tv Bloomberg Surveillance Bloomberg August 16, 2021 6:00am-7:00am EDT
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going to higher rates. >> we are facing an environment where it will be a little more disruptive. >> for me, subprime is contained if inflation is transitory in 2021. >> there is no place else to go. you have to be in equities. ultimately the recovery is here. announcer: this is "bloomberg surveillance," with tom keene, jonathan ferro, and lisa abramowicz. jonathan: good morning, good morning, this is "bloomberg surveillance," life. -- live. we don't begin with that -- your bond market yields, 1.27. tom keene, we begin with a foreign policy crisis. tom: over the we can come of the team on surveillance working. it is a movable story.
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some of the images off the news organizations, just extraordinary. this is a day that the biden administration must reckon with. jonathan: this is a quote that will haunt the president of the united states, the likelihood that the taliban will overrun everything is highly unlikely for some the president of the united states july 8, a month ago. tom: what i'm looking at is 300 miles northeast of kabul, a nation decisive france, the size of texas. there is a 47-mile border way up to the northeast, and that is a border with china. jonathan: we will get to that later in the program. lisa, to what degree, if any, has this issue overwhelm the domestic policy goals of this administration? lisa: last night a note was put out saying that this lowers the chance of the president biden getting through his $3.5
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trillion human infrastructure bill. a greater degree of disapproval behind president biden, a lot of disagreement on this. what does that do in terms of potentially pushing forward already controversial bills? jonathan: good morning. we have had all-time high after all time high on the s&p, coming into monday. we are -.2%. yields unchanged, a big change for treasuries on friday. the fx market, euro-dollar, euro negative, 1.1782. lisa: today is a light day on economic data. fed chair jay powell -- 88:30 am, we will be getting an interesting high-frequency indicator when it comes to the delta variant of covid and the potential ramifications on the recovery. we have a manufacturing survey coming out. we have seen serious concerns from employers, trying to hire
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enough people. how much is that in impeding costs going up as well as production going down? today new york city will become the first major u.s. city to require proof of vaccinations, a test of first of all putting restaurants on the front line, and second of all having something -- as the delta variant picks up. at 4:00 p.m., you talk about treasury yields, the fact that they have this consistent bid on the margins. this is something that has confounded a lot of people, especially because overall the economy is doing pretty well and a lot of people say the labor market is a lot tighter than people previously expected. so why rest in foreign buying of u.s. treasuries? that is why i am interested to see the june net treasury international capital flows. the idea here of, have we seen an increase in foreign buying that has given these low yields more downward pressure to go? jonathan: lisa, thank you. i would love some visibility as to what is happening on china.
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industrial production, retail sales down, unemployment, not a great move on unemployment in china. tom: you and lisa have been way out in front of this versus me, and the idea here is that it is sort of unthinkable to see china gdp below 6%, and then something as the data comes in that we have to frame. jonathan: and the currency remarkably stable. 6.47 on dollar china. mark, let's begin with a question -- to what degree if any will the issues overwhelmed the domestic goals of the administration? mark: good morning, jon. i don't think that it will overwhelm. they certainly are, as you rightly pointed out, in a setback and there is cause for concern, the hasty exit over the weekend was quite uncomfortable to watch. i heard this, some people died
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in their efforts to leave the airport. and i'm sure we will hear much more in the weeks to come, things that are really unsavory and unpleasant. it will be a temporary news gatherer. as your colleague pointed out, as tom highlighted, china is important, but so is the war with iran and how this may come dealings with iran moving forward. so very much an important issue. what i don't think it is going to disrupt the economic story in the markets. jonathan: to what degree do you think we should approach the situation? is this the optimal approach to a situation like this? mark: you need to distill down to the economic impact. you also need to distill down the risk factors. in other words, what factors come out of this, whether it is increased -- it has increased the support for terrorist organizations, and some change in risk premium? you may have seen over the
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weekend, a bit of chatter around the upcoming 20th anniversary of 9/11, and how this is a form of the events that happened right ahead of that. there are concerns that will build around terrorists, but of course the markets cannot pinpoint them with accuracy. that is just something in the back of people's minds, and over time we will have to monitor that. tom: away from what we have seen in afghanistan come and away from challenging international relations, there is identification of a wall of money. overnight repo went nicely through one trillion in the last two or three days. how do you distill the wall of liquidity that we have over into the stock market? mark: i think one of the snippets in the segment that you just shared highlighted that there is no alternative. that is the bottom line that we have been living for many months now, people are in pursuit and people -- when i say that
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broadly defined, retail investors, the robinhood crowd. it even mature institutions like endowments ended in between, they need to generate a return, whether it is from an income standpoint -- until there is a fundamental change in economic outlook or, more importantly, the support context, whether it is central bank support, or fiscal support, then the people are going to keep reaching. jonathan: what is so important -- tom: what is so important here is that bnp paribas has it right, delay, delay, delay. when jon ferro mentions the 10-year or the -- i'm sorry, -.11 volumes, i will use a phrase extend and pretend. it goes on forever. mark: we don't, tom.
