♪ >> from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. charlie: we begin with politics. attorney general jeff sessions appeared before the senate intelligence committee and he hiscalled to testify about recusal from the russian investigation and his role in the firing of james comey. the exchange was at times combative and some challenge his version of events and others accused him of stonewalling. >> i believe the american people have had it with stonewalling . americans don't want to hear

that answers to relevant questions are off-limits or cannot be provided in public. or that it would be inappropriate for witnesses to tell us what they know. we talking about an attack on our democratic institutions and stonewalling of any kind is unacceptable. and general sessions has acknowledged that there is no legal basis for this stonewalling. sessions: senator wyden, i am not stonewalling. i am following the policies of the department of justice. you don't walk into any hearing or committee meeting and reveal confidential communications with the president of the united states. charlie: session said that any insinuation that he was involved in meddling is appalling and detestable lie.

joining me now is a journalist that covers foreign policy for the washington post. so, how do we assess what happened today with the attorney general? >> it depends on the side of the aisle you're looking at it from. the attorney general did say frequently -- he was asked by both sides what his role was in the firing of james comey and he is recollection between what transpired between himself and the president and sessions. and a more detailed rendition of the terms of his recusal. thatrobes of the doj involved the trump campaign. he is a former senator and he was challenged by democrats. it really depends on the side of the isle you are on whether or not it was good for sessions.

he said very emphatically that he does not remember having any additional contacts with russian he did not think his conversations were problematic. he lost his temper at one point and he bellowed at ron wyden, who was pushing him hard on a line of questioning. on the other side democrats kept hearing that sessions was revision to answer questions without giving a legal justification for why, and his accounts of events did not jive with comey's. he gave certain answers that did not sit well with the democrats. there's also this theme that every time he answered a question about his contacts with russia, there was a caveat. he said, i do not remember, i don't recall, i can't recall anything.

i wrecked my brain trying to think of something. when senator harris was questioning him, he said if i don't give these caveats, you will accuse me of being a liar. it is a denial that leaves the door open for things down the line. charlie: did he help our further understanding of what the russians might have done, wanted to do, and how they might have accomplished it? >> not really. there were questions prompted by republicans saying that we should focus more on what the russians did and how appalling sessions said it would be if that transpired. sessions did not really offer any new information or facts about that and that ended up devolved into a "well, we should the focusing on this." and democrats are like, donald trump fired the fbi director running that probe. we have to look at that now and

ask why. there was a load of lip service it, to not, -- paid to discussing the gravitas surrounding this focus that everyone thinks should be there on what russia did or did not do. in terms of shedding on a light on that -- charlie: robert mueller is now special counsel. >> right. sessions said that he has had no contact with robert mueller and there was a lot of discussion when rod rosenstein was testifying before the senate appropriations that jeffee panel sessions was supposed to appear this afternoon trade there were

questions about, will robert mueller have independence to do his job and will that be influence coming from the white house. rosenstein said, i am not going to fire robert mueller without cause and i have to greenlight and if it's is going to happen. that is not going to happen unless there is a better reason. session says, i have not been talking to the trump administration about this. i was never briefed on it. how was i supposed to be a part of it? there are lots of discussions and understandings that could be happening that are not in the written record, around the time that comey was fired and afterwards with the special prosecutor being appointed. are they taking him and others at their written word, or is there speculation that there was more going on in discussions behind the scenes that are not written down?

and a lot of times you heard senators asking, we want to see your notes. jeff sessions says that he does not keep notes. it may never be laid to rest. it really depends on how inclined the senators are to believe them and the version of events that is documented versus the one that is speculated to have been bubbling behind the scenes. charlie: to understand what you said, that rod rosenstein said that, if anybody is going to fire robert mueller, it is going to be him. he alone has that responsibility? >> he said the chain of command for you alert stocks of the attorney general. since sessions has recused himself and it is rod rosenstein who functions as the attorney general. even if there was some sort of pressure from the president, rosenstein is the person who has

to sign that paper. he says that he would not do that unless there was cause. he does not think there is cause to fire robert mueller. he says i think this is going to go ahead smoothly. it has not fully satisfied democrats. there is the ultimate check and balance on robert mueller. he doesn't have an ability to run off the rails in the investigation. as far as rosenstein protesting to the procedures, it has to go through and at some point. charlie: do we know if the president has tapes or not? >> the house intelligence committee asked for them formally at the end of last week. they gave the president until june 23. no on that after today's hearings.

