>> and to bloomberg businessweek on radio and television. =vid: coming up, contributor gives us the lowdown on the bernie sanders campaign. carol: a war on salt. david: and timely advice on how not to get sick at work. we go behind the latest issue right here on bloomberg radio and television. ♪

carroll: we begin this week with the presidential campaign of bernie sanders. the vermont senator is taking on hillary clinton for the nomination, definitely making himself heard. david: a speech in new york city, and on all due respect. bernie sanders: are we in danger once again of a too big to fail situation, where the taxpayers have to bail them out? here is the irony. there a few people know this. after we bailed the banks outcome of three out of the four are significantly bigger then they were when we bailed them out. thel: joel stein wrote cover story. he joins us on the phone from los angeles. joel, this is not your typical presidential candidate or hopeful. what was he like, what was your mission in writing the story? for: the mission was businessweek readers, he is kind of the boogie man. it was to look deeply at him,

see how secure people should be. at least businessweek readers. neverson, i have interviewed anybody in my life, or met anyone, including like athletes and violinists who are so dedicated to one thing. he only cares about wealth inequality. there is not much else he is really interested in, not as politically but in life. he is what you think. he is like -- i am jewish. he is normal for me, somewhere between my parents and grandparents. a grumpy, likable old jewish hippie. david: politicians today spend so much time crafting their story, making sure they are conveying to the electorate their sense of who they are, how they want to be portrayed great this is not a guy very much concerned with that at all. joel: he is so annoyed about any question about his personal life.

he throws in one paragraph of bio into his hour-long speech read any kind of mumbles through it. he is a very interesting life story. he is just not interested in it. he cannot make other people interested. his campaign ads, they have a couple of pictures of where he grew up. but yes, he is not interested in talking about that at all. he wants to talk about numbers, issues. carol: you play this out in the story jolt. even people who have known him for a long time, friends of his do not really know who he is. which is interesting. joel: i was talking to a senator from the right really likes him. he was kind of singing his praises in a really interesting, nice way. and i asked him, as i ask everyone, what else is he interested in? and he said, you know, i never thought about it. but everybody i talk to will talk about football and i have

never talked to him about anything else. i have known him for 25 years. i don't even know if he has a wife or grandkids. it is just not what bernie sanders would bother talking about. david: he has been in a politics for a long time, as mayor of burlington in vermont. in congress -- the senate. why is he enjoying such success, what is resonating at this point in time so widely? jolt: i talked to robert reich about this. because wealth inequality has become such an issue, growing so rapidly, anyone who kind of took of the occupy movement beliefs would have gotten these kind of crowds, these kind of donors. he thinks elizabeth warren may have done even a little better. i disagree. because bernie sanders looks someone and occupy rally, you know, he does not care about his hair. he is crumpled. he is so fiery and angry.

i think he become the kind of perfect vehicle for all of that anger that you see on the left -- and the right. and you see it in the donald trump supporters, the tea party. physically,mbodies, that kind of anger at wall street. carroll: also, you put in your story -- you talk about this one kind of message that he is really trying to go after. he is really struggling with all of the inequality that is out there. i think that is something that is really timely, right? coming out of the financial crisis, for the american lit at large. joel: he became a very national figure. he is weird, but it is such a big deal. carol: did you really say he is weird? joel: he is very weird. but it is a weird political story. a guy that started out as a socialist -- he did not start as a local community organizer, although he did that in college, you know, at the university of chicago. but then he comes to vermont,

and runs for governor and then senate and then governor and then senate. as a socialist, third-party candidate -- 4% of the vote. he runs for mayor of vermont, wins by 10 votes because it is a four-way race. this guy should never have one any election. it was such a big deal when he became mayor of burlington, vermont. which was even a less significant city there. it is a national story, they elected a socialist to be married this is a national joke. he was in dunes very. and he did a pretty good job of d isr, and in starte thing as a third-party run for congress. he served for 16 years, and then the democrats back to him as he ran for senate. this is not the way a person is elected in this country. david: let me ask you about this campaign. you write it is a mom and pop

campaign. you look at the numbers, he has raised tens of millions of dollars. that is besides the point. look at how many people have given, way more than any other candidate. joel: if you remember that he declared he was running, it seemed like no one was going to run against hillary clinton. and when he, the socialist in the senate, decides to run, it seemed so ridiculous and fringe. he has gotten more donations that any candidate, including sitting presidents them at this point in the election cycle. he has almost as much money race, if you do not count the super pac's of hillary. and he has a lot more donors than she has. and his crowds are huge. no one, including trump, is attracting amount of people to the rallies that he has great in some places, 30,000, 25,000. carol: we just have 15 seconds here. what do you think the voting public to know about him, having spent time? quickly. joel: he is totally authentic,

