♪ emily: she founded a genetic testing company on one big idea, to create a dna database so big it could single-handedly move science forward, even help cure deadly diseases. but in 2013, a near disastrous lull. this at ceo anne wojcicki had to face a very public divorce from her husband, google founder sergey brin. years later, a remarkable comeback with the first fda approved consumer product, new

funding, and a $1.1 billion valuation. joining me today is "23andme" ceo and cofounder anne wojcicki. so great to have you here. the last two years for you have been crazy. it could have been disastrous for the company, but now you are back on good terms with the fda. how do you feel about where you are right now? anne: i feel great. i'm super proud of the company and what we have accomplished. when you have to slog through, you just have to put your head down and know there's a lot of work ahead of you and you're not going to see a reward for a couple of years, it is hard. i felt like we just climbed the first flight of stairs and we're climbing the empire state building. it is amazing we are back on the market. we have an incredible product. i am excited that this is the first chapter in a whole new

book for "23andme". emily: you have the first fda approved consumer test that someone can get. anne: consumers can go and buy things like cystic fibrosis tests without having to go through a physician. emily: and this is a test for recessive genes, a thing you might pass on to your kids. anne: correct, something you might pass on to your children, and other things like your eye color, which is interesting and teaches people about genetics, and things like caffeine metabolism. lactose intolerance as well. emily: i would love it if you could take me back to that day when you got that now infamous letter from the fda. anne: it was november 22, 2013. we were at an off-site planning for our future. we were all in great moods.

we had hired a great number of people. i think what we learned after that moment is how much there was a disconnect between what we thought we were trying to do with the fda and what they really needed us to do. emily: did you think for a moment, oh my goodness, that's our company. anne: there was probably about six weeks there where we talked to a number of lawyers, we talked to the fda, and it became really clear that there was no easy option forward. emily: did you seriously consider selling the company? anne: no, the idea that genetic testing is going to be a foundation for health care in the future, it is just core to my being. i'm wedded to this company for the rest of my life. i'm not interested in selling and i was never interested in , closing up shop and saying this is too hard. it was just a question of saying we need to refocus, we need to hire the right people.

we had a major miscommunication. we need to make sure we are executing the right way. emily: as you said, it was an arduous process. you hired a team who could better interact with washington. how did you get there? anne: it was literally me picking up the phone and calling everyone i knew, saying who are the heads of regulatory teams that i should talk to? we hired kathy hibbs of genomic health and she had a tremendous amount of experience. she understood genetics, she understood the fda and how we could structure the company so people could see the path we were taking. emily: there's so much more you want to accomplish like tests for breast cancer and alzheimer's. what is the progress on that? those have not been approved. anne: that's the top of my list. those are the things we are talking to the fda about, what is the pathway going to look like to move that forward?

i don't have any updates on that. emily: your original idea was to give consumers access to their own data and amass so much data that you could single-handedly move science forward. now you have one million customers. is this the single biggest dna database out there? anne: it's definitely the biggest one being used for research. what was exciting to me about "23andme" and what we were trying to do, all your genetic information, everything about what you eat and how you exercise and your medical conditions and what you respond well to, that with all this information we will be able to understand patterns and understand the genetic basis for why you might respond to a therapy or why you don't. in my dream world, i can imagine i walk into the physician and he they say, with all the information you've given us, you

are a couple of years away from being diabetic. and if you want to make a change, you can do x-y-z. that is my hope. byhaving so much data -- having so much data and knowing about your risks you can make , conscious choices about what you're doing on a daily basis to mitigate those risks. emily: sergey has been an critical part of your story and now you are divorced and you have two kids. how do you go through something a process like that? ♪

emily: your dad was a physics professor, and your mom was an educator. tell me about your upbringing. anne: i grew up next to people who did not do things for money, they did things because they loved it and they were interested in it and constantly questioning. this idea that you just question all the time was core to me.

