from our studios in new york city, this is "charlie rose." continue this evening with a look at the presidential election. controversy stirred with his suggestions that gun rights advocates take matters into their own hands against hillary clinton. mr. trump: hillary wants to essentially abolish the second amendment. if she gets to pick her judges, nothing you can do folks. although the second amendment people, maybe there is, i don't know.

that will be a horrible day. gets to put her judges, right now we are tied. thing,don't do the right you're not going to have a second amendment or you are not going to have much of it left. you are not going to protect yourselves, which you need. when the bad guys burst into your house, they are not looking at second amendment's. thatie: trump insisted comment was not intended to indicate pilots -- advocate violence against clinton. trump has suffered a drop against women. has --paign joining me now, karen tumulty and mark halperin. what did donald trump mean when he said second amendment

advocates on to use their power? know what he said he meant. the explanation that strikes me as probably the most closest to the mark was one that paul ryan gave today where he said, it was just a joke that went bad. trying to say,e no they, they were trying to marshall a coalition of devoted supporters of the second amendment. judging by the tone of voice in the reaction of the audience, i think again that explanation doesn't make a lot of sense. ark: it was uncomfortable to say, we don't believe you. even if you want to credit their explanation, saying after the

election, they could use their power at the bauer -- ballot box, he has to understand and his campaign has to understand a lot of people are troubled. they took it to mean advocating violence against a president clinton. if he wants to convince people he is reasonable and compassionate and sensitive, he thinks he needs to convince people of those things, he has missed another opportunity. charlie: is a presidential quality to be able to censor yourself and make sure what you are saying is not misunderstood. mark: if you are misunderstood, on a topic so serious, you have to be reflective and say, i don't like the way the press has taken what i said wrong but obviously, no one should make any joke about threatening the life of the united states president or would be president. of the distraction, 90

days to go, wasting days on something that has no benefit to him, is just another question of, does he have an understanding of the flow of news? a guy given credit as being a master of the flow of news. now seems to not understand you can't waste days on things that do not drive the message. charlie: supporters believe they have to get their message out. the more time they try to explain what they meant in a comment -- i don't think donald trump has problems with strong second amendment advocates. he doesn't have to spend time firing them up. nra is the only group that has spent money on him. his chances depend on reaching married female voters in battleground states. they would like to see less of the combative, ungracious,

somewhat tone deaf side of donald trump. charlie: what does donald trump have to do to broaden his appeal beyond his core constituency? karen: certainly there is a desire for change. the number of whether the country is on the right track or wrong track has been in negative territory since at least the of 2008. collapse he needs to speak to the anxieties and thirst for change of a lot of people this country. the problem with comments like the one he made yesterday is, isber one, the word pivot becoming a cliché in this campaign but it comes right after he gave an economic speech that was supposed to launch the new substantive donald trump. of a lotin the context

of things he and his supporters have been saying about hillary clinton. ts of, lock her up. that sort of thing. oftever side of the ballot this you are on, at some point, reachingits usefulness people who are undecided. charlie: you believe more republicans will come out and simply say they cannot support him, then perhaps say they are going to support hillary willon, in which case some withdraw their endorsement? underwaythink that is and it is underway because the party is afraid of what is going to happen to the rest of its candidates going on the ballot -- going down the ballot. they are in a position where

they could lose control of the senate. people are even talking about losing control of the house. where they enjoy their strongest majority since before the great depression. this would have been unthinkable some months back. question about whether donald trump is not only going to go down in flames himself what to take a significant portion of the party with him. mark: until elected officials see it is in their own interests to break from trump, they will not. the prominent ones are mostly retiring or from states or districts where he is not as popular. charlie: that explain susan collins. mark: she is so popular in maine, she can do whatever she wants. sonicial, jeb bush's

said people should vote for trump. people with political aspirations in red states or congressional districts will continue to be loyal to trump until and unless his numbers with republicans fall. charlie: is there anything to this argument that this is becoming a moral choice? you will be judged as to where you stood on donald trump? is a narrative a lot of democrats are pushing and reporters talk about. it is a narrative for a lot of spouses and children of republican officeholders. it is not something that i think that is existing in large numbers. we are in august. members of congress and republican politicians are not talking to each other. they are off on vacation or doing things that don't have them in the hothead atmosphere of capitol hill. are debates coming up.

