>> from the heart of where innovation, money, and power collide, in silicon valley and beyond, this is "bloomberg technology." with emily chang.

emily: i am emily chang in san francisco. coming up,musk's skepticism about pots has one investor suing the company. more on the threat to blow up the $44 billion buyout. plus, the future of flying cars. ed ludlow on the ground where leaders and investors have gathered. he will bring us an exclusive interview later this hour. my exclusive conversation on the heels of apple announcing its offering a competing version of by now, pay later. all of that in a moment. first a look at the markets.

apple and microsoft driving shares higher. katie greifeld with us now. katie: like you said, it was a risk on day thanks to tech. we saw a lot of energy in the last hour. the s&p and nasdaq finishing 1% higher give or take. as a result, volatility breathed a sigh of relief. the vix at 24. something to watch in the days to come. bitcoin, even though you saw a resurgence in some big tech names, not as much love for bitcoin. the coinage did trade above $31,000 a coin. i'm thinking about twitter. elon musk threatening to end the deal. that caused shares to drop 1.5% yesterday, today they gave back all of those losses.

twitter shares just about flat on the week, 10th of a percent lower. trading around $40 per share, couple of cents above that. if you look at the spread to elon musk's offer price, $54.20 a share. just over $14 between the prices. it was even larger back in may, but still a lot of daylight. emily: katie greifeld, thank you. an update on twitter and this elon musk saga. a shareholder has sued the company in delaware. he owns five shares, and he wants a judge to force the social media platform to hand over the platform -- it's become a hot button issue. max joins us now with more. this on the back of the texas attorney general opening

investigation into the spot -- bot issue. max: when this deal started, we are seeing the flipside of that. these lawsuits which are about real issues, they feel very much like follow on, bandwagon, trying to find ways to backup the claims elon musk has been trying to put forward. these are claims there is not a lot of basis for, not a lot of reason beyond elon musk's personal experience. emily: twitter says it is cooperating. have they handed over the information or not? the perception is they are trying to hide something. max: that is where the lawsuit, the claims -- not that there are

too many bots, but twitter is not disclosing properly. this is going to be a long dispute, lots of room for interpretation. the way twitter could prove it does not have as many bots would be to turn over user data. you don't want to turn over user data, someone continuously tweeting about the deal. you can see someone who would want to hold back to some extent. emily: what do you think the odds are that the deal goes through? max: it does not feel likely. that chart showing the gap between the offer and share price, it feels like elon musk is doing whatever he can to either get out of this or get through it at a lower price. we are seeing twitter saying we had a deal, we are moving

forward. if possible this could close though it does not feel likely. emily: you are also covering sheryl sandberg's resignation, you have people wondering why, why now? you are looking at her legacy, not just at facebook and google but on the internet, saying she has left us with the future of targeted ads. talk to us about her influence on the internet at large. max: this has been lost to some extent. in part because of the way sheryl sandberg chose to make the announcement. she talked about in 2007, when she first met mark zuckerberg, she thought of the internet as this funny place, which of course is totally crazy considering sheryl sandberg had built google into this advertising monolith. she was already a well-known,

influential executive, who had been known for building the adsense business at google, these personalized, data-driven ads. what we think of when we think of internet advertising. sheryl sandberg was the warm out there talking about how every business owner needed to adopt this. we saw her do the same thing at facebook. as she moves forward, this creates complications. her biggest accomplishment, creating this scaffolding of personalized ads, generating billions of dollars, it's much more controversial than it was before. her greatest achievement but also a vulnerability. emily: apple has been adding more privacy-focused features, we saw a more yesterday, this has impacted and hurt meta-and

facebook's business model. do you think targeted ads are eventually going away? max: that's hard to say. clearly, mark zuckerberg things this is not the future. why are charles samberg and mark zuckerberg this wonderful partnership, extremely lucrative, why are they parting ways? part of the reasons is zuckerberg is focused on the metaverse which is less dependent on advertising. we have seen apple throw up barriers for companies like meta to track people across different websites. that said, just because apple creates privacy rules, it's not going to stop websites from collecting first party data. inside of apple, inside of facebook. these companies have tons of data, that's never going away,

