"all sites are green." all of which helps you do more than your customers thought possible. comcast business. beyond fast. david: now when you are the head of the imf, do people recognize you? christine: it is a lot of ego food, which i take and store for the hard days. david: how did you get to be the head of the entire firm? christine: it is often in those situations when a woman appears. david: so with synchronized swimming, you became a member of the national team of france. christine: i did european championship and many international events. david: did you experience a lot of discrimination? christine: when i interviewed with law firms, where i was told back in those days i would never make partnership because i was a woman. >> would you fix your tie please? david: well, people wouldn't recognize me if my tie was fixed, but ok. just leave it this way? all right.

i don't consider myself a journalist. and nobody else would consider myself a journalist. i began to take on the life of being an interviewer even though i have a day job of running a private equity firm. how do you define leadership? what is it that makes somebody tick? many people don't know what the imf actually is. christine: the international monetary fund was set up 75 years ago by 44 men who decided that -- david: no women? christine: there was no woman in those days. so 44 men in 1944 on the eve of the end of the second world war with a view to avoiding major economic crisis, major instability in the world, which in their view led to the war. so that is the intention. david: where do you get your money? christine: from all the membership. every member, 189 members, they

contribute to the financing of this common pot. david: it seems to be an informal understanding that the world bank would be headed by an american and the imf by a european. that has been the case ever since. am i correct? christine: i want to believe it will be headed by someone who has the competence to do the job. it is my observation it has been an american at the world bank. i think that is how they cut those arrangements in the early days at the time when the world looked a lot different. david: well, the world looks different today. for example, asia is much more significant, so do the people from china and japan say, what about us? christine: the emerging market economies are very interested in the institution, and china is interested as well. china has a representative on my management team. there is a managing director, as i am called, there is the first deputy managing director who is an american, and i have three deputy managing directors. one is chinese, one is brazilian

and one is japanese. so there is a lot of diversity on the management team. david: let's go back to how you actually came to this position. you grew up in france, i assume. christine: yes. david: and what did you -- what did your parents do? were they educators? were they in government? christine: they were both professors. my father was professor of english at a university. my mother was teaching french grammar, latin and ancient greek. so that is the universe that populated my childhood. a lot of literature. david: so when you are growing up with parents like that, i guess you are really good at languages? they make sure you know all those languages? christine: no, i was hopeless. i was really bad, actually. david: i doubt that. i assume you were a really good student. you were also interested in synchronized swimming at that time? can you explain what synchronized swimming really is and how you came to be on the national team of france?

christine: the athletic activities had to do with the riots that we had in france in 1968. students were taking to the streets. my parents were terrified that i would do that too. so they allowed me to go to the swimming pool of the club so i could skip school and spend all my time by the pool. and i enjoyed swimming at the time. and gradually you know, one day after the other, i became really interested in synchronized swimming. it brought together girls, so it is teamwork, that required music and a liking of music, and i had always liked music, and discipline and methods. so i joined the team at the time. david: so with synchronized swimming, you became a member of the national team of france. were you on the olympic team as well? christine: no, because it wasn't an olympic sport at that time. but i did european championship and many international events. david: do you still do swimming? christine: yes, including this morning.

david: wow, how do you have time for that? christine: i get up at 5:00. david: oh, that probably helps. [christine laughs] christine: the pool doesn't open until 6:00. i have to do a bit of gym before that. david: so let me go back. what did you study in college? christine: i had a very classic education. i studied, you know, the basic subjects i suppose everybody studies, which is french, math, english, geography, history, chemistry, and physics. plus some sports, which were not so important in those days in france. david: but very often, leaders in france go to certain schools. and they go to these great, prestigious schools. did you go to one of those schools? christine: no, i failed miserably. david: because? christine: because the first time, i was in love with somebody who was going to become my husband. and i did not study very hard. and the second year, i did study really hard with a group of others who studied equally hard. and i totally missed the date of

registration to actually take the various exams. david: so you became a lawyer though. and what propelled you to want to become a lawyer? christine: the death penalty. i wanted to participate in abolishing the death penalty. when i started law school, the death penalty was one of the tools of criminal law. and for personal, religious, and other reasons, i wanted to participate in eradicating this penalty in the legal arsenal of france. david: and well -- christine: and unfortunately, when i finished my law school, and when i graduated and could have joined the group, the death penalty had been abolished. david: all right, but you nonetheless stayed as a lawyer. and did you practice in france? christine: yes, i practiced in france for a few years. and i was doing, like so many young lawyers in those days, you had to do tax, you had to do corporate, you had to do antitrust, you had to do labor.

