choose by the gig or unlimited. xfinity mobile. a new kind of network designed to save you money. call, visit, or go to xfinitymobile.com. ♪ announcer: from our studios in new york city, this is "charlie rose." , theie: jeff is here executive producer of 60 minutes. this year marks the 50th anniversary of the broadcast. the show was created in 1968. jeff has written a new book about the history of the legendary program. it is called 50 years of 60 minutes, the inside story of television's most influential broadcast. here is a look at 60 minutes over the past 50 years. ticking] ♪

>> good evening. this is 60 minutes. >> where did it come from? >> it is a magazine for television. >> what? i don't want to do 60 minutes. >> get right over here. >> stop the interview for a minute. >> i am scarpelli with 60 minutes. -- scott pelley with 60 minutes. >> i want to ask you about the tweeting. >> you are not popular in the country. >> i don't care what they say. >> i should probably not say it on tv. >> mr. president, they are not happy with the way you are doing your job. why is it taking so long? ♪ >> right here across the bridge you can see the black flacco vices. >> this is what you can expect -- the black flag of isis. >> this is what you can expect?

>> yes. >> i'm going to jail for that? >> only the bad ones go to jail. >> only the stupid ones go to jail. ♪ >> hamilton certainly change my life. ♪ >> oh. >> want to talk about sex? >> it is not 60 swinging minutes. >> whoa. ♪ >> how did you get around that? >> that is a good question. >> you have no problem asking that question. >> come on. >> come on. >> come on.

>> how do do that? >> what is the answer? >> 60 minutes. >> i am mike wallace. >> i am diane sawyer. >> i am steve kroft. >> i am leslie stahl. >> i am katie couric. >> i am charlie rose. >> i am anderson cooper. >> i am oprah winfrey. >> tonight, 50 years of 60 minutes. lock ticking] charlie: i am pleased to have jeff fager back at this table. 50 years. chronicle of our times. how did you write the book? jeff: the most important was a list of the stories. any loyalgive it to

viewer and they would recognize stories. there are 5000 of them. from amazing help fabulous producer, daughter of bob simon, knows the broadcast well, and work closely with me on a chronology. it was about memories, the hope this can be a book for journalism students. all the different things we do, all of the practices and values that we adhere to for all these years, i tried to get that in there, so it is a blueprint for part of our success. charlie: talk about the birth of 60 minutes. jeff: it was hard to get it off the ground. it took several years to sell it. charlie: the idea was? jeff: life magazine for television, a magazine that high and low. an interview in the same

broadcast as an interview with a movie star. charlie: the way edward r murrow would do migrant workers and movie stars. jeff: that incredible mix and variety that makes it so special. everybody is a generalist. steve does it. jeff: you have to have the ability to do every kind of story. everybody does it in a slightly different way with different strengths they bring to the table, but he could not sell it. he got into this position because he was fired. i don't think a lot of people realize that. he had been at cbs news for 15 job in thebest place, the executive producer of cbs evening news with walter cronkite. you're talking about 17 million viewers a night. it was huge.

youlie: that was where wanted to become a correspondent for the cbs evening news. jeff: that was the highest place you could be. he was fired. they were partners. they were the founding fathers really. n watched them and learn from them, but they were not that interested in television come and tell they had to be. charlie: they came out of radio, rhodes scholars. edward r murrow had a symbol to all these people during the war. that is how the organization was born. it was born and given these values. the practices, storytelling, how we will tell our stories, in narrow ways, all the things i write about in the book that don

taught us. why the time fred friendly became president, the big job, walter cronkite, he said i don't want him there. he is too much of a showman. charlie: he admired him. jeff: he looked up to them like news gods. he really did. charlie: he was a broadway producer. jeff: he was, but he called them gentlemen correspondence. he looked up to them so much. it was a shock because he had been the director of the next and-kennedy debate. charlie: when he was 37 years old. -- nixon-kennedy debate. jeff: he had been a pioneer of television. the idea that he rose to that level at cbs news and got fired, it was a shock. charlie: it is said that fred friendly called him and and said, we are going to promote you to your own documentary