charlie: do we know if the president plans to go under on to testify and be questioned by whoever would do the questioning? >> we know that the president cents, which is sure. nobody has said that they would try to schedule the president. i am not convinced that they will. if there is investigative value to it at some point we will get to the point where committees have decided they want to do that. that thexpect controversy and everything else surrounding the testimony of james comey, if donald trump was next in line, it would be mind blowing and i don't think the committees are ready. i don't think they have been gearing up toward that before trump said sure. democrats want it. ydon't think republicans do et.

charlie: lots of people have criticized james comey, but has anybody contradicted him as to the things that he said? >> not so much as undercutting his mental processes. a lot of what comey wasn't saying is based on his impression of what the president was trying to drive at. jeff sessions did not call comey a liar today. he said interestingly that he had been of the mindset that comey would have to go before he was confirmed. he said there was a process that , danahave reported it boente. it was never reported to her. it is saying that there is doubt

in the direction of james comey she shouldre are i's have dotted. not finishing the sentence in terms of what sessions is suggesting. it leaves the door open for the president to say what he is going to say. sessions can sit in the middle and not be directly contradicting other one. charlie: thank you for joining us. pleasure. back in a moment. stay with us. ♪ the u.s. treasury department unveiled sweeping recommendations monday that would eliminate or dampen regulations enacted in response to the 2008 financial crisis. pay nearly 150 page report takes aim at pieces of the dodd-frank legislation and reduces the capital standards required of banks.

the trump administration seeks to grow the economy by 5%. this is contingent on efforts to overhaul the tax code and other initiatives. joining me is steve mnuchin, who i am pleased to have on the program. welcome. >> it's great to be back with you. charlie: tell me what you hope to accomplish with this regulation. >> we are looking at the regulations around the president's core principles on financials. the first is focused on u.s. banks and depositories. what are the recommendations we can make that will drive growth in community banks, credit unions, and regional banks? if you look at the u.s. banking system, 50% of the assets are held. there are about 12,000 other banks.

we want to make sure that we unlock the burdensome regulation on those other things so the connection they are lending in their communities. charlie: one interesting question people ask is that unemployment is very low, the markets are very hot. si there has been no crises nce 2008. why do we need to fix it if it ain't broke? >> for a lot of people, the system is working, but there are a lot of people where the system isn't working. although we have low unemployment there are many that have left the labor force because they can't find jobs. for the last 10 years they have not seen wage increases. we're focused on creating sustained economic growth at 3% or higher, getting the economy back to where we think it is. that is a combination of tax reform, regulatory relief, and

trade. charlie: you have to find some balance between protecting taxpayers and on the other hand loosening regulations so that it will enhance growth. how do you find that balance? sec. mnuchin: that is what this is all about. sessions.ld listening this is not printing out an academic study. we have gone out to 18 different 00 people.h 50 to 1 we went out to regional banks and all of the regulators. tried to, with recommendations where we balance, make sure we never put ,axpayers at risk, and two lincolnshire that our banking system can be competitive, and that small and medium businesses have access to capital. charlie: you mentioned this is

one of four. what is the first part of crafting these financial regulations? sec. mnuchin: let me mention two other aspects. one is that we are calling for a review of the reinvestment act. it is important for banks. want to make sure that when banks are investing in communities, that they are doing things that are good for the community grade we want to reach out to consumer and housing advocates. we want to make sure as long as banks are spending billions of dollars, it is not just a check te box exercise, that that money is helping the economy, particularly in low and medium income families. the other recommendation is to wherese certain powers, you bring together regulators. one of our recommendations is where there are multiple regulators looking at the same

thing at a bank, for us to appoint a lead regulator to coordinate. it is about sound regulation and proper regulation. charlie: how would you change the consumer protection agency? sec. mnuchin: our biggest objection to the consumer protection agency is that it has no oversight. we have made one of two recommendations. there should be a board that oversees the consumer protection bureau, similar to the fed or f dic. the head of the investigation should be able to be removed at will by the president. we think that the funding should not be a blank check. we think that the funding should go through congressional review and approval like other government funding. charlie: and the white house should have the ability to fire the head of the consumer protection agency? sec. mnuchin: like the occ and

