♪ emily: we're bringing you over top interviews for this week in tech. an important stock on the zuckerberg apology tour. the facebook ceo steps that you toe parliament but decided testify in capitol hill. margaret a its operations in southeast asia to local rival. will talk about what uber gets in return. tumbles the most in two

years as questions swirled around a fatal accident. first you are lead. mark zuckerberg decided it is time to face the congressional music. the facebook ceo will appear before the u.s. house energy and commerce committee to answer on facebook's rule in the cambridge analytica data scandal. this according to a congressional official. familiar with the plans zuckerberg has been the subject of criticism from lawmakers on both sides of the aisle. he will not appear before a u.k. parliamentary committee. 's book with sarah frier who covers the social network for bloomberg on tuesday after the broke, as well as caroline hyde who joins us live from london with reaction from europe. >> zuckerberg has come to terms with the fact that he will do this. he said last week and find the right person to answer the questions i will do it but i have to be the right person. congress came back inside you are the right person. this is, we want to hear from you. zuckerberg have come to terms ofh that, and in fron tt

congress there will be so many questions that facebook cannot answer. a lot the questions of particular about where this data has gone that was shared with the party developers back before 2014. facebook really does not know. they will do some audits but they do not have currently the answers to know where are these 50 million user profiles now, when did cambridge analytica delete them. they relied on cambridge analytic telling them all of it was gone. until the reporting from the new and observer last week, we do not realize that was not the case. emily: what is the reaction in the u.k. were he said he will send his deputies instead? caroline: they can back fighting. the pay is investigating how big news might have been playing a role in the brexit vote. damien collins who heads up the

committee came back strongly to the news that in fact, the cto or cpo will come instead. he said it is absolutely astonishing that mark zuckerberg is not prepared to submit himself to questioning. urge him to think again if he has any care for people's that use his company services that people that uses company's services. mian letter damon collins wrote, he said a facebook senior executive who they hoped would b mark zuckerberg. the letter facebook sent back to him today for their among the longest serving executives and have extensive backgrounds and understanding. they are well paced to answer the committee. interestingly, there is also this statement from facebook. they say "the u.k. and eu should not really matter to you. we cannot confirm that around 1% of the global downloads of the

app that came from users in the eu, including the u.k." this is the one that was designed by aleksandr kogan passed on to cambridge analytic. a. users, 50 million facebook said hardly any air from the eu and u.k. which is why mark zuckerberg might feel he does not need to come in from of the parliament here. emily: facebook is getting at stocks in a row to lobby lawmakers. they are hiring for 11 different positions on capitol hill. talk to us about the extent of facebook's lobbying efforts as of now and how it compares to other tech companies. sarah: the first thing we have fundingis facebook spent on lobbying in d.c. is new companies that have been doing it for years. google's and microsoft's and apples of the world. facebook is pretty slow to join the party. in the past, they do not really relationship with

washington. they grow up and barack obama's presidency. now they are realizing they need to make nice and they need to figure out how to get in on hey comesues before t about and how to explain the product to congress, lawmakers. because a lot of them do not understand some of the fundamental ways it works like the fact that most ads are not purchased through him and salespeople, they are purchased through this automatic advertising system. these are all things that have become very clear in the last few months. i think just like the general public, congress has a lot they want to educate. emily: meantime, the controversy continues to swirl. we are learning new data and layers to the broader cambridge analytica story.there is a whistleblower who worked as a contractor at cambridge analytica who has basically brexit could have gone the other way if there had not been as he calls

it cheating, give us a little bit more background. learned -- cheating. give us a little more background on what we learned here. caroline: this is the pink haired christopher riley being a whistleblower. andame in front of the mp's said potentially, as you mentioned, the brexit vote could have gone differently is perhaps some of these related entities from cambridge analytica, this cambridge analytica disputes, the christopher wylie is saying entities analytica's were mixed up in the brexit vote and were paved a significant amount could have helped swing that.. he also sa -- swing that. he also says 50 million people could have been affected overall. notably, he talks about a company that peter tier is on the board of. he is on the board of facebook themselves. he could also be wrapped up in all of this. emily: that was sarah frier and

caroline hyde. as the fallout continues in the wake of the exploitation of data on millions of facebook users we caught up with former twitter ceo and asked him to weigh in on this controversy. >> one of the concerns i have questions i have is the impact it is going to have on the way people think about apis and access to data in the future. facebook had built up his platform approach that enables third parties to access this data and use them to interact with and engage with people on facebook and turn that off years ago. ther now sort of seeing consequences of that. i think it will have an impact on the way technology and company founders and ceos going forward think about how that data will be used. how they can dispose of the data. emily: how to facebook use data in a way that is different than the weight twitter handles data?

