>> i am caroline hyde.

bloomberg's world headquarters in new york. >> coming up on capitol hill is day two of hearings into the collapse of sam bankman-fried's crypto empire well they are detained in jail himself. >> airbnb is working to improve connection between guests and host. we talked to the company about the findings in the latest it had this commission study. >> twitter suspends multiple accounts tracking the private jets of world tech titans. we speak to the man behind the accounts. we check in on these markets now. today was the federal reserve. money coming out of tech stocks there as we think about a federal reserve still determines to detain inflation.

-- contain inflation. the dollar weakening. maybe there was a little bit of something for everything and everyone. how high interest rates would eventually go but the dollar seemed to think for the here and now, 50 basis points may be slower for the foreseeable. >> that seems the right way. when you look at the different point strikes, it was a megacap iteris lower. 4.1% cutting down into 2024. we are going to talk about the chinese economy later in the show but there is optimism around that restrictive covid policy. all of this before the fed

decision. looking at all this chaos that happened, i would point out after that the decision, there was a pullback below that marker there. >> we have to keep our eye on fintech, all of that, more broadly. her eyes on what is happening here. the outflows from the crypto exchange have stabilized. he was in traditional finance, he made the move to crypto. it is john wu. looking at what the crypto community is going on here. there is a lot there of it. talk to us about whether or not the contagion that you came onto the show previously and warned about -- is it still there, is it still warning -- worrying you? >> it still worries me.

this thing may not be over but i think the hearings the last two days and as well as some news related is encouraging. to me, the common thread between congress and genre is most of the number one source of the wrongdoing the came from misappropriation of customer funds. john ray in his opening testimony said the reason why this is able to happen is because the decision making, the governance and all the information was held by a smaller group of inexperienced hands with zero oversight. what i was surprised to not hear at all was there was a lot of market participation.

>> what you are talking about essentially is commingling. the relationship between ftx, the movement of customer funds, the placement of customer funds. is anything you have heard in the last 48 hours made you think that whether it is regulatory or from a legislation standpoint, will we find a fix to these issues that have been uncovered during the course of this saga? >> that is a great question. the result of all of this is taking trust out of the system so there are fewer players. in order to get the crypto capital markets back and going. i think this is the first. you need new leaders who have experience.

you need regulation. you know 2023 is coming up. i think there are companies already working to solve it from a technology perspective. i am excited about a company called enclave. it is a fully encrypted exchange. what they have done is create a second layer of security using hardware. in this case, customer information, trades, data are all put into an enclave, a secure enclave. no third-party will allow you to get access to it. the problem that john ray talked

about, misappropriating funds, it gets taken away. ? it participant, you probably heard at the top of the show, the market reaction to the fed. all of this makes me feel about what is driving from the market. you can see bitcoin jumping about $18,000 per token just before the fed by clearly reacting to it. is this the sort of fixation on ftx and the fallout or is the market now slowly returning to fundamentals? i have never found it easy to see when it comes to crypto but let's just call it fundamentals. >> i think you're referring to valuations be more difficult. what it highlights is the asset classes perform relatively well and in line with the risk assets on nasdaq. the equity crypto companies

completely underperformed. there are many reasons for that. frankly, i think a big reason, underlying reason for this is there a different communities underlying the assets. this is part of the crypto native community. they are far less distrusting of the space and more enthusiastic. the equity stocks you see are really crossover guys. they have very little trust in this space. for crypto as an asset class and technology to grow, the participants need to rebuild the trust. >> when you're on the protocol and focus, you will be talking about the security layers you have felt on that. i am interested to go back to a centralization point of view. talk to us around finance for a

moment. there are concerns about their about the clarity we get when we talk about the stabilization of outflows. he has been trying to dispel any concerns he feels has been building. the market is huge for them. the outflow is pretty literal. are you worried about finance? -- binance. >> i think that everyone needs to be worried about them. they started creating some sort of transparency scale. obviously, given the ftx situation, the participants probably want more transparency. hopefully we get there. that is one of the reasons why we saw a company report that

close to three million dollars withdraw in the last day or so. if you look at that, it is amazing how the as class actually increased even with the massive withdrawal. into private wallets and storage as opposed to dumping on the market. >> lastly, john, what is it like in the ecosystem right now? what is a like in terms of having access to capital? >> it is definitely harder. the rate of momentum we have in terms of building and business partnerships from traditional finance as well as new developers was definitely moving far faster and less resistant. right now there are clearly some people who hesitated a little bit. i am still positive about real

utility into the space. you have also seen just this last week, we have companies like porsche finance and nft plan. behind-the-scenes, what porsche is really doing is a very smart way to build younger community aspirational buyers very cheaply with cool entities, giving them loyalty engagements. the lifetime value of that get is actually very good for the low cost. there is actual functionality.

