>> if there's anything we've learned, you can't of turn on a switch and have the economy come back online. >> it seems like everyone is pricing in this perfect, transitory soft landing. >> low inflation, low rates, positive economic growth and strong earnings? that's a pretty good backdrop for risk-taking. >> the fed has effectively lulled everybody to sleep with the kool-aid that they are never going to focus on inflation. >> this is "bloomberg surveillance" with tom keene, jonathan ferro, and lisa abramowicz. tom: good morning, everyone. we welcome you to a monday simulcast on radio come on television. good morning across the nation and worldwide. from cornwall we moved to brussels and nato. i believe it is like a "surveillance" photo op. we have a photo op in this hour.

lisa: it is very fun to have the family photo. i thought the family photos from cornwall looked like a family vacation. very interesting, setting up the meeting with president putin and president biden this wednesday. also a coda to what was discussed at the g7. tom: we will do a lot more market coverage then we did the last hour. so much of this is a justification of the institution. the nato visibility, if you look at the long blue carpet, are 20 and 30, including northern macedonia as the latest nation. don't ask me where it is. [laughter] lisa: don't worry, i wasn't going to. tom: it is like the game of risk. but so much of this is the rationalization of an enduring institution. romaine: and there's a larger point not just about -- lisa:

and there's a larger point not just about nato, but about who the allies are and how allied they really are. president trump was blamed for the breaking apart of some of this alliance. however, it is clear that there are some real divisions, and they have economic and strategic underpinnings that follow biden in his position as well. tom: got a phone call saturday morning from romaine bostick's handlers, and they said, would you not ask him about meme stocks on monday? [laughter] but we can talk here about the vibrancy of capitalism and the backdrop for president biden and his america that is leading the way because of the vaccines and because of a blowout fiscal stimulus which trolls right over into the equity markets -- which rolls right over into the equity markets. romaine: i think some of the trepidation had to do with the reassessment of some of the fiscal spending or the lack thereof, or the lack of progress on some of this fiscal spending packages, but about what people are now expecting out of the fed with regards to what they signal

for the future of rates policy. tom: to me, it is sort of a press conference where he could say one sentence and change the math. romaine: absolutely. given the reaction we saw last week, with yields, a lot of people hanging onto everything powell is going to say. tom: we will look at asset allocation here. some good bond talk to come up as well. futures on four -- futures down four, dow futures up nine. the vix now at 15.95. we quote the dow for jon ferro. in the bond market, 1.46% on the 10 year. still as big a surprise as it was seven days ago. romaine: and it is probably not going to go much of anywhere for the next seven days. tom: headline coming out here on the ev challenges of lordstown. there ceo, cfo, i guess they are

resigned. they are having trouble figuring out what to do next. we will have much more on that throughout the day. right now, a monday briefing, lisa abramowicz. lisa: interesting to see what we see out of the nato summit out of brussels. can they build on anything they discussed coming out of the g7? because there was a lot of disagreement under the surface. they tried to put forward a sign of unity. interesting to see how this sets up president biden ahead of the vladimir putin meeting wednesday. how much is he going to try to prevent things from getting work with russia amid increasing concern about cyberattacks? at 7:40 five, james gorman speaking at a bank conference. interesting to see what he has to say about the deployment of savings. a lot of people getting on airplanes and renting cars. but the degree and the pace of

which people are unloading their cash really determined the trajectory of the of us economy. today, goldman sachs brings most of its workers back to the office. this is something sonali basak has been done at the headquarters covering all morning. it is important. it is one of the first companies to make such a big push to bring back all of its employees back. next week, the plan was to bring london employees back. how does this work for the bank? is it perceived well by employees? yes, they will get free breakfast and then there, but are they concerned about childcare? are they concerned about vaccinations? how cohesive does this make the workforce going forward, to give goldman sachs a competitive edge? tom: sonali basak, i think she's getting the free breakfast. solomon is giving out free breakfast this morning. lisa: way to sell it. tom: we will have sonali with us later in the hour. this is a treat. we do a lot in economics. we do a lot in finance.