now luckily, the french president to be elected was mitterrand, a socialist. and that government came out with lots of very, very hard labor law rules to benefit the unions, and the workers, and all of that. baker mckenzie, most of our clients who are international corporates, are american companies that had invested in france. and i was really busy. david: were there many women lawyers in france in those days? christine: no. no, no, no. one of the reasons actually i joined baker mckenzie was because the managing partner of the paris office was a woman. and she was then a role model for me. david: now, for those who don't know, baker mckenzie was for many years one of the largest law firms in the world. christine: it was one of the largest, yes. christine: and it was based in chicago. so at some point, how did you get to be the head of the entire firm? you are a woman, it is a male firm more or less. it -- you are from france. it is a chicago-based american firm. so how did you get elected to be

the managing director of the entire firm and move to chicago? christine: again, i would love to think that it is pure merits and quality of the work i was doing. i think it's -- you know, it's interesting, actually. so i became managing partner in the paris office. and gradually i was doing a decent job. i was picked up by the nominating committee, who selected me to join the executive committee. i was the first woman to be on that, on the executive committee. then i went back to practice. happily. but they came back to get me. by that time, it was a mess. the i.t. budget was completely out of, out of order. the knowledge management system was a complete disaster. and management was not really trusted. so the nominating committee had a tough time selecting somebody. and it's often in those situations that a woman arises,

so i was selected as chairman of the firm. david: imf managing director position opens up. did you really want the job? christine: so many things in my life happened sort of out of the right timing, the right people, and my sense of, all right, let's try it, let's do it. ♪

david: ok, so you are the head of baker mckenzie. you are living in chicago. was it a far in situation? because you were really from france. christine: chicago was a fantastic city. i have lots of friends and still have many of them today. i truly enjoyed my six years in chicago. david: all right. so you were doing that, and all of a sudden nicolas sarkozy gets elected president of france. did you know him? christine: it was the year -- it was two years before that.

chirac was still the president, and the prime minister was in charge. and he's the one who called me. david: he called you to be minister of trade? christine: yeah. david: so he called you to be minister of trade, and you went back and served as minister of trade for a couple of years. christine: yeah. david: how did you like the job? christine: i loved it. i really loved it. it was a massive change in my life, geographically, socially, financially, as well. david: i assume the income was not the same as you had before? christine: it was like divided by 10, that's what it was. but i loved it because -- i think it was the job i most enjoyed in government. because i was selling france around the world. and i think president chirac, he knew that i was this strange animal coming out of private sector and private and corporate life. but i think he had a lot of respect for me, and i had a huge respect for him.

david: then sarkozy does get elected to be president of france. christine: and he asked me to be minister of agriculture, which i had no clue about. but i was prepared to learn. david: you did that for just a few months. christine: i did that for two months because then he asked me to become minister of finance. i think he asked me to become minister of agriculture because he knew that it was going to be a hot wto potato, and he wanted somebody who was acquainted with difficult international situations. david: you are promoted after two months. or you did such a bad job that after two months, they said give her another job. one of those two. probably you did such a good job. christine: it was a reshuffling caused by elections. david: were you the first woman to be a finance minister of a major company in western europe? christine: yes. yes. i was the first finance minister for a g7 country and of many countries, actually. david: so you are, were a lawyer by training. and all of a sudden, you are in charge of the finances for france. did you have any background? were you worried about not having that kind of background? or did your job before as minister of trade helped you?

