♪ taylor: this is the best of bloomberg technology, where we bring you all of our top interviews from this week in tech. coming up, disney plus, the company surpassed 10 million sign-ups in its first day. we will get details. goldman sachs controversy. we will hear from the cofounder on how he got caught up in the accusationsrified

against goldman. we will bring you goldman-s quick response. return of the mac. apple introduced the 16 inch macro per, starting at $2400. disney was the big winner of the week, signing up 10 million customers in one day for its service. despite technical glitches upon mines. disney plus became available on tuesday in the u.s. and canada. the original goal was 90 million subscribers in five years. it is poised to reach that goal sooner. i got the latest from chris palmeri. perspective,s in hbo now, cbs all access, espn plus, a lot of these guys have been in business for a few years and none of them hit 10 million. disney did it in a day. go back to 1974, this is peak disney. the technical see

glitches. we can shrug those off. >> that is what disney was saying. were knew how many people trying to sign up, we could not plan this. they had an incredible deal with verizon between acacia and where 19 million customers could access the service for a year for free. even the free customers, disney is getting paid a wholesale rate from verizon. know where thet demand is coming from. what is driving it? disney does a fantastic job of marketing. the biggest synergy campaign ever. they promoted it on monday night football. they promoted it on abc. they had advertisements at the theme park, disney radio, they had espn correspondence tweeting about it.

s tweetingondent about it. everything from marvel to pixar to star wars, they threw it all at this service. inlor: where does disney fit the streaming wars? biggestare netflix's rival. the stock market reaction has showed that. netflix took a fall. disney surged. that is what we are seeing. textdot.s become a estimated subscriber counts to be 90 million in five years. they could get that number quite a lot sooner. taylor: that was chris palmeri. disney shares surged to an all-time high. meanwhile, netflix saw shares fall. disney's entering has consumers

tolerance for an array of choices. richard greenfield told me disney launched the death of the cable bundle. >> i think about the world from a standpoint of the legacy cable bundle where people spend 45where from the low end for or $50 for one of these top of $100rvices, upwards or more for comcast or charter spectrum. those bundles are going away. consumers are giving up on those bundles. cord cutting is at record basis. seeing all of this great content from disney plus, apple tv plus, netflix, amazon, soon peacock from nbc. it will make it easier to cut the cord. that frees up a tremendous amount. this is like adding fuel to a fire that has already started burning. it is going to make it that much easier to cut the cord going

forward. i think this is the industry. today is a watershed moment. this is disney saying look, the payable -- cable bundle is in the past. the future is streaming. we will put our best assets on streaming. whatever happens to the bundle, so be it. i think disney is clearly telling you that they know that the bundle is dead or certainly dying. they have got to move forward. taylor: you talk about the cannibalization of traditional cable subscriptions. of netflix'st 10% base could be at risk with apple and disney. is there cannibalization going on? >> it is one of the more absurd comments i have heard. consumers want to extreme. they want to stream lots of stuff. these are not replacement products. you are not choosing between netflix and disney plus.

you are saying i don't need cable service anymore. if you are not sports fan, you will give up on cable service. if you want to watch back episodes of friends, you will need hbo max. people have had hbo for years. hbo has been far more expensive than netflix. hbo has 34 million subscribers today. no one is saying oh my god, i have netflix. i don't need hbo anymore. these are going to coexist like hbo and showtime have coexisted. i think about it less in terms of price value than what do you actually want? if you want this content, if you want stranger things, if you want dolomite is my name, you have to have efflux. netflix. the loser will be the entertainment bundle where there is little flexibility. i think that is where people

should be looking for where these dollars and subscribers are coming from. taylor: that was richard greenfield. an array of services puts the consumer back in the driver seat as to which ones will ultimately succeed and falter over time. true optic, which measures audience intelligence, had a point of view on the disney plus lunch. swanson called it an early success. >> i think most people in the industry are looking at it incorrectly. they are looking at it as if disney plus is a competitor for netflix. disney has already shown over the past couple of years, with the ownership of hulu and the success of espn plus and disney plus, they have a winning strategy about how to attack that market. they are not really competing with netflix. disney has done a better job than anybody of getting a share of the wallet when it comes to media entertainment dollars, whether it was from theme parks