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we are respectful of the fact that alternate parties come to an end. we all recognize that the anxiety around the taper, we think it will be a tantrumless taper. the reason is that even as they start to taper, the market has discounted the fact that the fed can come back again next time it is raining outside. so there is a lot of comfort in that. what we worry about our deeper, more secular issues that go out over the horizon. once market rates start to move higher. then we see some of the excesses that have taken place, whether it is in some of the retail trading, whether it is in private assets, whether we are seeing more evidence of excess there in terms of yield structures, covenants, accounting practices for private companies. these things will start to be more exposed. that is when we get anxious. but not in the short term, from
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a broad standpoint. however, i want to highlight -- the month of september could be quite tricky, so we advise our clients to be a little more cautious because the way to generate returns in this very low return environment is to be nimble. you have to stay out of risk assets and you have to dive into them when the market feels choppy. we feel the month of september will be one of those choppy periods. lisa: what is the best way to be nimble? is it cash, is it treasuries? is there some bet on the vix that seems like a chief option here? mark: there are a variety with the catalyst you are talking about, lisa. certainly treasuries, certainly vix, and there are a lot of different etf's that are interesting. the cdx industries come as you know, are a good liquid,
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efficient tool to use. there are a variety of different -- right now we think people are, as you mentioned, surprisingly robust. one of the concerns we have not talked about much is what is going to happen when the debt ceiling -- in the debt ceiling in september -- does that mean a trade-off versus a second fiscal stimulus program? that is one of the reasons why -- jonathan: thank you very much. mark howard, bnp paribas senior multi-asset specialist. so much to get through this morning. the equity market looks like this. we are down 11 points in the s&p. the attention very much abroad in foreign policy this morning. tom: richard haass and thomas garfield join us with great perspective, particularly the can forward to speaking with ambassador haass, a controversial position that trump and biden messed this up big time. you have got to watch oil as a litmus paper. i would say pretty calm, $70.
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jonathan: crude one, the aussie another, copper one more. the data out of china disappointed. lisa: you start to wonder, when does a country like china reverse some of their strict policies. the major port, the third busiest in the world, still shut for a sixth day after one more person tested positive for covid. what is the threshold of when it will become more relaxed? jonathan: that is getting a lot of people nervous. -13, down one third of 1%. lower basis point at 1.26 94. the attention of the world on afghanistan. we will head down to washington, d.c., next, to catch up with our correspondent annmarie hordern. from new york, this is bloomberg. ritika: the taliban are taking
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full control of afghanistan, two decades after they were outside -- ousted by the u.s. they took over the presidential palace after the american backed president ashraf ghani fled the country. chaos reigned at kabul international airport. tells of people rushed to exit the country -- thousands of people rushed to exit the country. at least five people were killed as they tried to forcibly enter planes that were departing. in haiti, a 7.2 magnitude earthquake flattened homes and destroyed businesses. a rescue team is trying to find survivors trapped in the rubble. the new coronavirus surge is prompting more americans to get vaccinated. the u.s. reported almost a million vaccine doses given nationwide on saturday, where than double the 400,000 reached