as i understand it, twitter is more protective of user data, though twitter has its own issues, which we can talk about. do you think facebook has beentoo permissive -- been to permissiveo and careless about user data? dick: not to be an apologist for what has been going on, but this platform was public. people knew what those apis were capable of. they have been long disabled. on facebook, there are lots and lots of personally identifiable information. that turns out to be particularly helpful to advertisers. toertisers want to be able demographically micro-target and twitter does not have a lot of that information. tojust go back a few years when i was running twitter, frequently that was thought of as a disadvantage.

twitter does not know it anything or enough about users so i cannot target my advertisements as accurately as i can on facebook. so there are two sides to this .oint o it is a real benefit to the platform of business in other areas it comes back on you. emily: we are seeing former facebookers increasingly speak out about facebook. brian acted tweeted #deletefac ebook. this is the guy who sold his company to facebook for $20 billion. do you think it will take off? you think it will have a significant impact on users' des platform?to use the dick: i'm sure they will be returning their ill-gotten gains any minute now. i do not think this is -- these things happen. they come up every now and then when there is a big news events

around these platforms. facebook is such an important part of a lot of people's lives, it may be the case that a certain number of people here in silicon valley inside the bubble will delete it. i do not think it will be a big movement. it is too important part of too many people's lives around the world. emily: is a disingenuous for people who made a lot of money on facebook to now -- dick: irony made a joke about that. emily: you think it is? dick: i think it is easier when you are not part of the company anymore to sort of sit back and b in cocktails. there people who are inside the company who do the right thing. tenet has been talking a lot about the issues. twitter is trying to deal with these issues in the platform. there are people i inside

the companies doing the right thing. i tend to not love it when people can sit on the sidelines and lob in criticisms to them. emily: mark zuckerberg said in an interview that tech should be regulated. not a question of if but how. do you think tech should be regulated? if so, how? dick: i think there probably will be regulations here. is seems like that tide heading in our direction. is incoming, if you will. the challenge, particularly around areas of technology, it areas ande frequently concepts and details that are difficult to understand, which makes them very susceptible to lobbying. there are lobbyists on all sides of this equation. finally, i worry that in most cases, the regulations start to fight the last war.

technology are is changing so quickly, they do not anticipate the next issue or challenge that is coming up. because these companies work -- they caused these companies work and maybe do not address what the companies and societies have to deal with next. emily: he also said version two of russian meddling is happening on the platform. he said it is probably happening on twitter as well. and facebook and twitter stay ahead of this?now that they know it has happened can they keep up? dick: it is an arms race. fishing and these other kinds of challenges were in the past. thursday actors now on the other side. when you have state actors within enormous amount of resources, it will be a battle keeping up with them and going after their new attack vectors. they will never attack the same way they attack in the past. it will track new and different tactics. keeping up will be a real challenge.

emily: some of my conversation there with former twitter ceo di ck costolo. google could owe oracle $8.8 billion for using java. they said it violated oracle's copyright. the case was first filed back in federald sent to a court in california to determine how much the alphabet unit should pay. google said it is considering all of the next steps in this case. coming up, apple announces a new lower cost ipads as it aims to go head-to-head with google's from book in the education market. details next. news, you like bloomberg check us out on the radio. listen on the bloomberg radio app, online, and on sirius xm. this is bloomberg. ♪