or merchandising or theatrical releases. now, with disney plus, they have more of a direct consumer relationship and data that they can leverage to monetize across other revenue streams in a way that netflix and others cannot. taylor: this is what i heard from rich greenfield at the top of this hour, where they are competing, not with netflix but just grabbing cable subscription declines. would you agree that it will take on the decline? >> i like rich a lot. he says some bright things. i would argue that the decline in cable is irrelevant to disney's strategy as well. plus, that disney impacts hulu and the growth of hulu with their live service. disney's game is bigger than tv. it is another way for them to engage with consumers. it is not a stand-alone entity

in the way that other solutions are. it is different from the strategy of the others, whether it is in bc with peacock -- nbc with peacock or dish with sling tv. the don't have to monetize solution the same way that others do in order for it to be considered a success. >taylor: are they the clear winner, given they have the money to spend with original programming and that backlog and library of great videos from decades ago? >> it would be hard to argue that disney is not well-positioned area i am hesitant to say they are the winner because the game has not started yet. -- well-positioned. i am hesitant to say they are the winner because the game has not started yet. i will say that the biggest loser is absolutely netflix, which is more clear. so much of the most popular content that has driven not only

subscriptions but loyalties will be leaving between disney and at&t and nbc universal pulling content. netflix is not the same solution 12 months from now as it has historically been. taylor: this is an expensive business. investors will not tolerate losses for long. when do we start seeing a profit from these businesses? >> if you are looking solely at the streaming part of the revenue, i think it is going to be some time for some of these platforms until they are truly profitable. i think that companies that have a legacy library that they can liaison -- lean on may profit first. when we look at disney, we cannot look at the streaming of the standalone because of the impact it has. i would argue that relative to that, disney is already

profiting. swanston.at was andre coming up, hidden likes. more on instagram's plan to hide likes to cut down on social media pressure. if you like bloomberg news, check us out on the radio. you can listen on the bloomberg app. this is bloomberg. ♪

taylor: welcome back to "the best of bloomberg technology ." there is plenty of society on social media. reduce theants to feeling of pressure. a facebook -- the facebook owned company says the key to that is removing like counts on posts. they began testing that measure on some users in the u.s. this

week. kurt wagoner talked to the head of instagram after he announced wire 25 tech the conference in san francisco. >> what we are hoping to do is .epressurized an we think if you can make -- we can make life private, it will help people focus on the people they care about. with a small percentage of people in the u.s., next week. >> if i can't see how many likes your photo gets, that might decrease my pressure. >> you will be able to see how many likes your own photo gets but not how many likes other people's photos get. >the idea is to try to reduce social anxiety. >> what are you seeing in the other countries where there is a

change in the way people interact with instagram? understand how it changes how people use instagram. we want to understand how it changes how people feel. measuring how people feel is more tricky. it takes a long time. it has beenwhy running for so long. that is why people take time to get out the door. >> people are feeling better about instagram as a result of this. we are seeing encouraging data which is why we are rolling it out further. >> are there other things you are thinking about on the same front, either around metrics or some other way around the way people share that might change the feelings people have? >> when you back up and think broadly, irity more

think there are three areas of work that we do. like hatete issues, speech, we try to address them. the second is we are trying to one issues that we can lean . we also want to rethink the fundamentals of how instagram works. the combination of things i hope will change how people feel about what we do and the platform. none of this, there is no one silver bullet. it is a broader cultural shift in how we think about what we do. taylor: that was the head of instagram with bloomberg technology's kurt wagoner. facebook says they removed nearly 2 billion fake accounts last quarter. the social network added that in the last six months, they took

down 11.5 million posts of child explications, including child pornography. post violated content policies across facebook and instagram. other posts removed included terrorism content, hate speech and drug sales. and from online real estate to commercial real estate, facebook also announced this week it had signed a lease at new york city's hudson yards. the lease was signed for more than 1.5 million square feet of space. it is part of the company's push to expand its presence in new york. coming up, perspective from two pioneers of the tech industry. we will hear from alibaba's co-founder. his thoughts on the u.s.-china trade spat is next. on thesteve wozniak apple card. he was one of the first people to flag how the card issues credit limits when it come to --

comes to gender. that is coming up. this is bloomberg. ♪

jackr: alibaba co-founder spoke to bloomberg while he was in togo. he was there to meet with young leaders and entrepreneurs.

