>> from the heart of where innovation, money, and power collide, in silicon valley and beyond, this is "bloomberg technology" with emily chang.

emily: i am emily chang in san francisco this is "bloomberg technology." coming up the next hour, some of the world's most recognizable brands from apple to coca-cola are warning to pull advertising from twitter depending on how elon musk moderates. it is not just twitter with an ad problem, will they go to social media and the future or flee to streaming? airbnb gets a reality check, ceo brian chesky talks about his outlook on travel and addresses the high cleaning fees. as tensions between u.s. and china persist, how do businesses

change their strategies? where is jack ma? a former alibaba executive will join us. we will get to that in a moment, the stocks selling off the most in a fed day since january of last year, ed ludlow with the latest, not changing strategy anytime soon. >> not chaining strategy anytime soon in the earnings season hitting us over the head with the same theme. the fiscal first quarter down 5% after hours, they're talking about a major slowdown, double-digit decline in full your calendar 22 for smart phone handsets. economic headwinds and china impacting supply, robinhood posting a quarter beating estimates, ebay up almost a percent -- 8 percent. a ship to what the ebay is doing at the luxury end of the market, the market is up 0.1%, a really interesting that day.

the market having its worst post fed close since january 2021 , almost two years ago down 2.5%, tech the underperformer, names like apple and tesla the biggest points drag on the nasdaq 100. the message from jay powell for the clear, premature to think that rate hikes would and anytime soon. they raise rates by 75 basis points bring us to 3.75. higher rates discount the value of future profits. quick mention of airbnb, airbnb having its biggest drop on record this wednesday. the biggest drop on record. something hard to believe. analyst jumping on the tepid outlook for the fourth quarter this year, revenue 1.8, 1.8 billion dollars, below street expectations, it is a slowdown of bookings going to the fourth

quarter and the treatment of the habits of airbnb. emily: we will ask the ceo about that in a moment, a little bit more about twitter and advertising with elon musk. platforms we have taken for granted like twitter, facebook, instagram have been free to users next to the ads. that is beginning to change and could continue to change fast. i want to bring in bloomberg's kurt wagner, before we go further what is happening with twitter's ad products. there is talk of an advertiser boycott, elon musk has put the idea of a subscription. where do we stand right now? guest: everything is sort of

where it was last week, as you have mentioned there is some looming things that could be incredibly impactful. the first is this potential boycott. the idea that advertisers will say, we are not going to spend money on this platform unless you do certain things around speech or policing of speech. we saw that with facebook a few years ago emily, you remember. it was a big deal, facebook was able to weather the storm. they had someone talking to advertisers and senior leaders. all the senior leaders are gone, that is why i feel the advertising boycott of twitter could be dicey if that is the route some people go. they have been willing to do it before i would not be surprised if some the like that happens again. emily: in the meantime, twitter is grappling with the fact that advertisers are going elsewhere in general and facing a massive

economic slowdown. how are advertisers thinking about spending dollars on social media or looking to things like streaming? guest: this sounds so obvious if you are an advertiser, especially right now when budgets are tighter, there is a massive inflation issue going on , you only spend money where you can see a return on that investment, right? that historically has been places like google and facebook. places with really strong, direct response emphasis. i put a dollar in and i know with some consistency out get a dollar 50 in sales out. twitter has specialized around brand advertising, on a billboard or the super bowl, that is not something easy to measure for roi. when times are tough and money is tight, that you want to spend a bunch of money on that. regardless of what is going on with elon, spending money on twitter is probably a tough sell given the environment economically.

