tv Bloomberg Technology Bloomberg September 14, 2017 11:00pm-12:00am EDT
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alisa: i'm alisa parenti in washington, and you are watching "bloomberg technology." we start with a check of your "first word news." after dining with the president at the white house senate , democratic leader chuck schumer and house minority leader nancy pelosi say they reached a deal with trump to protect children brought into the u.s. by undocumented immigrants from deportation. >> one of our most productive discussions was on the daca program. we agreed on a framework. andassed daca protections additional security measures, excluding the wall. alisa: the white house says there is no deal on daca. adjust asked for a deadline on dreamers seeking work permits.
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president trump blamed the appointment of special counsel robert mueller on the attorney general jeff sessions decision to recuse himself from the russia investigation. that, according to "the new york times." they say trump blasted sessions in the oval and said he should resign. sessions did hand in his resignation, but trump didn't accept. trump denied asking sessions to resign. trump toured damage caused by hurricane irma in florida. he was accompanied by the vice president mike pence first lady, melania trump. global news 24 hours a day, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in more than 120 countries. i'm alisa parenti. this is bloomberg. "bloomberg technology" is next. ♪ emily: i'm emily chang.
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this is "bloomberg technology." oracle's cloud growth continues to soar. sending first-quarter revenue through the roof. we will break down the numbers from the stronger-than-expected earnings scorecard. plus, missed opportunity at equifax. the credit monitoring giant was fully aware of the software flaw exploited by hackers. we will discuss the continuing fallout and lawmakers are demanding answers. apple could be on the verge of its biggest deal ever. we will break down its possible investment into toshiba's chip unit. first, to our lead. oracle reported first-quarter earnings showing a surge in cloud growth. it was shares in extended $1.5 million. trading are up just under 2%. no, half a percent, about. the company issued guidance of $9.5 billion for the second quarter.
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oracle is in the midst of shifting services and products to the cloud. earlier this month, regulatory filings show top executives would only receive their performance options if the cloud business showed significant growth. joining us now to discuss, our editor at large, cory johnson, and from new york techonomy ceo. ceo, david kirkpatrick. what is your take on the numbers when it comes to cloud growth? cory: the executives of oracle change their bonus plan to get paid better if cloud growth goes faster. it's a good idea if it's going to grow faster. oracle has created many things, not least of which paying their executives more money than anyone else in the business. these results show very strong movement away from on premise software to the cloud. they have done the thing that is so impossible to do. they have changed the fan belt. they are doing it very well.
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they are accelerating on a quarter for quarter basis. accelerating the pace. the growth of the cloud business is very impressive. 13 weeks, $1.5 billion of cloud revenue, up about 80% over the previous year. emily: do they deserve their bonus? cory: i think they deserve more. they are such nice people over there. emily: david, what's your take? oracle has been behind, let's be honest, for a long time when it comes to other more forward thinking cloud service providers. is it proof that they can turn themselves around or turn in a different direction when the will is there? ingid: it must have been gall to oracle executives in the last few years when companies that were not competitors of theirs -- oracle has been seen as an old, stodgy, packaged software maker. it is super impressive, as corey
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-- as cory said, that they are able to be making these changes, though they have been laying the groundwork for this for a long time. even when marc benioff left oracle and started salesforce, larry ellison was famously kicked off the board when he created a company that competed with salesforce. oracle bought salesforce. with the oracle brand, the platform that ellison controlled, it's really coming into its own. netsuite acquisition was a little bit controversial because ellison is part of both companies. what is the impact of that acquisition? cory: it's helping the cloud revenues grow. the netsuite is not the biggest part of the story. we will see if they tell us anything on the conference call.
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but you also saw, interestingly, a slight pickup in gross margins. it shows me that the investment they made in the cloud, which was really expensive, is starting to tail off a little bit. you don't just see it in r&d. you see it in the cost of goods sold. the margins are gross margins. they are getting better. that suggests the investments are starting to roll over. we're not seeing the cost of developing this new software quite as high. now they are starting to benefit from all of these applications that have been rewritten from the cloud. it's working. customers like it. it's costing them less to build it. emily: does it matter that they were late to the game here? does it matter that others have such a big head start?