targeted advertising will be a huge business. the question is, is it the growth business it once was? that is to be determined. emily: thank you. coming up, the ipo winter. some call it the end of the era of free money. we will have more on that, next. plus, we will kickoff the bloomberg technology summit. the theme is looking forward. we have a host of powerful players in technology. i am sitting down with andy jassy for an exclusive conversation, you don't want to miss it. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: this first six months have been the weakest first half for ipos in years. how long will it weigh on wall street and silicon valley? i want to talk about all of this and more. we have seen multiple firms come up with their version of rip good times. guest: what we saw was the news trickling down slowly to founders, and i would say about a month and a half ago i was hearing about the slowdown and

now i'm having conversations with founders where this is looking like a downturn, there is still some denial. yes, we are looking at a downturn and we should not panic. we are see stage investors and beer in the business of taking chances and hoping they will figure out the business models, conserve a little bit of capital. emily: how big is the downturn going to be? alda: at least at the early stage, we are hoping they can find a product will want. at that stage, we are always in the business of taking chances. emily: are fewer rounds right now for our founder saying i'm not going to try? alda: i have been advising

companies to delay, i think vcs are exhausted of bullish markets, and i know so many that are looking forward to taking some time off. it's not a great time unless you are already planning on fundraising to shake the trees. emily: what should founders do? alda: there are plenty of ways to cut costs that don't involve raising capital, and certainly there are leases they may have that they can sublet. we put out a blog post about how it's possible to cut a small percentage of staff. that would reduce 20% of labor which tend to be 75% of the budget. emily: you are advising layoffs? alda: we are advising to not panic, take time to prepare if

you need to raise capital, prepare your story. think about cost-cutting measures including cutting back on snacks, retreats, offices. emily: suggesting that employers cut from five to four days a week is interesting. tell me more about that idea. employees across the board, contractors? alda: it depends on the teams involved. i think we could afford to cut a certain amount of days or salaries proportionally, versus taking an across-the-board pay cut, which my husband's company did during the start of covid. emily: what company was that?

alda: i don't know if i can disclose. they have come out of covid just fine. emily: let's talk about the road ahead. are you still looking -- are you still putting money out now? alda: we are in the process of looking for companies. i have the benefit for being in this market through a couple of downturns. we are looking at pitches, talking to founders. it's true that i personally was busy over the last couple of years and looking forward to taking some time off. emily: when you look ahead, what are the sectors, the trends you think are actually going to flourish?

what are you most excited about? alda: there are a lot of sectors i'm excited about. for one, i'm interested in the markets that appeal to consumers that may not have received software transformations in businesses. another industry is beauty, i think that's one. it generally appeals to more female or underrepresented groups of the population. i'd be remiss if i did not mention crypto. alda: we have talked to your partner at nosing. thank you for sharing your view. they were once bitter rivals, but they are teaming up. companies have announced what they are calling a long-term partnership.

it will connect to uber freight. it comes after a few months after the companies ended a long battle. waymo's trucking services expected to run on uber's network within a year. both ceos will be joining us at the bloomberg tech summit tomorrow, right here with me on the show. coming up, we are getting a status update on air taxis. an extensive interview with joby aviation and ed ludlow joining us. ed: we're on the ground, and also up in the air. all things that fly, electric, mobility. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: let's go live to arkansas. ed ludlow is live on the ground at this invite only gathering, over $1 trillion of assets in the room. ed: it's one guy everyone wants to speak to. the ceo of joby aviation. investors, other ceos, corporate's that want to collaborate. what is your message? guest: >> really exciting -- what is really exciting is sustainable aviation, how do we reduce the impact on our

environment. ed: we're talking electric. takeoff and landing. i quality flying taxi. where are you in your cycle? that's the other conversation. joeben: we have been working on this for more than a decade. it's a fantastic future that it's coming through today. we have in flying since 2017, certifying since 2018, we had exciting news today on additional progress on our certification program. the momentum is building. ed: sounds like you have a high opinion of the faa. i have heard from others they are frustrated. you are happy with where things stand. joeben: the faa has done an incredible job with the industry

over decades to make aviation the safest mode of transportation we have. it's orders of magnitude safer than any other mode, that's really exciting, that is the faa mission. ed: talk to me about the aircraft themselves. where are we, what is the target? joeben: we have just completed our pilot production facility. we have a close partnership with toyota. we are working with them on plans that will produce hundreds of aircraft per year. ed: the idea is you work with toyota to learn from their experience, or do use their facilities, how does that play out in practice? joeben: toyota is amazing. they are known for being able to build complex machines at an incredible -- affordable price