christine: i think the whole background helped. but i recognized right from the get-go i was going to have to learn enormously and learn from the team, from the treasury department. i had to work very hard. david: ok, so you did a good job there by all accounts. then imf managing director position opens up. did you really want the job, or did you have to be persuaded to move back to the united states? christine: you know, so many things in my life happened out of, out of the right timing, the

"all right, let's try it, let's do it." you know, when i returned back to france as a minister, i had not thought for a second about my pension, my compensation, the reporting lines, how it would work out. i just wanted to do it, i just wanted to help the country. as finance minister, i don't think i anticipated at all that two months into the job, the beginning of the financial crisis would loom as a result of the closure of the two bnp accounts. you just roll your sleeves and work, and you team up with people who know what they are doing, and who have a good moral compass. i think it is a combination of all that. david: you have done a very good job at the imf by all accounts. one of the things you have to worry about is not just countries that are not doing that well and need some money, but the economy of the entire world. because your job is to help the promotion of stability and development, also employment. how do you think we are better prepared around the world for another financial collapse of the type we had 10 years ago? christine: no, i think we are better prepared. we are better prepared because at least in certain areas, we have learned the lessons. when you look at the banking system, when you look at the ring of supervisors, when you look at the set of regulations that apply, i think in that particular sector, we are much better prepared.

you know, the banks around the world, almost solid capital ratios, liquidity ratios, leverage. and on all those funds i think -- fronts i think we have made significant progress. there are areas, though, because risks sort of tend to travel to the fringe. and if you look at other areas, you know, asset management, pension funds, fintech developments, those are areas where i am not sure that we have the same, the same added security that we have developed in relation to the banking sector. now, there are other numbers that look much more worrying. when you look at debt, the weight of debt on corporate sovereign and household has gone up by virtue of the stimulus and the indebtedness that had to develop as response to the crisis. david: when the euro was created, it was thought by some at the time that it might become a reserve currency.

why has it not? christine: i think because the job is highly unfinished. it is very advanced, and the great financial crisis has moved the euro and its institutions in the direction of consolidating. you know, with a stronger backstop, with a stronger set of institutions, and with more unity amongst the 19 members of the euro area. but the job is not finished yet. the banking union is not yet completed. and there is still too much uncertainty in the fiscal policies that should be common to all, or at least should share the same objective. david: let's talk about brexit for a moment. when do you think that will be resolved? christine: i think we will know on march the 30th, 2019. because that's the cutoff date when either there is a brutal exit, which would be costly and detrimental to both the u.k.

particularly and the eu to a lesser degree, or there is an arrangement that deals with the period of transition into the new regime which can be a variation of free trade agreement between the u.k. and european union. that can go from the norwegian model, to the swiss model, to the canadian model, and it will have to respect one thing which is a big red line for many, the irish border. david: if great britain does get out of the eu, do you think it will deteriorate the european economy in a six if it didn't -- in a significant way? christine: i think it will be negative in all cases. the variability of net will depend on the brutality of the exit. the more brutal, the more negativities. and i think it will be in many circumstances more , severe for the u.k. than it will be for the rest of the european union. and within the european union, you have a few countries that would be more exposed than

others, those that deal frequently with the u.k. frequently such as ireland, probably belgium, probably the netherlands. david: so have you noticed that when there is a very difficult problem, the men don't want to do it, so they give it to a to -- to a woman to do? christine: you said it, not me. david: the prime minister of great britain is a woman, and none of the men seemed to want to take that job, because they know it is very difficult, no no-win situation. christine: they will probably come and take the job afterwards. david: yeah, probably the case. now, when you are the head of the imf, do people come up for selfies, do they bother you? do people recognize you? christine: they recognize me, they ask for selfies, and it is very nice. and it is a lot of ego food, which i take and store for the hard days. ♪

david: ok, let's talk about another part of the world, china. do you worry about chinese growth going down? do you have worries about chinese debt or not? christine: chinese growth has gone down regularly for the last 10 years or so. remember the days when it was at double-digit? it has gradually come down. every time it was moving from a 10 to a nine to an eight to a seven, there was trepidation. i heard so many times that china was going to collapse. it hasn't collapsed. it has certainly held a great deal of the global world economy at the time of the financial crisis. because it was certainly one of the first, if not the first, country to come out with a huge package of stimulus in order to kickstart the economy. so yes, it is heavily inducted, yes, they are trying to rein that in. but at the same time, it is a country that has a huge population, which has massive