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cory: the difference is the fourth quarter in football is the end of the game. these guys have shown that slow and steady is winning the race here. they have become dominant, if not the dominant company in the cloud when it comes to software. emily: yet you have other cloud providers. david, you mentioned salesforce. amazon, google, microsoft, trying to get a piece of the cloud in a different way. it's sort of a whole new kind of race we are seeing here. david: in effect, oracle has no choice but to make this transition. by conventional analysis, you'd say they were late. the fact that they kept their profits up, their stock is at a high, that they are somehow managing that transition is masterfully impressive, but they really don't have a choice. they wanted to keep those extraordinary margins with them as long as they could. it's ironic that they probably don't want to move all the way to the cloud, another story we will certainly touch on in the hour is equifax.
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that shows there are huge risks to putting too many things into the cloud and making things more accessible. oracle's clients have wanted to have control of the data, and that's why they paid such high quality oracle software that sat on their servers. this company is walking a tight rope in a beautiful way. emily: david kirkpatrick, my guest host for the hour. editor at-large cory johnson, thank you for stopping by. to another story we've been following, president trump says he is close to a deal with congressional democrats differently protect nearly one million immigrants brought illegally to the u.s. as children from deportation, so-called "dreamers."
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alex, there has been a lot of back and forth. deal, no deal? what did happen at dinner? where are we now? alex: we think that they are still pretty close to a deal on daca. some sort of legal protection for the dreamers, as their advocates call them. trump has spent the day kind of contradicting himself about the conditions for a deal, whether a border wall will have to be part of it or not. he said several different things throughout the day. at this point, it looks like they are close to a deal and the border wall will not be part of it, but trump apparently wants some kind of assurance that immigrants will obstruct the wall in the future. -- that democrats will not obstruct the wall in the future. i don't know how he's going to secure that. emily: what was the point of the actions he took last week if today he's willing to make a deal? alex: i don't think trump really wanted to end his program. he faced pressure from his right flank to end it. he promised to do it as a candidate. he pulled the plug on an executive order that his lawyers had been telling him probably would not withstand a court challenge anyway, but he wants
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-- i believe him when he says this, he wants the protections for these immigrants to be an -- to be enacted into law so that they can't be removed by a court challenge. he wants a deal on this. he also wants his wall. he is stuck with his political base who is very upset with him for going back on his campaign promise. ann coulter has spent all day on twitter saying he should be impeached. breitbart, run by steve bannon again, has been hitting trump hard on this as well. emily: just another day in the life of the trump administration. i know you will keep us posted on whether a deal is indeed struck. coming up, google has been hit with a class-action lawsuit, alleging the tech giant is biased against women when it comes to pay and promotions. we dive into the case next. this is bloomberg. ♪ emily: bitcoin fell for a fifth
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straight day, the longest losing streak in more than a year after one of china's largest online exchanges that it would stop handling trades by the end of the month. this is part of a wider crackdown by the chinese government on cryptocurrencies. bitcoin had risen more than fourfold this year with greater acceptance of the blockchain technology. global political uncertainty and increased interest in asia -- google has been hit with a class-action lawsuit over claims the tech giant systematically pays male employees more than women. it follows a 2015 federal labor investigation which found systemic pay discrimination among the 21,000 employees at google's headquarters. the initial stages of the review found women earn less than men in nearly every job classification. joining us now to discuss,
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reporter mark bergen, and still with us, david kirkpatrick, techonomy ceo in new york. mark: it's been a really rough summer for google. three former engineers and employees at google are claiming not only that the company has paid men more than women, but that women are on a different, what they call, job ladder, trajectory to have jobs like the high paid technical engineering jobs, where they are paid more. emily: how is this different from the department of labor investigation, which said that there is a difference? mark: the lawsuit cites the department of labor lawsuit. there was evidence where the department did statistical regression and showed google has paid women less for similar roles.