emily: we heard a little bit from kathy wood who seems excited about elon musk as usual. >> the subscription advertising model is a good move, that verification is important to people could help clean up the platform considerably. emily: it is not surprising that some like kathy wood would be excited about elon musk's plans. what you make of her support and if there will be a wave of advertisers and people out there that like what elon is doing? guest: i am smiling, i do not disagree the blue check has value, i am not sure this will clean up the service of bots

makes a lot of sense. he says once i start charging for the blue check bots will not pay for the blue check. that will be who is real and who is not. that implies that regular people are going to pay for it. eight dollars a month is not something people are willing to fork over to prove to elon musk they are a human being. i am curious to see how this works, to me it feels relatively rushed. there could be more nuance to this, a lot of this is conveyed via his own tweets, there could be a broader plan we have not seen. on the surface, this idea that we will suddenly know who the humans are and the bots are, the humans are the ones that will pay, does not feel realistic when you have hundreds of millions of people on a service. not many people want to pay for this. emily: so much more tbd. bloomberg's scott wegner, thank you for your reporting on twitter, we will continue to follow your stuff.

coming up airbnb just had its best quarter yet. why did the stock plunge? the ceo will give us his take and more. next. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: let's get back to earnings now with airbnb reporting big revenue, with that income number and shares

falling after the company gave a disappointing outlook for bookings in the fourth quarter falling 13%. i want to bring in the ceo. 1.9 billion in income, high revenue, these are big numbers, investors disappointed. what is your response to the big stock plunge, it is the biggest since airbnb went public? guest: i try to make sure we focus on what we can deliver. we delivered a record quarter, $3.3 billion in the trailing 12 months, think people the world this is a very uncertain time. people are looking for indications of what the future holds. we have tried to make very clear on the call, we are feeling very confident about q4.

people are traveling, that is why results were good in q3 and we are feeling really confident, i want to make sure that people know that. emily: let's hone in on this moderating a book and growth that you are seeing. if we are heading into a long-term recession, who is a say that consumers will not cut back on travel, or are not going to choose to stay in cheaper closer places rather than splurge on the trip abroad and that will add up for airbnb. guest: that is a great point. one of the things we learned in the pandemic is we have a very adaptable is model. recall in 2020, airbnb was the first company to rebound in all of travel. that is partly why we have such a successful ipo. we are the more affordable option. we have nearly every type of space in every type of community. people come back, cross-border travel, might start working more for airbnb, we have found a resilient model and i'm feeling confident about it.

emily: our bloomberg opinion columnist has in an instant take, if airbnb has a problem it is you are making too much money. how do you respond to that? guest: no one would have told us 2.5 years ago, we are increasingly investing more in the customer experience every year. the reason we are getting more profitable, we are more efficient, incredibly efficient, 6000 employees, we spend a lot less on marketing than any other travel company. we are investing a lot more in the customer experience this year. we will continue to be more efficient, we will continue to deliver more and more for customers. i understand that people care about value. they want to make sure that airbnb is a brand, you can come to, get a great value, known for affordable travel. people are concerned whether or not airbnb will be affordable,

they will be. we will continue to focus to make sure our prices are competitive. that is what we're focused on. emily: let's talk about the transparency around pricing that you hinted at. we have all had that healing of looking at a rental on airbnb, we click all the way through, and the price changes given the fees, cleaning fees, etc.. what can we expect that transparency to look like? guest: there are two things going on. first, we want people to understand our pricing. not be surprised. second, will make sure that when they do see the final price they feel really good about the final price and it is still a great value. we are working on updating some of the designs for our platform to make it even more intuitive. we will have some updates very, very soon so stay student. emily: let's talk about average daily rates, their expectations they will come under pressure quarter even the strong dollar

if the booking mix shifts to potentially cheaper rentals. can you give us insights on consumer preferences right now? what do consumers want that you are seeing through the holiday season into 2023. guest: we are not seeing a major change, the reason the price has gone up, before the pandemic most people work using airbnb to cross the border, stay in a city and state in a one-bedroom a two-bedroom place. now alum people are booking 3, 4, 5 bedroom homes. the average rate is higher because the homes are bigger. what we think, when asia recovers, that could moderate the price pointed little bit. that is a good thing. that will lead to a lot more volume. you get an entire continent be traveling a lot more.