unit. he called his wife and said, i just got promoted. she said, it you just got fired. jeff: he didn't like documentaries. he called them hour-long snoozers because he was bored by them. he had a short attention span. i think he was right. that is how he came up with this idea. he could do shorter stories, three documentaries, cut them down to 15 minutes and put them into one hour. after fred friendly left the came in,ion, dick great president for 17 years, and was reluctant. he had said no to it in a previous iteration as president before, but word has it that someone said to him, friendly did not like this idea. you might want to do it. he said, ok and gave it the

go-ahead. charlie: harry reasoner was signed on. >> harry reid's there, and all anchor,thought just one but a couple of people suggested mike wallace should join. -- harry reasoner, and all of them thought just one anchor, but a couple of people suggested mike wallace should join. charlie: how did they differ? jeff: in terms of their personalities as journalists, mike, it was all about the interview, as you know, charlie. place been in a prominent on a new york talk show where he perfected that. charlie: night beat. jeff: tough questions, the famous parody is someone's wedding. -- someone sweating. i think sid caesar did it. that sort of direct approach. don who had a vision for the

broadcast and was a great editor and writer, people don't realize this about him. he would fix our copy and help us with lines. he had an amazing eye for a story. that mix of the two of them i think, it just had an imprint on that broadcast that lasted, and i think it's a huge part of the success come up that it did not take off until seven years in. charlie: morley safer came in after harry reasoner. jeff: harry decided to go to abc. don thought kuralt, charlie kuralt, would be the right person. he was a consummate storyteller. needed stature from cbs news who could tell the story and be a counter, the white hat to mike's black hat. charlie kuralt said no. charlie: he worked with walter

calm cry. -- with walter calm cried. -- walter cronkite. jeff: he had famously covered the war in vietnam brilliantly and got in trouble for it with the white house. the line lyndon johnston used because morley safer had captured soldiers lighting huts on fire. village they burned the to save it. jeff: the line he is, what is he some kind of communist? get him fired. they wanted to fire him. charlie: what makes mike wallace's interview so compelling. >> you don't trust the media. you don't trust whites. you don't trust jews. jeff: he said it best here on your program, -- charlie: i think i have it here

somewhere. jeff: it is so instructional in terms of how do you get the truth out of people. charlie: with good research, you can embarrass anybody. >> you can do it. if you are really after is illumination of an interviewee's character, qualities, substance, if you are really after that, you can ask questions, sensible questions, to get them to talk. you can establish what you do so well, a chemistry of confidentiality. that is what comes across at the -- which you come you dirty dog, have done with me in the past.

why? you get to people who know a little bit about the same subject. if the interviewee has respect for the interviewer and feels the interviewer is well-prepared , you can ask anything and you will find the interviewee will be a co-conspirator with you. charlie: and that is what wallace does. jeff: he said that that night. charlie: at this table. i treasure it. and because he was a hero of mine. hen i came to "60 minutes," wrote me a handwritten note. jeff: he was so happy when you join. this is the mature mike wallace. this is the mike wallace out there doing it who was ambushing people in the 1970's and early 1980's and became ashamed of that. he really perfected it and became the best interviewer that broadcast journalism had known.

he recognized that. i think he grew from all of those years of going in that direction as morley safer called it, mike jumping out of a closet. he teased everybody. he was a rascal full-time, full-time rascal. he was that way on our floor. charlie: how did he get along with morley safer? jeff: that was a tough relationship. is he was shocked because mike wallace stole a couple of his stories right out from under him, and morley safer is coming from london. well, that is not "60 minutes." welcome to my program. in a way, that helped us because morley safer was driven to find his own path. he had such a great way with words. he was able to come up with

these interviews, whimsical adventures. >> arthur miller's play death of a salesman, once in my life he said i would like to own something out right before it is broken. i am always in a race to the trunk yard. i just paid for the car and it is on its last leg. they time those things so that when you finally paid for them, they are used up. the trouble really is that nothing these days is built to last. a motor car best represents the fact that we have most of our lives in a junk society. know, is set against company rules. -- no, it is against company rules. >> do you like that one? jeff: he did that with his partner over many years, his producer.