>> apple is about to go head-to-head with google and education. apple high neared it but has let languish in recent years. i and event in chicago tuesday, the tech giant unveils a new ipad that will square off with google's chrome book laptop as well as a new education service called schoolwork to compete with google's classroom software. when apple was founded decades ago, and for decades after that, it was really synonymous with creative users, internet users, but also education users. i remember growing up in school -macs but that language over the past years. market share indicated iphones andm ipads with had 17% were 60%.e had aac there was a problem in apple needed to address it. but they did was go back to an ipad they released last year, the $329, lower cost, 9.7 inch

ipad without bells and wa whistles of the front models for good enough for education. this year they are updating it with a faster processor. pencil and the apple a few other small bells and whistles with a camera and lcd and stuff and slapping a label of education by putting it in the new education market. to have new software, an updated version of their classroom and school work apps for students to submit their work, they have new curriculums to develop ar apps first with programming for students. a lot of new education software to go along with the education hardware. the bigger picture news is the push around it.nothing they announced today is novel or breakthrough new. thes they are refocusing renew marketing strategy around students, teachers, and general education. emily: mark gurman in chicago. thank you so much for bringing it all down.

want to continue this session wi. your column today, you are quite that apple may not be able to reverse its fortune in the market. why not? >> mark talked about the market share losses apple has had in the education market. mostly because of google. honestly, one of the wonderful stories in technology of the last five years is the way google has managed to sweep into u.s. schools and take over the computing market there. i think apple's weakness here, and they know this, they talked about it today, is the software. t big selling point ofh chromee books is not just the low-cost devices. it is the kind of ecosystem, a bundle of devices, plus all the software that kids, teachers, bothdministrators need to manage those devices and have kids email, write papers, get

assignments from teachers, and things like that. apple made some of those promises today, the question is can they deliver. a companyany -- can whose software history is checkered if you think about some of the failings of software like spy work, which got refreshed today, of icloud, of itunes, does apple have the software chops and the collaborative software chops to really go head-to-head with google in education? emily: apple was not first to market with a tablet or first to market with a smartphone, and then they came to dominate both markets. why couldn't something like that happen in education as well? shira: totally fair. it has been a seesaw market in education for decades, but apple had a turn as the market leader, microsoft had a turn, google more recently had a turn. apple can rebound from some of their earlier losses in the educational market. it is not possible. but again, there are some weaknesses there that google

exploited on the software side, and in kind of talking to teachers, using teachers as evangelists in the educational market, and if apple is focused on the education market i think they absolutely can rebound. i am just not sure they have the technical chops with a focus on education that they need to really make a go of it. sily: that was bloomberg's hira ovide. tesla. most in two years as investors question the company's ability and,ep up with demand driverless ambitions. that story is next. a reminder all episodes of bloomberg technology are live streaming on twitter. check us out at 5:00 p.m. in new york and 2:00 p.m. in sanford is no. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: waymo and jaguar are

teaming up on 20,000 autonomous car's. the deal integrates's of the best system -- integrates the system beginning this year. the suvs are set to become part service by 2020. october is investing $1.3 billion in the sector. the half forward for driverless cars is still unclear especially in the wake of two fatal crashes. one involving an ube autonomous car in arizona and anotherr just last friday involving a tesla model x in california. tesla's stocks tank off the news. the company said it is working to retrieve the vehicle's log the crashs. . the crash killed the driver of the car. we spoke with bloomberg businessweek. >> there was a very significant is saying itteslad

is the most imaginative ever seen to one of their model x suv's. the reason this is sort of a problem for tesla is that they productionhis huge sprint going on trying to get as thismodel three's produced year as possible. to the extent that they will not those numbers and you something with this that calls into question the company's long-term prospects, that can be sort of a toxic mess for a company like tesla. emily: combine all of that with the general news about production delays. how much does that really set tesla back? model thaterg has a is very impressive. we do not know how close it is. the model has been showing that tesla's production is likely renting up to the end of the quarter. is possible even though the numbers have not looked super comethat elon musk will

out and say we knocked it out of the ballpark. because they were able to do a last-second sprint. that said, this is more than a sprint. easily to get to hundreds of thousands of cars a year, which is something they have not done. no one has done with an electric car. so, investors are going to be reading the tea leaves but whatever happens the next quarter and will have to continue growing production on a huge scale for the for the coming year -- for the coming year basically. emily: we have a charger that maps real-time negative news sentiment hitting tesla. the red is negative, the green is positive. have been getting a lot of bad news lately so not surprising the way this chart looks. you know, what do you make of tesla's responsive the fact they even they said they have never seen a crash like this before? they're working with government agencies. that standard? -- is that standard?

