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tv   Bloomberg Surveillance  Bloomberg  June 22, 2021 6:00am-7:01am EDT

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the public's hype over inflation it got too high and the fed got spooked. >> i think we will have real issues deciphering this data. >> economy that is really strong. it is not normal to have rates at these low levels. >> what the fed is concerned about is after 2023, you will see continued increase in inflation. >> the hawks are more willing to show their hands. >> this is "bloomberg surveillance." jonathan: from new york city for our audience worldwide, good morning, this is a quote -- "bloomberg surveillance." we are down on the s&p 500. tom: dow futures are negative. the number one statistic out there that goes to later on
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under the show, 75 print on brent crude. jonathan: throwing around a triple digit number, 100. tom: a well-written note. he makes no bones about it. 100 on demand, demand, demand. i love his phrase "work from car." the time continuum is so important whether it is transitory powell or transitory francisco blotch, there is -- the media gets into a panic given trend. he says up to 100. jonathan: let's talk about a market. tom: throwing shade at you. jonathan: can you believe people are prepared to shifter outlook over the federal reserve outlook? based on last week's price action. tom: you got a lot in there and the answer is, yes, there has been an over -- overreaction. i would suggest without yesterday's adjustment up in equities, you're right. it was not good.
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ebb and flow over two days to not make -- not stasis, but we're getting there. jonathan: and the bond market, lisa. lisa: perhaps it was an overreaction or a good excuse for people to get out of certain positions, reset as they go into the second half of the year. do your point, this is a key issue, the factor is more dispersion of the fed members but it does not necessarily mean that leadership is on board. they are doubling down on some of the more dovish rhetoric. jonathan: 9:30 eastern. i have to remember how to do this. where are we? exactly where we were three weeks ago when i left the building. almost. bond market yield. a couple of basis points. tom: nothing happened since you were gone. jonathan: stronger dollar.
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lisa: you are back so we can see some direction, maybe. today with the new york city democratic mayoral election. this is basically the elections is the democratic candidate usually does when. the key aspect, number one, this is a ranked choice election. people petition you on that street sign if you don't vote for our candidate number one, vote for number two. get a candidate that perhaps appeals to a broader swath of potential voters. basing new york city, the biggest city in the u.s., how do you recover from a pandemic that has decimated the workplace culture as well as the population? 1:00 p.m., the u.s. is planning to sell to your nose. tom keene loves bond option so i will go into detail. the reason why i care about this, the huge move we saw upward in these yields in particular. you can see how it surged to the highest level since march on the
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more hawkish comments by a select few regional fed presidents. how much will this turn into something perhaps a bit messier? 2:00 p.m., jay powell testifying to a house subcommittee. how much will he double down on a dovish tilt to emphasize heat and the likes of new york fed president john williams actually very much see this is transitory -- drink -- the whole idea they expect inflation to come back down as reiterated inflation expectations and breakeven rates? john, this is a question, this partition between the leadership of the federal reserve and the marginal players that perhaps don't even have voting rights and they try to throw caution into the markets. tom: angst. i look at the market over three weeks. can't think of he had and starts talking anyway. tom: the drawdown is horrendous. 0.07%.
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equities have really come back. they have corrected. jonathan: there's a big difference between having -- reaction function. a problem the federal reserve has is when they -- people start to question the letter. isn't that what happened the last? tom: i think we are making it up as we go. use of the separation from john williams yesterday with kaplan and the others. there is some really fresh debate out of the vent as they staggered to the next meeting. jonathan: let's bring in president and founder judy. chairman of the federal reserve in front of the house committee today. how important is that in terms of what we might hear from chair powell? judy: it is important to keep in mind this is not an official fomc hearing, this is a semiannual testimony. chair powell is not speaking for the entire committee. he is speaking more for himself and the leadership you were
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referring to. i do think we will hear a very flexible tone from chair powell. i don't think he wants to walk back the message of the june meeting. i think there is greater concerns about inflation and they want to confirm they are willing -- if it does improve transit to recommend the same time chair powell at his core is a labor market dove. he repeated when he was speaking for the committee the key lesson on the labor market is how flexible it can become how flexible labor supply can be. we really need to give the economy the month every opening. several more months of reopening before we can read the tea leaves. he believes the market will come back strong. tom: did his commas on the market is where the fed is -- this goes to british economics. there's a short-term, long-term. is the confusion about the fed
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and the market as one definition of short, medium, long-term and the fed has a different one? julia: i think the market has been very impatient to jump to the conclusions about inflation and labor supply. it is going to take a long time to sort through some of the frictions of the wildest swings and demands we have ever seen. of course the economy is experiencing some friction. we rebooted the global economy. there is going to be a lot of noise -- in both directions. it is important to remember, so prices on inflation in one direction and can easily surprise the latter half of the year. there is going to be a lot of swings and the fed is trying very hard to carve out room for patients to interpret that friction-full recovery reopening before jumping to conclusions
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and setting a course that will turn out to be wrong. lisa: how problematic is it? the response was lower breakeven rate, lower expectations for inflation over the longer-term -- exactly what the fed does not want to see. how much does this tie their hands? julia: yes, exactly. the reaction in inflation was probably not what they intended, the flattening of the curve was not exactly what they were shooting for. again, their patient. this is a few days of market reaction. i think they want to react -- this is not a hawkish reaction function but in fact if they do move later, he will be because the economy is so strong and that will be good news that they're here to accommodate the recovery, not stop it in its tracks.
