>> from our studios in new york city, this is "charlie rose." >> the prime minister of italy is here. he has been the prime minister since 2014 and is the head of the democratic party.

italy will remain in recession throughout 2014. the imf report urged him to push through a reform agenda. structural weakness continues to impede growth potential. the country's debt is the second largest in the eurozone. italy currently holds the rotating presidency of the european union. he met with technology entrepreneurs before arriving in front of the united nations general assembly. i am pleased to have him at the table because i love his country. >> thank you so much. >> what did you learn from silicon valley? >> i chose silicon valley because i love the future. it is one of the capitals of the future. our country, italy, is an incredible capital of the past. we must change our position and

invest in the future. silicon valley could be a model, could be a place of aspiration. and i receive a strong message from the italian people who say to silicon valley, we can change the world is you can gently if you can change the country -- you can change the country. >> how would you change the country? >> liberal markets, constitutional reforms. fiscal system. taxation in italy is particularly difficult. a new system of justice. we have a very concrete budget

and i think that with these reforms, we must absolutely give to italy the position of the past leadership. italy is leader, not follower. we lost opportunities. now is the time to change. >> you had the business community behind you, do you still? >> the business community is an incredible asset for the future of the country if, finally, we invest in opening markets in italy. because in the past, you know, the business community are very closed. but it is not important, the passport of an entrepreneur. it is important to the quality of project. the business community must

invest in made in italy. made in italy means a few things. wine, food, culture, and the ability of innovation. investment in technology. we must come back to change. > so you can bring a silicon valley to italy, in your judgment? >> ideas could change the life of the people, for an installment -- what i want to do to realizes the. -- in germany, one year.

>> when they say that italy needs capital reform, what do they mean? >> italy has a number of politicians that needs to make easy the process of politics. >> election rules. >> in the usa, there are 500 members of parliament. in italy, 1000. i am very proud of my country, but they have double the members of parliament as the united states. the reduction of power is a part of this challenge. >> the politicians do not want to give up power? >> the politicians have the power of veto at the moment, a veto block.

we must connect to the model in which the politicians are not the people who block the ideas but that provide the future. the role of politics in italy is the history of machiavelli to today. the future does not define the present. to me the structural reforms mean liberal markets. >> what did berlasconi due to the image of italy? >> with him, there is the destruction of discussion in politics. his party is my opposition, my enemy in the discussion of politics, but i think we must

close the discussion as we talk about the future. >> he is pro-business, but so are you. leonardo said that he was one of the wealthiest business owners in italy, if not the wealthiest. he said about you, you are the best government we have had in 10 years, and there are many obstacles. >> we have a lot of obstacles in this moment, but i think we must absolutely find a solution. not find an exclusion. i think that in italy, the last 50 years, the politicians explained a list of problems. show every problem but do not

solve the problem. i am not sure if i'm a good or bad governor. i am sure that i must absolutely solve at least a problem presented by the last generation and finally show that we are able to change. >> and what do you need to change italy? what is essential at this moment to get through the reforms you have talked about, including growth? >> we must absolutely create growth to give an opportunity to employers for the strategy for the future. if you ask what are the things that you need to change, many things. first of all, the consensus of the people. 41% last election.

the first time in 57 years in italy. second, the ideas are very clear and determined. this is very important. the third is the courage. i have only one possibility. to give a very strong message. if i solve the problem i change italy, but if i am not able to solve the problem, i must retire myself. >> if you cannot do it, you will get out? >> i think that we can absolutely obtain the results. i am confident. >> in foreign policy, there has always been a relationship between italy and libya. and you have said that libya is more important to us than syria. because there is a collapsing central government.