other independent regulators, the white house should be able to remove the person without cause. or if they can't do that, there should be an independent board that oversees that person. charlie: in terms of tax form, the sequencing of the legislative agenda -- the president laid it out that healthcare comes first, care regulation, -- at the same time, there is a sense that this may have been successful with finding common ground with democrats. sec. mnuchin: the president has been very hard at work on all of these issues. as it relates to tax reform, some question whether we should have gone for tax reform first. i have been working on it since january here, meeting with the house and senate.

tax reform is complicated. it has been 30 years since we have had comprehensive tax reform. we are working as fast as we can to come out with a plan where we have buy-in from the house and senate to get something passed this year. charlie: where does that stand? sec. mnuchin: we are working. we have meetings every day and we are optimistic that we will get this done. charlie: we saw a statement of principles a month ago. when will we see the legislative proposal coming from the administration? sec. mnuchin: the reason why we came out with a statement of principles and not a full-blown plan is that this has to be a process where we work with the house and the senate. as i said, we are working every week with them as fast as i come. our objective is to get this passed this year. we will release it as soon as it is ready. charlie: many people have referred to the steve mnuchin rule. it says that the tax plan would

benefit the highest earners and -- the middle class and not the highest earners. is that how you would define it? sec. mnuchin: i admire that some people have named a rule after me. the president's objective is to make a middle income tax-cut, simplify purchases and make texas competitive. -- make taxes competitive. we are taking almost all deductions except mortgage and charitable. charlie: what about the repatriation of money stored by u.s. companies overseas? sec. mnuchin: we have one of the highest tax rate in the world. we tax on worldwide income and we have a concept of deferral. it is not a surprise that our companies leave trillions offshore. as part of tax reform we want to

move to a territorial system and we want to have a system where trillions ofck dollars and invest it here in the united states. charlie: the question of tax reform is where you will get the revenue of cutting taxes. your answer is? sec. mnuchin: we are going to broaden the base. fundamentally this is about lowering rates. people have many less deductions. there are a lot of companies that don't pay the full tax rate because of all types of special interests. there are a lot of personal people who do not pay the top rate because of the deductions. this is about simplifying the tax code. making a competitive and broadening the base. sec. mnuchin: the president had a cabinet meeting and i assume you were there. just describe that to me. here is the president saying, he

had the greatest legislative achievement of any president other than roosevelt. each cabinet member steps forward to lavish this , mr.ordinary praise, like president, it is such an honor to work for you. was that staged? how did that come about? sec. mnuchin: everyone in that room felt the same way. it is the greatest honor to serve this country and this president. that is why we are all here. you have a lot of successful people that came from business and government. we could not be more proud of the cabinet and sitting here and working for the president. we all have the same job, which is to grow the economy, make the world safe, and make things better for americans. charlie: are you concerned about the investigation into the russian probe, that you have james comey making accusations against the president, the

attorney general speaking today, others being called to testify before the senate and house intelligence committees. does it concern you? you think that the president is under siege? you know this man very well. sec. mnuchin: that does not concern me at all. i can tell you that the president works unbelievably hard every day for the american people. that is what we are focused on in the cabinet. that is what we are focused on on tax reform, on international security council. -- the national security council. the investigation will go on, but it is a distraction. charlie: but you think that the president will come out of this ok? sec. mnuchin: beyond okay. the president just got back from an important trip abroad where he went to the gulf. we signed an important memorandum of understanding with saudi arabia and us cochairing

this effort in the gulf. the president went to israel and the vatican, to nato. she is working harder than i have seen anyone i have ever seen before. you think these legislative challenges will take place before the election? you think we will have a health care bill, tax form, an infrastructure bill, and the under legislative achievements the president has outlined as essential to his first term? sec. mnuchin: i can assure you that the cabinet is focused on the every day. we are committed to working with the house and the senate to get this done this year. charlie: thank you for joining us and it was a pleasure to have you on the program. mnuchin, treasury of the secretary. we will be right back.