emily: your sister janet is an epidemiologist. how do you all relate to each other? anne: we see each other a lot. in my world, nothing has changed. my sisters still come over and they steal my clothes. especially my sister susan, we see each other at events all the time. now it is really fun like we are both invited. emily: what do you think it is about your family and upbringing bred three different daughters in different disciplines? anne: we all learned to take feedback really well. there are few things that people could say that are truly insulting or that i would take offense at. we were raised in a way to be relatively confident in ourselves. none of us do things just for the money.

we do things that we really believe in and are passionate about. emily: you went to yale and majored in biology. you also were a competitive figure skater and hockey player. and you were a health analyst. anne: i got a job offer on wall street and originally said no to the job. two weeks later i called them back and said maybe i should go to wall street. emily: how did you go from wall street to silicon valley? anne: i was investing in everything from birth to death. i loved meeting with scientists and hospitals and just understanding how the health-care system worked. the more that i dug into it, the more i recognized how much it is a business. i went to one meeting back in 2005 and realized there were 1000 people working on how they were going to maximize billing outcomes for patients so they could take home as much money as possible.

i realized the system was never going to change. for me, that was throwing in the towel. as much as i'm investing and i believe there is so much potential in the health care system, it's not the health care system that i want. for me it was all about starting , a movement where consumers actually have a voice. emily: at a certain point you met sergey brin, the founder of google. your sister rented her garage to him. anne: we used to joke that i could not avoid him because he was always there. we would be washing dishes and see them in the other room, they were just there. my sister was there and it was free food and it was fun, so i got to know sergey. emily: what was it like for you, being on the front lines of the founding of google? anne: the things i was most inspired with, they did not start it because they wanted

money. they started it because they really had the dream of having the world's information on their laptop. out one point they could have sold the company and been professors and life could have been good. secondly i would complain to , larry about the health care space and how much i felt like health care was just dysfunctional. he was like, "you are either part of the solution or you are part of the problem." that was a call to action. if it is bad, except. -- fixed it. emily: you learned early on that sergey was predisposed to parkinson's. that became a critical part of the story of "23andme" and what the way you communicated what you guys were trying to achieve. anne: the discovery came about at the time we were starting "23andme" and i had to -- they told me essentially, "what would you do with the information, even if he did have it, what would you do?"

and i found that really offensive. how dare you tell me what information is valuable for me? it should be my choice. i joked that it was convenient that we had a spectacular science team. they put the mutations we were looking for on the chip. i remember i was sitting at the kitchen table and i called one of the scientists and said i think sergey has this mutation, is that what this means? and his mom has two copies of it, is that what that means? they were surprised, they had not seen one who had two copies of that mutation. getting that information definitely catapulted us onto a whole new journey of being involved with michael j fox and starting the "23andme" parkinson's community. you madeu say discoveries about parkinson's that could lead to a cure. anne: we made a number of interesting genetic discoveries

about parkinson's. we have a parkinson's team and we have some projects we are talking about doing, really understanding the genetic mutation specifically that sergey has. we are talking about some of the big things we are able to do there. emily: sergey has been a big critical part of your story. you have two kids and two companies between you, and you are officially divorced. when there is so much wealth involved and so much scrutiny, how do you even go through a process like that? anne: all i can say is it is complicated. divorce is never easy, but we are very good friends. we see each other almost on a daily basis. we are supportive of each other. it is the new reality of relationships. emily: you are a single working mom. do you have any advice from this period in your life? anne: you just have to accept that you do the best that you can.

it is 10:00 at night and my kids and i are eating ice cream. there are moments when sometimes it's just hard, and you do the best that you can do. i think part of it is also being gentle on yourself. you cannot necessarily do everything. part of what sergey and i have done really well, you optimize finding the best in everybody. emily: and you do things so normal. how do you stay normal? anne: you stay focused on the things that are important. i volunteer at the school and i make sure the kids do their homework and i see my family all the time. i still see my friends. emily: you have been active in the issue of women in technology and the lack thereof. how much progress have we seen, and how much progress still needs to be done?

