matt: welcome to "bloomberg markets." i'm matt miller. let's get a quick check of the markets at this hour, one hour away from the fed minutes, and traders are awaiting the release. we have a very low volume relative to what we've seen the past 30 years. s&p down .2%. take a look at the 10-year yield. we have been hovering around 420 for most of the morning and it

has rallied higher. i will give you comments from former treasury secretary larry summers. he spoke to david westin about a much higher rate. bloomberg dollar index continues to gain ground. it has been a lot of strength of the past four weeks as the yields get higher they are more attractive to foreign investors who needed to buy dollars to access that. crude, very interesting traded today. we have inventories a little bit light. nonetheless, we see nymex crude below $80 a barrel. west texas intermediate going for $79.84. i want to talk about the housing sector first. 30-year mortgage rates have top 7%, a threshold double impact affordability, sales, and refinancing activity. here is reade pickert to explain. what do we know about what the 7% mortgage is going to do to the housing market, which already seems like it is in a

deadlock since home wonders don't want to give up cheaper mortgages they have? >> that's exec the right. we have data that shows that the 30-year contract rate on a mortgage went up to 7.16%, matching the highest now since 2001. what we are expecting is a two-part situation. one is that when you see higher mortgage rates, that restricts demand. on the upside, -- on the flip side, it leads people to not want to list their homes. the reason we have had headwinds for the housing sector more generally is because people look around and they know they have their 2%, 3% mortgage rate, and they don't want to trade at in. the lack of inventory has been what is keeping existing home sales down. it is part of the reason that we have seen home prices start to pick back up again. what is interesting is how this will impact builders. we saw yesterday that homebuilder sentiment declined

for the first time this year in part due to this pickup in mortgage rates we are seeing. it will be interesting to see if we continue to have builders go out there and continue to build to try to meet this demand when inventories in the new home -- new housing market is already pretty elevated. matt: you can imagine that if people aren't going to give of existing homes, new inventory is the only way to tackle the problem. on the other hand, as you said, sentiment fell and building permits came in pretty light. we were inspecting a jump of 1.5%. they came up only 0.1%. at the same time, housing starts month over month work up 3.9%. how do you rectify that diverging data? reade: so it is important to get under the headline numbers today, especially in that housing starts data. when you look under that permits data, really what you saw is in a single-family housing, use

permits rise but the most -- you saw permits rise by the most in over a year. it was the multifamily housing component that was dragging down the number and led to the tepid gain in permits. when you look at the picture, at least what we got today is there is still this pipeline that builders are looking to keep building. it will be interesting to see if that continues, as we look later into the year. housing has been a drag on the u.s. economy for a long time now. but its turnaround is something that a lot of economists have been looking to as a reason the u.s. may avoid a recession, this rebound. it will be interesting to see if this new headwind of higher mortgage rates hits housing back down, or if it can hold and keep its footing. matt: reade, thanks so much for joining us. reade pickert talking to us about the housing picture out of washington, d.c. former u.s. treasury secretary larry summers says the recent

run-up in 10-year yields may have further to go here is what he told david westin for "wall street week." larry: you take 2.5 for inflation, you take 1.5, which isn't specially aggressive, for real rates, and you take 75 basis points, which is lower the history for term premiums, you are looking at 4.75 on the 10-year. it could end up being higher than that. nobody knows, but it seems to me we are in a very different era than the arrow we are in in the aftermath of the financial crisis. matt: here with more is david westin can the host of "wall street week." larry summers coming out really bearish on treasuries and even topping yield forecasts from the

bills, dudley and gross. david: exactly. one of the interesting things about larry is he goes to the math. 1.5% is historically low for real interest rates. that adds up to 4.75. he did say that it could go higher. we will have to be spending more on defense given to political situations, and our borrowing costs are going up. we will pay interest on all that debt. matt: what else did he ever say about the effects of this? we just talked to reade about mortgage rates. typically mortgage rates are about 2% above the 10-year yield. that is right where we are now. david: exactly. it does not say anything happy about people getting mortgages for it says something happy for people who already have mortgages. that may be part of the reason why some people say maybe economy is a little less sensitive to interest-rate changes right now because people

have longer term debt they are enjoying and there is a shift in services. you have to anticipate the possibility we will have a tougher time. but you know this, matt, we are in an artificial period. you don't have negative real rates for an extended time. money was free. it is not going to be free anymore. matt: it does show optimism on his part in terms of the inflation outlook. he things we will be 2.5% over a long period. david: one of the things he said to us is he no longer things a recession is likely this year. before he was saying it is more than 50% likely. it might happen in 2024. one of the interesting points he makes is if you don't have a recession, the fed will not be cutting rates. you can't have it both ways. matt: very interesting interview. david westin, host of "wall street week." catch that program 6:00 p.m. new york time on bloomberg television.