i think you will see that growth. we are expecting a pretty stable average daily rate. we are not seeing major shifts in the way people use airbnb just yet. emily: long-term stays still hugely popular, 20% of night booked. give us an insight on the trend, is it plateauing, slowing down, is the growth you saw there over? guest: no, long-term stay is the fastest growing segment by length of stay in airbnb. because a short-term stays have recovered it has been stable at 20%. i do expect in the coming years they had long-term stays increasingly grow as a percentage of the business. the reason why, increasingly more people are going to be flexible, fewer people have leases. i am not saying no one well, i am saying enough for this market to continue to grow. this will be a huge growth opportunity for us in the years to come. emily: it is so fascinating, how people use airbnb has changed in the last couple years, do you have a feeling that airbnb is

over reliant on long-term stays? guest: no, we have to make sure that every segment is growing, long-term stays are not coming at the cost of short-term stays. as long as short-term stays continue to grow, give it is another layer, amazon sells books, electronics, now they sell another category. these do not cannibalize they are different use cases. a lot of people are coming to list monthly stays. this can open up a lot. i think monthly stays can make short-term stays more popular. some people might book airbnb for a long-term stay, it is not so bad staying a summit also some, maybe i will do it for a short-term stay -- in someone else's home, maybe i will do it for a short-term stay. that's what our theory is. emily: interesting, some analysts believe airbnb is priced too high to some of the travel peers, especially if the booking mix is changing.

guest: our guests tell us that the airbnb is the best value. we want to make sure that as the economy slows down our value is even better. we do know that hotels are starting to lower prices. we want to make sure that our pricing is as dynamic. we are investing a lot more in pricing tools for hosts, so they can have more dynamic pricing. if hotels lower rates and they want to lower rates to be competitive we can do that. offer a great value, there is no question there is a lot more we can do on value. we will be focusing on that for the next six month and time for the next travel season. emily: longer-term, you have launched categories, supply will be key, how do you see growth in supply over the next two years compared to the growth you saw

in supply over the last two years? how do you convince all of these new would be hosts to choose airbnb first and only? guest: great question, let me say this, number one i expect a lot more new supply over the next two years in the last two years. the last two years have been hard because of the pandemic, now everyone wanted other. people in their homes. the next two years, there will be -- they will be interested for more reasons, number one, the further the pandemic is behind us the less where they are. we started in 2008, during the great recession, during the great recession a lot of people need to make extra money and they turned to airbnb to host for the first time. i think that will happen again. the final thing i will say, i will give a plug, november 16, 8 a.m. eastern time we will unveil a new easy way to list your home on airbnb.

that will be a big driver of a lot more hosts. we have cool new products albi launching in fewer than two weeks -- that will be launching in fewer than two weeks and that will be a acceleration. emily: we will be watching, airbnb started in the middle of the financial crisis and you thrived and survived during the pandemic coming was your strategy on cost during the downturn? are you considering m&a given the cash and opportunistic valuations out there, how are you mapping this out given that we could be in this for a couple of years? guest: that is a great question. let me tell you a really important lesson i learned during the pandemic. between february and april of 2020 we were one of the first companies hit by the pandemic. we lost 80% of the business in a weeks. 1000 of us gotten a foxhole, rebuilding the company from the ground up. we we rebelled a much -- rebuilt a much smaller leaner company.

what i told the team, no matter how good the economy is, no matter how bad the economy is, we will try to not ever run the company definitely because the economy. you can only do that if you stay differs -- disciplined. you do not want to get more disciplined. we should be a -- prepare for the storm whatever comes, will not change the way we run the company. at the beginning of this year we were only forecasting hiring 7% more employees. we are not pulling back, we are not putting on the brakes, we are going to step on the gas. that does not mean spending more money come is a lot more velocity of speed, innovation, taking more market share. emily: brian chesky, we will

keep that in mind ceo of airbnb. thank you. will be right back with more "bloomberg technology.a after this quick break. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: china is making moves that will severely curtail shipments in and out of the world's largest iphone factory, beijing is imposing a seven-day lockdown after the number of covid cases in the city quadrupled from monday to tuesday. paramount global, the parent company of cbs, nickelodeon, -- the big problem, continuing weakness in advertising. still there has been a turnaround in paramount fill --