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in mid july, according to the cdc. over 60% of the u.s. population has gotten at least one dose. 61% are fully vaccinated. saudi aramco is in talks of what could be a $25 billion deal. aramco is discussing the purchase of a 20% stake in reliance oil refining and chemical business. an agreement on the deal could be reached in the coming weeks. global news 24 hours a day, on air and at bloomberg quicktake, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in more than 120 countries, i am ritika gupta. this is bloomberg. ♪
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afghanistan 20 years ago with one mission, and that was to do with the people who attacked us on 9/11. that mission was successful. jonathan: that was antony blinken speaking on abc this weekend. alongside tom keene and lisa abramowicz, i am jonathan ferro. we are negative one third of 1% on the s&p 500. your 10-year, 1.2684. the line from the secretary of state, the fact that we went to afghanistan 20 years ago, with one mission in mind, to deal with the taliban, and that has been successful. there are many images over the weekend. the choppers hanging over the roof of the u.s. embassy in kabul was the situation that the administration feared. you remember the line over the last 20 years, the last several
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decades, from the taliban, that you have watches and we have time. that has come true this weekend. tom: monday morning here come at 6:18 new york time, it is just as important as anything over the weekend. the images from kabul have been brutal. jonathan: the image that stuck out for me was not the chopper over the u.s. embassy in kabul, it was the president in a room alone at camp david, and nobody else was there. i have no idea what the president was thinking. i do wonder whether he was pondering the consequences of the decisions made by leaders that came before him, or ultimately realizing that to some degree in public opinion, this is a decision that he alone would have to answer. tom: this will be played out in the media and by analysts as well, and we will have more on
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this in the coming weeks. this is a president at shangri-la, that is what camp david used to be called. he is in the situation room alone. but what was so important was who he was wired into -- the military, the state department, the secretary of state, mr. blinken. the cia was shown to some criticism as that image went public. it is the president at can't david who has two -- it is at camp david. annmarie hordern joins us this morning. annmarie: he is still in camp david. those pictures circulating on twitter, briefing with his team virtually. that is where we know as of now where he will stay. what is critical for this administration is to make sure all u.s. personnel get evacuated from kabul. you saw the scenes of what happened at the embassy with the flag coming down on the u.s.
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embassy, and what we heard from the state department is that we do have all u.s. personnel, diplomats, security at the airport. to make sure they get evacuated as well as the afghani's, that a lot of american officials gave their word to get out of the country. that is the chaotic scene right now, at the kabul airport. that is going to be priority number one. jonathan: the number one question i heard asked repeatedly over the past week, whether it was military veterans or armchair generals -- they all asked the same question, how did this happen so quickly with little or no resistance? annmarie: it is a very good question. there will be days, weeks, if not years dissecting all of this. we heard from secretary blinken saying that this is not saigon. as mark twain said, this does not repeat itself, but it certainly does rhyme. this is a very swift resurgence
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of the taliban. last weekend for me was a signal of the way the taliban was able to take provinces to the left, to the north, and to be able to circle kabul, and this was quicker than the intelligence community had assessed, which was months at one point, then to 90 days, and it happened within a weekend. you had the afghani president flee the country. this shows it was quite simple for the taliban to stroll in two kabul and -- stroll into kabul and clean the streets. you heard a little bit of that from the secretary of state on the sunday shows. that was a shock, how swift the taliban was able to get into the capital. jonathan: two hours. what do allies think? annmarie: the biden administration went from trump's america first to america back.