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googles claimed response has been, you don't have all our data and we are not giving you that for various reasons. to a lot of these claims, google has come back and said the difficulty here is that men typically go into more high-paying roles. there are more men in engineering. more men in the technical jobs that are paid better across the industry. emily: meantime, employees on their own have given some data to the new york times that they believe shows -- data collected from colleagues shows systemic pay differences. mark: that was correct. it was a couple years ago. there was an effort internally to collect compensation data across all different -- google has one to 10 rankings of employees. they showed that a level five employee as a man would pay more than a level five employee as a female. google's response to that has been that they don't have all the data. someone who is a search engineer may be paid a lot more than
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someone who is just working on operations. emily: this is on course -- on top of long-standing issues with the number of women in tech, only 20% women in the technical, critical positions at google. on the back of the james damore memo where an engineer wrote a memo to the company saying that there are biological reasons that more men are in engineering than women. where does this leave google right now? mark: it's in a tough spot. they are being hit on both sides. there was a clear message that we need to fix the issue, bring more women into the technical world. the memo said maybe the reason we don't have more women in the technical world is because they are not as good at technical roles. there was a huge backlash against that. google has said that because they are so big, one of the first large companies to reveal their hiring female and people
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of color on staff, that they have become more of a target than others. emily: david, what's your take on this? google has claimed to care about women. some of the most prominent women leaders in silicon valley got their start at google. yet you hear these things and they don't add up. david: and yet it's been a small percentage. i was listening and thinking about this. men presume that men should be in the higher-paid jobs. i think that's a generic statement that, sadly, is true. i think that's a problem that we have to kind of get over. it's great that google is being forced to confront that reality. ironically, i think that memo almost becomes a data point on behalf of the plaintiffs in this lawsuit, because it really illustrates the mindset that prevails in large parts of the company, even if he was a slight extreme outlier for that mindset.
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but it's also very interesting to look at how a company -- there's no other company like google. maybe facebook. but google is, until recently, it could hardly do any wrong. it was like riding high. self driving cars, pharmaceuticals, you name it. they are now on the defensive in so many areas. i don't think they are as fundamentally screwed up as a company like uber. but people feel total license to come down on these companies in a way they have not before. senators are being asked about antitrust enforcement. this is a change in the mood big time. this is very healthy. this company and the entire silicon valley culture does have to change. emily: larry page has -- now running alphabet. sundar pichai is running google in particular. has there been a marked change in how this is being handled within the company?
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mark: certainly his management team, you see a lot more women than historically google had as their leadership. they have been addressing this in unconscious bias training. google says that at each stage of the hiring and for promotions they have this unconscious bias. it's a really tough problem to solve. the industry in general has not solved this. google is a stand-in for that. i don't think the problems are as systematic as they are at uber. i don't get a sense that there are complaints about the culture, that it is a caustic workplace. a lot of women think that google is a much better place for women. emily: mark bergen who covers google for us. david kirkpatrick, you are sticking with me. coming up, the equifax breach was one of the worst in american history, but could the hackers have been stopped in their tracks? this is bloomberg. ♪ emily: equifax shares continue
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to take a beating. the credit monitoring company revealed thursday that the hackers exploited vulnerability that could have been fixed two months before the breach. the federal trade commission has announced it will be investigating the hack. equifax also wound up in the crosshairs of senate minority leader chuck schumer earlier thursday. >> equifax, stunningly and epically, failed to perform one of its two duties as a company, to protect the information of the people in its files. that's unacceptable, and there's no other word for it. emily: joining me now to discuss bloomberg's mike riley and my guest host for the hour, techonomy ceo, david kirkpatrick.