standard? that max: they are trying to take .his seriouslymax: they also want to leave open the possibility that yes even though there may have been a very bad accident your, a very bad crash, maybe even one in which the car did not perform as they had their autopilot can still be better on average than a human behind the wheel. that was the argument made in the wake of the crash great last year, a person was tragically killed. generalit is the teno tension around economist driving in general is even people who believe in this industry know that there are going to be that things that are going to happen, and they just hope the number of those bad things is less than what happens today with humans behind the wheel. emily: i wonder though, we are hearing cooper will not be with will not review with license to test cars in

california. is this going to take a lot longer than some hoped to get self driving cars out on the road in a way that is surely safer than the roads today? max: 100%. that is why you see tesla's stock take this hit. elon musk said the cars on the road today could be self driving cars with updates and stuff. part of this bet on tesla is betting self driving will come an people think. that is how tesla will dominate the auto industry. if it takes longer, either because the tech is not there or because regulators cannot get their heads around it, and we as a society cannot sort of come to terms with whatever compromises have to be made, then that is going to slow this down in that is going to hurt the companies that are betting on it. max chafkin.as the trump administration zeroes in on high-tech industries in a push to rebalance global trade. which industries will be most

impacted? that is what the hell our coverage on the fallout from faced's data scandal -- facebook's data scandal. can the social network keep them on board? this is bloomberg. ♪

best: welcome back to the of bloomberg technology. i am emily chang. president trump is pushing to rebalance global trade in america's favorite. the global tech industry is preparing for a huge impact. white house adviser peter navarro said wednesday the trump administration's tariffs on china will focus on high-tech industries were beijing wants to lead. >> surely, the focus of the tariffs are on the china 2025 industries. china, in my view, brazenly has released the china 2025 plan and told the rest of the world we are going to dominate every single emerging industry in the

future and, therefore, your economies will not have any future. emily: we spoke with adam siegel of foreign relations wednesday as the story was still unfolding. adam: when they named a specific sectors that they will penalize, we will see a lot of people left out lobby to be of the terrace, and we will have a good sense of where you might fit on that supply chain and how you might be punished. again, whou knowo, do you think the winners and losers could be essentially? adam: well, they have been fairly clear that they want to punish china in high-tech, so in thing devices,f automation, robotics. the made in china 2025 plan is basically an attempt to move turn up the value chain from just labor-intensive production to internet-based 3-d design.if

you are in any of those areas , it is very possible you are going to be caught up in the tariffs. artificial intelligence, robotics, automation, those are areas i think would be likely targeted. emily: i wanted to ask you about ai specifically because there has been so much talk about how the chinese could win in the race for the most sophisticated artificial intelligence. tucked was us a little bit about how advanced china's efforts are there compared to the united states. adam: the chinese really have three advantages. the first is just the size of the data in the market. 750 chinese web users in that data. that is available to the big players by alibaba. ability to use that data.

chinese privacy concerns not as high as the u.s. as they are in europe. government strategy. a very big push from the top for china to be a competitor in this space. the chinese firms are not as competitive as u.s. firms. most of the important research is still being done in the u.s.. china lacks on the talent side but they are a fast competitor to the united states. emily: we do have a bit of breaking news. veterans affairs secretary david shulkin is being replaced by president trump. the president will nominate his personal physician, ronnie jackson, to succeed him. the turnover in the white house continues. it actually leads to a pretty. big question on these issues arriffs. given the uncertainty of who is

in these jobs, how do you think it will affect how policy plays out? adam: is certainly affected the chinese. they have been scribbling to figure out who they should talk to and negotiate with. t president has been pretty consistent about wanting reduce the -- to trade deficit with china, so i suspect no matter who is in the position right now, we will see consistency there. a quote fromshould peter navarro and he seems to a year,lly, after positioned himself to take the lead on these issues and what t, i thinkeports ou there'll be consistency and policy even if there is some more -- emily: the administration is considering trying to penalize or influence chinese investments in u.s. tec sectorsh. specifically semiconductors and 5g.