the combination of the lack of chatter around them and the fact that trump, they feel, could turn things around means they are not think about this in moral terms. they are thinking about it in cold political terms. after the first debate, if he is not doing well, i think they will remember, for some of them and the people close to him, there is a moral dimension. that could be extremely dangerous to the trump campaign. who embracedrson that narrative was ted cruz. he said, vote your conscience. wellreally did not go over either with the republicans in the room or i think with the party at large. charlie: most people suggest he did it for the reason we are talking about. if trump came crashing down, he would have been on the right side of history. mark: and he still may be. thelie: and put him on position to pick up the pieces. is a different kind

of self interest. he is not on the ballot. he is looking to be the air to whatever the party is after trump loses. he felt a personal rebuke, a sting from what way trump comported himself. do itnger allowed in to but also gave him a talking point he can use for those who might be angry at him. showie: the national polls about a 10 point lead. ark: bloomberg politics has six point lead in a two-way race. four points in a four-way race. it is possible, if that trend continues, it is possible some of hillary clinton's lead to out of her convention settle down a little bit. polls inseen ohio and florida where trump is closer than any national

election. charlie: how do you explain that? mark: those polls are later, again, further from the convention. in a national poll, one in every is from california. it is possible, these out of round states will be closer than a national race. spenter, trump has not any money on television advertising. if you are the trump campaign, which has gone through a bad time in terms of news coverage, has not in on television with ads, being this close in battleground states is a big deal. the pennsylvania states continue to be so bad they are talking about another half. -- path. karen: all the movement in the key states appears to be going

against him. one thing about the ohio polls that came out in the last few days, was that where both the senate race in the presidential race were tied a month ago, now you have clinton opening up a five point lead. so is senator rob portman, a republican. one thing that is interesting, he is not only distancing himself from the national republican ticket, he is sending volunteers to campaign for him at clinton rallies. you are seeing, even if people are not coming out and renouncing donald trump, they are definitely distancing themselves. charlie: are you the guy that first said politics makes strange bedfellows? theseit is the case that senate incumbents, even mark kirk in illinois, thought to be

dead and certainly dead if the republican ticket was weak, winde races make their own and weather. i still think you could see hillary clinton doing potentially very well but not taking the senate for the democrats because these incumbents the problem. they get the challenge they face. trump demonstrated he can reduce the financial advantage hillary clinton has? good he had a one month of grassroots funding on the internet. sanders like. just beginning to understand how to prime that come. let's see with this month's numbers are like. i don't think he will catch her overall but he will have enough to be competitive. again, the fundraising matters but the earned media matters so

much more. yes, the fundraising is important. he has to be winning new cycles more than raising $10 million here. argue, or havee the impression that donald trump is in increasing number of cases listening to his advisors, because of the way he endorsed paul ryan and senator mccain? he still operates on a sort of moment by moment impulsive kind of way. one concern i have heard he doesn't have senior enough people around him on the plane who can, as he does these kind of in the moment got feel decisions, somebody to talk him out of them then. all the plans they want to. he has a tendency to put i

ed's in his way. charlie: take his temperature before he sees a microphone. tie his hands up away from the twitter. who is the most effective person you know to say no to donald trump? mark: i would think his kids, his son in law. and paul manafort. as karen said, he is often out there without them around. he is still living his life in his preferred mode. going home when he wants to go home. having the kinds of events that he wants to have. sleeping at home at the trump tower. he is still not on the plane, spending the kind of time doing policy prep. the trajectory we are on, the mismatch in terms of quantity and quality of debate cap before

the first debate will be unprecedented. she and her team are organizing this. i believe she will be the most organized and prepared candidate in terms of hours spent in the history of the debates. i believe he will probably be, as hard as this was given how hard senator mccain prepared, the least formally prepared. charlie: thank you. we will be right back. ♪

