>> from our studios in new york city, this is "charlie rose" charlie:. charlie:we begin with a hack of personnel records from computers across the government. it may be the largest reach ever of u.s. government networks. investigators suspect china is behind the attacks, which china denies. we turn to david sanger, let me begin with the basic question. how serious is this? how much damage does it do react go? david: as with all big

cyberattacks, we don't know yet how much damage it did. there is good reason to believe since the office of personnel management, which is the office that handles security clearances and all other personnel matters for the federal government, told 4 million current and former government employees that they were going to get free credit reporting at a subsidized -- subsidized by the u.s. government. they think they lost a lot of personally identifiable information, which, at its most benign, would be so so security numbers and addresses. at its worst, information and answers people gave as they went through the security clearance process. that has a knack oh -- that has an echo of last summer, which was directed at elements of the department that focused on these

security clearances. the big question here is, what was the motive of the hackers? was this about espionage? about getting the data that would give them an insight into people who have security clearances, everything from energy department to state department officers for the intelligence agencies. or, is this a criminal group that is trying to amass a huge amount of data, then sell it? charlie: who does the investigation of this? david: the investigation is being done by the fbi, and the department of homeland security which is responsible for attacks on u.s. soil. as soon as there is a chinese dimension to it, and here, we think it may be a chinese group operating from southern china north of hong kong they may have also been responsible, just

based on the signatures of this attack, the attacks on amp up and primavera -- anthem and primera. this may involve the nsa. once you get into hacking abroad, you need the nsa's ability to crack act into those networks. charlie: do we assume if it came from china, the chinese government would know? david: not necessarily. many chinese attacks seem to be state-sponsored. certainly, those that came out of the people's liberation army the famous unit we have discussed many times before, use -- unit 61398, they did theft of intellectual property, when it is an army unit, it is state-sponsored. in this case, it could be a credible -- a criminal group.

it could be groups the government knows about, that doesn't try to stop. it could be proxies of some other kind. that is what makes this kind of thing so difficult. if you don't know for sure that it is a state-sponsored attack, the way the u.s. said it was in the sony case, the chinese can say, what they said a few hours ago. which is, you got hackers and criminals on your soil and so do we. one day, someone will have to take care of this. charlie: some have suggested, if you understood how they go about some of these security checks within the office of personnel management, you might better be able to place a mole. david: you might be able to do that or out and agent. you might figure out if somebody has a different employer than

the state department. there are many possibilities. you may have a black male possibility, because once you know the social security number and address, you can figure out where their kids are, or what their spouse does. all kinds of possibilities are out there. that is part of the reason. there was an inspector general's report that came out a little more than a year ago about the office of personnel management that was pretty searing in its description of their sloppy cyber practices. in fact, it suggested basis spend some elements of the site until begin getting cleaned up. i think one of the big questions for the next few days is going to be, what do they do -- what did they do up with a governor report? what did they do after the chinese hack last summer? how quickly were changes implemented? if it is like past cases, i think you will discover the implemented some changes, and have not done to others.

that is what happened to the nsa when they were rolling out security changes. but they hadn't gotten to hawaii yet. edward snowden was in hawaii. charlie: does this have any relationship to the russian hacking that led them to some of president obama's, i guess it was, e-mails? charlie: david: it is like it was connected right now. it is fascinating that china and russia have both felt free to engage in what we can only describe as short-of-war activities. one of the fascinating things about cyberattacks is that they are not on and on-off switch like a nuclear weapon or missile. they are on it is like turning up and down the heat in your home. the result of that is you can do some relatively low to medium level hacks, state-sponsored, proxies, whatever.

and you can know that it is unlikely that a country will retaliate. charlie: do we assume the u.s. government is doing the same thing or not? david: we assume the u.s. government is doing a fair bit of national security spying against russia. charlie: does that include china? david: we know it includes hacking. from the snowden documents, we know that there are 100,000 implants in computer networks around the world. those implants can be used for surveillance to detect incoming malware, they are the early warning radar for an attack on the united states. they can also be used for attack themselves. a way to think about these is, think about a port that a doctor might put into a patient to go administer chemotherapy. it is there, and you can use it for all sorts of purposes.