speaks forom his heart. inequality, or if you would be a good leader, the answer is no. this is all he cares about. david: thank you very much. joel stein joining us from los angeles. you can read his story in the latest issue, featuring bernie sanders, it is online and on newsstands. arol: we will tell you about disciple of ralph nader, behind the war on salt. when bloomberg businessweek on radio and television returns. ♪

carroll: welcome back. i am carol massar. salt and we definitely love it. david: yes, i certainly do. but a restaurant group sued new york city, calling for chain restaurants to post warnings on food. carol: the national restaurant association said the city overstepped. and this week edition of bloomberg businessweek, john tozzi joins us in our studio. talk to us about this war on salt, and interesting crusader is involved. john: we wrote about a guy named michael jacobson, the head of a group in washington that is pressing the fda to set limits on how much salt food companies can add into processed food. they have been actually trying to get these sodium levels installed for years now. 40 years. carol: 40 years. david: a disciple of ralph

nader. i know the government has some guidance, many of us exceed what they recommend. but there is no limit placed on any of these companies that make food. john: that is the issue here. for a long time, health authorities have recommended that people consume less sodium. 2.3 grams peret day, about one teaspoon of salt. almost universally eat significantly more than that. and it is not because we are adding it at the table, it is generally because it is baked into the food -- the process food, the restaurant meals that we all eat. if you want tot lower salt consumption across the board, you have to start at the pie. and get food manufacturers to agree to lower the sodium in their product. carol: i thought that was interesting in your story, even though we have become more aware of what we are eating, the salt

intake has not really changed much. it has gone up. does he wanthe specifically here? john: jacobson and his group have asked the fda to remove salt from ingredients generally recognized as safe. that sort of paved the way for the agency to limit how much you can put into a product. what is more realistic, what the fda has actually talked about for several years, is creating voluntary limits that the food industry would adhere to. so it would not be mandatory, but it would be saying here are the standards for -- you can put x x amount of salt in this product. you can tailor it to the category of food. sort of baseline

for most of baseline, so the entire industry can work off of that. that, over time, the standards could be generally ratcheted down to sort of lower the overall salt intake without having any one company act first. because they're all afraid to. david: campbell's soup try to wase back how much salt in there. consumers did not like it. ofn: campbell made a lot headlines about this a few years back, trying to offer healthier options read lowering the saudi reversedtent, they course to a lot of ways, responding to the preference. one of the things that happens is that people get kind of accustomed to a high level of salt in their food. it is hard to come you know back away from that once. health authorities have recommended to sort of slowly trying to lower the levels in our food. carol: walmart is moving ahead with trying to decelerate their

products. john: a lot of products -- a lot of companies recognize the issues consumers care about. they know that too much sodium in the diet is harmful. and they want to be seen as responsive. so walmart and other food havelers, manufacturers taken steps publicly to offer low-salt options. have those available to consumers, to lower the sodium in their products. but i think that health authorities have kind of come to the conclusion that it you leave it up to voluntary action, we have in trying that for 40 years, it has not been very effective. has thischael jacobson 40-year war against salt. what is the latest battle he is fighting? he sued the fda. might we see action? john: sure, the context around

this, the fda has been working on these voluntary guidelines for the industry. a couple of years ago, they said they expected to issue them -- they were expected to do that by the end of 2014. here we are in 2016. obama's term is at its end. and jacobson is saying, listen, we need to get them to act on it. so his group filed a lawsuit, asking the fda to act on salt limits. so the regulator has until sometime in february to respond in court. carol: not everybody agrees there is a problem. you talk about the flip side in your story, people saying it is not really an issue. john: one thing that this is the science on sodium intake is complex. open,ow, science is not drivery. there is some evidence that says lowering salt intake beyond a certain level could be harmful.

americans are not near that level yet. but, you know, there are people making arguments saying, you know, that generally we are at a safe level of sodium intake. and when you talk to doctors, public health officials, looking at the recommendations of health authorities, they still say the opposite. that people really should dramatically reduce their salt intake. david: john, thank you very much. up next, how a vietnamese refugee is rethinking food delivery in america. carol: we talk about the details on the profile of the ceo of one company we are talking about. we are back in a moment. ♪

david: welcome to bloomberg businessweek on radio and television. startupunchery is a trying to solve the challenge of mealtime planning. hn, sayshe ceo, tri tra his amazing journey started thousands of miles away in the anomaly redstone joins us from vietnam. he ends up in the san francisco bay, via m.i.t.. talk about his life story. brad: sure, first of all, we hear a lot of startup stories here in the valley. particularly now, there are a lot of companies trying to deliver meals. they all kind of blend together. i first heard about the precooked nutritious meals, you keep them up at home. but what got me was hearing about the founder's story. tran, they said you should get to know him. hisparents sent him and