american securities ceo michael fish on the state of private equity today. this is bloomberg. ♪ ♪ (upbeat music) ♪ ( ♪♪ ) ( ♪♪ ) ( ♪♪ ) -awww. -awww. -awww. -nope. ( ♪♪ ) constant contact delivers the marketing tools your small business needs to keep up, excel, and grow. constant contact. helping the small stand tall.

matt: this is "bloomberg markets ." i'm matt miller. markets are fluctuating ahead of the fed minutes. they come out at 2:00 p.m., and then we will get a better sense of why officials are showing optimism for a soft landing. that said, interest rates remain high, and that is impacting private markets. that's get a read on the private equity space with michael fisch, ceo of americans agrees, as well as sonali basak, our wall street reporter. michael, thanks for coming into the program. we talk so much about higher

rates. i did a story on mortgage rates over 7%. we heard from larry summers, who think the 10-year will average 4.75% the next decade. how does that affect your business? michael: it affects it a lot. it is very important to plan for rates. it's not catastrophic for private equity. deal flow is down 40% from last year, 60% from the year before. that means half the deals are getting done. rates matter. when you plan for and what you expect -- 40 years ago senior debt was 14.5%. the private equity business was exploding then and it is doing well now. but if you bought companies planning for lower rates and didn't hedge add, that is a problem. the cost of your image was complete europe because of supply chain problems and inflation, is another problem. in a projected earnings don't come in, management has to be nimble. sonali: curious about the inflation store and how that is reading through your portfolio still. what are the sticky problems you

are seeing resting on? michael: we try to focus on the market share leader. the market share leader almost always gets at least its fair share of scarce product and scarcity of product leads to inflation. market share leaders tend to do well. smaller players can't have products, and so their sales are down, or can't pass along products wasn't as in many situations, being bigger here is good. sonali: what about the idea of exits? on one hand interest rates of impact the cost of financing, but the others that it is hard to sell into public markets. sales of started to come back slowly. what does it look like out there? michael: it is the reverse of the new deal market. sales are still possible. volume is half of what it was. sellers and sources are less ipo but more taking public companies private, buying corporate carveouts. that is an active an increasing percentage of our deal flow. matt: interested to hear about

your portfolio companies, because you say you focus on the market leaders. what are examples of portfolio companies that are doing best for you? michael: 60% of our investment or industrial companies. industrials are often misunderstood. they have grown for 20 years faster than u.s. gdp and are still growing and many of them are noncyclical. if you're in the used truck parts business, that is a good place. if you are making orthopedic shoulders, that is a good place to become unrelated to gdp cycles. if you have consumer businesses with aggressive forecasts, that has been more challenging over the last six months. sonali: let's talk more about that because you have interesting businesses in consumer retail, restaurants -- potbelly, conair. what concerns of a bigger slowdown do you have ahead? michael: we try to capitalize committees to have revenue in good times and market share in

bad times. conair is an example of a company that is doing fine on revenues. hopefully all over your kitchens with cuisinart products. belfour is in the disaster recovery space, so it is un correlated to cycles. matt: you know, we see so many disasters -- i just heard a bloomberg intelligence analyst say that wildfires have gone up 400% this century. of course we see it in hawaii, we see it in canada. does that company get more business as climate change increasing natural disasters? michael: hawaii and the wildfires and we had that in new york, very sad. our heart goes out to people in maui. belfour is anti-fragile. it's more fragile to water. hurricanes, big rainstorms, you have got to fix it or you're

going to lose her house. belfour is there with minimum to solve a problem when a hurricane comes. sonali: where else are you looking to areas to deploy first capital? -- fresh capital? michael: we are always looking for industries that may have a tailwind. in up-and-down times there is always something growing. we are the largest solar epc in the country. there was exploding demand for green energy, clean energy, and solar. we are always looking at water because water is a great place to be. there is a lot of companies that help process more and more food and make food production more efficient because there is a growing number of people and a food shortage exacerbated by these climate issues that you were talking about. matt:matt: i was living in berlin the last six years, it was wonderful. i would go to the super return conference, at which i would be quoted an ever-increasing number