i think that is an important genre for us, and became that. that is part of the mix, a regular part of the mix. charlie: it took that long to do what, build an audience, find a home? jeff: to find a home. >> how can you tell? >> just on the technical factors. >> a judgment call? >> no, sir. jeff: dan rather joined at that point which was important because you have an ensemble of reporters. that first broadcast in december 1975 at 7:00 on sunday, they had been off the air all fall. it was the beginning of the modern "60 minutes." charlie: part of the successes the mix? jeff: i think so. charlie: you don't want three investigative reports. but if there are three

important news stories ready to go and are perishable, we would put all three on. about that,ngly that the mix is not the most important thing. covering what is important is the most important thing, but if you have the chance and the ability to have a little of everything for everybody, i think it is the most viable. it gives you a chance to lighten up a little bit. the world is not such a bad place. we will give you a story that is inspirational and help you understand the world. charlie: scott had a terrific piece about a young conductor. jeff: it was brilliant. she was amazing. ♪ >> wonderful.

you just made that up before our allies. it is not written down. will it never be played again? >> i can't remember everything. jeff: talking about taking you away, a 12-year-old girl that has that ability. some extraordinary powers that no one can explain. ♪

♪ charlie: next in line was at bradley.

>> most people in this country think you are the face. >> they do. i am just being me. >> what was your reaction? else iink like everyone thought it was a tragic event. jeff: ed had so much. we missed him also much. they each brought something unique. , i loved him when he would fill in for the evening worked at it,he but he was like walter that way. he had that kind of god-given credibility. he had amazing ability. he really could do an interview. one of the things he talked about that i think made so much of what he did special is that he would wait it out. it out. just wait

i don't have to rush in and fill the void if there is silence in this interview. charlie: let silence speak. jeff: let that come out. he would sit and wait for that to come out. bob dylan is a great example. he sat there with bob dylan and got yeah, maybe. >> just like that? >> yeah. >> where did it come from? >> it just came. charlie: eventually the silence will work for you. the interviewee will feel compelled. jeff: eventually there is a relationship that builds, and it is tween the two of you. forget about all the other people watching. ed did that brilliantly. it was a shock when we lost them. it was as it was with bob simon, just a shock, stunning development, and we -- i will never forget that weekend that , and then lost bob, both of them in their 60's. charlie: cancer and leukemia.

jeff: leukemia that rose up, and after he had an diagnosed, and within three weeks coming he was gone. it absolutely attacked his system. everything, aer tribute to him, over a four-day period was therapeutic because you hear his boys coming out of every edit room. charlie: buffett loved him and came back. jeff: what's the line he is with lena horne? charlie: people always say what is your best interview. i would tell them the story of ed bradley, who told the story about going to heaven and being stopped, white do you deserve to be here? he said to god, have you seen my lena horne interview? jeff: a great interview. pe,i am a rich, ready, right

juicy plum. jeff: where you say that where you say that again? >> you can help your sexual nature. that is what that line means. charlie: he showed a side of her that the audience didn't know. jeff: part of that is what we hope to do. i did not know that. i learned something. i got something out of that. i gave him this time. thank god they gave me something back. a lot of that is the time it goes into it, the amount of reporting. isost everything we do investigative because we spend so much time, even on a profile, digging into somebody and determining what is interesting. charlie: what makes them tick. jeff: yeah, and what the audience finds interesting. that surprises you. charlie: 60 minutes is more of a

collaboration than anything i have ever seen. jeff: yes, it is. charlie: from the moment you focus in on the story, the process, producer and associate producer to again and decide what limits are possible. jeff: that is a huge part of the success. people on theen air, it is a high-quality individual that gets to 60 minutes. we have been able to maintain that. when you get there, you realize you have made it to a place that is special, and you have to perform, you have to deliver, and people feel that pressure every time they go out on a story, but it is a collaborative effort. when there is a good collaboration, a correspondent and produce a work very well together, it shows. you can tell. you see it. there is a higher quality story. charlie: and when you come back in the editor understands the story. jeff: the videotape editor is a producer as well in many ways.