anne: there is an imbalance and it needs to change. it is a 10 year issue. getting ethnic diversity in tech. you don't have to be the best at something in order to have an impact. everyone is good at something. it is really important that women understand the impact they can have in tech. part of our jobs is to not be intimidated. there are men, there are women, and there is [beep]. you try to work with the men and women. there can be men and women that are a pain you do not want to work with. just try to find those people that are going to support you. emily: when you think about the situation unfolding? ♪

emily: i do want to talk to you about theranos. given your own dealings with the fda, what do you think about elizabeth holmes and the situation that is unfolding? anne: i have a lot of respect

for her mission and what she's trying to do, but i have doubt stayed out of knowing the details of it. i think health care is changing quite a bit and people are always going to be skeptical. the onus is on us to be really transparent. emily: i understand health care and what she is trying to do, an is hard. but after 12 years, does it seem like it should be more evolved at this point? anne: i can walk into any center and i don't need a physician and i can just have a finger prick and get my information. people just want to understand the technology and understand the data. i get that concern because people are making life-and-death situation calls based on this data. they want to understand the why of how these things are happening. emily: this is a $10 billion company. people think it is a fraud. do you think it is possible, what she is trying to do?

anne: i am sure it is possible. she works incredibly hard. i've seen her discipline and how much she is working. i'm not close enough to the company to know about the technology, but i think it's what everyone wants to know. everyone is excited about the potential of new technology and people want to understand what that technology actually is. emily: how do you walk that line of protecting your trade secrets and being transparent? anne: she is not required to have the transparency that people are asking for. i think that is part of the disconnect, the fda has put out guidance where they are trying to regulate that whole industry. if that is the type of call the fda is making, it will be good to have that same transparency across all diagnostics. when you are in the middle of a crisis situation, it is hard to evaluate. it is the media's job, like you guys are all digging in, and when you are executing and you have more fda approval, all those things lead to what the reality is.

right now, there is a lot of discussion. emily: let's talk about the future of "23andme". you now share data with pfizer. the goal is to incorporate all of this data into drug discovery. how is the drug invention program going and health? anne: i am super excited about it. for people who have a disease like parkinson's or multiple sclerosis or chronic fatigue or any of the autoimmune diseases. if we can actually use all this data to translate into something meaningful, that is just a spectacular reward for our customers. emily: what diseases are you focused on. i know you've been doing a lot of work on lupus, for example. anne: we have a number of partnerships that we are doing with pharma companies. lubitz, parkinson's is a big

initiative. we are about to launch a few others. emily: are you going to do human testing yourself? anne: pharma will react best if we can come to them with a compound with some data about how it is functioning. there is a much higher likelihood of success if we can actually come with that level of information and help move that forward. emily: so that means you would do human testing? anne: not physically right here, but we would start some of our own clinical research, for sure. emily: there is competition out there. ancestry.com the something similar. do you see google and calico as competition? anne: no, everything we do here is focused on genetics and engaging the consumer and making really engaging products for them. calico is focused on anti-aging, but i always wish all these

companies will expand the entire industry, and i want to translate it into meaningful therapeutics, so we can come back and say that hepatitis c has been cured, or that we developed a cure for lupus. my success moment will be when we have that kind of cure, that came because millions of people came together and shared their data, and because of that, we were able to create something. emily: do you have any plans to go public? anne: i'm not eager to be a public company, but i'm not opposed to it at some point. it's just a question of finding the right time. we will figure that out. there are definitely pros and cons. emily: looking back, is there anything you would have done differently? anne: for sure. every day. when you are pioneering, you will make mistakes. we almost hired andy page five years earlier, and yeah, we should have.

that would have been much better. definitely an easier business model than what we have chosen to do. but we believe so core in what we are doing. in the long run, it's going to have a massive impact on society. i think back to when we started the company, we were like the lone voice in the microphone. the fact that it is there, it is happening, and it's a super exciting world now. almost like in when the internet 1996 was just starting. it is virgin territory. it is all starting to sprout up. there really can be this consumer health care world that is just spectacular, and we are to create something parallel to the existing world, but it will reflect more what you and i really want for our health care. emily: i hope to see it. anne wojcicki, "23andme", thank you for being here. anne: thank you for having me. ♪

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>> every year around november or december, many journalists will get an assignment that makes them feel -- >> gulp. >> a little nervous. >> you are putting me on the spot. >> they will be asked to write a story about what will happen in the coming year.