announcer: from our studios in new york city, this is "charlie rose." >> i am judd apatow filling in for charlie rose. we can all agree that president donald trump is like no other before him. the laypeople keep up with news daily, but it has been increasingly difficult to separate fact from spain and parse at what his policies really mean for the world at large. joining me now to discuss the impact of trump's presidency is keep open and -- keith

olbermann. and to others. what is happening? >> what happened in the last 4.5 minutes? since we entered the studio, we had one advisor to the president gone television and say that might not be so. we have had the president way in. you can take that instance of uncertainty and apply to almost everything -- anything in this presidency. you have a divided camp constantly. that is how trump manages. you see it play out on almost any matter. on matters of national security. how they are going to lay out their week on policy. it is very hard to keep up with. i feeling he runs the country like he ran the apprentice here it --.

he did not follow them, and then he would say, ivanka, how did meatloaf do? it is a little scary. it is a little unusual. >> what we had happened today was pictures emerge from the weekend rather was a new guest who joined. he was taking pictures of the president sitting at a patio dining table. i have been to mar-a-lago. flashlight an iphone on. they were going over documents on the north korea missile test in the middle of the dining area. it was shocking to see. when he saysblem it has nothing to do with his business. this is a privately owned company by his business. >> how come nobody said, donald, let's go talk about this in the other room. >> he does not have the kind of

relationship with anybody like that. traditionally, when you come into the game, yet been through the process. yet been a governor, senator, congressman, or something. yeah somebody who knows you and can tell you the truth. all of these people have become celebrities. time magazine covers and snl and all the rest of it. when i was in reagan's white house, we had 20-30 people who had been the same positions in previous white house is. they need again. they knew all the players. this was a brand-new team. -- with thenk possible exception of steve bannon, he does not see anybody sap or. peer. anybody as a >> and so you have a scenario

where they are understaffed in terms of experience. those who are there are just jockeying for position while the world operates without united states interference. the administration has been dedicated to these broad, large-scale, domestic policies which they are try to affect with the muslim band and the raise that's rates that began over the weekend. but where do we fit in the world where we are not waiting for ?onald tram -- donald trump it goes to hell in a handbasket. the focus of the administration seems to be, who is going to be that principle? who is going to be the adult that he listens to. even the half focus on the rest the world is in itself divided in half again. it is madness. that isther thing

amazing, having working four presidencies, we are now in our 22nd day. the staff has to be buried. thes had heads of state as good today and yesterday. yet all of these initiatives. it all gets lost in the cycle. when he appointed the spring -- supreme court justice, that should've been the story of the week. it should have been planned out. here's one of the most important promised during the campaign. it had unanimous conservative report. -- support. he is undermining himself. >> ya opposition to him is scattered and also diffused. the democrats are fairly leaderless right now. gorsuchng judge neil earned him a fair bit of

respect. he does not have anybody who he considers on adult who can say, do not do this. >> he has not had that his entire life, really. >> he has had a few people willing to push back to a certain extent. westels as if he had saint .- think was the critics otherwise, he did not think he was going to win. he did not spend a lot of time thinking about what he would do with the presidency. he is not fully understand what it means yet. >> it is a lot of work. it is a massive amount of work. he would always hear about obama being up for hours reading briefing books. today, they were talking about when they briefed him, it is a one page paper with bullet points and i lot of graphics. does that concern you knowing what is in those briefings? >> it concerns me.

i am an american and i know what goes on. >> can you do it that way? my sense is -- one of the reasons i think they potential is there if he gets the thing focused on 3-4 big decision today, which is what the -- hasnt has to make it to make. they areions come in, staffed out, then he sit down and listen to the argument and make the decision. then he do whatever you want to do. but if you cannot make decisions -- myu are rushed argument at this point in time would be whoever is scheduling him is over scheduling him. there's too much activity on. in ao not put shinzo abe weekend meeting and then bring in the canadian prime minister. those are big, heavy duty things that you should be prepared for. you should have 48 hours for. you have people come in and talk to. if you do not like to read,

