♪ >> from our studios in new york city, this is "charlie rose." >> bill bratton is here. he is the police commissioner for new york city.

he served previously under mayor rudy giuliani. he was also commissioner for boston and l.a. police department. crime in new york city continued to fall in 2014. homicides fell to the lowest since 1963. yet the nypd confronts challenges. thousands of new yorkers have taken to the streets to focus -- protest against the nypd's approach to policing. they responded to the staten island grand jury's decision not to prosecute the death of eric garner. there has been a widening between police, police unions, and the mayor, who expressed solidarity with some protesters. tensions peaked after the killing of two officers last month. offices turned their back on the mayor at funerals. they also had a significant slowdown in arrests and summonses. recent numbers show enforcement

activity is rising, but still short of last year's levels. the washington post wrote "the spirit of community-police partnership has been damaged in new york and around the country, but the best model for how to heal the racial and critical divide is bratton's onwn experience." i'm pleased to have bill bratton back on this program. good to have you here. the first time we have had a chance to talk about you in a job you know very well, from not only new york, but boston and l.a. does it differ in different cities, the role of the men and women in charge of the police? >> sure. that's what makes it so exciting for me. it is no deja vu all over again. now in my second time as police commissioner 20 years between the first time and the second time, it is all different in many respects.

that's why i enjoy it so much. i like the challenges it presents. >> when you heard mayor deblasio might be thinking about you this is a job you welcomed a return to? >> i never expected i would get an opportunity to return to it. after i left policing in 1996 and went into the private sector, i had not expected to return to the public sector. there was the opening in los angeles in 2002, and i heard the clarion call and off i went. >> you were there for seven years. >> hard to believe, where the hell that time went. >> what about police work captivates you? >> the fact it is so impactful, that you can impact everybody. more so than almost any other profession. if you get it right, the impact is so profound.

new york city 1994, 7.5 million people living in the city. making the city that much safer all 7.5 million of them benefited. the 50 million tourists benefited. los angeles, 2002, a city tour and racial violence for most of the last 50 years. the opportunity to try to heal that violence by using the police as the healing tool rather than the flashpoint for all the anger from the worst race riots in american history. how can you not succumb to that type of challenge? >> you have been in the forefront of using modern technology. some of it you designed here in your previous term. yet at the same time, it seems to me essential in every community for the police to have a relationship with the areas in

which they serve. those are not in contradiction -- is that still true? >> it is still true. i frequently talk about the creator of the metropolitan police of london in the early 1800's, and later became british prime minister. he had nine principles of policing. when you read them today, they are even more relevant today than they were 150 years ago. the first one, the basic mission for which the police exists is to prevent, i emphasize prevent, crime and disorder. the other eight principles go on to talk about how it should be done. when you talk about technology, technology is an enhancement of those nine principles. for example, the body camera issue which is so much in the public discourse today. body cameras have the ability to really help bridge some of the

gap between police and particularly the minority communities, where there is so much tension throughout america. the racial divide still divides us and police tend to be right in the middle of all that. clearly last year. that technology is going to be able to really move some of -- remove some of the tension between he said, she said. so technology if properly used can be a great boon to policing. one of the exciting things coming back to policing in 2014 is the world technology i get to work with. the new york police department -- no one has as much as the nypd. we are going to change the face of policing in new york city, effectively change the face of policing in america this year. >> what is the relationship

between the police and the police union? >> when you say the police and the police union, police officers or police management -- all across the board. i will speak to my relationship. i always had very good relationships sometimes excellent relationships, with these unions and the six police organizations i led. i never had a vote of no-confidence. oftentimes it is the badge of honor as a police chief. i have always been able to walk a middle road, where we have been able to agree or disagree professionally. it has never gotten personal. i work very hard at that. even now, in the midst of the contretemps in new york city between the police unions and the mayor, one positive at this juncture is the relationships i formed with the unions over the past year, helping to weather