he discussed the ongoing trade issues between the u.s. and china. to handle canceling, the , the usa-china relationship might be in some turbulence. we have to be very careful. i think it is so important for to workd the u.s. together. sure a lot of technology together. and, for so many years, china and u.s. have been working together. there is a problem. that is natural. if there is no problem, that is unnatural. we should not create more problems. africa.oves

bridge between china and africa. what we see as the main thing that china can gain from africa and vice versa, the main thing that africa can gain from china. ? my first trip, i read a lot of things about africa. i am inspired by the young people. so many young people. the origin of the cultures. i decided i would come every year to at least three or four countries. i will try to visit every country in 10 years. that -- how china can help africa or how africa can benefit from china.

i come as a global citizen, and entrepreneur. ideas, ourot of our helphow could enable and african young people. meanwhile, these years, i start in aink how can china help more efficient way? when i was very young, i heard a lot of doctors in my hometown had to go to africa for years to help. today, china and africa, there are a lot of things that are similar. africa can learn how china developed in such a quick way. the most important thing

is not to rely on china or europe or u.s.. it is to rely on the people of this continent. these young people, if they have the vision, if they have the know-how, if they want that change, that is the main driver. people like us, our job is to .ome here and support >> if you had to pin it down to one thing that china can -- or that africa can learn, you said there is a lot to learn. what would be one lesson that we can take from the chinese example in lifting people out of poverty?

think first, the people should have a real vision and , for marketing reform. marketing economy, through making people rich is the way. >> you have stressed the power of technology to unlock growth in africa. what can technology do? and what can it not do? technology can enable every individual. technologyy days, belonged to the rich people. everybody -- think the difference between

is rich,internet, i.t. powerful people. big companies. internet is inclusive. from the bottom to the top. that we haveing seen in such a short time, billions of people started using the internet. it is power. technology, if you embrace it, if young people really want to try it, it will help you. of course. change, ift want to you don't want to create a future, nobody can help you. know, isd like to lift thell a plan to

financiall? >> we don't have a plan for that for the short term. we are very profitable. i think we have a lot of things to make sureto do in we have enough investment for the future. >> do you know what exchange she would be looking at? said, we will not think abou where, yet? . taylor: that was alibaba's co-founder in an exclusive interview. steve wozniak took to twitter when his apple card -- it appeared his apple card discriminate against his wife. and howhear his story to remedy the issue next. this is bloomberg.

♪

taylor: welcome back to "the best of bloomberg technology." i'm taylor riggs. goldman sachs found itself in hot water this week is there were accusations of gender discrimination over how the bank issued its apple card. the controversy started when the tech entrepreneur tweeted that apple card discriminated against his wife despite the pair sharing joint returns and tax accounts. apple cofounder steve wozniak joined the chorus saying the same thing happened to him and his wife. he relayed what happened to kurt wegner on monday.

>> i didn't try to go out and promote issues i just don't do that. i saw a post by david about he and his wife having different limits. we encountered that months ago and found out through phone calls on the number on the card that we couldn't really get to anybody who would listen except they said maybe in three to six months. i just posted it to be like a little side feature of the article, and it became -- i did not expect all of these results. funny thing, goldman sachs has been calling us and they are doing incredible things in a very short time. they just released this card, and that's very hard to do something new for the first time. i have been there. not to have everything in place support wise for some time is understandable, but they are going out of the way, just like apple would. they were a lot of articles saying it was alleging gender

bias as the explanation. my wife thought that at first. i did not think that. in that apple itself for example is the least biased of all the companies. we are the only big company in the united states that guarantees equal pay for equal work by gender. so that was out of the thing. it was goldman sachs. they have listened. maybe because i got involved. i don't like to be getting special privilege, but they got involved and thought about it and they will make the changes very soon that will allow you to get to a human. i do not believe looking into the algorithm is the solution. i don't believe changing is the solution. i think it is being able to get individual attention in cases the algorithm misses. >> steve, you did mention that part of the problem was when you're trying to get someone on customer support for a company this size, it can be hard, we -- were you talking about goldman sachs or apple or a little bit of both?

