tv Bloomberg Surveillance Bloomberg November 16, 2021 7:00am-8:01am EST
7:00 am
euro-dollar with a one dollar 13 tents handle. lisa: the idea of the dynamism >> gridlock between the bulls of the u.s. consumer being a stalwart in the global economy really standing out in its and the bears. momentum. 8:30 am, we get a test of that >> i think we are seeing momentum. u.s. october retail sales. evidence that the labor market very curious to see whether particularly in the united states is pretty tight. people shrug off some of the higher prices and whether they >> stocks at the end of the day continue to buy. are an inflation hedge. it will also be interesting to see what the response will be >> this is "bloomberg from the federal reserve. jim bullard will be joining us surveillance" with tom keene, jonathan ferro, and lisa abramowicz. jonathan: and we wait a little on "bloomberg surveillance" at bit longer. 8:45 a.m. with michael mckee to from york city, for our audience talk about what their dynamic is to determine whether they should worldwide, good morning. this is "bloomberg surveillance ," live on tv and radio. end their bond purchases more quickly and whether they should start to talk about raising alongside tom keene and lisa rates. abramowicz, i'm jonathan ferro. 10:00 a.m. we get a dump of your equity market up four on data. we get you a september business the s&p, advancing zero point inventories, as well as the 1%. housing market index. we keep waiting. tom: it is almost like waiting how much do we see that momentum continue at a time when prices for a new yankees manager. are high and a lot of these we are waiting, and what is builders are trying to build for fascinating here, get out the the lower income sectors? calendar, you were right week
7:01 am
ago. this is coming very late, and 2:20 5 p.m., president biden will speak on his bipartisan they are going to have to infrastructure law from explain why that is. woodstock, new hampshire. when we get the announcement, he will also talk about the explanation around it will be interesting. trying to push forward the jonathan: looking forward to the announcement on the next chair. maybe it is this chair. social spending. one thing i can guarantee, more a lot of this was trying to shore up supply chain issues. outlooks for the s&p 500. they will be accepting they point out profit growth is competitive grant applications to get that money out quickly. not expected to ease some of the accounting for the entire profit constraints in the near term. growth. tom: we heard from credit jonathan: let's get the conversation started with david suisse. a little bit of margin compression. leibovitz -- with david the outlooks are fascinating. lebovitz, global market what i would say is i am really going to pay attention to the consistent bulls because they strategist at jp morgan. david: it is difficult to see have been right for three years. i want to hear them re-justify how at current levels, multiples forward. jonathan: goldman one of those expand further, particularly in consistent bulls. an environment where long-term interest rates continue to move higher. i want to latch onto something the difference between morgan stanley at 4400 next year year you guys were talking about with end, and goldman sachs 5100. respect to the margin story because that really is key for lisa: there's not expectation the earnings narrative next
7:02 am
year. when we listen to what companies for recession, but people don't are saying, when we look at what understand the nature of the companies are actually doing, inflationary pressures. and certain industries you are they don't understand the fed's response mechanism and how much seeing higher input costs passed consumers can continue to remain along to consumers, but another the strong beacons of this thing you are hearing from managements quite a bit is a focus on automation, efficiency, economy at a time when we have a productivity. so i think next year, the way we fiscal support rolling off. get past this margin headwind is the whole pie gets bigger to a certain extent, but companies the only certainty seems to be can continue to focus on running their operations in a relatively that recession is off the table. jonathan: getting comp sales. lean way. they know about the supply chain disruptions. they know about rising wages. so my guess is that they will 9.9% total sales for the start to do some the about it quarter. they raise eps guidance as well. and it impacts profitability. from what i can see in the early tom: david stubbs gave us an part of the release, he beat and raise from walmart. interview of the jp morgan view on the technology overlay that some decent numbers from home depot. tom: we are losing perspective. is out there. this is about nominal gdp, and i don't mean amazon and apple. i mean the technology overlay for walmart. for home depot. the gloom crew was stunningly wrong on that. peloton announcing a one billion they have had to extend out there gloom of when we get dollar equity offering. the technology overlay, is this
