♪ emily: i am emily chang in san francisco. this is bloomberg technology. on gm'st trump attacks plan to close plants and cut jobs. plus, samsung's press from hardware to software and everywhere between. the next samsung president weighs in on this slowing global market. facebook under fire yet again.

why a former employee is going public with claims that the company has a racism problem. but first, president trump has been on the warpath over gm's thousands of jobs and shut down five factories in the united states am a floating the idea of new tariffs, tweeting -- this after he threatened to cut gm subsidies, including those on electric vehicles. we saw tesla's shares jumped tuesday. joining us to does all of this, .avid welsh and celine marcy

david, i want to start with you. what do you make of this? not just the tax credit issue, but the tariffs issue and the uncertainty? what does it mean for gm and other automakers? david: trump was not clear on what he meant by ringback the chicken tax. if you were to put that on cars, does that punish g.m. somehow? only if he would redo nafta and he has already reached an agreement with canada and mexico on a differently named nafta but it is still very much like the nafta that companies have lived with. gm brings in about a million vehicles to the u.s.. that would hurt them, but he would have to redo a trade to that he has already adjusted at agreed-upon. to put caps on vehicles from asia or europe, gm brings in very little cars from there. he is using this as political

capital. justit a, general motors laid off a lot of people. that is not going straight to gm. it would be more widespread tariffs on asian vehicles. that would in effect -- not american carmakers -- but it would affect foreign carmakers quite a bit because they import vehicles into the u.s. every year. emily: this tariff on u.s. trucks dates back to the 1960's when the u.s. retaliated against .hicken tariffs in germany what does this mean for the financing of electric cars. isim: assuming that he referring to the $7,500 tax credit, it would impact the industry.

buyers are always price sensitive to these things. however, in the case of gm, interestingly, they are hitting a threshold beyond which the tax credit actually phases out. should this tax credit be repealed, ironically, it would impact competitors like ford and fiat chrysler, who are way behind. for tesla, we think they hit that threshold, 200,000 electric vehicle sales. we think they hit that threshold last quarter in q3. they would also have sunsetted that benefit. ironically, for all the bluster that trump is putting out there, it would not really impact gm or tesla either. emily: trump is piling onto the street from tuesday where he says very disappointed with gm and mary barra for shutting plants in ohio, michigan and maryland. saved general motors

and this is the thanks we get? we are now looking to cut all gm's subsidies, including for electric cars. general motors made a big bet on china and years ago when they built plants there and in mexico. don't think that will pay off. i am here to protect america's workers. with tesla nissan, have been lobbying to extend some of the tax credits. where does that stand? david: there is a proposal that would extend for another 10 years they eat he tax credits. it's now being kicked around in congress. congress arens in not in favor of doing this. there is a lot of horsetrading going on. trump could really use political pressure to make sure that does not come back into the new budget and just let the existing program phase out rather than re-up it. it would hit gm.

history to cut gm's subsidies, it is unclear how he would just go after general motors and up on his other carmakers as well there is a proposal out there to let that phase out or veto it if congress would try to put in the budget. it's the only way to stop that if it was to go forward. emily: automakers are reacting to all of this, including the the lack ofand clarity on what the president actually means. take a listen to this from volkswagen ceo north america we think even the conversation of tariffs and trade wars and these debates bring instability and unknowns the lack of stability and unknowns is not a good thing for business. we believe in free trade. we believe in fair trade. we believe in an open marketplace. we make investments that are 10, 12, 15-year cycles. you cannot have the chess pieces moving all the time.

emily: one thing we can be sure of now is that there is uncertainty cast into this at asian. how will that impact not just g.m., but tesla, nissan and others and volkswagen? the global ev market is not hanging on every word of president trump. there are many other schemes that are pushing these into the market. we think of the california state tax rates and another big markets like china and europe. as i said, if this federal tax credits were to be immediately repealed, it would impact the number of manufacturers. fiats, fords in the u.s. and sales could decline. most importantly, the bigger picture is that the fundamental technology driving these vehicles, batteries, and battery

prices, are falling. in the next five to seven years, without any subsidies, these vehicles will be cost competitive on an upfront basis with combustion engines. it is important to put this into context. over the long-term, rely onication does not subsidies. in the short-term, it would put a drag on sales in the u.s. emily: what is -- what does it mean for tesla more specifically? being an electric car company building a factory in china. david: if you're talking about the tax credits, it does not mean much for them. the trade war is a bigger problem because tesla is exporting a lot of vehicles to china. they will build more there. it does not hurt them unless they intend to sell their chinese production to chinese buyers as opposed to bringing them to the u.s. longwill be problematic as as the trump administration is calling the shots on trade. with : david walsh along salim mosey.