the storm as the mayor and the unions try to find common ground they can stand on so the disagreements of the last number of months that have boiled to the service -- service and boiled over, hopefully because of the relationships i have with the mayor i might be able to serve as a bridge in trying to deal with the rift the unfortunate rift that developed between them. >> what is at the heart of that risk? >>-- rift? >> a number of things charlie. there's no one thing. a succession of issues. the "new york times" had an an analysis of it. a number of things going on in the administration some appointments on the part of the mayor that the unions took umbrage at. the chief of staff a woman the

unions from the beginning did not like because of a relationship she had. >> who had a felony conviction. >> a felony conviction. it began to poison the well. something i ended up involved in , the mayor had a well-intentioned effort to deal with the controversy after the death of mr. garner, the so-called chokehold death. brought a lot of ministers and community leaders from staten island and also the reverend al sharpton into that meeting. the placement of the seating, the photograph the very famous photograph of the mayor and mr. sharpton -- >> what did that say to people? >> particularly to the cops they went crazy, as well as particularly the tablets in new york, the "daily news," about both of those -- both of those

papers hate sharpton. seemingly on even footing with the police mission or, it became a cause celebre. the police unions began to have difficulties with the mayor -- and it gave them another nail to drive into the coffin. even for myself it caused -- it caused me no end of problems, in the sense of friends professional acquaintances. as much as mr. sharpton has become a spokesperson, probably the most well-known spokesperson for the african-american community, the african-american civil rights community on the one hand on the other hand he is anathema to police in particular. >> because of the early history of his? >> particularly the

controversies around his financial issues -- there's no shortage of reasons why you either like or dislike him. that incident was really played up so significantly and continues to be referenced in any analysis of what led to the breakdown of relationships. >> what is your role? >> i see my role in the midst of all the storm and controversy, to keep moving the police department forward so that it delivers effective services, trying wherever i can to work with the mayor to bridge these differences and difficulties with the unions, but also to bridge the differences and difficulties with the communities that quite clearly voted him into office significantly around the issue of frayed relationships with the police department. >> these minority communities in particular supported the

candidate deblasio in part because they believed he would represent their point of view about law enforcement? >> the idea of stop, question, and frisk, which under the previous administration my predecessor ray kelly, mike bloomberg in the election in which mr. de blasio came from literally last place to first place and was elected, significantly it was around the issue of stop, question, and frisk, which really came to the forefront in that election. his position, one i supported the practice of stop question and frisk expanded too much the previous several years. like a doctor who treats you with chemotherapy -- if he gives you too much he will kill you,

even as he's trying to cure you. even as crime goes down dramatically stop, question, and frisk numbers went up to radically. the result of -- i think mayor bloomberg, who is passionate on the issue of guns and reducing gun violence, an anti-gun crusader, became convinced that one of the ways to control gun violence was to do stop, question, and frisk. unfortunately, that's 10% of the reason why they stopped people. they stopped people for a whole number of other issues. but the defense of stop question, and frisk as a principal means of getting guns off the street, that gave "the new york times" and others including mayor de blasio, the thought that if you get so few guns per thousand of stops it creates a disparate impact. racial profiling, if you will.

your viewership a lot of this might not be easy to understand -- >> i think it is. it is easy to understand because there was ferguson missouri and a whole lot of other places where they are dealing with this issue. the relationship between police and community. maybe a different community, but the issues seem to be -- >> i like using a medical comparison, because everybody understands medical issues. i use the comstat process analogy we developed in the 1990's. it is about timely accurate intelligence, to quickly identify emerging patterns and trends. if you go to a doctor and you are not feeling well, he does a whole series of tests, determines you have a cancer then he will treat it with radiation or chemotherapy. the secret is not to over-radiate you not to use too