aleppo: the crisis in deepened this week. fighting intensified between the rebel forces.nd 2 million are trapped. the u.n. called for a cease-fire on tuesday. died to 470,000 people since the conflict began. joining me from london is clarissa ward. she testified before the united nations here in new york. charlie: the ones -- clarissa: the ones who have decided to stay, most of them do not plan on leaving. they made a decision along time ago they would rather die in dignity in their homes than

leave. they have watched what has happened in other places in syria. they know how this movie ends. bomb them, start them out until ey finally leave. they know what happens to the people that leave their homes. most of them never see their homes again read many of them are loaded onto buses and never see the light of day again. pleased to have my great friend back on this program. welcome. clarissa: thank you. thank you for having me. charlie: tell me more about, what was the u.n. testimony about? before we sort of begin to do happening. is this is a formal u.n.

session. essentially i was invited to testify alongside two incredibly brave syrian american doctors who work with the syrian american medical society. also, the u.n. ambassador, samantha power. samantha power spoke, followed by the two doctors. and then i spoke. and then several of the other security council members spoke. essentially, the idea behind holding this session was to talk about the humanitarian crisis in aleppo. get a refresher of what is happening on the ground. perhaps try to dig up some new ideas about how to deal with this disaster. it came the day before yesterday's session. horrifico about this crisis. what is the situation

today and why is it different than other places under siege? situation is dire. one of the things i mentioned is i first went to aleppo in 2012 i thought, this is what help is like. life cannot get worse. relentless artillery. the lack of power. the planes that would start at 5:00 and you would do not know where they are going to drop their payload. you have this pit in your stomach, waiting to see where the bombs are going to fall i . found out thed i situation had gotten worse. there is only one road going in and out of rebel held aleppo. you have to fly down it at top speed. berms ofs had built earth to try to protect the way. of course, it felt like such a feeble defense mechanism.

when you look at the aerial power that the regime has. of course, with the backing of the russians. is evenhe situation worse than that. for the better part of a month, you had a full siege. it does appear rebels over the weekend managed to break through. the fighting is so intense, there is very little humanitarian aid being brought in and out out of that small area. you are looking at a situation in eastern aleppo. where as many as 300,000 people are trapped with limited food, as you heard from the u.n.. there has been damage to the water infrastructure, electricity, very little drinking water. almost no electricity. todiesel which is needed power generators. many of the hospitals have been hit. because the rebels have made some progress taking the seas,

you are seeing the full force of the russian and regime airpower. from people i have spoken to, the situation is quite unbearable. charlie: you are talking about the russian support from the air. are they doing anything else to help the syrian army? almost certainly, they are involved in providing logistics, help with intelligence. they have bases throughout the country. as you well know, the russians are not the most transparent when it comes to talking about the extent of their military intervention. what was interesting, after my speech at the u.n., when i had gone through all of the human rights abuses, the bombings of bakeries and schools, the one thing they russian

representative took umbrage with was my use of the word intervention. the only thing he seized upon, why should say the primary thing, is why do you use this word, intervention. this is not an illegal presence. invitatione at the of the government of the country. i just found it so interesting that in the midst of all the things we are talking about, this came down to him to a question of semantics. charlie: i assume without the russian support, assad would not have survived. clarissa: many people will tell you that. of coarse, it is always difficult to predict these rings. -- this time,ear a year ago, the regime was on the back foot. rebels appeared to have the momentum. everybody was whispering about

yo be near?d of the n had numerous occasions when people thought the fall of one side or the other was imminent. it is becoming clear that neither side can win a decisive victory. nowhere is that more clear than aleppo. even if the seizure is reinforced, you are talking about potentially years to starve or bomb those 300,000 people out of eastern aleppo. it is quite clear to anyone on the ground, the question of a decisive victory is not in the cards. charlie: what is going to happen? a stalemate and they continue to kill each other and more civilians are victimized and more children are starving and

all of the war and held this is creating? clarissa: it is heartbreaking. there are no winners on either side. there are no winners in aleppo. at the moment, when you have a situation they have just enough enough momentum that they can win a decisive military victory, you take away all incentive essentially to bring both sides to the negotiating table. i don't believe that there can be any meaningful these talks in ssad ishile president a in syria. i am basing this on conversations i have had with every single person either living in rebel held syria or who is supportive from outside of the country. that hast of blood been spilled, the amount of

