>> from our studios in new york city, this is "charlie rose." >> jeff koons is having a moment. "the new yorker" magazine calls him the most original, controversial, and expensive american artist in the last two decades. his his 10 foot stainless steel

sculpture sold for $58.4 million. is the most extensive piece of art ever sold by a living artist at auction. and they are presenting him with his first retrospective. it is the largest solo exhibition ever mounted at the museum. here is a look. ♪ i love that.

>> i always like the way they make me feel. i feel like i come into contact with my feelings and i've always love them. >> you have seen all you have done. it is there in that museum. what do you think? >> is nice for me to look at some of the images because i don't live with all those pieces and a lot of them are fresh to me again. owned by collectors and attend to live with other art. i am in my studio all day long and i'm around my work. it shows to me that it has been fun. i think i have been doing exactly what i've wanted to do

and it makes me feel more ambitious. i would like to do something. i think i have been having a dialogue and i want to do more. >> are you waiting, are you inspired, do you have something that has been there? that you just can't wait to get on with the creation? >> it is to exercise the freedom that we have for gesture, to experience the greatest amount of enlightenment that we can and to do the things that i really want to do in life. the things that you really want to do are the hardest things to do. >> haven't you been doing what you want to do for a while? >> i have been trying but i think you can get better at it.

you can give yourself more freedom. i think picasso gave himself the most amount of freedom when he was 88, 89, 90 years of age. it is astounding how much freedom that he gave himself. >> what you mean by freedom he gave himself? >> they are so layered, they are so accomplished, they have so much energy. they have the energy of the 24-year-old but with the wisdom and knowledge and layering that someone who has kind of a cognitive consciousness. and so vast. the amount of human information. such a desire and possibilities telling us what you can contribute to your own life and to your community. and at such a late age.

>> on this retrospective, has informed you and giving you insight into yourself? >> yes. it is there together. it is a lifetime and in relationships. >> i think about how my journey as an artist started and is started by not having any idea of art. it was presented to me really as a tool to draw and replicate something. and when i was really young, i drew something like that. my parents came up and patted me on the back. it gave me a sense of self. it wasn't until i got to college that i had any understanding

that art is something that connects you. effortlessly to your community and society and you can deal with all the human disciplines so effortlessly. you can deal in psychology, philosophy, psychology. you're trying to have a discourse in a wide variety area of human disciplines, what it means to be a human being and a flourish. >> you have often spoken about art and how it is perceived by individuals. >> i think it is how i feel as a creator. i like my senses to get excited and physically, i like to feel sensation in my eyes and i like excitement and for the senses to start having ideas generated. the mind and body together. and there is a point were you take on moral responsibility to

your community. i have already learned how to feel sensation myself and transcendence in my life. automatically, you want to share that. when you're younger, you think about sharing with other artist and you share with the broader community. >> is the reason -- the reason you're doing this now because you have the technology to do it? or do you find yourself in a moment where you have enough and you want to see it in its entirety? >> i wanted to have a show in new york for quite some time. there are different opportunities and when the whitney came to me with the space -- >> the entire museum. >> which is fantastic. i have been working for many decades and i think we are showing about 35 years worth of work. and i have worked on different

scales, but it was a chance to really bring everything together. i have shown a lot in europe, france, germany. i am kind of on the ground as an artist. i worked very closely with scott rothko. we worked very closely for five years. >> is not easy to put your stuff out because of size and weight and delicacy. an unique technology and a bunch of other things. >> the whitney was fantastic to work with. they never said no. i would like to show this work, they never said we can't do that. there is a problem with the budget or having that expense. >> how many months before they

were installed? >> some of them days. >> it is not just a retrospective. an up-to-date retrospective. >> we just finished that. >> we probably finished that inside the museum. it is kind of natural. you work on things and you try to put as much energy into that as we can. >> you don't want people to be intimidated by art. >> i remember my first day of college and i had no idea what art could be. as soon as i arrived, we signed papers and were enrolled. we got on the bus and went to the baltimore museum.