>> caroline, helping us join the market moves of what is happening in this industry as a result of ftx. we will have you back soon. coming up, over 30 chinese companies could end up on a trade blacklist. more on that and what it means next. this is bloomberg. ♪

>> let's go global. the country's economy is key to so many tech companies around the world. are there for supply chain or reaching consumers. bloomberg just reported that the country's leaders are proceeding with a key economic policy

meeting this week in beijing after considering delaying it due to a surge in covert infections. that is why we await more key economic data that could impact the shares of some pretty big names. alibaba, jd.com. ed, you're on top of this. >> we are looking on the supply chain side. american companies are impacted by their abilities to do business in china but also the chinese tech companies themselves very shortly will get retail sales data for the month of november. a bloomberg survey of economists expects a drop of around 4% year over year and even sharper contraction in retail sales that we saw in the month of november. why are we talking about chinese economic data? e-commerce is at the heart of that story. we have had some soft but leading indicators of certain markets. we saw alibaba pretty tightlipped about how singles' day actually went. that is kind of an indication

that it probably wasn't that good. as they pull back on the restricted policy for covid nbc the number of cases spread and rise through the country, there are eyes from american tech, eyes from the global supply chain towards china under consumer but also how they will react to what we are seeing and what the health of the consumer in that market is. right now, a mixed picture. >> continued and pretty murky picture when it comes to geopolitics in particular. we build on your great focus on the consumer to geopolitics in the biden administration. it is planning on putting more than 30 chinese japanese on a trade blacklist which would prevent them from buying certain american components. that deepens tensions between the two economic superpowers in the world. let's bring in tom giles here for more. just talk to us about this entity list, memory choque -- memberships here. what does it mean for these 30 companies? >> this will put big limits on

the ability to carry a business with u.s. companies. purchasing the components they need to make those chips. the u.s. is really intent on limiting, hamstringing china's ability to become a force in chipmaking. this is something the chinese government has stated over the last several years is a major goal they are willing to spend hundreds of billions of dollars behind this effort. the u.s. wants to cut them off at the knees. in particular they want to interfere with china's ability to make chips and use chips in their warmaking capabilities. that is what the u.s. has stated their goal is -- goal is. they are taking step after step to keep it from happening. >> this is one of many on the list.

they want to bring it back to silicon valley and the bay area. at one time they were talking to be a supplier to apple. it seems like the door is now closed on the company perspective. it seems to be making life difficult for companies on both sides of this debate. >> that is right. a huge company in china. the biggest memory. a potential partner to apple. apple saw the writing on the wall. apple recognized this was not going to happen. also a major competitor to samsung. one of the many companies china had been pinning his hopes on before becoming a major force in chipmaking. another thing to remember about this trade were between these two countries and have it has a ripple effect far beyond silicon valley, far beyond china is the effort by the u.s. government to keep chinese companies from buying the equipment they need to make chips.

that affects the netherlands and it affects japan as well. >> two we prepare for the tit for tat to continue? >> china has already spoken out against this. they say the u.s. is weaponizing technology as part of this trade war. they are speaking out against it. i think their potential to retaliate remains vast. absolutely. >> tom giles leaving the charge out of san francisco. thank you very much. as addictive as candy crush. do a lingo has surged in popularity by give him a learning. now the public company is grappling with how to make money without crossing its fears following. we will discuss that all next with the ceo. ♪ this... is the planning effect. this is how it feels to have a dedicated fidelity advisor

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>> let's talk about the free

language learning abdullah lingo. they are hitting a turning point. the company has made a name for itself. engaging over 56 million active subscribers. now the near the public up and he is facing the challenge of becoming a be profitable while keeping its loyal fan base happy. talk to us about your mission to develop the best education in the world and making it universally available. how do you turn that into universally available and profitable? >> we are a very mission driven company. we started because we wanted to give education to everybody. over the last five years, we have been trying to monetize it. we have been very successful at it. the way we did that is whenever you finish a lesson on dual lingo, we put an ad at the end of the lesson so you can use dual lingo as much as you want

entirely for free but you may have to see some ads. if you don't want to see the ads, you can pay us to subscribe. we may quit a bit of money from the subscription. it is about 7% of our monthly active users. this year we will be profitable. it is going better and better. >> carolyn set out here in silicon valley, the tale as old as time. millions of users, trying to find profit. you even just used the ultimate buzz word. we heard that from uber, twitter. the user base, 56 million is a part of making more money, just growing it. how do you get more people to jump on this trend of wanting to learn languages but in a way that is kind of give five? >> the main way we grow is we have a very engaging product. most of our users come through word-of-mouth.