with reliability. when we look at who we wanted to partner with to take this to the scale it needs to go, beyond the scale aviation has been done before, we selected toyota. ed: i was chatting with the alaska air ceo. he is an engineer just like you. he has some skepticism about the use case for factory electric in long-distance flying, larger aircraft. what is your take on that? you believe it's essential from a carbon, environmental standpoint. joeben: he is absolute right. i have been working on electric aircraft since 1993. we have had order of magnitude improvement in energy and batteries, but we have a real urgent problem we need to solve today. aviation is one of the highest

impact things we do on a daily basis, and it's imperative we reduce that footprint. battery electric only moves you -- it's valuable when you want to move across town or city's that are close together. the solution is hydrogen electric. hydrogen is three times specific. ed: there is also the use case. i know you are focused on the flying taxi. talk to me about other use cases. joeben: we are excited about moving people across town, but there is a valuable use case in moving goods. we have an amazing partnership where we are significantly reducing operating costs, improving reliability, and

making it possible for them to move goods around and around the u.s., people in a much more efficient way. ed: the government relationship that could be lucrative. give me a timeline for when this is a substantive business. joeben: we are going to build this slowly. we are not going to be able to turn it on on day one. again, today we are building tens of aircraft, and the next few years we will have the capacity to build hundreds of aircraft. we need orders of magnitude more aircraft in order to bring this vision to life, being able to move people to where they want to live, work. if you take it back is removed from walking to riding horses to

the railroad and automobile, it reshaped civilization. ed: i'm sorry to cut you off. the ceo of joby aviation, fascinating conversation. he is going to take me for a ride. emily: ed, you will have to keep us posted. tomorrow you are sitting down with cathie wood to talk about her version -- vision for the future. you do not want to miss ed's interview. coming up, i'm joined by a top cyber security official in the biden administration. what are the biggest threats facing us? how prepared are we? she joins us, next. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: welcome back to

"bloomberg technology". one of the biggest threat to the united states could be the lack of technology in the government. there is a very real concern the u.s. is falling behind. my next guest and others working in the biden administration is trying to fix that. joining me now, the chief of staff at the security agency. it is great to see you in person. there is this new pentagon ai chief who wants to crack the bureaucratic and show when it comes to some of these issues. how would you rate how modernized technology is at this moment and how much better do you want to be? kiersten: we are always assessing legacy infrastructure, what we are working from and where we are going.

what is so critical is you have leaders across the government, agencies, dod, the national cyber director, will all appreciate the value in need to bring technology into government. there are so many efforts that have been legislated over the last year that enforced and encouraged that spending. we know government can't secure the nation or industry by itself, we have to be working together to identify the technologies. we have seen a lot of efforts that are creating resources and an enormous amount of money, the budget is over $2 billion to bring that technology in and modernize the government. emily: last i heard there was 500,000 open jobs in cybersecurity. is that for real? what are the consequences of that? kiersten: i would say the number is more.

when we look at cybersecurity jobs, everybody is part of the cyber workforce. when we think about the accountability and responsibility, we all have that role. i'm hesitant to look at a specific number, because it also pigeonholes what the workforce looks like. one of the things we are focused on building a diverse workforce which is not just about racial diversity, it's really looking at diversity of thinking. i am excited that we are launching the second neuro-diversity pilot in the federal government where we are bringing individuals into the government to create a more inclusive workplace. emily: how would you rate the level of cyber threats from russia at this moment? kiersten: when we look at what happened with the invasion of ukraine, it's a marathon. this is a long-term battle.

