>> from the heart of where innovation, money, and power collide, in silicon valley and beyond, this is "bloomberg technology" with emily chang in san francisco. ♪

emily: i am emily chang, and this is "bloomberg technology." coming up in the next hour, tiktok is under fire over a challenge that involves cooking chicken with nyquil. we will have the details understand that led to a warning from the fda. plus, looking for the next big thing after posing $300 million in new funding. i will talk to them about the next move. first bloomberg, the outgoing ceo jesse powell talks about why he is stepping down. also what he thinks about jp morgan ceo jamie dimon: crypto tokens "decentralized ponzi schemes." first i want to get a look at the markets. all about the fed, the central bank raised rates 75 basis points. stocks including tech and most

major digital currencies swung between gains and losses. learning as to break it down is ed ludlow in new york. ed: it was a roller coaster afternoon. 75-basis point hike as expected. the surprise and the more hawkish element in the afternoon was the forecast on where rates go. 4.3% by the end of the year, 4.6% in the terminal rate in 2023. the market figuring out what the fed is prepared to do in terms of fighting inflation and giving the economy some pain. the generations behind me of the nasdaq 100, the tech-heavy index, there were big swings. ultimately we closed down 1.8%. on the equation of inflation fighting against pain, here is what fed chair jay powell had to say. chairman powell: there is a possibility that we go to a certain level that we are confident in and stay there for some time.

but we are not at that level. clearly today, we have just moved probably into the very lowest level of what might be restrictive. certainly my view and review of the committee, there is a ways to go. ed: we saw the same gyrations in equity markets go through the digital tokens like bitcoins which hang out after 3-month low. not a lot of news driving markets. pain in megacaps. apple was one of the biggest point laggards. one company that did hold onto gains was nvidia. they have their conference at the moment. analysts really bullish about their latest chip. and they will develop a chip for certain was driving. at one point, cepton was up 4.5%, its biggest jump since june. emily: all right, we will see you later in the show.

the fda has issued a warning that a new tiktok challenge could be dangerous. the so-called "sleepy chicken challenge," is when people cook their chicken in nyquil. tiktok, meanwhile will ban fundraising for politicians and government accounts on the platform. to discuss is brooks alex rinker. how big would this have to get for the fda to weigh in? alex: it got big enough for parents and folks to complain, which is typically what happens for these companies. social platforms play a bit of whackamole, searching down these challenges. we saw the really dangerous tide pods challenge a few years ago on the other social platforms. but this one does seem like tiktok has stopped this one. if you search for that term right now on the app it sends you to a warning basically about dangerous challenges and fads.

i will say that there are a lot of scary-type challenges, weird information that pops up on the platforms that doesn't always get folks from the fda to get involved, so clearly this was one that they felt like they needed to jump in on. i will say, you search for "sleepy chicken" and those quotes have been taken down. i think it illustrates the challenges these platforms have when it comes to looking down on misinformation like this. emily: we found some of them, but decided not to show them to our viewers, for obvious reasons. perhaps even bigger news, the decision on politicians and governments and not allowing them to make money on the platform, can you explain how this works? alex: of. tiktok came today with a pretty significant expansion of its ban on political ads and political

content ahead of the u.s. midterms. in the past historically, tiktok has banned advertisement from governments and politicians, and now it is taking that a step further and saying that these individuals also cannot fundraise. so there is no soliciting of campaign donations, not asking for money if you are a politician or government entity. they are also funding these accounts from accessing any moneymaking tools on the platform, things like keeping from users or gifting, or things like the creator found, which is a fund that pays out users with a lot of followers for the number of views and engagements that they get on the app. you have heard about this argument before from "bloomberg technology, you heard the tiktok chief operating office in front of a senate panel make this argument last week. they like to attest that they are an entertainment platform, not a place for politics. some of these prohibitions and moderating of this type of content back that up, but it is

a very notable piece of news, particularly in this election season, and as we start getting fired up about the next presidential election which will come closely on the heels of the midterms this year. emily: how does this compare to what meta, instagram and twitter have done in terms of their stance on politicians making money? alex: tiktok and twitter both have completely banned political ads, so there is no moneymaking there. on meta'platform, facebook and instagram, those ads are able to be there. i am still seeing content on the platform soliciting donations, so it seems tiktok is taking it a step further than their big tech peers. but social media platforms tend to exchange ideas and it will be something we will be watching closely, particularly if there are any dust-ups with facebook were instagram in this election season. emily: alex barinka, thank you

