♪ from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. ta-nehihassee coats -- is here with a book of essays written during the obama era. his first essay called "the first white president" was featured in this year's "atlantic monthly". he has won many awards including the macarthur genius grant. the new york times calls him the preeminent journalist of his generation.

i am pleased to have him at this table. >> the basic idea of it was to take the essays/articles i had written during the obama years and put them together into one single volume and say, this is what i wrote, i hope you enjoyed it. oldas i went and read the essays and work that i did during the. , i begun to see the possibility of a new book emerging, one of like a memoir interlaced between the actual as is i had written. so i picked a few of them and i wrote a story with the linkage being the thought process that went into each piece, where i was and my life. charlie: a great thing to do. good negro regarding government, the first years, how we lost the white man, 30-year, why do so few blacks studied the

civil war, and fourth year, the study of malcolm x, 50-year, the and in they, and eighth year, my president was like and then the epilogue -- the first white president. is there one year that for you more than the others? coates: for me personally, i think it would be the civil war one. i had a great gig, i have a great take. baracking the years when obama was the president i was in a privileged position to observe and right pretty much as i wanted to write . -- i had the power to observe and write pretty much however i wanted to write. a significant part of that time frame was spent studying the civil war.

the other thing that happened to reveal obama years were the centennial of the civil war, and i spent a good time reading about that and studying the conflict, terrifying something for me about american history. charlie: was it primarily the impact of slavery? more than thats: it was the fact that we lost so much life in the struggle to actually abolish slavery in this country. when we went into that timeframe, it was still respectable to say, and to some extent it still is, that the war was not about slavery, the academic consensus had long ago decided that. before south carolina pulled down the confederate flag, it was still possible in the minds of some to divorce those two things. clear, we lostt about 800,000 americans, more americans than in any war, and

all of the wars that we fought combined, and it was over the thet to expand and protect enslavement of 4 million african-americans. i think that fact exert huge weight, even today on american society. therefore, the idea of the monuments was something that you looked on as coming on too soon? ta-nahesi coates: definitely. nothing that i would add is that it feels to many people that the idea of taking off these monuments of robert e lee is coming out of nowhere, but african-americans have been fighting these battles since the statues went up. thing, it is a very old a depressive statement that the city like new orleans where you have a city that literally says -- this was erected in preservation of white supremacy, there can be no real debate about what that statute is. that you have to have armed guards there when you are bringing it down, it says much

about our society today. charlie: do you think the idea of the white supremacy was a factor in the 2016 election? ta-nahesi coates: i do. as i said in the essay, i do not think it is a mistake that donald trump began his political career in worth a resume, that the idea -- the political career -- his political , that our first african-american president was illegitimate. he began his political career in birtherism, calling him the food stamp president. it is connected to the congressman for south carolina who stood up and yelled -- you president obama was talking. i think it is all links together. an article inrote

the atlantic about the case for reparations. where are we on that? has anything changed? ta-nahesi coates: that some things have changed. for instance, a number of the universities, opportunities and ivy league universities, there have been some for that but now they are doing research on their past and their linkages to enslavement in this country. whether you are harvard, yell, georgetown. yale -- there is a movement to embrace that history and do something about it, whatever one might think of the effort to rid i do not claim effort -- mont might think of their effort to do that. charlie: it is the legacy of slavery you believe, that most informs the sense of the relationship between locks and whites in america. ta-nahesi coates: i think

without slavery, they would have no political purchase, the blacks would not. obviously, one of the cases that i make all through the book is the labels of race are always tied to politics and issues of power. i am black and obviously when i go there, they see me as when i open my mouth, that is not the predominant identity that i have. charlie: is it an intellectual identity? >> it is an american identity. charlie: so that is how they see you? ta-nahesi coates: that is it. it is the bottom line, as soon as i start talking. they had their issues with racism but it is when black people, and much more with cases of the north african people, they actually have history with it. i am not that representative of a friend to them.