7:03 am
nominal gdp down to normal, and a key driver that would grossly underestimate, the benefit of some even suggesting we go below the new post been -- normal, down to some grim to post-pandemic technology? david: i think to an extent, we percent real gdp number. we are nowhere near that. jonathan: the stock up in the do. we were talking about the consumer, and can the consumer continue to power these games premarket by 0.5%. next year. one thing we think might happen walmart raising eps guidance. is the baton gets passed from the consumer to corporations, and you see investment spending they are looking for bigger margins. kick in as a key driver of we have been talking about this economic growth. a lot of that has to do with margin test all throughout the year. technology. they expect companies to keep beating it. lisa: i just wonder where that the important thing to recognize about the role technology can is going to come from. play, obviously as a sector is it going to come from itself, it can enhance passing the costs onto consumers? profitability and the other sectors where it begins to show a real booming economy supports up, but investors are willing to pay for the earnings that the idea of 5100, 6000, to the technology, whether via sector moon. jonathan: i haven't seen the or investment, the earnings that 6000 yet. maybe we will. is able to drive. so it drives that constructive narrative next year where, if just take it in. you see this investment in this equity futures up four . tech focus, arguably some of
7:04 am
let'swhip through the price action -- let's w through the these earnings forecasts may end up coming to fruition. lisa: how much is the u.s. story price action. hip -- let's whip through the going to shift to become a global issue next year, the idea that a lot of people are seeing price action. that the upside gains really lie in europe or even japan from here? david: we do see value in markets outside the united states. i tend to think about it in terms of owning the emerging markets and renting places like europe. europe very cyclical, same thing with japan. the exposure you are getting from an industry perspective is going to be quite positive in a world coming back online, so it does -- a preference for the united states and emerging markets. at some point, growth does get back to the long-term trend.
7:05 am
eventually we get back to where we were in the aftermath of the financial crisis, and that is a world that favors things like technology, things like health care, as opposed to those more cyclical sectors. jonathan: what are the return assumptions right now, considering the gains we've had in this equity market? david: it is interesting you ask that question because effectively, a lot of the estimates haven't really changed all that much. one of the things we spent a lot of time doing over the course of the past year was thinking about terminal valuations and coming back to the theme of technology. we think you get what you pay for. so if you were just to assume reversion to the mean from a valuation perspective, the returns would be looking worse. but because we see that sector mix and that industry makes continuing to evolve in the direction of being more oriented towards technology, that is something we believe could
7:06 am
support higher valuations long-term. jonathan: could you give us some insight in supply chains at home? how is it going? david: it has been a long and arduous process. everyone has dealt with their own version of these supply chain disruptions. the way i would categorize it is you can get the labor, you can get the materials, but getting the two of them together at the same time in the same place is very challenging. tom: have you advised esther -- advised mr. dimon on this experience, given the manse you are putting up on park avenue? david: that must be where the majority of workers are. jonathan: i think he might have a different budget, too. thank you very much. have you seen that tower going up?