stay with us. ♪

charlie: joe maddon is the manager of the chicago cubs, who had not won the world series since 1908. last year they capture the title in dramatic fashion. thereviously managed in tampa bay rays and he led the team to the world series. the cubs are in second place in the national league central standings and i am pleased to

have joe maddon at the table. thank you for coming. joe: i am honored to be here and i mean that sincerely. charlie: how is the team doing? joe: on and off. we are in these prolonged winning streaks and losing streaks. we have not caught our stride, but we will. coming off of a world series in , the previous year, we went to the nlcs. it has been two long years and i have been conscious and aware of the mental state of our guys. i think the word rest is important for me. it is best to reach our peak by august or september. right now it is not exactly where we would like to be, but it is not bad. charlie: coming off of the world series, you knew you wanted to repeat 2017. joe: i did not want to be complacent in any way.

that was my first thought. i wanted to play off of the authentic component of our guys. authenticity is a strong part of our players. fans, even outside of chicago, are attracted to the young, players because of the authenticity of our group. and i really want to focus on defense. everyone loves hitting home runs, etc., but a big part of the success last year was defense. i tried from the first day to attack these different concepts. do not become comfortable, do not become complacent and rely on the authentic component of our nature. beyond that, it is about managing people and personalities, the human element, where you have just played two long seasons and we came back with higher expectations being thrown at us. how do you manage a bunch of young players' minds?

that was on my mind. we talked about simplicity -- i don't want to make this complex. more importantly, how do we manage the minds? charlie: trust is crucial. joe: it is all about trust. quite frankly when i took over the job and i had three things on my mind, building relationships among the group and once i do that, i knew trust would be established. and after that we could have a free exchange of ideas. if you don't build relationships and trust, there is push back with ideas being exchanged. if you get those two things in order for, you get the most important thing, which is this open conversation where people are not just trying to say things to ameliorate your needs or wants. they are going to give you honest feedback. listen, during the game, i say to trust your guys. i will say that to myself when things get hot or if a pitcher

is in trouble. trust your guys and walk away from the moment. charlie: what is the toughest decision for a manager to make? after you have assembled your >> on a daily basis, it is just managing your bullpen. there is so many good young players and to place the right guys out there, it is hard to put them on the bench. as a major-league manager, i think the part of your day that is the most beneficial and difficult is the management of your bullpen, putting the right guys on the right hitters, the right amount of rest, and bullpen usage is the toughest. charlie: that includes one to call them in. >> yes. for instance, we played against

the rockies yesterday and i had one of my better relief pitchers in, but it was unusual and the game had some import. i thought the lead was important and i went away from normal to salvage the game, which we did. sometimes, you go by the book and sometimes, you go away from the book. it is about knowing your opposition and trying to push the right buttons at the right time. charlie: when theo came to you to manage the red sox, he said they did get for him and it gave him time to season. >> they made the right decision.

i was not ready for all of that. i was really impressed with theo and i loved the idea of working with them at that time and boston at that time. i thought i would live somewhere close to the ballpark and the family's are traditionally there for you and controversial and tough, at times. i thought it would be interesting. they chose francona and it put the wheels in motion for me to get my job and i got interviewed more because of that moment. they did the right thing and i have told them that. charlie: are you like winston churchill, who came to 10 downing and said that everything he had done have prepared him for this moment.

>> i love that about him and i was very happy i didn't get this gig until i was 52. i had gotten to cut my teeth in a lot of different cities been trying a punch of different things that people think are crazy and i saw what works and does not work. i am thankful that it took me this long to get to this point. i am so much more convicted in what i do and how i do it. i have no idea how they do it and i could not have done it, frankly. i'm talking about the media situations that arise that are unique that you have not been involved with before. i am happy that it took me as

long as it did to get to the major leagues. >> you remind me of mike at duke. there is a sense of trust and confidence in players and a sense of being able to talk to them about anything, understanding they are humans with motivations and thoughts that either help or get in the way of them being as good as they can. >> i don't have rules. the only rule i have is running hard to her space and i want my pitchers to work on defense. if there are rules, i have the players make them themselves. there are best ballplayers at duke -- but the more freedom i give, the more discipline i get. we get the most influential guys on the team in a room and we discuss the policy.