they regard me as american when i talk to them. .- of the french they have a long history of african-american authors going do not occupycks that place in french history. black coming from senegal for example, the relationship would be different. you and i have talked about this before, you want to be the first rank of what intellectuals without qualifying or describing it. i consideroates: myself a writer and reporter, that is how i was trained, as a journalist and as a reporter, to go out on the street and talk to people, research and write. that is the job that i do. i am having of it provokes thought, i hate the word "intellectual", -- >> the same idea, i have friends of mine in the military for

ample who are -- for example who are african-american and based at the wanted to be the best general, and not the best african-american general. i do not want to be just the best african-american -- i want to be the best person. my influenceses: are voted very much and being black, like all other black writers, i pulled from all sorts of literature. charlie: barack obama. does he have a different attitude about what america than you do? ta-nahesi coates: probably, yes. by his: he was raised mother who was white, he knew why people but he did not view them harshly. >> no, you did not. point,: but you make the -- -- >> i make the point -- it is not

new in african-american history to have a white family, but he had a waste family that embraced him as a black person. it was not a problem that she had a white family that embraced he had a white family that embraced him as a black person. -- he was notl made to feel any type of way, any type of negative way about the fact of being black. his family and, many ways was the conduit to the african-american experience, the culture, the politics. give mother and father taking him to just clubs. that is a very different thing. i have not been encountered stories like that. i have encountered stories of black people with a white parent that not one in which the white family is that loving. >> and wanted to make sure that he was understood and appreciated how to be black and being black. >> yes, and that is different. charlie: the believe in a sense that it restrained him in some

way, because his experience have been different, he did not want to be talking about race all the time? >> i think most black people do not want to be talking about race all the time. i have my own curiosities that i would love to talk about that sitting here with you right now -- >> that you wrote the book. ta-nahesi coates: yes, i did write the book. i think he spent a lot of time talking and thinking about race, but the difference with him, i think is that when white people family, like your you said, when you go to iowa and you see people who remind you of your grandparents, that is a positive thing. it signals acceptance to you, it is a very different relationship. charlie: did he change over the eight years? i do not know,s: i did not really start interacting with him until about 2011-2012. >> three years and to the presidency?

>> yes. what i know, from his own ,estimony, and talking to him he and office probably underestimated the kind of opposition he was going to face. --y thought >> was that because he was black? ta-nahesi coates: was opposition because he was black? that was part of it, but it is more complicated than that. it was not just that he was a black president, it was because he was a representative of the democratic party that the vast majority of black people are represented by. people often say, bill clinton also got a lot of resistance. but parties represent people. if you go to the south today, the republican party is virtually entirely a white party at the local level. so barack obama was not just a black politician, it was whose interests he represented and whose interests they represented.

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♪ charlie: did you grow, did you change over the eight years, and having to change? ta-nahesi coates: i did not believe in reparations when i started. charlie: did you learn that from all of the civil war readings? the 1200 that you read on the civil war? ta-nahesi coates: [laughter] here is the thing.

in terms of an ambassador, barack obama was the best that we had, -- >> ambassador from whom to whom? ta-nahesi coates: from black america to the rest of the country. he was like a character out of the brady bunch or something. iraq, -- a black ivy league lawyer, a beautiful, attractive wife who was also an ivy league lawyer, beautiful children, a -- named bo >> it is what hollywood would have done if they made a movie. >> exactly. and then to see donald trump show this guy to actually show off his birth certificate, you saw that any set -- something deep is going on here. that is what spurred me on to my research, it probably radicalized me a little bit. pretty i am a

standard-issue liberal, i was at the beginning. i did not really believe in race-conscious policy. i think all politics -- >> do you think politics -- >> i do not think you can talk about one without the other in america. they may not spell it out that way but if you get down to rest tax -- if you get down to brass tacks, you are talking about that kind of policy. for example when you talk about ocean security and medicare, you are talking about a certain type of people, you are not necessarily speaking to an identity, not to 25-year-old, that is not who you are making a pitch to. across theering board, i do not think politics can get away from that.