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i think that maybe some of the clarification we hear from powell. we already have the testimony. it is a repeat of the official opening of his press conference. it will be the nuances and 80 q&a and how he really addresses some of the strength -- and how he addresses q&a and some of the strength. don't have enough this going? don't we have not enough? and chair powell will meanwhile be illuminating his roles on the dynamic. i think he is very optimistic we are going to get a robust labor market recovery, that inflation will be contained, and what we will see is a faster and stronger recovery than we saw last time and that is the ultimate objective. jonathan: what we're top question be this afternoon? julia: my question would be around the debate on the tightness of the labor market. i think it is pretty wild to be
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calling a labor market was so many millions of people actively looking to work and many other millions of others on the cusp of the sidelines tight. i think we know there is some repricing in certain occupations. i am on camp, not tight camp. we can go a lot further. i would like to hear where powell comes down. i think a question like that would get at the heart of his dovishness on the labor market and really tell us where the leadership stands on that very critical issue -- if you think inflation is not going to be transitory, it is because you think the labor market is tight and we have tapped out earlier than we might hope. there are people on the committee that do believe that. we hear that. we heard it from president bullard yesterday, the labor market is much tighter than you think stop a lot of these people want to come back. this is what it is. i would try to ask powell where
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he thinks the labor market is and how tight does he think it is going to be. jonathan: julia coronado, we have to leave it there. 2:00 p.m. eastern this afternoon. lisa: it will be interesting to see if there's a market response or a people have basically gotten us out of their system. jonathan: look at the bond market, these moves. that is quite a range over a couple of days. tom: the dynamics are extraordinary. you see it in the spread. i took a careful look at the real yield because i know you will be back and -- on friday with their real yield. the tell tell sign is coming to be breakthrough to a lesser negative, higher real yield? that really has that happened yet. jonathan: the nominal yield. i can see in front of me, dow futures. while i was away. tom: roman, thank you.
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roman wrote a memo of my. -- roman red a memo of mine. the dumb pajamas -- you can wear mine. jonathan: from new york city -- making a comeback. excited for that. lovely. good to be back. good morning. this is "bloomberg." ♪ >> the u.s. has 150 lane americans have been fully vaccinated -- says 150 billion americans have been fully vaccinated. cases are rising in several fully vaccinated states with more young people being admitted to hospitals. the highly contagious delta very first identified in india has been spreading in the south. the ceo says he sees are really enormous opportunity in fintech.
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he spoke exclusively to erik schatzker about his company's growth prospects and digital payment. >> we need to replace the credit card system, cash stop everybody wants to replace cash. i think the opportunity fintech is enormous and we look forward to capturing a small percentage of that enormous opportunity in fintech. >> he tells bloomberg he doesn't think anyone should "have a considerable portion in crypto" because it is very early stage and very volatile. health minister says the country will in the mediterranean's fs masks and open spaces -- will and its mandatory use of face masks in open spaces. the government says they will follow medical expert guidelines on safety. global news, 24 hours a day, on air and at quicktake by bloomberg, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in more than 120 countries.