we do a lot in investment. but we rarely talk about the process of asset allocation. jason draho is at ubs. he's not going to give us a bunch of fancy analysis stuff, but he is going to talk to us about how people don't participate in the market, and how asset allocation can give courage to people who are scared stiff. jason, let's start with the basics. his 60/40 dead -- is 60-40 dead? jason: it's not dead. i think it had a 20 year track record that has been fantastic, and it's been ideal conditions. it has been disinflationary growth. that's the sweet spot for 60-40 portfolios. tom: what we hear interview after interview is a barbell strategy. in asset allocation, is a barbell strategy replacement for desperation, or is it a sound

strategy in someone's retirement plan? jason: it depends on what you mean by a barbell. that's the challenge. you have a situation where yields are low. the correlation right now between stocks and bonds is at least flirting with being positive. if rates rise, you get bond volatility. some thing we have thought about within some of our portfolios for a number of years now, the more risk you are taking, you probably want the longer duration to offset that. at the same time, you don't want to be really exposed to long duration because of the potential for rate rise. do you have to avoid higher rates? but also longer-term, that gives you long-term potential if we get a risk off environment. lisa: how important is wednesday's fed meeting? jason: i think it is marginally important. you guys were talking earlier that a month ago, people thought

not much would come out of this. that's what this market is pricing for. if the fed gives some sort of hint that it is talking about talking about tapering or something along those lines, that could see rates go higher. but otherwise, it is a bit of a yawner event. romaine: going back to tom's original question about the 60-40, i wonder if you can distill this a little better. we track the 60-40 portfolio on the bloomberg terminal. friday, it closed at something like a record high paste on the replication that the folks at bloomberg intelligence put together. what knocks that down a level? everyone is looking at inflation and saying that will be the ultimate undermining uplift, but what is the threshold that could be the real speed for that? jason: i think the situation that would be the worst is if you start to get rates go higher

, maybe because of a policy situation. because really, real rate are going to go higher that of a real challenge. if that happens, that's a challenge for bonds, for risk assets, and there's not a lot of places to hide. one of the thing we are think about his exposure to commodities. in that kind of environments, it's one of the two asset classes that has been particularly well. when you look against things like equity risk, it dominates your portfolios. tom: are we over diversified? i say this with dead seriousness. if you have so many few winners, you want to be in them. we all know the allocation risk here as well. have we marketed our way into over diversification by having too many things involved? jason: if you look at the stock market, beyond 30 or 40 stocks,

the incremental diversification starts to climb a bit. you can think across asset classes for a similar idea. what are you really trying to diversify against? if you are worried about drawdown to markets, we know that equities and all correlations for that matter, you can sort of diversify, but do you really get the divers evocation you need? is it really going to work when you need it? i think longer-term, that is where diversification across different asset class styles can pay off because in that case, long-term return tends to be -- which is going to cause the portfolios to fall back. tom: thank you so much. jason draw how -- jason draho with us this morning out of ubs.

it is a really important thing to how to split up the small pot that everyone's got. lisa: and what does it mean to be diversified in a world where so many asset classes are moving in tandem? a lot of people have moved to private assets, but even that is getting correlated to the same inputs as public assets. tom: i don't want to go all cfa on you, but you know where i stand on beta, and i'm a huge believer in sector diversification, not individual security diversification, in my bias. romaine: but it is hard to get that, tom. correlations could end up being the undoing of this bull market rally. the correlations are just high everywhere. tom: to put up 12 months trailing number, the banner that i had an hour or so ago, the last 12 months have been underperforming. it has been single-digit all in all. i think we are up 35%, dow jones industrial. the nasdaq has just

outperformed. romaine: i think what you have to look for is not only what the fed does, but really how that feeds into some of those margins and the margin pressure we have been dealing with. lisa: does that underperform your triple leveraged cash? tom: no, but i'm comfortable. [laughter] lisa: are you? what are you drinking in the morning? [laughter] tom: lisa, go away. lisa: transitory. ♪ ritika: with the first word news, i'm ritika gupta. the u.s. is approaching 600,000 deaths from covid, even as fatalities, infections, and hospitalizations continue to plummet nationwide. the country is largely reopening. daily deaths have fallen from a peak of more than 5000 in february 2 an average of about 300 over the last week. president biden is in brussels for the nato summit. his presence at the meeting