i called them "the lead bulls." they would get the lead bulls running in the proper direction and they will direct everybody else. we sit down and we figure out travel. that was dictated by our players. charlie: did you, when you were down 3-1, say you could do it? >> they had to see me not panic or change or start saying a bunch of crazy things. charlie: not second-guessing. >> it is easy to do. it happens in life and in our game. finger-pointing is detrimental in any part of society.

in that deficit, a lot of it was just we were not hitting the ball well and we have a dh who is going to be available again and our pitching was good, at that point. i was not distressed. i thought we had that point and i don't think enough people talked about coming back from 3-1. charlie: when it was all over and they had won, what did it mean to them? >> for the players? the goal is the ring. it is about that sense of accomplishment as a professional at it, beyond that money and recognition. the ring is symbolic of being the best right now.

working backwards from that, it was about the family passing away and my wife. the next part is the coaching staff and the money involved when you win is really important. i kind of thought that anytime chicago gets a win, they're looking for the next world series victory. charlie: you say to "do simple better." >> we are always looking for convoluted answers. i believe in reducing to the most simplistic point possible

and i start with the thought of "do simple better." we don't have a lot of plays. the one we do, i want run well. it is like the packers' sweep. the other team knew was coming and they couldn't stop it. when you do simple better, it is good. charlie: it is interesting. you look at doing simple better, but life goes back to doing basic skills. >> all i ever want to do is harp on the fundamentals and doing the simple things correctly more often than the other team. you win and you break the team. that is rthe simplicity -- the simplicity of it. i tell my kids to enjoy the struggle. charlie: enjoy the struggle and

think about being uncomfortable and try not to suck. >> we did not suck last year. that was a conversation between david ross and i. the idea is to not embarrass yourself. you do not want to embarrass yourself. so, we kept going back and forth and i had bias and i said, at the end of the day, this is just about trying not to suck. he giggled and it took a lifeform of its own that made a lot of money for the foundation. charlie: managing a world series team, being in the major

leagues, this is hard. it is hard to be there and many do not stay for 3-4 seasons. joe maddon: i want to defend the everyday major league player. people have to understand how hard it is to play 160 games annually with day games after night games, hot weather, cold weather, you are ill, something is hurting, that is not easy to do. when you are able to play and participate on this level and play well for a long span of time, i have so much respect for that person.

the average player is 3-4 years, especially in the nfl with the injury rates. ♪

charlie: you don't know this about me, but i went to the red sox game for spring training. >> they are down in ft. myers now. charlie: i met ted williams and ted williams and i became friends. he was a minor league hitting coach and we had this meeting. he was a minor league hitting coach and i was doing a program that started at 2:00 that ended at 6:00 and he would get up to go fishing. i was his prime time and he knew that and he would invite me out. we would go fishing. it was amazing. he had this whole sense of how much he cared about the

techniques of the game and he wrote a wonderful look on hitting. >> aydin read it. i never got to meet mr. williams. i would have loved to. i have had some common friends that i have had conversations with. i am a manager and i am not coaching. i did start out as a coach and i've coached hitting, catching, baserunning, and outfield play, the whole gamut. it is interesting to get involved in the more technical components of the game. my job is with the mental side

of the game and how i can motivate. >> it seems that you have merged traditional values, like trust, authenticity, with a real understanding of the technology of the game and what we are learning about using a laptop or numbers or data to say things that inform how you see. >> i am rooted in this. i got my first laptop and they even shall he morphed into numbers. even when i work with the angels, i used to break things for them in my rudimentary ways.

there are things that are done with the click of the fingers now. my pocket has analytical information that i utilize. you still have to balance what you have learned from getting in the game with the feel and the understanding of the methods of the game. i do not believe in extremism in either direction. i believe in gray and they run away from gray. you have to morph this into things that have stood the test of time and that is what you need to do today. i think that is the right way to be. charlie: how did they tell you? has anyone said you don't have enough speed, hitting ability, you are going to make it?