and when we got there, i went inside the museum and i looked at paintings and they did not know any of the artist. i did not know matisse. i would have known picasso and dali. i felt like i survive that moment and a lot of people don't survive that moment. i wanted to work where people did not feel they had to bring anything to the table other than who they are. that they are perfect. that art is about them. not to disempower that. >> that is my point about you really caring about how people respond to art. what impact does it have on them? >> i care about my experience

first. i love the transcendence that i feel expanding my parameters and interests. i want to share that. it is not that i set out to make something. it is not a conscious way of going about it. it is very intuitive. i follow my interests and a focus on those interest. it takes me to a kind of metaphysical place. >> if somebody writes a thesis and says his work lacks its electoral rhythm, do you give a dam-- intellectual rhythm, do you give a damn? >> i don't want to lose anybody and i don't want to lack communication.

i want to make the best work i can to try to bring about a positive and informing to my life and community. i know my intentions. i really wanted to try to contribute so i feel like i've lost somebody but do i care pass that, i just go with it. >> words like showman and salesman? >> i go on. i know there is a certain visual quality, maybe a spotlight quality. but that is just to compete with the rest of the world. you have hollywood or you have all these other realms of information and they attract

attention. they enjoy the presentation of themselves. >> do you like the idea of selling? >> it is kind of the moral frontline of society. maneuvers are making reference to the door-to-door salesman selling you a vacuum cleaner. >> exactly. you say the frontline of morality and everything else, that it was a way of connecting. >> you know, as a child, i was brought up to be self-reliant. and i would sell drinks on the golf course. i will go door to door selling giftwrapping paper. a lot of the images that are in my celebration work. riggins, candy. i learned to be self-reliant and

you want to go outside yourself and become more involved in your society and your community. >> some people have written micro swanson in new york magazine, the art establishment doesn't just endure the work of the artist but for the most art that of the world-famous koons and others that have become so big and so rich that it no longer seems important to have opinions. you stand above the art establishment. you're that big. >> i don't know about that. i just wanted to participate. i wanted to get in there and have a dialogue with dali, liechtenstein, picasso, and be part of this dialogue. that is what is really exciting

and rewarding. >> you don't think you're that big? >> i think i have a platform as an artist. >> you have a retrospective in an entire museum. that, by any artist imagination, is huge. >> it is a tremendous platform but at the same time, i want to do something. >> it's not about being huge, it's about doing something. >> it's about becoming. i really want to make work that can affect the lives of people. i really believe in mobility. i believe in enlightenment and i hope that a viewer comes across

my work and is stimulated in whatever manner. our friend speaks about the beholder. and there is some communication there but it is about themselves, about their interest, their desires and that they can walk away feeling stimulated and feel that they can expand their life. that is really what i'm interested in. >> and there is the reality of the impact you have. that you are a catalyst in our culture. and that when a viewer engages in your work, we really know what we are. >> as a human being, as an artist, i try to be honest and i try to go about my life and make the works about the things that i respond to. i have a family that is really important to me and my life is

about being with them and enjoying life and looking at things. so i go about and look at things and what i respond to, i carry with me. and eventually, i will make a gesture or an artwork based on those interests. usually things resonate for maybe two years before actually making the gesture. finally, it will be of a relevance. >> you talk about your ability to somehow identify or nail an image or an object as something that captures the zeitgeist of the moment. do you feel that? >> all of these things as an artist, it is flattering to hear some of it.

i look back and i am proud of some of the works and i think some of them today look kind of iconic. >> it has an impact beyond itself. >> if this is happening -- i was interviewed and somebody said to me, you have success right now, but aren't you afraid you're going to lose it? such an odd thing to say to a young artist. so i started to think about, what do i do? what is the process i do as an artist? i think the process is the same for whatever anybody does whether you are an artist or a mathematician or whatever. i think the only thing you can

do is follow your interest. and for my childhood in pennsylvania, whatever my parents and extended family directed me, i follow my interest and focus on those interests. dali was an influence. he was an influence i representing an internal journey that i learned to go inward and express myself. it's all about this inward journey, the beginning of the 20th century. and also his generosity as a person. when i was 18, i called him up. i asked if i could visit him and he answered the phone and said yes. come up on saturday, i will meet you in the lobby and he was there. he asked me if i would go to the gallery that he had an exhibition at. and that generosity, i went home that night thinking i can do

this. i can participate and live a life like this and be involved with ideas and art and it can be a way of life. >> but you've got to admit, it took something. not everybody calls him up at the hotel and says, this is jeff koons. i would like to meet you. it requires a certain quality of self. when you look at the consequences, you can have that kind of life. you would have to work thomas be creative, and be fully engaged. >> that is all i've ever wanted. i am trying to participate in this kind of tradition and kind of an extension of the avant garde.