they are looking for how to best tell the story. , there are several levels of collaboration before it gets on air, and sometimes that can be painstaking. the screening,is which we have talked about before, the producer, correspondent, and editor have put together something and say, look, here is a beginning cut. jeff: yes. charlie: you and your colleagues that there an offer what is essentially a storytellers craft of being able to look at something and say, it works better this way. jeff: i think that process we go , which canat ritual be painful, but also fulfilling, is part of why a story that gets on "60 minutes" looks like it belongs there, which i hope the viewer takes for granted. they come in and tune in every sunday night expecting something. charlie: expecting quality. jeff: and we have to deliver.

charlie: yet. -- yeah. responsibility, diligence, and care helps to deliver stories that belong there. charlie: anybody come to you and say, i don't like this. this is not for me. i am out of here? be a burnoutan factor, the intensity can get to people. it is an intense place. it is an adult shop. you are not supervising people. you arrived at "60 minutes." we know you will bring back a quality story. our job, my job as executive producer comest to help you be better at it from if i can, to do whatever i can to help you tell that story and report it. we will talk to the process, if they want to come and need to, otherwise that is one of the great beauties of being there. people love working there because they are adults. charlie: there are not a lot of

meetings are memos. i don't like memos. jeff: i don't either. it is a reporter's place. we had don, mike, harry had gone to abc, came back to cbs, had morley come in, dan come in, was it diane next? jeff: when diane left is when steve came. charlie: he came in for a couple of years. jeff: she went to abc. that is when steve came in. that was a huge development as well. >> how long do think this will take? people hopeush and to have their power in january, maybe february. jeff: talk about a pillar of the broadcast, 30 years. he and i joined together. charlie: you were his producer for a while. jeff: i produced his first story for "60 minutes."

that was a good experience. we were really nervous about that. at least i was. steve was confident. mike wallace -- charlie: another magazine show on cbs. jeff: mike wallace came to our screening. charlie: he has no reason to be there. jeff: it never happens. you don't find correspondence to come to screenings, but he wanted make sure we are good enough. it scared the hell out of me. they gave us a round of applause. it was because they were relieved. charlie: that you did not screw it up? jeff: that we had a story you could put on air. i learned so much from him just watching him. terribleter, i had a expense where we brought in a story about the berlin wall falling and poland shifting towards capitalism and we finished showing the piece, lights came on, and don said,

where do you want it, kid? right between the eyes? charlie: what came out of that was a better piece? jeff: absolutely. and that is how you learn. he showed us how to make that a better piece, and we were happy. they got on the air. charlie: leslie stahl was next. was understand the fbi running a staying on the bush-quell campaign? >> i don't know anything about that. jeff: another pillar of the broadcast. she was two years after steve. it is amazing. she came with more experience than anybody had. one of the things she brought come as they all have, was an amazing work ethic. people look at it and say how many stories is she doing. that requires a time. works atrespondent who

60 minutes does every single interview. travel, roadlot of time, and a lot of late nights trying to get a story together. charlie: that me catch up with your journey. born in massachusetts? jeff: yes. charlie: started in television there? jeff: 1977, graduated from college and got a job as a kid to help out basically. ended up in san francisco? jeff: got a job as a news writer in san francisco. charlie: when did you come to cbs? jeff: 1982. i was producing the 11:00 news at kpix and they needed someone who could produce a broadcast live. charlie: nightwatch was live for the first couple of years. jeff: it was. i was 27. it was an amazing entry into cbs

news. charlie: it became a cult favorite. jeff: when you took over. charlie: then you went to london. jeff: london was the best experience because of the variety of stories. it was hard, challenging, a great bureau, still is. charlie: pretty good place to live. jeff: it is. i was not there much. i was primarily cbs evening news. you are on the road most of the time. we had a couple of kids at the time, and i was gone 60% of the time. you cover just about everything imaginable. the level of expense for someone who had just turned 30 was remarkable. also, another adult job. i loved that about it. it was amazing. charlie: there for three years, then came back to "60 minutes"? jeff: 48 hours, and i was there for a year. my family stayed in london.

