pres. biden: welcome to --mark: welcome to the bnn. i'm mark crumpton with first word news. a study finds some covid-19 booster shots lost their effectiveness earlier than originally thought. it found protection against death and hospitalization in elderly people began waning as soon two months after vaccination. those results build on previous reports about the effectiveness of updated boosters from moderna and pfizer, which show the shots sharply reduce the risk of severe covid in older adults. the biden administration is weaving to stop the food industry from promoting meet from foreign animals to products of the u.s. that would close a

labeling loophole that has infuriated domestic rants are in consumer advocates for years. president biden called for reassessment of the labeling standards, as part of the 2021 executive order targeting big business anticompetitive practices. in the u.k., senior doctors of the national health service are threatening to walk off the job over pay and pensions. doctors represented by the british medical association voted 86% in favor of strike action. the latest strike call raises fears of another round of disruption at the nhs, after analysts -- amulets drivers and nurses enter talks with the government over the weekend. global news 24 hours a day, on air and on bloomberg quicktake, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in over 120 countries. i am mark crumpton. this is bloomberg. ♪

>> welcome to bloomberg markets. i am amber, in for jon erlichman. kriti: green on the screen. i would not call it a ton of conviction. nursing s&p 500 volume down on the day, relative to a 10 day average, higher by only 0.4%, paring gains as we get closer to the closing bell. certainly something to keep an eye on. the bond market selling off, perhaps all incorporation for the testimony we will get for chairman powell and congress over the next two days. as you start to see that move lower in yields as well, paring back the initial move higher, the dollar falls unchanged at the moment. the tick by tick is what matters here. a quick check on the commodity market. simek screwed trading with an 80 handle. amber: one of the influential movers today is apple in everson one of the major industries.

the headlines continue to fly. it is throwing in the towel on crypto. the stock is rallying a little bit on that. ritchie brothers is trying to get a $7 billion deal to buy iaa across the finish line. they recommended shareholders reject the deal. kriti: certainly something we're going to keep an eye on. thank you for walking us through that. let's get back to our special coverage of the conference in miami. standing by with john zito. over to you. jon: great to be with you. we are right in the thought -- the throng of it. i will speak as loudly as i can. i always hate this question, but

we sat in the same seats a year ago and things were looking ok then. maybe training downward. now, we are definitely heading downward. what do you take away from the last 12 months? john: clearly, the asset class is more interesting than a year ago. thanks to j.p. morgan for having us. we have been doing this for over 20 years. it is by far, every year, the best conference for everyone to attend. clearly, we can see from people coming and saying hi to you and everybody, seeing that with rates higher, the return in asset classes is as interesting as it has ever been in over a decade. i don't think anyone a year ago expected the pace of financial tightening. but being a lender is great right now. you can be senior, first lane, double digits in returns. >> i get my own outdated view of what you guys do. it is often tethered to the market. it has not been great for the last few months.

a lot more today and i know you will talk about it, but just in the deal space, how that have things gotten and what has that meant for the business pipeline? john: there's multi-trillions of dry powder in the market. the quality deals are going to be higher. the quantum of debt is going to be lower. the cyclicality is going to be lower. there are still going to be deals. generally speaking, as a lender, there is still $300 million of refinancing that needs to get done in the next two years. some comes due in 2020 four. the pace of refinancing is very high. even if m&a is very low, refinancing will happen if the markets are open. that is great for us to be providing capital. reporter: the fact that this downturn, whenever it is, has been talked about so long, how has that changed the financing needs for the companies of the clients you service?

john: some of them, i think generally speaking, they can't make has held up better than anyone expected, given the pace of tightening. if interest rates stay where they are, there are lots of structures that will require some kind of reaching in the next couple of years, if rates stay high. that involves more equity from sponsors, picking up debt, but generally speaking, the quality of businesses borrowing that kind of capital are going to be able to sustain at a minimum a soft landing or no landing. if we go into a hard landing perspective, hopefully lots of that capital is sitting there with high-quality businesses. ed: one of the narratives of recent years hitting the private industry with inroads into traditional banking, and that accelerated last year because of the economic environment pullback from some of the more risky lending. my question for you is, how does your industry cement those gains?