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this is "bloomberg." ♪
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>> there's no question the fed
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needs to go into a period of normalizing rates and normalizing the portfolio. i think the question is how quickly they do that and how they do that in an effort to control inflation. jonathan: use treasury secretary speaking at the qatar economic form yesterday. good morning. i am jonathan ferro. tuesday morning price action shaking up as follows, down a single point off by not even 1/10 of 1% on the s&p 500 after a tiny snapback in yesterday session, breaking four straight days as of losses on the s&p 500. bond market, yields lower. really volatile over the last couple of days. big bounce back in yields. also -- treasuries, rather, and the yields coming back. i can't make this up. work at where we have been, where we are going. philosophical.
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tom: we do yield to four digits here. that's all you have to remember. ok. did you do your expenses yet? jonathan: i haven't. i called jamie last week when i got my email as had, can you give me an extra week? my expenses are about as long. did you do the internal training? i have to do that, too. tom: i have done all my internal training and part of that is to leave jon alone. right now we are voting in new york. shelly banjo will join us in the next hour, truly an expert on new york city voting and rank choice. marty schenker joins us. i would suggest, this is 50 six st where we are voting and this is historic.
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the industrial arts school of new york city, a famed school, goes back to marx jacobson, further back than that, more downtown i believe, to the great tony bennett who is 94 today. that is a landmark in new york for the landmark election. marty schenker, washington. this is a week where redlines will be drawn. we can start with voting rights or anything else, the powerplay will be sorted out. marty: not just the voting rights bill that they need to unify democratic already in the senate to get pass and even then you still have the filibuster, so that bill is probably dead on arrival. tom: but there are other bills as well. we're talking about the polarity of united republic -- i would suggest -- in the different parts of the democratic party. where is the dynamic going to be in august or september? marty: i think this will
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infrastructure bipartisan to will tell a lot about where the politics goes really through the rest of the biden administration's first term. if they can get a deal, if they can figure out how to finance it without running afoul of joe biden's feelings about this, then i think they can actually make some constructive progress. i do think it is quite possible if they can figure out how to find it. lisa: $579 million. a far cry from some of the previous but some people are still talking about a multitrillion dollar fiscal stimulus from joe biden. what are the chances we actually do get significant sized stimulus given the emphasis on a bipartisan solution? marty: as i said, i think this might possible if they can figure out a way to find it -- and it does look like the bipartisan group is trying,
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taking what this whole notion of another increase in the gas tax, to find different ways of funding it. their moving in agreement for that -- they are moving towards an agreement on that. 579 million dollars is not a small number, but it seems like it these days. lisa: to go back to the voting rights act and the fact tom was mentioning today during the new york city democratic primary race, there is a question of whether ranked voter support get broader appeal beyond new york city and could even be the way of presidential elections. is there any discussion about that? how closely are the new york racist been scrutinized? marty: i think there's quite a bit of attention on rank choice voting. it is a big controversial. a lot of people think we should go for the person we want to be -- to hold that office and it is a simple choice.
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i do think a lot of people will go into the voting booth today and the really confused about what they're supposed to do. you may see long lines not because of participation, but because the amount of time it will take to fill in the ballots. tom: this headline out, the white house has they may invite senators to infrastructure talks. they may invite senators to infrastructure talks. the biden administration -- marty: i do think joe biden once a bipartisan infrastructure deal. it is not just lip service. tom: is senator schumer in support of a bipartisan group of senators made with the president? marty: i think chuck schumer would be supportive of anything joe biden once to get done. they can move on to the bigger seamless letter. tom: did you miss jon? marty: i absolutely did.
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jonathan: thanks. i believe you. can you tell me what is going on with the upper structure talks? tom: where we are is normal, healthy american politics. as marty schenker wisely said, the great american vision, this goes back a few years ago, when the colonies moved away from the motherland -- it is simple. we have argued about who is going to pay for the since time began. jonathan: i forgot. i should ask lisa, not you. lisa: you did miss something. a huge shift in tone with the infrastructure discussion away from headline up $1 trillion, one point $2 trillion, now down to $579 million with a question mark around anything else to get a follow on from that.
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to me, that is a big ship. we're talking about a big change and the awareness of paying for things. tom: lisa is fully briefed. why don't you continue with her. i will look up to see with the padres-doctors did last time. jonathan: i probably should have done this before the show. just in case anyone takes me too serious, i'm joking. we bounced back. what do you make of that yoko last year we cleared it out -- what do you make of that? that's true we cleared it out. lisa: the positioning story as well as the global disinflationary just because rates are so low internationally, you see a lot more flows. that said, there is dissidence between risk as its railing and
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a negative message on the economy that the bond markets are sending. what? you wouldn't update on the padres? tom: machado just killed it. this is baseball. jonathan: i that it was basketball. tom: stocks when we come back. ♪
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jonathan: good morning. here's some of the price action on the s&p after a big ounce back yesterday. energy financials leading. you're done about two points on the s&p. small caps, a little bit softer. take a look at the board. are we confusing the subtle shift of the outlook from the federal reserve, more balanced outlook, a shift ended the reaction function? -- a shift in the reaction function? huge range over the last couple of days on a 30 year.