my wife did not want to come back to the u.s., so i did a lot of the first episodes and we added them in london. it was great, and amazing opportunity. how long had you been pointing at that thing? jeff: for me, it was a dream. i could not imagine what happened, but a year in i started talking to morley safer about a job and i had worked in steve croft in london for the evening news. hegot the job and boom, asked me if i wanted to come with him, and i sure did. charlie: how long before they ask you to go over? jeff: five years. i produced three years for morley, two years for steve, and iarned a ton from don so that thought i was at age 40 ready to be an editor myself. that was a great thing about "60 minutes" and my trajectory.

i had so much time out covering every kind of story. i think there aren't enough editors in the world who spend enough time out in the world to experience what it is that people go through when they are covering stories. i think that helped me a lot in running the evening news. charlie: dan rather was your anchor? jeff: yes, a wonderful experience. i loved working with him. charlie: then the idea of "60 minutes ii" came up? jeff: les moonves presented the idea to the correspondents. he had just inherited cbs as head of entertainment. he had nothing to work with. magazines were proliferating and he thought, why wouldn't we copied the best one, so he got them together and they were upset about it. charlie: they wanted no part. jeff: he said it was like arguing with mount rushmore. he had huge respect for mike and

morley and ed. charlie: and don? they thought it would be an imitation. jeff: they thought it would be watering it down. they got used to the idea it was going to happen and what be better off you you choose someone -- charlie: they rounded up some good correspondence. jeff: the compromise was i would run it. charlie: first you, confidence in you? news yeah, and the evening had gone well because i was using the traditional values. charlie: and your belief in hard news. jeff: and covering what is important. manylittle frills and not tabloid stories, so it started incredibly well. you're one of the first people i went to, charlie. charlie: i wanted to keep this show. jeff: he did not think i should hire you if you weren't willing

to show up. morley,nny because forget that. bring charlie in. charlie: thank you. take greatthings i pleasure in. would let the cigarettes burn until the end, all these marks, and you see pictures of his office. it's like someone threw 150 books on top of the desk. he was also a painter. jeff: really talented. the work he had done, he gave me so many pieces. charlie: including one with your head. jeff: my head on a platter. i was quoted at the start of "60 minutes ii" when someone asked

me if i expected to win the ratings. about iter had talked that sunday, but i quoted john the baptist saying it is ok to be number two. we all know who number one is, so morley came in the next they with my head on a platter, and under it said the punishment of saint john the baptist. charlie: dan rather, scott pelley, me, bob simon. jeff: that was it. it was a great team. charlie: we were there five years? jeff: six years. retires, whendon did you know you would succeed him? jeff: i did not think about it until two years before it happened. they started talking about the possibility. we were doing great and i was very happy and i did not think in my mind that, i thought don

would always be there. it became apparent that it was time for a change. he was getting on and they needed something fresh at some point, and i think most of the correspondence recognize that. about a year and a half before he retired, i knew. charlie: a year and a half before it happened? jeff: yeah. charlie: you know they say come you don't want to follow the guy who is the legend. you want to follow the guy who follows the legend. succeeded steve jobs and needed that kind of challenge. how did you meet the challenge? he knew you. it was not somebody plucked from another network. that would not have worked. jeff: i don't think so. everything we did at "60 minutes ii," all those correspondents

were working. they were all working there. for me, i was confident i would be able to do the job well. so much.rned from don i love what it was. i thought we could be newsy. we did. my job was really to show everybody i could help them make period, onees better story at a time. the person i was closest to, steve and morley and mike, and ed, but ed was the most nervous. charlie: about you? jeff: yes, and is this really going to work. it took two serious story collaborations to convince him, and once he was on board, he was great.