much chemo. he will make you sicker. the use of stop, question, and frisk in this city made the patient, particularly the african-american patient bearing the brunt of the treatment -- they felt more aggrieved. it's interesting, because both bloomberg as the mayor and commissioner kelly in a lot of opinion polls, rated very highly. commissioner kelly would go to african-american churches on sundays and was rated very highly. his police department and its policies were the cause of great consternation in that same community. there was a disconnect. >> that was the background of the election. >> and de blasio effectively wrote that horse to victory. when i got on the horse with him -- i believe that stop question, and frisk was being done in excessive quantities. >> in terms of how you look at

stop and frisk -- >> in terms of stop, question, and frisk, one of the things that is missing in the city, many opponents who are against it thought the mayor was going to do away with it. you cannot do away with it. it is a basic tool of american policing. the challenge is to do it inappropriate amounts to the issues you are facing. last year, we did fewer than 50,000 stops that we doubled the number of stops that resulted in arrests. reinforcing that the stops were being done appropriately. and the fact that last year was the safest year in the history of the city in terms of overall crime. with fewer stops, crime continued to go down. the tablets were predicting -- tabloids were predicting crime would go through the roof. i joked that when the mayor was

elected, the four horsemen of the apocalypse would come charging into new york armageddon was arriving. >> it didn't happen. do you think the police officers and the police union understand the mayor? do they have a perception, then that you find unfair and unreasonable? >> i spent a couple hours a week we have a meeting every week me and my senior leadership team and him. >> on a friday. >> a friday meeting. she is much more pragmatic than dogmatic, i think. his progressive ideas, the idea that he is unabashedly to the left and progressive, that he is not dogmatic -- but he is not dogmatic in reference to looking

at issues. an example of the pragmatism -- the "broken windows" philosophy, which i am a strong promoter of, a strong defender of the mayor, much to the chagrin of his support base supports "broken windows," and likes stop question, and frisk appropriately applied in the right amounts. a lot of his supporters don't understand that they -- they want broken windows done away with. he don't realize how important it is to the safety and security of the city. this is an example of his pragmatism. he's really committed to trying to find the right balance in the city. not just for his base, but for all new yorkers. >> that's what you tried to explain to the police. >> that's the man we are dealing

with. a great part of my social circle in the upper east side, a lot of my social circle and friends are not particularly supportive of the mayor. in some instances, i'm able to make the case for him, because i can speak from my experience. >> wendy you criticize him? >> the issues of criticism would be publicly i'm not going to criticize. but if i have an issue or a difference one of the things about the relationship is i am free to basically offer that advice and counsel. if you are comfortable doing that he is open to that type of input if you will. >> when you tell the police it is not a good idea to turn your back, that a funeral is a place

for grieving not grievance, your eloquent words. does that resonate? >> at first that was heartfelt for me. apart from any mayor or any governor or any president, that's how i feel about my profession. the expression of disrespect it is not place for it. that's why i wrote the memo that i did encouraging for the second funeral, let's not repeat the mistake of the actions at the first. the good news was, my understanding is at the larger funeral -- we had 23,000 at the funeral for officer ramos, and 28,000, probably the largest in the history of america for a police officer's death. several hundred in the crowd of 20,000 turned their backs.

some news reports would have you believe the vast majority were doing it. >> between the first funeral and the second funeral -- >> my understanding of it the numbers were much less than they were in the first funeral, which i felt good about. but i would have felt much better if there had been no turning of the backs at all. but that's nothing i can control. i can seek to influence, which i sauce to do with my words -- sought to do with my own words. even of the officers are in uniform, they are there on their own time. my ability to say "you will not do that" -- i don't have that. even if i have that, i would not use that power. >> the mayor is anxious to heal this breach. >> definitely. so much riding on healing the breach -- writing on healing the