7:07 am
tom: i honestly haven't seen it because it is beneath 59th street. i should get down there. jonathan: just the steel going up at the moment, but it is growing. their outlook for the equity market, 3400 year end next year. 'bramo is writing the outlook as we speak. where do you think the s&p target is? [laughter] has it got a 3000 handle? lisa: i'm not that bad. 2200. jonathan: on radio, on tv, what a beautiful morning. this is bloomberg. ritika: with the first word news, ritika gupta. pfizer is taking a step to hope coronavirus patients in low and middle income countries. they will allow cheaper versions of its coronavirus pill. pfizer will not get lured -- not
7:08 am
get royalties as long as the virus is classified as a public health emergency. president biden and china's xi jinping spoke of the need for cooperation in their first virtual summit. it lasted more than three hours, but the two leaders announced no major breakthroughs. they discussed a wide range of issues, including trade, state of taiwan, and human rights. there's a sign that increased spending on home improvement is outlasting the pandemic. home depot posted better-than-expected results for the quarter. the average ticket size rose to more than $82. it is another hurdle for russia's controversial nord stream 2 gas pipeline. germany has halted the certification process needed before the link with russia can start operating. the move comes as the pipeline operator has decided to set up a german subsidiary in a bid to meet eu requirements. european gas prices are up as much as 12%. in the u.k., the labor market
7:09 am
strength and after the government benefit program for those out of work and the pandemic came to an end. companies added 160,000 people to their payrolls last month. meanwhile, job openings surged to a record high. the bank of england raised interest rates as soon as next month. global news 24 hours a day, on air and on bloomberg quicktake, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in more than 120 countries. i'm ritika gupta. this is bloomberg. ♪
7:13 am
7:14 am
secretary pete buttigieg there. your equity market already exists, -- your equity market persists, back through 1.60%. the two-year in and around 50 basis points. here's the view from td. we will catch up with priya misra and about 12 minutes. there he much looking forward to that conversation. "we believe that moderating growth and inflation amid the fiscal drag in 2022 are likely to keep fed rate hikes act they -- fed rate hikes at bay, and expect lift off only in december 2023." tom: this is a huge deal. it is a timeline that you see there, it is something i don't think many people are considering. she has a chart in there which is my absolutely favorite chart. we will talk to that.
7:15 am
jonathan:jonathan: i am come along -- jonathan: there's a ton of. lisa: -- there's a ton of uncertainty. lisa: the other part of this call is higher rates. they do see rates eventually cooling off as the fed hikes sooner. this would be a really interesting development year. -- development next year. jonathan: morgan stanley was really interesting. september 2023 the call from td. tom: there's a lot of people with a lot of different opinions. always with an important opinion , annmarie hordern. i like how "the washington post" leads with the dicey topics of the usn chinese leader yesterday. what are the dicey topics for democrats right now?
7:16 am
what is that distinction between democrat moderates and democrat liberals? annmarie: i think it has to come down to spending, and that the second part of the president's agenda, which he touted yesterday as he was signing that hard infrastructure agreement, that he wants his party to pass the second part of his economic agenda. what is so interesting for me is that this week potentially, he will get part of that win if the house votes and the cbo scores somewhat matchup with the white house. we will find out potentially as latest friday. but the cbo has indicated they may not know the inflationary impact of that agenda until january, and this is potential he something the moderates can run with. tom: i know they are not looking at home depot and walmart earnings, but this is a boom economy from two ginormous retailers. are they talking at all about
7:17 am
the overheating of the american economy? annmarie: they are every day when they talk about what is going on in the labor market. a tight labor market, wage increases. but they are incredibly concerned with elation. you could hear that when the president was speaking yesterday. he started saying we need to start talking to the electorate. i care about kitchen table problems. that is what the president said yesterday. so he understands that he wants to be able to deliver for the everyday american people, and again, you have his own party calling for the likes of hitting the spr to put more oil barrels on the market to lower gasoline prices. this is what is driving the agenda right now, especially as we come up to the holiday season . the democrats do not want to be the ones that are being called the grinch as people cannot get their shopping done in time, that your thanksgiving or christmas meal is going to cost more, and that is what they are speaking to. lisa: for your christmas tree from home depot. just talking about td securities and its outlook, one of the
7:18 am
other lines is that chair powell's future isn't certain, and we think new fed appointments will have a dovish skew. is that correct? does this administration, given some of the inflationary concerns, what this federal reserve to be perhaps on hold for longer, even if that means higher long-term rates that affect the cbo score, that affect their spending plans? annmarie: we don't know yet. all we know is comments from lael brainard, from chair powell over the course of the year. we have not dealt with this level of inflation while these individuals were in their positions, so we don't know how they are going to act. what we do know is that both governor brainard and jay powell view the labor market and inflation as they should be working in tandem, where the -- in tandem, while there have been others who have viewed this as hierarchical. whoever is going to be the next
7:19 am