it is because the product is very give him a fight. we also grow by -- we have a really popular tiktok account if you have not seen it. we are really good on social media. the good news is we don't have to pay to acquire users. it is pretty much organic growth. we are growing a lot over the last five quarters in a row. we have been accelerating our years of growth. we are pretty happy with the growth. that is one of the ways in which we make more money. we basically get more people to use dual lingo. >> you make a good point which is social media, what do you consider dual lingo to be? is it your aspiration to be like a facebook? a tiktok? that kind of scale and daily use? or is it the content you want to use to differentiate yourself? >> we really think we can get to a much larger scale. language learning is pretty interesting. there are about 2 billion people in the world learning a foreign language. we only have close to 60 million

monthly active users. we have a lot of room to grow. we are going pretty fast every month. we think we can get to hundreds of millions of monthly active users. >> talk to us about the way in which you use artificial intelligence at the moment. we are all talking about chatty pt and the amazing things it can do. what are the amazing opportunities in ai for you? >> dual lingo, we have been using ai for the last 10 years. we are really big believers in using this to teach. dual lingo is as good as teaching in a classroom but not as good as a one-on-one human tutor. our goal is to get to a lingo to be as good at teaching as a one-on-one human tutor entirely through artificial intelligence. it is a lot cheaper to deliver to literally millions of people. we think we can get there. i don't know how long it will take but we think we can get to as good as a one-on-one tutor. >> i am interested in that for

your future and also the way in which you perhaps use your content. you're talking about who you see yourself as becoming. what about the actual content you are producing? the people? the characters? are there ways to monetize that in the future? >> the main way we will try to monetize is by teaching. we are starting to expand other things. we just launched a math app. we have an app to teach early literacy. we want to have recognizable characters. the most recognizable is our green elf but we have a whole other cast of characters. the idea is to be the apt version of sesame street. -- app version of sesame street. >> i will go on the app and try to learn was. we will follow-up in a years time and see how i did.

the cofounder and ceo of doolittle. coming up -- airbnb, fighting discrimination and building inclusion within the community. more on that next. this is bloomberg. ♪

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>> welcome back to bloomberg technology. we have to talk about what is a macro story that affects technology today? and effects hiring within technology? we have the fed chair jerome

powell sang the labor market appears to still be very tight. it is so interesting that you and i talk about the layoffs in technology and yet the danger -- it does not seem to prove it. but there is complete contrast. they are trying to get slack in this labor market, slow down growth until the jobs data goes in and they are still zeroed in on inflation. it is the same message every time with the same result. we will fight inflation. at the same time, it is so incongruous. the idea of all these jobs openings. >> the idea is that perhaps what is not showing up is the people who are losing their jobs are highly employable. they go onto to new roles and they are being snatched up around the board. whether it is finance companies, whoever wants to be hiring engineers at the moment, there is still such a desire for them. i think evaluation stories are

going to be rolling over somewhat if we think that terminal base will be at 5.1%. we have interest rate hikes to come. it is just perhaps the pace will be slightly slower. >> there is a psychological aspect to it. they say don't hire people, keep the powder dry. at the same time, when you do see layoffs, there are people that are talented. they start companies. look at what happened in 2000 and 2008. they need access to capital to do that. it is mixed messages. we have had some clarity from one name. even after amazon's biggest round of layoffs ever last month, the company's chief of devices is responsible for the likes of the alexa voice assistant. he is pledging the company is still committed to investing big in devices, here to discuss our global technology had, brad stone. you lead our coverage at bloomberg. we have reported that there will

be layoffs to amazon. there are layoffs to amazon. the devices his nose has been impacted. what was the message? >> he sounded a little bit aggrieved that his unit, that devices and services unit at amazon has been the kind of prime target of this reporting. he is pledging that the layoffs in the devices unit are relatively small. he told my colleague less than 2 -- less than 2000 layoffs spread inside his group, the devices group. he talks about the price of the devices being on his p&l but things like shopping and app sales not accruing to him. this has been a little bit misleading. they can test this idea that if there was any retreat at all in the ambitions in the devices of