originally, i went to art school in baltimore, maryland. i love the chicago images. i studied with a great art historian there and at a certain point, i wanted to stop going on in inward journey and i wanted to be involved with more objective art. >> your relationship and son you lost in court battles in italy, how did that impact everything? >> when i ended up into a custody situation with my son, he was born in the states and

taken illegally to italy by his mother. i was never able to get him back. i won custody, but he was there in italy for so long that they would not send him back. it was a time that i was really losing confidence in humanity and i had only my art to hang onto. that is what i hung onto and i decided to make ends to try to communicate to him that if not at this moment, he could realize how much i was thinking about him. i wanted to make works that could hold up in the larger context of making art because at the same time, i would not be his dad that's also an artist performing on a level of making

great works but my son ludwig, i brought him some plato and he made a mound and he said dad, look. wa-wa. i looked at this mound of plato and everything that i try to do every day of my life to make something that you couldn't make any judgments about. is it too much red, too much blue? it was perfect. ended up going back to my studio and making that. i think there is a mythic quality. an interior or dark quality like a trojan horse. so that theory, i was trying to maintain my confidence and my belief in humanity to show my son how much i loved him and at the same time, the performing on the highest level i could. >> was your attraction to his mother -- you can't explain it,

it just has its own notion that only the two of them understand? >> you mean ilona at the time? she was an extremely beautiful woman, very attractive. and we started the made in heaven photo shoots. she was kind of very vulnerable, showing me how she got involved in pornography as a young woman and she wanted a different life and we fell in love. we ended up in a short time having ludwig and that it wasn't going to work out but i was in love with her. >> did made in heaven help or hurt? >> i think i became a better artist.

i loved the hunan bust. i am proud of the paintings and proud of the work and i think i came out of it a better human being. i have my wife and my family. she is my muse today, so i am really very happy. ♪

>> what about warhol? >> andy, when i came to the city, i never wanted to go to the factory or hang out. i always saw him there and i met

him superficially, twice. studio 54 and once in an elevator somewhere. i knew there was a dialogue and the relevance of his work. i always thought of kind of the grandfather, you have the sun and you have andy. kind of following in the tradition of the ready made in that dialogue. >> today, we will talk about specific pieces -- you were concerned about a happy life because you want to be as creative as you can until the 80's. i have a total of eight and six young ones that range from almost two -- and justine and my oldest is 13. >> what do you think? it is the work? >> a major portion of my life is the work. my mental interest, what i can have my life he come, what i can give to my society and my

culture is through the work. and i would say the last decade, especially. the kind of idea of more of an internal aspect that is subjective and the objective really come full circle. i live a way of just going about my life kind of daily, not under a lot of pressure. not like i have to do something today, and have my goals set to make the pieces i want to make when i am thinking about to do that. >> does anything bother you? >> i would say stagnation bothers me. i think injustice bothers me. i think i've been involved in

work that is about very much leveling. i have tried to make art accessible for people and i don't mean dumbing something down, i try to enrich myself every day to the fullest that i can to know more about antiquities and what art can be. it is really what i'm involved with. what art can be in to try to make it something as vital and engaged in our lives as possible. trying to make art that everybody can not feel

intimidated by but have an experience that is absolutely to the capacity that at that moment, they are ready for. >> this is the inflatable flowers. tell me about this. >> i moved to new york and was becoming very influenced. i saw these inflatable flowers in the showroom room and they only sold inflatable's. they were sold for modern home decor. my father was an interior decorator so i grew up with him displaying objects in his furniture store. an ashtray or a table. i was intrigued about making these objects, and if you look at it as kind of metaphoric, feminine, and masculine. this is a double-decker. i was asked -- displaying objects and to confront the viewer with aspects of

mortality. and the strength of something inanimate against one thing that is animate. these objects display their integrity. i would impact them and this kind of display case. they are displaying their integrity of earth. >> and one of them is total equilibrium. >> i wanted to make work that was more biological. this is a little more masculine way of looking at consumerism. but this is pre-birth. before the new and after death. it is kind of a timeless situation here.

the ultimate state of being. >> did you consult with richard feynman about this? >> i did. i saw some paper that you put in the back of a fish tank and that was the beginning of equilibrium. how can i have this date -- i read in time magazine that dr. feynman enjoyed art. he told me i could do it and i could have a basketball hovering in fish tank at equilibrium and i kept looking. i searched and continued to be in contact but it is really impossible.