for the dry powder out there. $1.7 trillion, then $2 trillion, then $2.7 trillion. is there really that much cash availability in private equity? michael: yes. write out a corny to one consulting firm, $3.7 trillion of dry powder, and about $1 trillion of that is private equity, or so-called bios. the rest is infrastructure and other things. that is a big number, but what i always think is more important is what percentage of the ecosystem that is. one way to express that is how many years of investment current pacing is that. typically it is between two and five years, now 3.4 years. it is where it has always been. it grows because the industry keeps growing. sonali: but is one of the problem that there is too much money chasing too few deals? the sheer amount of money seems like it could be a problem ahead. michael: one could think that.

the first time i heard tmmctfd was 1987. too much money chasing too few deals. now it just depends on your space. in the middle market, there is enormous growth and very little capital. in some places there is tons of money and smaller numbers of deals. it just depends. back to your point about interest rates, in the large deal space, the lack of syndicated debt financing market for the last 12 to 18 months constrained the ability for large deals. not so, market space, where credit is readily available. matt: you and the firm you founded, you mentioned the portfolio companies you are in, industrials, cuisinart,, truck parts, potbelly -- sonali mentioned potbelly. sonali: chicago girl, what are you going to do? matt: not a lot of tech. are you pivoting away from tech? michael: it is a great space, and a lot of smart people

pursuing that space. we are focused on industrial businesses for 30 years. it is 60% of what we invested in. we services and consumer. we are bringing tech because it is everywhere. we are bringing into these old economy companies. we are not investing in tech per se. sonali: what about ai? do you think jobs will be impacted by evolving technology? michael: no question about it. there is a large investment bank which came out with a study synchrony 5% of jobs are going to be displaced through ai. on the one hand that could be very problematic if it is your job and how we retrain this people is going to be a big issue. the bulls would say that is more efficiency and higher productivity. we are seeing it across all of our companies now, a lot of ai projects going on to read document and process consumer issues faster, to locate new

restaurants -- if it was potbelly, a former investment, or new service enters for truck parts, ai is everywhere and everyone is figuring out how to adopt it. matt: great having you here and we hope we get more time with you in the future. michael fisch is the ceo and founder of american securities, and our star wall street reporters nelly wasik, thanks as always -- reporter sonali basak, thanks as always. high-potency marijuana has lawmakers we thinking regulation. this is bloomberg. ♪

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matt: this is "bloomberg markets ." i'm matt miller. today's big cake looks at the recreational marijuana industry, which is pouring money into products with high thc levels, of course. early-to-legalize states are possibly rethinking their laws because of extremely high-thc products causing health problems. tiffany, it is important to point out that not everybody using weed is doing dabs, these incredibly concentrated thc gooey products that are practically smoked out of a crack pipe. but those who are have had issues. >> that's right, there is a huge range of marijuana product from old flash and, people who roll

into joints, edibles, vapes. with vapes and concentrates, ghc is not only 60% and up, but can be sometimes 90% and up. that is where we are starting to see people complain of these health issues. matt: is there any regulation inside saying you can sell flower, gummies, edibles, but we have a problem with butter or dabs? tiffany: we have seen some states debate is. vermont is one state where it has become an issue. i focused on colorado and washington because they were the earliest states to have recreational cells and they say we see them sold out the back door sometimes to kids. they are trying to come up with regulations but seeing his pushback from the industry saying, look, maybe medical patients need these products. you cannot just cap thc, that

would wipe out a huge swath of the marijuana industry's products. matt: but there are parallels with the alcohol industry. you can buy beers and wines between 4 and 14% alcohol, and then you have hard liquor, 40, 5 0%, and then everclear, which in a lot of states is illegal, more like 95%. why can't they do something like that? tiffany: it's really interesting analogy. there is an analogy with tobacco where we have seen cigarettes have been sold for so long, and then there is controversy over vaped which has higher nicotine levels and accusations that those levels were used to addict people. only now, a century into people smoking, regulators are talking about putting nicotine caps in tobacco. with cannabis, the science is so much younger than it is with either alcohol or tobacco. matt: right recently saw stork -- i recently saw a story that

ohio is putting recreational use on the ballot, or trying to get it on the ballot, in their respective vision that that might sway sherrod brown, head of the senate banking committee, to push safe banking. have you heard about the safe banking act in any progress there? that is one of the big problems for the burgeoning industry. tiffany: it has been, and it has continued to fail to get traction. it is hard to say when there is been so much hope for so long and it keeps getting pushed off to what the prospects really are. matt: problems like this, people who are using incredibly high concentrates and doing damage to the health, don't really help. tiffany: i don't think it helps the industry, no. i was surprised to find that more than one third of the marijuana industry's products seem to fall into this category now. you have a cannabis industry depend on the product that there is uncertain regulatory prospects and health concerns about. matt: great having you on the program. talking to us about weed.