amazon. >> i want lead it all off. it is fighting talk that they are doubling down investment. he is saying that if you have a situation where your device is being put away in a drawer, they are not doing well. they want to keep innovating. what were some of the key takeaways? >> we talked about a lot of things. >> i was very curious about that combo about. they still call this day one addition. he talked about being ready committed to home robots. they bought irobot earlier in the year. they talk about the device being stymied by things like a black floor and a ceiling to floor ceiling. -- i ceiling to floor window. we talk about it being a work in progress and they are very committed to it. >> your news program was about this.

>> as the father of high schoolers, my first question was why? this would make it very easy to cheat on an essay. i was wondering how some of the companies responsible for playing -- providing anti-plagiarism tools to schools -- they talk about their software being able to identify essays but may be in the future, not. it will create a really big problem for teachers and schools. amazon wanted to say this is what we were doing but by the end of the day, they grew very big. >> let's move onto another key company. they were not planning on any layoffs. they are even stepping on the gas. the company also has another key focus.

they go full steam on the inclusion. this is hot on the heels of a new report. they are discussing -- it is a six year update on how you are trying to fight discrimination and trying to measure it. project lead has this key partnership. talk to us about how you are looking to measure, how you are trying to identify bias at the moment. >> thank you for having me. as you mentioned, this has been a six year journey we have been on civilian measure and address is rumination on our platforms and the changes right there at the front with us. this is about understanding with the data is telling us. we did not want to jump into addressing discrimination without understanding what is the discrimination we are trying to fight and create solutions for?

project lighthouse is ultimately the tool rebuilt and created that gives us that data to help us fight the battle. >> at the opening of this update , it is focused on tackling discrimination. it sort of struck me. it is so upsetting. it is the intractability of discrimination. if it is intractable, what are you trying to do to measure and then tackle in some ways? what are some of the ways in which you have found have worked to educate and someday -- some way? >> we know that when we bring people together on a platform like airbnb that discrimination can happen. a lot of what we have done is establish what type of community we want to be. going back to 2016, he mentions laura murphy. we continued to work with her and others but we created something called the community

commitment and it really is a foundation of how we want our community to engage with one another. it essentially says that people and users will not discriminate against others. we have had 2.5 million people decline that community commitment and be removed from our community. i think this is really about establishing the type of community that we want to have and engaging with our users. this is another tool in that toolbox. i think the other part of it is trainings and bringing people together really does help bring down discrimination. it dispels the biases we have because it makes people human. they are not just characters -- cara catches of who they are in their racial identity and other identities they live in. >> talk to us about practical ways. i know you removed the ability for hosts to view a guest profile photo before the reservation was made.

you can see until after it has been agreed to. what other tangible ways have you managed to change the way we go through a bookings process that has helped breed in more diversity? >> instant book was a tool we created in 2016 and it really was a tool that essentially removes bias from the decision-making process that a host has. it is a way for a guest to book a listing without ever having to be considered on their identity. that said, we had a goal in 2016 of getting to a million instant book listings. we far surpassed of and we are at about 70% of our instant book listings. we had real success and this is another tool in our toolbox, with this report, we are also looking at instant book and finding ways to make 5 million more people able to use instant book. we hope that tools like this and solutions like this will have an

impact in addressing discrimination on the platform. >> how do you make five million more eligible? how are you seeing your ways and means of doing this as being enacted by other companies? what are the other practical ways you can do that? >> in terms of project lighthouse, when we build project lighthouse, we created a white paper that tells other companies how to do this. i know that many of our partners we have worked with to develop and launch project lighthouse and who have supported this report that we can met with yesterday, many of them want to see other companies. for us it is really about holding ourselves accountable. it is about creating that transparency and may be serving as a model for other companies that this data can sometimes be problematic and unacceptable like our bookings success rate cap. that data can only be addressed -- like you have the data and

then you can find the solutions and continue to measure whether or not the solutions actually have the impact you want. >> we are all of that here. coming up, let's talk about crypto a little bit more. it is a scenario we need to measure. hedge funds are now setting their sights on the stablecoin tether. we will break down why. that is next. this is bloomberg. easement