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many nato allies feel they were left high and dry. they also feel they are now going to be dealing with a significant refugee crisis. as you can see afghan is just desperate to get out of the country because many of them know what that heilemann role was before the united states entered into thousand one. the taliban was largely in control of the country, along with other warlords. this is something they do not want to stand. so you do have a lot of allies -- the british defense secretary talking about what comes next is likely a resurgence of al qaeda, and that is the reason united states went to afghanistan. lisa: there was a lot of support for exiting before the way that it wind down. how much support truly has president biden lost, and from where? annmarie: there is a lot of support from the american people. they don't want to see this
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"forever war, and we have seen every administration just punt it to the next administration. president biden said i will not pass it onto a fifth president. we have seen pushback from republicans, like senator mcconnell, who was also against it when trump launched a withdrawal, saying it is a botched withdrawal. also from the likes of representative cheney. he is going to see pushback from republicans in the way this is handled. democrats are offering their concerns, especially for afghan women and girls, but they have not gone as far as to announce what the president is doing and call this a failure of a withdrawal. jonathan: annmarie: thank you. we have to leave it there. i know the man who has had pushback is the head of the council. to give you a flavor of the
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conversation coming up shortly on this program, here's a tweet -- "what makes the situation so frustrating is that allies have reached somewhat of a -- it was not a peaceful military victory, but it was instantly preferable to the strategic and human catastrophe that is unfolding those comments over the weekend. tom: whether you agree or disagree, it shows three stages of war. as you say, we reached an equally. of 3000, 4000, 5000 soldiers and contractors. equally the blame of republicans and democrats. jonathan: there are questions that you and i cannot answer this morning. what have we achieved over the last 20 years? what did we achieve? tom: there will be a lot of analysis on that. is this the same taliban as the
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very wide but so far the cannabis sector seems to be holding up well. ♪ jonathan: live from new york city, here is the monday morning action. a little bit of weakness as we kick off the trading week. an all-time high on the s&p 500. we are negative on the nasdaq and the russell. let's get to the bond market. we start by looking back on friday, a move lower, eight basis points on the 10 year yield. the survey for sentiment looking forward in america, i thought that was important because we talk about how demand was driving prices higher and now we are talking about higher prices weighing on demand and consumer confidence. treasury yields are back to one
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point 27. -- 1.27. let's finish on this, china has done nothing for so long now. dollar-china is about the same and that currency challenge is not responding to weaker data does not respond to retail sales or downsize a price on industrial production will step tom: it's going to be interesting to see in china is not only in the markets this morning but in our fractured international relations. richard haas is a busy monday morning because he is the center of a raging debate of the past in afghanistan. he is on the council of foreign relations.
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i want to get right to it and i want to get to the movement. is this tele-band the same tell a ban two? >> if anything, it's worse because now it's had a chance to regroup. it now has access to american arms and it has proven his resilience. the opposition in afghanistan is weaker than it was so it's at least as bad step there is no sign of any mellowing by the tell about -- by the taliban. tom: is the vacuum going to be filled by china with a 47 mile border constructed by the british in 1895? >> now, the chinese don't want
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to get in afghanistan. they want to keep afghanistan out of china. they are worried about their own muslim minority in the last thing they want is for them to be radicalized. none of the neighbors with the exception of pakistan has an appetite for getting into afghanistan. want to keep the terrorists and the guns and the drugs out of their country. there you -- they are worried about refugee flows and that's what people will be focused on. tom: let's go to iran and the wonderful frontline efforts that was done a number of weeks ago. it is sunni and shia, is that ultimately what this will be about? >> i don't see friction there. we've got problems with iran it has to do with their nuclear program. iran has been helpful in the past and 20 years ago, they were helpful in standing off a post
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taliban government in afghanistan. they want a stable neighbor, not one exporting drugs. i don't think iran is the place to look. >> do we look to be allies? >> the answer is there is no solution to look for. this is now the new reality in afghanistan. it will be awful for afghans. the danger is they invite -- the danger is the terrace invite themselves back in. america's consistency for -- and read has taken a hit and i worry about the long term effect for afghanistan. afghanistan has to -- has keeping -- is kept the taliban alive. in the medium to long run, i would worry about that but for the united states, the focus has to be on getting as many afghans
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to work with us out of that country. it's outrageous we would leave them behind and abandon them. i think we have to go around the world trying to demonstrate that the awful scenes we are seeing in afghanistan are not somehow representative of the totality of american foreign policy. we've got to persuade people they should not read too much into this. >> many officials have said this is not a war we could win and we were keeping the peace and sacrificing american soldiers. it was to keep a piece that was unnatural in this nation. what do you say to capture that? why was it for u.s. troops to remain in afghanistan at a lower rate than they had been say five or 10 years ago? >> we reduce the u.s. military presence to around 3000. there hasn't been an american combat detail there for 18 months. for a relatively modest investment come i thought we were getting good results in the american presence was essential to keep the allied troops there