which apparently he doesn't, you have people come in and talk to you and explain what is going on in canada and japan. then he so overreacts to the media. the media is the media. the democrats are his opposition. they will tell their story. each always try and argue who will set the agenda, but you do not try and start with the media as the bad guys at day one. they are not the bad guys. the key thing is, if she is going to write the story, my job as president is in that story and to make sure nothing is incorrect. >> this is where i think his death is not serving hidden well -- him well in the fact that his staff knows this is who he is. he will lose his cool over certain stories. sean spicer barks at the press. you need to have some wink and nod if you are the -- if you are

sean spicer. if you are injecting humor into this, do not carry the exact same message of the president. you're not advancing him in that way. basically the talk shows. they're performing for a audience of best an president trump. that is not what we have seen in previous white house is. there's been an effort to soothe global leaders. >> he has no interest in soothing anybody. he is trying to have everybody rattled. wants to ask for 10 times money more than i deserve. he said this is how you get 40 times more money. he is trying to scare everybody in wind up somewhere else. i don't know every country understands the approach. a television show is running the country. that ispoint about exactly right. it explains everything. we have time in human history.

we have time because otherwise everything would happen all at once. this is a president who is working on a 60 minute format of a tv show. we put all these things together and that is fundamentally the problem. you're going to the boardroom to please this man, and he cannot break the idea from the presidency from the role that he had on his television show. i imagine this would get through. for somebody to say to him, you know the ratings on your television show declined steadily until you were the 85th or 86 most popular show. you need to have somebody come in and rework the format. there has to be some way to get through, because historically this moment is fascinating, but you can also say they cuban missile crisis was historically fascinating. i would not want to have been within three years old during the cuban missile crisis.

i would not have wanted to live through that. i do not want to live through this. we need to steer him out of the office, or out of his way of ruining the office. why is the russian hacking story and the michael flynn story important? isthe russian hacking story important because it is a foreign agent that is an adversary that is headed impact of some kind on the election. it did impact the election. trump talked about wikileaks from that podium every single day. the white house -- the obama white house was uncertain exactly how to handle this. it would look as if they were interfering in a campaign. an open question about what trump would do with the sanctions. michael flynn was indeed telling a russian counterpart, just wait until we are in office and we will lift the sanctions. that is deeply problematic. on its own is problematic. -- generale slain

flynn who appears to have a knowledge that he misled the president and white president. he has apologized to the vice president. >> why is he making that call? doesn't yet make the call because donald trump tells them to make that call? >> who knows. who knows with mike flynn. he has been a freelancer for a. of time. , if we knewreason he feels likelike putin is a bad guy and has committed that acts, but put in with ayatollah khomeini -- but prudent is a dangerous man. everybody in the world knows he is a dangerous man. everybody knows he is playing lots of games with the world. the fact that trump wants to love this guy bothers a lot of people.

>> the bottom line is, you get it in a fight with the canadian and the mexicans, and australians, and the people who have not been our friends and allies. it is absurd. problem also with this is to suggest that trump is somehow influenced by russia. we do not actually know why he is saying this stuff. he has a 25 year history of praising authoritarians. in 1990 he gave an interview where he suggested the chinese had handled that tiananmen square massacre. i do not know how and on that is. it feels like he had a really tough dad. and now he loves these brutal people. .e wants to be vladimir putin

except i do not think he will ever write a shirt -- a horse with his shirt off. >> the picture of his father is the only picture he has in the oval i -- oval office. fred trump is the only bots he ever had. asked the president if he had a hero, he began to extol his father. and then he caused and said he built houses in queens in the bronx. he had to separate himself from his father as if that was not good enough. if you want to psychoanalyze this president, i hope you have a long time in the whole team to work on it. this is certainly the most complex president. >> if you have several hundred massivedollars, get a tax break when you take this

job. and you are an older man, what --the reason >> it is one of the biggest jobs in the world. you get to travel the world. you don't have to worry about making money. it is very prestigious. you wouldn't take the job? >> i would not take any of these jobs because i am a reporter. i think you see it with manus nec with kelly, you see people who feel a sense of patriotism. this is a president that has no government experience. very tinyounded by a teen. he only trust his family, if that. they feel like they want to try to steer the ship. as we have seen, the cap is not fully in place. we do not know how much authority they are actually going to have. we saw kelly gets steamrolled on immigration. and rex tillerson got steamrolled on immigration

order. over role on who he wanted us is number two on the state department. withaw something similar general mattis, wiping still does not have a number two. yet people who went in with a real sense of duty and honor. i think they are being a bit frustrated. ♪