>> i was upset. i was my second year in minor-league ace ball and doing well. i was sitting around .300. a scout named lloyd christopher was from san francisco and he was a contemporary of joe dimaggio and one of the hardest and toughest scouts in the game and said, when are you going to stop playing and star coaching. i hit a home run the night before and lloyd gets in my face and asked that question and i was 22 or 23. it was apparent to others that my tools were not good enough.

charlie: it is hard to recognize. >> you need to be a good self evaluator and most of us are not at a certain point of our lives. i did keep it in the back of my mind and i was released by the angels and went into a couple of independent teams. i played for $200 for the month in my last month and i was commuting in a volkswagen. that is how i existed and i was living in a closet and that is not an exaggeration. that was the indicator that it was time to get out. charlie: what is the hazelton project? >> i went back home to my small town in pennsylvania and there was a disconnect going on between the hispanics and the group that was already there. i went home and i was shocked by what i was seeing and it was a

dark and fearful place on both sides. we went to california and i told myself to keep my eyes open and listen. i thought that we had to do something about this. again, briefly, my concept was that we were pushing away the very people who were going to save our town. they wanted to be there and they were young, had families, believed in family values and concepts, and just like the italian family i grew up with and the polish family i grew up with. we'll was romanticize those stories from the past. these people have a chance to live exactly how it looked back in the 1920's and 1930's and we are pushing them away because of the same reasons they were pushed away, the different language, the kids were dirty, trouble, crime. we are building a community center to bring people together and we have afterschool programs and adult education programs. we have athletics programs.

we're trying to have both sides come together and understand that, if we do this, it will come together and they have been very good to us and i'm going on thursday. cal and billy have been wonderful and have put in the money for the gym. charlie: can i talk a little bit about who is going to be in the world series? >> the chicago cubs. i don't know who the american the challengers is going to be. we are going to straighten this out and i have so much faith in our guys. charlie: is it the indians? >> it could be. they have a similar record and are coming off of the same sort of season.

they are really good and the dodgers have been good. the nationals are doing well, but i have a lot of belief in our guys and the yankees would be a good opponent. we will take on all of the comers. charlie: getting to the world series is difficult. you work all your life to get to the world series. >> gene was one of my favorite. charlie: i know that you knew him and he was one of the smart managers. >> he was one of the guys who i never challenged if something was true or not when it came to baseball. if we were sitting right here and my back was to the door, you could feel him walk into the room. he treated me well and he gave me a lot to hold onto in the brief time we worked together.

he is probably the best. >> the players, are they better because of conditioning and everything else? nobody will ever hit the ball better than ted williams. >> he was pretty phenomenal. >> i think he hit one 490 feet. >> you could argue about the size in the conditioning been better. i cannot tell you about being better baseball players. bigger and stronger athletes, i will give you. >> the conditioning is different. >> guys used to come to get in shape and these guys come to spring training in shape. there is better methods and nutrition is a big part of this. nobody would talk about whether

or not it was good to smoke a cigarette or not or how much whiskey you drink in a night. that wasn't part of conditioning and it now is. charlie: they have trainers and dietitians and people who work on your head. joe: we control the food in the clubhouse and on the road. we have all kinds of things. whatever you need that we think will make you better, we have it. when you walk in, you want to live there. it has everything you possibly want. >> it is tough to be at the ballpark on a nice sunny afternoon and see somebody with exquisite skills do things that you know you can't do but could imagine doing it because you have played the game.

it is not like watching a sport that you never played. it is seeing people do something you did as a kid with skill, passion, and love. >> this is fly there is a lot of critique. everybody has played it somewhere. everybody wants us to punt all the time and everybody wants a two handed catch. a bunt only works when it is necessary and it is a one-handed game and not a two-handed game will step these are things that you get taught by your dad that you try to push your players in a different direction on. >> have you written a book, are you writing a book, will you write a book? >> i have not done that. frankly, i want to wait to see of people are actually

interested. i'm still writing this book, i think. i think it's good take a lot of time. i don't want this to just be something haphazard just to make a couple of dollars. i have no interest in this part of it. if i did it, it would have to be a sincere effort to tell you what i think. >> thanks for coming. >> it is great to see you. >> like you for joining us. see you next time. ♪

alisa a check of your first word : news. steve scalise is wounded and in critical condition after a gunman opened fire as republicans practice for the annual congressional baseball game. a second congressman sustained minor injuries. the shooter was james hodgkinson from illinois. he was killed by capitol police. a gunman who opened fire at a ups in san francisco was an employee according to local police who say three employees were killed before the shooter killed himself. police say h