>> amid the chaos surrounding sam bankman-fried, and full of hedge funds are focusing back on the crypto industries's original bogeyman. it is tether. they have been leading the charge. >> a bunch of hedge funds have been shorting tether or at least looking for a way to short tether. there are some that have ventured into this realm. others we mentioned like valiant have looked at the trade and gotten in but gotten skittish

about it because they are worried about counterparty risk. tether is the third-largest crypto currency out there. >> in large part, there is a great podcast on this as well, people use it to spike themselves. even though we are a bit worried about what assets are really there to be in reserve, some have proved their worth. what are people worried about here? >> it has been around since 2014. it is not a new cryptocurrency.

the fact that it still remains on audit, tether says they cannot get an audit. they don't want to work in the cryptocurrency realm as much. but for whatever reason, it remains on audit. there are a lot of questions about whether or not it has the reserves it says it has. what gives people up at night or what tether shorts would tell you is if there is any question about whether you might not be able to get a dollar out if you put a dollar in, that could be a problem. >> sources kind of outlining these short positions that were established in the air. some funds had second thoughts. where do they lay with tether

right now? >> it speaks to some of the trust or lack thereof of the system. one of the ways to short tether is through a counterparty and genesis is among the counterparties that have been used in the past to short tether. even tether would tell you this. the people in charge. it is not exactly an easy trade to put up. coming up, elon musk was after him allegedly. and now, no more twitter page. we will have jack sweeney, author of the twitter account elon jet next. bloomberg. ♪

>> let's talk about delta

airlines. even his rivals won a weaker demand. the cfl joined us a little bit earlier. following the company's financial outlook and strategic update new york. >> the industry continues, whether it is with pilots or with the equipment manufacturers. there are numerous constraints on the system right now. >> does that frustrate you? >> i think there is a good structural backdrop.

we have been fortunate. we have been more in a training cycle. it is about building that operational capability in order to ensure that we can deliver that in a way that we can expect of ourselves but more important the way customers expect of us. >> really interesting from the delta airlines executive vice president. really talking about the determination continue to invest , particularly with the technology. this is sort of a flying taxi. they want to make it easier. because they are kind of like future proofing. at least they are putting their money there.

they see no crux in first quarter demand. those execs in business class seats, you know how us to get around question mark private jet. 20-year-old jack sweeney, he drew the ire of elon musk with his vital twitter account called elon pasta jet. elon offered him $5,000 in exchange for deleting the account which he ultimately refused. now, wednesday, the account has been suspended on twitter along with all the other accounts that jack sweeney operates. i am delighted to say that he joins us live now. jack, you operate -- were operating a series of accounts which provide automated updates that track a number of

individuals and entities by tracking their jets. twitter suspended all of those accounts today. can you is plain what happened? >> i wake up this morning and first i see that elon jet is bent and people are already going nuts. and then slowly, i noticed that all the other accounts that i run -- the thing is some of the accounts journeyman attracted jet of a person. it is just an organization like nasa or boeing or something, experimental aircraft. it is really not fitting the same rules as a person yet. he just went through my account and clicked ban on all of them. >> i want to talk about elon musk's response to what has happened today. he has taken to twitter that -- to say that rose i'm posting up someone else's location violates twitter's policy but delayed postings of locations are ok.

do you feel or do you acknowledge that what you are doing across those various accounts was a breach of twitter policy? >> they just changed that ruling within the past week and people have checked on the web are just checked on the web archive to see the wording of the terms and they have changed it and they gave me no warning on terms. they changed it and quickly banned by accounts and said i violated it. >> are you going to appeal? >> if i can and i will. it will add a delay but they gave me no opportunity to do so. >> what about the business behind this? it is an amazing source of transparency. what about losing money for yourself? >> i have been trying to build it up and make more revenue from it. i have been working on that. there is some amount, not a crazy amount but this is not happening.

-- helping. >> there is an argument that you put him in danger. he has a full -- a big following. do you accept that? >> somewhat. i would not say crazy in danger. if people are really after them, they can track them themselves. >> fascinating conversation, jack. let us know, get in touch. let us know how the appeal process goes. we thank you. stay well. that does it for this edition of bloomberg technology. >> it has been astonishing this show. that twitter issue is not going away. listen again to what we discussed. forget our podcast. >> i was going to say, they could probably go watch the

interview again. thank you for being that -- bringing that in. he is probably a bit offended right now. >> i will be back very soon, just watch. this is bloomberg. ♪

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