he was just great. charlie: what makes a great "60 minutes" segment? jeff: it's funny, we tend to judge ourselves -- charlie: story is a better word. jeff: we tend to judge ourselves by how good our investigations are. i'm not sure that's how a viewer judges us. this year, impact is a better way to put it, if you look at this season, the 50th, it has been an interesting mix of stories, beginning with your steve bannon interview. charlie: why do you do this interview? >> it is important to get the message out about president trump. charlie: never interviewed, everybody knew, but did not know, even more controversial in person than he was from a distance. jeff: he really surprised us. he came to play. talk about impact. i don't remember an interview with one person weather was so much talk. there were legs. ,eek after week after week

quotes from it in so many stories. charlie: the white house press secretary spent the entire day on monday answering questions about steve bannon. jeff: yes. the monday after you hope for that. i think impact. we have had so many stories in these past two months. the one that stands out to me is the story about the opioid crisis and the dea being hobbled in terms of not being a good crack down on illicit sales. that was a collaboration with the washington post, and talk about legs. that thing hit hard. it is those kinds of stories that we try for. everybody who works there wants that. charlie: in the news, relevant, an impact soave that the president of the united states is forced to respond. man whos, yes, and the has been appointed drugs are has

to's -- czar has to step out. one of the great things working at "60 minutes," you can do something totally different. the next are you had was the emi qatar. croft did this year. it was one of his favorite interviews. jeff: no matter how well you knew him and read every book, you got a feeling from him. you understood him. you had seen him through his words. now you saw him through his own voice. that is what "60 minutes" can do. jeff: three weeks later, steve is in puerto rico doing a story about the disaster there. >> when you say puerto rico is a colony of the united states, what do you mean? territory.colonial

we are possession of the united states. congress has full power over puerto rico. >> what is to stop the congress you saying, i'm sorry, but know we have california and florida and texas to take care of them and you are just a u.s. possession? >> what will happen is that fast majority of puerto ricans will catch a flight and moved to one of those states. jeff: another thing we try to do that we are proud of, to help our viewers better understand what they saw. that is another thing we try to do. there are stories that can have an impact on an individual viewer by helping them better understand the world, but then there are stores and have an impact on the greater good. ♪

♪ you can explain something to people that people don't know much about, but no it is important. artificial intelligence, immunotherapy, scott pelley went to duke. jeff: and you have done some artificial intelligence stories that have been important. charlie: this is looking at the front tier of science and where it is going and finding the people who are doing the things that will make the difference, win the nobel prizes, who will infection are you the way. jeff: some of those stories are complicated and difficult to tell on television.

that is a challenge and source of pride for us as well. world,s of the business the great crash of 2007 a year later, we did a story, steve kroft and --, credit default swaps. oh, my god. most people in the television news business would not go near that. >> these investment banks were not only selling securities that turned out to be terrible investments, they were selling insurance on them? to sell thet easier terrible investments if you could convince the buyer that not only were they going to get the investment, but insurance. when homeowners begin defaulting on mortgages and wall street's high risk mortgage backed securities begin to fail the big investment houses and insurance companies who sold the credit default swaps had not set aside the money they needed to paid off all the insurance contract they had written. that challenges us.

it goes against conventional wisdom of what is supposed to work on television. the viewer did get a much better sense of what created that horrible recession and crash and sent shockwaves through the financial world, and at the same had ayou know, really feel for it and the audience was huge. is one of the biggest audiences of the fall, so there is a hunger for it in america for that kind of reporting. charlie: what is the culture see everyle who sunday coming up, and you watch it at home because you want to be where the viewer is. jeff: i watch it every sunday at home. charlie: and don does the same thing? jeff: yeah. i don't like to be invited somewhere on sunday. it is just one of those things where i feel like you have to watch it, like everybody is watching it, even though i have seen the story so many times. charlie: can you define the

culture? jeff: of 60 minutes? can.i without sounding too hokey, i think everybody who works there thinks of it as a calling, that there is a responsibility, that you have an opportunity here to reach the biggest mass audience for a news program in america. charlie: how many? jeff: there were probably 13 million people watching, early october, 13-14,000,000, and that is about what we get this time of year. butoes up to 18 million, there is that drive to -- in our broadcast to do something really beand to better than last sunday. that is a big part of the culture too. i am so busy thinking about next sunday, i can barely remember what happened last sunday, which

is what made writing the book so interesting. charlie: you can look back. jeff: you can look back and see that you touched a lot of stories. charlie: a couple of things that you have done that make accessibility more easy. one is the "60 minutes" app and something called "60 minutes" over time. >> my model of businesses the beatles. they were for talented guys who kept each other's negative tendencies in check. they balanced each other. , the total was greater than the sum of the parts, and that is how i see business. great things in business are never done by one person. they are done by a team of people, and we have that here at pixar, and we have that at apple as well. that is what let's me do this. together,eatles were they did truly brilliant come innovative work, and when they split up, they did good work, but it was never the same.