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\ jon: i'm jon erlichman. welcome to "bloomberg markets." matt: and i'm matt miller. the s&p off .4%. slightly lighter volume because we are waiting for the fed minutes. come out at 2:00, just about 30 minutes from now. 10-year yield rising almost four basis points, up to 42484 right now.

bloomberg dollar index has picked up. oil interestingly is down, $1.30 a barrel, even after inventories came in a little bit light. jon: pretty dramatic move for oil the last week after that move towards 85,000 sector -- then move towards 85%. sectorwise, we have the underwriting number updates from progressive. that stock is up 8%. we will be talking by the retell story, target numbers, but also t.j. maxx in the spotlight with broad gains. then we have been watching coinbase's stock, staying with the technology team, where we saw the approval on the crypto futures in the u.s. stocks down right now. one stock that is flat at this point -- one stock that is notably weaker on the session is tencent, as the china weakness

is evident in the latest quarterly results can also softness in the technology sector in china. matt: let's bring it back here to north america. tech stocks have struggled recently. the nasdaq 100 in new york rallied a whopping 44% through july. has had a steeper drop this month that than the s&p and the dow. our next guest is one of canada's best known tech investors. leading early investments & co.'s like shop -- in companies like shopify. john ruffolo is the head of maverix private equity. angst very much for your time. i have got to ask about grades. we saw mortgage rates go up 7% officially. larry summers is going to be on david westin's program "wall street week." he says he think the 10-year will average 4.75 over the next decade. how are rates like this affecting your business? john: i actually think the rates

are actually coming back to the long-term mean, and it is making technology businesses ultimately more sustainable. so much over the last decade they were fueled by excessively cheap rates, and capital was funding businesses that perhaps should not have been sustainable businesses in the first place. i think that if rates stay like this and not really move much more, or drop a little bit, but i don't think this is a cataclysmic situation for the tech sector. matt: one of the problems we saw earlier this year as a result of rising rates -- to some extent you could say as a result of bad management as well, a few banks failed, but specifically svb, so important to the venture capital world. how did your portfolio companies deal with it?

john: in canada they really weren't a significant player. they were about 10 years ago, but the canadian banks started taking away their market share. although they were a very good and reputable player, their real influence was that they were quite aggressive in their pricing, and they kept the canadian banks honest in terms of the structure for the technology companies. but it really wasn't that big of an issue, certainly from the deposit perspective very, very little impact, and once it was insured, obviously no impact. it's now been taken over by another bank, and it's just created healthy competition in canada. jon: and i think what is interesting, john, we go from this year of challenge, 2022,

the uncertainty with silicon valley bank, to all of this excitement about artificial intelligence was we spoke to you in toronto not that long ago, and the ai hype was in front of everybody. as an investor, how are you looking at the ai story right now? john: i am looking at it the same way i did before, but i think the rest of the market is starting to calm down a little bit and to oversimplify the two macro areas of investment, there was investments at the infrastructure layer, the large language model layer. openai certainly has taken the public by storm. but that area of investment -- my view is that there is only going to be a few very large players in the world. by the way, you are seeing it now. there is questionable activity going on intensive where they

are grabbing all their data from. i also believe there is going to be so few players that are going to make money by being at the infrastructure layer. it is like a big utility. the interesting area for me is the application layer. this is the layer where they are actually doing things for particularly companies, and making their businesses more effective. this is what is going to change the world, and at that level, the application layer, there is going to be hundreds and thousands of great companies there. that is where you will see venture dollars start to focus in on. jon: there is the theme of investors being able to more broadly play in this sandbox. we have seen all the money flow into the big ai stocks publicly traded big players. but there has been an ipo drought for roughly a