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mike, how could they not have patched this vulnerability? isn't their main job to protect our information? mike: that's right. the consumer credit agencies often go around telling people before this that they basically have one job, and that is security, so they clearly failed at the job. it's a story like always that is a little bit more complicated. there was a patch out for this vulnerability. it should have been fixed, but the other side of the story is those fixes aren't always easy. they are built into web apps. you have to change not just one web app, but multiple to pass these things. it's a slow process. in some really big cases of
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vulnerabilities, sometimes it takes months to do the complete patching job. that's one issue. it's one thing to be able to get into a website through a vulnerability like this. it's another thing to be able to steal 143 million americans' data. how did those two things connect? it's not just the first failure, but the ability to get in through the web application and get all this data. we don't know if that was hard or easy. we don't know how long it took them, in part because equifax isn't telling us. emily: do we still not know who is behind this or have an idea? mike: it's a little strange. it doesn't seem like a target, where the intruders immediately tried to dump all the credit cards on forums, that they were clearly out just to make a quick buck.
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that doesn't seem to be the case here, which raises the possibility these actors are a little more sophisticated. that could be organized crime, the cyber version of that, or it could mean there is maybe a state hand behind us. it's criminals that got in there, but maybe there was another market for it. that attribution piece often takes a long time. emily: david, basically anyone with a credit card was probably impacted by this. yet the response has been completely fumbled. as a consumer it almost leaves , you feeling helpless. david: it's going to be interesting to see how urgently they did try to patch this when they found out about it. i'm pretty sure we are going to find that they didn't try to do it nearly urgently enough despite how hard it might have been. this company clearly failed in its fundamental job, which is being said widely. i think the ceo has got to go. that is the kind of thing you , can't keep your job when it happens. when your stock drops 30%, it is clearly going to go down more. for consumers, i'm not sure what it means for consumers. the possibility that this could be a state-directed attack is a very interesting one. there are states that are trying to essentially assemble dossiers
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on the american public for unknown reasons. that has been discussed before. this could be a very effective way to add to one of those efforts. when everybody's data was stolen, i wonder how much risk each one of us actually faces about our data being misused. that i haven't figured out. there's a lot of alarmist articles saying you have to freeze your credit. i just don't know. emily: look, i'd love to keep talking about this, but we have to go. mike, i'm going to have to call you to get the rest of the story. thanks so much for stopping by. david kirkpatrick, you are sticking with me. coming up, a sneak peek at our exclusive access to the alibaba group during the company's 18th anniversary celebration. you will hear from founder jack ma. this is bloomberg. ♪ >> it is 11:29 in hong kong and
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12:29 in tokyo. i am rosalind chin with the first word news. north korea has fired its second missile at japan in as many after thest four days yuan approved harsher sanctions against kim jong-un's regime. it flew over houck ido, before landing in the pacific ocean. it was an intermediate range missile. they held an emergency meeting. rex tillerson has called on china and russia to take action of their own. canada and mexico have bristled at a u.s. proposal to include a
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five-year sunset provision in the nafta agreement that would force numbers to reconsider the deal or dump it. commerce secretary wilbur ross says the u.s. is unlikely to quit nafta within six months notice, as allowed in the current agreement. ross will confirmed travel to china with president in november on a trade initiative. the uk's foreign secretary boris johnson has called on myanmar to make clear that violence against the rohingya minority is unacceptable. they have forced them to flee western myanmar. the u.n. called it ethnic kyi has beend suu widely criticized for her response. global news 24 hours a day, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in more than 120 countries. this is bloomberg. >> i am sophie kamaruddin with a check on the markets.