comes as a relief to many, and the leaders will tout a new chapter in trans atlantic relations, according to a draft of the summit communique seen by bloomberg. this is the first nato summit since the presidency of donald trump who questioned nato's utility, sparking concern he could withdraw from the agreement. -- is warning there is very little time left for world powers to revive the 2015 iran nuclear deal. the trade restrictions have all but prevented the islamic republic from exporting oil. the american father-son duo charged with helping former nissan motor chairman carlos ghosn flea trial pleaded guilty in a tokyo court today. they were accused of helping ghosn escape japan, where he was

facing charges of financial misconduct. he smuggled himself in a case for audio equipment, eventually making his way to beirut. global news 24 hours a day, on air and on bloomberg quicktake, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in more than 120 countries. i'm ritika gupta. this is bloomberg. ♪

>> it's worth going it alone if we can do more for working

people in this country. with 50 votes, we have the potential to lower the age of medicare eligibility so that more people can be covered and guarantee their right to health care, as opposed to 60 votes where we do very little, and the scope is defined by a republican minority that has not been elected to lead. tom: the gentlelady from the bronx on cnn with dana bash. we welcome all of you on radio and television across this nation. emily wilkins darkens the door now. romaine bostick info jon ferro -- in for jon ferro. the house is back in today, and i think it is way underplayed with the pelosi scorecard looks like. i believe it is in the vicinity of 219-211, depending on the vacancies, and the donkey in the room is within every

conversation is the fragility of the democratic majority in the house. how fragile is it? emily: at this point, you've heard many democrats from across the spectrum, progressives, moderates, individuals in california, new york, and new jersey all come out with various concerns about what they are seeing not just for president biden's plan, but also how things are progressing. in the moderate wing, they really don't want to vote on -- tom: you ok, emily? emily: yes. the moderates want to make sure any legislation they are voting on will actually pass the senate. progressives are pushing hard. they want a big package, and you heard in that clip there, they don't want to wait for republicans to come up with the negotiating. they don't want to have less from the republicans. they want to make sure they have the biggest package possible,

and they know they are not going to get that with the bipartisan thing they are working on right now. tom: the pragmatist pelosi and the moderate democrats can deal with the left and with the liberals. how does pelosi handle her liberal constituency if things are so fragile? emily: it is a certain degree of knowing where the lines are. what do progressives really want to see in the legislation, and what sort of win can speaker pelosi delivered to them? think about the $1.9 trillion covid bill. there was a vote on the $15 minimum wage that gave the progressives the ability to go back to their constituents and say we took a vote on this thing that we know is a big priority for you. we have shown that we can go ahead and show our support for this. i think there's going to be a question of exactly what that looks like in this package. i think there's also a big question if there is a bipartisan agreement, is there then another package that democrats pass by themselves

that includes their priorities? that is something speaker pelosi set over the weekend really needs to be done when she was asked about the bipartisan agreement that those 10 senators had come to, the $1.2 trillion that the white house said they will work with them on, but we don't really know what the path forward is for that. lisa: my sense is the grotto pipe -- the gravitational pull has all to do with the international, the g7 and the nato summit happening today. there's a question of bite and diplomacy and how well received it has been at home. how much are people applauding the approach she has taken? emily: to a certain extent, there are lots of people in washington led to see the u.s. get back onto the global stage, for biden to reassert the u.s. as a national leader, working together with other democracies, focusing on individuals and countries like china. i think there is going to be a big test this week when he sits

down with russian president vladimir putin. biden was the one who called this meeting, and there's a question of what they can get out of it. secretary of state antony blinken has already downplayed expectations, saying there's not going to be a light switch moment here, but i think the goal for president biden is to really had off any sort of -- really head off any sort of future tensions with russia, trying to say to putin the hacking needs to stop him of the interference with elections needs to stop, giving him a few ultimatums there, but i think for the most part, when you talk about president biden and what he wants to do internationally, china is the big actor here, not so much russia. lisa: i've got to say, when we hear about the u.s. and russia summit, i've got to wonder how much is international, how much is domestic in biden trying to show how different he is from president trump in terms of his russia policy. romaine: that is a great point. i'm curious about the relationship not just between

