. it is forcing the longest suspension in baseball history when it comes to dep. >> i'm thinking of the comparison of lance armstrong. a he had not tried to make comeback the last time, he might not have been discovered. is there a similar kind of pattern, or timeline for a rod? >> the problem that baseball has

, and all these agencies have, it is really impossible to this -- to stay ahead of the people coming up on these new designer drugs they can't be detected. that is the case here was with baseball. in one way, this biogenesis candle -- scandal was the best thing that ever happened. they were finally able to get people who were coming up with these designer drugs, enabling players to beat their drug tests. in drug tests, there have been very few players testing positive in the last year or so. we all know now by this case there are still players that are doing a lot of drugs, beating the system. they didn't have any subpoena power. they had no help from the government. didn't, and they

what they did was they sued bosch. by suing bosch, they were able to get him into court and then start mounting his own defense funds. me, it played out like a movie. there were threats saying they won a bosch to go to columbia to get out of the limelight. it had all of the elements of a movie thriller. >> i regarded as a novel come to life. take your lance armstrong analogy and extend it further. when lance armstrong was asked when he stopped doping, he 2009, the cycling body implemented biological passport testing in which your timetio is monitored from

to time. up until last her, it was all belowkeeping your ratio 4-1. most people is 1-1. they allow this window. that is what tony bosch is doing. manipulating ratios. laster it is a new ballgame. that is when you can take the atio, and it it says spiked all, once they do, that is a red flag. even if it is not above 4-1/ . you're going to get busted. that worked fine in 2012. it is not workaday. >> fascinating. thank you for joining us. great to see you again. case continues. back in a moment. stay with us. in order to live together,

law and order should be kept. you have to keep employing order. justice should be made. saturday inron died a hospital. he was 85 years old. he suffered a massive stroke. he will be remembered as one of the most influential leaders in history. one of the greatest warriors. he will -- he played roles in the six-day war as a commander of the israeli army. elected prime minister in 2001 after the outbreak of the second palestinian intifada. dignitaries from 20 countries attended his memorial in jerusalem. joe biden was among those whom

eulogized him. >> like all historic leaders, he was a complex man. alreadyich you have heard from his colleagues, who engendered strong opinions. like all historic leaders, all real leaders, he had a northstar that guided him. never,star from which he in my observation, never deviated. goldberg. me, jeffrey and ethan bronner of the new york times. israel -- tell me what israel and the world has lost in the character and achievement of ariel sharon. eight years ago

when he fell into a coma. at a moment of inflection for israel. he had just pulled out of gaza. reversing what he had done earlier in his career. he is the guy that put the sellers -- the settlers in place. the expectation he was going to pivot and do the same in the west bank. greatest warrior hero emma was in a position politically to do such an evacuation. stroke, nonethat of the leaders who followed him have been able to do the thing the majority of israelis say reverseuld be done, to the settlement project and free

some accommodation with the palestinians. his loss is as important in my mind as it has ever been. reald thent the d peace process. -- derailed the peace process. i do not think you can overstate it. >> was he in your judgment with drawn from the west bank? >> there are theories about that. he did gaza to avoid dealing with the west bank. the second theory, this is where eileen, he was ruthlessly pragmatic. felt that the way to secure israel demographic future, as a jewish majority, settlers from the the west bank. he would have done it. he had the power within society

to try and execute that. headingthat they were in that direction. we will never know obviously. it is plausible. >> we will come back to that. as a zionist, you've written about that. >> him as a zionist. that is a great question. he didn't comes, from either real camp. into an ideology. he was ruthlessly pragmatic. what work is what he believed in. he had no faith at all in arabs and palestinians negotiating with them, working with them. his view was in some ways the revisionist view of building a new iron wall. came time to make

decisions about moving forward because it was no longer possible to hold onto all of this territory and people, that is when he began to think about talking about occupation and switching. in some ways, his story is the story of this country. the story of zionism, both in its brutal form and its effort to come to terms with reality. >> would you consider him the greatest is really military leader? whoever?han i should qualify that. he was the greatest reckless general israel had. you could argue. sharon had operations to his