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it is a mixed session in asia with the regional benchmark barely eking out. these it shares are losing 1%, heading for the worst drop in five weeks. hong kong looking at a third day of losses. property stocks rising in shanghai. currencies have some exceptions. a five daye yuan, drop. it is headed for its worst week of 2017, given the pboc signaled it is an easy with the yuan. there was the scrapping of the reserve requirement role. the costs are continuing to climb, and bankers are taking advantage of higher rates. the ringgit is leading gainers today. that has been the case for most of september. along with the rupee. the yuan down 4/10 of 1%. uab anticipates more weakness
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for the yuan. a last look at the yen. -- pared the earlier advantage it had. it is at 110.70. that is your market wrap. ♪ emily: this is "bloomberg technology." i'm emily chang. apple has been dominating the tech headlines this week with its product launch tuesday. ceo tim cook took the stage in cupertino. he was setting in motion plans for what could become the company's largest deal ever. apple is in talks to invest about $3 billion in toshiba's memory chips business as part of a deal with the consortium bain capital. it could exceed the company's acquisition of beats back in 2014. joining me to discuss, ian king. still with us in new york, our guest host, david kirkpatrick, ceo of techonomy.
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why is apple doing this? ian: toshiba is the second-largest provider of this kind of memory. it is naan flash memory, one of the components that stores data on the iphone. there are only six makers of this technology worldwide. samsung has 40% of the market. apple clearly wants to keep toshiba independent, wants to keep it as a balanced to samsung -- as a balance to samsung's weight in the market. and keep its cost down. emily: apple has for 10 years used samsung chips. why? ian: if you need a memory chip, whether you like it or not you , have to at least talk to samsung because of their market share. they have the best production, best technology, and biggest scale, so they have an inordinate influence on pricing for those key components that apple really cares about.
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emily: what's your take on this? david: tim cook's talent has been supply chain and logistics. he is hedging his bets in a critical way. it's awkward that apple has such dependence on samsung for not just these chips, also screens and other components that go into their key product, the iphone, with which they compete with samsung's own phones. there is a very logical competitive as well as supply chain hedging strategy required here. also, it really strikes me that apple is getting better and better at understanding and utilizing chip technology as a competitive differentiator. the fact that they built watches that they just launched that are the same size as the last one, but now they connect to the wireless network -- that is a massive semiconductor win because they designed the chip.
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these guys are getting better at chips. they understand chips. $3 billion is a minor investment for them to have a guaranteed supply. emily: david, i'd love to hear your thoughts on president trump blocking the deal -- a chinese-led company tried to buy lattice semiconductor, a u.s. company. what do you make of trump's decision? david: i think it's necessary. the fact is that certain technologies are key to our national defense and to our national competitiveness. i admire china. i admire chinese industry. but the reality is that any chinese company in some effect is a de facto arm of the chinese government. anything that we sell to any chinese company, we have to accept it will be in some sense controlled by the chinese government or highly influenced by it. i think that the u.s. government the u.s.k that cfius, government entity that decides these things decided that was a
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, risk we shouldn't take in this case. i don't think we should be selling tech companies to chinese companies unless they are things that are just generic. emily: ian, would you agree? ian: there's no doubt that what david said is reflective of the current political environment in the u.s. and the thinking here. it's about economics. china is the largest market for semiconductors. it is trying to domesticate supply. it's trying to take shortcuts. it's trying to buy companies. a small $1.5 billion maker of these chips is not going to change -- emily: is there a security risk? ian: very little. this is not intel. emily: ian, thanks so much. david kirkpatrick, my guest host for the hour, of techonomy. alibaba executive chairman jack ma says he doesn't believe we are heading for another bursting of the tech bubble.
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alibaba shares have doubled, despite short-sellers saying it is poised for a fall. stephen engle spoke exclusively exclusively with ma in china during the 18th anniversary celebration. >> i think the next 18 years the , globalization, the trade will be much better because the internet. because this is our vision, which we should build an electronic world trade platform. we are making sure that a small business and young people can benefit from that. i think eight years is enough for us to improve globalization instead of killing globalization. i believe when trade stops, war starts. >> what your u.s. strategy right now?