i would need a much higher tank, but he was fantastic. i ended up using very pure sodium. it is not a homogenous solution. but the way light travels through the water, it is very hard to see the water down below because of the sodium. >> i love the idea that you just called him up and said, i read you love dart and i would love to -- >> he was great. i was at the library. i was trying to understand equilibrium and how to achieve it. i was not able to achieve permanent equilibrium.

i could have two admissible liquids were the ball would always be there but it wouldn't have the purity. >> the inflatable that we saw, and the next one is 1986. this is from luxury and degradation. >> i was riding the subway in new york and i realized that depending on the stops and the economic environment of the city, that advertising was using abstraction and different levels depending on the income level of that location so people at that time made $10,000 or less would see images and the type of abstraction taking place here is like taking your weekly paycheck

and gamble and throw things in the air. it is really about risk. that is that form of abstraction. we would go up economically and to a higher level of society which was grand central station. you would get to an image like that and you would be hit with a much heavier form of abstraction where it would be like a wave of liquor and there would be a little information in the way that you would also be disconnected from your society. and you can find a quiet table. totally disconnected. >> how long between idea and execution? >> i think things generally

resonate for about two years. i would have a show every two years sometimes, but the information that getting ready to maybe start to make a gesture, there are some others. >> this is louis the 14th, 1986. >> i found louis the 14th on canal street. it used to have a lot of plastics and a fiberglass cast probably for restaurant or somebody's backyard. i saw louis and maybe a couple days later i saw a small statue of bob hope. and i realized that they are the two ends of the dialogue tom a kind of a panoramic view. if you give art to a monarch, eventually it will become reflective of their ego and

become decorative. and if you give art to the masses, it will reflect past ego which bob hope represented. telling a joke not because -- maybe subjectively he thought it was funny but it eventually becomes reflective of mass ego. and the similar thing would happen to the artist. it was about losing control. >> my rabbit was part of the statuary exhibition. they had been very important collaborators. i think one of the things that i always try to do is i direct my work to dealers that had interests in the same areas that i had interest. i would have interest in say photo narrative work. i think a lot of artists make the mistake of they go and get

involved in the community that can have very different interest. and so the community, all the artist and friends, we would sit around and talk about art and have a beer. it is really like a whole generation in a way. moving forward with their ideas the way they see the possibilities for art and the way they see the world. >> the next image is michael jackson and bubbles. >> i made a piece right before the curl, a piece that was a fiasco. i made a mold on a ready-made statue and it got banged up against the wall to get the ceramic shell.

i had to decide to not be in a major international exit vision, to drop out, or to give it radical plastic surgery. to work with this ready-made object and make it presentable. for me, everything we have been looking at, these images are ready-made. i work with something and i try to maintain every aspect of it. every flaw and every perfection to try to maintain a. and it freed me because i realized it was just a metaphor. and what i really cared about was people. it was about their flaws, their perfections. i was just freed and it was a tremendous experience. michael jackson and bubbles and these works to try to communicate to people that their

own cultural history was part of it. >> is this in any way indebted -- >> it is renaissance sculptures, a triangle. it also has an egyptian quality to it. a little bit like king type. >> here is one that we already talked about. >> is was a large billboard. after banality, i had a huge success with that show. people said it was the equivalent of roy lichtenstein. i really kind of became an art star. at the same time feeling that culturally not being very relevant and participating in american culture through the film industry, entertainment

industry, the standard has been kind of looked at as being culturally significant. maybe i will put another star on my shoulder and the easiest way would be film. and they asked me if i would have interest in participating in an exhibition. if i wanted to make billboards and i could do anything i wanted on the billboard. i thought, i will call that politician. i used some of the images of ilana. i used an image of a dress that she wore. one of my banality sculptures. i will call that woman up and i will just use her as a ready-made set. i will put myself in their and it will be like we are making a film. it will be called made in heaven. i called her up, i hired her. >> and fell in love. the next one is balloon dog.

one of the more famous. >> it is like a child's birthday party. i have always enjoyed inflatable's. vacuum cleaners, things dealing with lungs. breathing. it is kind of anthropomorphic. >> and you said when the air goes out, it is almost imagery for death. >> and now it is optimism. it can be like that tomorrow or the day after tomorrow. it has very strong optimism and it is mythic. but when inflatable loses its air, it is -- >> is it representative of darker themes? >> you are not so involved in the interior of that object but with celebration.