the u.s. and china and russia, but the relationship that a lot of the other g7 members have with china, have with russia, relationships that are little more economically intertwined. they may not necessarily be able to give biden the types of concessions he wants with regards to being tough on both of those nations. emily: this is something where president biden is not going to necessarily walk away with everything that he wanted from this trip to europe, but i think his number one goal was to reassert that the u.s. is once again interested in being a world leader and playing on the world stage. that is something we did see him to a degree accomplish with the g7 summit, and we will be looking forward to nato and seeing, as far as the topics of discussion, what sort of agreements, if any, come out of this meeting. tom: bloomberg's emily wilkins out of washington. the president is going to come home after meeting with mr.

putin, and it is that drive to the white house where it is, we are home. lisa: and the reality sets in of, we are home which is just like that. it's got a lot of weight. i think that going forward, it is going to be interesting to see how far the allies get when it comes to vaccine diplomacy. in other words, how much they can get shots in arms, that billion vaccine pledge. that was the big take away from the g7 meeting. now the question is how they actually implement it, given that that will be the trajectory of the global economy and how it recovers. tom: what did you see this weekend in your reading on the equity markets? our people tweaking? what was the tone you saw? romaine: i think it is waiting period importance of the fed meeting is a lot higher than it was may be a few weeks ago. a lot of folks are looking at these valuations and saying that without that continued said support meaning eat asked continued fed support meaning easy -- continued fed support

meaning easy monetary policy, people are starting to expect a much more hawkish tone out of the fed come wednesday. tom: for those of you on radio, it is a long, blue carpet we have been making light humor of today, stretching to luxembourg. maybe not, but it sat almost like an oscar walk for the native leaders. mr. macron -- the nato leaders. mr. macron of france meeting with mr. stoltenberg. lisa: it is an apt analogy, like the oscars of politics. is that all it is, a photo op? this is a real question. is this just to give the appearance of everyone kumbayaing together? tom: i will go to the u.s. commander general of the air force at nato years ago, and

said his nato reinventing itself. you do that with a little hollywood. coming up, robert tipp of pgim. from new york and brussels, this is bloomberg. ♪

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♪ tom: "bloomberg surveillance." mr. ferro is off. romaine bostick is in for jon today. the tape a little soggy over the last 90 minutes. let's call it red and green. actually the dog that won the westminster likes nothing burgers. a little bit of tension there. i'm selling this, romaine. i'm trying as hard as i can. the yield, 1.4 602%. oil, we did not get to $74 a barrel on brent crude. romaine bostick to save the day on individual securities selection. romaine: tom, thanks. with some of the individual movers, we have to start with

the vaccine companies here. novavax finally showing data from its trials, saying it is on track for approval in europe sometime in the third quarter. novavax has sorta been late to the game, but novavax, as well as some companies that already have vaccines out there, have said that there is a long-term market here for these covid vaccines. novavax up 12% in the premarket. moderna down slightly. pfizer and biontech weaker slightly with a new player in the market. take a look at lordstown motors. the shares down 10%. that company added concerned language to its q2 filing. company tried to walk that back a little bit and soothe investor fears that the company would be able to keep going, but now we are getting worried that the ceo and cfo have both resigned. they put in an interim cfo for now and in interim executive chairman.

they are looking for a new ceo to take over. this is an ev company that still hasn't managed to bring its vehicle to market. we will see how investors react, but right now they are down about 10%. just a couple other quick names here to keep an eye on. square, a lot of talk about bitcoin over the weekend. bitcoin is rallying back to that $39,000 mark your get jack dorsey was pretty active on twitter, his platform. this time he seems to be pumping up the idea that nigeria could take the lead in the developing world for bitcoin adoption. another tweed by musk also helping underpin that. shares are down fractionally, -- o.a.t -- oatly shares down fractionally. that company ipo'd last month.