name that were extraordinary. in the 1973 war, when israel was on it's heels, he managed to and came suez canal within striking distance of cairo. it was an achievement. it was one study by militaries around the world. where does the reckless park i'm in? he decided in that way he was going to remake lebanon, to expel the pillow -- plo. you have to put that in his credit column. he was the sort of tank commander that any prime minister would want to have in his corner at a stressful moment. >> george patton. argue patton is

the best general, but certainly the boldest. and he is famous for not following orders. >> exactly. he began in the early 1950. this was the first leak commander unit. the whole effort was no rules. we're above roles. they were lied about afterwards. ,hat became the way these units 19-year-old kids, very bright people, doing these daring acts. he set the tone for that throughout the entire military. >> what was his relationship with others? was all the people who have been prime minister,

netanyahu, -- the older guys, they admired him anyway for his nativeborn grit. they loved, they felt represented the outlook. his peers found it difficult to get along with him. throughout his career he got into incredible riffs with people. he and netanyahu never got along. >> white question mark what's he refused to follow any rules. he wanted it to do it entirely his way. >> this comes back to that point about, he was all energy. all the energy was forward. lebanon, that energy was used for destructive purpose. war, he was such a

man of action. he was uncontainable. that he had -- he was courtly to his political rivals. and had a surprising sense of humor. >> he was a funny guy. like a lot of people in public life, they are far more approachable and appealing to talk to then you would expect. that is right. he had a kind of manner to him. he was brought up by snobbish russian parents he found a lot of that thing irritating. cried -- he was quite charming. he seemed to want to please. he wanted to make sure that you were comfortable and you were happy. it is not a well-known

characteristic among is really prime ministers. >> how did he feel about the idea of the jewish day? -- jewish state? >> he was in favor of focusing on that. they have a talk about it for decades. he definitely felt, this was the core issue for him. when the arab or old accepts the legitimacy of the jewish state, we can talk about making peace. no point., there is whether he would make this demand, that seems reasonable to imagine he might have. he was not interested in negotiating. >> i spent a long time with them

before he ran for prime minister. he had discouraging things to say about palestinians, about the nature of arab hatred for jews. down whenic was toned he became prime minister. when i saw him several month before he had the stroke, the worldview had not changed at all. the plot from gaza was almost a response to the immutability of arab hatred. he was looking to engineer a divorce. >> then there is the thing about al-assad. wasperson he really feared sharon. >> the interesting thing about that is when assad looked at sharon, especially his behavior, he saw himself.

rules.re assad had a muslim brotherhood problem. he leveled a city. he saw an sharon the only israeli he feared could do the thing. eastern.ron was middle i don't mean that in an enlightened way. he absorbed the lessons of the behavior of people like al- assad. he thought israel had to be as brutal as those dictators. that is what got him into trouble in lebanon. >> there is this. the idea that we withdraw from gaza was a huge mistake. it led to hamas getting more power. and destroyed unity within the palestinians. >> there are two arguments.

the right wing argument says we should never have left. the left wing argument, by not negotiating, by just leaving, you're basically legitimizing leadership, and allow hamas to rise in gaza. that is the strong argument that has been made about why he is probably responsible for the rise of hamas. we a pivotthings, moment in 2006 when he had his stroke. we don't really know whether that is the reason hamas rose. we don't know many things. >> one of the ultimate ironies about his life is that his last significant act was interpreted by his foes as an active capitulation. he left gaza without getting anything in return. that is a legitimate critique.

his belief that the palestinians would not negotiate under any circumstances let him to take this unilateral step, which was interpreted by hamas as a victory for their brand of terrorism. , the fact theres matter remains today there are no israeli settlers and gaza. that is a good thing from a lot of people's perspective. sharon, come about to the question of where we are today, and what we know about the negotiations secretary kerry is trying to pull off. more than i.n a -- jeff may know more than i. they been trying to get some kind of framework together they can agree on to move forward, to

allow for more settlers to be moved possibly, or to be a two state deal. in the four years that i was in jerusalem, there was no sense that this government had any taste for removal of anybody. except for outpost. certainly not most settlers by any means. nothing like the 80,000 that will be necessary to move forward. there is that issue. there is the issue of the jordan valley. permit military presence? and the right of return in jerusalem. all these issues one cannot imagine how they're finding a way through. on the other hand they are still working. that it issurprised still viable? >> both sides are just trying to figure out when is john kerry going to leave.