the united states has some of the most of this decade in cyber capabilities, if not the most sophisticated, of any nation on her. now, the u.s. would then also say, look we don't gather personal data about nongovernment officials. we don't steal intellectual property been given to state owned companies because we don't have state owned companies. we use this for national security. every country defines national security differently. that is why it has been so difficult to make any progress here. remember, it was just a year ago, this month, that the justice department indicted five members of the people's liberation army for some of those intellectual property thefts. what did that do? it shut down a lot of the dialogue between the u.s. and china. i am not saying it was a bad idea to indict them, but it is difficult to retaliate without stopping the diplomacy. charlie: am i missing anything about the subject of hacking? david: i think what's important

for most people to understand is, while they hear all about hacking and their personal information, and worry about it whether it is target or home depot or the attack on the office of personnel management. you have to think about these attacks in different ways. some are criminal, some are aimed at gaining personal data for reasons we don't understand and some are strategic. some are aimed at our core defense systems, and our -- and are meant to be part of an escalation of conflict. if you go back and look at where most of the attacks, not all of them, but where most of the attacks that are state-sponsored , they come from four countries. china, russia iran, north korea. two of those are old superpower

rivals that, either of weakness like russia or strengthen china's case come are looking for new ways to deal with united states. two of them are states that had ambitions, in building up a nuclear infrastructure, and have discovered that cyber is a more usable weapon. that tells you we have a level of challenge here that will be with us long after any iran nuclear agreement, long after whatever happens next with the north korean nuclear missile. in some ways, this is harder to handle. the barrier to entry in cyber weaponry is very low. it is cheap, it is hard to deter. charlie: david sanger of the new york times, thank you so much. we will be right back. stay with us. ♪

david: ken friedman was a successful executive with no experience in the food world. then, he decided to open a restaurant after he was introduced to april bloomfield. he knew he had found his partner. together, they open the spotted pagan new york -- the spotted pig in new york.

it was a hit. the new yorker called it a place where normal people go to feel like celebrities, and celebrities go to feel normal. here is a look behind the scenes. >> i spent my whole life in clubs as a musician, putting on shows. you are standing up at a club and you are looking at the band or looking at the dj or looking at girls. restaurants are like clubs for grown-ups. you can still mingled and meet new people, but you eat instead of get drunk. it is my midlife crisis, this restaurant. it has made -- it is made for people like me who do not decide where to go until five minutes before, who don't dress up urea this jack and i am wearing is a big deal. when i decided i wonder to quit

the music business and devote my energy and my money to opening the spotted leg -- the spotted p ig, i needed a good chef. april: here -- he asked if i wanted to move to new york. i said, i don't know who you are. but i ready to try something new. whenever you get artichokes it is so wonderful. ken: she really believes, and respects ingredients. she believes if you only have three or four of the plate, make them the best possible. the way i cook at home is, the way i learned from her. the best ingredients, that's the secret. april: i think it is just a casual setting. he has an amazing place with great energy. people can eat delicious food in

a casual, relaxed environment. april: ken: april gets assessed with certain things. right now, she is obsessed with chickens. april: i am. ken: at first it was pig's. april: we feed off each other. ken: she is the greatest partner i could have. i have done a couple things without her, and i realized, i don't want to do anything without her. she is a better partner to have. i am more proud of what we are doing when she is the one making the food. charlie: i used to live a block away from the spotted pig. there was always a table where i could sit. we became great friends. ken: you are on charles street, which you thought was named after you.

one time you didn't get a table. i had to beg you to come back bring you a bottle of wine. now, you always get a table. we will build a table, we have a cup on salary to build one. -- a carpenter on salary to build one. charlie: when you go, you would a place to sit. ken: the real vips are the people in the neighborhood. some celebrity who comes in once in a while, if you bend over backwards to them and your regulars see that, they will come back. we gave you the time of day because you lived a block away. now, you are uptown. charlie: every time i celebrate anything, for me or my staff, we go right to the spotted pig. april: we love having you there. charlie: so you decided you want

to own a restaurant. mario batali he knows something about restaurants and he knows this guy. the idea of you, came from, the idea of april? was it mario? wasn't jamie? ken: there were two people. your friend peter, who didn't want to do it. april: peter asked me, jamie gave my number two can -- to ken. charlie: and mario and jamie gave you a tour, and you were sold? ken: i was sold beforehand. we were e-mailing back and we don't know how to e-mail. sorry i pushed send. we are like bumbling idiots.