fed chair is going to have to potentially deal with do you go for full employment of the labor market, or do you have to start moving quickly in terms of moving fed policy to temper inflation. lisa: is there really enough time to get chair brainard through as chair, or is the lack of a nomination at this point a tacit admission that it is jerome powell because he's the only candidate right now for consideration who could actually get confirmed in time to replace himself? annmarie: time is of the essence. when you look at the days left for the rest of the year, it is about two weeks of working days, but already you are hearing leadership say get out your grand pianos, we are going to be having christmas carols right here in washington, d.c. on the capitol. they are going to be expected to be here and not in their districts or their states as we approach the halliday's. also, his reappointment, this comes up in february, so they do
7:20 am
have january. it is not that it wouldn't be possible to get through a governor brainard to a potential chair brainard, if that is what the president chooses. jonathan: thank you. we wait and we wait to find out who is going to be the next chair. what does imminent mean? i've got no idea. annmarie: imminent for me means asap, as soon as possible. it is coming within hours. but we still don't have it, so i'm not quite sure. jonathan: thank you. we will have a domestic later about this, have a stronger conversation about why we haven't got it yet. i have we not got it? you know what is interesting for me? this market is price for a rate hike in the middle of next year, and td is at december 2023. that is an 18 month spread for something that some people think will happen in about six months time. lisa: if you think about how
7:21 am
much volatility there has been in the two-year, that is likely to continue, right? if you look at the bank of america merrill lynch move index, it is expected to continue. when does that affect risk assets? does anyone care that you've got up-and-down short-term rates that actually is the benchmark for so many borrowing costs? this is one of my key questions. jonathan: i am just going through a range of calls from td. one of the calls a steeper twos-tens curve. morgan stanley has picked up on the disconnect in this bond market. it is curious to see a deeply negative real fed funds rate of -6% in the yield curve that has actually been flatter because there is the belief the fed does have to come back in. tom: for global wall street, stay with us. the conversation with priya misra is going to be just stunning. jonathan: it comes up next. the head of global race strategy at td securities. -- global rates strategy at td security. for our audience worldwide, this is "bloomberg surveillance."
7:23 am
it's another day. and anything could happen. it could be the day you welcome 1,200 guests and all their devices. or it could be the day there's a cyberthreat. only comcast business' secure network solutions give you the power of sd-wan and advanced security integrated on our activecore platform so you can control your network from anywhere, anytime. it's network management redefined. every day in business is a big day. we'll keep you ready for what's next. comcast business powering possibilities. so many people are overweight now,
7:24 am
and asking themselves, "why can't i lose weight?" for most, the reason is insulin resistance, and they don't even know they have it. conventional starvation diets don't address insulin resistance. that's why they don't work. now there's release from golo. it naturally helps reverse insulin resistance, stops sugar cravings, and releases stubborn fat all while controlling stress and emotional eating. at last, a diet pill that actually works. go to golo.com to get yours.
7:26 am
price action. equity futures advancing zero point 04% -- advancing 0.04%. it big spread of some 700 points. 4400 four morgan stanley, near end next year, 5100 for the likes of goldman sachs. twos, tens, and 30's and the bond market. the two-year around 52 basis points. let's talk about that compared to your tenure, 1.6 077%. -- your 10 year, 1.6077%. the chart steep through q1. we start to roll over, and this is where the conversation gets interesting. morgan stanley's lisa shalett pointing out it is very curious to see a -6% real rate on the fed funds rate versus where inflation is with a 6% handle, compared to the yield curve that
7:27 am
has been flattening lately. this is what is going to divide people who think the curve can get steeper and for people who think this curve will be flatter. does the fed have to come back in and maybe come back in early? priya misra of td securities is pushing back against that. end of 2023, the fed rates. the curve doesn't get flatter. tom: strategists lose and gain their careers based on this. this is during the outlook derby , particularly on guesstimates. as we said yesterday, we've never seen a time like this. jonathan: this time is far more interesting for me. it is more interesting this time around. lisa: 100 percent. i think next year will be fascinating for the history books as well. tom: that would be a great book
7:28 am
title for lisa. bullish and boring. lisa: what we don't want to be. jonathan: i won't even push back against the boring thing. that's obvious. lisa is not boring. [laughter] tom: but that's got your attention. it will sell on i'll three. jonathan: that's your process at price action. let's say good morning to romaine bostick. romaine: a lot of people looking ahead to that retail sales data that is going to come out. if you are looking for a read on what is going on with the consumer, take a look at the results we got out of home depot and walmart. for home depot, comp sales up about 6% here. you did see a big slow down from pandemic level growth. this was still well above what the street was looking for. there was a drop off in the total number of transactions, down by about 5%, but the actual value per transactions was up. the company guiding higher here
7:29 am
on the year. those shares of about 1%. walmart shares up about 2% in the premarket. more importantly, a lot of strings and gaining share in the grocery business. not only in terms of bumping up the comp sales, but also in terms of margins. keep an eye on biogen. those shares slightly down by 0.7% after its chief scientific officer said it is going to leave. -- said he's going to leave. there's a lot of controversy about the approval of this alzheimer's drug. a lot of speculation about his departure. let's take a look at the ev space. elon musk selling more shares, bringing his total to about $7.8 billion. take a look at lucid group, up about 6% in the premarket.