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yields coming in a couple of basis points, little bit of a flatter curve in today's session. dollar strength story. reflecting the stronger dollar story. this is not a massive change and a big move away from what they expected the pair to finish on the year. looking at the euro-dollar. tom: we will do it later. we will get to that in moment. right now in the equity markets, someone with a long-term perspective who has been right about dissipating in the mark -- participating in the markets. a little bit of experience going to convex met officer for equity markets. -- experience, chief investment
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officer for equity markets. how unloved is this unloved bull market? >> it is pretty unloved. that is one of several arguments for why we think we are in a long term trend here. you start with skepticism. a lot of people got burned in 2007, 2008, even the bear market in 2000. we have this generation just starting to come back in to equity. we just increased again. the market is at that pricey. zinke risk now, -- the key risk now, we are happy with the fed powell testimony last week is our concern is the fed makes a policy and react too slowly,
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causes a massive bubble, and has really slam on the brakes and the whole thing ends in tears. i think we can prolong this recovery and the market if they just start taking their feet off the pedal. tom: this is important insight for radio and television. you take the $250 federated to a present price-earnings ratio of the s&p 500 of 60.84, a number, a huge number of listeners and watchers don't see we are at right now in a relatively cheap market -- steve, if we get a fed that is aggressive and they tighten up sooner or later, should we fear what equities do? >> i don't think so. i know ray dalio was mentioning that. tom: is he wrong? >> i think he is right to think
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the risk is the fed makes a mistake and wait too long, that i do think where he is a little bit wrong is i think he's overreacting to a little bit of the pullback last week that happened when the fed began to act. the market will always pullback initially when the fed indicates the push-pull full of iv getting withdrawn. but i think once cool heads prevail, i think you will be at least for me if the fed -- they're not going to overreact. they have these employment indicators they are watching that are causing them to go slow. we have a whole set of dashboard indicators we are watching to try to indicate what they're going to do next. as long as they start doing something, even start thinking about thinking, just what we got last week and i kept telling my staff, let's hope they start thinking again. i think last week they announced they are thinking. that is good. jonathan: thank you for the
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update that they are thinking. what people want to know from you is what do you want to own in this environment? is it cyclicals, big tech? >> i want to only cyclicals. i think that will power higher here. they have had a nice rest. i look at all of my favorite names in commodities, energy, financials. they all had pullbacks in the last few weeks of 8% 20% in one case. we have had a nice correction in those names will stop the fed is -- in those names. the fed is not going to kill this recovery. inflation is going to be very high this year. probably above trend year. that will help those stocks. they are still cheap if you look at them relative to where they could trade. i see them as having higher in leading this recovery out.