>> it is difficult to rank the problems around the world -- if we are ranking to be problems around the world, italy's problem is libya. for my country, the neighbor with problems is libya. libya is now under control. and we must absolutely create the conditions to give enough to the libyan people and the european people. >> does the larger community have to come together to make sure that that happens, or can the libyans do it on their own? >> i think that libya, after the decision to stop gaddafi, a few people believe that the mission is accomplished.

no. because when you use that, that very important intervention in an area, you must think also about the future. not only about the present. it is difficult but possible. we are only one country. we are the only country with our embassy open in tripoli at this moment. we will create the respect for the last elections in june of 2014. and we reduced the battles and the fights. i think libya must be absolutely -- we must have more attention from the international

community. italy is ready to make desk to -- to play a very important role. >> in libya? >> the international community must think that libya is not the last problem. >> the public in europe and say that they have two great men. one is pope francis. which i am sure you agree with. >> pope francis is a great man. i met him with my family. and i think that he is very important for the catholic church, obviously. for the relationship with it italy and the vatican. but also to give a message of hope, because in this moment, there is a lack of hope. if you read a newspaper and

verify media messages a few times, message is not a message of hope. this is why francis pope gives us opportunity, these words of kindness. it is new in the international discussion in this moment, and for me, it is important that i value the human value. >> his pastoral role as well. the other man that many say has the potential of greatness is >> -- mario draghi. >> absolutely, he is a good man he is not the federal reserve.

>> it is different. >> he has obtained a few important results. i think that his role for the euro is absolutely a good role. and i think that, really, it is great man for this job. >> how will we measure whether you succeeded? >> if italy, in the next three years, will be more open, smarter, and simpler. this is the message that we have won the battle. because this is happening, we must absolutely, don't waste nothing a day.

we must work step step everyday to reduce the power of bureaucracy and get this message of efficiency in our country. i am confident that this could be possible. but we must absolutely don't waste nothing, don't waste a day. we could lose the next election, but we cannot lose now. >> and what do you say, finally, to the italian people? what must they do in order to restore italy's greatness? >> come back to be dreamers. because in the last period, we lost the dream and we make nightmares. we lost the possibility, the

ability to show ourselves as the men and women able to have projects. in the last period, italy was sad. it had a lack of a future. my fourth message is exactly that. my fellow citizens, we are able to come back to be dreamers. to come back and get the message of equality and quality of life and lifestyle and ideals and culture around the world. but we must change. change is not a bad word. change is the only way to come back together. >> thank you. it is a pleasure to have you there. back in a moment. stay with us. ♪ >> the french foreign minister is with us. he is here for the united nations general assembly. an algerian-based group released a video showing the execution of

a french tourist. the group claims solidarity with the islamic state in iraq and syria. they are called dash. france joined air strikes in iraq on friday, but has not yet participated in syria. i am pleased to have laurent back at this table. me, and so many people around the world, extend our sympathy for the loss. >> it is a terrible day because he was not only assassinated but beheaded. it was terrible cruelty. these people, that we call dash. >> or isil, the term for islamic state, as you object to the term

islamic state. >> they say that they represent islam but it is not true. >> no islamic leader that i know says that they represent islam. >> they want to have a bloody fight. we are defending freedom, and these people we cannot accept the way they have behaved. it is an attack not only on france but on all of us. >> what does france do with respect to the united states and the other countries that are participating in this? >> we have decided to bring an air support, and the iraqis have asked us to do that and we are doing that.

we have given weapons. we have given humanitarian aid as well. >> in iraq? >> in iraq. in syria, we are directly helping the moderate position in terms of humanitarian aid and weapons as well. and training. but the two things are interrelated because the group is transnational. america has decided with some arab countries to be present in syria. which is good. but you know that we cannot do anything, and for the time being we are concentrating on iraq. >> i do not understand why you cannot do airstrikes in syria. >> obviously we could. >> why do you refuse to? >> we do not want to do everything.

our view is we are supporting what the americans are doing. but we have to pay attention, because dash has to be fought, but the problem is that it must not be used by bashir al-assad in order to gain ground. and therefore, right now, unfortunately the moderate position is strong in some spots week in other spots. we are sharing the same goals. the americans are doing some jobs, and we are doing some jobs. maybe in the future we shall evolve, before the time being, we are concentrating. >> i still do not understand why there is a difference -- >> it is a different story why. because in iraq we have been asked by the iraqi government to support them.

in syria, it is not the same story. >> because you do not want to support the syrian government? is that the reason? >> in syria, we not only want to fight dash, but the other one -- >> bashir al-assad? >> we do not support them by any means. if you remember, he was the origin of dash. he liberated prisoners from prison, and they are the leaders. during years, bashir has not fought dash. and today, dash has a lot of oil and a part of that is sold to bashir.