i see business that way. it is always a team. charlie: we were all with producers who come together to write, producers often write a first draft, then you work on that, and then show it to you. i think this is what a great story editor does. we are trying to tell the story, and then you will say, your remarkable colleague bill oh owen will say, this is a story about a were you don't know about. it is the idea of asking yourself, how do i reach the viewer? i want to tell you a story about a war you may not even know about and a place you have probably never been, but is having huge consequences in the middle east and not lead to something that might lead to something horrible. jeff: so, what is also a big part of our culture is to tell a newspeak the way

reporters tell stories. i have a board in my office that has forbidden words, news speak, words only reporters use, and as an example, the word "clear," which is the most overused word in news television. you hear all the time. nothing is clear. we don't talk like reporters on tv think they are supposed to talk. charlie: we talk like storytellers. jeff: yes, we like to speak and write in the spoken word. it is easy to follow and so important that it is not overwritten and understated rather than overstated. we hate hype. i think the viewer feels that as they watch it, just easier to take in, and we always follow this principle that you can't go back and read that paragraph again. you better make that understandable, and that is part -- charlie: it is also for the ear,

not the eye. jeff: it is also for radio. that is not the driving force. we are on the radio as a simulcast because it works so well. charlie: has there been a more difficult time for "60 minutes" than the tobacco story? was that the biggest crisis? part of that happened here at this table. jeff: it did, and that is where interrupted. charlie: yes, it was. jeff: it was tough and difficult. it was cbs saying you can't run that story because the tobacco companies will sue us. he was the whistleblower, saying they understand nicotine is bad here it was addictive and the secret and everything in it would kill you, but they kept saying it wasn't. he came on to say it wasn't. they feared, and this to me is a little bit of sanity, a lot of sanity, that when the public health is at stake in terms of reporting, nothing is more

important, so how can a company sue us when we are trying to a publice truth about health hazard that is killing millions of people? and so it was the perfect "60 minutes" story, but when the company blocked it, and in the days of larry tisch, i don't know the exact reasons, but they owned a company that was part of it possibly. charlie: his company being the owner of cbs and the largest holder of stock and ceo. jeff: yes, so forbidden to put the story on the air, what are you going to do? i think adversity arises in a situation where everyone is working closely, and yet competing against each other, which is part of how the place is set up, it started to get tense. it did break out at this table was assuring you, charlie rose, and your viewers

that everything was on the up and up. ,e was a pure whistleblower when he had been paid a consulting fee on a previous story, not on the story in question at the moment. and, he had been promised by some kind of insurance protection from that, so morley .as so upset when he found out he wrote you a letter of apology. they say they never threatened to sue and they never had any contact with cbs, correct? >> as far as i know, they didn't. charlie: what indication is there that brian williamson would have sued cbs if they went forth with this interview? wouldn't they raise this with you? the lawyers, and to you and don -- >> we raised it with them. charlie: and they said?

>> they said this is our judgment. this is our judgment. as they our judgment have not threatened or contacted, but our judgment is they may sue or will sue? >> i am told it is a fairly litigious company. the tobacco companies generally speaking have been litigious. documentsdo is with that they do not want to put to public view, they will file or send all documents that are sensitive through their legal department or to their outside counsel, thereby invoking attorney-client privilege, am i wrong? >> 10 years ago, brown and williamson did collect a few million dollars from cbs which was in a libel suit coming out of chicago television. that was thes, largest libel judgment collected

against anybody. ofrlie: that was part one our two-part conversation with jeff fager, the gears of "60 minutes." two.row night, part ♪

♪ yousef: welcome to "best of bloomberg markets: middle east," i am yousef gamal el-din. and will fixes that as stock prices right and global demand estimates are cut your why are the views so different from opec's? airbus and boeing battle for supremacy. crackdownudi arabia continues to reverberate. but