>> has seen the president obama time after time in conversations here in new york that i saw, talk about notwithstanding the between-- the conflict -- with police, notwithstanding what happened at charlottesville, notwithstanding all of that, i have seen the president say time after time, we have made huge progress. ta-nahesi coates: we have made some progress, i would agree. -- toe: he seems to make think that we have made more progress than he believed. there is a fundamental sense of almost despair -- >> i disagree. i do not despair. charlie: so you are optimistic? >> i do not like thinking in those terms. i think like a journalist. by which i mean, -- >> but you are more than a journalist? >> i do not feel like that.

charlie: it is not just me, a lot of people who admire you think that you are more than a journalist. ta-nahesi coates: but the work that i do every day, i research and are right, it is the work of journalism. >> so the idea of "public-intellectual" has no appeal to you? >> no, it is like some dude stroking his chin. that is not what i do. it is foreign to have to think that way, as journalists, i think. my editors never ask me that. that is a real downer, no one ever says that to me, in the editorial process and evil never said it to me -- >> let me posit this in a different way. you look at the election of president trump in many ways as a rejection of what happened in the previous eight years. ta-nahesi coates: i do. i do see that.

charlie: because? >> because i do not think you could have donald trump without the reaction to barack obama. i guess, i just go back to the fact of how donald trump got his campaign -- began his campaign. issue?: the birther ta-nahesi coates: yes exactly. charlie: talking about the judge who was mexican? ta-nahesi coates: exactly. i do not think that was accidental and i do not think president trump would be president without that. charlie: i am trying to stay away from optimism and pessimism because i over to you. when you look at what the country has gone through, the kinds of things that have happened in the last eight months, the presidency of donald trump, what do you think the challenges are, where are we?

your colleagues like david brooks constantly write about this, what were the cultural and economic factors that were at play in the 2016 election? ta-nahesi coates: obviously i have taken aside the notion that race was very important, and i would argue that it was in fact essential -- >> you say more important than economics or they are tied together? ta-nahesi coates: i do not think they can be disentangled from each other, often times when you talk about race you are talking about economics and vice versa. i do not doubt for instance that there are people who are very angry about the fact that we had economic collapse and no one was held accountable for that. certain number of people a certain way in the polls, into the voting booths, i do not doubt that when folks heard that hillary clinton took speeches from wall street and was paid and x number of

dollars. making: barack obama is speeches for wall street. does that disappoint you? ta-nahesi coates: yes, very much so. charlie: were you surprised? ta-nahesi coates: [laughter] i am disappointed. i wish he didn't, i wish he did not. i think it sets a bad example. -- the contrary to how of twice is good that he used to conduct himself as president and during the campaign, i think again for those people who watched and economic collapse and saw very few people punished, to see someone turn around and give beaches, i do not care if you're giving the money away to charity or not, the fact that people can purchase access to you in that way which was built off of public trust with here is what i have issue with that. they purchase access --

>> charlie dent fact that barack a speech come and make to these people and make a point that he wants to make, i do not think he is doing it to please these peopl, i do not think that is the point they're making, to please these people. no one is writing the speech for them. ta-nahesi coates: i do not think it is quid pro quo, i give you money and you say what i would like to hear. whoink it is a matter of you surround yourself with, and who you are around and that becomes normal to you. there are a lot of suffering americans out there who do not have the ability to purchase an audience with you like that. so i think you have to be really he shouldt think never give paid speeches.

he was paid quite a good deal for his book -- clinton, obama, bill they get huge contracts for the book that they write. >> i think that is fine, i have no problems with that at all. charlie: he lives and a million-dollar home that millions of americans cannot afford. but the problem you have is that he is paid money to give a speech to wall street? ta-nahesi coates: yes, i agree to that. charlie: you have said that when you look at your own growth over the last eight years, you have become more radical. how would you define your radicalism? ta-nahesi coates: i did not understand -- my basic thoughts about policy in this country, stronger social safety net, the desire for people to have some , that did their work not change.