it has been decided, and it is -- to cut the financing -- by the u.n. recently, to cut the financing. we have to organize ourselves. the u.s., france, the arab countries, the coalition. >> are you pleased that the americans are using their airpower in syria to attack? >> we have said today that we are supporting them, yes. >> what is it going to take in terms of, quote, boots on the ground to liberate syria, and is

the only on the ground sufficient, and can be be made sufficient? >> there is a lesson from recent conflicts, you cannot win without the support of the people themselves. in iraq, the iraqis, in syria, the syrians. in iraq, we think that thanks to our support, the iraqi step-by-step will be stronger. and they can beat dash. we are bringing air support. in syria, it is a bit different. because the moderate position, is sometimes in a strong position and sometimes in a

difficult position. >> but can they do it over the long run? >> yes. we shall have ground forces. we are training them. we had a meeting today, this afternoon, with the core group. all the people that are supporting the syrian army, the opposition. we have decided to support them. in between, we have to strike dash. but we need to avoid that bashir will take advantage of this. >> in no circumstances will be a relationship with assad it to defeat dash.

>> he wants to be a part of the coalition, but he is at the origin of the terrorists. things happened so quickly that we have forgotten the origin. you remember, three years ago, in the arab spring. in the beginning, it was people in the countryside in the countryside in syria who are wanting to be freer. he reacted in such a way that it is unbelievable. you have 200,000 thousand people that have been killed. remember that you have the chemical weapons. therefore, by no means shall we

support him. by no means. >> do you believe -- did isis get money from arab countries? this is to charge that i heard yesterday, the countries that helped build up isis because they were opposed to bashir are now fighting isis. is that true? >> i think that there has been a financing. it can be states. it can be persons.

it was possible to have a sort of agreement which would protect them if they were giving money, but it was completely foolish. because these guys -- and it is different if you compare them to al qaeda. al qaeda will want to have a -- were not wanting to have a state. these ones are wanting. syria, palestine. saudi arabia, turkey, and then why not u.s.? >> that is why it is essential. stop them that you can.

>> i think that these persons are menaced by dash, now there is a resolution that has been voted by a unanimous vote saying that the funding will be completely cut and that every country must take precise steps in order to prevent foreign fighters going there. under what we called chapter seven, meaning that can react and have sanctions if they do not do it. my guess is that all of these countries understand that these

guys are dangerous for everybody. >> what are the iranians doing? >> we have met the president. we know that he is tied geographically to iraq, and the prime minister is a shiite as well. they were not accepting that dash could take baghdad or erbil. >> they fought against that. >> they actually helped the iraqis to prevent that. now what for syria it is different. they are supporting assad. we do not agree with them at that point. at the end of the day, we will have to have a political settling. and the idea is to have the agreement between the moderate position and some elements of the regime.

>> bashir leaves and -- >> i do not know what will happen. >> a political summit, because russia and iran, as friends, or building some kind of an agreement in which he would give up the presidency. >> that was the idea that when we signed the geneva agreement and it is still true. in between we need a strong moderate position. >> is america leading the coalition? >> yes. the next question is, what about france? we are part and parcel of the coalition, but you know that we are talking about autonomy. we are coordinating efforts with the u.s. and there is no problem.

>> this is climate week here. i think in 2015, you will chair. what progress is being made? >> i should say that in terms of practical steps, there has been some progress. maybe not enough. we have to capitalize what we call green farms. there are some countries that have announced money but not enough. there have been a lot of speeches, all of them in the same direction, saying that we have to have an agreement because this question -- i do not speak about climate change but climate disruption. and warming, it is not true,

because in some parts of his warming, and in some parts it is cooler. and every part it is an extreme phenomenon. to answer your question, there have been some practical steps. the most important thing is that the private sector has decided to invest in the new direction. the local governments, towns, regions, have decided to move in the same direction. there is a very strong movement saying that we have to make the decision. >> a decision to? >> to halt, to stop -- >> carbon in the air? >> the situation where our world

will be impossible to live in. ban ki-moon has an incredible problem. there is no plan b, because there is no planet b. that is the best summary. if you don't do it, then do it quickly, because it is not a question of in 40 years, it is right now. we are the first generation to be aware of that and the last generation to be able to act. >> there is a window of opportunity. >> a window of opportunity and necessity. next year --