how do you sort of prevent it reverting to the norm as we return to a more benign economic environment? john: the last decade, we had effectively zero interest rates. we built is not just to be a single solution, private lender, lbo. the press loves to talk about us as a lender, how we compete with the banks. i think it is much more of a hybrid approach. there are some things that make sense in the private market and some in the public market. if you look at our balance sheet, we are investment grade. it is providing senior secured safe lending that is styled in different forms. that will include everything from royalties lending, receivables lending, mortgages, commercial real estate lending, and in addition to all those things, you are also seeing other ig-style lending, things that are more gp oriented. again, that is really a private solution, but it does not get

caught in the lbo definition. ed: it's probably less exciting to talk about for the press. if you think of it as an lbo, although it is several other things as well, there's still a lot of debt sitting on the balance sheets. is that something apollo would look at, potentially taking petition before that gets to us? john: we have been in the press and around the asset. it is not something we are looking to do. we finance anything typically that has safe asset characteristics, senior secured, with consistent cash flow. most is been focused in the safe lending category paired that has not been a particular focus. ed: are you saying this is not safe lending? john: i would say we are typically focused on investment grade. ed: another situation apollo has

been linked with is credit suisse. just explain that to me. is that into the bank itself or the new business that is coming out? john: there's lots of rumors about lots of partnerships with banks. for us, we have been around the banks anyway that has been really helpful for both the bank and apollo. we are looking to work with the banks in anyway so we can provide capital, but nothing really specific. ed: a question i have asked several people here at the conference, and edward foley, as private credit gets bigger and moves further up the capital, writing the same size checks we traditionally saw from the bank, what is the difference between a businesslike heirs and a businesslike direct lending from jp morgan? john: as i mentioned, all of these corporate's are looking for the best execution and solution. in some cases, it is better in private form.

jp morgan provides that as well. we have third-party businesses that provide that and we have a retirement services franchise that provides that as well. for us, it is always about providing the best cost of capital to the company. we work concurrently with jp morgan in an effort to do that and really provide liquidity to the market in any way we can. ed: a great conversation. we will be back next year to do it all over again. i turn it to you. >> john zito, over and apollo. coming up next, we have the exclusive interview with chase chairman and ceo jamie dimon, as coverage continues at the jp morgan leverage finance conference in miami. this is bloomberg. ♪ welcome to ameriprise. i'm sam morrison. my brother max recommended you. so my best friend sophie says you've been a huge help.

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kriti: this is bloomberg markets. time now for our stock of the hour. we're looking at jp morgan, sitting there session lows, shares down. as he saw a moment ago, the firm is currently hosting its global high-yield leverage finance conference in miami. ceo jamie dimon shared his

thoughts on the health of the consumer and weighed in on the possibility of a soft landing. >> the consumer still has a lot more money in their checking accounts than before covid. they are spending 10% more than last year, 40% more than pre-covid. it looks like they will have ways to spend roughly until the end of the year. at that point, is of a cliff, a soft landing? that is going to happen at some point later this year. you are going to know what these things do. but we could still have a soft landing. the other thing about all these economic forecasting's is russia-ukraine. that could change it dramatically and very, very quickly. ed: do you think absent russia-ukraine, will we have a soft landing? >> i think it's possible. i think a mild recession as possible, a harder recession as possible. i hear there is a good chance inflation will come down, but

not enough by the fourth quarter , because the fed may have to do more. think of bigger trends. they are inflationary. infrastructure, spending, the ira act, trade and certain parts of the world, bringing trade back to america. the greener transition is going to take a lot of capital. all of those things have inflation attributes that are very different than the last 20 years. ed: i'm going to come back to the consumer point and a second, but last year, you talked about this confluence of factors, america rebounding fairly strongly, then obviously the war as well. he talked about them leading us into an unprecedented period. how do we get out of that? jamie: diplomacy. we always talk about uncertainty in the economy. i call it normal uncertainty. we know what the weather is like. that is why these things are different.

qt, coming out of covid, the war in ukraine, i think it has been pushed out a little bit further. i had thought we would be dealing with this a little sooner, but it looks like some of that stuff is coming to fruition at the end of this year. russia-ukraine, we simile don't know. i think it is wrong to try to predict. if you look at the history of wars, they are pretty much unpredictable and how they play out and which ones affect the global economy. there were very small parts of the economy. this is not a small part of the economy. this is a european nation could it is russia, oil, gas supply, food supply around the world. this is a whole different attribute to it. ed: but then why does the consumer here in the u.s. remain, as you say, fairly bullish? jamie: over a period of time, home prices have been going up. employment and wages have been going up. i think it's a good thing.

a lot of money in the checking account. stocks have generally gone up for 10 or 15 years. the consumers, if you look at today, in great shape. i'm telling you, that will end at one point. amber: sonali basak is joining us with her take on the interview. it is so fascinating to hear him talk about that it could be a mild recession, a harder one. you could add jp morgan to the list of ceos that really aren't sure what we are going to get. walmart, target, and this is a guy who has a window into people's bank accounts, and he is still unsure. sonali: uncertain, for sure. there was optimism in his language, but i want to point out some of the things he talked about. in the second half of this year and heading into next year, it could present publications into the market, that a lot of people were thinking would start to clear up. among those issues include quantitative tightening, potentially worsening the market.