>> what about the fact that his

family is so involved in the administration russian mark so when you say his closest confidant is evocative, what does that mean to you? >> it would mean a lot more to me if they were here in new york. when you are there every day, it is like a son-in-law. the son-in-law he has great confidence in. he did -- if you go with them once a week and said let me give you my opinion. as opposed to being in every single meeting, a young man among not so young man. to a certain extent, a president is entitled to whoever he wants to advise him. he go outside the administration or stay inside the administration. i hope there's more people. the problem is you do not have clear-cut lines of authority. you have a bunch of type a personalities, typical of the white house. there are no fences in the white house. when i was the political director, i could go any where, anyplace, anytime.

sometimesent would push me back. this is all about people biting, pushing, shoving trying to get the role. is as somebody said to me one day, the next time the president asked me about politics, you can give him an answer on defense. i was arguing what he should do with the military. get a clear line of the authority. this administration has no clear line of authority. >> also an important point on it of uncle was here in new york. this is a president who is always selling. not as president, but in life. donald trump been about closing the deal. the times when he is had the most interest in talking to me is when he thought he was trying to sell me on some version of himself. quickmber that here's a story. one of his aides comey in may of 2015 and said he is going to eclair on june 16 and we want you to write about. i said no because i'm not doing this again. i did it with him in 2011 and he

did not actually run. i said i'm not playing this game. i lunch with him on june 3 of that year, and he was sitting here and his campaign manager was there, and he was trying to sell me on the idea that he was really going to do this your he was clearly getting frustrated that i was not biting. . was wrong clearly, i should have written about it. i good reason not to. is the same thing with television. is interested in rex tillerson, is because rex tillerson was not interested in him for a long time. this was somebody who was higher than he was. if his son-in-law and ivanka were not in bc, they would be reaching out to him. instead, they are there in bc. -- washington, d.c. >> the three young advisors who are his kids, they are some very smart. best they canthe with limited experience in government and what have you. my concern at this point in time

is if you slow this thing down a little bit and he basically say, let's get the 100 eight thing out of fdr, it was a different time and different environment. the idea that you can get everything done in 30 days -- it is not a 30 day term, it is a four-year term. congress, have an infrastructure plan, a tax lien. the idea that he wants to get all done right about the same time he is fighting over the election that they stole it from him, which is all absurd -- >> what is that mean? that sullivan was writing we should all be concerned about his lack of stability. you have had some commentary on this. when sony says there are 3 million illegal votes and there are no evidence of that. there's a lot of misinformation coming from them -- or lies coming from them, whether we think of that in terms of -- is that a strategy? is a delusional? what is that?

>> we could hunt for the meaning behind it, like i said, we could psychoanalyze him for a thousand years. is the pattern of what it represents to something important. if the president wants to believe that there were 3 million illegal voters bused to massachusettsmassachusetts to ce seat, fine. it is not really have any meaning except as template. because then some of you could say, well, the real problem in asia is not north korea, we can deal with north korea. it is south korea. we really have to come down hard on the south koreans as they have a corrupt government -- or whatever the argument is. or, the australians are behind all this trouble. what happens when he believes something as fabricated as that -- something of importance? that is why it is relevant as a warning to really issues. >> each time he says something that is not true, do you think when they are having meetings at

the white house, they know it is not true and they are basically setting the table for more voter theression, or setting table for more mass incarceration. it feels like it is planned. use a fake news a million times, and a certain amount of the population believes nothing. >> i do not believe there is a plan. i do not think there is a plan anyway. the truth of the matter working for whitson -- nixon, reagan, and board. reagan developed a philosophy over 30 years. he had positions that he had adopted from people that he wanted to implement. he knew that strong national defense was very important. get a agenda when he got there. he got most of it a conflict. i do not see an agenda. i see defense. i see keep illegals out. protect the country. make america great again. who's to say america is not great as it is? my senses he went out and sold a bunch of men and women who did