charlie: that does not sound radical to me. yes, that dides: not change. i did not consider what supremacy -- white supremacy as essential to american his every -- american history. charlie: how do you think the route of that? ta-nahesi coates: i think it is the work of generations. i actually do not know how we grow out of that. charlie: how do you think we grow out of that. ta-nahesi coates: i think the first step would be to take it seriously and i do not think we are doing that. i think when you have a president of the united states who is objecting to a statue of a general who kidnapped that people out of the north, like he is not taking it seriously, you are not being serious. the fact that we are still having debates about that. when you get to the blue sky question it is tough to get there because we are still down here, on the ground level,

arguing about things that should be obvious. charlie: you have called president obama a conservative revolutionary? >> yes, i have. charlie: meaning what, he was not revolutionary enough? or was it his style? ta-nahesi coates: it means that he was revolutionary in the sense that he was the first black president but i think he believes an institution, he is as the limits -- he is establishment terrarian. charlie: you say that this book was written in the first eight years of the first president, the first year is called the good negro government. let us talk about that. ta-nahesi coates: it is taken from a declaration made by the named thomas miller in 1895. in the. of reconstruction.

he spoke to a number of blackators who had been people and had been in fact an slaved and in 1895 he was at the south carolina constitutional convention and they are effectively disenfranchising blacks and taking the rights away from them in the state of carolina and he could not understand why they would do this. and in our time, we basically reconstructed the entire state. in response to that, that lead me to boys -- the writer dubois said that he made an error, that he was making an argument for a good negro argument. this thing that white people feared was not a negro government but a good negro government. charlie: didn't barack obama put a lot of racism --

>> yes, and i think that was a lot of the problem. the lightes, he put to racism because he was so supremely talented -- >> when i was talking about barack obama being a great ambassador, the idea of looking like something out of the brady bunch, it was to counter the idea of what that people are, encountered the stereotype -- it countered the stereotype. the stereotype of black people at the root of the belief system behind the actual policies of white supremacy. i think that influence a lot of -- >> you are saying that these people, if they had looked at barack obama in a way that measured their own expectation, they would not have had the need to rebel against him? ta-nahesi coates: there is a long history of it. if you look at the history of lynchings and race riots and

this country, often the places that are attacked or middle-class, "well-to-do" areas. because they stand in violation of the very idea of white supremacy, they offend the hierarchy. and barack obama was very much in the same -- >> offending the hierarchy? as many people said, he gave evidence of the idea that my child could be president. there are other people on the side of that equation who also take evidence of something else. and i think that explains a lot about the way our politics is right now. charlie: what was the expression the arkn luther king -- bent towards justice? do you believe that? ta-nahesi coates: no. it is chaos. chaos means that you do not know, it could be that, i hope for good but you just do not know. judgment, whatr

are the core values of the country that you think have served as so well? -- have served us so well? i do not know,s: i like individual freedom, i like that. i like the idea that someone like me, if we were talking off-camera about being in france, and i was very aware when i was there that my story would not be possible there, not to -- not for some grander huge reason, the society, all of a sudden individualism made the way for someone like me to be a college dropout and be able to myance my way -- finesse way. it taught me to think and that way, there is a different way of looking at the world. i have not examined in a society's to make comparison.

charlie: people have talked about this, that there were people who voted for trump were not white supremacists, because they did not like the other candidate, because they did not -- they saw him as the "lesser evil." that may be 18-20% of the people might be considered -- and the other 85 might be people of a different political philosophy? >> i would put that number of little bit higher. i would put it around 40% of the people who support donald trump or white supremacist? >> no, but that they hold some kind of phobic relief, the least i believem, towards the lgbt community. let us take the argument that it was only a 15%, the other 85% had no problem electing someone

who at the very least, at the activated actively -- white supremacy, began his campaign in white supremacy to become president. if you are black, that is very scary. it should be scary for us all, even in the most conservative reading of it. charlie: are you fearful of the future of the country? would you be offended if i asked you that? ta-nahesi coates: i am not fearful about that. i am fearful about day-to-day events, on north korea, i am scared. charlie: because it demands a rational -- >> it does not help that we do not have that. charlie: do you think donald trump is evil? ta-nahesi coates: i do not use words like that. i think he is dangerous.