people killed, the bombardment, the barrel bombs, the targeting of schools and hospitals, people do not feel they can move beyond accept assad toxcep continue as their president. who is in a position to force or push him? certainly not america. possibly the russians, they iranians. what incentive do they have? charlie: that is what the diplomats who wrote the letter. they need more leverage on the ground in order to bring the other side to the table. .larissa: exactly to to be clear, the u.s. has no leverage. the people of the syrian people is the u.s. has stood back and washed their hands. the turning point was the so-called red line after the use of poisonous gas.

the syrians understood there was no way the u.s. was going to step in and intervene on their behalf. that was cemented when the u.s. decided to intervene and fight against isis. now, essentially, what leverage does the u.s. have? when it is sitting at the table,ting saying, you need to stop the bombardment of civilians. the incendiary devices and cluster bombs. they don't have anything to back it up. there is no reason for the toian regime or its proxies pay any attention to what the u.s. is saying about this at all. the reason the u.s., according to the obama administration, did not uphold the promise about the red line in the syrians using gas was in fact the russians negotiated a deal to get most of the gas out

of the country. course, that is the case. the u.s. is talking about potentially entering into some sort of partnership with russia groupget together the that was the al qaeda affiliate on the ground in northern syria. they say they have severed that high. there has been talk about essentially entering into an alliance with russia to target that group. affirmation oran agreement to stop the regime from bombing civilian targets. i cannot say or comment on what that sort of relationship or partnership would actually look like on the ground. onan tell you, based conversations, they think it would be disastrous. they think it would be a huge mistake. even though some of these more extremist factions are not

popular with everyone in rebel held areas, they are also the people who have unfortunately emerged as the so-called heroes in this narrative. they are the ones who have stepped in to fill the void. not the international community. the international community has been standing on the sidelines for years, wringing its hands, while the people have been found with cluster bombs, barrel bombs. hitting schools and bakeries. the reality is in rebel held syria, these islamist factions have emerged as an important force. if the u.s. was to join with russia to take out the more extremist factions, that would be unpopular with the syrian people. group, inoes o

its branding change, doing more than surface image? inthere a significant change terms of them playing a larger role when all of this comes down to parsing out what is going to be the future of syria? clarissa: when you look at this move, with them calling a new name, saying they have severed ties with al qaeda, this is not a change in ideology. it is a change in strategy. when you watch the video when they made the vide announcement, he thanked the current leader. he quoted osama bin laden. the group is focused in the long some sorttablishing of islamic government inside syria. at the same time, that doesn't mean this is not significant. they are trying to show several

key things by doing this move. firstly, they are trying to show they have put the needs of the syrian people above their own political agenda. they want to be seen as fostering unity between all the different rebel groups on the ground. they have learned from the stakes in the past that al qaeda made in iraq. understand if you alienate the local populace, you will never be able to implement the kind of governance they are looking to implement. they are trying to a mesh emesh themselves among the syrian public. they are trying to do that by working closely with other rebel held groups. they are trying to telegraph a message to the u.s. and the international community which is, you may not like us but we are rational actors and we have no interest in launching attacks beyond syria's borders. our focus right now is the syria

project. whether or not this move changes anything in terms of the larger significance, one can say one thing. well ona move playing the ground in syria and playing well also with a lot of the allies of syria. whether in turkey or qatar or saudi arabia. charlie: all the jihadist groups are sunni, are they not? clarissa: they are. they have beens, the focus of so much of the rhetoric and discussion. isis, i don't even include them because they are operating in a separate art of the country and they did not have support of the syrian people or rebel groups. but there are extremist groups working very closely with assad. to name one, hezbollah which is designated a terrorist

organization. iraqi militias. afghan militias. iranian forces. there are a number of extremists operating on both sides. charlie: thank you so much for joining us and your parents before the united nations security council. thank you. clarissa: thank you so much, charlie. ♪

charlie: "florence foster jenkins" is the new film from director stephen frears. meryl streep stars as a new york heiress whose terrible voice does not stop her from becoming an opera singer. here is the trailer. >> i am so excited. we are going to make a recording. >> wonderful. >> try a another take? >> i don't see why. when i was 16 years old, my father said if i didn't give up music, he would cut me off. he didn't understand music is my life. >> they need music. >> you must go on. >> this is what we live for, isn't it? well.is going very, very