how do you expect that to play out? am: the president walked the broadcom acquisition of qualcomm. we have seen lea of documentsk -- weeks of documents by the government was thinking about nationalizing 5g networks. i think the reform will be of the committee on foreign investment in the united states. and there has been concern that some of the way that china has and acquiring technology either using minority positions are going after companies that are bankrupt are trying to buy an ip, i think that process will be reformed as a bill that has pretty broad bipartisan support. and that will make it harder for the chinese to invest in a number of critical technologies. el.ly: that was adam sega back to continued coverage on facebook's scandal. an analyst is warning of a

potential hall to some advertising campaigns on facebook. mark zuckerberg took out full-page ads in newspapers in the u.s. and the u.k. to apologize for facebook not doing enough to safeguard user data. is that going to be enough to keep advertisers happy? we spoke with debbie williamson monday. debbie: advertisers are thinking about a couple of important issues. the first one is what are users doing? book orng the #deleteface of a keeping their account for using facebook less? does that leave fewer hours of lessspent on facebook and room for my advertising? i think they are concerned about any sort of regulatory impact on the data that they have access, with regards to targeting advertising. if there were any sort of regulation that would involve

reducing their ability to target advertising, that would impact their ability to use facebook going forward. i think that is weighing on the minds of advertisers as well. emily: let's talk about what we are seeing with engagement. i have a chart here. this shows daily active users. how much of the concern is that? debbie: i think facebook does want to continue to see growth in daily active users. not only that, they want to see growth in engagement. not just people absentmindedly stroked scrolling through their and but interacting with talking to people, engaging with their friends and family. that is why you saw facebook a couple of months ago redo its algorithm to favor that content from friends and family.

they really need people to spend more active time on facebook, not just logging in once a day for was there.k emily: there are a lot of questions to how facebook would potentially evolve the way it uses data in order to target users, in order to target advertisers. i have another chart here. it shows the prices of ads have has actually slowed. thinkurious what you advertisers are going to do here. our advertisers going to wait this out? but they going to keep throwing money into facebook because it is still one of the best ways to reach a very specific user or are they going to leave? >> those are problems we're having right now with the subscriber base.

i can tell you preliminarily what we are seeing is that it is still one of the largest platforms around in order to reach a mass audience of people. a lot of major brand advertisers still want to reach a lot of people. that is one side of it. i think the targeting is another issue. to veryy, the ability precisely target people on facebook is something that once again, if there is any limitation to that going forward, that is going to give them some cause. those advertisers looking for branding goals, there is that massive reach. they will continue to use facebook and will continue to spend dollars there. it will watch what happens in the next coming weeks and months regarding usage. emily: always great to have you on the show. i want to continue to look at what this means for facebook with michael wolff, the ceo and founder of activate.

of mtvpresident and ceo networks. i am curious, speaking earlier about the power that facebook will have and the fact that crises like this, facebook has weathered before. how much of an impact will this actually have on facebook from a reputational and in this perspective -- business perspective? >> facebook is an and -- important part of campaigns today. it, if youk about segment advertisers, they look at branding. there are advertisers that use google and facebook for performance, to drive specific sales. apart from google and facebook, those are two of the most important ways in which

advertisers are driving sales online. to be int is going important part of what advertisers do, and it will continue to be. go ahead. emily: i want to ask you from a reputational perspective. users mighttrust, opt in to this, but even when they opt in or check a box, they do not understand how their data is being used. facebook is not done a good job about being clear about how the data is being used. will this and -- undermined trust? >> yes. there is a lot that facebook can do to reestablish that trust. it is more about control. this book needs to be explicit in allowing people to have control. facebook needs to be clear to its users what information they

have on them and how that information is being used. the last couple of days, there has been news that facebook has been using data from conversations on facebook messenger and calls for advertising targeting. facebook needs to make it clear to users how they are using their data. if users feel like they have control, they will not delete facebook. , sure the ai up that powers your facial app is great, but did you know it could be hiding in inherent bias? ♪

emily: twitter is banning ads for token sales on its site. they said we know that this content is often associated with fraud. came after facebook

dropped cryptocurrency adds in in february.ds artificial intelligence is supposed to make our lives easier. is that tech really colorblind and gender blind? a study by researchers at m.i.t. shows that the skin of darker women with unidentified 35% of the time. ai?do we un-bias un- do not know if we can bias, but we can mitigate the bias. ,he first thing we need to do what i am working on right now is to give people a guideline as to how and where a particular data set the years.