film studio, with top gun maverick the top grossing film this year so far. sources telling bloomberg the largest e-commerce company is freezing staff levels, and it's profitable ads business, will continue to fill vacancies but will not create new jobs. coming up, growing demand for cybersecurity services. we will talk with the ceo tracking cyber efforts in russia's against ukraine, plus the story behind the rise of the tech giant alibaba we will get the inside story from former executive brian wong. he has a new book out. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: welcome back to "bloomberg technology," i am emily chang in san francisco . the banking sector says people

and businesses are paying more and more in the wake up ransomware attack's. banks reported one point $2 billion in ransomware attacks, more than five times in 2019, a taste of what jeff stone will explore with the weekly newsletter. including coverage of inside the world of hackers and espionage mall businesses are playing defense. tells more about cyber bulletin and the goal. guest: that cybersecurity is a lot more than ones and zeros, and the latest data breach there is all types of characters involved, cryptocurrency is part of this, this information is part of this. influence operations and everyone trying to monetize data. that is what we try to exploit here, how people can act -- protect themselves. emily: cyber threats have been on the rise for a while, why now are you launching this? guest: we are busier than ever, let's take on one more project.

the invasion of ukraine has highlighted this big explosion of ransomware they have alluded to. it is urgent for people to get a better sense of what these threats look like and how to respond in cyberspace. again, think people are used to this world of email scams and fraud through the apps. we are going to dig in and help people strain out how to protect themselves at a more urgent time than ever. emily: all right, bloomberg's jeff stone come you can sign up for the weekly cyber bulletin newsletter at bloomberg.com. we will stay tuned. for more on cybersecurity, i want to bring in christopher, they are actively tracking the cybersecurity threat level in

ukraine. give us the latest level there. you have been involved several months now, what are you most worried about at this time? guest: it is really interesting, we worked a little it with one part of the ukrainian government on the morning of the 24th of february we -- you can probably check out our tweet on that. we said we would get behind these guys and help them out anyway we can. our intelligence platform is in the hand of seven agencies over there. it is been interesting, in the lead up to the war there was a whole bunch of russian activity at the crossover into the war they killed a bunch of medications infrastructure. they have taken a part of -- communications infrastructure. they have taken part of the system, running destructive malware against ukrainian power systems ongoing like. what is impressive, ukrainians along with people help them,

have been able to withstand this. that is the most impressive. the russians are going at it. we may not hear too much about it, as much as both -- when bullets and the like flight of the are a lot of things go to the back. it is full speed ahead for sure. emily: you have been donating software, geopolitical intelligence ukrainian agencies, how long he prepared to this work? guest: there is no ending to that. we came out and said we would go all in and tried to help them in every way that we could. we announced a big hiring initiative we are hiring another

100 people in ukraine. to your point we have given them software and access to our intelligence cloud in seven different agencies. we are using it to walk cyber attacks, misinformation on the battlefield. we think it could be helpful, we are doing a little part, we will do it as long as we can. help them in every way that they need to to help them basically crush the russians. that is what this is all about if i am slightly blunt here. emily: we have some big midterm elections coming up in the united states. how would you rate the cyber threat level more broadly, what are you most concerned about when it comes to the upcoming elections? guest: i would say it is interesting, the broad set of misinformation around that is ongoing at the same level of 2020. there has been a lot of work and by the u.s. government, and other firms, the social media firms and people on top of that in terms of fighting back on this. the russians are still there, no question, ira, the internet

research agency in st. petersburg there still try to go at it. a very targeted audience they can come at. they are obviously quite busy on the home front. the iranians have been busy on the home front. maybe not as much. we could have read the last couple days about interesting things with the chinese going at it. there are threats there. i think we are in good shape, the election is safe, a good election. even though these guys are trying at think we are doing better. emily: what is keeping you up at night right now that we are not talking about enough? guest: obviously, to his point here just now there is plenty of cyber activity and it is not great. i do not think we have started yet. over the last 25 years the world has slowly migrated onto the internet.