steve: i am talking about all of the big companies. it can be hard to get to. you have human support in stores with the applecare. they do a good job of making support available. i said -- i decided a long time ago that having a good product is not as valuable as good support. >> obviously when you choose to weigh in on something like this, especially apple related, it's going to get a lot of attention. you said you were surprised by how much it got. did you hear from apple as well? i don't think we heard from apple directly. they were contacting my wife who contacted them way back months ago and called the phone number. i guess they had her number to call. they said they're going to have their standard number by the end of the week and now they are telling us by tomorrow i guess it will actually go through to support people here the whole

idea is to get to humans. you cannot expect solutions instantly because there might be too much in, or too much demand and not enough supply for a while. i am glad. but they are talking just exactly right, the way apple would something like this. we are going to support the customers. i always believe in the customer getting respect over the company having power and because they have power and authority they can be right when they are really wrong. >> steve, you mentioned this isn't just the algorithm issue, that there might be other solutions. it is certainly -- it starts with the algorithm. do you think this is the kind of thing that is reflective of the challenges of broader and the tech industry right now? -- steve: a lot of things that algorithms cannot handle, things that the dumbest human could easily look at and come up with the solutions including a lot of self-driving

issues. >> what are some of the areas where you feel like ai and the s are really a problem at least in terms of starting some of these issues? steve everywhere that we have : learned that we can apply computers, we call it ai, but we apply them to handle everything to avoid humans to be hired to do this job of supporting people. that is all of the big companies -- once i was getting a hundred calls a day for some door -- or -- door dasher put down my phone number. i could not get to that company, there was no way to get to the company to explain the problem unless maybe i got an account. i don't need another account. you just cannot get through to the humans when you need to to solve it. >> do you think that it could be help with the government stepping in, not specifically to apple, but telling some of these companies, if you're going to use ai to solve some of these problems, you're going to put

new rules or guard around that? steve i think it goes back to : what i was saying that i always favored the consumer over the producer, always want that to be respected and they will not get taken care of by the companies making decisions. the companies work for themselves. only government can step in to handle the masses, anything from road construction on. it's just not going to happen at the private company level. we will take care of the problems ourselves now. i do not buy that. taylor: that was steve wozniak. shortly after the interview goldman sachs announced a customer service line and issued the statement that they, quote, not and never will make decisions based on gender. the company announced that it would introduce the ability for household numbers to share a apple card credit line. meanwhile, the debate over the role of algorithms and consumer finance heated up with presidential candidates elizabeth warren blasting

goldman sachs for their bias against women. other lawmakers said they intend to look into the ability of earlier claims. as for some apple product news, we got a glimpse of the new macbook pro this week, the first update to the device in three years. the new laptop comes with a slightly larger screen and an improved keyboard. bloomberg's mark urman wheezing. in.: -- ways weighs in. mark: it is all about the keyboard. the thing to me is that it really should not be all about the keyboard. the reason we are talking about the keyboard is because it was read designed after there were complaints on what is known as the butterfly mechanism keyboard. if they had not moved to that design we wouldn't be talking about it right now. the good news is the new model they are shipping has a big improvement. taylor was the audience here?