as we heado come towards this meeting with i saturday. cars, twoith electric electric vehicles revealed this week. a pickup truck along a seven seater suv. after nine years of divine -- --igned and ceo joined brad stone to discuss. this is a lot of excitement on the consumer side. the manufacturers are looking at this and they are impressed with what the vehicle is capable of. because of that, part of our business beyond trading is to take some of the technology, like the drive system, battery system, cooling system, and apply that to other applications with customers that are not

businesses, whether that is other manufacturers, players in the mobility space. brad: have you gotten any interesting m&a queries from conventional automobile manufacturers. is not the objective of the company. the desire is the reason i built this company, to make sure we can take technical problems and thingss -- you know, that we thought of as being possible and use technology and innovations with a collaborative working environment to help solve those. we really remain focused on delivering the product. we are looking at opportunities to leverage and utilize our technology. but our focus remains on launching products and we are close to that. brad: you said you guys have been at rivian for a number of years. what has been the hardest part

in getting to today and the two vehicles? >> from the early years of putting the scene together, getting -- finding solutions for manufacturing, this orchestra of activities, it took a lot of time to get all the right pieces to the puzzle, so to speak. we now have all the pieces lined up. for us, it is an exciting time to finally show this because we are confident, because we have as big items that do take a lot of time, a lot of effort and carry some risk. brad: when can we buy a vehicle? we have centers opening up now. delivery start in the second half of 2020. --ly: that was the really in ceo.ivien

trade tensions are escalating and impacting big retailers and e-commerce giants as well. from amazon to walmart. we talk about how. if you like the rig news, check us out on the radio. listen on the bloomberg app, bloomberg.com, and, in the u.s., sirius xm. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: black friday and cyber monday may have hit retail -- record sales but retailers are not off the hook yet. ande tensions between u.s. china are escalating and some of the biggest retailers are caught in the crossfire. amazon and walmart have cut back purchases and orders for some of their private label products to to getad a potential --

ahead of a potential tariff increase. no details are given, one source told the journal amazon served the bulk of its electronics from china. they're hoping a tree trees comes out of the meeting at the g20 summit later this week. here to discuss we have emma chandra and darren baker. what does this mean for amazon, walmart, target, and others when there is still so much uncertainty about what will happen? ml: you said it best -- emma: you said it best. the big problem is uncertainty for all of the retailers. they do not know what will happen. tariffs are tweeted about by the president frequently. we think there will be -- between u.s. and china. the market often reacts and then things might get worse. i was reading a note from the head of political analysis at ever court and he said he is putting it 95% chance this meeting between president trump and president xi is just going

to be a grip and grin. we are not in the see any resolution. that is exactly what retailers do not want. they want to see some resolution. the report in the wall street journal says they are trying to cover their bases ahead of this possible increase in tariffs in january. they're are stalling to look at their supply chains. i have been speaking to a number of ceos from retails and they say the uncertainty is making things difficult they are looking at their supply chains and where they can make changes and change suppliers. it is not easy. supply chains are complex. not something they could do without. emily: as emma said, it is the uncertainty that is the one thing likely to continue. had you expect us to the bottom line of e-commerce? darren: i think it is an interesting story and there are a couple of storylines. amazon, for all of its e-commerce dominance, still 60%

of their sales come from third -- third-party sellers. emily: which means? darren: that means the sellers have interesting decisions to make. if i may 3-party seller on amazon and my cost of my product is 10% higher, do i raise the cost of the product, eat it in the margin, stop spending less on advertising? i think that is uncertainty that is interesting. emily: emma, walk us through this in the context of holiday sales happening now, deals happening now. trying to get all of this merchandise to customers on time. emma: we have had a holiday shopping weekend from thanksgiving through cyber monday draw millions of people shopping online. we saw something like $8 billion spent online for cyber monday. a lot of people say it was a great weekend and there was a positive forecast for the whole holiday season from november