year-and-a-half within the tech sector. what is your outlook on that front? john: i think we are in this infrastructure layer of investment. let me give you a concrete example in the public market. nvidia their stock price has gone through the moon because right now where is it so much of this money going to the large language model layer? it is to buy chipsets. you are seeing the nvidia stock of there is going to be a point where that calms down, and you are going to see incredible activity and a lot of creative destruction, where a lot of businesses are going to finally say, wow, i can really embed ai into my business, and the negative side is that could mean a lot of layoffs, or a lot of transition of people. but i think this is the exciting

area. this is the area that people need to watch out for, especially as the united states has determined that this is a strategic and national security issue, and as they pull away from their investment, particularly in china, you are going to see more and more companies stateside that are going to be investing in this space. matt: does that have any effect -- has been biden signed the executive order last week. -- president biden signed the executive order last week. congress would like more oversight into investments by big asset managers like blackrock, for example. what about your portfolio companies, companies just getting a foothold in these markets? do they have to be really worried about their connections, possibly investments in or any kind of presence in china? john: i would say that if you're in sensitive industries, you

might have to. if you are in developing infrastructure layer ai, quantum, certain cybersecurity companies, i think the answer is going to be asked. what you are to hope for is -- what you are going to hope for is there is going to be a trade-off. if, for several, united states -- let's talk about the u.s. government procuring goods in these sensitive sectors from china. it was going to need to be replaced. so that creates an opportunity. the real question is will the decrease in the inbound ordering of goods from china be offset by the activities in the united states or in its allies. right now there's a shortage of manufacturing capacity. but like i've always said, never bet against the united states to change the equation very quickly. matt: by the way, you mentioned

creative destruction. we were talking with michael fisch of american securities, and he was talking about the fac t that ai is definitely going to displace people from jobs. of course it will create jobs as well. we see that with every paradigm shift. where do you see job creation due to ai? john: well, i would say that i probably fall a little bit more on the pessimistic side, and the reason is you are absolutely right, since the industrial revolution, this creative destruction has always occurred, but there is two differences now that make it more challenging. the rate of change of the displacement has never been this fast. before, it used to take generations. jesus, now we are talking six

months for displacements to occur. that is not enough time to do retraining of people. and number two, it was largely on human labor, physical human labor that was being displaced now we are getting into brainpower. i think a lot of the color workers who have gone to school --white-collar workers who have gone to school and been educated in certain areas didn't expect this. in the long-term, do i think the new jobs, particularly understanding data, understand ing different techniques on how to attract customers, all those areas? absolutely. will there be a time lag? i would say there would have to be. what's going to have to likely happened is that the governments are likely going to have to use taxation dollars or social programs to perhaps a that displacement. -- bridge that is pleasant.

jon: it paints a picture of a very different role and a discrete to get your perspective. thank you for joining us, john ruffolo of maverix private equity, on the tech landscape and the ai boom. we will talk about earnings and spotlight in the retail sector. target out with its quarterly results. corey tarlowe will join us with his take on what is happening in the retail sector. this is bloomberg. ♪

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still up in the session. inventory improvements and cost controls -- matt, the better profit margins we saw lessening the sting from the fact that this was the first sales the client fo -- first sales decline for target in four years. matt: to meet is still puzzling that investors take so many positives out of an earnings report with an outlook that is so bad. corey tarlowe is going to join us to tell us what is happening there. he has a buy rating on target. i know maybe it was expected that target would bring its forecast down a little bit. but still, who cares about the quarter that happened? we only care about the quarter that is coming. corey: i would say there are three key points i would make. the first would be on sales, second on margin, third on outlook. on sales we saw comps decline about 5%. the street had expected there to

be 3.7% comp decline. it was worse than expected. but the kicker is that margins were better. the gross margin came in at 27%. the historical averages close to, if you go back the last 10 years, 29 to 30%. i know you like to look at stocks on a more longer-term basis. there is an opportunity to get in line with we've seen historically. just on the outlook, the outlook was lowered by 10%, mainly due to a consumer that has been may be overall a little resilient. but we are starting to see some signs of a little bit of hesitancy, and on the back of what we are likely to see is a pullback due to student loans resuming, some caution on behalf of target management. jon: corey, once we are through this busy retail earnings season, do you think outside the reality of the changing consumer base, we'll have some strong