carrie is wearing them down. the problem is twofold. they are divided. half of palestine is controlled by hamas. that is a nonstarter. the palestinian leader is not as strong as yost arafat. side, primeli minister who has many suspicions of the arabs as sharon had, but not in the sense of action or confidence, but in his own ability to change reality around him. netanyahu is a man of inaction. it is hard to see him taking ariel sharons would've taken in the circumstances. >> there are many hands here. netanyahu,rest of they share an interest in actually getting some kind of a

creating that it would have some storm -- some form of stability. that is why netanyahu does understand and does grasp there is a demographic problem. israel can't have control over the west bank. the key question is, when sharon did the withdraw, he knew the prop -- party was split. now i know understands -- netanyahu understands the problems they see israel. if he leaves the party, no many people would follow him. this is a guy who is interested in maintaining his grip on the prime minister ship. i am not confident kerry can talk him into that boldness rate

>> thank you. we will be back. stay with us.

,> the thing that every israeli

every jew, wants peace. generals are not expected to live wars. -- and one >> i have had several conversations with ariel sharon. we conclude with those moments. friend you think of your ? how do you feel about the way he is running the government? what you say in these private moments? the stories you remain friends and have conversations about the future of the country. wax i have known him for 43 years. i have appreciation for mr. rabin.

discuss national problems. i think that in this case, by shaking hands with a war criminal, by signing the with one palestinian terrorist organization, there is an assumption they will fight others. >> hamas. >> yes. they have an agreement. continue, and they're not going to fight each other. the assumption of one organization will defend the israelis from the other, that

will not exist. case, mr.at in this rabin made the mistake. there are good generals and bright generals that make mistakes. >> you made mistakes yourself. >> everyone in their career has made mistakes. >> tummy tuck the mistake -- tell me about the mistake, israel has nothing -- nothing to fear from the plo. we have questions of assault on individuals. nothing that this great nation has to fear from the plo. you disagree question my >> completely. we can see that everything .tarted from a palestinian

terror, murder. we cannot live in israel because of terror. we had to defend ourselves. we started complaining to the united nations. >> then you created unit 101. retaliatet, you would exponentially stronger. >> that was the policy of the government then. policy.it was the right israel cannot survive that way. in order to live there, the decided to take steps against terrorist. arab countries hosting those organizations. they could not leave.

started in ther middle east. >> terrorist led to war. >> they lead to war. see the seeds of this feature war that all of us would like to prevent. >> you have said before that you .anted to assassinate arafat you wanted to see him killed the cousin thought he was an enemy of the state. correct? >> through the years, tremendous effort to bring to a situation go to haverers who civilian blood on his hands, should be out of society. we made tremendous effort three >> to kill him.

>> you use very hard words. >> why is that hard work? of him.nted to get rid >> that is a euphemism for killing him. >> that is not the right word. to kill, to assassinate. we speak about a murderer. >> he wanted to murder him. >> no, no. >> why did you fail? >> it was complicated. he is always on the move and you can never get that close. >> many reasons. wantedthe reasons, we , but we werenments

aware of the fact that civilian people do not have any concept of murder altogether, might be helped. that was maybe the main reason why it failed. maybe the best special units. >> to you want the prime minister? >> to be prime minister is not my dream. >> do you want to be? >> it will be necessary. if it is necessary, i will do it. it is not my dream. i believe if i become prime minister, some dreams may be accomplished.

>> you not believe that an high on who -- netanyahu is the best leave the party? this is not the best place to discuss is really politicians. we have problems in our party. i believe these problems will be solved. >> how long can israel continue the way that it is? without some aspect for peace? not expectingfor war any moment? how'd do you go about changing that? what peres says to you. what is your plan? everyst, the thing that israeli, every jew, wants peace. not generally generals are expected to like war.

myself was branded as a general looking for war. i might tell you some impersonal. i've been participating in all of the wars of the state of israel. a started as a private first class. horrors. the i felt all the fears of the battles. friends.ost of our i was seriously wounded twice. i felt terrible pains of being in the hospital. i hate to make the decisions of light -- life-and-death of myself and of others. --ieve me, the part of these believe me, anderson the part of peace better than those politicians.