through december and expected to see sales growth of 5%. before the holiday weekend, one of the things that came out of the report is a focus on inventory. a number of retailers are bulking up inventories in the way we see to a much higher degree. target inventories are at an all-time high. part of that is seasonal demand, but that is them preparing for january hoping to get a lot of products over in the states ready to be able to deal with any -- so that they don't have to pass on increases in prices through january. emily: these sales really are driven by price and price wars are in full swing. how does this uncertainty impact price wars? deren: you have to look at a category by category. there are private labeled categories like amazon basics products. they have been less dominant in

categories like women's apparel is a more decided purchase. if they are able to whether some of the storm because of the diversified stream and say i will go after the women's apparel category and cut prices on h&m and the other companies that have a much less diversified revenue stream, there is an opportunity for amazon. emily: do you expect certain categories to be impacted more than others and if so, which? deren: i think the luxury purchases will be less impacted. if you're willing to spend $1000 on an iphone, you are willing to spend $1100 -- emily: even if there are tariffs. deren: right. there are other categories like low-price women's apparel which amazon has not made good on. amazon walmart are not doing quite as well as wait there. -- wayfarer.

the giants have this as an opportunity to grow sales over time. emily: all right deren baker and emma chandra, thank you. we will continue to monitor going into this meeting. coming up, salesforce impressed wall street with a strong third-quarter beat. we will take a look at what is next in the cloud. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: salesforce shares jumped the most in two years after they reported stronger third quarter results than expected. revenues jumped 26% from the year-earlier driven by an expansion in the service and sales cloud segments. earnings came in far ahead of the average estimate while billings grew 27%. joining us to discuss is bloomberg intelligence analyst mandy.

>> it goes to show this the company that has really scored big in cloud and continue to show remarkable consistency when it comes to growth rates. 20% plus all of the time. enterprise spending is going toward cloud so companies like amazon on the infrastructure side and the salesforce on the application side are the real winners. they will continue to do well. emily: what is a mean for the tech sector to see this success here given this can be an indicator for other similar companies and competitors? mandeep: we did a report last week where --

>> we think small-cap to mid-cap companies in cloud, like box, these are names that are single product, that have not scored big, like ones that i mentioned. they could be in play here. emily: bloomberg's mandeep singh for us in new york. >> smaller cloud vendors that have under a billion dollars, they are single product companies, the ones that will probably look in terms of standalone prospects, versus getting acquired by workday or service now. you will see acquisitions, but companies will have to pay out. look at sap. they paid 20 times sales. whatever cloud mobile --

multiples, ibm is such a big deal. companies will have to pay up for cloud vendors. i think that is where we are going with this. we asked about m&a and he said valuations are incredibly high. can these valuations hold up? do these acquisitions stand the test of time? a remarkable,ch predictable model, that the legacy companies, if you look at some of you like oracle, they would love to acquire a large cloud company. i think they will be willing to pay these high multiples just because you can buy predictable growth. it is very hard to get on the consumer tech side or any other hardware semiconductors segment.

software cloud is the attractive, predictable segment. emily: what are the companies you are watching that could be in play? >> we think small-cap to mid-cap companies in cloud, like box, these are names that are single product, that have not scored big, like ones that i mentioned. they could be in play here. emily: bloomberg's mandeep singh for us in new york. it could be an exciting year in m&a. up next, at a time when facebook is in the spotlight for leadership issues and much more, a former employee is calling the social network out for racial inequality. we will speak to the employee, next. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: this is "bloomberg technology." i'm emily chang in san francisco. facebook is battling criticism on all fronts, now from an ex-worker who says the company has a racism problem. a former employee wrote a lengthy internal memo explaining how difficult it was to be black and employed at the social network. in the memo, he wrote, "facebook's disenfranchisement of black people on the platform nears the marginalization of its employees. racial discrimination at facebook is real." he says he expected some change. instead, he got a message saying his experience may not be representative. mark luckie joins us now

exclusively from atlanta to discuss. describe what it's like to be black at facebook. mark: to be black at facebook is really finding your community, because you don't see a lot of people who look like you. the majority of facebook's population is white and asian. when you see other black employees, you look to them for support. that's where a lot of conversations that were the start of this post came from. emily: you write in the memo that not only did you feel marginalized, that you had walked by employees and two or three times a day employees would look at you, tap, and shove their hands into their pockets. why did you decide to go public with these feelings? mark: because there are so many employees who are going through the same thing. prior to the post, going internal, i would have a conversation with an employee, a