very much. coming up,'s firm just raised $230 million. where will that money go in the downturn? eric hippeau joins us next to talk about that. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: lerer hippeau, one of new york's top venture capital funds , just announced plans to invest 230 million dollars in early stages. the former ceo is also back as managing partner. joining me now is eric hippeau,

managing partner at lerer hippeau. great to have you back with us. tell us what the fundraising environment was like, given a very challenging macroeconomic backdrop. eric: good to be with you. the majority of these new funds were in fact raised last year, and this is our 12th year. these are early-stage and late-stage, so we have done quite well, and we have very loyal lp's we have been able to capture some new ones as well, so it has not been exceptionally hard. i would emerging that today, for a new party, it would be pretty difficult. emily: so, how is that changing macroenvironment changing your strategy and where you are going to place your bets? eric: we are quite well-known

for our consumer companies, companies like warby parker and casper and many others. but in more recent years, we have also been very focused on b2b, enterprise software. we are less known for that, but we do have have our investments in those areas. those are at the moment very exciting, and we are looking forward to balancing our consumer business with our b2b business. emily: venture capitalists are announcing big funds left and right, but it seems like there's not a lot of places to put this money. is it just a lot of dry powder sitting on the sidelines that is piling up while valuations come down? and the economy resets? eric: there is a record amount of dry powder, as you say. we are finding that funding at the seed and precede level, our specialty, continues at the

normal pace. series a as well. our companies are getting funded. but where things are much slower is in the later stages, series b and beyond, and that has to do with the fact that late-stage investors really not sure about how to price, how to value companies. but as soon as the market settles in the later stage, there will be plenty of money to be put to work. emily: so are you waiting for valuations to come down, is that what i hear you saying? eric: where we invest at the seed, valuations have moderated. they have not yet come down to pre-2021 levels. but we take a very long view. we invest in a good year or in a bad year. our companies will start maturing years down the road, so

we find valuations to be more attractive today, for sure, but more importantly, we have more time to do our work. there isn't the frenzy that existed last year when people wanted to close their rounds in a matter of days. now we are able to close a round in a matter of weeks, giving us more time to do our work and our due diligence. emily: what is your take on, the rate hike from the fed, they seem to be continuing. her is that impacting your outlook? eric: the biggest impact for venture capital at the moment has to do with the fact that the ipo market is dead in the water. so companies that wanted to go public this year are postponing that particular event, and that always has the effect on the m&a market as well. if the ipo market is slow, the m&a market is slow as well. last year we saw a record amount of liquidity.

we returned a record back to our limited partners. this year, it is much slower. but again, we take the long view, you have a down year, we have an up year, but over a period of time, it doesn't really matter. emily: eric hippeau of lerer hippeau, it was good to have you here. thank you for stopping by. eric: thank you, emily. emily: coming up, cracking ceo jesse powell, stepping down. what it means for the future of the group to exchange. of a conversation with him coming up next. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: a quick check of the markets again. i want to bring back our ed ludlow, who has been watching a few more things. what else is catching your eye? ed: so much happened on wednesday afternoon. as a reminder, the fed raised rates 75 basis points. the hawkish surprise, officials saw 4.3% by the end of 2022, 4.6% terminal rate going into 2023 or in 2023. behind me is the corners of the technology market, it was the megacaps and the u.s. shares of chinese listed companies that fell the most. vm ware down 2.6%. we talk about why we keep going on about interest rates, why everyday do a standard part of you and say rates are projected to do this.