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>> we have never changed our strategy. we want to help companies sell to china and asia. we don't want to go through u.s. and be the local e-commerce company. amazon, ebay, so many nice, interesting companies are already over the usa. >> you don't want to take over amazon doing what they are doing? >> no. you have been in hollywood, amblin. you have been patient, you've been the tortoise. what's your strategy? >> we have been preparing it for 10 years. we have a seven-year strategy to go. the plan is not to buy a movie company or to buy this or that. when you buy all the stuff -- you have to learn from them. you have a proxy with them. there are a lot of things china entertainment can learn from hollywood by partnering with them. not let's buy it.
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>> you've talked about the coming winter, when you listed alibaba.com. sure enough, the win came pretty quickly with the collapse of lehman brothers. i was watching your progress through the tech bubble and that bursting. you had these challenges that wiped familiar names off the board. we facing a similar bubble right now with these billion-dollar unicorns and the inflated -- are -- and the inflated tech scene? are there any similarities? >> no, not that much. i think the challenge at that time, a lot of people did not understand how powerful internet is, how to do internet, and whether internet can -- people were just jumping. i found a lot of people have crazy ideas, but they don't know how to operate and do not know how to -- today, everybody knows the internet is powerful. it's going to change the human history. also, the infrastructure of the internet -- the infrastructure is much better than 10, 15 years
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ago. if you are not that greedy, if you are not that stupid and crazy, it's easy to survive today and yesterday. emily: alibaba founder jack ma. you can see more of that unprecedented and exclusive access to the alibaba group during our special half-hour program, "alibaba: the global disruptor" on friday at 5:30 p.m. new york time. microsoft is teaming up with intel to enhance its cloud-based security in an effort to keep out hackers and the government. the new encryption protocol will eventually create a virtual black box that keeps anyone that is a customer from accessing that data. even microsoft won't be able to get at your information and turn it over in response to government warrants and subpoenas.
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microsoft is pursuing a lawsuit against the u.s. government, fighting the requirement to turn over client data, sometimes without the customer's knowledge. coming up the man that invented , twitch has a new startup. he thinks it could revolutionize the legal industry. could your next lawyer be a robot? this is bloomberg. ♪
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oled's are likely to see the sharpest increase in demand as apple switches to a higher demand model. entrepreneur justin kan is best known for cofounding video streaming services like twitch. now he is setting his sights on the legal industry. he just launched his newest venture, aimed at bringing the legal profession into the tech era. he secured $10.5 million in funding. he joins me now live in the studio. what exactly is aetrium, and how will it work? justin: it is a technology enabled law firm for startups. the company i founded, powered by this software that is created by my technology company, legal technology services, lts. emily: are lawyers being
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replaced by robots? justin: it will be a long time, probably decades before lawyers are replaced by ai. we are building a suite of tools that help create bionic lawyers. emily: are you talking to a human? justin: to a human. that's what i wanted as a founder. i always wanted to talk to a human when the stakes were high. i didn't want the uber of lawyers. i wanted someone who had experience and expertise to help me, but there were things that i wanted within that. i wanted it to be transparent what the steps were. i wanted it to be price predictable. i wanted to know what i was going to pay. that is what atrium is set up to do. emily: can your software do the job that lawyers do? it's so subjective. you read the fine print. every form is drawn up differently. it all matters, what the fine print says.
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justin: there are parts of what legal services do that are art, and parts that are more turning the crank, the same thing over and over again, and that's what software is really good at, doing the same thing over and over again. you always need lawyers who are going to do the explaining to you, because people want that, and also the customization of whatever forms or documents, the sticky situations that you get into. emily: you recently left y combinator. why did you leave? justin: i wanted to get back closer to starting startups. i'm a glutton for punishment, i guess. i spent a lot of time recovering from founding companies at y.c. i taught a lot of people about startups. it was kind of time to shorten the feedback cycle and be doing something where every day i felt like i was making a substantive change to a business. emily: how would you describe the funding environment right now? are we seeing a pullback,
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caution, tightening of the belt? justin: i think there's a little bit of a tightening. if you compare where we are at today from 2014, 2015, there's way less froth. but i definitely think that there's also plenty of companies getting funded right now, especially since we are in september and all the vc's are back from vacation. it's worse than the all-time high, but not terrible. emily: when you say way less frothy, what does that mean when it comes to valuation? are valuations going down? justin: for series b and c stage companies, they have come down. they require more business-model validation. they have all been exposed as having weaker business fundamentals than people assumed they could get to.
