♪ david: this is my kitchen table and also my filing system. over much of the past three decades i've been investor. the highest calling of mankind i've often thought was private equity. and then i started interviewing. i learned from doing the interviews how leaders make it to the top. >> i asked, she wanted, i didn't negotiate with them, i did no due diligence. and how they stay there. >> you don't feel inadequate now being only the second wealthiest man in the world, is that right? >> within the headquarters of the national football league i just have a chance to interview the commissioner of the nfl, roger goodell is now serving his 19th year as commissioner. we had a chance to talk about issues like international expansion, popularity of the nfl and the fact that private equity firms are now being allowed to invest in the nfl. so today, the nfl is by far the most profitable and largest

revenue sports franchise for leak in the world. revenue of about $20 billion were sold last year, and every team seems to be profitable. the television ratings are very good. what you think makes the nfl so popular? >> to fully starts with the game. i think it is one of the greatest games if not the greatest game in the world. the competition is extraordinary. the players, the coaching. our games have never been closer. it brings people together. it does well on media. i think being in the stadium is better. i think we are fortunate to have a great product. second, i would say the business model. i think we need to look at the key aspects of revenue-sharing and a salary cap that we design

with our players. we have something i think that makes every team competitive and they think unusual. and i think that is an important element that people overlook. and also it is a statement.

i think the competitive issues still need to be worked out. >> all the super bowls have been held in the united states. they had more than 50 of them so far. you ever envision a time where a super bowl will be held in a city not in the united states? >> well, we've always, i think, had a super bowl city that has a franchise. i think that's sort of the core principle we've had. i think if we have an international franchise, i definitely see that happening. i think as we become global, that will be something that as we have international franchises, that would be logical. >> let's talk about the franchises. recently a team was sold about a billion dollars, amendments for

a price that nobody ever thought a sports franchise in the united states would reach, $6 billion. were you surprised the price was that high? >> no. i think one that's a franchise that growing up in washington, i probably have a deeper emotional feeling for it, but that's a franchise in a great market. we believe that it's going to be a tremendous success there. i think josh harris and his limited investors are going to do a great job. i'm also not surprised at that price. >> recently the nfl allowed private equity firms, including mine, to invest in nfl teams in minor stakes, i think up to 10%. a number of these have already been done. i think valuations are above $6 million that the commanders received. some of the minority stakes are at least $8 billion valuations. why did you let the bad guys know a private equity people into the tent?

and why have you capped it at 10%? >> one, letting the bad guys in, we really feel like there are things you all can teach us about our business. and maybe help us think about it a little differently. as you know, that 10% position is a silent position. we believe very strongly in the fact that we like the principal owner approach that we've had for years and other sports have had successfully. so we want to make sure that the controlling owner is the one that makes the decisions on behalf of the club, both at the league level and at the club level. >> do you ever envyings a time that there's a minority stake in a team? >> i don't think we'll ever allow institutional in a controlling position, at least in the foreseeable future. again, i think we feel very strongly about having a prince pal owner that is there operating the franchise responsible for that, both in the club level, as well as the league level. >> on television, the case that somebody that only subscribes to

basic cable can still watch any of his teams or her teams' home games, or what are the rules? it's very complicated as to what you have to pay for, what you don't have to pay for today. what is the basic rule that makes it possible for somebody to watch the nfl game for their home team? >> in the nfl, it's about as simple as it gets. we are committed to free television for the home teams, the home markets. so it's not just the home team, but the visiting team. they will get their game on free television. 100%. >> in other words, everybody who wants to watch their home team can watch it on basic television for free? >> correct. >> so now you have other packages for people to watch, special games or games that are not the home team. they then sign up for netflix package or something else like that. >> we have a few games that are on pay service, but we still are close to 90% of our games that are on free television, for everybody, and i think that is something we're incredibly proud of.

and i think it's led to the popularity of our game, because people can access it. and we give them opportunities to see those games. we have a limited number of packages, whether it's espn or whether it's netflix or amazon or youtube or espn+ or our own network where we have, i think it's roughly 35 games that are available, and those are pay services of some type. and they've been incredibly successful. we just had a christmas day game with netflix, two games that averaged over 30 million people on a global basis. and those audiences are younger. we're seeing that on some of these new services. and as you know, the media business is changing. and so it's our responsibility to make sure we do what's right in the best interest of our game to partner where we can bring more fans into the game. while i think we have a nice balance, we're still reliant on our original partners or network partners.