breach. he likes cops. he understands the importance. he is really working very hard to understand the grievances to understand the issues. there's a lot going on behind the scenes to meet some of those grievances and those issues. it is lost in the fog of war. there is so much churning of issues. it might take a while to let the dust settle and let people take a look around. >> people are beginning to speak to each other. >> there's a lot going on in the sense of dialogue behind-the-scenes. we have had plenty of meetings. the public needs to see that we are trying to talk with each other. i used an expression that i think will resonate with you. the masai tribes in africa -- "we see you." i heard this expression from an

african-american unity leader in los angeles. she said to my wife and i you know why we like you chief, you see us. i love that expression. i like to think one of the things i learned a long time ago, when you talk to people look them right in the eye. it's fascinating of people respond. sometimes they look away, but the eyes come back. that is an african custom of the masai. they look you right in the eye. >> the mayor feels like he has gone as far as he should without as much reciprocity? give a sense of how you feel. >> my dealings with him my interactions with the unions he has treated the department extort nearly well in terms of

resources. in terms of support of me. he always speaks very highly of me in public and private settings. he speaks highly about the police. what he does question and challenge is some of the practices and procedures. so it's amazing how the dialogue is -- everybody's hearing something different. in terms of the challenge moving ahead it is to get everybody to effectively be at the same place. >> they are not hearing the same thing. what do you mean by that? >> it is a sense of saying that we are trying to reform these practices the cops did not enjoy participating in. the cops hated being pushed for

more stop, question, and frisk activity. part of the resentment is that the administration changed but there is still fear. the new inspector general, federal oversight, the racial profiling bill the new city council -- they feel all of that burden is now placed on them and they were not because you of the reasons -- not the cause of the reasons they were created. they were not the cause of the stop and frisk that created resentment in the african american community, but they are bearing the brunt. so you understand their frustration, their anger. we were told to do this. policies and procedures. >> designed by the mayor and police chief. >> now they are gone, but we are still here, dealing with the aftermath. >> is al sharpton helpful? >> sharpton, i think, is helpful

in the sense of his reach into the african american community. quite clearly even as he is doing that, he would be the first to tell you that he believes that through his actions he is able to control violence that might otherwise emanate. he firmly believes that. >> is he right? >> in terms of how he would present -- you could present cases where it did happen, was he an instigator, at fault? that would be subject to debate. >> he's not always a destructive force? >> there would be many who believe that is the case. giuliani recently spoke out forcefully in that regard, feeling mr. sharpton's actions were not helpful and contributed to the problem rather than contribute into the healing. but that opinion is not shared

by others. >> is it shared the mayor and the police chief? >> we are in the tower of babylon in terms of the issues of controversy. >> this is my point -- what is happening in new york is seen through a national lance. >> that's why new york is so important to this country. >> this is from the "washington post." "between pronouncements that interest -- or present the interests of the elite and statements of support for the mayor at which pleasure he serves --" do you believe he can succeed at repairing these issues? >> i certainly do. if i did not i would be gone.

i did not come out of the private sector back into the habit sector leaving a very comfortable life in the private sector, to come back into the challenges of the public sector, if i did not believe i had a lot to contribute. the issues that have been compounded in a much more, but fashion over the course of the year -- -- complex fashion over the course of the year. whether it is terrorism the relationship between police and community became more frated the past year. but what police continue to deliver is public safety. crime declined the city became even safer the city became even more attractive. tourism continues to increase. quality of life in the city has improved for so many. but for others it has not.

an that isan -- that is an argument we advance all the time, the mayor, the police department. pockets of poverty and desperation still remain in what is arguing the world's greatest city. it has not changed dramatically. high unemployment, for schools will -- poor schools, lack of opportunity. violence is concentrated in those neighborhoods. those challenges still remain and there is the ability to successfully deal with it, but boy is it going to take a lot of work. the media in this town is very complex. you have "new york post" passionate in their dislike of mayor de blasio.