-- can be used. facialso it shows recognition software is far less accurate for women of color and for white men. that is sexist and racist. we looked at commercial systems. what they do is they look at a picture of a face and they tell you whether the picture in it is a man or a woman, male or female , binary classification. they do not handle any other types of identities. when we look at the accuracies and break them down by race and -- i do not even want to say race. race is not a well-defined thing. we looked at skin types. we looked at skin tone, which is a dermatologist approved way of looking at skin types. as the skintight gets darker and

this systemomen, approaches random chance. one of the ways in which we can mitigate this bias could be to setso gather more diverse and test our algorithms by different populations, instead of having one single member that says my algorithm have a at 90%.ar accuracy but when you break it down by subpopulation, you might see it works much better for some populations than other. emily: is this something that apple has a problem with? >> i'm not done a study of apple face id, but there was a highly publicized article of this chinese woman who said the face id did not work well on her. i am pretty sure this is a problem that happens across the

board. just face recognition, but other types of algorithms as well. what are the consequences of this on the broader scale, if we do not start we training these algorithms and we writing them to get new data to fix it? notne thing people do understand is that ai components are being used everywhere by everyone. they are being used in many manyrent places in high-stakes scenarios. if you look at face recognition algorithms, they are being used -- whotify what people people think are criminals and for surveillance. whether or not facial recognition to be used as surveillance is one debate people should have anyways. be used forere to surveillance, we have to make people understand that these faith recognition algorithms are

not accurate enough -- face recognition algorithms are not accurate enough. i think that anybody who is marginalized in this moment, in our society is at a higher risk of losing jobs because of ai. many lower paying jobs that are more easily amenable are being done by people from lower income, by people who have been historically marginalized. marginalized -- they are more likely to lose jobs. this weow much of cannot solve because it has only been done? >> i think a lot of issues of

bias could be mitigated by not only having more people who are communities,ized but also interacting with these people. it is not a coincidence that the two authors of the paper you were just describing on gender classification systems and showing how biased they are our black women. black women. emily: do you think companies like microsoft, facebook and google are doing enough to build diverse teams and try to make sure that the bias is not get rewritten over and over? >> no. i do not think companies are doing enough to build diverse teams. this is unilaterally across text companies. there is a lot more talking about diversity then there is action. there is some action, but it is

not a priority. up, uber exit south asia. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: samsung vice chair j wiley is visiting europe in his first business trip since getting out of jail. withng de facto chief met local business partners. they declined to say what he plans to do in europe. he departed on march 22, a day before an annual shareholders meeting, maybe seeking acquisitions. uber has agreed to sell its southeast operations to grab. birdsill fire all of the

-- uber's operations. will join the board of grab. >> the competition has definitely happened in china and southeast asia has required a lot of investment, and in some , there is a lot of waste in the process. the con celebration makes a lot of -- the consolidation makes a lot of sense. think the threat of what it dd is a goodwith

deal for both companies. emily: they got a huge investment from softbank. competitors, how must you think that is playing a role in the decisions being made about strategic partnerships? he is a very influential man. dd and uberke in and grab. perspective, obviously, this consolidation makes a lot of sense. he definitely have a hand in it. think that going beyond the ridesharing -- look at what is

happening in china. dd, despite consolidation will face competition. yet.ompetition is not over i think the consolidation is a step forward for grab and uber to have a strong goal of landing . emily: what would your message uber's ceo about india, latin america? are these markets that they should waive the white flag in? >> i do not know enough about these other markets to provide good advice. seeing in southeast asia is the ridesharing service is a very local business.

extend.it has to platform.o offer a that includes put the -- food delivery service. the bike sharing in jakarta, bike sharing can be a strong contender as well. you have to have this conference of service on the ground. ,hese other markets like india i do not know enough about them to make those comments. managing partner at bb&t capital. that does it for "bloomberg technology." tuesday -- tune in on tuesday.

tune in every day at 5:00 p.m. in new york. we are livestreaming on twitter. that is also now. this is bloomberg. ♪ ♪ retail.

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david: was a great leadership? >> all that. -- : david: invest about, you had michael jordan. we get a forger million dollars gift, do you write a check out? >> yes. david: well you say is the most favorable memory you have -- what would you say is the most favorable memory you have?