: was it mostly software developers and video editors? mark this is their highest and : laptop, and lots of people buy these things. it's the most popular other than the macbook air. there's really no limit on who will buy them but they are designed for video editors and gamers and software developers, anyone who wants to drop that much money on a computer. lots of students by these as well. taylor: talk to me about the price point could you just mentioned about $2400, and that goes for almost double that. is there demand at that price point? mark: absolutely. these macbook pros have the same pricing scheme for about eight eight or more now. the first was launched in 2006, the powerbook was before that, so they've always been in that category. a lot of people thought this new model before its introduction would come in quite a bit higher, but apple has actually replaced it.

so the good news there this is , cheaper than some expected it would actually come out to be. taylor: where does the macbook fit into their overall revenue strategy and product strategy? aboutthe math represents 10% of apple sales, generating between 23 and 27 billion a year annually for the last seven or so years. it has been a steady seller for apple. it has brought in 10% of revenue, that's a lot when you're talking about this company. they have a trillion dollar market cap. in terms of its future, apple seems dedicated to it. this was not always the case. two or three years ago, it seemed like the mac was dying on its way out from being in the product line. lots of people complained, and people noticed it was taking a long time to update its computers. in the last two or three years, it seems like apple specifically its marketing head took the

issue head-on and turned around. it really appears to be more important than it has been sometime. taylor: that was a bloombergs mark gurman. coming up, the ultimate backup drive, how and arctic bunker is preparing software for the end of the world. that is next. and later, one of the healthiest education technology companies want to provide the path to higher learning for working nationals. we will talk about one of the big voices behind the effort. this is bloomberg. ♪

now you all know , about the now famous arctic idea meant to save crops. did you know that there is also one meant to save the world's open source software? our ashlee vance got a peek inside the apocalyptic code

bunker. e: we are here at the 78 degrees north latitude at the site of the future get out arctic code all. >> he is depositing 6000 of the most popular open-source projects in an archive inside this mountain. >> open the vault. ashlee: this is how it works -- the data is stored on this film and the information can still be read by a computer, or if need by a human with a magnifying glass. >> along long will this last? >> we are aiming out for 2000 years. >> we collected the film inside these cases and headed into the darkness. as we venture further into the abyss, and let me catch you up. this company is the main place go to write open source code.

tens of millions of people hop on and create the applications to. hackers and other unforeseen disasters. ok, it's basically a tool shed. but it is cool. >> into the data vault. arctic is one of the going tots, and we are put it here for the ice for the next 2000 years. >> thank you. >> i think 20 years ago, if you told someone that you are in the year 2020 all of human civilization will depend on and run on open source code written for free and put into almost every product in the world, i think people would say

that is crazy. that will never happen. software is written by big companies and yet here we are. >> how much of this is just making sure we can restore our way of life? >> i am overall pretty optimistic about civilization. humans will be residing on planet earth for a long time. it is just like a time capsule. this amazing moment in history when the whole world is starting to run on software and that software is open source and it is in everything. vance joined me wednesday with more on his arctic experience. it is way north of norway and as close as you can get where humans still exist. there is a treaty in place within times of war. it remains neutral. you are down in this cave and it is protected from whatever existential threat you can think

of. this idea of putting it in the middle of nowhere. taylor: are they really preparing for an apocalyptic type of scenario? : that's part of it. open source code runs about everything these days, so it's good to have a backup but it was sort of marking this point in time, this idea that humans has gotten together to do this great collective effort, so part of it is just an archive like he would do for a library. taylor: what are they hoping to use it for? are they hoping for a hundred years from now or 2000 years from now we will be able to look back and use what we've done today? you could. if there was something horrible that happened, you don't actually need a computer to read it. you can just set there with a magnifying glass or analog technology and read it. a lot of it is just the symbolism of this moment in time

when we did this thing. >> i want to talk about this open-source. is a capitalist thing country and they are attempting open-source. where is that tension in your story. >> this fundamental idea of open source, so get hub championed this idea. there are owned by microsoft. microsoft bought it last year for over a billion dollars so a lot of the people who were hard-core open sorcerers, they thought this was like the worst thing that could happen or the most surprising. but they have changed a lot, they operate with all kinds of things. they have embraced open-source in a cynical manner, this gives them access to all of the best and brightest developers, which is like an audience they did not tap before. >> it was interesting in your article and nate friedman came out as well if they created a comespe of class when it

to open source where what did he mean by that? >> if you had a big open-source project, you would probably get paid by google or intel one of the companies that cares about it and you can do fine. but there is this whole group of coders who are making software that we all depend on and we just don't know about it. there's no real system in place to get them paid very well by companies or by like personal patrons. get hub is trying to move to this model to support the developer and let them do this full time. >> what is the feeling about open-source? you talk about everyone participating and yet you have big tech companies like google , facebook and amazon that have used all of that to track us. it's a really, it isn't free. what is that tension? >> what i got into in my story, there's this great irony that open-source software started out as this rebellion against microsoft, about freedom of