black employee every single week at least would say, you know, i'm going through this or i'm having a tough time with diversity on my team or i'm being called hostile, things like that. even if every black employee didn't experience everything listed in the post, chances are they experienced at least a little bit of it. it was tough to walk through the facebook campus and know that this is a company that promotes inclusion and diversity, but that not being reflected in my day-to-day experiences there. emily: facebook executives, including mark zuckerberg and sheryl sandberg, have had a lot to say about some of the other criticisms they have been getting recently about this delay, deny, deflect with respect to russian election meddling, leadership issues, and more. did they say anything to you about this? mark: they did not. that is really uncharacteristic of the company. usually for something that is this conversational inside the company, there is some comment from mark or sheryl or somebody from that team to say, ok, we are thinking about it. a lot of black employees felt even more marginalized because they didn't get the same treatment or the same conversation that other issues may have received.

emily: you did get a response from one of the highest-ranking black employees at facebook, who said to you, i guess i'm just confused and pretty hurt, because i voted for your hire, was inspired by your willingness to strengthen the community, and that post just seemed so out of character. he later tweeted that many have diverse experiences, diverse perspectives, but that your experience may not represent the experience of others. what do you make of that response? mark: it's interesting. about a week before i handed in my resignation, one of the employees told me the only black employee who can be there authentic self is ime. i think there is a disparity between the people who are close to mark and his team and the employees who are on the ground level. i think it's disingenuous to say that this is just my experience or that i'm out there just

putting out all kinds of information about the company that isn't true. because i was so disappointed in the company is why i wanted to put this out. i didn't want to be another black employee who left the company and didn't say anything. the day i put a post up internally, i had three different people, to me and say i handed in my resignation for the same reason. i'm doing it for them and for all these people. emily: facebook did respond. we got this from a spokesperson. "we have been working diligently to -- working in many different functions across the company is a key driver of our ability to succeed." importantly, you point out in your memo this is not just about employees' experience at facebook. you believe this extends to the experience of black users on facebook. how so? mark: because most of the people who work at the company are white and asian, they don't

think of the black experience, which is a shame because black users are over performing on the platform. it's a missed opportunity, a missed financial opportunity for facebook to not engage with those users in a meaningful way and also to make their experience on the platform much more difficult through all the ways it is taking action and inaction. emily: this had me recall the incident back in 2016 where there were black lives matter slogans written on a wall at facebook. employees had crossed that out and written all lives matter. mark zuckerberg did condemn that. you also worked at twitter. i'm curious how your experience at facebook compared to your experience at twitter and whether it is more deep-seated than perhaps zuckerberg realizes. mark: the great thing about

facebook is that there are posters all through every one of its offices, particularly in its headquarters, many of which proclaim black lives matter. black lives may matter, but you are not seeing black lives as frequently inside of facebook headquarters. twitter really made a lot of changes in the last couple of years, a lot of improvements. their black employee resource group is active and engaging with the community. someone internally asked me, do you think this problem just happens at facebook. of course, no. for facebook to proclaim that it is connecting communities and really supporting these groups, what happens after they get hired? you have to think about being inclusive, and not just hiring black employees. emily: what's your response to the general leadership issues, both zuckerberg and sandberg under fire for how they have handled this russian situation? do you think they should still be leading this company? mark: i think that's up to other

people to decide. the leaders inside of tech are thinking the best possible use cases for their technology. they are not thinking about the worst. that's where you see issues like the russian hacking, the fake news issues, this issue about the black people on this platform. it would behoove tech companies, not just facebook, but to think about how will this get in the hands of the wrong people and how can we curb that before it gets to market? emily: you are done with silicon valley for good. is that correct? mark: that is correct, unfortunately. emily: why? can an employee like you help silicon valley change? mark: well, i tried to effect as much change as possible. i had a great run at twitter and

ultimately moved on because there was more that i could do, and the company would not have been a great place to do that. facebook, i was very determined to stay there as long as possible, and i was going through issues with living in a mostly white neighborhood. i was going through issues with having my work curbed at every level. so, i said to myself, i can't give up my social life, my personal life, my health, and my security, to work for a company that is not supporting me and also not supporting a lot of people who work in diversity. they hire a lot of these people, but their efforts are being curtailed left and right. emily: black people are sorely underrepresented at facebook, in addition to latinos and women, despite sheryl sandberg's leadership. what do you think facebook needs to do about this? mark: i think facebook needs to think beyond the pipeline and think about non-technical roles. that doesn't get talked about a lot. there are a lot of engineers who work inside of facebook, but there are many more roles across the company that have everything