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the tech stocks, look, those are long-term. they will grow their way into the earnings evaluations eventually. but right now they become almost inverse treasury yield plays. we saw that last week. that was the knee-jerk when the tenure came down in the low 140's. jonathan: the relationship between the rates at what may or may not happen, does your cyclical call need the bond market cooperates? do you need high yields? >> the financials for sure. i definitely need higher, whiter yield curve spread. it would help a lot to get the tenure up to 2.5, which is where we think we will probably end of the year, maybe get into three next year. the market can sustain that as long as we get there gradually. you are right, the cyclical trade needs the higher yields. if you think bonds are tapped out here, i think you do want to
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go long to growth stocks. we still own them in our portfolios. we did usual after being overweight a long time. we think there is still time to get back into those things, probably six months to 12 months. lisa: one thing i was struck by an the price action over the week, risk assets were pretty unphased by the idea of tapering bond pretty quickly. within six months if we got to that late 2022 projection from jim bullard. why is that? is this basically risk assets shrugging this off and saying, not going to happen? >> no. i don't know, lisa. different people have different views on this. i think the folks with a little more experience that lived through some of the big bubbles in the past, the japan bubbles in the 1990's, the southeastern -- south east asia, the risk does nothing, creates an
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inflationary bubble that they have the tools they keep telling us they know how to deal with this but the way to deal with that at that white is to cause a massive recession after you already have everybody loaded up in stocks and that is not a good outcome. i think it is long-term -- maybe short-term choppy as we digest the idea that that is going to start pulling back. i think the idea there introducing away 2023 is the first fed fund hike is unrealistic but at least are starting to talk about it. my guess is we get the first type either late this year or early next year. lisa: seriously? meaning the taper has to start sooner. the reason i'm harping on this idea between bond markets and stock markets is because it seems like the bond market is not comforted by sooner taper. frankly, the message from the bond market is a narrower yield
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curve, lower long-term inflation expectations. that is the opposite of the fed acting prudently to get ahead of inflation and not having to abruptly stop a rally and abruptly poked some bubbles. there is a question about how long this can last, especially if you see rate hikes sooner than later this year. >> later this year -- let me say sometimes the first half of 2023 is likely. jonathan: later this year that maybe the first half of 23. >> later this year or early -- something like that. i might've gotten a little excited. certainly by later this year, i think most people would digest the idea that there is going to be a hike in the first type of 2023. to me, i'm always six month
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ahead of where the puck is headed. tom: that is ice hockey. jonathan: thank you. chief investment officer for equities. lisa: this you come in next year. i think he is thing the first half of 2023 with markets trading out of that. yes, tom? tom: the last 10 years per year for the standard & poor's 500, 15.95% per year. i think we can round that up to 60% year. jonathan: and he is been bullish for much of that market. lisa: i don't see how stocks can keep rallying if they taper within six months, the entirety of each monthly 120 billion dollars purchases. do you buy that? risk assets continue to rally? jonathan: not for me to buy or
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sell. it is? asking. tom: can we get into the philosophical questions? jonathan: i am not in a position to say. did the equity market to ok last time around? when does it start to suffer? when they reduced the balance sheet, when they started to push rates through what most people -- tom: well, we are making jokes about it but like michael wilson over at morgan stanley talking about, pc anm2 reduction -- this goes back to tony dwyer. is this a recession? no ,own stocks. it is the pendulum of taper. jonathan: morgan stanley makes a good point. we're not talking about a reduction of the balance sheet. reduction of bubbly purchases.
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tom: the pendulum of taper season five of "game of thrones." jonathan: john hopkins center scholar. your equity market down about two points on the s&p. for our audience worldwide, -- tom: radio is beautiful. jonathan: this is "bloomberg." ♪ >> a bipartisan group of senators working on a name for structure deal said there getting lesser to an agreement that they say they're still trying to figure out how to pay for the plan considering white house opposition to indexing the gas tax to inflation, lawmakers said to meet white house officials today imply to drop a framework for proposal this week. exxon mobil preparing to cut jobs at its u.s. offices. evaluation system will be used to identify low performance and cut 5% to 10% annually for the
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next three years to five years. exxon has 40% in the u.s. nfl player has announced g he isay is gay. he said he is pretty private but hopes this coming out on me and other people would not have to make similar videos in the future. he added he is donating $100,000 to a nonprofit that works to prevent suicide among lgbtq most of global banks like hsbc are ramping up hiring ahead of so-called wealth connecting link between hong kong and china. it will allow investment across the border and could open up more that $40 million in annual fees. hsbc to hire 400 people in hong kong. standard chartered is looking at hiring or promoting 3000 wealth managers. global news, 24 hours a day, on air and at quicktake by
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>> pretty highly vaccinated but
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also seeing an increase in infections and overwhelmingly these infections are the delta variant. this is sort of the next chapter of the covid pandemic and just reminds us for every move that humans make, the virus has another one and we just have to continue to press the case against the pandemic. jonathan: the never ending pandemic with dr. sharfstein. from new york city, good morning. tuesday morning price action as follows, s&p 500 4214. yields come again, couple basis points. dollar strength. euro-dollar coming down. tom: important conversation. maybe have update with your travels over the last three weeks, there is a lot of effort
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to open up economies -- i believe in italy, making an effort to open up and two days ago, john murdoch said, wait come italy is one of the biggest headaches. i am lost. so are you. let's get martyr. -- let's get smarter. doctor, which is it right now? is it economies and societies open up or because of the indian delta variant they cannot? >> it depends on the state vaccination in your country. if you are highly vaccinated like the u.s. where your high-risk population, the majority of which is vaccinated, the delta very will cause problems but not put you into crisis.