april: did you receive it? ken: we are kindred spirits. when we go driving together, we have the worst sense of direction. i was sold before we met. charlie: how do you divide up responsibilities? april: im in the kitchen, in the back of the house. i have a lot to do. we dispense ideas freely. charlie: and you are the person who is out front, making sure that everything is ok? ken: yes. that and, sometimes a lot less sometimes a lot more. charlie: doing the planning ahead and all those things? ken: it is important to have a partner like april, who doesn't forget that it is not about the next project, it is about the last project. making sure each plate that goes out is perfect.

i sometimes suffer from getting bored with what we have now and wanting to do the next thing. it is important to say, we are already committed to this. let focus on this. april: if can -- if ken had his way, he would open 20 restaurants per year. we ground each other. we both play without a little bit. charlie: you probably have ideas on how to cook, and you send them to her? ken: never. april: apparently he cooks the best chicken liver that i have never he. -- that i have never eaten. charlie: have there ever been e-mails where you said, how about this? april: kosher hotdogs and tofu burgers.

no. ken: if what you want is tofu dogs i am not the right person. i was trying to lose weight e-reader don't go to a real chef and say, come up with a tofu dog. charlie: what is your new pub? april: chefs took over paths that were going out of business in the 90's. they put a good chef in their someone who is at the front. they created exciting, warm environments to go hang out with their friends every night. ken wanted to create this place where he could bring his friends. charlie: has the menu changed a lot? april: not really. we still have the burger. we buy everything from the market so it changes seasonally. that dictates what we put on it. charlie: the union square

farmers market. did you call it the -- want to call it the prodigal hague -- the prodigal pig? ken: my friends didn't know what prodigal meant. spotted pig is a visual name. i told april and mario, who is my friend, helper and advisor he loved it. so it has worked. charlie: you went from pigs to chickens, and this book is about vegetables. april: i love vegetables. charlie: is that a new affair? april: no, a long affair. i grew up eating them. i've tell in love with vegetables at the river cafe.

you have to go to the pig to see that i have a love affair with vegetables. i wanted to create a book to show that side of me. charlie: you work -- you were at the river cafe in london when they found you. april: we had a great time. i was rating menus in my element. but i was ready for a different experience. i wanted to eat different food and meet new people. ken offered me an opportunity. he was in his midlife crisis and we held hands and junked together. we created this amazing thing. charlie: your midlife crisis? ken: i was 40 years old, in the music does this. i didn't want to play music anymore. i was born. i was the guy who's always throwing parties. people said, you should open a

restaurant. you think, yeah right. i thought, i will try it. i want to look back on my life and say, i did the things i wanted to do. i thought, how bad could it the geoeye didn't have kids or a wife or a mortgage. i could live for a couple years on the money i saved. although i spent it all when we went over budget on the pig. charlie: your friends in the music business come to your restaurant. your associations and friendships are deepened in the music business. ken: yes. i didn't know i would find a chef as great as april, but i wanted it to be about the food. i did not wanted to be a music business place for six months then everybody goes on to the next hip place. charlie: so you ensured that you had a good chef in the kitchen? ken: when you do dinner, you

don't -- i feel like chinese or a burger. you don't say, i want to see celebrities. if people are going to come back again it is for great food and great cocktails and wine lists. charlie: in the beginning you had 10% of the partnership. then, did he just walk in one day and say, i will give you 50%? or did you say, i will walk out without 50%? april: i approached ken to be equal partners at the spotted pig. you have to value your work and value yourself. ken appreciates what we do. he said no problem. ken: it was a simple

negotiation. she said, i think we are in a partners. -- equal partners. then the lawyers did paperwork. charlie: expansion. you started john doerr he -- john dorrie. that lasted eight months. how did you screw it up? april: we made bad judgment. any business person can do that. we should listen to our instincts. charlie: instincts that maybe not -- april: i didn't really speak up at first. i was too much in the background. i didn't like the space or the area. i have to take full responsibility for that. now, i do speak up. that was my learning curve through the failure of that restaurant. we cut our losses and decided to