>> and what about the taylor swift effect? some people say that taylor swift is bringing more fans in because they want to watch her watch games, and other people say that she's getting as much attention as her, i guess her boyfriend, who's a player for one of the teams, the kansas city chiefs. so is that any impact on the nfl or not really that much? >> no, i think it has had a positive impact. listen, the most important thing is that two young people, travis contest and taylor swift, seem to have a wonderful relationship. they're both incredible people which i've had the good fortune of getting to know. but we just wish them well. but as far as what it's done, i think, you know, it's brought more interest into our game. taylor swift is one of the greatest entertainers in the world today, and i think has a tremendous following, and the fact that she likes football, i think it intrigues other people and causes them to, you know, be interested in the game. >> in the united states, the

biggest sporting event every year is the super bowl. what is super bowl week like for you? you have to go to the city. you have to deal with everybody. you have to be polite to everybody. you can't get upset with everything. but is it just a lot of tension that week? do you make the decision on what city you're going to have the super bowl in, and who the entertainment is going to be? >> let's start with the selection of it, because it usually happens five years out. it's actually a process we go through to select the super bowl city. the owners ultimately vote on that and select that city. and then our staff works with that city for roughly five years to get ready for the super bowl. super bowl week has gotten bigger. it starts earlier. it now starts on monday night with a big media event. and it's an incredible event that we think is a celebration of football a global basis. it's a hard week, because you're pushed in a lot of different

directions, but i couldn't be more honored or more privileged to do it. it's excitement. when we have 200 million people watching the super bowl, which is what the number was, that's an extraordinary impact and extraordinary event that you have the responsibility to pull that off successfully. >> you get people who knew from you high school calling you up asked for super bowl tickets? >> i get that a few times, yeah.

david: you wrote a letter to pete roselle when you were in college asking for an internship in the early 1980's. and he responded i guess positively because you got the internship. have you ever thought in your wildest imaginations what would've happened had he not responded positively and where you might be today? roger: well, he was kind. i don't know about positive. they get a lot of letters and a lot of interest in becoming an intern. he pushed it off to his executive director. i think it was close to 53 letters later when i got the internship. david: i see. roger: it wasn't an immediate response. it took almost a year before that happened. i have no idea what i would be doing today if i wasn't here at the nfl. david: so you didn't have any idea of doing something important like private equity? roger: those guys are too smart for me, david. david: i doubt that. for people who are watching now and people say, what did he put in his letter that was so persuasive to get an internship at the nfl. what did you say for future people who want to write letters to put in their letter? roger: i have a copy of it over there. i would say it wasn't the letter.

i think it was the fact that i wrote 53 times. at one point the executive director said, if you are ever in new york, come by. i said, i happen to be in new york. he said, can you come by at 8:00. i said of course, butthe problem was i was in pittsburgh. i drove all night to get there. i think you just have to take advantage of your opportunities and distinguish yourself in some ways of what you are deeply passionate about. and what you think you can create value for. david: let's talk about your own background for a moment. where were you born? roger: jamestown, new york. i grew up in washington d.c. though. david: what did your parents do? roger: my mother was a nurse. my father was a politician. david: he was a congressman who was appointed by nelson rockefeller to succeed the assassinated robert f. kennedy and he became a senator. is that right?

roger: that's correct, 1968. david: your family moved to washington? roger: no, we moved there in 1959 when i was born so he could serve in congress. david: people may not remember this, but your father was very famous because he was appointed as a moderate republican and then he opposed the war in vietnam under richard nixon. that became very difficult for him politically because many republicans at that time wanted to support richard nixon and didn't feel that a republican who opposed the vietnam war was a good republican. was that difficult for you? were you proud of what your father had done at the time? many people who were younger were against the vietnam war. roger: i couldn't be prouder of my father and the courage it took for him to do something that he knew was the right thing to do. it wasn't popular. and he knew at the time that he would likely lose his seat and lose the election. but he did it anyhow.

and i think when we were young, he actually gathered us around. well i'm one of five boys. with my mother and father. and said, i'm going to do this but i will likely lose the election. but that was a lesson that stays with me to this day. you have to do the right things, regardless of the consequences. david: going back to your growing up. so you grew up in washington but then you moved back to new york. roger: after he lost the election. bronxville, new york. david: then you went to high school in bronxville. you were a three sport star. you were in football, basketball, baseball. and the captain of all three of those teams at your high school. you went to washington jefferson college in pennsylvania. roger: yes. david: when you graduated, you wrote your famous letter to the nfl. what were you doing when you were waiting to hear back from the nfl? were you working in a mcdonald's or something like that?

roger: i wasn't. i took some time after the summer after i graduated. i focused on what i wanted to do. i eventually, because i did not hear back from the nfl in a positive way until february of the year after i graduated, i worked in the steel industry briefly. it was a good experience for me. in a management training program. david: eventually you get the job at the nfl. you work for them. the commissioner was pete roselle who was the longest-serving commissioner. you are the second-longest serving. is that right? roger: that might be true. i hadn't thought about that. david: pete roselle became commissioner when he was only 33 years old, when the afl and nfl came together. what were you doing in the early years? roger: i was an intern in the public relations department. so i did a little bit of everything.