i think he is really, really dangerous. i obviously did not vote for president trump. "welie: the book is called were eight years in power, an american tragedy." we'll be right back. ♪

♪ charlie: laura ingraham is the

most listened to woman on the country in medical radio. -- in political radio. t she has a new show called "he ingraham angle". she also has a new book called "luminaires at the barricade, the populist revolution from -- to trump". why did you want to write about the populist revolution? laura a ingraham: election night was very enjoyable for me to watch because of this column thes, the dour looks projection of gloom and doom on the global scale predicted after , thatent trump won america would become this protectionist force, none of that happened. the economy is booming globally, the forecast for 2018 is very

strong except for maybe russia and great britain. i wanted to write a book and take people on this journey to go back all the way to next in talk about this alleged majority, through the ascendancy of ronald reagan -- talk about this silent majority, from the ascendancy of donald reagan all the way to george w. bush who said he would have a humble foreign policy, even obama who had some populist zeal. >> does it more about economics or culture? >> i think it depends on the times that i think the focus right now is on the american it'll class, the american were -- the american middle class, the american worker. 2005-today,of about the middle class has not really seen their wages go up. to have become despondent and began to think of the system is working against them than before the -- than for them. i come from a working-class background, my mother was a wait list until she was 74 -- was a

waitress until she was 74 and i carry her's. . -- i carry her spirit. dartmouth,u went to uva law school, a clerk at the supreme court -- >> i never forgot where i came from, charlie. never. that working-class sentiment made me hungry and it connected me to what was happening in projects -- in politics. >> so you say they are someone who respects that working-class sentiment, you think that populism is who you are? i think it is who i am. civic pride and civic virtue is under assault. charlie: but you are not -- for eight years under

clinton, eight years of obama, there were a lot of things i disagreed with. it is ok, republicans did not have their act together and i never sat for the pledge or never kneel for the national anthem because there are certain things that hold us together, the glue the society that i do not think we should trash. president trump equal american populism in 2017? we have seen him govern, he has shown his colors. i do not think we're going to see anything new. >> the reason that i use billionaires to barricade -- the reason i use billionaire, for him the barricade is something very big to clear. just getting elected was a monumental feat, he beat the media, many corporations, a lot of the big ceos are not want him to be president and yet he won

the electoral college. he has work to do on the popular vote that was a stunning feat. charlie: you say this is the story of donald trump, but it is also the story of those who supported reagan, and where they are. theld reagan led conservative movement, donald trump leave something else which is populism. where do they overlap, where are the separate? i think goingam: back to 1976, it was a shock that donald -- that ronald reagan almost won the gop nomination. they called him a disruptor to the status quo, an actor who writeothing, who did not his own speeches, and i worked in the reagan administration. people act now like everybody was embracing reagan, the media -- we did not have the apparatus that we have now, we do not have cable news for the most work but

they ridiculed him. for most of his presidency, but what he tapped into was this sentiment for people in the south who for years thought the democratic party was working for the little guy. that is why they had trolley, -- they had -- the house of 19 50'statives from the all the way to 1974, the democrats had a hold on the. as it was written in the atlantic in october, they lost the contest. he captured it. charlie: so donald trump, is he inheritor, a true populist who recognized that those like him, who believed in the same values, donald trump, a very smart celebrity and successful businessman whose on opportunity and grabbed it? >> i think going back to his early remarks about trade, and

immigration, he had those two issues in the palm of his hand he had a lot of democrat friends and donated to a lot of them. but i think when he came to run for the presidency, he saw that there was a double vacuum, within the republican party, with the exception of rick santorum and huckabee, the blue collar republicans, and buchanan. buchanan did not have the individual wealth to take that message -- >> a lot of people look at buchanan's campaign and say that that is where it all began. absolutely. charlie: the ideas against big business? the isolationist aspect, it was also buchanan. laura a ingraham: let me talk about the isolationism thing, many of the many of the right dismissed trump. they say that he is anti-immigrant, that he is