move on. we knew the concept will. we knew we loved it. charlie: what is the concept? april: british seafood, a fish restaurant. we got a space on the corner of 29th at broadway and decided to move there. charlie: then the breslin came along? ken: that was right after we closed the other restaurant. then, we made a deal with a hotel. a friend of mine said i am coming to new york to this hotel. it is a 300 room hotel on broadway. we thought, broadway? really? he said, take a look. he said, look up. there are amazing buildings here. so we had never done anything we had one big success, one restaurant that just closed. we were looking our wounds. he says come i want you to do 24

hour room service. a huge pop. -- a huge pub. charlie: and so you put another restaurant next door? ken: it was seamless. there was a corner space where the lease was about to become available. the idea of a british seafood place, people in america think reddish seafood is fish and chips. they do not know that there is a tradition of british seafood. we made it an oyster bar. april: we made it a bit more casual. it is such a great evil watching space -- people watching place. it was a project that ken made a deal with, and i don't know. i was ready for a change, i think.

charlie: and then there is tosca in san francisco. ken: tosca is a mythical, i went to college at berkeley. tosca was a play -- a place where i could never get into the back room. all kinds of stuff going on in the back room. charlie: that ambience and feeling of the physical property, you can't -- that can make a restaurant have bad food but it can enhance good food. april: it can turn something good into something great. charlie: danny meyer was talking about fine dining casual a phrase he used. does that make sense to you? april: i think so, yeah. charlie: give us a sense of how

you see where the restaurant world is. april: right now, i think people want a relaxing environment. i don't think they want all of the frills. but i think they want the attention to detail. i think they want that kind of refined food on the plate, the refined glasses, but not 12 glasses or 10 sets of cutlery. or somebody's standing there very stiff. i think they want that pared down and just refined and agile. charlie: are you growing as a chef? april: all the time. i grow despite -- i watch what -- i watch my chefs interact. by going out to eat, traveling doing events with other chefs. seeing different stuff and being open. charlie: is it exciting for you to fire up the stove and do something that comes to heart and mind?

april: it is the smell, the sight, the touch. the day if i don't like it, that is the day i'm going to stop it. i have been doing this for a long time. i have been cooking since i was 16. i love it. there's never a dull moment. i'm not one of those people. i have as much passion and fire as i did when i was 16. i love the fact that i still have that and i hope it comes through with the people i work with. charlie: what is your ambition? ken: to keep excited, to keep doing projects that are exciting or new. not just to re-create stuff.

do new things. charlie: he's obviously very good at this. what is it he has? april: i'm still trying to figure it out. charlie: to know ken is to love him. i'm serious. you have that quality, it's not just me. you know if you were in trouble he would be there for you you know if you have a special requirement he would be there to help you. therefore he has a personality so when you come in there you want to see him. april: he's very charismatic. charlie: charismatic. ken: i'm right here.

charlie: congratulations. you chose a great partner. ken: i'm good at choosing partners and friends. charlie: there's breslin, now in san francisco. more to come. this is a big project. ken: this company rose associates, they are renovating this building. it is the seventh tallest building in new york. top four floors. charlie: this a big deal. are you up for this? that's the only reason it becomes exciting because you are in over your head.

charlie: good luck. back in a moment. stay with us. ♪

charlie: richard lewis is here. the chicago tribune called him one of the most audacious wordsmiths this side of lenny

bruce. his therapist, the late comedian said lewis proves you don't have to institutionalize a psychotic. he released a box set of his work called bundle of nerves. he has now created a book. richard lewis's guide how not to live. i am pleased to have richard lewis. richard: i'm pleased to be here. charlie: tell me about you and him and how you came to admire him. richard: a friend when i was three or four introduced me to cark u\\ -- carl in the 1980's. soon after that larry david got him a studio. i end up bulk buying 30 or 40 of his paintings. he is so understood the way he paints my mind, good or bad. i'm going to call you up and anything that tickles your fancy -- which is a phrase i've never

used on television. dinah shore once used it. it's not a bad name for a jazz song. i called him up and we got the book together by a wonderful editor. now it is a powerhouse books. 50 images. larry david wrote the foreword. he just demolished me.