it is because a rates discount the present value of future profits. for tech companies including the meme stocks, including the nonprofit corners of the tech market, they have not got any profit. they are trading at very high multiples. that was an area of the market we looked to. a really interesting part of the market was aerospace and defense. you heard president putin of russia talking about mobilizing troops and talk about annexation of certain parts of ukraine, of course that war is ongoing. at first defense stocks have been much higher, but post-fed, they declined 9%. some headlines crossing the bloomberg terminal in the last few minutes from salesforce, one of the companies you and i discussed more often which is up 3% in after-hours. . the company saying it has a four year 2026 revenue target of $50 billion. why does that matter? in full year 2021, salesforce

had a revenue of $35 billion. so as part of their investor day presentation in san francisco on wednesday, they have been telling investors what their longer-term expectations are, and that expectation is to boost revenue on a full year basis in a meaningful way, to add $50 billion of sales by full-year 2026. i know we will be keeping a close eye on that stock. emily: absolutely. i am actually interviewing the salesforce co-ceo marc benioff tomorrow at dreamforce. will get his input on the broader market moves. i am also curious what he things about adobe buying figma in the middle of a downturn. it will be interesting to get his thoughts, given salesforce but slack -- bought slack,

and it will certainly be interesting to get his thoughts as the fed makes these decisions. ed: he has an opinion on everything, but he is no stranger to mergers & acquisitions either. actually, salesforce has gotten quiet in the last few weeks or months, you and i used to cover them a lot pre-pandemic and during the pandemic period. this is obviously a company that has decent sales, but also a really higher-margin business, and marc benioff is a man of many passion projects, and i am sure you will discuss this with him, too. emily: absolutely, it will be a great one on the thursday show. thank you. meantime, as claimant week is in full swing in new york, california governor gavin newsom spoke about the state environmental challenges and how to avoid blackouts like what we have seen in past years. he spoke with my colleague david westin from the sidelines of the u.n.'s climate action race 20

and the resilience forum supported by bloomberg philanthropies. governor newsom: we were distressed test. we had no blackouts. we were challenged, but we kept our wits and we are maintaining principles that will allow us more resilient in the future. so i don't think you have to sacrifice one for the other. i would argue not transitioning is a bigger risk. >> transitioning is a big word. there a lot of experts who say we have to get to renewables, but you can't just give up, for example, under natural gas. do you agree? >> absolutely. we were able to keep our lights on because we had backup generators. we aren't naive about the situational challenges. but that doesn't mean that we don't accelerate areas like battery storage, we have the largest battery projects on planet earth. 250 megawatts 2.5 years ago.

close to 4000 megawatts, our largest powerplant today. that is just in 2.5 years. look at what we can do in 5, 10, 15 years. so i think people are no evilly assuming that we aren't capable of doing so much more with the innovation and entrepreneurial spirit in this country. >> where do you need to go in order to get a zero emissions? >> we have very ambitious goals to carbon neutrality -- net-net zero, carbon neutrality in 2025. 90% of clean energy on our electricity grid by 2035. and we have the mandate, which is the most aggressive of any jurisdiction in the united states. we have to do multiples, probably six gigawatts a year to move things along. here is how we do it. it's not just putting an unprecedented amount of money to back up these technologies. we have new incremental

investments, setting the most aggressive policies to get the private sector to invest, but also the biggest issue we face is time to project delivery not just from the supply chain perspective, but permanent perspective. the nimby-ism. huge issue. so we have completely knocked out all those barriers and we have put in rigid timelines to get projects permitted and go through a judicial process in their challenge and that is a game changer. >> carbon capture is critical. i know that is an important part of your strategy. at the same carbon capture to the scale you needed to be? >> not yet. we have directed carbon capture in a number of companies, matter of fact, they are demonstrating that in wyoming. we worked with the oil industry. but no, carbon capture and sequestration, we want to invest in that.

and by the way, that is an important point you are making. we were able to find some balance in that space. years ago others were, like, no, we don't want to have the conversation. green hydrogen? we don't want that conversation. we recognize that we need to do you risk, including by the way, extending the life of our nuclear plant five years in order to stress test this grid as we transition, and look at the issue of cost, which is profoundly important. emily: california governor gavin newsom there, with bloomberg's david westin. some other stories we are following, india is wooing chipmakers to the country. the government will increase financial incentives for manufacturers upwards of 50% of a project's total cost. india is the world's second-biggest mobile phone maker. and the world of music is heading -- warner music is tapping in you ceo.

he will become so ceo in february. he has spent most of his career at youtube where he led creative and commercial partnerships, and helped launch a subscription service. he was also part of the team at netflix that introduced original streaming programming. beyond meat has suspended chief operating officer doug ramsey. he was arrested on charges that he bit a man's nose during a fight at a college football game in arkansas, another blow for the plant based protein company which cut its revenue forecast last month. coming up, how latin america's digital economy has bounced back post-pandemic in a bigger way than the united states. investor hugo barra joins us next to tell us more. this is bloomberg. ♪