the next 25 years the internet is where it starts and the world ends up being a reflection of the internet. world power, is as, currency -- business, currency, money, identity will emerge out of the internet. in that world we better have our act together. it is an incredible opportunity to build and intelligence company. we will be the bloomberg of cyber if you want, the world better have its act together, the world will be quite wild and you better be ready for a ride. emily: i wonder how you think about elon musk taking over at twitter, potentially having a more open-minded approach to content moderation. does the world have its act together? guest: it is a dangerous subject to get into. i think you will do good with it.

i am a positive person even if i sounded scared before. i think you will have new smart ways to go at content moderation. i am an optimist about that. if he screws it up, the dangerous, the dangerous part for him, these are pretty fleeting audiences. they will go anywhere else. if he does not handle this one well, we might see too much of this audience going over to the hands of tiktok. to be honest i rather have elon musk run a great platform or not such a great platform in the united states then having our upcoming generations living their social life on tiktok. i would take twitter over that any day. emily: why is that? guest: because i think if our dear chinese friends are controlling the information flow on tiktok, controlling the news flow, intercept communications on that, too much control in the hands of the chinese government, to be frank or chinese

intelligence agency is not a good thing. emily: i appreciate you navigating, waiting into some trigger take -- tricky territory for us, thank you for sharing your thoughts we will have to have you back soon. coming up the line between traditional finance and decentralized finance inning blurt, we will talk more about how next. this is bloomberg. ♪

>> i think some people have avoided this asset class. it is very risky is not appropriate for everyone. when you buy cryptocurrency on sofi we say it is a risky asset, it is unproven, you lose all of your money. with prices down we have seen people taken an opportunity to experiment with this type of asset and get to know -- it to know the asset better. emily: earlier on bloomberg as the world's of traditional finance and d5 continue to come by -- defi continue to combine. >> it is important to listen to what anthony had to say about crypto. they are a traditional technique -- financial technology firm that successfully acquired a

bank that help them rein in depositor money for client that help them by crypto in a downturn or invest elsewhere. the reality is, options here, borrow, by assets, the positive your money for safe keeping at a higher interest rate than many other large banks. that is what the choices you are faced with at the end of the day. after the interview we did come at the comments but made by the ceo of finance -- binance. we have them talking about the idea of buying a bank, there are people that hold certain types of local licenses, traditional banking, payment service providers, even banks, we are looking at those things. we want to be the bridge between crypto and the traditional financial world. what does that look like at the end of the day?

when you think of binance eating into traditional finance, can they do it successfully with fintech like sofi doing it? i want to show you what it looks like in terms of multiples. when you look at what it means to be a bank or by a bank, even coinbase with the huge drawdown you see in the stock this year you see them trading at a higher price to earnings then you see of the biggest banks thing that states. that is between nine and 11 times earnings, and you see coinbase traded a higher multiple. if you look back at what cz said, when traditional crypto firms pair with finance firms, the stock of the finance firms tend to jump. by partnering with those companies, taking a stake, or buying a right you can get a potentially higher multiple for finance -- binance and that firm.

it will be interesting to see what deals will come out, not just a partnership we saw on the last year or so, but pure money from traditional financial firms. firms that got so large in the crypto space like binance. emily: so much more to come there, thank you. coming up with u.s. china tensions continuing to escalate we take a look at the chinese tech giant alibaba, how to get this far, and what is next under a potentially more controlling calmness party what is up with jack ma. that is next. this is bloomberg. ♪

emily: let's take a look now at

the behind the scenes of one of the world most influential tech companies in china and the world. that is alibaba. the topic of a new book from a former alibaba executive called the tao of alibaba, inside the digital giants changing the world. how did it take on the world and what is i have next? let's bring an author brian wong , former top alibaba but executive. you were the first american working at alibaba, 52nd employee, and special assistant to jack ma. we have seen -- you have seen some things. what is alibaba's and jack ma's secret sauce. brian: i wrote this book because i want to share what my understanding and perception was from the nearly 20 years i was with the company about the essence of jack ma and alibaba. to put it into basic terms, jack really was able to build a