7:30 am
they had their first earnings report. no real earnings or revenue to speak of here, but they add $5 billion on their balance sheet. they also at about $1.3 billion, so investors taking that is a good sign that this company does have some future, and rivian is up for four straight days. no more than double where its ipo price was. tom: this is the conversation of the day, with great respect for james bullard of the st. louis fed. for global wall street, the td securities call is simply stunning. it is mark mccormick and his resilient dollar with some nuances for next year, but leading the charge, there is priya misra, head of global rates strategy, into the far future. on the cover of your stunning report, you have the most important chart i have seen in fixed income in 20 years.
7:31 am
credit suisse showing the fed funds rate and the ois for everyone's guesstimates that we have gotten wrong. you say once again we have got it wrong. priya: this sort of tells you that rates strategists on the market doesn't always call the fed. at the market is being really torn with high inflation. so the market is pricing in the first rate hike right after when tapering ends. our view is that huge impact on inflation will start to decelerate. so growth is going to slow. and inflation has peaked. it is not obvious to us that the fed has to turn around and start hiking aggressively. we actually have the first rate hike much later than when the market is pricing in, a steeper
7:32 am
curve, the front end staying anchored. but it is ultimately a view on the economy and the outlook on the economy as we recover into this post-covid world. jonathan: it is a call that they won't change their mind, that they won't get uncomfortable. how do you get a read on that as you look not to the end of 2023, but just the next six months? priya: we always struggle with economic outlook in the fed reaction function. i think the committee is a split as the market is. i think the december dot plot which shows there are those who believe that inflation is transitory and that we should be hiking, but the fed has taken a pretty big step there. they have tapered sooner than what anyone was looking for. they are going much faster than the last time. so they are responding to the risks in this risk management approach. they are already responding
7:33 am
to the risk of high inflation. that's when i think the growth outlook is going to matter. i think the reaction function doesn't need to change. we saw difficult that was in 2013 with the taper tantrum. i don't think the fed wants to risk it. we have time to figure out that reaction function based on how the data comes out over the next six months. jonathan: do using the labor -- lisa: do using the labor market is weaker than most expect? priya: we do, particularly because of the slack. some people who have left the labor force have done so because of covid. whether it is childcare, whether you are just concerned about getting sick, they will come back. the high savings has buffered some people. they have been able to weeded out for higher wages.