charlie: this is what he wrote -- this one works. and it did work. richard: thank you, i think it did work. he's a happy man right now. we had this connection for 35 years and i didn't have the greatest upbringing. i wasn't molested were abused that emotionally i felt tethered to nothing. i was all alone. he used to come to all my shows and on tv and oh my concerts. he would understand the need the darkness was another layer of darkness. he was able to illustrate this in this book.

charlie: take me through the coming attraction at here's the image we can see on the screen now. richard: my nightmares are coming attractions. he would do it. that is a slight joke but not enough of a joke. charlie: the worst audience i ever had were my parents. richard: we had to edit the book, of course. my mother was ill. she had a lot of problems. my dad died before i became a comedian, but they were never around. my brother was a beatnik who was lying on fourth. my sister eloped when i was 12. i was alone with my mother. it was like a neil simon-eugene o'neill house together. when i saw this i never expected it.

i remember asking a lyricist. when you gave your poem of 30 years to larry book, he says he never let me down. carl never let me down. every time i saw it i went -- the flags and the kites arch it -- are just trippy. charlie: you call him up. how soon do you see the image? weeks? months? richard: it averaged about a month. i was never disappointed. when i saw the mousetrap i said that's me. charlie: the next one is, what a shame love is a two-way street.

richard: i have been a recovering addict for 20 years and i was a mess. i'm still nuts, no longer an addict. alcohol and drugs and coke is not managing me anymore for 20 years. that's good. my wife never saw me loaded. before that, i think it was the media maven saying communication is a two-way street. it was a shame my narcissism got in the way of a relationship. particularly as a drug addict, i had to be right all the time. charlie: i used to think topical depression were my relative in florida.

richard: that is a joke, obviously. i was on the island waiting to be put down by the majority of my family. they just didn't get me. such a small percentage. i was tethered on to nothing. i felt it was easy to understand that even though i was doing well in the early 70's. it was a different deal. the village -- i must have gone to manhattan. new jersey for a while and i broke up with my college girlfriend.

i was a wreck. back then in the 1970's, all the iconic comedians, all of these guys were on stage. they were the big guns. i said, how can i to this? how can i make a living at this? i'm not going to milk a cow. i had to do this. and i never gave up. it was good. guys like steve allen, who i was a friend with, he would see my set and say you got it. david brenner said you got to work on this 20 you can become a star. people like that -- charlie: did you admire?

richard: i listened to lenny bruce's album where i graduated. when i heard the berkeley album -- he was already dead. he died the night i bottomed out. i was holed up in my house doing crystal meth for about 10 days. i looked like a jewish -- who who hid out in hotels in vegas? i looked like howard hughes very thin rabbi. people came over, are you going to die? i was in denial. true friends did. the doctor said, what are you doing? i said i'm dying, it's over.

no mas. that was it. charlie: you have to tie yourself up to do that. richard: there are different types of programs and i had friends who were horrible junkies. if they can clean themselves up -- that is the good part of having a lot of friends. if this guy was a junkie and came back 18 times -- i like alcohol, the cocaine came last. i dated a sweet girl and she experimented. she said you are so mean on booze, nicer on ecstasy.

charlie: you're clean now? richard: 20 years. charlie: look at this one. you draw that? there it is. richard: that was putting myself down in front of my wife. it's really odd being with someone for 17 years -- i don't want to go overboard on this. it's my journey. i wouldn't have a lot of things. it's all over. i get a kick out of saving it. i see guys line down like this. i know he is saying -- if richard lewis can clean up, that makes me feel good.

the actors were diane weiss, faye dunaway. it is never ending. i went over to a dramatic actor. i auditioned for the role and got it. i was doing a letterman show. the producer broke down and cried. i was only sober for months. i was staying at this one hotel lot for 10 years. and the woman who helped me, i said i have to base here. he was a junkie. i said give me the worst room that you would give to a neo-nazi. give me a horrible room.