"daily news" depending on the day and the issue. the "new york times" who feels the mayor is not far enough to the left for their liking, so as far as they praise him they are just as likely to bang away at him, which is ironic because he is truly a progressive. >> trying to push him to the left. >> and the "wall street journal" -- it is owned by the same person who owns the "new york post." the "wall street journal" reporting on police issues is probably some of the most balanced in the city. and "news day" a long island newspaper good reporting relative to policing. >> how long have you known him? >> from when he was first campaigning. he was the outsider. i recall meeting him for the first time at the st. patrick's

parade. he had a truck where he was dispensing coffee and hot chocolate. i have known pat for 20 years. >> does he want to do something to make the relationship between the mayor and police better? does it help if he says the mayor has "blood on his hands?" >> the rhetoric pat has used his unfortunate. it is inappropriate. we can agree to disagree but i -- there's nobody i shun. my relationship with part is both a personal and a professional one. two i agree with everything he's doing? certainly not. in this instance, i voiced my concerns about it. understanding union leadership, you need to recognize that union leadership, their first

obligation is to their members. in the police, they certainly have an obligation to the public but their role is to represent. if the mentorship doesn't feel they are being represented -- >> the editorial said "the madness needs to stop. mr. de blasio should appeal to the public and say that the police are trying to extort him and the city he leads. if they will not do their jobs mr. de blasio should consider replacing them." >> that is crazy. would he go to war with the cops? they are basically advocating going to war with the cops. my approach "charlie rose which i think right now is using a well-manage -- my approach which i think is using a well-managed response.

police are going back to normal levels of work. we have not had to use the approach that the "new york times" would encourage,. the last thing you need is trying to instigate a widening of the gap. i'm trying to close the gap. so that kind of language is very inappropriate in this discussion. that tech of language on the part of the "new york times" and similar language on the part of the "post" is not helpful at all. >> let me turn to the future in terms of what you want to do. do you -- the tragic death of mr. garner, and the tragic death of those two police officers who were posthumously raised to detective, as you referred to

them. in your mind, are they connected? >> there's certainly a connectivity in mr. garner's death, the death of the young man in ferguson they were part of the catalyst for the demonstrations that began to roll across the country. and, if you will putting on to the front burner once again the racial issues that had been so divisive in our history, that we thought to -- we had begun to result in the 1970's and 1980's. in the 21st century, they are clearly on the front burner again. i stated quite clearly that the actions of the individual who murdered my two police officers were clearly the results of his being influenced by that turmoil in the previous month and a

half starting with november 23, the ferguson decision. then we had the garner decision. >> the grand jury decisions. >> and so my opinion is that his actions were influenced by his dissatisfaction with those decisions. >> you really saw the heart of the city at the funeral, the response to those two brave young police officers. in a way it is similar. when something happens as it did with the death in paris of those cartoonists and the hostages. a country came to its senses. you see the death of those two. >> wouldn't it be wonderful if

the legacy of the death of those two officers were that it did stop some of the madness that it did in a sense bring about a pause, if you will, in tensions around the issue of race. the absolute irony of it it was an immigrant asian officer who came to the country at age 12 and an officer of puerto rican descent killed by an african-american. that's the irony of that, that there he was lashing out at police, and the two officers he ends up murdering were what the city is all about -- >> the promise of the city. the reason the city has had a sustaining sense of being, as

the statue of liberty projects. >> we are a city that works. i have this fascination with subways and transit. the symbol of the city every day 6 million new yorkers get into the subways and ride throughout the city everywhere. and the subway pole is clearly the symbol of new york city. look at all the different hands. black, yellow, greece under the fingernails, jewelry. i love the subways, because it is the future of the world and it is happening now in new york city. the idea that 6 million people can cram into those subway cars, and on an average day we have four or five reported crimes in the city on the subways. with 6 million people under extraordinary crowded circumstances. that's why i have so much hope for the city. this current distress we are in