7:34 am
but ultimately, that brings them in, so there's a lot more slack in the labor market. we also think a service recovery will pick up and create demand for those jobs. so it is not a weak labor market. it is just the slack where people are really divided. we think there's a lot of hidden slack, and that has become more evident in the first half. lisa: some people have been saying this is going to be a shorter and hotter cycle. is your call that that is not true, that this is going to be a long and arduous cycle, and that the fed will be patient? or that the fed already missed its window to tighten, given how much depth there is and how much momentum will decelerate next year? priya: if we compare it to the post financial crisis, we think it will be shorter than that. we did not have as much physical easing, so i would say the cycle is shorter. we just had a lot more policy
7:35 am
support. but will it be that short of an order heating where the fed will need to tighten financial conditions? i think it will be longer than the two-year cycle the market is pricing in. what is shocking is for those who believe the labor market slack is gone and the fed starts hiking mid next year, why is the in point owned -- the endpoint only 1.5%? that is a really productive outlook. tom: in the combat battle, your call is a career maker or breaker. when jon mentioned 2023, i immediately thought of mario draghi at the ecb. what does your call and the failure of those guesstimates mean for the ecb and lagarde?
7:36 am
it hugely advantages her if she gets a ms. recall. -- a misra call. priya: they are all trying to adjust policy in an evolving economic outlook where one of the structural impacts of covid is, is it going to have impacts on inflation that all central banks need to adjust? it is a big question. cross market trades will make sense. you've got the ecb and the fed on one side that have run below the inflation target for so long that they can afford to be patient. then you've got the bank of england, the bank of canada, economies that we think will be forced to start that process of normalization. jonathan: fascinating trades that could come off the back of that. we would love a comment from you on what bill dudley, the former new york fed president, said in the last 24 hours.
7:37 am
he said the fed funds rate would not top out at around 1.75%, were many people in this market think it will. granted, he believes the murkier the crystal ball gets, the further you go out. priya: that is not our call. we have the endpoint of the hiking cycle closer to 2.5%. i hope bill is right, that the economy, maybe because of covid or all of the technology being put in, that productivity does move higher. if that is what is happening, i am all for higher rates. if productivity is higher or maybe labor force growth grows, then i think the economy can handle it. we had a lot more debt in the system, so i think if the fed raises rates up to 3%, the
7:38 am
economy is more levered. we have been watching productivity, and there has been that silver lining that we can just take labor force productivity that much higher. jonathan: super sharp. love the outlook. we are going to spend, this afternoon reading it too. priya misra there of td securities. the number one response i think i've had as executor what priya was talking about. can this economy handle 3% to 4% interest rates from the federal reserve? tom: i think it is an original economy. let's dovetail the deadly view, which so different from the -- the dudley view, which is
7:39 am
so different from the misra view, into this economy. what is it going to be like nobody has a clue. jonathan: i think the argument of bill dudley is that is how far you have to go. your equity market unchanged. what a moment on wall street. on radio, on tv, what a beautiful morning. i am going to keep saying it, and new york city. this is bloomberg. rk city. this is bloomberg.
7:43 am
>> what we are advocating for our capabilities that are going to be key to the backbone of the next century of american leadership. we are talking about not only bridges and roads, getting things prepared, but actually getting things connected so that we have more digital infrastructure that can actually evolve over time. jonathan: the chairman, president, and ceo of z mitts --
7:44 am
fc mets usa. 1.60% on tense. there's a divide on wall street over the next move. the market looking for the something in the middle of next year. morgan stanley can with q1 2023. td going with december 2023. others looking for the second half of 2022. tom: james bullard coming up, and ira jersey will join us in moments on the stunning td securities call. right now, david wilson on the stunning growth stocks. dave: another way to put it is how many more value stocks there are relative to growth. inc. about it. for the last several years, you can go back to the late to thousands and you see value doing relatively poorly by comparison with growth.
7:45 am
lori calvasina at rbc capital markets took a step further because it is not like the russell 1000 growth and value index has a fixed number of stocks. they vary over time, deepening on which companies best meet the characteristics. so what has happened is you see an increasing number of value stocks relative to growth. think about it in simple economic terms. if the supply of something goes up in the demand doesn't come of the price goes down. that is what has been happening in large measure over the years from value stocks. you see the number of shares as part of the in value relative to growth. tom: what are you seeing in the outlooks of small caps? dave: things are positive at this point. it is really a matter of the rising tide lifting all boats. if the economy stays strong in men just to sustain growth, the
7:46 am
smaller companies should do relatively well. it has almost risen as much as the s&p 500 this year, so there is room for a recovery there, too. tom: we need to continue this discussion for global wall street. ira jersey joins us, and the heritage here is important. ira jersey had the privilege of working at credit suisse, where they invented the chart which shows decisively how wrong strategists have been. the fed interest rate market overlaid with a guesstimate is measured by ois. is wall street going to be wrong again in calling for higher interest rates?