she gave me the worst. i said take all the furniture out. i brought a picture of lenny bruce and jimi hendrix and put it over my bed. peter cohen, who directed it, he came in and wanted me to audition some actors who had smaller roles. and he walks in, and like an addict who feels he is even the greatest or the worst human being on the planet, i said get someone else. you don't need me. i'm an alcoholic. he looked around this room which looked like gitmo with pictures of lenny and hendrix. if we get to it i can tell you some people that started what comedy is all about. he laughed, he says you are an alcoholic.

what a shock that is. i was only sober a little bit. i was so raw. i was freaked every time it went to the set. charlie: was there time you thought you had a great opportunity to be a great actor? richard: what happened to me is i remember that year, it was talking heads. if that was on air force one maybe. probably would have made $200 million.

monologues, actors should get this and see the monolgues. they are just astounding. just unbelievable. i will miss so many. i was in the first scene of losing las vegas. i said fine, i read the script. i said if he nails this nick cage is going to win an oscar. and he did. i'm sitting outside. i have a degree in business and i fired 300,000 agents and managers. i like you who i have now, you happy? he's practicing his different levels of alcoholism. i said what i love to play an alcoholic and two months later i auditioned for "drunks."

the same year i did a special which got great reviews. things that were never shown before. it is a really cool package. it has stuff that people like me have never seen. for some reason, agents who are fired say i am making a lot of money as a standup. i'm not going to be daniel day-lewis in "lincoln" but i can play that. i can play a gangster. charlie: could've played lenny bruce. so david letterman leaves the scene. richard: he set a precedent to maybe save my standup career.

i used to do tonight with johnny. we've had funny stories. once i was on a plane going to paris. i was with my ex-girlfriend. i had a lot of nervous tics. he's there on the island first class. my girlfriend says if you continue to stare at carson, you are dead. he's right here. i keep staring at him for five hours. i went over to him and said johnny, i'm humiliated. i have a lot of tics. i wish it was one of the

stooges sitting there. he said it was cool. two things about carson and letterman that are very crucial to me, i had this monologue. you have 5.5 minutes. then you sit down. i was doing a division of motor vehicles routine i was doing for a decade. i couldn't wait for to get to carson. young comics should know this, you do one tonight, one talkshow, it's like doing a nightclub in manhattan three times a night for a full house. you better not walk through it you better take every six minutes seriously. i always did. i was doing my monologue and i was killing it in burbank, which is normally a pretty square audience. i see this stage manager go under the camera and go wrap it up.

i was thinking if i wrap it up i will never get the show again because i didn't finish half the monologue. if i stay on it will be the longest monologue in history which it was. it was, 11 minutes. i said i will never get the show again. if people say how come you are not on with johnny, i say unto funny. as i walked back, the segment producer said, you will never get this show again. i knew i did the right thing. carson saw me be great. i go to the palm, where i used to go after tonight shows. there is carson with his ex lawyer. what a billion to one shot.

we still had our make-up on from the show. i dart over like jack ruby. i got on my knees and let my case. i told him what i told you. i didn't want him to think i didn't know what a monologue was. the next day i get a call from a rather nasty tempered producer and he went, you are a lucky man. you are back to business with johnny. but letterman said, i've seen your tonight show's. some are great, some aren't. he said this to me before he got his late-night show in 1981. he might forget this. he said you can write for me and still do standup. he says you come on my show as often as you want but never do standup on television ever. you are too physical. charlie: the book with the foreword, larry david basically says -- know that you are way ahead of

the game. thank you, richard. good to see you. richard: good to see you. ♪

rishaad: i'm rishaad salamat in this is "trending business." ♪ rishaad: a look of what we are watching. waning demand. warning signals in china. the consumer prices are rising less than expected. inflation is 1.2%. less than the half 3% official target suggested. there is room to loosen policy.

apple should up the music industry with itunes and now they launched a music streaming service. the biggest retailer of music after leaving ground to spotify and pandora. the european union's frustration with greece is mountain. angela merkel is asking for urgent action. [indiscernible] let us know what you think about today's top stories. follow me on twitter. the cpi, the index stretching the record of declines. weak demand in china and abroad. steve is here with the details. steve: we need to tell about the deflationary environment in china. the prices of goods that leave the