transition issues to deal with, and where the necessary reduction of growth that we are seeing by virtue of the size of this economy now has to be monitored, has to be controlled in order to tame any risk of conflict. that is how i see it. david: and what about the tariffs? president trump has been talking about imposing tariffs, and has imposed tariffs against china and other parts of the world. do you think that is a plus for the global economy, or you think it is not? christine: i think that tariffs are not a good idea in general. if they impact trade to the point that trade no longer plays the key role as an engine for growth, what do we see in the last 30 years? we see trade growing faster than growth. so it has been a driving engine for growth. we see lots of people taken out of poverty. we see the cost of living in

advanced economies, including in the united states, lower by virtue of cheaper refrigerators, cheaper television sets, cheaper telephones and so on and so forth because they were made in countries where costs are much lower. so there have been huge benefits. not only benefits, but there have been huge benefits. and i don't think we can dispense of those benefits going forward. so my take on that is fix it, don't break it. because trade needs fixing. there is no question about it. i think that president trump has put the finger right where it hurts. there are issues about the trade rules and organizations that need to be addressed and dealt with. david: let me ask you this. you have spoken about the fact that women should be in corporate boards more than they have been. corporate boardrooms and ceo's, and do you think you have made a lot of progress? why do you think women should be more represented in these positions?

christine: i think there is a very clear economic case now that more women on the board, more women on the executive committees and management teams, actually generate better returns, better results, and better profits. so even if you have a very, very cold heart, no moral imperatives and no sympathy for women and for the principle of inclusion, even if you were that person, you have to consider including women and bringing them to the table and to all the tables. have we made progress? some, yes. and when i look at numbers, it tells me that we have made progress altogether. do we still have a long way to go? yes, as well. david: now did you experience a lot of discrimination because you were a woman as you were rising up in your career? do you feel you are still experiencing it today? christine: i did experience

discrimination. yeah, from, from the, you know, the first day when interviewed with law firms, where i was told back in those days that i would never make partnerships because i was a woman. or when i was regarded by japanese clients for instance in those days as a, as a woman who can serve coffee when i was actually a practicing attorney drafting contracts and negotiating for them. and there are still instances when, you know, i walk into a room full of men, and i can just tell that there is this little smile about their face which is either "here she goes again, she is going to talk about women" or "wonder what she has to say." it is less so the case, sure, but when you are in a minority, that is what you experiment. david: what is the greatest pleasure being the head of the imf? christine: working with the teams. david: and what is the worst part of it?

christine: having to sit through meetings which endlessly repeat the same things and end up nowhere. david: ok, well, at least you didn't say interviews that ask the same questions. you were nice enough not to say that, because i am sure you have been asked these questions before. but just before we wrap up, you have said you are going to finish your term here. when you do finish, you will still be relatively young, by most standards. so have you thought what you may do when you finish your term? christine: no. i will come and talk to you, david. david: ok. christine: you will give me some good advice. david: now, when you are the head of the imf and go to have lunch or breakfast in a restaurant in washington or other famous cities, do people ask for selfies, do they bother you, or can you go places without being bothered? christine: no. no. i'm -- david: people recognize you? christine: they recognize me. they ask for selfies. they are very -- most of the time, they are very, very nice and flattering and complimenting, and it is very nice. and it is a lot of ego food,

which i take and store for the hard days. david: any regrets about your career? christine: no, no regrets. like piaf would say. david: ok. well, thank you very much for taking the time with us. and thank you for the great job you are doing at the imf. christine: thank you, david. ♪ david: you produced some of the

most famous movies in american history. barry: first we failed. in order to figure stuff out, you are going to make a mess. david: you decide to leave. barry: i have certainly been successful. but none of this is mine. david: how did you gravitate towards the internet? barry: i saw screens being used for something else. it was interactive and it intrigued me. david: is that how it happened? barry: i know it sounds quite crackers, but that is what happened. david: people said barry diller, who has been -- barry: yeah, then people said i was crazy. >> would you fix your tie,

please? david: well, people wouldn't recognize me if my tie was fixed, but ok. just leave it this way. alright. ♪ david: i don't consider myself a so barry, you have had a very unusual career. let me try to explain this. many people -- barry: i wish somebody would. david: ok.