isolationist. think about what he did, his first foreign trip, he goes and visits them visits that house -- the countries that have the three major religions. he wished out to muslims, the vatican, and to israel. jared kushner point that trip together, and everyone said, oh, you are betting out more than you can test your biting off more than you can chew. that is someone who understands that america cannot carry the load by itself. it needs allies, it needs to be respectful, but i thought that in the trip, he did not get a lot of credit for it. charlie: he did get credit for it, i agree with you that there were a lot of things that happened on that trip, but when he went to the g20, he raised questions are not including article five when he started talking about where the united states would be if there was an attack. laura a ingraham: yes, he

denigrated our lectureship with nato. charlie: angela merkel said after the trip that we have to start looking after ourselves. laura a ingraham: when you listen to his speech at the u.n., he talked about the fact that all of the leaders there worked for the benefit of their people, with or france, -- >> he said that you should be acting in your own self-interest. laura a ingraham: china is doing that. i do not agree with your tactics, but they want the chinese people to be the dominant people globally, not just in the hemisphere. their economic and military power, they want to dominate and you have to admire that. trump said that we have to do that, if we are a weak power economically, we are not going to be a great ally to everyone else. american people are saying -- my wages have not gone up in 20 years, and need help.

i think that when he talks about sovereignty, he is talking about freedom. charlie: you saw what happened in the alabama senate race. did you support that? >> i do not know the new lenses of every race, that that should've been a wake-up call to the establishment. charlie: the big wake-up call was the loss of the primary. laura a ingraham: i was involved with up to rick i did not know who he was, but my friend is a filmmaker and it talked about it in the book, he told me that i have to look at this. he has a working-class spirit, economicsegree from -- and economics degrees, and i had him on my radio show. ifbarometer is very simple, you are a republican and afraid to come in my radio show, you're probably going to have a difficult time convincing me

that you will contact to the average working person -- connect to the average working person. so he comes on and he starts talking about we have to work for the american people, we have to be for the little guy, otherwise you are just for big operations and for a bit government. that is not how we were raised under the principles of reagan. ,nd i said, he is interesting so i decided to go down to a country club a week before the primary,. he said i do not want to speak at a country club. that is against my message. he said about you to come and club.at cantor's country i said ok let me go. -- packed 700 people in this open area, hanging from the rafters and saying laura, you have to help dave. and i thought it was wild. then, he said we had to park

some of the cars in the overflow parking outside eric cantor's house. then i got the call a week later. charlie: where did trump and populism meet? i think when you look back at his -- >> was it about immigration? laura a ingraham: it was not only about immigration. it was about the working-class, he told them that they are not forgotten that government should work for you. charlie: what do you think that government -- >> i was covering the rise of ukip, and nigel farage, and i think that is should've woken the elite to what was happening in the hinterlands. these evil are good people who want the best for their country and few and far in between politicians were speaking to them. so trump came along and said these republicans keep cycling the same policies and the voters

were saying no, we do not want open borders. deal,re going to do trade let them be trade deals that actually work for us. charlie: what do you think of corker deciding not to run for reelection? laura a ingraham: if the elites really have the best path forward for the republican party, -- >> why is he an elite and donald trump not one? laura a ingraham: it is a sensibility, not how much money you have. charlie: i am talking about how you live your life. laura a ingraham: i am talking about being a rich person, if you have the spirit of the working class and understand that a lot of these policies helped to -- the industrialized these states. charlie: how long have you known donald trump? >> about 15 years.