as we see this, we have to appreciate what we have learned. one thing was the cyber collaborative which was partnering in real time with industries, we set up slack channels, we developed the plan, the computer emergency response team, we have shared that with industry partners and we are able to see a much better profile and threat picture. emily: some critics say the war caught the u.s. government flat-footed and we are seeing the shifting of responsibility to the private sector. kiersten: i would disagree with that. in november, we put out something called shield up, in anticipation of a potential --

look at things like multifactor authentication, and what we have heard is that was a very helpful tool, because it gave them a heads up on not what the specific threat was going to be, but the need to create resiliency. emily: there is an effort to scale up and broaden membership, how is that effort going, what would you like to see the role peak? kiersten: those of us that have been in the space so long, the term lost its meaning. we are seeing this real-time information sharing. we are building this out to where the threat has been. we brought in financial institutions, the energy sector because those are where we had the greatest concerns. this is one of these delivered processes to bring in the right

partners as we are moving out. emily: what do you think businesses need to do? kiersten: we would like to see lowering threshold for reporting , but importantly, we are at a place where we need to ensure security is innovation. where security is a differentiator. that would go a long way. the ability to see security as a positive effort. if we see startups take on security as something that is an advantage and to make the business case, we will see a lot of progress. i have to make a plug for multifactor authentication. we are calling it more than a password. just to get everyone to take that on. the other piece is organizations focused so much on their own security, but now we have a

responsibility with the increased threat landscape to secure the digital ecosystem. so we can raise the resilience of both the public and private sector. emily: thank you so much for joining us. kiersten is one of the many featured speakers at our tech summit tomorrow. it starts new eastern, 9:00 a.m. pacific. we're talking cybersecurity, crypto, e-commerce, a whole lot more. coming up, doug etf's. how are they faring? we will discuss. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: time now for our crypto report. sonali basak is here with more. sonali: when you look at the decline in bitcoin, you look at what happening in the etf world which are often tied to stocks, bitcoin, the performance much worse. sometimes almost twice as bad. katie greifeld found the six worst-performing non-leveraged etf's were tied to crypto companies. blockchain, again, nearly double what you are seeing in bitcoin.

again, they are holding the likes of coinbase, marathon digital, galaxy digital. we talked about the equities trading alongside bitcoin have seen a bigger drop in many regards, and that is what you are seeing in the etf. emily: thank you for that update. i want to talk about all of that and more with matthew ball and matt cogan. both of you are out with your own news, launching a new index fund along with multi-coin capital. matthew, tell us more about this new fund? matthew: the goal was to provide qualified purchasers an opportunity to divest in and i diversified index of tokens that are consistent with the metaverse. our goal is to take a look at the entire ecosystem, focus on liquidity, stress test

securities and provide yet another diversified opportunity. emily: matt, the fund is only open to qualified purchasers. how do you identify those? matt: individuals in the u.s. that have $5 million or more in liquid assets. this is one corner of the market. a big story is how it act open the market before it expanded. the metaverse is exciting an early opportunity and that is why it is appropriate for this market. we would love to open it up more broadly, but that is where we are today. emily: matthew, your metaverse etf is down almost 40% so far this year. yes, so much of the market is down. why should investors think this etf is the right call? matthew: the perspective is it

is about 39% down year to date. a reflection commencement with the expectation. 13 trillion in annual gdp will come from the sector. as it relates to the specific product, i see it as another asset class. the etf is designed for public market exposure and the cryptocurrency and blockchain environment. emily: this is it that you see on the future. matt, how do you see this fund evolving? matt: it's going to be a big deal.

five years or 10 years out, a lot of people feel confident that our immersion in the digital world is going to increase. it should grow, become, name, and we should get more assets in the fun. we are early in this opportunity. five years from now this will be a much larger asset class, these assets will be more familiar, and investors have the opportunity to access them today. they are able to get in early, megatrend. emily: i would love to get your thoughts on the crypto winter that seems to be ongoing. bitcoin can't seem to break out of it. where is the spelling? -- where is this going? matt: we are seeing a macro

induced crypto winter. if you look under the hood, the fundamentals continue to be strong. developer activity is strong. new product launches are strong. coinbase is doing interesting things. all of this great activity is going on. we need macro markets to normalize and you will see the impact. i suspect we have a few months ago before the macro markets normalize, and once they do, you will see crypto rebounding. that continues to be true in this market. emily: it can be hard for investors to believe in the future whether it's crypto in -- the queen jubilee was this way, we saw a hologram of the queen. how do you see this as an indication of where the

metaverse and some of these future technologies are headed? matthew: the most important thing is the advent of graphics based computing, 3d simulations to solve problems that previously were outside of our reach, while also recognizing younger generations, i grew up using text, my identity was reflected by an email address, growing into more multimedia and now we see through minecraft and others that is reflecting through 3d objects, avatars, 3d spaces. the confluence of graphics based computing on the industrial side mixed with societal and behavioral changes, posted by new technological paradigms such as blockchain and xor hardware gives me confidence in >> around the corner.