but when i get this transparent coating to it tom and they become darker. they developed an interior life. there is a darkness, and internal quality. >> this shows you how long it took to make it. the sculpture we see is the one that you mentioned before, constructive and given to you. >> he did not make this exact one but he made it. >> it is connected to the inspiration for this? >> i made this entry created it, i am large did. originally i was good to put in

polyethylene. it is a material that a lot of times will make toys for children where they can have their own car or a play house in the backyard. but as i continue to work on the model, i gave it undercuts where i no longer had this two percent or three percent draft that i needed to pull the mold. i made a conscious decision to keep making it hyperrealistic. and i ended up changing to put it into aluminum. i think to me it represents the 20th century and is kind of freudian. the mounds just play on top of each other. and it has an interior feeling as well. each has an inside face, top and bottom and how they construct themselves organically. it also has a freudian quality. think it also has kind of the

20th century -- >> not just 10 years but 20 years. the next one is split rocker. this is from the series "easy fun." >> my son had a rocking horse and i would look at the rocking horse and the same line between the rocking horse and the two sides of it right down the center. i was walking around and saw this dino rock. wouldn't it be interesting to cut the rock down the center and put the profiles together? i think this was at the time of the divorce custody so i think one was maybe myself, one is the ex-wife, or at least a sense of division of what was taking place. and the line that happens in

between where these two forms come together, i always thought that liechtenstein would appreciate it because you can try to drive and define it but the only ways to kind of experience it. >> one more slide. >> painting. i have always been a painter. i went to art school and i studied painting. i never studied sculpture. i am always making paintings and it's kind of a montage of images. when i was making these paintings, i would go through thousands of magazines and look at images. if it had resonance to me, i would pull the page and i would go on and have more magazines. i would go through these pages

and start having stacks where things looks like they linked together. and in the backyard of the junk ground somewhere, these other images ended up being in that pile and that is how the painting was created. >> here is an example of how you have influence the culture. this is a conversation from my colleague morley safer. a great friend of yours and a great collector. >> he is probably the largest collector. he was there for you when you needed it. >> one of his favorite artists is the your principal jeff koons. a veritable cornucopia of genius. all painted and sculpted by hired craftsmen.

he is nothing if not worshiped. >> i just have to say that standing here, what a fantastic location. look at the natural light coming in on these works. this is a tremendous gallery. >> do you get some kind of emotional kick? >> it makes me smile and makes me feel good. i see other people looking at the work. >> and quite honestly, it mystifies me. michael jackson and chimp, is it? >> michael jackson and bubbles. in the banality series i was trying to communicate to people that whatever you respond to, it's perfect.

>> if you find his art speak incomprehensible, just wait. >> references to being in the womb a little bit. prior to any kind of concept of death. >> do you get what he's talking about? >> i do listen. >> my friend morley safer had an ongoing conversation about what was art and for him, it was passion. it was a number of pieces, a very famous piece in which he questioned what exactly is art. >> i think it is a vehicle that helps and connects people with their internal life and the world. they help us fine tune the

internal and external lives that we have. >> when the question comes up about it, to actually do the work. do you accept his idea, to me, maybe you have said this as well -- that architects design buildings and other people build them. how do you see the notion of your participation along with these other people in creating a piece of art in contrast to picasso? >> i never wanted to be in a room by myself. i really like to be around people. this analogy like the way i move

my fingertips is the way of working with people. and it is my responsibility to inform them exactly of what i'm looking for. and you can articulate and achieve that goal. it is no different than articulating and achieving the goal of moving my fingers the way it is right now. to be able to do that with people and have that extension, i am not just working alone in a room. the other companies i work with, we affect the lives of a lot of people. everybody is getting a better understanding of art. we are creating these things. i started to work with people when i went to a foundry.

i realized i don't have a foundry, i don't have the facilities to cast myself. you learn how to work with people and trust them. >> it is on view until october 19, 2014. someone once said art is in the eyes of the beholder and another said obviously every work of art affects everybody in a very different way. that is what is remarkable about art. it speaks to you in that context. clearly when one museum devotes its entire availability and the time it is making a huge move downtown, it is worth going. nothing is more talked about in the art world today than what jeff koons is done in his retrospective.

that alone is enough to make you say, "what in the world are they talking about?" let me go experience it for myself. it runs until october 19, 2014. i am greatly appreciative of jeff coming here. thank you. ♪

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