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emily: welcome back to "bloomberg technology." i am emily chang in san

francisco. when it comes to the digital revolution, latin america is catching up fast. the venture from atlantica just published a report showing how the digital economy in that part of the world has skyrocketed as a result of the pandemic. let's dive deeper into this with the atlantica venture partner hugo barra, he was vice president of android at google, worked at xiaomi, and google as well. what are some key highlights you learned from this report about the latin american digital economy? i am curious what surprised you. hugo: nice to see you. there is definitely a lot to unpack. in this report that we just published yesterday, probably the key story, the big headline which underlines investing is that the pandemic tech boom has been sticky in latin america. it is a huge deal, because in

the u.s. we saw a bit of a reversal of the historical trend, or back to the historical trend in tech. whereas in latin america, particularly in brazil, we seem to have jumped ahead. brazil e-commerce, for instance, is three years ahead of the plan, that growth curve has shifted up three years. and obviously it has driven tremendous amount of activity and acceleration in tech there. there are some pretty interesting, borderline absurd statistics that i think are worth talking about. one of them is the part of the e-commerce branch, grocery delivery. groceries delivery in brazil as measured by ifood, which is the largest player locally, saw a 6x jump in the beginning of the pandemic. it has grown 10 times since

then. so is 60 times jump between the beginning of the pandemic and now. another big one is telemedicine, obviously pretty understandable. but the virtual appointment in brazil as measured by one of the leading players, 10x'ed in the first year of the pandemic, and then doubled since. so it is like a 20x jump. and these are sustained levels, which is pretty exciting. emily: interesting. i am curious how this is influencing where you and atlantico are placing your bets, because you are learning about these new trends at the same time as we are going into a massive macro economic downturn, and i wonder how that is uniquely impacting latin america. hugo: so, i think a few things are shifting, and i would probably look at the venture investing seen, specifically.

without a doubt, investment has gone down as compared to what and in 2021 and 2020 as a result of this new economic reality. investment slowdown in latin america, in particular we noticed that foreign investors remained active in the region, but they are pulling back a little. what happened is that the local funds are making up the difference. this is directly in response to this sort of lasting tech boom post-pandemic. the excitement remains. so valuations have gone down, but investment, particularly in earlier stage companies, continues. there is a few other unique things happening that i think will continue to fuel investment in a big way. in tech is extremely well developed. i would argue in some ways much more than in northern america. there is a couple of examples

work mentioning. first off, we saw one of the most successful fintech companies, the largest neo-bank in the world go public recently. there is another stat that relates to the investment climate, which is what is happening with mobile payments in brazil. it is a skyrocketing example. the central bank launched these new, instant-payment rails a couple of years ago, called pix. it is in some ways very similar to upi in india, which everyone talks about. . but what is interesting in brazil is that pix got to $1 billion a month in the year, which is a quarter of the time that it took upi to get to that similar transaction level in india where they have 16th the population of brazil. it changes consumer habits and

makes it easier for e-commerce, online to off-line and off-line to online patterns to play out. that has affected the rate of which the fintech sector is growing and it also affects investing in fixed tax specifically. emily: given that you have worked at so many big-tech companies and you were more recently the head of virtual reality at facebook, now meta, we have seen the big shift in public markets, investors seem really skeptical about the metaverse thing. facebook's market cap is now 1/6 of apple's. do you think the metaverse favorite was a good call for mark zuckerberg? hugo: it is obviously a hugely important question, and i am biased because i do believe that virtual and augmented reality are in the future as the next

major competing paradigm. so, i think it was the right call. the rate of investment is i think where we could spend some time debating, should it have been half of the investment level, for example, that it has been so far. but i have no doubt, history has kept us objective here that we as a society will go through a competing paradigm shift in the next 10 to 15 years. and the companies that have made the early investments in the platforms and in some of the core technologies will be the ones that have the winning horses in the next major platform race. and the thing about meta's is that meta is starting from much further behind than google or apple because they don't have sort of an operating system of major platform investment in the current competing paradigm, which is mobile and smart phone

economy. so it does require a disproportional amount of investment. you can debate the rate of investment, but i think that strategically thinking, 20 years forward, i think this will have the right call. emily: you have worked in different markets, china, india, now your focus is on latin america. you were closer to latin america earlier in your career. there is a lot of concern about the global economy, a lot of concerns about the smartphone market in particular. there is a new iphone out. do you think people will upgrade right now when they are paying so much more for literally everything from gas groceries, are you concerned about the health of the smartphone market? hugo: i am, and i have been for a couple of years, because i think the industry has run out of things to do. sort of run out of innovation space.