so many people have built media companies, and then sometimes they run them. and a few other people have built internet companies, and sometimes they run them. what was it about your abilities do you think to be able to do both? barry: probably a couple of things. one is curiosity. i probably am more curious than those people who have been on one side or the other. i am -- let me say, i am sloppily curious. and the other thing is, it is about editorship. i mean, i think that certainly in media businesses, which is where you are choosing from "i will do this or i won't do that" -- true editorship. david: you did very well in television, very well in movies. how did you gravitate towards the internet? barry: well, it started -- first of all, i don't really like repeating myself. i had been in the movie and television business for 20 years, kind of running multiple movie and television operations. and when i left, first of all, my biggest issue was i did not want to work for anyone anymore. because i had been a corporatist. i had always worked for a company. and i got to a point where i was 49 where i said, i really, you are either kind of are or you are not, and i want to be not having anyone's thumb on my neck.

also i wanted to see if i could create something that was really my own. david: another way to say this, or at least the way i would say it, and maybe i have had the same view myself, they can do this, why can't i do that? you didn't have that view? barry: no. because i never really -- i have always acted more out of more insecurity than security. and i probably didn't think the people -- i mean, i thought a lot of the people i worked for were idiots, but in the main, i certainly didn't think, in fact, i could do that. the question for me was, could i do that? david: let's go back through how your career unfolded before what you are doing today. so you grew up in beverly hills, and you went to college initially at ucla? barry: you know, it is a bit of a fake out. and i have never absolutely clarified it. i mean, i went to ucla for about three weeks. david: three weeks. what did your parents say when

you dropped out? barry: nothing more than they said before it, afterward, or during. my parents were the most laissez-faire of parents, and they did not really have a point of view, other than they assumed they would just support me for the rest of my life. david: so were your parents wealthy? barry: fairly, yes. david: so what did you do? barry: i hibernated for a while. i knew where my interest was pulling me. my interest was pulling me into entertainment. i had always been fascinated by it. there was obviously a lot around me. my parents, my best friends, and their parents were mostly in various forms of the entertainment business. so it was, it was the allure, but i had no clue how to get there. i mean, there are no starting jobs. i called my best friend's father, danny thomas, who was a famous comedian of the time, a

television star, and so i started at william morris in the mail room. david: what do you actually do in the mailroom? because i could never figure out how you start in the mailroom and you wind up being ceo. barry: i didn't do what most people do in the mail room. what most people do in the mailroom, they really, they want to make contacts. they want to network with people. they want to meet people. through that networking, if they impress people, they will probably get a job. or usually, people in the mailroom wanted to be agents. the last thing in the world i ever wanted to do was be an agent. i read the file room of william morris for almost three years, and essentially the history of the entertainment business from a-z. and that was, that was my school. david: how do you break out of the mailroom to get into a real job? barry: so what happened, serendipity. most of my career is a cross between serendipity and curiosity.

anyway, i had met a middle level executive at abc called leonard goldberg. he was a new york executive moving to los angeles to become the vice president of current programming, a very middle level job, but i thought he was really smart, and i really didn't have some yen for television, particularly. but you know, i was sparky, and i was interested. i knew i couldn't stay at william morris any longer. so he asked me to be his assistant. i said yes. the day that i left william morris and was going to start at abc, they fired the tsar of abc -- the czar of abc programming, and they reached out, and they picked my guy, leonard goldberg, to be head of programming. so i went from this little tiny thing, to moving to new york, to becoming the assistant of the