takeaways on the haves and have-nots, who is getting aligned's share of -- the lion's share of that money right now? corey: certainly. as i alluded to, the consumer has been a little more resilient than expected. but we are seeing under the surface indications of the consumer being incrementally or stretched, -- more stretched, and we often to see consumers shifting from wants into needs, and further beyond that, shifting within those categories further into private label away from brands. now you're starting to see credit metrics spike, further indication that the good tumor is becoming more stretched. as we think about the retailers that are the haves and have-nots, certainly one that comes to mind which reports tomorrow is walmart, as i have. the company in stark contrast to target is going to post a robust

second-quarter results on the back of a consumer trade down. and then you also have a business in the walmart e-commerce business growing at a very healthy rate. what we did, rather uniquely compressed take a look at app usage during the key selling period of amazon prime week, also walmart plus week. we saw usage search nearly 30%. the business is growing at a rate of 30%. we expect that to continue to buoy results ahead of when we hear from walmart tomorrow. matt: i like to look at stocks over five years because the function defaults to that on bluebird. target had such a great pandemic. they just shut up and have now come crashing back down. walmart was checking along, and it looks like that stock is about to overtake target over five years.

if you put amazon up there, they have only returned 44, 40 5%. they are doing worse than walmart and target, but none of them compares to costco, up 170%. this is a company that is doing a lot better than the others. is it going to be a beneficiary? corey: we think so. one remarkable thing about cosco is the membership metrics have continued to be incredibly robust. although the business is a joint or $25 billion enterprise, -- $225 billion in price from profit margins are relatively slim. it is predominantly membership dollars. on the back of sam's club raising its membership fee from $45 to $50 for the base, we think now might be a good time for costco at some point on the horizon to raise its membership fee and provide another boost to profitability.

it clearly is an environment where consumers are prioritizing needs over wants, you have a membership model that drives predictably -- drives predictability in sales and profit ability. to your point on kirkland, that is one third of the overall business and growing for costco, and also helps to support slightly better margins in the namebrand products. jon: thanks so much, corey tarlowe, jefferies equity research vice president. we will keep an i on the walmart numbers tomorrow. tesla continues price cuts worldwide. we will have the impact on the bottom line next. this is bloomberg. ♪

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matt: this is "bloomberg markets ." i matt miller, with jon erlichman. tesla has announced price cuts to its cause around the world. ed ludlow covers ev's and he

joins us to talk about this. it is mainly china, right? they made slight price cuts on monday and then came out yesterday with much bigger price cuts on the higher-end models. ed: yeah, and it's tesla and elon musk being consistent. monday there was $1900 trim in the chinese market. , tuesday a new entry-level price for the model x in the u.s., and overnight, a 10,000 u.s. dollar cut to model x in china. you go back to july 19 for their earnings call, elon musk telegraph this could happen. they use the lever a price cuts to open a pockets of demand really well. it's just so interesting, the timing in the context of china's economy right now. for me, this is the data story, and tested being able to real-time judge demand of around the world.

jon: what does that mean for the rest of the industry, which obviously has to keep pace with the likes of tesla? ed: what elon musk outlined his they feel dialed in on understanding what a consumer is willing to do. buying a car is a big consideration in any economy. the concern for the market -- you look at shares under pressure, down for fourth straight day this month, is it widens the ev price war the reason china was surprising is that tesla along with the domestic uses in china agreed to a pact, essentially, the wording of which stated clearly it was nonbinding. but tesla changed direction and said we will cut prices. the concern is that this comes with u.s. domestic automakers and the other chinese domestic makers as well. it impacts the bottom line. if you are an investor, your

priority is completely different from a consumer who sees that and goes, great, i can suddenly afford this ev. matt: and none of them are really that affordable. do we see any other price cuts across many factors, other than ford, which i know has cut prices in response to tesla? bmw, mercedes, audi, they all make very expensive electric vehicles. ed: they do. run with the mercedes example. remember in china the back end of last year, mercedes made a very deep cuts to premium models and that market. i kept asking how that would continue on. they have not used it in the same cadence that tesla has. that is the point of difference. even with ford, theirs is a response to tesla and the domino effect. they don't do it with regularity or the switch between raising prices and cutting that tesla has done. in 1h, tesla did go back and raise prices on certain models. matt: great having you on the

program as usual. ed ludlow, host of "bloomberg technology," telling us about the ev industry covers so well. for jon erlichman, i matt miller. this is bloomberg. ♪

romain: the fed meeting in late july, along with katie, and there were public comments made from the f.o.c. members.