>> bravo. i am pleased to have the stars of the film, narrow street, hugh grant, and simon he meryl streep, hugh grant, and simon helberg. worst toshe was the ever sing at carnegie hall. lot.e heard a a lot of her arias. at the same time, she breaks your heart. she is so courageous. charlie: she wanted it so badly. stephen: she was a woman of such spirit and such will. is it good that she

said, i want to do this and the hell with the critics? you said she was the perfect amateur? meryl: she was. i think she did, when she said music is my life, i think that was partly true. animated by her love for bayfield. his support in letting her follow her dreams and try her best to express yourself. most lives are curtailed. she had plenty of money and plenty of support to make a fool of herself. charlie: this is a guy who is married to her. has a mistress, has a relationship or does he love her? is it simply opportunity? glad yound i am brought it up. this is what we want the

audience to ask themselves. then we want them to learn the truth, which was the truth. which we now know empirically because we researched the characters. these two genuinely a door to each other. the long 35 year marriage wasn't quite a marriage because they didn't remember to get married, but there was massive love. albeit, it was a marriage with an unorthodox, modern kind of shape. simonmy character makes that argument. he finds out i have this mistress. what heocked to find thought was a happy marriage, in fact i have a mistress. i explained to him, we have an understanding. really, it is more me convincing myself.

i have an understanding that i am not going to understand it. not going to think about it. charlie: was it hard for you to learn to sing this? meryl: it was difficult to learn these extremely challenging arias. challenge to sing well, you had to learn them badly. meryl: first i had to learn them, and to learn them right. it was really hard. were singing. simon was playing live in the film. we were allowed to play with where we went off. where we failed. charlie: what is your characte ? 's role in this?

: my character's role is ae compan a company asked -- ccompanist. the eyes of the audience, i think. wisp of a man that wonders into what he thinks is his dream job. florence opens her mouth and birds fall out of the sky. he is looking around for help and nobody seems to understand what the problem is. >> you have been told. >> what should i play? >> i really don't mind as long

as it is not too loud. ♪ ♪ i must say, i think you are absolutely ideal. >> did i mention i also compose? >> he also composes. more about howe it could be that someone with florence's vocal skills could emerge, could emerge as a popular singer who has the chance to go to carnegie hall. meryl: she saying, she was a

member of many clubs. of meanswhere women thrived at that time. they were not in the professions. they had no other thing to do. she found herself in new york with a lot of money from her father. she and her mother negotiated through society this way. found a place. gave lots of money away. mostly to musical organizations. andjust loved the music basically really wanted to sing but she couldn't sing at all. charlie: and she knew that. yes, and she launched private concerts. at a certain point, at 76, she decided to make her debut which ended up being her farewell concert. bought the hall.

charlie: you may know about this, a very good conductor. not universally viewed that. he had a magazine. he had come to new york, he had lived in new york, went to school in duke and came back. he had a magazine called "the institutional investor." e fell in love with mahler. died maybe last year, fell in love with it. it meant more to him than anything he had ever heard. set out to become a conductor to conduct this one symphony, nothing else. ed it in london. spent the rest of his life, he would occasionally play this.

and had critics who said he did a good job and only knew this one piece. some of the people who were conductors, music purists, said, this is not fair. this is not right. but there was a touch of florence in him. he did it well, just one symphony. meryl: i'm sure people recognize, as i am sure they did it in florence, it was equal parts bad singing but that aspirational zeal. desiresort of wonderful to share this thing she loves. ar elaborate costumes. charlie: one of the most fun things you have done in a while. meryl: it was. i think it was the spirit of the

woman. it's sort of, you know, sort of toxic cast over the world currently can it is wonderful to encounter people who believe in love and art. these are the saving graces of civilization. stephen: when you said toxic -- simon: when you said toxic cast -- what made it fun, you had a collaboration about things. meryl: i made people laugh on the set. charlie: she can make people laugh. she could have very well done comedy all her life. meryl: i don't know about that. charlie: she found the, the in maggie thatcher. -- found the comedy in maggie thatcher. can do donald trump.