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three years ago, there was a race to catch as much market share as possible. now people are being much more conservative about making sure that people a want to address -- that people want to invest in real businesses. emily: i want to talk about snapchat. we are seeing growth slowed down. facebook copying a lot of what snapchat does. what's your prognosis on snap? justin: as a broadcast platform, they are hurting a lot, compared to instagram. i think instagram, by cloning the stories feature, really took a lot of the wind out of their sails. it's very -- i see more and more influencers moving to instagram as a broadcast platform. as a chatting platform, snapchat remains pretty dominant among
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young users. emily: will that continue? justin: there's a very strong network effect. you can't just migrate to instagram or other platforms if all your friends are talking there. influencers will go wherever users are. whoever is courting them. instagram has done a much better job caring about influencers. snapchat is trying to play catch-up now. they just released a feature where you can get verified as a snapchatter. previously, they had never even considered -- i remember asking about getting verified and they were like, there's no way to do it. i think instagram has been a lot friendlier to influencers. we will see if that strategy works out well. i think they want a lot of the market share in the influencer market. emily: justin kan, ceo of atrium, thank you so much for stopping by. coming up, it's been a busy week in the electric car world. just when will we ditch the gas pump entirely? that's next. this is bloomberg. ♪ emily: this week is electric
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least 12 electric vehicles by 2025. it's looking to cut nearly $2.5 billion in component spending to help finance its shift to electric cars. daimler trucks is trying to gain a foothold in the nascent electric truck market. it is supplying a number of fuso to severalof trucks new york city nonprofits to make the city streets cleaner and quieter. joining me to discuss, the managing director of deloit's future mobility unit. thank you so much for joining us. let's talk first about the costs. margins on cars are typically, what, like 5%. will electric cars improve that? >> good afternoon, emily. thanks for having me. the question about will elect or vacation improve the margins --
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electrification improve the margins. we are at the next ordinary time in electric mobility -- we are at an extraordinary time in electric mobility. this is one of the trends driving the emergence of the future of mobility. equally important are things like shared mobility, autonomy. electrification is coming. at the end of this transformation, we are looking at the opportunity where we can move faster, cheaper, safer, cleaner, in ways that are more convenient and tailored to us. the net of it is that probably the overall costs will come down. today, just to give you one example in the u.s., we move 3.5 trillion miles for roughly $2 trillion of income generated by the extended automotive industry. in the future, that number will probably come down. emily: i spoke to tim cook, ceo of apple, a few months ago about his view on cars. he sees three big shifts, right hailing, self driving, and electric vehicles.
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take a listen to what he had to say. >> there is a major disruption looming there. not only for self driving cars, but also the electrification piece. if you've driven an all electric car, it's actually a marvelous experience. it's a marvelous experience not to stop at the filling station or gas station, whatever you want to call it. emily: could electric cars be the first of those big see -- big sea changes to hit the industry? scott: the three elements actually come together. we are already moving along very quickly in shared mobility with the rise of ride hailing services. electrification is probably next, and then autonomy. when you look at the convergence of all three, the way that this
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is going to play out is that, in urban areas, we will probably have fleets of shared av's that are electric. one of the things that people don't talk about is that, for autonomy to really work, having complete electrification of the vehicle and complete drive by wiring connectivity is far better than an internal gas combustion engine with the parts. electrification enables autonomy and autonomy accelerates the adoption of electrification. emily: we will have to leave it there. thank you so much for stopping by. we will be watching for the sea change. that does it for this edition of "bloomberg technology." you can see bloomberg's unprecedented access to the alibaba group during our special program friday at 5:30 p.m. in new york. this is bloomberg. ♪
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