-- we will get through it. i am 67 now. it's going to take time. nothing lasts forever, in the sense of the stress we are under now. it can be exhausting, dealing with this stuff all the time. it is mitigated by the fact that if we get it right and we will get it right i am an eternal optimist -- i would not be doing this if i didn't feel i had a role in giving it right -- we will get it right. i have the full confidence of the mayor, and i have confidence in my cops. >> and you have confidence and belief in the communities. >> i wrote the book a couple years ago about bringing people to come in grants. anthony lucas wrote a wonderful book about the issues of common ground. i remember reading that book as

a police officer in boston, just how marvelously he captured what was going on. the idea of common ground. i take it from that book. ♪

>> you saw that her and is killings in paris in two separate events. what you worry about? what are the lessons? >> my predecessor, ray kelly coming into office right after 9/11 had to create counterterrorism capability for the department. relying on the joint terrorism task force. ray over his 12 years as commissioner created the counterterrorism intelligence bureau 1000 officers but also signed onto a fund-raising organization with 12 officer stationed around the world. london, paris asia. we have an officer that has been in the middle of all these events in paris providing

information to us in a timely fashion. we have a delegation over there right now, 10 officers showing the camaraderie that exists between police. in terms of what concerns me certainly crime. every time there is a murder. on my blackberry i am notified about every shooting, stabbing and rape that goes on in the city. also terrorism. the way terrorism has morphed from the original al qaeda threat to now isis, an even more dangerous potential event. al qaeda is on the big event. isis is focused on everyone pick up a knife, an axe, take action. >> taking action not just against civilians but

especially the military and police. >> in september i put out a twitter to the effect, you see the assault in parliament the ax-wielding madman australia had its recent incident -- we see how these calls can be responded to by people beginning to become radicalized. that's a constant threat rather than al qaeda trying to always replicate a 9/11 a big event. >> at the same time, al qaeda in the arabian and insula -- peninu sula has been advocating and trying attacks, whether it is the underwear, the shoe bomber. they have promoted the idea of individual attacks. both by somebody coming into the country, and at the same time

people who are here. >> al qaeda, which is understood to be mainly hiding in pakistan in mountainous territory, and aqap in yemen, which has been charged by al qaeda central to conduct attacks against the west. the christmas day bomber the cartridge efforts to down planes, this come out of yemen, aqap. they are now believed to be the influencing entity for the two brothers in paris. >> do we know what happened when the brother went to yemen? >> that i can't speak to. i don't know that myself. >> the french investigation. they clearly need to figure out what he did, what he learned, did he's been to the leader of al qaeda in the airrab p

eninsula. and who might have been working with him when they came back. they kept a low profile. paris police are trying to find six other potential members. >> clearly, as we saw in the boston marathon bombing, that activity created -- predated isis. their ability without having trained anywhere to work with basically magazine instructions and create so much havoc in boston. the inspired threat can be just as impactful as those who are trained in syria or yemen. >> why is that more impactful? >> well even though there are thousands that traveled to syria to fight, a lot of them from

europe and maybe 100 or so from america, there are thousands upon thousands who can be inspired here in the states, in canada from thousands of miles away. so they don't have to travel. they can be inspired here. as we saw with those two brothers in boston. >> how do you combat against that? a constant challenge, isn't it? >> in new york, more so than any other city in america, with the exception of l.a., which i was the chief of a number of years ago. we created the camera to his room -- counterterrorism capability in l.a. most american cities don't have the resources we have here. it is a growing threat, a growing concern. >> the question has been raised, whether because of limited resources that the paris police had been forced to cut back on

some of the things they wanted to do. >> that's some of the early stories. we're waiting on the analysis of the investigation. could it have been prevented, the assault of the two brothers, the assault on the grocery store. they will attempt to determine what can be learned going forward. one of the earlier stories was, because of a variety of budget issues other issues the resources of the french intelligence service had been reduced. that potentially becomes an issue for america, as we see cutbacks particularly at the federal level. >> and concerns about privacy whether surveillance goes too far. >> the controversy with snowden. in new york our capacity has not been reduced. it has been expanded. the resources we apply have been

expanded. in response to the growing threat, the new york city government and new york city police have continued to commit resources to that priority. >> is the level of communication between nypd the justice department the fbi, the law enforcement agencies domestic and foreign, at the highest level? >>that's essential, isn't it? >> it is essential. i would defy you to try to find somebody on either side of the fence, the nypd side, the federal side that would not say that the relationships are the best they have ever been. which is important because we are continually trying to improve those relationships. we need transparency. we need to have a seamless web of interactivity between us and i really believe we do have that.