7:47 am
ira: the market is usually very optimistic about how quickly the fed can move. i am in mixed emotions here as to when the fed might go because with inflation as high as it is, if it continues to be a big concern, certainly the federal reserve will try to get ahead of that, at least hiking early and then may be a little bit slower than the market expects right now. but the question is when are they going to lift off. that first lift off is going to be very important for market pricing because once they do, the market is going to keep on pricing for additional hikes, probably every other meeting or something like that. if they hike in june, that means you could potentially price the market for three hikes. right now the market is priced for a little bit more than one hike in 2022. basically, a september hike with maybe some chance of a december. that is the point of those
7:48 am
charts that we put out, that td put it down -- put out again today. jonathan: this is priya misra of td securities a little earlier on. priya: the fed has tapered sooner than anyone was looking for. they are tapering much faster than the last time or analyst estimates, so they are responding to the risks in this risk management approach. they are already responding to the risk of higher inflation. by the middle of next year, that is when it is going to get really tricky because if they start to hike, that is when the growth outlook is going to matter. jonathan: build on that why you think the fed won't blink in the first half of next year. ira: one is they want to be somewhat pretty double. number two, they are not sure how the economy is going to shape up. even though you have inflation reasonably high, real growth
7:49 am
rates look like they are going to remain very low, if not negative. look at real wages right now, and wages adjusted for inflation are actually negative on a year on year basis. so the fed is going to be worried, do we really want to clamp down on demand when a large portion said they are not demand driven? that is not something monetary policy can help. jay powell mentioned that several times in his last couple of press conferences. we did think the fed was going to start to taper this year because the recovery was reasonably strong, and you don't need the additional accommodation. i don't the economy needs the additional accommodation but the federal reserve has been provided with all of these asset purchases. but that is a different issue than whether or not they are going to hike and how early they are going to hike. lisa: i do wonder if there is a
7:50 am
sense of what the terminal rate can be, how high it can go before it torpedoes the economy. we did hear from the former fed president of the new york office, bill dudley, it could get to 3% to 4%. do you think that is reasonable? ira: i think that is probably on the high side. what is really interesting about this is even though the market is starting to price for a 2022 liftoff, the long-term expectation is only for 1.5% fed funds rate, so the terminal rate right now as it is priced is very low, at least in my estimation. i think we are somewhat closer to 2%, maybe 25 basis points either side of 2% is more realistic than the 1.5% we are priced right now. we put that out in one of our research notes just yesterday, noting that the market thinks early hikes, but not very many of them. i think that is probably a little bit too pessimistic.
7:51 am
the market miss prices, but it can mispriced both ways. it can mispriced how quickly the fed is going to like, but also how low the terminal rate is going to be. jonathan: thank you, as always, for weighing in. that is what catches my eye. for the people who think the fed goes early, just the amount of hikes they think come subsequently, which is in many at all. tom: i did not expect coming today at like 5:52, and makeup was a little slow, i have never seen this ever. and it shows how unusual this covid economy is. jonathan: andrew sheets is coming up next to weigh in on this, morgan stanley's chief cross asset strategist. this is bloomberg. ♪
7:56 am
>> stocks are still the only game in town. i think that gets lost in this equity market discussion. >> we think this bull market has legs still. >> liquidity is slowly going to be drawn away through the course of next year. >> the market is telling us that this economy might actually be re-accelerating. >> this is "bloomberg surveillance" with tom keene, jonathan ferro, and lisa abramowicz. tom: good morning, everyone. a simulcast, bloomberg radio, bloomberg television as well. extraordinary tuesday. there's no other way to pu
37 Views
IN COLLECTIONS
Bloomberg TV Television Archive Television Archive News Search ServiceUploaded by TV Archive on