brother away, out of vietnam, in the 1980's he was 11 years old. as a parent myself, it is sort of mystifying -- how could that even be, you know? forced separation. i went and met him, and i got this story. this is postwar vietnam, a lot of deprivation in the 1980's. his brothers and parents are living outside of ho chi minh city. and there is not enough to eat, which of course is ironic considering the juxtaposition of his current business. and his parents really decided that these kids -- if they want to have any future -- they need to leave vietnam. the whole family tried to escape together. i recount this in the story. they try to couple of times. they got arrested and thrown in jail. the communist government would not let anyone lead. at one point, they found a smuggler who was pretty good. he looked at their zodiac sign determined they cannot live together. it was unlucky that the signs conflicted. the parents were going to split up, the dad was going to take the.

then the grandmother, the mom's mom, said let me take the kids. the three of them got on a boat, fleeing to indonesia. they spent six months in a refugee camp there. david: he starts his company because he and his wife not have time to cook. in silicon valley, i gather there is a lot of interest income is like this. blue apron has a $2 billion valuation. for investors here, ways of getting food to the dinner table in a different way. brad: they do have a story about him being very strapped for time, trying to figure out a way to feed themselves -- so the food is high quality. i bring it back to the origin. living in this tightknit vietnamese community, having a , you know, ang for kind of community experience, good quality food. there were a lot of services around silicon valley where you go to a restaurant every day and pick up a pre-made meal and bring it home.

it was kind of a longing for that old way of eating, not just picking up fast food on the way home. is so, that is why munchery so much different than the companies you mentioned. rocket, caviar -- there is a long list. they are delivering restaurant meals. but what theyt, are trying to do -- and there are a couple of others like it -- they own their own kitchen. in the cities where they operate, chicago and new york ynd seattle and l.a., there employ a lot of chefs. they are making chicken, salmon, vegetarian dishes -- almost like home-cooked meals. they chill them and deliver them to your house. you heat them up in the microwave for two minutes or in

the oven for 10 minutes. it is different from the other companies. david: thanks so much, joining us from san francisco. carroll: now let us take a look of the magazine. let's bring in julian, who edited the section. sick, how not to get something before he about a lot this time of year. i wonder, first of all, is there really a way to prevent it? the office is crowded, can you avoid getting sick in the wintertime? julia: the most important thing to do is get a flu shot. you should do it on there is no reason not to, according to the best experts that we spoke with. carol: whenever i am sick, i think much i call in? are there rules? julia: nothing hard and fast. does listen to your body, if you feel like you are not going to be productive, do not go in. it costs employers a lot of

money every year. sometimes, if you're really feeling terrible, the best thing you can do is not go in. carroll: coffee beans, similar to what we have seen. tell us about this. julia: absolutely. last fall, you saw a lot of big financial place in the craft coffee industry. a couple of favorites were bought up by pete's, itself owned by a loarger conglomerate. they have a lot of money. david: i grew up in north carolina, countercultural coffee. really an outsider now, very big but still an independent coffee roaster and distributor. julia: most of these companies grew up doing wholesale. counterculture is still doing that, they get 90% of revenue from wholesale trade bluebottle actually announced they would stop doing wholesale entirely. carroll: they are trying to stay independent.

i did not realize about this third wave coffee movement. julia: sourcing your beans, treatment with loving care at the coffee shop, really eating customers information. david: people talk about the best may use things that you apply to wine come a craft beer. even a chainis coming up in the west coast was started in northern california, that is perpetuating this poor over brewing method. of course, taking it large-scale trade carol: my favorite part of the section from you talk abou comfy slouchy pants. you talk about pants that are appropriate for work. julia: we are starting to see drawstring, more flowing styles out there. you can wear these to the office, they are office-appropriate. david: i'm looking at the photos. a lot of them look like pajamas.

when you have done rather massively here is kind of mask that. is the point, how to style and wear them. carol: david, i see you may be wearing the drawstring pants. david: i am wearing a tie here. but there are outfits that are inspired by men's neckties. prince very much look like that. like preschoolk pants, everything comes around. julia: and you did it with the alvin ailey dancers. we wanted people who were able to capture these languorous shapes. they did a goo before job. thank you so much. carol: that does it for bloomberg businessweek on radio and television. i am carol massar. david: the latest edition featuring bernie sanders is live

on newsstands. carol: we will see you. ♪

>> from our studios in new york, this is "charlie rose." charlie: "the revenant" is a new film based on the 2002 novel. it explores the existence of fur trappers in the 1820's. leonardo dicaprio plays hugh glass, a legendary frontiersman who suffered a bear attack, was left for dead by his companions, and crawled 200 miles to safety. here's a look at the trailer.