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and provide a psychological and military floor for the afghans. it wasn't going to give you peace, it wasn't good to give you a military victory but it was going to avoid ringing about exactly what we are seeing now. sometimes with foreign policy, you got to measure success not by what you overt and by that definition, this was a success and we undermined our own policy. tom: with all of your experience, this comes back to scoop jackson of washington state and maybe donald rumsfeld and others, it's this thing called neoconservatism. how did that neoconservative crews pick up the pieces? >> i'm not sure they matter a whole lot right now. they have an ambitious foreign policy. they want to transform the world and are often they want the united states to act alone i
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think the biggest challenge for the u.s. right now and across party lines was something that stick -- said we did too little. they -- that the united states pulls back from the world. essentially we under reach in the world and if i had a crystal ball, i would be more worried about american under reach going forward than overreach. tom: what is their post afghanistan world look like? >> can afghanistan, it looks horrific. that's for us to determine. will we stand by our allies? will we stand up to russia and china? will we actually do more to combat climate change and improve global health? there is nothing about afghanistan that stops us from decreasing our exports of covid vaccines. there is nothing about afghanistan that stops us from joining the asia-pacific
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regional trade agreements. i could go on. i disagree fundamentally with what the last administration and this one have done afghanistan but that doesn't stop us from doing other smart things in the world. >> you were talking about this concern about allies in the perception of the united states and the trustworthiness of some of the assertions that the involvement the u.s. has had. with other initiatives whether it's combating global warming or the pandemic, how much clout has president biden lost on the international stage among allies who already are somewhat skeptical of the u.s. promises? >> i will not sugarcoat it. this is a bad thing. he gained clout by the original response to covid, he gained clout by the performance of the u.s., me. this is clearly a setback. he's got 3.5 years to go to make
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a record but there is no way this is anything but something significant in the deficit column step this will hurt the reality and the perception of the united states and the world and it reinforces a narrative that was already out there which is that this united states is different than the old united states that had tremendous staying power in the cold war. jonathan: before we let you go, a message for this administration -- we have heard a limited amount from the president over the weekend. what you number one question for them this morning? >> what more can they do to help the afghans who are trapped in the country and are vulnerable? i find it painful to watch. i think we got to do more to help them we can't send would be focused on getting americans out. the real question is how does this administration proved to the world that american foreign policy should not be understood through this lens.
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we've got to be active and we got to be smart elsewhere. we cannot undo the mistakes we have made in afghanistan. it doesn't mean we have to make mistakes elsewhere. jonathan: thank you so much. he wrote over the weekend that america's withdrawal -- the president was recently asked if he had any regrets about his decision to withdraw from afghanistan and he replied he did not but he should. tom: it's extraordinary and the numbers from 110,000 troops at the peak on down we go to 3000 or 4000. the distinction is to say that's a small amount so why not leave it there. president trump said no, we go. jonathan: the messaging that is
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sent to the rest of the world is important. it takes a nato approach and we can reaffirm about covid and all the rest with their international relations. i am more worried about the adjacencies around afghanistan and the six countries that are focusing on pakistan and others focusing on iran. jonathan: we will continue on bloomberg tv and radio and the market coverage continues as well. a four-day winning streak on the s&p 500 step from new york city, this is bloomberg ♪ >> desperate seems are playing out at the international airport in kabul. taliban fighters took control of afghanistan's capital with thousands of people rushing to
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find a way out. at least five people were killed as crowds tried to enter planes leaving the country and the u.s. is trying to evacuate american citizens and their families. the biden administration plans to announce the biggest long-term increase in food stamp benefits. the average benefits in october will go up by more than 25% pre-pandemic levels. 42 million people are in the program. the financial services firm is leaving his new york offices. executives at the boston company told new york staff they will might be returning to their midtown manhattan location and they expect to offices near rockefeller center. the u.k. is stepping up its efforts to encourage young people to come forward to take covid vaccines. a number have companies have
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come up with awards for those who get shot. -- you get shots. all 16 and 17-year-olds in the u.k. will be offered the vaccine by next week step 2.7 billiard -- million dollars in cash for a kkr phone company. global news, 24 hours a day, powered by more than 2700 back to journalists in 20 countries. this is bloomberg this is bloomberg. ♪.
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>> if it turns out as the day to come in, we see we do need jonathan: that was dr. fauci speaking to face the nation over the weekend. he said as the data came in, we need to give an additional does to people who are immunocompromised. we will be prepared to do that quickly. from new york city this morning, good morning. here is the price action in the equity markets. we are down 13 on the s&p and negative in the bond market. 15 minutes into the program and we haven't mentioned the federal reserve. you will hear from the chairman tomorrow in a town hall with educators that will take place tomorrow afternoon.