i am sort of dying for google and apple to jump on the folding phone bandwagon, because i think that sort of unlocks potential with a new formfactor. so i think there is -- emily: interesting. hugo: pretty high risk that we will see stagnation in terms of upgrades for the next couple of years until we see the next major wave of innovation. so, yes, concerned, and watching it closely. emily: so you think the next iphone should be foldable if they want to sell more of them? is that what you are saying? hugo: i think there is a humongous amount of potential if you explore new form factors, and i think foldable's have a lot of promise. i am happy samsung has led the way here, but it will be happy to see everybody else, particularly apple's creative

eye jumping aboard to make that work. so, crisscrossed. emily: alright,, that was an unexpected insight. we appreciate it. thank you for bringing us the new numbers. hugo barra, good to have you back. alright, coming up, the tez os co-founder on the ethereum merge and what it means for her blockchain which is a to get an upgrade of its own. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: in the coming weeks, there will be another upgrade for blockchain, the turtles protocol, a proof-of-stake network considered a competitor of ethereum will undergo its own upgrade. joining me now is kathleen breitman, cofounder of tezos. how will your upgrade be different from the ethereum merge? kathleen: fundamentally, tezos is a cryptocurrency that has a mechanism for ratifying upgrades to the particle, meaning upgrades have been seamlessly and without the hard fork, which is why the ethereum merge took so long. it was basically, in their own words, like herding cats.

the reason why tezos has been able to upgrade seamlessly is that it was made with upgrading itself in mind, there is a mechanism that makes this process pretty straightforward and seamless. tent time, 11 hopefully this friday. emily: what kind of technical issues are you preparing for? i wonder if perhaps none, because there was all this concern about the ethereum merge and whether it would go off as planned, and it seems like it was kind of a nonevent. kathleen: i think this has been an excellent marketing effort on behalf of ethereum's most vocal promoters. but actually, if you prepare, these things tend to grow quite smoothly. maybe they will learn that on the third or fourth time that the upgrade. emily: how substantial are you upgrades compared to the ethereum merge, given that you have done this 10 times? kathleen: one of the benefits of

tezos as a philosophy in a way of approaching innovation, is that when you have upgrades that happen under regular cadence, you don't have to use consulting speak. these types of things can happen piecemeal. what i mean is that tezos's algorithm has been changed wholesale twice, and it has also had a number of different improvements that have inched towards scaling, which i think will be the next big challenge for any blockchain, including ethereum, of course. but a lot of these networks don't scale very well meaning they can't handle a lot of transactions, which is why you see different things like congestion and fees arising because of the cost of going under blockchain. it gets higher as multiple people use it. scaling is something we incorporated in the last two

upgrades, and with the one hitting on friday it introduces some concepts and technical. . capabilities that lean towards having a lot more people use blockchain. emily: it is climate week, and we have been talking about crypto's energy problems. how much energy does tezos use, and how have you been working to combat its carbon footprint? kathleen: the tezos blockchain has been proof-of-stake since 2018, meaning it was launched with proof-of-stake, which is a lot less energy usage and lot smaller carbon footprint than proof-of-work. ethereum transitioned to proof-of-stake with their merge. so i think that has been a huge relief, because i think it has been a fact about the industry which has antagonized a lot of people who would otherwise be neutral, this idea of, why are you using a bunch of energy to secure your returned money, that

just seems wistful. hopefully with ethereum's transition, that part of the conversation at least starts to dissipate and we can focus on more interesting questions about the cryptocurrency space. [laughter] emily: we will be watching out for your 11th upgrade soon. tezos co-founder, kathleen breitman. and for stopping by. we will be right back. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: jesse powell, the outspoken and controversial founder of crypto exchange kraken is stepping down as ceo. he is known for his bold predictions about the future of crypto, some of them right here on our show.