as well as a banker who has so much you intevac accounts across this america, there is this idea of a cliff as it pertains to the consumer. he is less worried about employment. job employment and wages are strong. he worries a lot about how spending will start to shore up into next year, once some of those savings start to diminish. the other thing i would talk to is this idea of inflation. he said the fed might have to do more to curb inflation, even if it does start to come down. this higher for longer narrative is certainly in the back of jamie dimon's mind. while he is a beneficiary of a lot of these higher interest rates, the consumer bank is starting to feel that rising. that worry about the consumer, the impact of inflation and the overall impact of higher rates is clearly shining through what jamie dimon is saying. kriti: one of the reasons for that inflationary take, and jamie spoke about it alongside many of his peers, is the were

in ukraine. what is interesting is that he said perhaps the wharton ukraine is not the only factor to be watching on the geopolitical front. sonali: there are two things i would think about. one is of course the war in ukraine, what it means for the global world order. he started to hint at that a little bit in the conversation. but also what it means for global pricing, commodity pricing, trade relationships changing. jamie dimon has been very vocal about the energy security of the united states, in particular. and he has been grow pretty hard in washington about jp morgan's financing of energy companies and coal companies. i am sure it will be highlighted very highly in his yearly letter. china is front and center for all of these banks. a relationship between china and the global east, when you think about it. when you think about jp morgan's relationship as well, jamie dimon was recently grilled on capitol hill about what would

happen, what would he and j.p. morgan do if china's tensions with taiwan were to flare up in a bigger way. jamie dimon, in this conversation and that one, takes the key of the united states, the government, and what they would say to do in those instances. but clearly, he was passing the baton to the policymakers here, in terms of the future that jp morgan should be playing in that world order. amber: despite all that concerned about uncertainty, taking a look at jp morgan shares, they are close to about a one year high, signaling investors still have confidence in jamie dimon's competence to navigate those challenges. sonali: remember, you flocked to safety environments like this, not just in the united states. jp morgan is a global bank. it can benefit now from some of the pressures easing off of europe because they have been extending some much into europe. they have been fighting on all fronts here.

they have been expanding into equities and fixed income trading's in a volatile market, really benefiting from that extra risk-taking. also, that benefit of higher interest rates will benefit jp morgan more than anybody else, given this scale of what they have in the united states and what they are able to make from that interest. the americas the other when you think about that front. i would say the big question, going back to the beginning of this question -- of this conversation, is should some of these challenges persist into next year, what new headwinds does jamie dimon and everyone else start to face? amber: thanks so much tuition olive asset for providing that analysis paired we're going to take a quick break. what is the largest oil services company have to say about the future of electric vehicles? that interview is next. this is bloomberg. ♪

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amber: this is bloomberg markets. for today's "for what it's worth." $29,000. that is the amount that has been cut from tesla's car prices, as the company slashes prices for the second time this year. that news coming as tesla is replaced by a ferreri as morgan stanley's top u.s. auto pick. ferrari's list of u.s. stock has gained 61% since the low in june. they got a recent boost after the company raised its outlook. but where exactly is the market when it comes to going electric? listen to what the ceo of slb had to say, the world's largest oil services company. this is what he told bloomberg in an interview. >> i think there will be a mix. some of the cars will go electric, no doubt. i think in 10 years or 20 years,

it will be a transition. it would take longer than anybody expects, but it will transition there. but that is not the only use of oil that exists. kriti: that was the slb executive chief speaking earlier to bloomberg. it is interesting paired we are talking about the acceleration into ev's and the price ec from a stockmarket market perspective. tesla has been the biggest weight on the s&p 500 today. apple has been the biggest gain or. -- again -- gainer. amber: tesla has been the winter so far. with all these price cuts, a lot of people look to how the ford -- how ford and gm will keep up. yet to keep in mind that tesla's margins are a lot larger on these cars, so they have a lot of room to cut. kriti: a lot to digest we talk about the health of the consumer.

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romaine: rally losing a little bit of steam on monday afternoon. romaine bostick alongside scarlet fu. we are kicking you off to the close. >> we are waiting for jay powell to speak to tomorrow -- to speak tomorrow. waiting to give a clue to the fed. romaine: everyone is behind closed doors thinking how can i not give this market a clue. it gets to the broader issue about the market looking for a catalyst. you talk about s&p