i'm saving it for the inauguration. charlie: is this film about her ambition or something else? meryl: her ambition, gosh. it doesn't feel, doing it it didn't feel like ambition. it felt like an embrace. audience and the of the people she was sure wanted to hear this. and they did. so she wasn't wrong. unfortunate thing that happens she makes a record while i am away. i'm am with a girlfriend. she releases it to a radio station. everyone goes mad for it he cuts

it is so funny. everyone wants a copy. poor old florence didn't understand. that is why she decided to have a big concert at carnegie hall. charlie: it explains his relationship. he was the enabler, the protector, all of that. meryl: she protected him, too. he was not a very good actor. she destroyed the bad reviews. him see didn't let them. believed the people were wrong thread i'm sure he earsort of a 10 year -- tin himself. best actors you have worked with, and you have bunch, they have

to come to some sort of real understanding of the character. why she was the way she was. you do that. that comes in part from the text and where else? meryl: from the experience. i think you can get ready and learn the arias. and when weou meet exchange, you know, desperation. the whole thing just happens in here, in the air between us and nowhere else. the better actor you are, the better you would do it on the health. -- hoof. i notice meryl doing a lot of that. charlie: i am with meryl streep. the more insecure and

actor is, the more they have been prepared and they are liable to give exactly the performance they have prepared in a bathroom year. if i have learned anything, meryl is right. do the prep but then try and wing it on the day. charlie: the other thing i know, the idea, do you want to do it deliberately or just try to do it one more time? or do you view it as an opportunity? meryl: i don't even think about it that way. know, ihink of, you don't know where he is going to throw the ball. if you anticipate that, you are dead. the thing is dead. it is like a dead thing. charlie: you can't say dead without giving it something. imon: it is incredible.

doing scenes with meryl, it makes the life come out of you. and you, too. i'm not trying to -- hugh: no. i felt the same way. meryl: you didn't do as many numbers with him. directors are tragic figures. charlie: what did you do, what was your role? stephen: they were very, very good. talentedwhen you have people. stephen: you shut up. no, of course you watch them. if they do something idiotic coming you say so but they do not. i see the movies, i see how actors are shown. to be these sort of screaming

monsters. here are three fine actors. they played together. they play it as an ensemble piece. he does,u know what seriously, often, they have monitors where the director watches what is going on even though it is right here. they look at the monitor. stephen listens often. did you notice that? he would be listening to the scene. that was where he found truth or not. he would hear it, hear the truth . used to john houston turn his back, literally turn his back so he could listen. billy wilder had a wonderful year. -- ear.

you can hear more than you can see. famous golf coach, who coached -- he didn't look at you th at all. he would say, you are slicing it, aren't you? charlie: you can hear a great shot. it sounds different. meryl: solid. charlie: what are you looking for? mike nickel, a great friend, one me ito me -- once said to want my actors to surprise me. i want them to do the same thing my architect does. i want them to come back with something that surprises me.

stephen: you don't know what you are looking for but when they do it, you will know. you think, that is right. that is why you are a director and they are not. meryl: i couldn't do that. charlie: you have never thought about it for a second? meryl: i thought about it. but then i think of the total job. i think, no. eye.e the subject oive i like defending my character, my turf. my little quivering somebody. i don't want to think about everybody. charlie: you are not slighted at all. " opensce foster jenkins on theaters on friday, august 12. thank you for joining us. see you next time. ♪

>> with the father of the man responsible for the orlando massacre doing at a hillary clinton rally? >> the campaigns are being questioned over a couple of people spotted at the rally. look who is right behind clinton. right there, spotted in the crowd. >> another controversial guest was spotted at a campaign rally. >> trump's campaign released a statement tuesday saying it disavows his support. ♪