company around a very deep purpose of solving the world's problems. he created a culture that was very optimistic and positive. he was able to align an organization to focus on that mission. at the same time give them the flexibility to adapt to the constantly changing world and industry it was operating in an order to become successful. i've seen the company re-create itself over and over the last 20 years. the athens of it, what i call essence of it, what i call the tao, is a mission driven purpose driven culture jack helped create. emily: the question is can alibaba reinvent itself again, when the company tried to globalize a few years back it did not quite work, should alibaba revive those ambitions now? will it work when there are others pushing for de globalization? brian: one of the amazing things

about the country is how resilient it has been, when it was small it faced an accident -- an existential crisis against sars, the company mobilized itself about the direction of the leaders, the staff came together and figured out ways to keep the company operating during its early years. during a lockdown period when he did not have the conveniences you had today in the terms of mobile connectivity and devices. the company with its dna and the culture that has been really established and institutionalized with alibaba does have great potential to continue to grow. also, as to globalize, yes, the world now really needs some positive forces that utilize things like technology to improve society. and frankly solve a lot of the

problems we are facing, not just in the developed world, but in the emerging markets. emily: china's covid zero policies have had a myriad of potentially negative impacts and supply chain and execution. some people say alibaba's glory days are over. what do you say? brian: i would say the challenge of zero covid and supply chain is more of a larger national issue that needs to be resolved. the country needs to work through that, we may disagree or agree with how they're handling it, this needs to take place on a national level, then the companies can get back on their feet and do the things they need to do. i do think this experience has built up a strong capacity in terms of dealing with uncertainty. when you look at how companies like alibaba were able to adapt to the situation over the years, i think they will come out

stronger once this is all done. emily: the question is, how does big tech survive in president xi's china. when they clamped down on the ipo, he put a scarlet letter on alibaba and jack ma himself. brian: i think it was one of a string of events that happened, it was so high-profile because it was that this start of this change in policy. it was a major decision and quite sudden. i do think what this really indicates, the shift in government policy, one that was previously a light touch governance model that allowed room for innovation to one that is more heavily regulated. this is a global issue, when we think about what it's we are dealing with now in terms of antitrust, we are dealing with a

in america as well as china. big tech is becoming big and influential, governments are trying to figure out how to manage this. each respective country and their covenants -- they are will figure had to deal with that. down the road, there are opportunities in the market for higher quality industries, or areas, china's trying to update its industrial capacity. how companies can plan that space will be the secret to future growth and how they can tap into that. emily: jack ma has not seen -- been seen publicly in some time. what is the last time you've spoken with him, where do you think he is, how is he doing? brian: i have been in touch with jack for the last two years, it in communication, he has been

free to move around, he has been laying low, he has traveled abroad. people mentioned they see him in europe and other places in asia. emily, i think he is gearing up for his next act around philanthropy, education, helping those areas that really need assistance. it is a passion of his to help those who are they more marriage -- marginalized parts of society. to get on their feet. rural communities, as well as learning. he was doing a lot of learning tours in the last few years. he is ok, a lot of people have been wondering. hopefully at some point he will have his next, sort of, you know, big thing come out in terms of philanthropy. emily: wondering and rightly so. he was so out there, a frequent guest on this show. he loved talking to the press.

here is the last question, obviously u.s. china tensions are escalating. how is that going to play a role in if alibaba will succeed in this new world or not? brian: i think it is still in process. the countries are buckling down and trying to figure out what is there best -- their best policy in the interest of national security. sometimes that means the relationships turned very tense and challenging. i really do hope as many of the diplomats and policies mention the key here is to continue to engage, and compete at the same time. there are key issues on a global basis china and the u.s. need to cooperate on. those are more important in the long run, then the disputes that we are facing that are creating the tension.

i am confident that the g20 coming up, hopefully there will be some dialogue between the two governments however that may turn out. these two countries need to continue to collaborate. emily: brian wong, former alibaba executive author of the tao of alibaba, thank you so much for joining us. that does it for this edition of "bloomberg technology," thursday we have the ceo of aurora talking about big changes and challenges ahead for self driving technology i am emily chang in san francisco. this is bloomberg. ♪

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