charlie: was he thinking about running for president then? laura a ingraham: when he first mentioned it, i rolled my eyes, i always had an image of him and i said oh, he will just talk about himself the entire tee time. 1.5 hours, iut realize he had not said anything about him elf. charlie: he asked questions? laura a ingraham: yes, how do you make money in the radio business, how many minutes do local stations get, and by the end of it, i look to my friend and that -- he has not talked about himself at all! and he said, we need a car, to desk to go somewhere. id i said, take my car -- needed a car. and he said, take my car. they will take you wherever you need to go. he was really nice and very

curious about my life. he had a sense of curiosity about my mother, my ringing, -- my upbringing, my father. he asked me how i became what i am today. charlie: what was your answer to that question? laura a ingraham: i think it was my mother. she worked her tail off, she grew up in the depression, she lost her mother at age 14, and she believed that america the greatest country in the face of the earth as her parents came here from holland. in the middle of its own struggle to keep his --fromdence -- from: paul poland. she always reminded me never to forget where i came in. told me, i would've loved to go to college and she told me to make it matter.

i was the editor of the i remember thew, election night party in 1984 at the hanover inn where i was editor of the review and all of the professors are on the of that looking in and we were on the inside where a married and band ofmary --a merry political revolutionaries -- >> tell me more. >> i kept watching the mclaughlin group, and i sitting with a friend of mine said, i think i could do that. and i was told that there was a new network getting started. people, cbs many also called me at the same time, and i was working for both networks at the same time is on.

i did not know where i was going at cbs, i didn't think i was very good that i met a lot of interesting people on the way. it has been a wild ride. awesome, iuntry is get teared up every sunday when i go to mass, i thank god for what i have and i ask him to give me wisdom and humility as i go forward. i had adopted three came -- >> did he answer your prayers? >> yes, sometimes, if i do the right thing. kids, onethese three from guatemala, and two from russia, and i want them to have a country that is free and prosperous as the one that gave me all of these opportunities. i know that it sounds hokey but that is what i want. maria is three and the boys are 11 months and 12 months when i adopted them. three.a was >> so you are going to fox, and

hannity's top slot. laura a ingraham: yes. i'm trying to be like you. you work all day. like,taff by the way is he is doing this and this. and my friends says you can do the morning show and a nighttime tv show, no problem, if rose can pull it off. [laughter] charlie: what happened to the legislative program of donald trump? is that a failure of donald trump? >> i think he made mistakes and he has learned his lesson. he made the mistake of diluting his message to capitol hill. he needed to get more into the weeds a little bit on health care. , theobably thought republicans have voted for the seventh time to repeal obamacare -- but who would've thought the republicans seven years later would say oh, it is too hard.

charlie: where do you think he is on north korea? laura a ingraham: that is a tricky one. north korea has been a disaster and i think he rightly says that we presided over the rise of a potential nuclear north korea. madeleine albright was there and tried something, bill clinton was hopeful, george w. bush, barack obama, none of that works. so what is new, what is next? the war of words with kim jong-il, that is not something i would do. charlie: is it good cop, bad cop? ofause as you know, a lot national security people look at that and say, that is not really the way to go. laura a ingraham: again, i would say to the national security act -- a lot of them are the ones who wrote the policies that led to the rise of a potential north korea. i get it.

charlie: you do not see it as a when someone like senator corker says that he may be taking us to the path of world war iii? laura a ingraham: i would say that we are at this is because all of the establishment politicians from both parties, not just democrats, i think both parties have culpability here. donald trump comes along and says we are going to do things differently on north korea, middle east, trade, immigration, tax reform -- he will have some wins and some losses. goodtopping leaks, getting people confirmed, having some allies on capitol hill, he has a lot of barricades to clear and we will he how he does. the jury is out. charlie: will the wall be built? laura a ingraham: i think he has to build the wall. as it is not billed, he is finished. the structure has to be there -- if the wall is not built, he is finished.

that is the cornerstone of his campaign, and it represents a break of that she represents a point of faith with the voters. charlie: a billionaire at the barricades, the populist revolution from reagan to trump ngraham thank you for joining us. thank you. we'll see you all next time. ♪ is this a phone?

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♪ kong comem. in hong alive from bloomberg's asia headquarters. welcome to "daybreak asia." wall street gains set to extend oilhe asia-pacific spirit also on the rise. clashes with the army and kurdish forces -- from bloomberg's global headquarters, it is just past 7:00 p.m. on monday. there may be a new favorite to have the fed. plus