to do from vr to building internet in third world countries. and you are still not seeing the diversity on those teams. thankfully, i worked in partnerships, which has a significant number of black people, but they are still few and far between. i would like them to go beyond the people that they know, the people that they have worked with previously, who are more likely to get in the door, and to engage and see who else is out there that we may not be thinking of because we don't have personal relationships with them. emily: all right, former facebook employee, mark luckie, joining us from his new home in atlanta. thanks for sharing your story with us. coming up, we head to bloomberg's year ahead conference. we will talk about the slowing global smartphone market. plus, they have been at the top of the chipmaking world for decades, but are they about to lose their crown? that's ahead. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: we talked about the racial claims against facebook earlier. now one company is trying to reshape the workplace in order to avoid these kinds of issues. ibm is launching ibm's talent and transformation, a new ai-fueled talent business. for more, we are joined by ibm's talent managing director. how exactly does this technology work? >> we are really excited about this new business. you know, as technology is continuing to advance, about 120 million workers at least are going to need to be reskilled in the next few years. this is a really important board room topic for most companies. our new business is being

launched in order to help those companies deal with that in two different ways. one way is to help them with reskilling their workforce on a continuous basis, as well as helping them change the way they are working for their employees. the second way is to help them reinvent their hr function, so that can be the catalyst for that change. emily: how could this avoid a situation like the one facebook finds itself in now? we just spoke to an ex-employee who says this company has a racism problem and went public with it. amy: the fact of the matter is that ai can help with many decisions in the workplace, but the people that make the decisions -- it is the people that train ai. our belief that ibm is if we educate our employees in how to use ai, how it helps them in their jobs, they are the ones that ultimately are going to be able to impact our ways of working and make a real positive difference for bias in the workplace. emily: you are absolutely right.

it is about the people who are building the ai. this is an industry that is dominated by men. ibm doesn't release a diversity report, but it is well-known that the tech industry in general has a gender problem, has a race problem. isn't it profitable -- possible that ai could not just, not necessarily reduce bias, but re-enshrine bias that already exists in the algorithms? amy: the ai algorithms are trained by people, so it is just -- just like without technology people can have bias. technology can help this bias in a very dramatic way, if it is trained in the right way. that's why it is so important that companies adopt us, as many have, a belief system on how important diversity is, like ibm has for over 100 years, and that they train their people in the right ways to use technology, so that can help educate the workforce and help educate decision-makers to not use by us

-- use bias in decision-making. emily: reuters published a shocking story about an amazon recruiting tool that trained itself to reject the resumes of female candidates. it simply learned that male candidates were better because so many men got hired. how do you make sure that doesn't get built into your system as you are developing this product? amy: we actually have several products that assist in the recruitment area. avoiding bias is a big part of what they do. in today's world, the entire function of recruitment has pretty dramatically changed. now that employees, instead of looking for a specific job, a candidate looking for a specific job, they can upload their resume and our products, our watson candidate assist product can look at their resume and look at their skills and identify what roles they would be skilled at doing.

it opens up a whole new set of capabilities and roles that an individual would be qualified to apply for, which is a totally opposite perspective than the situation you are referencing, because it opens up a whole new world of qualification for people, that perhaps they didn't even know they were ready to take on those new adventures. emily: how much do you think this new product will impact ibm's talent business? do you think this will be a big revenue generator? emily: our business is not about a single product. our business is about helping corporations shift their model so that they can have a competitive differentiator with talent moving forward in the future. emily: amy wright, thank you so much for joining us. well, bloomberg's year ahead summit is underway in new york, bringing together ceo's to tackle every topic from brexit to trade talks and the future of technology. selina wang sat down with david

to talk about the coming year for the tech giant. she started by asking about its transition from a hardware company to a software company. >> there are these designations we all used to label companies hardware companies or software companies. i believe that in the future we won't use these designations because companies will just be successful or not and products will just work or not. the most successful products will most likely have what i call a thoughtful integration with hardware and software. the challenge is, though, if you think about hardware or media even, when you launch a product, when you bring it out to the marketplace, it has to be perfect. once you sell that tv in the store, once that tv show is on air, you can't really change it. but of course the opposite is true with software. the motto that most software companies live by is to launch early and iterate. you use your consumers to provide you with feedback. the challenge for companies on either side, if you come from a hardware background, is