head of programming at abc, and within six months, i was running the program department. david: you're on your way. and eventually you became the president of abc television, is that right? barry: well, the entertainment part. david: entertainment part. and you invented something that was novel at the time called the movie of the week. >> abc presents the movie of the week. barry: we had the idea of saying, well, rather than buying mostly bad movies and putting on continually television series that tend to fail, why don't we see if we can make a movie every week? and we chose this 90-minute form rather than two hours. it was very ambitious. because it had not been done before. and everybody thought they would fail because that was not the diet of television at the time. and as most things, what everybody thinks is going to fail worked. it worked. david: so you are doing very well, and you are in your mid-30's, if that? barry: no, i am 30 -- i was just 32. david: you are 32, but you were pretending that you were 33 or

something, or 34. you wanted to exaggerate how old you are because you are so young, right? barry: no, i love being young. i hate being -- now i have gone from the youngest person in the room to the oldest person. david: i know this phenomenon. barry: it is a bad transition. david: believe me, i know it. barry: anyway, i was 32. david: you were 32 years old, you were getting a lot of attention and somebody said would you like to run paramount pictures? is that how it happened? barry: charlie, who i had gotten to know very early when i was a year or two at abc, he had just bought paramount at the time. paramount had been failing, which is why and how he had bought it. and he wanted to sell these movies to television, old movies from paramount's library, all of which were terrible, and i gave him a very hard time. he liked that. we got -- began a relationship. and some years later he offered -- he kept wanting me to come to paramount, and i didn't want to go. i didn't really want to leave abc particularly, but finally, he said "all right.

i am going to make you chairman and chief executive of paramount." i said, "charlie, i have no experience in the movie business. yes, we have made 75 movies for television, but are you -- you really want to make me chief executive?" he said, "yes." i said -- actually kind of reluctantly -- i went to leonard goldberg, the founder of abc, and i told him, i said -- i told him about this, and he said, "well, you have to go." i said "really?" and it's true, i know it sounds quite crackers, but that is what happened. david: and then you decide to leave. barry: i got to the point where i was 49 and i said, "i have certainly been successful, but none of this is mine." and i went to rupert, and i said "i want to be a principal." ♪

david: now, when you are running paramount, you produce some of the most famous movies in american history. barry: first we failed. because i actually believe that in order to figure stuff out, you are going to make a mess. david: what did you make a mess of? barry: we made a series of awful movies. but i was learning the movie business. we were in last place. and i was kind of on fumes at that time and saying to charlie, "you know, maybe this hasn't worked out." but we were -- in that two years we were laying really good development tracks for the future. when it turned, which it did in the third year of paramount, when we went literally from sixth to first place, it was a big, big dramatic turn. david: some of the ones that i remember were very big hits. "raiders of the lost ark." did you know that was going to be great from the beginning? barry: yes. it is rare that you really know from the beginning, but when --

if you read -- do you remember seeing "raiders of the lost ark?" david: of course. barry: you remember the opening scene when he goes to the tomb and then the big ball? david: i remember that. pretty famous. barry: ok, yeah. that was about 12 pages of the script. by the way, i finished that 12-page script saying, "if we can shoot this, this is going to be fantastic." of course, it is going to cost more than any movie ever made because of whatever, whatever. but that script -- rarely, it has happened 10 times maybe -- when you finish that script you say, "this is a smash." david: but you also did television production. i remember you had "cheers" was one of yours? "cheers," "happy days," "laverne and shirley." you were doing a great job. people are telling you you are great, and all of a sudden you left paramount to run 20th century fox. barry: yes.

and rupert murdoch came in. at the same time, i had already been interested in the idea of a fourth network. and so again, serendipitously, john, who owned a group of television stations called metromedia, he was passing through los angeles. and i said to rupert, "why don't we buy his television stations and start a fourth network?" and rupert, the greatest player, gambler, a strong instinct with nothing to back it up, but thinking this was a good idea said "yes." i said, "yes? it will cost $200 million." he said that's ok. and not more than an hour later, we should hands with john and -- shook hands with john and bought the television station. david: so, you were building the fourth network, and people thought you were crazy. but you did it. barry: the best position is for people to think you are crazy. i think it brings good luck.