washington prime group has a lot to work through. since march, they have been trying to negotiate with debtors. tom: romaine bostick on the individual securities, and that will fire up through june and into the earnings season in july. right now and fixed income, thrilled to bring robert tipp in , double degree financed out of berkeley. i look at duration and what pros like you do in buying the maturity out or in the middle, and the belly of the curve, or short-term, etc. what we have is price up, yield down. what we do on a duration given the shock move of price up, you'll down, we want to show you on bloomberg television. what do you do now about price duration? robert: remember where we left

off a couple of months ago, yields were soaring. it's a challenge for bond investors because the timing of these markets is very difficult. growth is soaring. inflation is soaring. yields went shooting up. but the market is not a paint by numbers exercise. the yields don't go up. the market was already pricing in not only this kind of strength, but the rotation we talked about. half the losses of the bear market through the end of 2019 have been retraced, and yields are probably still substantially higher than where they will end up in the long run after we are

done with the stimulus package. lisa: that is a really important point here. basically, you are saying we have not yet seen the lows for treasury yields, despite calls for treasury yields to potential he higher in the near term based on higher inflation. please explain. robert: that's right. we've seen the high and treasury yields. that's what i'm saying. there's some risk of a twin peak in. the 2009 recovery -- a twin peak. in the 2009 recovery, we saw a surge in yields and another increase in 2010, but then there was the rivers into the underlying secular fundamentals, along with the hangover from the financial crisis that we don't have this time. you're not going to get that kind of whiplash. but the fact of the matter is these strong economic recoveries create opportunities for bonds, and you can't wait until the economic momentum has turned down. when you look back at what we've done over the years in the

papers we put out into thousand 3, 2009, and so on, economic recovery creates opportunities and bonds. that's the rotation we were talking about at the end of the first quarter from credit to duration. lisa: frame out the parameters within we should view treasury yields. the idea that if we are seeing behind now at 1.46%, what will long-term yields like given the disinflation every trends of higher debt and a slower economy just because of demographics later on. robert: it is not going to feel disinflationary for some time. those inflation numbers are hot. you are going to have a staggered economic recovery going on around the world for some time. there's still a lot of regions really suffering under covid, as some are coming out of it. covid creates the shortages that make these acute problems and rises in prices in the areas

where you are having the aggressive recovery, so you're going to be seeing the inflation numbers for a while. you're going to be seeing solid growth numbers, but your treasury yields are probably peak would be my guess. if we have a twin peak scenario, could we end up scratching 2%? it appears to be incredibly robust, but i am guessing that 1.5%, 1.25% is going to be more of your central tendency for 10 year treasury yields looking down the road. romaine: how stable are these moves going to be, or how smooth are they going to be? there's a lot of concern going forward that the volatility in trying to assess where yields need to be could prove to be more of a disruption than the actual level of the yields themselves. robert: what we have seen is pretty volatile, and i think that gives you some idea of what your worst case in terms of volatility, half dozen

percentage point range freed up by the bond market. but the bigger risk for investors is staying in their strategic allocation. for investors that got out at the end of 2019 or that got out at the peak of the bond market at some point in 2020, they had to make two decisions. after the decline in prices, they had to get back in. otherwise they lost a couple percent in what the bond market maybe optimistically turns going forward. does that mean you shouldn't be in bonds? i don't think so. i thing investors should be diversified because what are they getting in cash? they are getting zero. the fed funds rate peak will probably be lower this time. there's volatility, but i think that the returns are going to be fair within that context, and

investors that stay diversified with strategic allocation in their equities, but particularly in their bonds, will have an increase in return of cash over the long run. romaine: do you see any other asset classes that could compete with regards to return? robert: in terms of return, i think bonds are expected to be in the middle of that distribution between cash and your equities and your real estate and so on. i would think those asset classes, the higher growth asset classes, should do fairly well. but i think they also have done extremely well, and their valuations are extended. to some extent, contingent on the bond market valuations. so i think investors that stay in the meat of their strategic allocation, are diversified across these pockets of fixed income that have value, whether it is your high quality structured products, high-yield,

investment grade corporate's, sovereign bonds, european peripherals which are very well supported by the ecb, and across emerging markets, i think there's a lot of opportunity for investors to capture alpha within the fixed income market, capture the meat of that return profile. romaine: before we let you go -- lisa: before we let you go, a lot of people blame the fed. is that the correct way to look at it, or is this just where the natural yield should fall? robert: i think all of the central bankers share some blame for this. i think that there are a lot of different equilibrium's that could be achieved in the markets , and i think they have guided the forwards down from incredibly low levels. it is not as if we have a problem of excess saving in this nation. in general, there is a plurality of under saving. so i think the inflation