understanding how you can be more agile and use your customers for feedback to create products and experiences that work and then on the software side, you may launch and you can iterate, but you have to cross certain thresholds of quality so that it works for people. this is why companies from both sides have not always been able to work together effectively. it is improving now. what we're trying to do is, within this hardware company, bring in people who have the software and services expertise to inject that dna into the bloodstream so we can have the best of both. selina: the smart phone market has been slowing. as chief innovation officer, how are you looking at the smartphone business in the future for samsung? what is your plan to reinvigorate growth and innovation there?

david: one of the things about samsung is that, while we have a very successful mobile business and we sell tube tv's as -- we sell in any given year 500 million displays of one form or another. for us, that is a huge opportunity to connect these devices so that they can create complementary experiences. as we think about things like iot and connected homes, as we think about the proliferation of ai, with think about these displays as touch points where we can gather information and then provide experiences that are chained together. so, for example, many people from -- for many people, the biggest investment they will ever make is in their home. yet when you leave your home, you have no idea what's going on, you have no relationship or ability to communicate with it as an entity.

so, what we are seeing now is not just our company, but other companies giving consumers the ability to have a relationship and a dialogue with their home. and this is supported and will be sort of fortified by having cameras and sensors and everything from climate control and energy to lighting all connected. so, when you talk about a specific device like a smartphone or a tv, they can't just been seen as standalone devices, but seen as one of a portfolio of things that can give consumers a better experience. when i'm away from my home, i might be able to send a message to my family, and it shows up on the display in our refrigerator. or when i walk in front of my tv, the photos that i took over thanksgiving break, can easily be shown on my tv or someone's tv that i care to share with. as we think about the future of

our businesses, it is not just a pure hardware business, but we think about how we can create great experiences, which is what i call the thoughtful integration of hardware and software. selina: how is samsung navigating the current trade tensions between the u.s. and china, and is that impacting your strategy at all? david: i'm not in the hardware business. our belief is that, while silicon valley is fantastic as a source of innovation, for me, it's more of a mentality. it's a way of thinking. innovation can be found everywhere. we have set up offices and we have done deals all over the globe. we will continue to do that. we want to be wherever the entrepreneurs are. emily: samsung next president david eun. still ahead, intel's dominance in chipmaking is being challenged by taiwan semi.

we will have the details next. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: for more than 30 years intel has been the dominant force in chipmaking, producing the most important call -- component in the bulk of the world's computers. that is under threat by a company helping others shed the industry's reliance on intel's chips. taiwan semiconductor is the third biggest chipmaker in the world, though not necessarily a household name. why does intel have to be worried? >> production technology is important in the chip industry in the way that it isn't in other industries. you are not just making things more cheaply. you are not just making things more efficiently. it actually contributes to making the products better. intel dominates in computers. it makes a lot of money for making chips for computers. if taiwan semiconductor's work is better, it could make a lot

of money. emily: its customers include apple. how dominant is taiwan semi? >> if you have a smart phone, chances are the main component in that smartphone was made in one of their factories. emily: intel lost that battle long ago, didn't they? >> they have a different type of chip in apple, but the main microprocessor, the guts of the iphone is made by tmsc. emily: we talk about intel's dominance being challenged. do you see them on the brink? >> it's hard to say. they have faced many challenges. they have always been on the brink, and they always seem to find a way, but we have never seen them take multiple years to sort out a problem like this. emily: they have taken several months now to find their new ceo. what's the progress on that? >> we don't know. we have done a lot of reporting on this.

as you pointed out, it has taken perhaps longer than some would have hoped. emily: if you could put money on it -- i know you are a journalist, so you can't. what do you wager the chip industry looks like in five years? ian: everybody has been writing intel off for so long now. intel has always found a way. the intelligent analysis i have been given says intel perhaps isn't as dominant, but it finds other ways to grow. emily: ian king, good to have you here. talk to you again in five years and a lot in between. that does it for this edition of "bloomberg technology." you can check us out @technology. follow us. this is bloomberg. ♪ i am a family man.

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