barry: yes. i got to the point where i am 49, and i said "i have certainly been successful, but none of this is mine," and nothing is ever yours, but it wasn't. and i went to rupert and said, "i want to be a principal." and rupert did me the greatest good service. he said, "there is only one principal in this company. so, very nice that you want to be, but that is reality." i went away thinking, "oh my god, what a terrible thing, what a terrible, harsh thing to be told. now i have to actually either decide that i'm going to act on it or not," so i left. david: you had been successful with everything you touched. now you have to start your own business. and you don't know which one. barry: i was unsuccessful at each step of the way. it started very unsuccessfully, but worked out.

david: but in the end, each one worked out. barry: they worked out. david: so you decide you would change your life and become a principal, but you didn't know what you wanted to become principal of. barry: the things people wanted me to do, of course, was run a movie company, take a job -- chief executive job in this part of the industry, and all of that stuff had really no interest to me. david: so you started to buy some things. barry: my wife had gone to a place called qvc. david: your wife is diane von furstenberg? barry: she is a designer. she went to qvc because they had wanted her to sell clothing on qvc, and she said "you have to go and see what this thing is." it is the most amazing thing. so i go there, westchester, pennsylvania, and i see on a 10-foot square, 100-foot square stage the use of computers, and television sets, and telephones. and me, who only knew about screens being used for narrative, i saw screens being used for something else. they were -- it was interactive.

there was a computer screen that when, they offered a product, you would see -- the calls would be on this computer screen, seeing them rise and fall, and rise and fall, and rise and fall, and the whole thing was this very early kind of convergence. and again, my only thing about screens was storytelling, and here was another use of a screen, and it intrigued me. and then again, serendipity, i'm having lunch with ralph and brian robert. david: who own comcast. barry: who owned comcast, and they wanted me to do a production company. i was so bored with this lunch, i thought, "when is it going to over so i can go home?" and as you do in those situations, i don't want them talking anymore, trying to lure me into this thing. i said to ralph roberts, "tell me your story." he told me the story and in the story he tells me about how we started this thing called qvc. i said "stop. tell me more about qvc." he starts telling me more about qvc. i am drawing him out and drawing him out. and i said to him, "what are you

going to do with qvc?" he said, "well, the founder is going to retire." i said, "oh, really?" i said, "what is he going to do?" he said, "well, he is going to sell his" -- i said, "could i buy his interest?" ralph said "yes." i walked out of the four seasons hotel knowing what i was going to do. i went to qvc, took an interest in it. and that was three years -- again, a primitive convergence of computers and telephones, that was three years before the internet really started for normal folk. so it was luck and circumstance. david: at that point, people had said barry diller, who has been a big -- barry: yes, then, they said i was crazy. david: and he is the low rent -- barry: they were sure i was crazy. david: "low-rent qvc, where is he going?" barry: went to westchester, pennsylvania, "we will never hear about him again."

david: ok. so qvc, you had a stake in it. ultimately you grew it. so you started buying internet-related companies, things that sold things over the internet, ticketmaster or things like that, and you put them into a company called iac. did you know at the time each of these would probably work? barry: oh no, of course i didn't. by the way, many of them didn't. david: but the most successful of them is expedia? is that the biggest one? barry: expedia is probably the biggest. but you know, they, they range from livenation, ticketmaster, match.com. david: so you own this company and it has now become a very big public company, roughly $250 million was put into buy the company's initial that you started with, and today, it is worth $57 billion. barry: more or less. david: that is pretty good. barry: not bad. david: as i mentioned, your stock is up 80% this year. so how are you going to top that in the business world? you can't do much better than you have done. barry: i will find something else to fail at first. david: it prompted you to say if i did this, maybe i can do something else. barry: they came and said they were going to tear down the pier because it was falling apart.

and would i be interested in building a new pier? and i said, "what you are planning to do is boring. but if i could be ambitious about it, about maybe building an actual island in the park, if you are up to it, i am up for it." ♪

david: today the internet is still very much a part of our lives. what about television and motion pictures? do you think they will continue to be important parts of our lives? barry: i think the movie business is over as a really cultural institution of any great value.