targeting regimes that are narrowly focused on these specific measures of inflation, if used -- of inflation, that kind of fine of monetary policy that could be keeping rates unreasonably low has a cost in terms of the asset valuations and volatility that seem more on the equity side than on the right side. but the secular drivers are going to keep us somewhere in the zip code that we are in. i don't think the fed is keeping rates 2%, 3% from where they have been. tom: equity markets outperforming by 1400 basis points per year going back three or four years. brussels is very sterile. there's different parts of

brussels, and there's lovely parts of brussels, but where nato is is three or four lanes of highway, just beautiful roads , with the wonderful headquarters building and three or four buildings around. it is a fairly sterile building where they will do a photo op of nato. for those of you on radio, across this nation, it is a very important part of the united states' projection in europe, and for the nations that are a part of nato as well, as the leaders greet, socially distanced on the floor. sort of like the way lisa and i are socially distanced. lisa: a lot of blue suits. tom: mr. erdogan there, standing in front of chancellor merkel. they did no one from the netherlands behind chancellor merkel -- the gentleman from the netherlands behind chancellor merkel. it is nato. our maria tadeo is there.

she walked the entire blue carpet this morning. good morning. this is bloomberg. ♪ ritika: with the first word news, i'm ritika gupta. president biden tried to reassure u.s. allies today by emphasizing washington's commitment to the nato. at a nato summit in brussels, the president said a strong alliance is essential for america as he turned a page on a period when donald trump questioned its value. biden said he views nato's mutual defense guarantee as a "sacred obligation." benjamin netanyahu is already plotting a comeback. the israeli leader was voted out of office on sunday, replaced by a shaky governing alliance. netanyahu issued a pointed warning as he addressed are limited in his last moments is minister saying, "i will be back soon." the new coalition will command

just 61 of parliament's 120 seats. global news 24 hours a day, on air and on bloomberg quicktake, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in more than 120 countries. i'm ritika gupta. this is bloomberg. ♪

>> we are getting inflation.

it may be transitory, but on the other cited this, we are probably ending up higher than we did after the post financial crisis. some of those components will not be transitory. tom: alicia levine of bny mellon with david wilson this morning -- bny mellon setting up david wilson this morning. "bloomberg surveillance." we just did an important research item, and we decided sonali basak was better looking than david wilson, so we are keeping david wilson short today before we go to's and ali -- go to sonali, holding court down it goldman sachs. factoring in global wall street come apart of it is the seachange we've got an inflation right now. dave: alicia levine came out with one view just now. the chief strategist at bci research, based in london, figures we've got an inflation bubble going on. he's concerned that as these price increases recede, it is going to take down some industry

groups in the stock market with it, specifically industrial companies and raw material producers. he had a more elaborate version of this where he put together an index that was half of each of those groups, but either way he compared it with the 10 year breakeven rate here in the u.s., the whole idea that that is a market based inflation he's looking at developed markets for industrials and materials that have moved along with this breakeven rate, and if that goes down, so do the stocks. tom: too short today. david wilson on the idea of what we see off the fed meeting on

inflation. at goldman sachs, they will be watching the fed meeting on wednesday. so will sonali basak, holding court in front of goldman sachs today as they reopen on wall street. i am not going to mince words. all of new york wall street watching this moment. how will the other firms react to what mr. solomon is doing? sonali: it is a great question because we have certainly heard that some firms are taking note and watching how many people come back, what the concerns may be, and whether they should reopen sooner. a lot of firms are not planning to fully reopen until after september. we have even heard of some firms letting some employees work remotely or partially remotely until next year. over here at goldman sachs, everybody is asked back to work, with some exceptions. but five days a week is back to the normal. tom: i know all weekend you were talking to goldman sachs people as they complain. how complaining are the people complaining this weekend about the return on monday? sonali: it is interesting. some of the people have already been here for the last year, so for some people this is not a big deal at all. it is part of the culture at goldman sachs, actually. funnily, today you have david