>> china is better than it has been before in its commitment? >> a major shift in the u.s. attitudes and chinese attitudes. you know that john kerry is completely dedicated. i am reluctant to talk about such things now because you have the midterm elections, but i hope that it will do it at the beginning of next year. as far as the chinese are concerned, they are fully aware. it is not a question of international pressure, it is a question of their own life. the last time i was in beijing,

the same day, in paris, we decided to have alternate traffic because the pollution was 10% more than the average. on the same day in beijing it was not 10% more, it was 18 times the normal. people could not breathe on the street and children could not go to school. it is difficult for the chinese because it is a complete shift in their economy. but the new element is that now people understand that it is not just a constraint but it can be an opportunity to bring growth, the creation of jobs. it is a new big thing, particularly for big business. >> where is the resistance? what stands in the way? >> the resistance is that many people think that the decision will have to be taken within 50 years. no way. the resistance is that all of us are conservative. and it is difficult to change our habits.

we have to do it. but once more, no plan b, no planet b. and you know, at the beginning, i was not a specialist. but once i knew that france had to chair it -- i can tell you that it is the question, the big question, and we have to do it. >> we will talk about iran, which were also a part of, but ebola. it seems to get worse and threatening. >> especially in three countries. as far as france is concerned, we are concentrating on guniea, we are doing what we have to do. but it is never enough. we have a meeting tomorrow in

the u.n., and all of us will have to concentrate on that. but once we -- i hope that the epidemic will be stopped. we have to understand that the basis is the weakness of the sanitary systems in those because when such an epidemic comes, and you have no hospitals and doctors, it is a catastrophe. we have first to stop and then help them build sanitary systems. >> is there a scenario where it could get out of control and become a global threat? >> that depends on our

commitment, and we have to be committed. >> you have said that you do not think they can be linked to the fight against dash. they cannot be connected. the iranian president said that to me yesterday as well. is anybody trying to link them? are they saying if you make an agreement that we agreed to on nuclear, we will change our participation? >> no, they have never said that to us or spoke to us about that leverage, and they are right to do so. because the question of the atomic bomb is a question of itself. it is an expression that i have already used. when i have been discussing with my partners, i have very often used the words in that question, you cannot be half pregnant.

either you get it or you do not get it. and what is the question? what is the problem? we are saying to the iranians, you have the complete right to have civil nuclear energy. you are a power, you are a great civilization, you have the right. but so far as the nuclear bomb is concerned, it is just no, because it is too dangerous in this region particularly. and we want to avoid in the nuclear proliferation. and all the discussion, which is very, very technical, is to draw the consequences. i remember that we asked and they accepted to put it at the beginning of the statements, and i remember the words. under no circumstances, iran

will never seek nor posess any nuclear weapons. the sentence has been pronounced by the supreme leader. and i said that if it has been pronounced by you, we must draw the technical consequences of that. never seek nuclear weapons. we are discussing about iraq, we are discussing about control. in order to implement this principle. if they agree it will be ok, if they don't, it will not. >> how do they agree to that? >> there is a discussion because they agree with the principle, but there are consequences to be drawn because once more, you cannot be half pregnant. >> there are many who believe that they have not made a decision to seek a nuclear weapon, they just want to be

within reach if they make a decision. >> no. the question is to renounce. we cannot be halfway. >> do you believe that you have sufficient economic sanctions to force them to do that? >> the economic sanctions are very, very powerful. it is very likely that it is because of the economic sanctions that we are discussing. but we have said that if we find an agreement they will be lifted. and it will be important for the population. and once more we wish we could find an agreement, but it depends on their commitment. it has to be clear because it is a matter where you have to be clear. >> and the supreme leader says they need 190,000 centrifuges. >> if it is those sort of figures, no way.

you know that we are discussing about several hundred or thousand. you can discuss if it is 1000 or 2000. 2000 compared with 190,000. if they do not want to have a nuclear bomb, what is the use of getting 190,000 centrifuges? >> you are negotiating with them, what is their answer? >> it is not very clear. [laughter] >> are they transparent? >> we wish. >> the aea says -- >> the question applies to be -- the past and to the future, because we have to check.