i guess maybe my two big breaks were the jets who needed an intern late in the preseason. they asked if i wanted to go over and do that. and so i had a chance to be with the jets for one season. and it was a remarkable experience for me. to be on the club level and understand what they go through. it's different than what we do at the league level. it was incredibly valuable experience. but i went back after the season. i was actually asked by one of the coaches, the defensive coordinator, to stay and be an assistant coach. i decided i wanted to go back to the nfl. even though i didn't really have an opportunity there. i was still an intern for a year and a half. i thought, this is the right thing and what i wanted to do. pete roselle was a hero of mine and i wanted to work for him.

i thought the nfl played a really important role in society and had a great future. david: if you thought that you could one day have become a football coach at the nfl? roger: i could have. i probably wouldn't be with the jets anymore. their tenure doesn't last long. i think i made the right choice. david: in 2006, you became the commissioner. now people are probably wondering, what does the commissioner actually do? it is a great title, the commissioner, but it's an awkward position in the sense that you are employed by the owners but you have to sometimes penalize your employers if they do something wrong. you have to fine them and sometimes they are not happy with you. how does that work when you have to please the people who are your employers? roger: i always say, just don't get 24 owners in one day pissed off at you. that's one thing. i think the real issue here is, yes, you are hired by the owners. they select you. but i think the commissioner's ultimate role is to protect the integrity of the game and to

grow the game. that happens by balancing a lot of interests including players and coaches and owners. and partners. and the general public and our fans. ultimately, you work for all of them. that's how i look at this job. i look at this job as i have a responsibility to each one of them to make sure that we secure this game for the future. that we put the best product on the field. and that our game continues to grow in a way that i think people are proud of. the thing i'm most proud of is not just the quality of the game but the fact that the nfl has become the big tent that brings people together. ultimately, i think it's one of the few things that does bring people together in society. the policies and the rules of the league are paramount. if there are violations, you deal with that with discipline. whether that's fines or suspensions.

david: the nfl has had problems getting minority owners. in other words, minorities often don't have the money in our society to pay $6 billion for a team. how do you try to address that problem of getting people who are minorities in our society to become minority owners in the nfl? roger: i think a lot of times, our principal owners, the majority owner ultimately starts as a limited owner. we have several examples of that. in 2022, i recommended to the membership that we state publicly as well as to every potential owner that we welcome diverse sets of ownership. and that everyone should look at that. whether it's people of color or

women. we want to make sure that we have a diverse ownership group that will make us stronger, better also. we passed that. since then, every ownership group has become more diverse. not only the ones that have changed hands but also limited positions. i think our ownership has taken this very seriously. i think we are stronger for it today. david: do you spend the whole week there in the super bowl city? roger: i'm usually there by sometime on monday.

david: when you are a sports fan, one of the pleasures of being a sports fan is that you get to root for your team. but you can't root for anybody. roger: i always say, i root for the team that is behind and the officials. david: how many games do you typically go to in a year? roger: roughly 25 to 30. david: everyone is watching you. when somebody does a great play, you cannot jump up and say great because you are rooting for one team if you do that. how do you sit there passively watching a game? roger: i'm ok with rooting for a great play because that's what we love to see. that's one of the things people come for. the great play. i don't root for a specific team. david: do you ever go to the locker rooms and talk and see the players? roger: i try to see them all before the game. when you're getting ready for a football game and you are in the locker room, the last person you want to see is the commissioner.

so i choose carefully when i see them. but i spend a lot of time talking and communicating with players. i think it's important to understand the perspective. they are incredibly smart and passionate about the game and have a really important perspective that's important for us to hear. david: on the commissioner, when you're dealing with players, you have to fine them sometimes. is that awkward? do you sometimes have to deal with tom brady and the famous deflategate issue? roger: the policies and rules of the league are paramount. and so whether it's an owner or a club executive, a player or coach, if there are violations you deal with that with discipline. whether that's fines or suspensions. ultimately, it's important that you be thoughtful on that. it's not my favorite part of the job. and thankfully it's a small part of my job. but when i first came into this

position, it was clear that we needed to make some changes with respect to enforcement of our policies. particularly off the field. because they reflect on every single player or every single coach or every single club. and our fans. we wanted to raise that bar. we wanted to make sure that the great people who play this game, coach this game, are involved in this game were meeting the highest possible standards on and off the field. david: so would you recommend to people that they aspire to become commissioner because it is such a great job? or not for another 10 years or so? roger: no, i encourage it. as a matter of fact, i have met several people. listen, there's a timefra on how long you do this job. as you said, pete roselle did this 29 years. i am 19 now. there will be a time when it's needed to be a change that's in the best interest of the nfl. that's an important thing. david: when you were young, you

were too young to be president of the united states. they are in their late 70's these days. you are 65 i guess. you've got a ways to go. you signed a new contract that extends your terms are 2027. have you thought about anything past there? roger: i have a full day that takes up a lot of my focus and thoughts. that's where i keep it.

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