solomon, the ceo, traveling, meeting clients. so it has been back to normal for some time. some things that are not so back to normal for goldman, there's free food. there will be music outside throughout the week. so they are doing everything they can. tom: ok lisa, we've got it here. lisa, can you imagine what a goldman sachs breakfast is like? how gourmet is gourmet? dave: probable -- lisa: probably, people would say the same about our bloomberg axis. sonali, the blaring horns are a sign of just how much people are trying to come back to work and come back to work in their cars, not necessarily using public transportation. is there a sense that there is gridlock or a scramble to figure out how to get back, and people don't feel safe yet using public transportation? sonali: public transportation is a big part of this. a lot of people don't live in new york. safety has to come first.

interestingly, some of the new rules that goldman, if you are vaccinated, you don't need to be wearing a mask, but if you are not vaccinated, you need to be wearing a mask at all times. it will be interesting to see how that pans out over the next couple of weeks. when it comes to travel, we will see. it is already crowded, as you can see. romaine: we can see that. i am curious here, goldman is one of the bigger banks out there. a lot of other banks, i would assume, are keeping a close eye on how things go with regards to the return of the bankers there. what do we know about some of their competitors out there? what are they doing? sonali: some of them, like citigroup, which is just blocks away from here, is waiting for a more full return to office in september. after labor day is really supposed to be the big moment for everybody. it is not just the u.s., by the way. we know goldman is planning to open its u.k. offices for

everybody next week or so, so they are watching the u.s. reopening very closely. of course, this is the headquarters, but this is happening across the entirety of the united states, where there are different rules and people with different risk tolerances about coming back to work. lisa: there's a question of how this is being received. you've got certain tech companies saying you don't have to ever come back full-time. we are very much for flexible work arrangements. you have others say and come back to the office. is the office model considered old economy, or is it welcomed by the younger workers as they wait to build culture and job security. sonali: right now we are standing right outside of where all the interns are being greeted in, too, at goldman sachs, so a lot of hugs and high fives you are seeing. it is a very different five and you would see from the people who are not here, people perhaps having more trouble with

childcare or other concerns in regard to covid. so the question of the younger banker, we have heard time and time again older bankers are concerned that the training their younger talent gets when they are working from home. there's 2000 interns being welcomed back to goldman sachs across the united states today and across the world. tom: sonali basak reporting from goldman sachs. she will continue our team coverage with reporting from the dead rabbit tonight. we are looking forward to that, right now, as well. [laughter] how come we don't get these gigs like sonali? lisa: i just want to see the internal workings of your thought process. like you are watching sonali, and then the dead rabbit. tom: you know, drinks? romaine: you can go down there and broadcast later tonight. lisa: we should do a remote. tom: protech, radio and tv, you have a bloomberg terminal on yourself, ok?

so you go, -- so you go, al, look where euro sterling is. it's terrible. can you use more come party -- more campari this time? lisa: i think it is really interesting to see how this shakes out, whether people think it is valuable or whether people do want to be home more and have gotten adjusted to having a more home centric life. i don't know the answer. romaine: one thing that will be interesting too, the fight for talent. it will be interesting to see how they will approach the return to office and how it affects recruiting down the road. tom: i am going to stay out of this discussion as well. what a shock, i may have an opinion on this. lisa: there's no one watching. it's just us. go ahead. tom: i want all of us in the same room.

you, me, david wilson, sonali, everybody. a big, ginormous desk like at nato. ♪ "we are the world" ♪ lisa: i was waiting for something like that. tom: it's bloomberg on wednesday. -- on a monday.

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♪ >> if there's anything we've learned in the last couple of months, it is that you can't just turn on a switch and have the economy come back online. >> low inflation, low rates, positive economic growth and strong earnings? that's a pretty good backdrop for risk-taking. >> the fed has successfully lulled everybody to sleep with the kool-aid that they are never really going to focus on inflation. >> the question is what risks are most important to the fed, and what risks are most important to the real economy? >> this is "bloomberg surveillance" with tom keene, jonathan ferro, and lisa abramowicz.