not live up to the expectations. they can not take care of their kids. america was not with a draft it was going to be. it was kind of a third time -- term. is always tough getting a third term. hillary clinton was not a strong candidate. at this point in time, he needs to say these are the 4-5 things i'm going to get done this year. if i make the business economy better, if i get corporate taxes down to 15% and do not do anything else, that will stimulate the economy. if i can change dodd-frank. fixing obamacare is a massive problem, it will take a lot -- at risk oft put it having the same problems of 2008? >> i do not think so. it has become of her accuracy for accountants and lawyers. it is forced banks not to lend

money. you have to make banks lend money again. whatever it takes is what we have to do. if someone said to me, what is the stock market keep going up? >> if you could borrow money at 1%, you can make money too. but nobody gets to borrow money at 1%. you have to be part of that system. we have to stimulate thousands of small businesses. they have to have an ability to get money to have lower taxes, business taxes will help that. >> have you feel about the potential guiding of the consumer protection bureau? this is something that elizabeth warren worked on. it's a people hundreds of millions of dollars from getting ripped off by the banks. it seems like it is a giant park. gas giant target. a big gap between

what he does with executive orders. those are press releases on steroids. what actually happens, i think -- he literally said johnson the economy a million times in every speech. that resonated with people. -- notst week in office even a week, his first few days in office were focused on trade. it was focused on renegotiating nafta. focusing on things that voters might be concerned about the elizabeth warren's main achievement would be affected by an care about. that might hold this. but we have not talked about is how he has stopped the white house and his cabinet with plutocrats. that is completely at odds with what he ran on. that is not got that much attention because there's so much focus on everything else. that is a real risk to him too. he runs forink when

reelection, people will notice there are so many people from goldman sachs in his cabinet? >> he was trying to steamroll. during the campaign, he would send out a million different tweaks, comments, and controversies. it did work for him during the campaign. governing is very different. there's a part of him that believes it will not matter. he did something that i've not seen any elected official do. the day he was worn and he started talking about 2020. they are always running, but they never do it immediately. that was really striking to me. politicalbeen the director and run the reelection campaign for reagan, we do not think about that. 83 that is when reagan asked me to run the reelection campaign. prior to that we are worrying about house seats. needs -- the real fights that

are coming is there is no spending restraint whatsoever. everything they talk about is gigantic. republicans do not with to spend more without tax cuts. all of this stuff is going to cost gigantic sums of money. unless you start focusing on some of that, you will have a real battle. >> the budget is going to be on the enormous fight. >> you said a focus on himself. that is the danger of being in that office. that is him. his focus is him. colin earth do we have a government if we have somebody who is more focused on himself then perhaps the rest of the citizenry combined. him,at i wanted to do for and i am a presidential fellow at hofstra. i know all the presidents. the president who knew more about the presidency to anybody else was bill clinton. he got impeached. you do need to know about the constitution. you do need to know the role of

the judicial system. if you want to get bogged down with justices and appeals courts spendat have you, he can his defense all tied up with that. >> do you think we should be nervous right now, or is this blown out of proportion? >> i'm a trump supporter, and my concerns, having been around a long time and not -- it's not like i want that. i just want what's good for the country. i have a 21-year-old daughter and i want the country to be good and effective. the next 4 years will be important. what i want him to do is some healing. we are so partisan lee split, and the ugliness out there among everybody -- we go to a dinner party in new york and you fight with people. impeached in six months. others say, as they conversation we all have. they are sitting there, saying, analyzing who they will be 4 years from now as opposed to saying, thank you, lord, for giving me 4 years. i want to rebuild the infrastructure, i want to get people back to work, i want people to feel good about

themselves. and what to put our place in the world to where our military is equipped. we need some real clear planning, and i don't see any of that. >> why doesn't he make any gesture to all the people who voted for hillary, so there's almost 3 million people who voted for her more than him. why does he not see an advantage to saying, i'm going to do something about student loans, about all this debt, all these hundreds of thousands or millions of kids have? why is there no gesture? maggie: this is not going to be a sufficient explanation, but it is what i think it is. in this way, he's very much not a politician. he genuinely does not see the political advantage to doing certain things. he's viewing this, for lack of a better term, as a personal wound. these people do not vote for me, i'm angry they did not vote for