the movie business is now about -- primarily, it is about making sequels and big, huge mega-movies that are more marketing things than anything else. so i think movies have very much receded. i think television, of course, as we all know, is having a great period because of the, the incredible optionality in television, and the craft. david: are you worried that four or five technology companies could control our culture and our lives so much, or are you not worried about that? barry: no, i am worried about that. i have always thought concentration, too much concentration is bad, and that goes against the consolidating principles, which are forcing consolidation everywhere and will continue to. and i think that is not a good thing, but --

david: you expect the movie companies and television companies will ultimately be bought by these technology companies -- barry: i'm not so sure they'll buy them. i think they'll actually supersede them. i mean, the thing is that the two companies that are really dominating right now are netflix, grown totally outside the infrastructure of the entertainment business, and amazon, whose business model is absolutely antithetical in a way to what the business model of entertainment has been, which is you put on a show and people like it, and the audience comes and they pay you. their business model is to sell subscriptions to prime, and as a subsidiary, they give you good stuff on the side. david: it has worked out pretty well. barry: yeah. david: you spend a lot of time on philanthropy. you are committed to the giving

pledge that warren buffett and bill gates developed, and you are one of the original signers of it. and one of your philanthropies in new york is something called highline. barry: what the highline was, was an elevated railroad track that had not been used for probably 50 years. so what we did -- it took 10 years, we created this elevated park. we thought the first year we would have 350,000, i think it was 350,000, people. 3 million came the first year, and last year 7 million. so it has been -- david: been very successful. barry: great thing. david: so it prompted you to say well, if i did this, maybe i can do something else. barry: even stupider. it happened this way. they came and said they were going to tear down a pier because it was falling apart, and would i be interested in building a new pier?

and i said, "well, not if it is a pier. what you are planning to do is boring, but if i could be ambitious about it, about maybe building an actual island in the park that is not shaped like a pier, if you are up for that, i am up for it." and of course we started with, you know, kind of a narrower vision. and like all crazy projects, it is, boom. david: all right, and people can go there and -- barry: yes, the idea is -- i love public art. the idea of making a public space i think is great. so it is a park for people. it is also a performance center. so we pull it off. it is almost like walking on the -- you get to it by two bridges, and walking through the bridge, you leave this city of concrete, mostly concrete and stir and all of this stuff, and you go to oz. david: what is it going to be called? barry: pier 55. david: not diller park. barry: no. david: you don't want that? barry: no. david: so today, if you were starting your career all over again, what area would you go into? barry: i have no idea. i mean, i think -- i have never really had a goal. i have never, i mean, i've never said, i want to be that. so me, it was whatever i was curious about.

david: one of the things i like to ask people about is leadership. what are you the skills you had as a leader? barry: probably the kind of, often blind willfulness. i think will and some energy to propel it, but the stronger the will, i think, the more -- that at least allows people to follow. david: if you were to say today, what you are most proud of what you have achieved with your life, what would you say? barry: probably, probably my marriage. david: ok. so you got married in 2001 to a very famous fashion designer. does she give you fashion advice in dressing you or not really? barry: take a look. no. david: well, i don't know -- [barry laughs] david: do you give her device on internet-related things? barry: no. i mean, her instincts transcend fashion, and so anything that comes up, her instincts are pretty damn good, and so i listen, and she occasionally listens to me.

david: ok, so you have a very happy life. barry: i'm so lucky. i say thank you. that is what i do all the time. david: congratulations for what you have achieved and thank you for your time. barry: a pleasure. ♪

david: when you were a young boy, did you say, i wanted to be chairman of the federal reserve board? alan: [laughter] david: you were called by many the maestro for being such a great maestro the economy? alan: i always got too much of the credit. david: you made your key decisions in the bathtub in the morning? alan: i was writing speeches in the bathtub. david: were you surprised at the criticism? alan: nobody forecast the 2008 crisis. david: do you see any movement to sol