intellectual property and the freedom to do with technology what you want. it just so happens that whether it is google or amazon, their entire infrastructure runs on it and it has been flipped on its head to monitor people. it's kind of the underside of the story. taylor: that was ashlee vance. coming up, former american express ceo and chairman ken chenault discusses his effort to link with higher education programs with employers. his position on the board of the denver-based, fema ed guild , education, that is next. this is bloomberg. ♪

the education industry

appears to have given birth to its newest unicorn one that wants to connect to educational programs with the understanding that higher education can lead to economic mobility. guild education is a denver-based female lead unicorn that is fresh off of an infusion of cash taken into the unicorn status. on thursday, i spoke with the ceo and a member of its board of directors, ken chennault, who happens to be the former ceo of american express. >> at guild we partner with leading employers like disney and walmart to collect education -- connect education for their employees with the corporate strategy. we have done it by building a technology platform that enables companies to offer education to their employees and in partnership with the leading universities around the country to offer programs to the employees. it is a win-win for employers who get to see benefits from recoupment and retention and upscaling and for the employees

who get to head back to school debt free. taylor: ken, you are leading and helping this funding round. what did you like at guild you couldn't get elsewhere? ken: what is really important to us, taylor, is, we want to work with companies and founders who really want to drive powerful, positive change for our society. what is incredibly attractive about guild is that, if one has a mission to empower the workforce of america through education, and very importantly, it has tremendous economics. this is a software platform that has very high margins, and has substantial growth opportunities. but i think what is absolutely exciting is this integration of a company that has very strong economics and growth potential,

and yet has the opportunity to transform workforce education in america. taylor: rachel, you hear ken talk about the tremendous economics of the company. what is your business model? how are you making money? rachel: sure. so at guild, we have taken a unique approach to aligning our margin and mission. we think that is very important for business was -- businesses in today's era. we are paid primarily by the universities, who replaced the large marketing budgets they used to have to spend on google and facebook to meet the frontline workforce of america and help them go back to school, and instead, when they save those dollars by meeting students through our employers, they pay for our technology and our services, and keep some of the savings themselves. taylor: ken, we talk about this being a company that is female led. i wonder, what has the pressure been in the last six months or 12 months to look at corporate governance and being invested in

female led companies? as other companies, wework had an all-female board and that in part was one reason why they weren't able to go public. ken: i have had, i think, a very strong record of promoting and delivering on diversity. and general catalyst shares this philosophy very strongly. i think it is very important to that guild education is a female-led company. and rachel and her team have put together a very diverse team. it really is representative of what companies should be doing. and so from my standpoint, i believe that businesses and companies have to be more reflective of society overall, and we live in a very diverse society.

and we are absolutely very focused on driving technology through the technology industry, and business in general. taylor: so ken, you are joining the board. day one, what is the first change you make at the board meeting? is something very important that i believe. i have a high level of confidence in rachel and her management team, and what i want to do is help guild education grow and transform education in this country. and we can do that with companies working hand-in-hand, because we have in our roster, as rachel can go through, disney, walmart, discover, we have a range of companies i think are at the forefront of innovation, and trying to bring about change and succeeding in workforce education.

taylor: that was the guild education president rachel carlson and ken chenault of general catalyst. that is it for this edition of "the best of bloomberg technology." we will bring you all of the latest in tech throughout the week. tune in each day we are . we are livestreaming on twitter, check us out at technology in be sure to follow our global breaking news network at tictoc on twitter. this is bloomberg. ♪

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jason: welcome to "bloomberg businessweek." i'm jason kelly. kailey: and i'm kailey leinz. we are inside bloomberg headquarters in new york. jason: this week in the magazine, allegations of gender bias from the new apple credit card and its issuer. we are talking about goldman sachs. why it is the poster child for a bigger issue with algorithms. kailey: details on that, plus a