we want to be sure that in the past, of all that has been done. but once more, we hope, and any reasonable person has to hope, that we can find an agreement. but it has to be a solid agreement. it cannot be a sort of -- >> the president of the united states has said and reconfirmed numerous times, as has his vice president, that it is unacceptable for iran to have nuclear weapons. and has said that they will not allow it. which means that if they are close to getting them, they will launch a military attack. does the french government support that? >> it is what we call the breakout. what does it mean? imagine that we have an agreement. great.

but we can imagine, too, that the agreement will not be implemented and cannot happen. the breakout time must be sufficient for the partners to react. and obviously the reaction would be a tough one. but, we are trying to get an agreement. >> do you support the u.s. decision? >> we do not want any nuclear weapon. that is clear. you have to be a partner in the negotiation. [laughter] >> two places, the ukraine and then libya. the ukraine. there are a lot of economic relationships with russia in europe.

will they impede a very strong reaction against putin if he tries to move against the eastern ukraine? >> no. we have already done sanctions. it is true that the sanctions are neither good for russia or us. but you know the problem, that we, at the same time, have to be firm because we cannot accept that a country, whatever it is, would make an annexation of a region, crimea. we cannot accept it. >> you seem to be accepting it. >> we do not accept it. we shall not go to war with russia, but we have to take sanctions. on the other hand, we have to have a dialogue. germany and france in particular have organized a possible

dialogue. today we have a cease-fire. at the end of october we have elections. what is our idea? ukraine has to be a free country with good relations with russia and good relations with the eu. if the russians, directly or indirectly, are exerting pressure, we have to react. because that threatens security. but at the same time we have to keep open diplomacy, the ways and means to have a dialogue. i can't say i know what is in the head of mr. putin. i know that we are trying to have a dialogue. >> libya. it is a mess. >> libya is a mess, that is a real term.

what can we do? tomorrow, we will have a meeting in the u.n. you have two problems. the first is that you have two governments, different militias. we have to try and have unity. a new person has been appointed to try and favor this, because you cannot have two governments. that is one point. it implies that other countries will not intervene, giving weapons, giving money. and we are back to the dash problem. the second problem is that in the south of libya, you have a number of terrorist groups which

are not affiliated to the two other ones, which are dangerous by themselves. and their relationship with boko haram is nigeria was a different terrorist. we have to deal with the parliament, we hope that if we are doing it, we have to deal with the terrorism. because there are a lot of weapons in libya. it is a rich country, and it is not a state. >> it is a failed state. >> it has never been a state. >> does that mean -- >> i draw a lesson from that. you remember, charlie, that we have intervened in some other countries. >> you led the intervention.

>> i do not regret it. what i regret is that there has been no follow-up afterwards. sometimes it is necessary to intervene, but it is not enough. it is the same for what i was saying for syria or for iraq. it is not -- maybe it is necessary to send bombs, ok. but afterwards, what happens? the lack of political follow-up has been a big mistake. >> why did it happen? why did it fail? >> i do not know. maybe it was an illusion to think that it was enough to kill mr. gaddafi and that everybody would be ok. >> today's president, did he not lead conversations about what to do in the united nations? >> yes, because they are

chairing the security council. and the question was how to fight foreign fighters? >> what came out of that? >> a unanimous resolution saying that every single country, under chapter seven, must take legal elements in order to prevent their nationals from going to syria and so on, and that we need to cut the financing. these are elements. >> sarkozy says he is coming back. here you are ranking member of the socialist party. why is your party and your

president so in disfavor with your people? >> i think the main reason is that, as you know in europe, the situation is not good. no growth, particularly in france. reforms when there are no growth are difficult. >> has the president changed? a socialist president said that we have to be different. has he changed his attitude as to what is necessary to put france on the right course? >> i know, because i am working with foreign policy, he is dedicated to deliver the reforms. >> to the economic system? >> yes. france has a lot of assets. there have been reforms that

have been postponed, and we need to do that. and sometimes they are not popular. but when you are president, you have to work -- maybe it is not good for your reelection, but you are here in order to work for your country. it is as simple as that. >> thank you for coming. the foreign minister of france. thank you for joining us, we will see you next time. ♪ >> tonight, on titans at the

table. i will be shutting with an -- bob benmosche, former chief executive of aig. i traveled through croatia to spend time with this retired it tighten. when you come here to you instantly relax? >> at his vineyard. he recounts how he turns around the company left four dead. >> you thought i had a company worth zero dollars.