personal relationships with our colleagues, the fbi other agencies. we socialize with each other, we go to professional conferences with each other, and we are in constant munication. that is critical. >> it has been said to me that the biggest concern by law enforcement is that somebody is going to find a way to slip into this country with some kind of weapon, a dirty bomb. is that your biggest nightmare? >> that would be the idea of some type of chemical or radiation device. because the potential for mass casualties as well as mass mitigation of a large area -- when i say mitigation, it would not be habitable because of the radiation impact. the current threats even what just occurred in france the total death total is horrific in and of itself.

we see how impactful those actions were. but that is a death toll of less than a dozen or close to a dozen. you can only imagine if you had an event with the death toll into the thousands, like we saw at the world trade center, for that an area of the city became not habitable for decades to come because of contamination. is that a real concern? it is currently. is it likely, currently? no. we have not been able to detect at all that there is a capacity or capability to pull something off like that at this time. >> you have not been able to determine whether somebody has the capacity to do it, in terms of getting their hands on the weapon fo? >> matching the skill set with the resources. >> getting it into the country. >> in that regard, new york is one of the better-prepared

environments in the country, because of the radiation protection devices installed here. hundreds of our officers walk around with the devices on them all the time. as we go forward into the future we see the phenomenal advances in the world of technology, in cyber-crime. there's a wonderful movie i just saw, "black hat," action-adventure. it's about the issue of cyber security threats, and that is a growing concern, a growing risk. if there were anything what keeps you awake at night, the cyber aspect of this would be a great concern. >> shutting down the electric grid, the financial system? >> certain things happened in recent years that are alleged to have been cyber activity-related. those are areas where i don't

profess to have intimacy with all of that world, but i have a lot of people in the department and colleagues in the federal government who do. >> that is one of john millard's jobs. >> for sure. >> here's a question. with all the rise in terrorism we have seen with the internet and the capacity to influence new young people for whatever reason to join some kind of, to sacrifice their lives to give them some sense that there is a greater place they do this act for, their religion, are we less safe than ever? less safe? >> we have the potential to become less safe. as police commissioner in new york i'm not living in fear. at this time i think we are

very safe as we go forward. the great challenge will be to keep safe. because the threats are clearly going to become more complex potentially pervasive, and our challenge is going to be how to stay ahead of the curve rather than being behind the curve. after 9/11 we were behind the curve for a period of time, that we were able to catch up. nationally, and certainly mayor bloomberg and commissioner kelly created a system that mayor de blasio and myself benefit from. but the world is a very interesting place. it always has been. going forward, it's part of what stimulates me. i was many of the people i got the privilege of working with, they were very good at keeping

the city safe against traditional crime. the challenge will be to continue to keep the city safe against traditional crime while keeping it even savor against unknown, future, terrorist-related crime. >> thank you. in the interest of full disclosure, your wife works with me on another program. we are lucky to have her. quite thank you, charlie. >> commissioner bill bratton thank you for joining us. see you next time. ♪ ♪

>> i'm mark halperin. >> i'm john heilemann. with all due respect to country club bartenders, never go in against the speaker of the house when death is on the line. [laughter] >> our lineup tonight -- the team and baiters scream. but more variation on the mitt romney seemed. everyone in the republican party is talking about the resurrection of willard. the problem is a lot of members of the gop are not saying the nicest things. romney is scheduled to address the gop in san diego, but the