me, i have to invalidate this in some way. he's just not pass that. i don't know when he will get past that. he is working hard. he's overwhelmed in a lot of ways by what the presidency is. i think he has, for whatever reason -- i think in some ways the path was easier for him, the campaign was easier, there was a tactical reason for continuing to talk about his crowds, but also an emotional reason to talk about his crowds. this is perhaps a kinder way of saying what you were saying. he doesn't see it, he doesn't see that other people either want to be reached out to buy their president. he believes and a lot of his supporters believe that he is a more exaggerated version of what president obama did in terms of partisan politics. a lot of people don't share that view, but i've heard it great i don't know that he won't get there, but i think he is a ways from it. >> thank you all for being here. thank you, charlie, for letting you sit here. it was a great honor. i hope i didn't dishonor the

table. thank you, everybody. ♪ >> crashing is the new series.

here is a look at the trailer. >> my wife slept with somebody else. i caught her today. >> who is this? why is my hand towel on your --? >> oh, boy. go write some jokes. >> i've literally never done anything without her. >> i have a plan. i will be a comedian. >> that's the stupidest thing i've ever heard. >> somebody trying to shake me from my corner. >> there's no good way to tell people you haven't seen "the wire." >> i'm going through a divorce straight i'm floating around. there is laundry downstairs. you will want to do that right away. >> hey, good morning, little fella. get on up here. >> standing on the corner, eating street food. you will do a set tonight at a club in manhattan.

>> following the dream, grinding it out. i'm happy to be with you guys. >> what's wrong with you? >> get over here. >> you want me to come on your podcast? >> i did not drink, i do not smoke, i did not have sex. >> ♪ is this the low or is this the high? ♪ >> i was trying to free you. >> let's do it. >> i'm doing ok, actually. >> celebrate. >> that's enough. >> is that a weird laugh? host: all right, with me right now is the creator and star, p ete holmes, and costar, the great artie lange. easy e. >> is not the guy you want to be. >> the first time someone on

"charlie rose" is wearing a winter hat. >> it's another step towards giving up completely. >> i always say the only time i noticed it is when i'm on "charlie rose." there are cameras behind you. they see it. >> for me, it was -- the "stern" show was believable. -- unbelievable. host: this is the handsomest panel that has been on "charlie rose" in a while. so, the new show, which premieres the very 19 on hbo, after "girls" -- pete, tell us about it.

pete: you and i got together, and we are excited about doing a show that is about being bad at comedy. we notice there were a lot of shows, obviously. this is a show that shows the secrets of what it's like starting. you saw the trailer, handing out flyers, sometimes you have to pay to go on. this is what you do for 5, 10 years. you are still finding your voice. it is those origin stories of really interest me. when i pitch you the show, you would have gotten back into seeing it yourself. it was very fortuitous for me. >> you were vulnerable, and i pounced. >> a lot of the show is also about spirituality and religion. why is that? >> i grew up religious. i was the kind of kid that if a grownup told me something, i believe them. i went to church. i really hook, line, and sinker got very deep into the evangelical scene. in real life i got married when

i was 22. i could barely drink at my own wedding. to the first person i ever dated, first person i had ever slept with. >> i said slept with. >> that's pretty graphic for this hour. >> the only woman i took as a lover. [laughter] after six years of marriage, she left me for a small italian man named rocco. >> you always mention his name. >> this is a funny joke to me. i think the sense of humor of the universe is very funny, and the fact that i'm am this soft, gentle, golden retriever, stood up man, and she's with a muscular guy, tough guy -- i really liked him, actually. i thought he was a sweet guy. this was not a revenge piece. >> i'm sorry, we have a lawsuit. >> the show is about someone who is religious entering the world

of comedy in new york and encountering peole. -- people. your religion? >> i grew up roman catholic. i mother was into religion, my father was not. we would get up there. go to church for your mom, but there's nothing up there. he was a real articulate guy with stuff like that. i failed typing in 1981, in the eighth grade. i did a ray charles impression the entire class, and that's where i failed. my father, was of legendary wisdom, said typing, that's for broads. [laughter] the worst part of technology to me is falling behind in text. you actually say yes to the wrong question.

i don't want -- i don't hate your mother. >> i keep doing this thing where if i mad at someone and trying to complain to someone else, i write the emailed to the person i'm mad at. i'm so mad, i'm just like -- jeff. and then i send it to jeff. jeff is like, was this meant for me? then you have to act like it was. >> it changes the whole dynamic of communicating. it's crazy. >> so, what do you think your role in the show is? >> i think -- chris pete -- pete's character -- i got to tell you. i said this before about the charisma you have, you can't be born with this.