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if you are a country where there's not enough of the elderly population vaccinated, the delta variant could put your hospitals back to the very beginning of this pandemic. that is what you gauge how the delta variant affects the country. how much of the country is vaccinated, especially the high-risk portion. tom: is there value to really looking precinct to precinct in england and how the variants were? does that come over to the united states? >> i do think there is value because england is highly vaccinated. what you are saying is the delta variant increasing in cases coming to dominate but not necessarily translating into hospitals in crisis or high level of debt. this is the concept i spoke up, the decoupling of cases from hospitalizations and deaths. that is what is happening in england and will help -- happen elsewhere. i think it is important to be aggressive with the delta variant but not something that has the capacity to put our hospitals in crisis. he will be a different flavor that prior increases in cases but it is inevitable we will see
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upticks in places where there are not enough vaccinated people. lisa: is the sense that it as longer-lasting applications for people not vaccinated, morville really know what is the distinction of the delta? >> the distinction is it is more contagious. it is more than any other variant in more contagious than the original version of the virus. there is mixed data on if it is more or less deadly than the other versions of the virus but that sometimes is something that does not pan out when you look at the data. but this could take off in an unvaccinated population. that is why were we have pockets of unvaccinated individuals come it is important for them to get vaccinated. the more vaccinated, the less we have to worry about any variant. lisa: health officials and community leaders, a question of how we are recording who has gotten vaccinated in the ongoing honor system in the u.s. do you think the honor system is
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the way to go or should there be a more formal process of tracking those who have been vaccinated and those who have not been? >> it is important remember when you get vaccinated, there is an immunization record. those numbers are correct. but there is nothing on your person that really tells people you are vaccinated. you have these flimsy cards that are not really anything that can be considered an official document. i think this was an opportunity early on the government should have thought of come is there a way to have an app on peoples funds that gives their status. new york did something that did not take off. this is something we should see private industry innovating. tom:, on. --come on. a huge body of our listers saviors agree with what you said and the two minute drill list, who is going to drive this forward? are you telling me american
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airlines is going is that public all super america? >> i think it will probably come from the private sector because the biden administration says they don't want to do anything like this. the international association of travel agents has been working on some apps. i think you'll see one of those companies come out with an app where they can verify into become sustainer. tom: that's good you are other guests, jonathan ferro has been traveling. what is it like on an error -- airplane? disclosure, ferro is vaccinated. jonathan: i think it is ridiculous. you mentioned the private solution. i'm sure the likes of the american airline and united would love that. the fact is, we are still shut down. the president go with -- they went to cornwall and the geneva.
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double bombs and then geneva without a mask. -- the elbow bombs and then to geneva without a mask. i don't get too personal but i want your opinion on why on earth we have not addressed this travel situation. >> it is mind-boggling. with fully vaccinated individuals, they can go back to the pre-pandemic lie. they should be able to travel freely. that needs to be the standard. look at canada. they will not let americans in. we have to start moving past the pandemic. why give fully vaccinated if you don't have the ability to move around the world stop it is going to take some time. jonathan: thank you.
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that is something that is not going to get addressed soon. tom: i can't believe we are not doing heathrow to new york. we have to go through the cycle. people are thrilled you are back,blah blah blah. dead silence on radio is a failure. i asked about soccer and there was complete -- he did not even fake it like me. lisa: who is that failure on? i am just saying. tom: total silence. let's go to euro 2020. the issue is harry kane fit? i am asking. jonathan: i don't know. italy always has this
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philosophy, the team's strategy and england just tries to play its best players at all times and it never works out. tom: he thinks we are serious. lisa: the pendulum of football. jonathan: from new york city, we're almost there. 56 minutes. this is "bloomberg." ♪
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♪ >> public hype over inflation got to high. the fed got spooked. >> i think we will have real issues deciphering this data. >> we have an economy that is really strong. it is not normal to have rates at these low levels. >> what the fed is concerned about is that after 2023 you will see continued increase in inflation. >> given the rise in inflation, the hawks are more willing to show their hand. >> this is "bloomberg surveillance" with tom keene, jonathan ferro, and lisa abramowicz. jonathan: from new york city for our audience worldwide, good morning. this is "bloomberg surveillance ," live on tv and radio. alongside tom keene and lisa abramowicz, i'm jonathan ferro. a little later that afternoon, chairman powell going down to capitol hill to testify tom:
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he's got

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