how long can they live like that? thatll have to live like change in there is no the attitude of the arab world to juice in israel. jews - in israel. we has be very careful. i think it is important jews around the world, and friends of israel, should understand that if we are facing all the time and now dangers to our existence. decide if theto ans want to help -- have independent country of their own

. to hold ato be ready sword in one hand. not mean they do not take steps for peace. >> are you disappointed? >> nothing personal. >> how do you feel? >> c is making a terrible mistake. historic mistake. i am sorry for that. >> just sorry? .> i'm sorry that is what i feel. i worry about it. the more i think that this government brought us into one of the most dangerous situations we have ever been in since the establishment of the state of israel. i have seen a difficult

situation. i never lost my self-confidence. it is going to be very complicated. thing.ve in the same our rights to this country. maybe we will be able to overcome that. >> why are you more involved -- why aren't you more involved? i know you talk to a lot of people. you got in your car after the change of power in the gaza strip. you drove to gaza. .o look you want to be back in. do you think it will happen? are you prepared?

are you ready? think the answer is yes. -- the first question is how to bring back responsibility for the future of future into our hands. it is not in our hands now. back in our it hands. believe, ithing i can provide necessary answers. i don't know the problems. >> you have no concessions anywhere in your answer. >> no, no. what i'm saying is, there will

be concessions. >> here is the judgment on you so far. great soldier. terrible politician. >> one can use any kind of terms. i don't know what they mean, to be a great politician. to shake hands with a murderer is to be a great politician? , to be a great politician. that meanillusions you become a great politician. myself.involve

i think the results, every -- ira membergo 31 years ago after i left the military, i came up the idea to parties,ether five national jewish parties, into one place. everyone burst into laughter. the good soldier knows how to move divisions. he commands hundreds of tanks. what does he understand in politics? i will not -- >> you will not accept their judgment you are a bad politician. >> no. >> and you say to foreign

ministers you are both older than i am. >> i don't think it is important. who are verypeople old. i know all people who are very young. value them is can you situation, do you have the answers? i believe they do have the answers to the problems. i can provide the answers for the most coveted of problems. >> tom friedman wrote a book in which you were mentioned in number of times. youas said about you is, were the one person assad veered in israel. he is now writing a column for

the new york times. he said there is increased since among the israeli public that -- they're more inclined to see two accepted states, and to , and have aitory clean division between them. using the is a good idea? do you think that is a good idea? he doesn't fear the present government. maybe it would have been a , and wet government would reach much better piece on both sides. any possibility for any separation. what is the means of separation?

have close to one million palestinians who are israeli citizens. what is going to happen. many support the hamas movement. then? going to separate what will happen to jerusalem? are we going to have to divide jerusalem? were going to prevent palestinians from gaza? or to jericho? are we going to build fences? hundreds of kilometers of fences. who will defend the fences? not the answer. >> what is the answer? >> the jews and arabs live together.

they have been living together for many years. all, law and order has to be kept. you have to employ order. justice should be made of its commitment. >> do you have a home in the -- party? benjamin netanyahu said you are permanent subversive. >> many things have been said. [indiscernible] left in 1973, i brought

five parties together. that was the party i have been serving with. keeparty was a way to ideas. >> s not -- no one -- >> how is it that you, and look at things so differently, and rabin look at the same way, and you differ? in the military [indiscernible] they see different. i think, i don't know what the

, but it doesrack make a difference. differences about the and i think there are -- i believe peace means security. that is what we are looking for. >> you have said in today's climate he's has been the goal rather than a means. >> piece is a goal. peace is a goal.

what we need first is security. fear't think the desire we -- feel [indiscernible] everything is in our hands. we could live peacefully. ♪

.

>> this is "taking stock" for tuesday, january 14, 2014. i am mark crumpton in for pimm fox. this hour we focus on things that are ready to take off. air cap makes a $5 billion deal with aig. the company is set to become a leading global franchise for aircraft. plus, the top executive from a digital mini company that is adding 25,000 companies per day. we will tell you why they are considered the youtube of publishing. plus, why lindsey vonn will take off once set