holograms is imminent. we're going to see it deployed globally in retail stores. emily: we will be watching. good to have you both. coming up, apple getting into buy now, pay later. what does it mean? next, an exclusive interview. this is bloomberg. ♪

>> apple pay later lets you split the cost into four equal payments, spread over six weeks with zero interest and no fees. apple pay later is available everywhere apple pay is accepted.

emily: that was apple unveiling its new buy now, pay later, allowing customers to split purchases through apple pay with four payments, interest rate. that announcement because chairs of the firm that offers a similar service to fall. joining me now exclusively is firm's ceo. for question of what this means for your firm and other services. we want to know how big -- the firm has lined up big merchants embedded in what you offer like walmart, amazon, major airlines. will apple penetrate these merchants? guest: first of all, i think they are quite significant. just as importantly, that is not why i am not worried about apple pay entering the space, they are focused on the convenience of

the six-week product which i think is great and there are plenty of competitors that should be worried. that spells concern for folks specialized in the short-term product. we spent 10 years building out technology, partnerships, integrations, food underwriting models so we can offer plans from six weeks to 16 months. that is unique and special. it involves not just data and underwriting, capital partnerships, figuring out how to manage markets, interest rates, etc. feel good about the sheer complexity about what we

reasons about apple pay later. one, they chose the right things , no late fees, no gimmicks, that's the right message. it sent the right statement to the rest of the world. credit cards have some real competition, and it's great to hear companies as powerful as apple say it out loud. part two, telling the world, the consumer that this is a thing that is better than credit cards, including apple's own credit card. we feel like this creates a nice -- emily: apple does have a huge potential base of one billion iphone users. that has to be too big for even the largest merchants to ignore. how do you think about that? are you preparing for a cut of what a firm gets to go to apple? max: in the world of truth zero-sum that would be a concern, for context, in the u.s., buy now pay later is sub 5% of commerce. i don't think there is much concern. when paypal announced their entry into the space, everyone was holding their breath, we said at the time this is going

to register because there is so much ground to cover. we are all competing with credit cards and credit cards are competing with cash. not concerned at all. emily: i have to ask about your preorder -- broader view. elon musk says he has a bad feeling about the economy. a competitor, maybe not apples to apples, they are laying off 10%. how did you feel about the economy? max: we are not just not laying off, we're actually hiring. laying off, no comment on elon. in my world, when you feel the need to hire, that means you have not done the necessary thinking and working in the past. we are hiring because we have real needs to grow the product, build new things, deliver value.

as the economy teeters on the session, downturn, it's going to get worse before it gets better, we have a mission to deliver spending power in a responsible way and improve the topline growth of our partners. we take it very seriously. we are gearing up for time to shine for growth, new products, new ways of delivering value. that is why we need more people. no time to rest for us. emily: a keyword you used is responsible. we are hearing more and more stories of young people getting in trouble with buy now pay later. are you doing more to warn some of your potential customers about the risk of taking out a number of loans, the longer-term impact it could have? this has drawn the scrutiny of regulators. max: first of all, i had said it

before, i think it's important to regulators understand how this flavor works. as they dig in deeper, they will see this is a better product than a credit card because quite a cards allow you to refinance your own debt in perpetuity which is not that different from payday lending. it's really important regulators see what buy now pay later can do, which i believe is a healthier consumer product. two, it's important for consumers to understand when they are overextended. the reason we chose to never charge late fees is because we are permanently aligned with the borrower. if the borrower is late, banks and credit cards make more money. that is a bed -- we don't make a penny if consumers can pay us back. if they are late, we have to make the way of not making the mistake again. the lack of faith fees is a powerful motivator for us to design products and improve only as far as we believe people will pay us back.

the other side, you have to help people build credit history. the firm has always reported and furnished information to the bureaus specifically so consumers can build history with credit bureaus. the majority of mike competitors do not do that. we are very committed to that. we feel like we are doing a lot on the underwriting side and we will do more. emily: the ceo and cofounder of a firm. thank you for joining us so quickly. that does it for this edition of the show. huge state tomorrow, the bloomberg technology summit is happening. the theme is looking forward. andy jassy, uber, waymo, the ceo of mastercard as well. ♪