i do want to help you. and i have done this with other comics, and other comics did it with me. you bomb, and i see you bomb. it is really an emotional thing, which i relate to. my role is, i see him and i sort of engage with him at first. and then he grows on me. i think my role is, in a weird, perverted way to help this kid and show him the ropes a little bit. don't step on these landmines, in a rated r, edgy kind of way. >> it looks like he's trying to save your soul or save you in some way. >> eventually, you can see that's where this is going, and people have tried to. >> how do people do when they

try? >> they succeed for a little while. and eventually they have to go to work. but i feel warmth from you, john. you have too much success. it's a fun role-play, to be in the world of comedy, shoot at the seller in those locations. his character would try to help me, and you have already in the show. >> i think everyone in the show that is getting it is giving it. you see right from the beginning, he cares about comedy and making jokes way more than he does -- his wife actually abandoned first. you see that. helping me, but i'm helping him. you're cheating, we are helping. >> my character thought about that deeply. you justify her behavior because you cheated on her with comedy, and i can't even see that. >> the show is the result of a lot of therapy, and trying to write a fictionalized version of something that happened to you that was negative from the other persons perspective. we really wanted lawrence

character to be sympathetic and understandable. when i watch it -- she's right. >> she's amazing. we are both lithuanian. >> a lot of the fun of the show is comedians hanging out with comedians, helping each other out. when you got divorced, comedians let you crash other places. what was that like for you real? >> in real life, when my wife told me she was leaving, the first person i called was nick kroll, john mullaney helped me get an office that had a coach in it that i would sleep on all the time. pj miller flew me out to the set of a movie. when we talk about comedians, their backstabbing and we are all just out for ourselves -- that can be true, i suppose. but there is this unlikely canopy that we represent on the

show that i think is a real thing. put me up in a hotel, hung out with me every day. in a really dire time. >> i am front stabbing. [laughter] i've broken the ice. >> we have you, we have a towel on the show. >> guys, you think you have a certain association with them, and there really is a beautiful heart to the community. my talk to somebody and find out they are a comedian, i instantly bond with him. >> you mentioned david cell. he's become my best friend. when you are best friends with somebody, you do see that warmer side and he's the only person -- i got pancreatitis a couple years ago and canceled a couple gigs. i got some moneys.

when i canceled the gig, dave got worried about money and he came to the hospital with a check. i had done something similar to that. he said, we are flying. thank you so much. it shows respect to a few people. i can tell he's nervous around you, a little bit. i like that. [laughter] i like seeing that in him. >> you said the first comedian you saw when you went to the comedy cellar the first time was david tell. -- dave attell. >> he did a joke i was hoping was not an average joke you have to tell to be a comedian. it has sam goody in it. the joke was -- john denver -- i was in sam goody the other day. a blank cassette cost $2.50. a lot of people left at the $2.30. there's another great joke. i went up to the managers

because i was like, this guy is considered good, right? the greatest, limit i can give dave, -- complement i can give dave, i want to say i'm best friends with the greatest comedian. >> that camaraderie, especially with someone you respect, it think is funny to you and respect -- being a comedian, that's the biggest privilege. >> who are your favorite comedians of all time, of the ones you've been able to hang out with in your life? >> long time would be richard pryor. that the cliché. it's hard to beat him. i do think chris rock is the best comedian ever. is a combination of longevity and unique delivery and brilliant jokes and stories. that first richard pryor said i

talk about, it is him making tragedy comedy, and that is what has become of me. the last tv show we ever did was the norm show. i'm on the call sheet. i saved it, because he checked out about a year later. his people let him come out. he was cripple like this. he does a cold open. george carlin -- people i met, dave attell, brian regan, norma donald -- not just because i'm friends with him. before i met norm -- his delivery is unique, and i love it. >> a lot of comedy is taking pain and turning it into joy. that's what the show really is about. >> we are on the "charlie rose" show -- it's a love story to suffering. it's how something you never would have asked for is actually the mobilizing factor that gets you where you want to go. >> do you think people who watch