he has also encouraged any, quote, "woke" employees at kraken police don't align with the company's culture and values to leave. he will be replaced by the chief operating office dave ripley, who will become the company's chair. jesse powell is with us now. how did you come to this decision, stepping up, not down, as you say? jesse: i like to think of it as i am taking a higher level role at the chairman level, i will have ultimate oversight over the company. dave ripley will be doing the hard work for me so i appreciate that. i am excited for this next chapter, i am actually confident in dave ripley and his ability to lead. he has been with us since we were 50 people six years ago, all the way up to made 3000 -- mid-three thousands right now. he has seen it all. we came back around to david after running an external search and talk into a half-dozen other

people and he is clearly still the front runner after all of that. i think it is in great hands. i will still be actively involved in day-to-day. hopefully this will give me more time to go deeper on the product and user experiences, which is something i enjoy doing. emily: we are in the middle of a massive, broader market downturn, it is definitely bleeding into crypto. kraken's market share according to some estimates has shrunk by one-third. did that play at all into your moving aside up, stepping up, as you say, at this time? jesse: definitely not, this is something we have been thinking about for a year. it is a long time coming. i felt the time was right with the company being in a good position right now, in terms of our culture, our engagement with employees. the jetski program you mentioned, after all the work employees left, we ran a server

and people are more satisfied than ever. the company is in a great spot. we recently aligned on our five-year strategy. it is just a good time for me to step away after planning for long-term. we are looking to hire a new chief operating office to back dave, so there will be a handoff period, but everything is great. i hate to go out at the bottom of the market. david's performance will look amazing when things bounced back and i will not get credit. but there is never a perfect time. emily: let's go back to those woke employees, as you called them. it was very controversial at the time you said it. curious if you faced or you are worried about facing any backlash in your future endeavors? jesse: not at all. after that whole thing happened, we had a tremendous amount of support, record-breaking numbers

of job applications coming in. i think a lot of people were just waiting for somebody to say it and they are looking for a place where they can be themselves and not have to work on action shows, a place where they can just get to work and work on important things and not be distracted by petty grievances that people have. i think it actually attracts people and deters the wrong kind of people that are not cut out to be working in a professional environment. emily: now, jamie dimon had this to say about crypto. take a quick listen. mr. dimon: i am a major skeptic on crypto tokens, which are called currency, like bitcoin. they are decentralized ponzi schemes. emily: "decentralized ponzi schemes." what is your reaction to that? jesse: i feel like it is better than a centralized ponzi scheme which is the stock market and national currencies.

[laughter] i mean, it's an upgrade. we should be asking is it an improvement? you can point out problems with anything. the question is, is it not perfect or is it an improvement over the existing system? crypto helps a tremendous amount of people in the world. there are many unbanked people in the world. it might be hard for jamie dimon to understand that, running a bank in the united states but there are billions around the world who don't have access to bank accounts and financial services, and crypto is a lifeline to those people. emily: i have to revisit some predictions you made. one bitcoin per lamb io believe you said. to the moon,. infinity and beyond. how do you reflect on that? do you still think it will get there? how much further off is 100,000? jesse: i do think we'll get there. a look at this rainbow chart for bitcoin. we are at the extreme buy territory. i bought it again at $18,000.

i am still very long-term bullish, still have notched for the share of my kraken bump stock. i am extremely bullish on my company and on crypto. i continue to hold. the fundamentals keep getting stronger for crypto. user adoption keeps growing. we keep proving we can do these upgrades to these networks in a secure and orderly fashion, and so, everything keeps looking better over time. the macroenvironment is playing a big role in what is happening with crypto right now. people don't know if they will be able to afford gas or groceries next week, so that certainly affects one's discretionary income or ability to invest long-term. but aside from the speculative value of crypto, again, it is solving real problems and it does have a functional use case in many parts of the world. so i think we should look at it more from that perspective, what is the goodwill it is doing? can we measure the value crypto

brings to the world by some other means, besides the financial value, the appreciation of the asset? what problems isn't it really solving for people? emily: alright, one lambo, may be someday, not sure when. but still greater happened, according to you. jesse powell, outgoing ceo of kraken. we will be watching you in your chairman role and whatever you do next. thank you for joining us. that does it for this edition of "bloomberg technology." thursday, i will be interviewing marc benioff, the salesforce co-ceo. and also the ceo of impossible foods, as well.

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