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tom: you will avoid monetary era, no doubt on his way to jackson hole. with futures at -13 and doubt futures -102, from afghanistan, the horrific earthquake in haiti, there is still the pandemic. there are little people with major problems. it's on pediatric hospitalizations which is front and center for johns hopkins school of public health. it's 1900 people i believe, little children, hospitalized. do they get sick the same way we get sick or is there something unique to pediatric hospitalizations? >> generally speaking, kids get the same kinds of complications that adults have but they are also admitted for the condition of an immune response to the action so it could be a mild
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infection and then they get the immune response that can be quite serious. it's what adult get plus for kids. it's a smaller number than adults but the number has been rising so where is the highest number of pediatric hospitalizations are at the highest ever and it's almost a third over the previous high of january. that's why hospital beds are filling up across the south. tom: what is holding the authorities back from allowing for a vaccine for those under 12? >> the frustrating thing is we don't know the answer to that. i think it would be helpful for the food and drug administration to be more transparent about the situation step there have been studies of kids 5-12. there are reports the studies will involve more patients which could be a reasonable decision
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but it hasn't been the case that the fda has revealed its thinking and parents have to understand what's going on. they hope they will come forward with a full explanation and a timeline for younger kids. lisa: in the meantime, there's a deep sense of demoralization across the nation as people start to realize that the pandemic will not end anytime soon and there is a question about herd immunity. is it an achievable goal? how much have we been set back how much more of the relation to we have to get vaccinated in order to get back of some semblance of normal or is that off the table? >> the delta variant has absolutely changed the story here. it's really become apparent how much that is the case and have different things are. this has been a very quiet summer except for the delta variant.
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we have summer being in a norm is challenge. pediatric hospitals are acting like is the middle of winter, the peak of the season and schools have not even opened yet. it's demoralizing but we have a danger that we have to be careful for ends school systems have to get that make -- make the right decision. they have to do battle against the pandemic again. on the other end of this, we will have chances to keep this at a certain level in the most important thing is the vaccine is highly effective against the delta variant. the vaccinations still looked like the best path forward. lisa: is it weighing in the same as it was in the united kingdom? >> i haven't seen a great sign of that yet. i have seen many news stories suggesting that over the last
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few weeks but i don't know, i think we will have to see what each week brings. i'm worried about other parts of the country that haven't been hit as hard as the south. tom: richard haass was just on about afghanistan and he talked about how the u.s. can reassert itself internationally by exporting covid vaccines. if we export covid vaccines to other parts of the world, are we taking vaccines away from americans? >> i don't think so because we have so many vaccines right now. there is plenty of room to do both. i also think the u.s. can help other countries with manufacturing vaccines and start a program for manufacturing vaccines and that would signal some incredible type of partnership to the u.s. to go into with other countries to help them be able to vaccinate themselves over time. i think there are a lot of opportunities. jonathan: it's great to catch up, thank you.
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tons to get through this morning. we will catch the fed chair tomorrow afternoon and he will speak to educators in a town hall at 1:30 p.m. eastern. if we see a few more job reports like the woman just got, i would feel comfortable saying maybe we haven't completely filled the whole but we made a lot of progress and then might be the time to move forward. tom: maybe the most interesting single sentence over the weekend was deutsche bank. he said tapering is not a big deal. he said it's not what he is focused on. jonathan: what is he focused on? tom: he is focused on the dynamics of a global economy and that's what we should be focused on. jonathan: we started to see cracks in the dynamics of the
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global economy, specifically out of china. lisa: how much does it affect with the slowdown in china? how much does that delay any potential tapering? they are coming up with reasons to hold tight. jonathan: for domestic stories, to what degree does this overwhelm domestic policy? lisa: the question about the $3.5 trillion human infrastructure bill passed in the senate but how realistic is it and what does it do to the market? these are some of the uncertainties at a time when all are the signs show the markets are leveling off. jonathan: prices are starting to
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♪ >> rates will go up a little bit i think we will have more physical coming so i think the debt dynamics will born -- will point to higher rates. >> it's going to be a little more disruptive. >> jimmy, sub prime his contained as the inflation is transitory. . >> that headwinds today is supply chain. >> there no place else to go. you have to be in equities and ultimately, the recovery is here. >> this is bloomberg surveillance with tom keene, jonathan arrow and lisa abramowicz. jonathan: getting your trading week started, good morning. this is bloomberg surveillance live. your equity market is down 10. no matter what you throw at this market, there is still an all-time high.
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