"charlie rose" will say, i want to what's the show because it talks about a mobilizing factor? -- watch this show because it talks about a mobilizing factor? >> that the universal story. it's a very funny show. one of the things i like, because of the comedians, it's always believable that we would be making jokes. people are always being very funny. there is something underneath. you and i were excited about the idea of a religious guy, sweet guy, what parts of his soul will be maintained and what will it be like when he starts playing with fire and different types of lifestyles? that is something people relate to. no matter what you are trying to do in your life, you can watch a guy go through a journey and go, oh, he had the suffering, now he's kicked out of the village and he's got to go back and change and adapt. i hope that is why people watch. >> in your career, you have done the same thing. your last special you did was all about your issues, your issues with addiction. how is it to try to put that together and turn that part of

your life into comedy? >> its therapeutic. to me, it brings closure to it. it's a great discovery, to have like, i can talk about this publicly and maybe get a laugh out of it. everything become self-deprecating. i think the audience -- it's a trick. you let the audience think, here is a screw-up. i can feel like i'm better than this guy. that is something i go to too often, and i think it is something i got to work on. i was a heroin addiction. and i was. i use the word junkie because it's so harsh, and that reminds you that you should not want to be that. and i do a bit about -- in rehab, they asked me to go trainer. he really told me once that he

thought a runner's high would be as good as heroin. it took a long time to go from what i just told you there -- riding on stage, a bit more i'm doing something so tragic and as soon as i say heroin -- we are not used to harsh words out of context. they hear the word heroin and there's nothing they can say that will come back to you. no, now you can't be funny anymore. it was a lot of hard work to get that funny, and i like that challenge and i'm proud of it. i wouldn't know how to do it any other way. i look for a tragic thing and it's not hard to find. >> we all have bad things happen to us. there is something very therapeutic about turning it into something that is funny. >> that's a great way to get over it. >> you have to process it anyway, and a lot of people do it in 30 are with their friends, and we have the privilege of doing it to the delight of other

people. >> how come you weren't heroin addicts? [laughter] when -- he kept you on the straight and narrow. >> it had to do with my faith, a little bit. >> fear of hell? >> a friend of mine smoked pot in high school. friend of mine had sex in high school. how dare you. >> if they are like, you are going to hell, i would be like -- >> you created hell in your mind. >> that's your problem. >> i think that was the problem. i think my father would want me to say he's looking up at me right now. >> you and i were talking about how it helps with, let's ride the lightning. >> is nothing like fear.

i'm afraid of the wrong things. i should embrace intimacy. commitment. i got on mad tv 27 years old. this was my dream. i said, i want to be on a sketch show as an original guy. in my dream, mad tv was much bigger. it still lasted 14 years. you can trace everything back to mad tv. i did a lot of work. they released the best of my sketches. when i got that of 27 and i said, five years i will be 32, i can't do this. i really thought that. and i think subconsciously, 2 years out, i got arrested. maybe i really wanted that bad. don't do it. >> that's the idea you and i

were talking about, the idea that sometimes you create chaos as a way of avoiding the panic of doing something as a way of having control. >> how do you feel right now? the show is about to air. you might be the next sarah jessica parker. or the show could go away. >> it's like lighting a firework that has my daily face on it. he will either sale majestic into the sky and light it up in a beautiful way, or ricochet off a closed window and kill a rabbit. it's a very exciting time. >> a really great piece of work. both of you are hilarious in it. i'd like to thank you for being my guests on "charlie rose." >> this is a dream for me. i appreciate -- >> likewise. it's mutual. this is amazing, you kill it, i'm really excited to see people see artie come back to acting. >> it's already good.

i think the reaction is already good. >> what you brought to it is the real reason why the show works. >> i should be better in your bread, i friend. you are a hero and mentor. >> i'm happy to have the chance to work with you guys because you are both so brave and honest about your lives and yourselves, and you really gave of yourselves. i think that's why this show is great, and it will be on february 19, 10:30 on hbo after "girls." also, we will be performing all of this together in los angeles on the 18th, at the regents theater for charity. we will also be at the herbs theater in san francisco, also for charity. real girl. >> real girl, which is a female empowerment program. >> thanks, everybody. >> thanks. ♪ yousef: softbank gains after it

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